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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Soul Crusher on June 15, 2012, 06:47:12 AM
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Thanks Obamacare: 83% of Doctors Surveyed Say They May Quit
Townhall ^ | 06/15/2012 | Kate Hicks
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katehicks/2012/06/14/thanks_obamacare_83_of_doctors_surveyed_say_they_may_quit
The Doctor Patient Medical Association has released a new survey of about 700 doctors, and the results are bleak. Scary bleak. Among other dismal figures, Doctors' Attitudes on the Future of Medicine: What’s Wrong, Who’s to Blame, and What Will Fix It found that 83% of respondents are contemplating leaving the industry if Obamacare is fully implemented, owing to its disastrous projected consequences. Indeed, they openly blame the healthcare law for their industry's woes:
KEY FINDINGS
• 90% say the medical system is on the WRONG TRACK
• 83% say they are thinking about QUITTING
• 61% say the system challenges their ETHICS
• 85% say the patient-physician relationship is in a TAILSPIN
• 65% say GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT is most to blame for current problems
• 72% say individual insurance mandate will NOT result in improved access care
• 49% say they will STOP accepting Medicaid patients
• 74% say they will STOP ACCEPTING Medicare patients, or leave Medicare completely
• 52% say they would rather treat some Medicaid/Medicare patient for FREE
• 57% give the AMA a FAILING GRADE representing them
• 1 out of 3 doctors is HESITANT to voice their opinion
• 2 out of 3 say they are JUST SQUEAKING BY OR IN THE RED financially
• 95% say private practice is losing out to CORPORATE MEDICINE
• 80% say DOCTORS/MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS are most likely to help solve things
• 70% say REDUCING GOVERNMENT would be single best fix.
If this isn't an airtight argument for the repeal of Obamacare, nothing is. When the people providing the actual healthcare are thinking of getting out of the game, the system is clearly broken. Here's hoping the Supreme Court strikes down Obamacare this month.
________________________ _____________________
Option FAIL & Lurker - eat shit morons.
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Option FAIL - another thing, spare your bullshit about Doctors for America. That is nothing but an Obama front group.
Tool.
But I hope you now can feel rejoice in the fact that the God King messiah you worship is now destroying your chosen profession. Cheers.
http://www.ama-assn.org/amednews/2009/05/11/gvbf0511.htm
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Thanks Obamacare: 83% of Doctors Surveyed Say They May Quit
Townhall ^ | 06/15/2012 | Kate Hicks
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katehicks/2012/06/14/thanks_obamacare_83_of_doctors_surveyed_say_they_may_quit
The Doctor Patient Medical Association has released a new survey of about 700 doctors, and the results are bleak. Scary bleak. Among other dismal figures, Doctors' Attitudes on the Future of Medicine: What’s Wrong, Who’s to Blame, and What Will Fix It found that 83% of respondents are contemplating leaving the industry if Obamacare is fully implemented, owing to its disastrous projected consequences. Indeed, they openly blame the healthcare law for their industry's woes:
KEY FINDINGS
• 90% say the medical system is on the WRONG TRACK
• 83% say they are thinking about QUITTING
• 61% say the system challenges their ETHICS
• 85% say the patient-physician relationship is in a TAILSPIN
• 65% say GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT is most to blame for current problems
• 72% say individual insurance mandate will NOT result in improved access care
• 49% say they will STOP accepting Medicaid patients
• 74% say they will STOP ACCEPTING Medicare patients, or leave Medicare completely
• 52% say they would rather treat some Medicaid/Medicare patient for FREE
• 57% give the AMA a FAILING GRADE representing them
• 1 out of 3 doctors is HESITANT to voice their opinion
• 2 out of 3 say they are JUST SQUEAKING BY OR IN THE RED financially
• 95% say private practice is losing out to CORPORATE MEDICINE
• 80% say DOCTORS/MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS are most likely to help solve things
• 70% say REDUCING GOVERNMENT would be single best fix.
If this isn't an airtight argument for the repeal of Obamacare, nothing is. When the people providing the actual healthcare are thinking of getting out of the game, the system is clearly broken. Here's hoping the Supreme Court strikes down Obamacare this month.
________________________ _____________________
Option FAIL & Lurker - eat shit morons.
I can garrantee that not 1 single doctor will quit....not one. Being a doctor is way too lucrative and I would seriously doubt someone would throw away all those years of work to get that sheepskin
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We have the most expensive healthcare system in the world and yet we will lose our houses and be destitute to pay a bill for a heart attack that we never wanted to happen in the first place. Universal healthcare where all pay what they can is the only answer.
The insurance companies would have had people flocking to buy policies because of the mandate..........would have been a HUGE amount of money.
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We have the most expensive healthcare system in the world and yet we will lose our houses and be destitute to pay a bill for a heart attack that we never wanted to happen in the first place. Universal healthcare where all pay what they can is the only answer.
The insurance companies would have had people flocking to buy policies because of the mandate..........would have been a HUGE amount of money.
Why was healthcare affordable (like any other service) in the past, but now it isn't?
???
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Why was healthcare affordable (like any other service) in the past, but now it isn't?
???
Insurance companies, government and HMO's.
Look at higher education....back in the 60's-70's my parents were able to pay for school by doing summer jobs and saving their money. Now, well, different story.
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Insurance companies, government and HMO's.
Look at higher education....back in the 60's-70's my parents were able to pay for school by doing summer jobs and saving their money. Now, well, different story.
Yeah, I think what I meant to ask is can we ever go back to those days?
???
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Yeah, I think what I meant to ask is can we ever go back to those days?
???
Think of all the money those companies etc "donate" to Congressman/Presidents campaigns and all. And then think about how many Congressman/staff-members/board members cross pollinate.
It's all entrenched. So I guess the answer is no.
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Think of all the money those companies etc "donate" to Congressman/Presidents campaigns and all. And then think about how many Congressman/staff-members/board members cross pollinate.
It's all entrenched. So I guess the answer is no.
Good point, sad :(
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Bump for licker
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Think of all the money those companies etc "donate" to Congressman/Presidents campaigns and all. And then think about how many Congressman/staff-members/board members cross pollinate.
It's all entrenched. So I guess the answer is no.
+1
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Why was healthcare affordable (like any other service) in the past, but now it isn't?
???
Because our healthcare system is a "For profit company" It answers to share holders to increase profits. Each insurance company has an entire division that tries to keep from denying you coverage even if youve been paying premiums for 20 yrs. They dont care and they get bonuses from turning down your claim.
This is common even on homeowners policys ( Still an insurance company). My mother paid for 30 yrs to state farm and then a blizzard knocked a tree down on her roof. My dad took care of the roof but they needed the large split base of the tree taken away. She thought no problem... well they canceled her when the time for renewal came (once a year).......Un freaking believable. This is what happens when theres no oversite or rules to play by and its all crashing down soon.
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Henninger: ObamaCare's Lost Tribe: Doctors
The practice of medicine is the Obama health-care law's biggest loser.
By DANIEL HENNINGER
Like this columnist
Back at the at the dawn of ObamaCare in June 2009, speaking to the American Medical Association's annual meeting, President Obama said: "No matter how we reform health care, we will keep this promise: If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. Period."
But will your doctor be able to keep you? Or will your doctor even want to keep you, rather than quit medicine?
For the longest time now, since the day one of the Affordable Care Act, we have been having arguments over the mandate to purchase health-care insurance, requirements that insurance companies accept policyholders regardless of health, and price discrimination in insurance policies.
Corbis.
And of course this past week, the Supreme Court—or something resembling the Supreme Court—outputted a decision on the tax status of the insurance-purchase mandate, the states' obligation to pay for Medicaid and as a bonus, the Commerce Clause.
Have you noticed what got lost in this historic rumble? Doctors. Remember them?
ObamaCare has been a war over the processing of insurance claims. It has been fought by institutional interests representing insurance, hospital and pharmaceutical firms. The doctor-patient relationship, or what used to be called "the practice of medicine," has sunk beneath these waves.
Barack Obama, a savvy pol, understood from the start that rationalizing payments claims through the maw of these private and public bureaucracies was not what the average person thinks of as "health care." To any normal person, health care means that when you or yours get really sick, the doctors and nurses who attend to you will push all else aside to give you medical help.
Thus, the constant Obama chorus that you can "keep your own doctor." No one knows better than Barack Obama that his law sends the nation's doctors on a voyage into an uncharted health-care world in which they are just along for the ride with their patients.
A Wall Street Journal story the day after the Supreme Court ruling examined in detail its impact across the "health sector." The words "doctor," "physician" and "nurse" appeared nowhere in this report. The piece, however, did cite the view of one CEO who runs a chain of hospitals, explaining how they'd deal with the law's expected $155 billion in compensation cuts. "We will make it up in volume," he said.
Volume? Would that be another word for human beings? It is now. At Obama Memorial, docs won't be treating patients. They'll be processing "volume." And then, with what time and energy remains in the day, they'll be inputting medical data to comply with the law's new Physician Quality Reporting System (PQRS), lodged in the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid.
Here's the Centers' own description of what PQRS does: "The program provides an incentive payment to practices with eligible professionals (identified on claims by their individual National Provider Identifier [NPI] and Tax Identification Number [TIN]) who satisfactorily report data on quality measures for covered Physician Fee Schedule (PFS) services furnished to Medicare Part B Fee-for-Service (FFS)."
We're all pressed for thinking time these days, but the one group we should make sure has time to focus on what's in front of them is doctors treating patients. Instead, they'll also be doing mandated data dumps for far-off panels of experts.
Doubts, even among believers, have begun to emerge about what ObamaCare could do to the practice of medicine. A remarkable and important piece by Drs. Christine K. Cassel and Sachin H. Jain in the June 17 Journal of the American Medical Association directly asks: "Does Measurement Suppress Motivation?"
The question raised by the article is whether imposing pay-for-performance measurements on individual physicians does more harm than good: "[C]lose attention must be given to whether and how these initiatives motivate physicians and not turn physicians into pawns working only toward specific measurable outcomes, losing the complex problem-solving and diagnostic capabilities essential to their role in quality of patient care, and diminish their sense of professional responsibility by making it a market commodity."
This is an important piece, because Dr. Cassel is part of the intellectual foundation for the measured-directives movement. The saying that comes to mind reading these misgivings is that it's better late than never to notice that the core relationship between doctor and patient is being eroded. Except that in the wake of Chief Justice Roberts's upholding of the Affordable Care Act, it's too late and we're beyond never.
Mitt Romney needs a way to talk about health care in America. This isn't just a fight over insurance companies. It's about the people at the center of health care—doctors. The Affordable Care Act will damage that most crucial of all life relationships, that between an ill person and his physician. Barack Obama's assertion that we all can keep our doctors is false. You could line up practicing physicians from here to Boston to explain to Mr. Romney why that is so.
Write to henninger@wsj.com
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Because our healthcare system is a "For profit company" It answers to share holders to increase profits. Each insurance company has an entire division that tries to keep from denying you coverage even if youve been paying premiums for 20 yrs. They dont care and they get bonuses from turning down your claim.
This is common even on homeowners policys ( Still an insurance company). My mother paid for 30 yrs to state farm and then a blizzard knocked a tree down on her roof. My dad took care of the roof but they needed the large split base of the tree taken away. She thought no problem... well they canceled her when the time for renewal came (once a year).......Un freaking believable. This is what happens when theres no oversite or rules to play by and its all crashing down soon.
Yup we could fix that by having government run health care but people were freaking out over this calling it communist, and now we have the option where they have to consult private companies and thats wrong too. People are gonna complain no matter what
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I can garrantee that not 1 single doctor will quit....not one. Being a doctor is way too lucrative and I would seriously doubt someone would throw away all those years of work to get that sheepskin
Possibly not, but many doctors who have amassed enough to live on may retire early.
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Possibly not, but many doctors who have amassed enough to live on may retire early.
Not to mention dissaude people from going into medicine now.
Why would anyone bother any more to undertake such expense and liability when you have communist rabble like Obama looming overhead?
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I can garrantee that not 1 single doctor will quit....not one. Being a doctor is way too lucrative and I would seriously doubt someone would throw away all those years of work to get that sheepskin
Of course they are quitting. They have riots to start in the street. And cities burn. Didn't you read the Globe article the board retard quoted regarding this?
Better get your duffel bag ready.
::)
Funny thing about being an HA is that I can actually see the waiting list of docs wanting to contract our/my OR out and it has new names added to it all the time. Guess they didn't get the memo.
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Doctors don't want no knee grow germs
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Of course they are quitting. They have riots to start in the street. And cities burn. Didn't you read the Globe article the board retard quoted regarding this?
Better get your duffel bag ready.
::)
Funny thing about being an HA is that I can actually see the waiting list of docs wanting to contract our/my OR out and it has new names added to it all the time. Guess they didn't get the memo.
You know nothing. Spends a couple of years in a basement only listening to conservative news sources and then come back. Thats how knowledge is earned
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You know nothing. Spends a couple of years in a basement only listening to conservative news sources and then come back. Thats how knowledge is earned
Right all of these doctors are lying to the pollsters. ::) ::)
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Not to mention dissaude people from going into medicine now.
Why would anyone bother any more to undertake such expense and liability when you have communist rabble like Obama looming overhead?
The Association of American Medical Colleges is out with new data projecting that first-year medical school enrollment will steadily increase in coming years, increasing by 29 percent over the course of 15 years: wrong again 333386,maybe in make beileve world :D :D
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KEY FINDINGS
• 90% say the medical system is on the WRONG TRACK
• 83% say they are thinking about QUITTING
• 61% say the system challenges their ETHICS
• 85% say the patient-physician relationship is in a TAILSPIN
• 65% say GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT is most to blame for current problems
• 72% say individual insurance mandate will NOT result in improved access care
• 49% say they will STOP accepting Medicaid patients
• 74% say they will STOP ACCEPTING Medicare patients, or leave Medicare completely
• 52% say they would rather treat some Medicaid/Medicare patient for FREE
• 57% give the AMA a FAILING GRADE representing them
• 1 out of 3 doctors is HESITANT to voice their opinion
• 2 out of 3 say they are JUST SQUEAKING BY OR IN THE RED financially
• 95% say private practice is losing out to CORPORATE MEDICINE
• 80% say DOCTORS/MEDICAL PROFESSIONALS are most likely to help solve things
• 70% say REDUCING GOVERNMENT would be single best fix.
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Not to mention dissaude people from going into medicine now.
Why would anyone bother any more to undertake such expense and liability when you have communist rabble like Obama looming overhead? says 333386
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The Association of American Medical Colleges is out with new data projecting that first-year medical school enrollment will steadily increase in coming years, increasing by 29 percent over the course of 15 years: wrong again 333386,maybe in make beileve world
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Not to mention dissaude people from going into medicine now.
Why would anyone bother any more to undertake such expense and liability when you have communist rabble like Obama looming overhead? says 333386
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Association of American Medical Colleges is out with new data projecting that first-year medical school enrollment will steadily increase in coming years, increasing by 29 percent over the course of 15 years: wrong again 333386,maybe in make beileve world
So I present findings of what is going on TODAY, and you counter that with a projection based on nothing whatsoever?
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Why would anyone bother any more to undertake such expense and liability when you have communist rabble like Obama looming overhead? says 333386
did you write this
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Why would anyone bother any more to undertake such expense and liability when you have communist rabble like Obama looming overhead? says 333386
did you write this
Yes.
By the end of medical school and college you will have 300k in debt + correct. Under MugabeCare, reimbursements are getting slashed.
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The Association of American Medical Colleges is out with new data projecting that first-year medical school enrollment will steadily increase in coming years, increasing by 29 percent over the course of 15 years: wrong again 333386,maybe in make beileve world
this says your wrong
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I speak and work with Dr's all the time, most really don't like the law at all.
And they don't outright say they will "quit tomorrow!" but they def. do say that they will retire as soon as they can. Not all but a majority.
It's a small slice of the total Dr. population and anecdotal but that's what I hear.
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no problem, we have plenty more coming in.
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I speak and work with Dr's all the time, most really don't like the law at all.
And they don't outright say they will "quit tomorrow!" but they def. do say that they will retire as soon as they can. Not all but a majority.
It's a small slice of the total Dr. population and anecdotal but that's what I hear.
I doubt it.
Being a doc is a pretty good living
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Lets all just whip our cocks out and solve it that way
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::)
The Doctor Patient Medical Association (DPMA) and the Patient Power Alliance (PPA) work to repeal health care reform[1] and call themselves a "a nonpartisan association of doctors and patients dedicated to preserving free choice in medicine."[2] The organization is a member of the National Tea Party Federation[3] and the "American Grassroots Coalition."[4]
↑ Suzanne Hoholik, Group Predicts Savings from Health-Care Law, Columbus Dispatch, October 27, 2011
↑ 2.0 2.1 Amy Kremer, Politico Arena profile, accessed December 20, 2011
↑ National Tea Party Federation, Membership List, organizational site, accessed December 20, 2011
↑ American Grassroots Coalition, MORE CITIZEN ACTIONS PLANNED THROUGH WEEKEND: Unprecedented TEA Party & Grassroots Coalition Aligns to 'Kill The Bill'; Rally Saturday at Capitol, Other Events Across Country, organizational press release, PRNewswire, March 18, 2010
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I doubt it.
Being a doc is a pretty good living
You know, out of the HUNDREDS - yes, I said HUNDREDS - of docs that are contracted with my hospital, or provided through our third party business partners like Team Health and such, not a single one of them has said they were going to quit.
None.
Zilch.
Zero.
Nada.
Anyone who thinks they will is just stupid. As evident by this bipolar retards thinking here. Any doc claiming they will is no different than those liars saying they would move to Canada if Bush got elected for a second term. How many did that? That is the EXACT same number of docs that will quit their jobs.
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http://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2012/07/02/its-over-for-marcus-welby-as-obamacare-market-trends-take-out-solo-practice-doctors
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So I present findings of what is going on TODAY, and you counter that with a projection based on nothing whatsoever?
You present the findings of a backassward Tea Party fringe group and thinks it reflects the opinion and trend of the majority of this country.
I would ask you if you could possibly be more stupid, but you would probably take that as a personal challenge.
Get the fuck out of here with your weak shit.
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I doubt it.
Being a doc is a pretty good living
Guess you missed the point about early retirement and amassed wealth. My doctor did this, and flat out said it was because he didn't want to deal with this anymore. I met the head of internal medicine at a major Massachusetts hospital and he said Obamacare's a disaster (he offered this up, I wasn't even asking).
Yes, this is a small sample, as Gigantor mentioned, but these coupled with the poll data should raise eyebrows.
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Guess you missed the point about early retirement and amassed wealth. My doctor did this, and flat out said it was because he didn't want to deal with this anymore. I met the head of internal medicine at a major Massachusetts hospital and he said Obamacare's a disaster (he offered this up, I wasn't even asking).
Yes, this is a small sample, as Gigantor mentioned, but these coupled with the poll data should raise eyebrows.
It won't and it doesnt to leftists who think that we are all supposed to march in lockstep with whatever bullshit they pass and try to control.
These idiots never read Atlas Shrugged, don't understand that incentives matter and that the same govt that bankrupted SS, tyhe post office, Medicare, etc is not going to do any different here.
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Guess you missed the point about early retirement and amassed wealth. My doctor did this, and flat out said it was because he didn't want to deal with this anymore. I met the head of internal medicine at a major Massachusetts hospital and he said Obamacare's a disaster (he offered this up, I wasn't even asking).
Yes, this is a small sample, as Gigantor mentioned, but these coupled with the poll data should raise eyebrows.
So let them retire and bring in some new doctors? Will help with the unemployment as well
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So let them retire and bring in some new doctors? Will help with the unemployment as well
LOL - bring them in from where? India and Pakistan right?
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LOL - bring them in from where? India and Pakistan right?
Tons of Dr's come from those 2 nations. They come over with little in the way of debt and start practicing or go to medical school over there and come over here to do internships and such. I have no problem with it, I'm more concerned about the cost of med school in the U.S. and how that will effect the U.S. training of U.S. home grown Dr's.
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Tons of Dr's come from those 2 nations. They come over with little in the way of debt and start practicing or go to medical school over there and come over here to do internships and such. I have no problem with it, I'm more concerned about the cost of med school in the U.S. and how that will effect the U.S. training of U.S. home grown Dr's.
Thats' the whole point - our best and brighest have little incentive to go to medical school other than for truly personal reasons to help people.
Call it greed or whatever, but personally i have no problem w incentivizing the smartest and brightest people going into medicine for financial rewards.
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sighhhhhhh......oh sure...83% of doctors will give up their lucrative careers in opposition to a politician....wow..you are so over the top its amazing....what will they do???..sweep and mop floors???
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sighhhhhhh......oh sure...83% of doctors will give up their lucrative careers in opposition to a politician....wow..you are so over the top its amazing....what will they do???..sweep and mop floors???
Average MD hardly has a "lucrative career" compared to the investment put in, hours worked, bullshit to deal with, worsening work conditions, etc. compared to many other professions requiring far less time, stress, bullshit, responsibility, etc.
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Average MD hardly has a "lucrative career" compared to the investment put in, hours worked, bullshit to deal with, worsening work conditions, etc. compared to many other professions requiring far less time, stress, bullshit, responsibility, etc.
not true....they are still doing well.....they may have to play less golf...but their income hasn't taken a nose-dive like the Lawyers...oh you wouldn't know that since you're not a lawyer :D
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not true....they are still doing well.....they may have to play less golf...but their income hasn't taken a nose-dive like the Lawyers...oh you wouldn't know that since you're not a lawyer :D
::) ::)
Andre - you - like the rest of the 95ers, would have this nation be like cuba, haiti, zimbabwe, nigeria, and venezuela, within 2 years if you idiots were ever to control the government in toto.
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::) ::)
Andre - you - like the rest of the 95ers, would have this nation be like cuba, haiti, zimbabwe, nigeria, and venezuela, within 2 years if you idiots were ever to control the government in toto.
your basement must be really comfortable for you to sit there and come up with this stuff.....AMAZING..I'm starting to think you are actually gh15 as well :)
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your basement must be really comfortable for you to sit there and come up with this stuff.....AMAZING..I'm starting to think you are actually gh15 as well :)
Why? Look at Detroit, Chicago, or anywhere else total leftist tyranny has been imposed like you advocate - collapse, decay, fail, and degeneracy.
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sighhhhhhh......oh sure...83% of doctors will give up their lucrative careers in opposition to a politician....wow..you are so over the top its amazing....what will they do???..sweep and mop floors???
Riot in the streets.
Burn cities.
That is what the board retard claims is going to happen.
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LOL - bring them in from where? India and Pakistan right?
do you ever stop lying,you are a sad person
The Association of American Medical Colleges is out with new data projecting that first-year medical school enrollment will steadily increase in coming years, increasing by 29 percent over the course of 15 years: wrong again 333386,maybe in make beileve world
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Why? Look at Detroit, Chicago, or anywhere else total leftist tyranny has been imposed like you advocate - collapse, decay, fail, and degeneracy.
SPIN COCK
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Yes.
By the end of medical school and college you will have 300k in debt + correct. Under MugabeCare, reimbursements are getting slashed.
first off nitwit, in a recession everyone has to take a hit..Doctors are no exception...Lawyers incomes are down drastically....Doctors deserve no special economic advantages....
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The Hospitals are 83% empty of Doctors now.
We are in a commy tyranny state.
The sky is falling
SPIN COCK lives.
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your basement must be really comfortable for you to sit there and come up with this stuff.....AMAZING..I'm starting to think you are actually gh15 as well :)
i think his moms basement has extremely high mold levels :D
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The Hospitals are 83% empty of Doctors now.
We are in a commy tyranny state.
The sky is falling
SPIN COCK lives.
Do you even know a fucking thing about the details of obamacare?
Doctors hate it because they are going to be forced to see more people for less pay. How do you think that works out for the average patient?
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i think his moms basement has extremely high mold levels :D
:D does inhaling mold cause mental illness??
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:D does inhaling mold cause mental illness??
Toxic Black Mold Symptoms - Mental & Neurological
The trichothecene mycotoxins produced by toxic black mold are neurotoxic. This means they can kill neurons in the brain and impair a person's mental ability. They also cause nervous disorders such as tremors and can cause personality changes such as mood swings and irritability.
:D :D :D
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Doctors hate ObamaCare even more than you do
By: John Hayward
3/15/2012 09:49 AM
www.humanevents.com
Heath care is an expensive product, with high demand chasing limited supply. There are only so many doctors, and training new ones requires a long education at great personal expense. Meanwhile, advances in medicine are steadily prolonging life and improving its quality.
It follows that if we want to decrease the cost of health care (or, to use the currently popular political vernacular, “improve access”) we need more doctors. Conversely, reducing the supply of doctors would make medical care more expensive, and reduce its quality. If government controls are then applied to skyrocketing costs, shortages and rationing would be the inevitable result.
What will ObamaCare do to the supply of doctors? For the answer, we turn to a Heritage Foundation report on a new survey of the medical profession, which confirms the results of a previous survey from 2010. Doctors hate ObamaCare even more than the general public does, with 60 percent of respondents saying it will “have a negative impact on overall patient care,” but that’s not the worst of it:
The Doctors Company, which is the largest insurer of physician and surgeon medical liability in the nation, received more than 5,000 surveys, including all specialties and every region in the country. The results weren’t good for the President’s signature piece of legislation.
Not only do doctors believe that Obamacare will not improve the health care system, they also anticipate that it will worsen the current condition. According to the survey, nine out of 10 physicians are unwilling to recommend health care as a profession to a family member, and one primary care physician even commented, “I would not recommend becoming an M.D. to anyone.”
Obamacare doesn’t just discourage entrance into the medical profession; it encourages those who are already practicing to leave it. The survey states that “health care reform is motivating doctors to change their retirement timeline.” In fact, 43 percent of respondents said they are considering retiring within the next five years as a result of the law. A surgeon from Michigan wrote that under Obamacare, “We will be moving further away from humanity-based health care and more towards the patient as a commodity. This was not the way my father practiced—nor will I. Winding down to retire early.”
(Emphases mine.) This comes as the United States teeters “on the brink of a severe physician shortage,” with the American Association of Medical Colleges estimating that we’ll need 91,500 more doctors by 2020 to meet demand.
This is the sort of disastrous “side effect” that probably wasn’t included in the Congressional Budget Office’s already horrific estimate of ObamaCare’s exploding costs. It’s also damage that would not be easy to reverse. If ObamaCare is not repealed soon, the loss of doctors will ripple forward for years… and the necessity of tight “death panel” rationing of precious doctor time will be used as a club by Democrats to not only keep ObamaCare, but actually make it worse. Wait until the doctors of 2014 get a load of the tidal wave pouring into their offices to collect their mandated benefits… and look behind them to see an increasingly large army of stern bureaucrats dictating the fast-food practices necessary to keep the human cattle moving through those exam rooms.
Let’s hear Health and Human Cattle Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius tell us some more about that private-sector “death spiral” ObamaCare was supposed to fix!
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Doctors hate ObamaCare even more than you do
By: John Hayward
3/15/2012 09:49 AM
www.humanevents.com
Heath care is an expensive product, with high demand chasing limited supply. There are only so many doctors, and training new ones requires a long education at great personal expense. Meanwhile, advances in medicine are steadily prolonging life and improving its quality.
It follows that if we want to decrease the cost of health care (or, to use the currently popular political vernacular, “improve access”) we need more doctors. Conversely, reducing the supply of doctors would make medical care more expensive, and reduce its quality. If government controls are then applied to skyrocketing costs, shortages and rationing would be the inevitable result.
What will ObamaCare do to the supply of doctors? For the answer, we turn to a Heritage Foundation report on a new survey of the medical profession, which confirms the results of a previous survey from 2010. Doctors hate ObamaCare even more than the general public does, with 60 percent of respondents saying it will “have a negative impact on overall patient care,” but that’s not the worst of it:
The Doctors Company, which is the largest insurer of physician and surgeon medical liability in the nation, received more than 5,000 surveys, including all specialties and every region in the country. The results weren’t good for the President’s signature piece of legislation.
Not only do doctors believe that Obamacare will not improve the health care system, they also anticipate that it will worsen the current condition. According to the survey, nine out of 10 physicians are unwilling to recommend health care as a profession to a family member, and one primary care physician even commented, “I would not recommend becoming an M.D. to anyone.”
Obamacare doesn’t just discourage entrance into the medical profession; it encourages those who are already practicing to leave it. The survey states that “health care reform is motivating doctors to change their retirement timeline.” In fact, 43 percent of respondents said they are considering retiring within the next five years as a result of the law. A surgeon from Michigan wrote that under Obamacare, “We will be moving further away from humanity-based health care and more towards the patient as a commodity. This was not the way my father practiced—nor will I. Winding down to retire early.”
(Emphases mine.) This comes as the United States teeters “on the brink of a severe physician shortage,” with the American Association of Medical Colleges estimating that we’ll need 91,500 more doctors by 2020 to meet demand.
This is the sort of disastrous “side effect” that probably wasn’t included in the Congressional Budget Office’s already horrific estimate of ObamaCare’s exploding costs. It’s also damage that would not be easy to reverse. If ObamaCare is not repealed soon, the loss of doctors will ripple forward for years… and the necessity of tight “death panel” rationing of precious doctor time will be used as a club by Democrats to not only keep ObamaCare, but actually make it worse. Wait until the doctors of 2014 get a load of the tidal wave pouring into their offices to collect their mandated benefits… and look behind them to see an increasingly large army of stern bureaucrats dictating the fast-food practices necessary to keep the human cattle moving through those exam rooms.
Let’s hear Health and Human Cattle Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius tell us some more about that private-sector “death spiral” ObamaCare was supposed to fix!
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D sorry i couldn't help myself
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Do you even know a fucking thing about the details of obamacare?
Doctors hate it because they are going to be forced to see more people for less pay. How do you think that works out for the average patient?
You don't know the first thing about doctors. Evident as how you won't see one to help with your pyscho delusional state of mind.
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Do you even know a fucking thing about the details of obamacare?
Doctors hate it because they are going to be forced to see more people for less pay. How do you think that works out for the average patient?
Do you? ::)
Or have you just been sucking conservative SPIN COCK so long you think its normal?
SO ARE 83% PERCENT OF THE DOCTORS QUITTING NOW 3333333?
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The Hospitals are 83% empty of Doctors now.
We are in a commy tyranny state.
The sky is falling
SPIN COCK lives.
It's hilarious seeing him start a thread like this and then on the inside he is running, ducking, and getting smacked like a obese girl during high school dodge ball class.
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It's hilarious seeing him start a thread like this and then on the inside he is running, ducking, and getting smacked like a obese girl during high school dodge ball class.
LOL - you idiots know more than the majority who hate obamacare. Got it. ::) ::)
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yep, big problem at ER today because 83% of doctors quit.
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yep, big problem at ER today because 83% of doctors quit.
Spin however you like - I have not seen even one study to where a majority of docs favor this insanity.
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Spin however you like - I have not seen even one study to where a majority of docs favor this insanity.
Oh you mean how you claim 83% of doctors are going to quit? ::)
Grow up. You are so stupid sometimes.
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Oh you mean how you claim 83% of doctors are going to quit? ::)
Grow up. You are so stupid sometimes.
THE POLL RESULTS SAY - "MAY QUIT"
DID IT SAY "WILL QUIT" ? ? ? ?
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"may" quit is pretty thin.
They "may" attend the Mr O expo and decide to turn tranny.
They "may" do a lot of things.
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Ok 3333.
Check this out... I just read up on the DPMA...
Now.. you can retract this bull shit.. or i can destroy you... yet again... on the pure fuckedupedness of this thread...
Ill start this off with a small tidbit...
The DPMA has been around since 2011...
Now... im going to breakfast... and when i get back... this shit better be corrected and properly vetted or i will do my customary dismantling of the whole shit.
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THE POLL RESULTS SAY - "MAY QUIT"
DID IT SAY "WILL QUIT" ? ? ? ?
SPIN COCK 333333, suck it good, suck it hard, swallow whole.
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Ok 3333.
Check this out... I just read up on the DPMA...
Now.. you can retract this bull shit.. or i can destroy you... yet again... on the pure fuckedupedness of this thread...
Ill start this off with a small tidbit...
The DPMA has been around since 2011...
Now... im going to breakfast... and when i get back... this shit better be corrected and properly vetted or i will do my customary dismantling of the whole shit.
I have yet to see even one study, one, other than Obama's fake "doctors for america" bullshit you tried to get over on us, supporting this insanity.
2 docs in the gym i know are furious over this shit, Shootfighter hates it, talk to most docs they hate it.
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Ok 3333.
Check this out... I just read up on the DPMA...
Now.. you can retract this bull shit.. or i can destroy you... yet again... on the pure fuckedupedness of this thread...
Ill start this off with a small tidbit...
The DPMA has been around since 2011...
Now... im going to breakfast... and when i get back... this shit better be corrected and properly vetted or i will do my customary dismantling of the whole shit.
:D :D :D do tell us ;D
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I have yet to see even one study, one, other than Obama's fake "doctors for america" bullshit you tried to get over on us, supporting this insanity.
2 docs in the gym i know are furious over this shit, Shootfighter hates it, talk to most docs they hate it.
Well at least one should be quitting lol
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45% Of Doctors Would Consider Quitting If Congress Passes Health Care Overhaul
By TERRY JONES, INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY
Posted 09/15/2009 07:09 PM ET
View Enlarged Image
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IBD Exclusive Series:
Condition Critical: What Doctors Think About Health Reform
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Two of every three practicing physicians oppose the medical overhaul plan under consideration in Washington, and hundreds of thousands would think about shutting down their practices or retiring early if it were adopted, a new IBD/TIPP Poll has found.
The poll contradicts the claims of not only the White House, but also doctors' own lobby — the powerful American Medical Association — both of which suggest the medical profession is behind the proposed overhaul.
It also calls into question whether an overhaul is even doable; 72% of the doctors polled disagree with the administration's claim that the government can cover 47 million more people with better-quality care at lower cost.
The IBD/TIPP Poll was conducted by mail the past two weeks, with 1,376 practicing physicians chosen randomly throughout the country taking part. Responses are still coming in, and doctors' positions on related topics — including the impact of an overhaul on senior care, medical school applications and drug development — will be covered later in this series.
Major findings included:
• Two-thirds, or 65%, of doctors say they oppose the proposed government expansion plan. This contradicts the administration's claims that doctors are part of an "unprecedented coalition" supporting a medical overhaul.
It also differs with findings of a poll released Monday by National Public Radio that suggests a "majority of physicians want public and private insurance options," and clashes with media reports such as Tuesday's front-page story in the Los Angeles Times with the headline "Doctors Go For Obama's Reform."
Nowhere in the Times story does it say doctors as a whole back the overhaul. It says only that the AMA — the "association representing the nation's physicians" and what "many still regard as the country's premier lobbying force" — is "lobbying and advertising to win public support for President Obama's sweeping plan."
The AMA, in fact, represents approximately 18% of physicians and has been hit with a number of defections by members opposed to the AMA's support of Democrats' proposed health care overhaul.
• Four of nine doctors, or 45%, said they "would consider leaving their practice or taking an early retirement" if Congress passes the plan the Democratic majority and White House have in mind.
More than 800,000 doctors were practicing in 2006, the government says. Projecting the poll's finding onto that population, 360,000 doctors would consider quitting.
• More than seven in 10 doctors, or 71% — the most lopsided response in the poll — answered "no" when asked if they believed "the government can cover 47 million more people and that it will cost less money and the quality of care will be better."
This response is consistent with critics who complain that the administration and congressional Democrats have yet to explain how, even with the current number of physicians and nurses, they can cover more people and lower the cost at the same time.
The only way, the critics contend, is by rationing care — giving it to some and denying it to others. That cuts against another claim by plan supporters — that care would be better.
IBD/TIPP's finding that many doctors could leave the business suggests that such rationing could be more severe than even critics believe. Rationing is one of the drawbacks associated with government plans in countries such as Canada and the U.K. Stories about growing waiting lists for badly needed care, horror stories of care gone wrong, babies born on sidewalks, and even people dying as a result of care delayed or denied are rife.
In this country, the number of doctors is already lagging population growth.
From 2003 to 2006, the number of active physicians in the U.S. grew by just 0.8% a year, adding a total of 25,700 doctors.
Recent population growth has been 1% a year. Patients, in short, are already being added faster than physicians, creating a medical bottleneck.
The great concern is that, with increased mandates, lower pay and less freedom to practice, doctors could abandon medicine in droves, as the IBD/TIPP Poll suggests. Under the proposed medical overhaul, an additional 47 million people would have to be cared for — an 18% increase in patient loads, without an equivalent increase in doctors. The actual effect could be somewhat less because a significant share of the uninsured already get care.
Even so, the government vows to cut hundreds of billions of dollars from health care spending to pay for reform, which would encourage a flight from the profession.
The U.S. today has just 2.4 physicians per 1,000 population — below the median of 3.1 for members of the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, the official club of wealthy nations.
Adding millions of patients to physicians' caseloads would threaten to overwhelm the system. Medical gatekeepers would have to deny care to large numbers of people. That means care would have to be rationed.
"It's like giving everyone free bus passes, but there are only two buses," Dr. Ted Epperly, president of the American Academy of Family Physicians, told the Associated Press.
Hope for a surge in new doctors may be misplaced. A recent study from the Association of American Medical Colleges found steadily declining enrollment in medical schools since 1980.
The study found that, just with current patient demand, the U.S. will have 159,000 fewer doctors than it needs by 2025. Unless corrected, that would make some sort of medical rationing or long waiting lists almost mandatory.
Experiments at the state level show that an overhaul isn't likely to change much.
On Monday came word from the Massachusetts Medical Society — a group representing physicians in a state that has implemented an overhaul similar to that under consideration in Washington — that doctor shortages remain a growing problem.
Its 2009 Physician Workforce Study found that:
• The primary care specialties of family medicine and internal medicine are in short supply for a fourth straight year.
• The percentage of primary care practices closed to new patients is the highest ever recorded.
• Seven of 18 specialties — dermatology, neurology, urology, vascular surgery and (for the first time) obstetrics-gynecology, in addition to family and internal medicine — are in short supply.
• Recruitment and retention of physicians remains difficult, especially at community hospitals and with primary care.
A key reason for the doctor shortages, according to the study, is a "lingering poor practice environment in the state."
In 2006, Massachusetts passed its medical overhaul — minus a public option — similar to what's being proposed on a national scale now. It hasn't worked as expected. Costs are higher, with insurance premiums rising 22% faster than in the U.S. as a whole.
"Health spending in Massachusetts is higher than the United States on average and is growing at a faster rate," according to a recent report from the Urban Institute.
Other states with government-run or mandated health insurance systems, including Maine, Tennessee and Hawaii, have been forced to cut back services and coverage.
This experience has been repeated in other countries where a form of nationalized care is common. In particular, many nationalized health systems seem to have trouble finding enough doctors to meet demand.
In Britain, a lack of practicing physicians means the country has had to import thousands of foreign doctors to care for patients in the National Health Service.
"A third of (British) primary care trusts are flying in (general practitioners) from as far away as Lithuania, Poland, Germany, Hungary, Italy and Switzerland" because of a doctor shortage, a recent story in the British Daily Mail noted.
British doctors, demoralized by long hours and burdensome rules, simply refuse to see patients at nights and weekends.
Likewise, Canadian physicians who have to deal with the stringent rules and income limits imposed by that country's national health plan have emigrated in droves to other countries, including the U.S.
Tomorrow: Why most doctors oppose the government's plan — in their own words.
http://news.investors.com/articleprint/506199/200909151909/45-of-doctors-would-consider-quitting-if-congress-passes-health-care-overhaul.aspx
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I have yet to see even one study, one, other than Obama's fake "doctors for america" bullshit you tried to get over on us, supporting this insanity.
2 docs in the gym i know are furious over this shit, Shootfighter hates it, talk to most docs they hate it.
I interact with hundreds of docs through my job. ER and OR. I know every single doc that sets foot on our property and works/bills for patients here.
Not a single one of them is quitting, may be quitting or even said they were quitting.
This isn't about supporting Obamacare, this is about you proving your stupid ass claim that docs are quitting. When pressed for facts and evidence all your submit is a skewed biased crap poll.
HAHAHA you prove everyday you are not a real lawyer.
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Thanks Obamacare: 83% of Doctors Surveyed Say They May Quit
Townhall ^ | 06/15/2012 | Kate Hicks
http://townhall.com/
If this isn't an airtight argument ....
anything after the words, "townhall.com" is just...
yada yada yada...
airtight; about as airtight as someone's butthole. ;D
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Yeah, a doctor just knocked on my door to ask if i needed any yard work done.
Meanwhile, nurses are getting promoted to doctor due to the shortage. Also, burger flippers at Micky Dees are getting to be nurses.
333333, you love sucking SPIN COCK don't you? You should love this.
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Let's not forget how the public schools are now thriving (read : overcrowding) due to the docs being unable to afford private tuition for their kids.
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Alright 22222 i see you went from 83% to 45%...
Ill give you a bit more time to drop another half.
Just be smart about this.. its an easy one to dispute..
But for fucks sake.. "Docters my quit"
Poll conducted by a right winged group formed soely to dispute Obamacare that just came about in 2011... Cmon man.. its pretty weak
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Damn. Dismantled the spin of 2222002 on this thread. His copy and pastes of fox news, limbaugh and orielly make him too easy.
Serious question for you 3333 or whatever.....Do you see both sides of a subject? Do you see common sense when its given to you?
See....most people..as they get older and more intelligent can push thru the bullshit after thinking about it.
Start getting some balance on veiws and think about them before posting. Do you see the big picture or are you spoon fed by hatred for obama and some of his successful policies. Are you even smart enough to know what if any good he has done?..........
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I see that even if 25 percent want to quit due to Mugabecare it's a disaster.
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I see that even if 25 percent want to quit due to Mugabecare it's a disaster.
Most doctors dont like medicaid/medicare because of the paperwork...and yes they want more money. But think of this now.....more people coming in to their offices will actually have a policy of insurance. The mandate makes that likely! its pro business!!
Even if what you say were true. (Which it isnt) Do you think a docs gonna quit becuase his income went from 200k to 150k...(Just random numbers)
You think he'll want to go to home depot to get a job for 15 dollars an hour? lol. NO, Because what hes got is still better than what hed have by moving on. Also do you think all the new kids in med school want a 200k job per year or a 36k job per year.....THINK 3333!!!
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Toxic Black Mold Symptoms - Mental & Neurological
The trichothecene mycotoxins produced by toxic black mold are neurotoxic. This means they can kill neurons in the brain and impair a person's mental ability. They also cause nervous disorders such as tremors and can cause personality changes such as mood swings and irritability.
:D :D :D
Thanks...it all makes sense now :)
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yep, big problem at ER today because 83% of doctors quit.
:)
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SPIN COCK 333333, suck it good, suck it hard, swallow whole.
LOL @ SPINCOCK ;D
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I see that even if 25 percent want to quit due to Mugabecare it's a disaster.
83% to 45% to 25%
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83% to 45% to 25%
Backpedaling in full effect now. Give it another page and he will be resorting to his usual lame exit techniques by then.
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Poll: Physicians Bearish on Healthcare Reform
Cheryl Clark, for HealthLeaders Media , January 20, 2011
A national survey of 2,958 physicians indicates "frustration and dismay in a time of change," according to a report by Thomson Reuters and HCPlexus.
For example, 65% of the doctors said they believe healthcare will deteriorate in the next five years, while 18% said it will improve and 17% said it will stay the same.
The reasons given ranged from their political views of healthcare reform, to "anger directed at insurance companies and a lack of accurate planning in the reform act," according to the report.
When asked what kind of healthcare professional will treat the 32 million currently uninsured Americans who will have access to healthcare under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, respondents said that nurse practitioners will see as many patients as primary care physicians. The survey revealed that many patients will be seen by physician assistants.
Physicians who responded to the survey also said they believe that under PPACA, they will be treated less fairly when they submit claims for reimbursement. The survey was conducted in September, 2010.
"Physicians overall have a clear frustration with the non-physician providers' compensation, which is comparable to primary care physicians, citing that nurse practitioners and physician assistants are not as well trained or as educated," the report says.
Physicians were significantly pessimistic in their responses to the question about the impact the new legislation will have on patients, with 58% saying it will have a negative effect and 27% saying it will have a positive effect.
In one of the most surprising responses, 45% of doctors who answered the survey said "they did not know what an accountable care organization is...It appears there ha been a lack of physician education in this area. And for those who did know what an ACO is, no physician category or specialty had more than 17% of its respondents who said 'yes' when asked if they were participating in discussions to form an ACO.
Asked about the impact of electronic medical records on patient care, physician response was less one-sided. While 24% were negative about the impact, 39% were positive and 37% neutral.
The report includes written verbatim comments from some of the physicians who responded. For example, a dermatologist in Colorado said his practice "has had EMR in place for three years and would never go back to paper charts. We have two offices and EMR makes it easier to keep track of patients at both sites."
However, another dermatologist in Arizona said he thinks EMR "interferes with the patient-doctor interaction. You cannot record your patients' answer and still maintain eye contact and watch the patient's body language as you proceed with the interview."
The survey divided the respondents up by medical practice and response. For example, 908 responders identified themselves as internists, family practice or general practice physicians, or primary care physicians.
While PCP doctors were generally positive about the future of healthcare, the 245 doctors who identified themselves as pediatricians and psychiatrists were the most optimistic.
Dermatologists were the most negative, with not one of the 73 who responded "felt (that the) PPACA would have a positive impact on physicians."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cheryl Clark is a senior editor and California correspondent for HealthLeaders Media Online. She can be reached at cclark@healthleadersmedia.com. Follow Cheryl Clark on Twitter.
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http://www.healthleadersmedia.com/print/LED-261601/Poll-Physicians-Bearish-on-Healthcare-Reform
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MDs fear healthcare reform: Thomson Reuters survey
By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Editor
WASHINGTON | Wed Jan 19, 2011 9:17am EST
(Reuters) - Nearly two-thirds of U.S. doctors surveyed fear healthcare reform could worsen care for patients, by flooding their offices and hurting income, according to a Thomson Reuters survey released on Tuesday.
The survey of more than 2,900 doctors found many predict the legislation will force them to work harder for less money.
"When asked about the quality of healthcare in the U.S. over the next five years, 65 percent of the doctors believed it would deteriorate with only 18 percent predicting it would improve," Thomson Reuters, parent company of Reuters, said in a statement.
The U.S. House of Representatives began debate on Tuesday on efforts to repeal President Barack Obama's overhaul of the U.S. healthcare industry. Repeal of the bill is likely to fail in the Senate.
Also on Tuesday, the Health and Human Services Department released a study predicting that up to 129 million Americans under 65 who have a pre-existing health condition would risk losing health insurance or be denied coverage if the bill is repealed.
Polls show consumers are divided about the impacts of healthcare reform and the House debate has presented an opportunity for many groups to make their arguments for or against it.
REIMBURSEMENT CONCERN
Thomson Reuters researchers and physician services company HCPlexus surveyed 2,958 doctors of varying specialties from 50 states plus Washington, D.C. via fax.
The survey found that 65 percent of the doctors predict healthcare quality will decline over the next five years, 18 percent say it will improve and 17 percent believe it will remain the same.
Most -- 74 percent -- believe the changes will make their reimbursement less fair, according to the survey, available at www.HCPlexus.com/survey .
HHS has predicted that 32 million Americans who do not currently have health insurance will receive it under healthcare reforms. When asked where most of these newly insured people would get care, 55 percent of the doctors said a nurse practitioner or physician assistant would provide care.
As for patients, 57 percent of doctors predicted the impact of the changes will be negative, 27 percent said they would be positive and 15 percent forecast a neutral effect.
"The National Physicians Survey tells us that physicians have not been enlisted in the healthcare reform process," said David Shrier, chief executive officer of HCPlexus.
"The message they've taken from healthcare reform appears to be 'Do more with less.' Doctors are telling us they feel disenfranchised and overburdened," Shrier added in a statement.
Doctors were also asked about electronic medical records, a major initiative of HHS and of healthcare reform.
There, opinions were split, with 39 percent saying electronic medical records would help patients, 37 percent saying the effect would be neutral and 24 percent saying they would hurt care.
"Our present survey suggests that greater attention should be paid to understanding the present opinions of the health care provider constituency before proceeding down a path of reform. Without the physicians supporting change it will be difficult to accomplish," the report concludes.
(Editing by Eric Walsh)
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/19/us-usa-healthcare-doctors-idUSTRE70I0KT20110119
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Cut and paste FAIL!
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Cut and paste FAIL!
::) ::)
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83% to 45% to 25%
yikes
but, wait, folks,
it's jumped from 25 to 65!
pick a number, any number...
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I'm still LOL at "SPIN COCK" ;D
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Yes i imagine all these doctors would just quit an great income now.
And forget about all those years of education.
Lets quit
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So how many are quitting today? What's the magic number?
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So how many are quitting today? What's the magic number?
after the morning's read of the tea leaves, and whatever is the latest on 'townhall.com' we'll know.
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after the morning's read of the tea leaves, and whatever is the latest on 'townhall.com' we'll know.
Oh boy, won't we know. It will be cut and pasted in every single thread here over and over again.
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Just waiting for limbaugh to pull a number out of his ass so 33333 can gargle it to us in longform :-X
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ADVERTISEMENT
Eighty-three percent of American physicians have considered leaving their practices over President Barack Obama’s health care reform law, according to a survey released by the Doctor Patient Medical Association.
The DPMA, a non-partisan association of doctors and patients, surveyed a random selection of 699 doctors nationwide. The survey found that the majority have thought about bailing out of their careers over the legislation, which was upheld last month by the Supreme Court.
Even if doctors do not quit their jobs over the ruling, America will face a shortage of at least 90,000 doctors by 2020. The new health care law increases demand for physicians by expanding insurance coverage. This change will exacerbate the current shortage as more Americans live past 65.
By 2025 the shortage will balloon to over 130,000, Len Marquez, the director of government relations at the American Association of Medical Colleges, told The Daily Caller.
“One of our primary concerns is that you’ve got an aging physician workforce and you have these new beneficiaries — these newly insured people — coming through the system,” he said. “There will be strains and there will be physician shortages.”
The DPMA found that many doctors do not believe the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act will lead to better access to medical care for the majority of Americans, co-founder of the DPMA Kathryn Serkes told TheDC.
“Doctors clearly understand what Washington does not — that a piece of paper that says you are ‘covered’ by insurance or ‘enrolled’ in Medicare or Medicaid does not translate to actual medical care when doctors can’t afford to see patients at the lowball payments, and patients have to jump through government and insurance company bureaucratic hoops,” she said. (SEE ALSO: Jeremiah Wright: ‘White racist alien DNA’ running through synapses of Obama’s brain )
The American Medical Association, which endorsed Obama’s health care overhaul, was not able to immediately offer comment on the survey. Spokesperson Heather Lasher Todd said it would take time to review the information in the survey.
Janelle Davis of the American Academy of Family Physicians said the AAFP could not provide thoughtful commentary without studying the survey’s findings and methodology.
Article printed from The Daily Caller: http://dailycaller.com
URL to article: http://dailycaller.com/2012/07/09/report-83-percent-of-doctors-have-considered-quitting-over-obamacare
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This is the same "poll" from that super trustworthy group that was formed in 2011 solely in opposition to Obama care...The same exact shit you posted on page 1
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The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (PPACA) was signed in to law by President Obama on March 23, 2010. Doctor Patient Medical Association believes this law, with over 12,000 pages of new laws and regulations giving sweeping new powers to political appointees like the HHS Secretary and IRS is detrimental to the medical freedom of medical professionals and patients.
It is DPMA's position that PPACA is the Destruction Of Our Medicine, attempting to insert the government and bureaucrats between the relationship and decisions of medical professional and their patient.
http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/issues/patient-protection-and-affordable-care-act-ppaca
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DPMA led coalition letter urging repeal of PPACA
http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/images/files/Senate_PPACA_Repeal_Coalition_letter.pdf
your source is pure bullshit.. try again fuckface
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Kathryn Serkes
Learn more about corporations VOTING to rewrite our laws.
Kathryn Serkes is the Co-Founder and Chairman of the Doctor Patient Medical Association (DPMA), a conservative group working to repeal health care reform[1] that calls itself "a nonpartisan association of doctors and patients dedicated to preserving free choice in medicine."[2] The DPMA has ties to the Tea Party Movement.[3]
Ties to the American Legislative Exchange Council
Kathryn Serkes represents DPMA as a member of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) and is on ALEC's Health and Human Services Task Force.[4]
About ALEC
ALEC is a corporate bill mill. It is not just a lobby or a front group; it is much more powerful than that. Through ALEC, corporations hand state legislators their wishlists to benefit their bottom line. Corporations fund almost all of ALEC's operations. They pay for a seat on ALEC task forces where corporate lobbyists and special interest reps vote with elected officials to approve “model” bills. Learn more at the Center for Media and Democracy's ALECexposed.org, and check out breaking news on our PRWatch.org site.
Background
Role in Defeating Clinton Health Plan
According to her biography on the DPMA website, "for more than 16 years, [Serkes] served as public affairs and policy consultant for the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, representing that group during it’s litigation against the Hillary Clinton and the White House Health Care Task Force, and helping to spur the national coalition that lead to the defeat of the Clinton health plan."[4]
Time at the Controversial Federal Emergency Management Agency
"Appointed by four Administrations to serve at the Federal Emergency Management Agency" (FEMA), according to Serkes' biography, she "received that agency’s highest recognition, the 'Director’s Award for Meritorious Service.'"[4] FEMA is a "former independent agency that became part of the new U.S. Department of Homeland Security in March 2003 - is tasked with responding to, planning for, recovering from and mitigating against disasters."[5] FEMA's role in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina has been widely criticized.
Work to Limit the Rights of Americans Injured or Killed by Corporations
According to DPMA, Serkes is "founder and chair of the 'Coalition Against Prosecutorial Abuse' to rein in government trial lawyers – the criminal companion to civil tort reform."[4]
History in the PR Business
According to DPMA, Serkes "is also president and founder of Square One Media Network, a strategic communications firm serving clients such as Boeing, Sheraton Hotels, Continental Airlines, Time Warner Communications, Washington State Dairy Commission, Washington Health Care Association, and the State of Washington since 1985. Offices are located in Seattle and Washington D.C."[4]
References
↑ Suzanne Hoholik, Group Predicts Savings from Health-Care Law, Columbus Dispatch, October 27, 2011
↑ Amy Kremer, Politico Arena profile, accessed December 20, 2011
↑ National Tea Party Federation, Membership List, organizational site, accessed December 20, 2011
↑ 4.0 4.1 4.2 4.3 4.4 Doctor Patient Medical Association, Kathryn Serkes, organization biography, accessed December 20, 2011
↑ Federal Emergency Management Agency, History, government agency site, accessed December 20, 2011
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Ken Hoagland is the chairman of the FairTax National Victory Campaign based in Houston. His new book, "The FairTax Solution" appears on bookshelves March 4th and will be previewed at the upcoming CPAC Convention in Washington, D.C. More information on the FairTax can be found at www.Fairtax.org .
It's Time for a Second Tax Revolt
By Ken Hoagland (Feb 11, 2010)
More than 200 years ago a new idea about the rights of individuals and the rights of government began as a tax protest in Boston Harbor. “No taxation without... more
2008
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Bro...i can stop if you want me to...just fess up... say you picked a fucked up partisan source to try and make a point...no harm no foul
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Report: 83 percent of doctors have considered quitting over Obamacare
Published: 2:20 PM 07/09/2012
By Sally Nelson
Eighty-three percent of American physicians have considered leaving their practices over President Barack Obama’s health care reform law, according to a survey released by the Doctor Patient Medical Association.
The DPMA, a non-partisan association of doctors and patients, surveyed a random selection of 699 doctors nationwide. The survey found that the majority have thought about bailing out of their careers over the legislation, which was upheld last month by the Supreme Court.
Even if doctors do not quit their jobs over the ruling, America will face a shortage of at least 90,000 doctors by 2020. The new health care law increases demand for physicians by expanding insurance coverage. This change will exacerbate the current shortage as more Americans live past 65.
By 2025 the shortage will balloon to over 130,000, Len Marquez, the director of government relations at the American Association of Medical Colleges, told The Daily Caller.
“One of our primary concerns is that you’ve got an aging physician workforce and you have these new beneficiaries — these newly insured people — coming through the system,” he said. “There will be strains and there will be physician shortages.”
The DPMA found that many doctors do not believe the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act will lead to better access to medical care for the majority of Americans, co-founder of the DPMA Kathryn Serkes told TheDC.
“Doctors clearly understand what Washington does not — that a piece of paper that says you are ‘covered’ by insurance or ‘enrolled’ in Medicare or Medicaid does not translate to actual medical care when doctors can’t afford to see patients at the lowball payments, and patients have to jump through government and insurance company bureaucratic hoops,” she said. (SEE ALSO: Jeremiah Wright: ‘White racist alien DNA’ running through synapses of Obama’s brain )
The American Medical Association, which endorsed Obama’s health care overhaul, was not able to immediately offer comment on the survey. Spokesperson Heather Lasher Todd said it would take time to review the information in the survey.
Janelle Davis of the American Academy of Family Physicians said the AAFP could not provide thoughtful commentary without studying the survey’s findings and methodology.
http://dailycaller.com/2012/07/09/report-83-percent-of-doctors-have-considered-quitting-over-obamacare/
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Report: 83 percent of doctors have considered quitting over Obamacare
Published: 2:20 PM 07/09/2012
By Sally Nelson
Eighty-three percent of American physicians have considered leaving their practices over President Barack Obama’s health care reform law, according to a survey released by the Doctor Patient Medical Association.
The DPMA, a non-partisan association of doctors and patients, surveyed a random selection of 699 doctors nationwide. The survey found that the majority have thought about bailing out of their careers over the legislation, which was upheld last month by the Supreme Court.
Even if doctors do not quit their jobs over the ruling, America will face a shortage of at least 90,000 doctors by 2020. The new health care law increases demand for physicians by expanding insurance coverage. This change will exacerbate the current shortage as more Americans live past 65.
By 2025 the shortage will balloon to over 130,000, Len Marquez, the director of government relations at the American Association of Medical Colleges, told The Daily Caller.
“One of our primary concerns is that you’ve got an aging physician workforce and you have these new beneficiaries — these newly insured people — coming through the system,” he said. “There will be strains and there will be physician shortages.”
The DPMA found that many doctors do not believe the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act will lead to better access to medical care for the majority of Americans, co-founder of the DPMA Kathryn Serkes told TheDC.
“Doctors clearly understand what Washington does not — that a piece of paper that says you are ‘covered’ by insurance or ‘enrolled’ in Medicare or Medicaid does not translate to actual medical care when doctors can’t afford to see patients at the lowball payments, and patients have to jump through government and insurance company bureaucratic hoops,” she said. (SEE ALSO: Jeremiah Wright: ‘White racist alien DNA’ running through synapses of Obama’s brain )
The American Medical Association, which endorsed Obama’s health care overhaul, was not able to immediately offer comment on the survey. Spokesperson Heather Lasher Todd said it would take time to review the information in the survey.
Janelle Davis of the American Academy of Family Physicians said the AAFP could not provide thoughtful commentary without studying the survey’s findings and methodology.
http://dailycaller.com/2012/07/09/report-83-percent-of-doctors-have-considered-quitting-over-obamacare/
Oh Beach.. i give you more credit than 333... so as an adult lets do some homework before you repost "POLLS"..First off...just because it says non partisan doesnt make it true.. This is a Group that was put together in 2011 for the sole purpose of being anti Obama care... All you have to do is look at their WEBSITE ... look at their CEOS HISTORY on the subject and then you tell me if this is a credible source. To repost this as some kind of hard fact is just irresponsible
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Oh Beach.. i give you more credit than 333... so as an adult lets do some homework before you repost "POLLS"..First off...just because it says non partisan doesnt make it true.. This is a Group that was put together in 2011 for the sole purpose of being anti Obama care... All you have to do is look at their WEBSITE ... look at their CEOS HISTORY on the subject and then you tell me if this is a credible source. To repost this as some kind of hard fact is just irresponsible
Coming from the fool who tried to pass off "Doctors for America" baloney?
LMFAO!
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Bitch
Let me know.. if you want me to further dismantle this bullshit... you started with this 83% bullshit. And i know first hand. I was just posting some shit i found just like you did to show how easy it is. But if you really want to go on this subject i can destroy you even further. Did you vett the source of this bullshit poll. Im sure you didnt because you have the brain power of a single celled amoeba. God damn imbisile. And god forbid you come on here and say, my bad, i fucked up and used a bullshit source for this... no....you double down and make yourself look more like an idiot by throwing more idiotic numbers that contradict your first set of figures.. God damn youre a fucking moron.
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Bitch
Let me know.. if you want me to further dismantle this bullshit... you started with this 83% bullshit. And i know first hand. I was just posting some shit i found just like you did to show how easy it is. But if you really want to go on this subject i can destroy you even further. Did you vett the source of this bullshit poll. Im sure you didnt because you have the brain power of a single celled amoeba. God damn imbisile. And god forbid you come on here and say, my bad, i fucked up and used a bullshit source for this... no....you double down and make yourself look more like an idiot by throwing more idiotic numbers that contradict your first set of figures.. God damn youre a fucking moron.
I didnt start anything - I posted a widely reported on survey that most docs in your profession seem to despise obamacare.
Bro honest question - what does it feel like knowing that obama, who you voted for, single handidly, knee capped your chosen profession ?
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I didnt start anything - I posted a widely reported on survey that most docs in your profession seem to despise obamacare.
Bro honest question - what does it feel like knowing that obama, who you voted for, single handidly, knee capped your chosen profession ?
No you did start it, by posting this ridiculous thread.
And that "honest question" just shows how stupid you are. The medical group i work for. Healthcare Partners medical group. 2nd largest medical group in California to Kaiser. ITs a doctor owned group. And the Love the ACO. As a matter of fact. The CEO, who is actually a DOCTOR (unlike the marketing director who is the ceo of your DPMA) is an advisior to and HCP is of the flagship medical groups that will roll out the new healthcare reform in its functionality. I know because my mother is the Vice President of the company and ive gathering information on this since its inception from a moral standpoint and my duty as an American to help other needy Americans, as well as from a business perspective because my family's future is tied in with the medical industry, from my mother to myself. And from my mothers standpoint (BA from UCLA Masters from Stanford) ACO is great for our company and will boost buisness.
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No you did start it, by posting this ridiculous thread.
And that "honest question" just shows how stupid you are. The medical group i work for. Healthcare Partners medical group. 2nd largest medical group in California to Kaiser. ITs a doctor owned group. And the Love the ACO. As a matter of fact. The CEO, who is actually a DOCTOR (unlike the marketing director who is the ceo of your DPMA) is an advisior to and HCP is of the flagship medical groups that will roll out the new healthcare reform in its functionality. I know because my mother is the Vice President of the company and ive gathering information on this since its inception from a moral standpoint and my duty as an American to help other needy Americans, as well as from a business perspective because my family's future is tied in with the medical industry, from my mother to myself. And from my mothers standpoint (BA from UCLA Masters from Stanford) ACO is great for our company and will boost buisness.
That forcing young broke people to pay for expensive policies they will never use is definately going to boost the bottom line for some for sure!
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The policies will be less expensive than the drain of the un insured right now. By adding policies based on wage you will have the free-market deciding the cost also. But as we know 33333 doesnt beilive in the free-market or capitialism.
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That forcing young broke people to pay for expensive policies they will never use is definately going to boost the bottom line for some for sure!
Woah woah woah.. so what is it.. Is it bad for the Doctors or is it bad for the patient. There is a term in Latin used for this situation, Que Bene, Who benefits.. because someone does...
Son.. youve switched your argument like 12 times now..get it together son. You cant take a stance, get destroyed, and just morph the argument... Cmon.. get your head in the game, youre better than that son. Lets put on your bigboy pants and get back in there and act like an adult.
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The policies will be less expensive than the drain of the un insured right now. By adding policies based on wage you will have the free-market deciding the cost also. But as we know 33333 doesnt beilive in the free-market or capitialism.
False - the policies will not be cheaper and everyone, INCLUDING Obama himself admitted this. Sure he lied his ass off in his campaiging for this, but he told the truth once about this.
Anyone believing premiums will drop like obama once promised is delusional
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now im headed to get coffee..now straighten this shit out before i get back
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False - the policies will not be cheaper and everyone, INCLUDING Obama himself admitted this. Sure he lied his ass off in his campaiging for this, but he told the truth once about this.
Anyone believing premiums will drop like obama once promised is delusional
So is it bad for doctors or patients?... out with it
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The policies will be less expensive than the drain of the un insured right now. By adding policies based on wage you will have the free-market deciding the cost also. But as we know 33333 doesnt beilive in the free-market or capitialism.
Of course he doesnt why do you think he screams for the government to fix everything from the economy to the middle east for several hours everyday? Doesnt sound like a free-market no government type does it?
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False - the policies will not be cheaper and everyone, INCLUDING Obama himself admitted this. Sure he lied his ass off in his campaiging for this, but he told the truth once about this.
Anyone believing premiums will drop like obama once promised is delusional
So you dont believe in the free-market to balance this out? How conveinent.
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So you dont believe in the free-market to balance this out? How conveinent.
LOL.
Free market means insurances carriers can sell policies across state lines and offer any insurance products they want to willing customers.
Obamacare is the opposite of that.
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LOL.
Free market means insurances carriers can sell policies across state lines and offer any insurance products they want to willing customers.
Obamacare is the opposite of that.
So you' d want a national standard for health insurance instead of a states right to determine policy regulations? Then you are for national healthcare and taking away a states right to regulate it.
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So you' d want a national standard for health insurance instead of a states right to determine policy regulations? Then you are for national healthcare and taking away a states right to regulate it.
No national standard at all. That is the problem. National standard means less competition and higher prices.
If a company in say Connecticut offers a type of policy that I want, why should i be forbidden to purchase it just because I live in NYS?
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June 15, 2011 at 8:30 am Aaron Carroll
This is an ongoing series on health care system “memes” that continue to permeate our debate, even when evidence shows them to be false. The introductory post contains links to all entries.
This meme appeared recently as part of Governor Romney’s health care plan. It’s a common one, brought out often to argue that deregulation is the answer to lowering health care costs.
But let’s think this through.
The reason that insurance can’t be sold across state lines right now is that states have the right to regulate their own insurance markets. Yes, states – not the feds – get to set their own rules when it comes to the individual insurance market.
Since states differ in terms of local politics, and local needs, they set different rules for insurance. Some states want to have an insurance market where you can’t be denied insurance for any reason, and you can’t be charged more for being sick. Other states want to limit the difference you can be charged for being older or sicker if you want a policy.
I say “want” because we still live in a democracy, where people vote for what they think they need. These states have these policies because they were enacted by local governments elected by their residents. So, unless you no longer believe in state government, this is how it goes.
Right now, there’s nothing stopping an insurance company from selling policies in every state in the nation. They just have to create policies within each state that comply with local laws. Many insurance companies do this, finding a way to be profitable in each market.
This is the first problem with the “sell insurance across state lines” argument. If you support this, you’re effectively telling states that they cannot make their own decisions. They can’t set any standards for themselves locally. They have to abide by the decisions of other states when it comes to insurance.
Because, make no mistake about it, if you remove the state regulatory boundaries, all the insurance companies will set up shop in the state with the fewest regulations and start to sell insurance nationally. This is exactly what happened with the credit card industry.
Perhaps this doesn’t bother you. Perhaps you’re fine with this because you believe that it will lower costs, and that is paramount. So let’s deal with that side of the issue.
There is no doubt that when you set community ratings and guaranteed issue that the cheapest policy will be much more expensive than the cheapest policy in a state without those regulations. Let me explain. If I created an insurance company in a state without any regulations, then I could choose to cover only completely healthy young males. I could be assured none would get pregnant. None would need pelvic exams, or mammograms, or Pap smears. I could refuse to cover anyone who had ever been ill, or who had ever had a family member who had been ill.
As you can imagine, it would be really cheap to care for this population, and so the insurance I’d sell would be really, really inexpensive. Everyone else, however, would be out of luck. And anyone who tried to insure that population would find a skewed risk pool, making the average policy created for it really expensive.
Now, if I’m a healthy, young male in a regulated state it might be attractive to me to buy a policy from that unregulated state. But if I were a female with diabetes, I’d be totally screwed. Moreover, as all the healthy people snapped up cheap policies, the remaining people would form an uninsurable risk pool.
About 20% of the population is responsible for about 80% of health care spending. Would they be any less ill? Would their medicines cost less? Would their procedures? What exactly about health care would be cheaper in this alternate reality?
No one would want to insure them.
What we would have is a world where it would be likely cheaper for those who don’t need health care to get insurance. For everyone else, especially those who need care, insurance would be more expensive, and care harder to obtain.
There’s no example of this working out well, anywhere in the world. It’s rhetoric that sounds good, but would lead to terrible outcomes.
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Good read
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Another one bites the dust
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Woah woah woah.. so what is it.. Is it bad for the Doctors or is it bad for the patient. There is a term in Latin used for this situation, Que Bene, Who benefits.. because someone does...
Son.. youve switched your argument like 12 times now..get it together son. You cant take a stance, get destroyed, and just morph the argument... Cmon.. get your head in the game, youre better than that son. Lets put on your bigboy pants and get back in there and act like an adult.
This is the very reason mommy makes him wear a helmet while on the internet. To reduce the damage of having his ass whipped in threads all the time.
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This is the very reason mommy makes him wear a helmet while on the internet. To reduce the damage of having his ass whipped in threads all the time.
LOL.
You are one sick perv aint you? Stalking people like a jilted obsessed ex stil not over the break up.
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Oh Beach.. i give you more credit than 333... so as an adult lets do some homework before you repost "POLLS"..First off...just because it says non partisan doesnt make it true.. This is a Group that was put together in 2011 for the sole purpose of being anti Obama care... All you have to do is look at their WEBSITE ... look at their CEOS HISTORY on the subject and then you tell me if this is a credible source. To repost this as some kind of hard fact is just irresponsible
I don't know anything about the group, or whether the poll results are credible. I looked at the site and I don't see anything in their purpose section that talks about Obamacare or the group being formed solely to defeat Obamacare. You'd know more about that than me. Here is the link: http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/who-we-are
But if the poll is accurate, it does support what 33 was saying.
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I don't know anything about the group, or whether the poll results are credible. I looked at the site and I don't see anything in their purpose section that talks about Obamacare or the group being formed solely to defeat Obamacare. You'd know more about that than me. Here is the link: http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/who-we-are
But if the poll is accurate, it does support what 33 was saying.
Of course not! If I post something negative about Obama it just has to be fake! Didnt you hear? Dear Highest Lord Messiah can do no wrong and the edicts and dictates to us serfs from above are loved universally by the populace at large.
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LOL.
You are one sick perv aint you? Stalking people like a jilted obsessed ex stil not over the break up.
If I were going to stalk someone it would be someone that actually had a life. Not an internet dwelling reject from society.
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That forcing young broke people to pay for expensive policies they will NEVER use
really?
this will be the first generation that NEVER gets sick, goes to the doctor, gets involved in accidents?
this I gotta see.
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LOL.
You are one sick perv aint you? Stalking people like a jilted obsessed ex stil not over the break up.
no, it's just that you are so fun to tease.
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I don't know anything about the group, or whether the poll results are credible. I looked at the site and I don't see anything in their purpose section that talks about Obamacare or the group being formed solely to defeat Obamacare. You'd know more about that than me. Here is the link: http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/who-we-are
But if the poll is accurate, it does support what 33 was saying.
Ok..ill take that.
But all you have to do is look at their CEO and why they were created.
Its very easy to do.
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Of course not! If I post something negative about Obama it just has to be fake! Didnt you hear? Dear Highest Lord Messiah can do no wrong and the edicts and dictates to us serfs from above are loved universally by the populace at large.
See.. instead of defending your article.. you go and get sarcastic... as i see.. you got nothin as usual...
The Mal Destroys again...
Thank you thank you thank you
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Ok..ill take that.
But all you have to do is look at their CEO and why they were created.
Its very easy to do.
Who is their CEO? I didn't see his/her name on the website. I looked at the bios of the two founders and there is no indication they formed the group solely to be anti-Obamacare.
Which part of the website are you talking about?
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Kathryn Serkes
there you go...
And on the real, thanks for taking the time to actually research the source...like for real.. it would be easy to go and run with it because its on the internet but if youre actually looking into it.. thats cool.
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Kathryn Serkes
there you go...
And on the real, thanks for taking the time to actually research the source...like for real.. it would be easy to go and run with it because its on the internet but if youre actually looking into it.. thats cool.
Thanks. I looked at her bio and a clip of her talking about the individual mandate. I'll give you that she is anti-Obamacare. But I don't see where she formed the group solely to be anti-Obamacare.
She sounds like she is concerned about the rising costs of healthcare. I only watched a couple clips, but what she says appears to be consistent with what the majority of Americans think: they don't like the individual mandate and they're concerned about rising costs.
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Kathryn Serkes
Learn more about corporations VOTING to rewrite our laws.
Kathryn Serkes is the Co-Founder and Chairman of the Doctor Patient Medical Association (DPMA), a conservative group working to repeal health care reform[1] that calls itself "a nonpartisan association of doctors and patients dedicated to preserving free choice in medicine."[2] The DPMA has ties to the Tea Party Movement.[3]
Ties to the American Legislative Exchange Council
Kathryn Serkes represents DPMA as a member of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) and is on ALEC's Health and Human Services Task Force.[4]
About ALEC
ALEC is a corporate bill mill. It is not just a lobby or a front group; it is much more powerful than that. Through ALEC, corporations hand state legislators their wishlists to benefit their bottom line. Corporations fund almost all of ALEC's operations. They pay for a seat on ALEC task forces where corporate lobbyists and special interest reps vote with elected officials to approve “model” bills. Learn more at the Center for Media and Democracy's ALECexposed.org, and check out breaking news on our PRWatch.org site.
Background
Role in Defeating Clinton Health Plan
According to her biography on the DPMA website, "for more than 16 years, [Serkes] served as public affairs and policy consultant for the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, representing that group during it’s litigation against the Hillary Clinton and the White House Health Care Task Force, and helping to spur the national coalition that lead to the defeat of the Clinton health plan."[4]
Time at the Controversial Federal Emergency Management Agency
"Appointed by four Administrations to serve at the Federal Emergency Management Agency" (FEMA), according to Serkes' biography, she "received that agency’s highest recognition, the 'Director’s Award for Meritorious Service.'"[4] FEMA is a "former independent agency that became part of the new U.S. Department of Homeland Security in March 2003 - is tasked with responding to, planning for, recovering from and mitigating against disasters."[5] FEMA's role in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina has been widely criticized.
Work to Limit the Rights of Americans Injured or Killed by Corporations
According to DPMA, Serkes is "founder and chair of the 'Coalition Against Prosecutorial Abuse' to rein in government trial lawyers – the criminal companion to civil tort reform."[4]
History in the PR Business
According to DPMA, Serkes "is also president and founder of Square One Media Network, a strategic communications firm serving clients such as Boeing, Sheraton Hotels, Continental Airlines, Time Warner Communications, Washington State Dairy Commission, Washington Health Care Association, and the State of Washington since 1985. Offices are located in Seattle and Washington D.C."[4]
References
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Kathryn Serkes
Learn more about corporations VOTING to rewrite our laws.
Kathryn Serkes is the Co-Founder and Chairman of the Doctor Patient Medical Association (DPMA), a conservative group working to repeal health care reform[1] that calls itself "a nonpartisan association of doctors and patients dedicated to preserving free choice in medicine."[2] The DPMA has ties to the Tea Party Movement.[3]
Ties to the American Legislative Exchange Council
Kathryn Serkes represents DPMA as a member of the American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) and is on ALEC's Health and Human Services Task Force.[4]
About ALEC
ALEC is a corporate bill mill. It is not just a lobby or a front group; it is much more powerful than that. Through ALEC, corporations hand state legislators their wishlists to benefit their bottom line. Corporations fund almost all of ALEC's operations. They pay for a seat on ALEC task forces where corporate lobbyists and special interest reps vote with elected officials to approve “model” bills. Learn more at the Center for Media and Democracy's ALECexposed.org, and check out breaking news on our PRWatch.org site.
Background
Role in Defeating Clinton Health Plan
According to her biography on the DPMA website, "for more than 16 years, [Serkes] served as public affairs and policy consultant for the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, representing that group during it’s litigation against the Hillary Clinton and the White House Health Care Task Force, and helping to spur the national coalition that lead to the defeat of the Clinton health plan."[4]
Time at the Controversial Federal Emergency Management Agency
"Appointed by four Administrations to serve at the Federal Emergency Management Agency" (FEMA), according to Serkes' biography, she "received that agency’s highest recognition, the 'Director’s Award for Meritorious Service.'"[4] FEMA is a "former independent agency that became part of the new U.S. Department of Homeland Security in March 2003 - is tasked with responding to, planning for, recovering from and mitigating against disasters."[5] FEMA's role in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina has been widely criticized.
Work to Limit the Rights of Americans Injured or Killed by Corporations
According to DPMA, Serkes is "founder and chair of the 'Coalition Against Prosecutorial Abuse' to rein in government trial lawyers – the criminal companion to civil tort reform."[4]
History in the PR Business
According to DPMA, Serkes "is also president and founder of Square One Media Network, a strategic communications firm serving clients such as Boeing, Sheraton Hotels, Continental Airlines, Time Warner Communications, Washington State Dairy Commission, Washington Health Care Association, and the State of Washington since 1985. Offices are located in Seattle and Washington D.C."[4]
References
Doesn't exactly sound like an unbiased source.
Also, do you think this makes the poll results unreliable?
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Doesn't exactly sound like an unbiased source.
Also, do you think this makes the poll results unreliable?
Well The founders background as anti healthcare reform + the fact that the group was formed in 2011 + the fact that they actually wrote a letter state senators for the repeal of obama care+ the fact that the letter is signed by a whos who of right winged news, commentators, authors etc. It raised eyebrows wouldn't ya think.
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Well The founders background as anti healthcare reform + the fact that the group was formed in 2011 + the fact that they actually wrote a letter state senators for the repeal of obama care+ the fact that the letter is signed by a whos who of right winged news, commentators, authors etc. It raised eyebrows wouldn't ya think.
How about the simple fact that obamcare sucks and was a product of fraud and corruption?
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also
The Doctor Patient Medical Association (DPMA) and the Patient Power Alliance (PPA) work to repeal health care reform and call themselves a "a nonpartisan association of doctors and patients dedicated to preserving free choice in medicine."The organization is a member of the National Tea Party Federation and the "American Grassroots Coalition."
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How about the simple fact that obamcare sucks and was a product of fraud and corruption?
Yeah...i just dismantled your dumb ass poll that your are trying to pass off as fact.. i see you got quiet on the thread because you saw how full of shit it was...
you cant say..."hey this is bad... and this is why..." and then when your reason is totally proven to be false you cant say "well screw you its still bad"
Thats like going to court and saying , "this guy is charged with murder because we found a bloody knife in his home" and then come to find out.. it wasnt his home and he was in iceland at the time of the murder, you cant just say "well fuck it.. he is still guilty" just doesnt work like that.. i dont like the bill either.. but i will not sit here and let you pass junk data to further your point.. thats not what adults do
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Many other polls show similar hatred of ThugCare. it's only Obama slaves like yourself, who suffer stockholm syndrome, think that it is ok.
Yeah...i just dismantled your dumb ass poll that your are trying to pass off as fact.. i see you got quiet on the thread because you saw how full of shit it was...
you cant say..."hey this is bad... and this is why..." and then when your reason is totally proven to be false you cant say "well screw you its still bad"
Thats like going to court and saying , "this guy is charged with murder because we found a bloody knife in his home" and then come to find out.. it wasnt his home and he was in iceland at the time of the murder, you cant just say "well fuck it.. he is still guilty" just doesnt work like that.. i dont like the bill either.. but i will not sit here and let you pass junk data to further your point.. thats not what adults do
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Many other polls show similar hatred of ThugCare. it's only Obama slaves like yourself, who suffer stockholm syndrome, think that it is ok.
I just said i dont like Obamacare.. so what the fuck are you talking about... are you going retard again... you got to be the dumbest person on this board.. You just dont give a shit about how far your ignorance goes... its truly amazing. its a site to see
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I just said i dont like Obamacare.. so what the fuck are you talking about... are you going retard again... you got to be the dumbest person on this board.. You just dont give a shit about how far your ignorance goes... its truly amazing. its a site to see
Me and more than 50% who want this mess repealed.
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Me and more than 50% who want this mess repealed.
Boy you just wont stop.. you revel in your ignorance like a pig in shit... Fuckin idiot
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Boy you just wont stop.. you revel in your ignorance like a pig in shit... Fuckin idiot
I guess so. Most people hate ObamaCare. FACT.
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Well The founders background as anti healthcare reform + the fact that the group was formed in 2011 + the fact that they actually wrote a letter state senators for the repeal of obama care+ the fact that the letter is signed by a whos who of right winged news, commentators, authors etc. It raised eyebrows wouldn't ya think.
Yes, it raises eyebrows. Does it make the poll not credible? Perhaps. But I haven't seen anything yet that shows the numbers are unreliable. Even biased sources can provide credible information.
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I didnt start anything - I posted a widely reported on survey that most docs in your profession seem to despise obamacare.
Bro honest question - what does it feel like knowing that obama, who you voted for, single handidly, knee capped your chosen profession ?
Dude..docs do not like change.........they don't like anything new because they like cost certainty....they like knowing what they will get in fees so they in turn can pay their malpractice insurance, golf fees, etc......I understand that....but docs were against Medicaid as well...how did that work out for them???..many docs have gotten rich off medicaid...
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Of course not! If I post something negative about Obama it just has to be fake! Didnt you hear? Dear Highest Lord Messiah can do no wrong and the edicts and dictates to us serfs from above are loved universally by the populace at large.
maybe because 90% of what you post IS fake or very very subjective.....I still remember your legendary Obama thread on how he and Michelle had a secret service agent fired because he had overheard Obama and Michelle saying racist things about white people....
That thread was the first major confrontation that you and I had on Getbig....before that, we got along well and actually agreed with each other a lot...(a period I am ashamed of) you were the only person on the internet and in the news world who had heard this....once I destroyed you in that thread and exposed you as a fraud, you went off the deep end and began your anti-Obama campaign
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really?
this will be the first generation that NEVER gets sick, goes to the doctor, gets involved in accidents?
this I gotta see.
very nice destructive comeback.......
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See.. instead of defending your article.. you go and get sarcastic... as i see.. you got nothin as usual...
The Mal Destroys again...
Thank you thank you thank you
thats usually the first step....then come the stupid crybaby pictures before he disappears from the thread totally
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So are we running out of doctors yet?
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So are we running out of doctors yet?
We didn't really run out of them.
They're just rioting in the streets, so they aren't in the hospitals at the moment.
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We didn't really run out of them.
They're just rioting in the streets, so they aren't in the hospitals at the moment.
Is that what that noise is? I thought it was my tumbler
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This is like watching a fat girl have her period in a shark tank.
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very nice destructive comeback.......
short
sweet
to the point.
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There are surveys all across the board on this mess and all point to one thing - both doctors and taxpayers hate it in large numbers.
You obama tampons can cry all you like - but your messiahs' agenda is not popular with anyone but his fringe base of gays, racist blacks, enviro marxists, government workers, commies, and a few guilt ridden white aging hippies.
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There are surveys all across the board on this mess and all point to one thing - both doctors and taxpayers hate it in large numbers.
You obama tampons can cry all you like - but your messiahs' agenda is not popular with anyone but his fringe base of gays, racist blacks, enviro marxists, government workers, commies, and a few guilt ridden white aging hippies.
And why do they hate it? They have no idea what long-term impact its gonna have and neither do you. They just "know" what they are spoon-feed like you
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And why do they hate it? They have no idea what long-term impact its gonna have and neither do you. They just "know" what they are spoon-feed like you
http://newsok.com/obamacare-a-minefield-for-workers-in-oklahoma/article/3691058/?page=1
Read - simple to understand for you why ObamaCare sucks for everyone.
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Under penalty of law we are to do business with private companies. How can this be good long term?
Basically I bet it boiled down to this:
Government to medical industry: you gotta reform you bull shit policies
Medical industry to government: fuck you
Government to medical industry: ok then we will make it a law to buy insurance from you
Medical industry to government: thank you now we get the best of both worlds, 30 million new customers and the higher costs.
Maybe you fucking tards should stop sucking anti 333333 SPIN COCK so much or better yet serve up some actual facts, because if this is anything like car insurance in Cali, which has some of the most expensive auto ins in the country this shit ain't getting cheaper, it's going up.
PS: 83% of doctors may be quitting is PURE SPIN COCK also.
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This isn't about Obamacare. This is about the claim of 83% of docs quitting, for whatever reason you can come up with.
It just isn't happening. Keep chasing your tail and getting beat down over it though.
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Under penalty of law we are to do business with private companies. How can this be good long term?
Maybe you fucking tards should stop sucking anti 333333 SPIN COCK so much or better yet serve up some actual facts, because if this is anything like car insurance in Cali, which has some of the most expensive auto ins in the country this shit ain't getting cheaper, it's going up.
PS: 83% of doctors may be quitting is PURE SPIN COCK also.
Ok.. as ive stated before..I am anti Obama care..I dont like it.. To me its either Shit or get off the pot.. Make it universal and taxes pay for it... or dont do it at all... This half half shit just benefits the same people its been benefiting. My gripe is, when the points against it get outrageous and just plain ole dumb. I dont like driving SUVs any more because of gas. But if there is an anti SUV group out there saying they are bad because they tip over and explode upon ignition and 97% polled think they will stop driving them. Thats when i have a problem. We cant get to the truth because its covered up by so much bullshit filler falsehoods. Once we can get down to brass tax, we can address it easier. But if we pile on a shit ton of crap, it only makes the argument less credible and turns the discussion to an idealogical shit pool. I dont like Obama, but youre not going to make me dislike him any more by coming on here saying he is going to eat your children.
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This isn't about Obamacare. This is about the claim of 83% of docs quitting, for whatever reason you can come up with.
It just isn't happening. Keep chasing your tail and getting beat down over it though.
It was one survey that was reported on. There are others showing less, but still show that a majority of docs and taxpayers - HATE OBAMACARE.
Get over it - people hated obamacare in 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 etc.
There is no polishing this turd. Its a horrible law from start to finish.
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Ok.. as ive stated before..I am anti Obama care..I dont like it.. To me its either Shit or get off the pot.. Make it universal and taxes pay for it... or dont do it at all... This half half shit just benefits the same people its been benefiting. My gripe is, when the points against it get outrageous and just plain ole dumb. I dont like driving SUVs any more because of gas. But if there is an anti SUV group out there saying they are bad because they tip over and explode upon ignition and 97% polled think they will stop driving them. Thats when i have a problem. We cant get to the truth because its covered up by so much bullshit filler falsehoods. Once we can get down to brass tax, we can address it easier. But if we pile on a shit ton of crap, it only makes the argument less credible and turns the discussion to an idealogical shit pool. I dont like Obama, but youre not going to make me dislike him any more by coming on here saying he is going to eat your children.
Come on bro - he already ate dogs. Accusing him of wanting to eat kids is not that far a stretch at this point. :P :P
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Ok.. as ive stated before..I am anti Obama care..I dont like it.. To me its either Shit or get off the pot.. Make it universal and taxes pay for it... or dont do it at all... This half half shit just benefits the same people its been benefiting. My gripe is, when the points against it get outrageous and just plain ole dumb. I dont like driving SUVs any more because of gas. But if there is an anti SUV group out there saying they are bad because they tip over and explode upon ignition and 97% polled think they will stop driving them. Thats when i have a problem. We cant get to the truth because its covered up by so much bullshit filler falsehoods. Once we can get down to brass tax, we can address it easier. But if we pile on a shit ton of crap, it only makes the argument less credible and turns the discussion to an idealogical shit pool. I dont like Obama, but youre not going to make me dislike him any more by coming on here saying he is going to eat your children.
I agree and you are preaching to the choir here.
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oh ok.. i put that just incase you thought i was just anti 3333 for the hell of it..
Im not.,. im just anti dumb shit
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oh ok.. i put that just incase you thought i was just anti 3333 for the hell of it..
Im not.,. im just anti dumb shit
I know lol, I read your responses to 33333 all the time. :)
It's the same formula with him:
You back him into a corner or call him on his BS he reverts to:
You morons voted for him, you are kneepadder, or derails and deflects, etc.
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I know lol, I read your responses to 33333 all the time. :)
It's the same formula with him:
You back him into a corner or call him on his BS he reverts to:
You morons voted for him, you are kneepadder, or derails and deflects, etc.
The time to stop ObamaCare came and went in 2010 and if the democrats who voted for Obama stood up to this thuggery like the Tea Party tried to, it never would have passed. Many of us warned everyone from Day FNG 1 how bad this was, but it all fell on deaf ears because of course those racist fringe right wingers are always crazy right?.
But nooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooo, we had to let the Messiah have his way because to oppose him was racist. I mean who could possibly oppose "health care"? So the democrats sat silent and never challenged or said shit and just let it happen without so much of a peep being said. Despite the lies, despite the policy reversals, despite the corruption, despite the payoffs, despite the warnings, the left sat silent why?
Same as Obama's police state and war mongering policies that they were in the streets over when it was GWB.
The answer is very simple.
We are living in a Cult of Personality w Obama to where he can ram through a corrupt, evil, and disastrous agenda no one else could possibly even dream of.
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We are living in a Cult of Personality w Obama to where he can ram through a corrupt, evil, and disastrous agenda no one else could possibly even dream of.
:D
Seriously you are way to bored. Only people with nothing to do what-so-ever can come up with this shit
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We are living in a Cult of Personality w Obama to where he can ram through a corrupt, evil, and disastrous agenda no one else could possibly even dream of.
:D
Seriously you are way to bored. Only people with nothing to do what-so-ever can come up with this shit
As a cult member yourself, you , like the other obamabots are too corrupted and blind to see it.
Please explain to me one reason why the left refuses to hold obama accountable to his lies and continuation and expansion of the GWB 2nd Term?
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As a cult member yourself, you , like the other obamabots are too corrupted and blind to see it.
Please explain to me one reason why the left refuses to hold obama accountable to his lies and continuation and expansion of the GWB 2nd Term?
Why bother any argument i can come up with would mean ZERO anyway because anyone who disagrees with you are Obama cult members, lefties and commies anyway, right?
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Why bother any argument i can come up with would mean ZERO anyway because anyone who disagrees with you are Obama cult members, lefties and commies anyway, right?
Simple question - not trolling - why havent democrats ever held obama accountable for doing things there were in the streets over that Bush did and which he explicitly promised he would not do?
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Simple question - not trolling - why havent democrats ever held obama accountable for doing things there were in the streets over that Bush did and which he explicitly promised he would not do?
Because they are democrats and so is Obama.
Why are republicans trying to smear Obama for doing politics very much like their hero Reagan? Because they are REPUBLICAN.
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Because they are democrats and so is Obama.
Why are republicans trying to smear Obama for doing politics very much like their hero Reagan? Because they are REPUBLICAN.
I asked that question because many in the GOP fought back on GWB w amnesty for illegals, harriet meirs, dubai ports, etc etc.
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It was one survey that was reported on. There are others showing less, but still show that a majority of docs and taxpayers - HATE OBAMACARE.
Get over it - people hated obamacare in 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 etc.
There is no polishing this turd. Its a horrible law from start to finish.
I know you are stupid. You have proven it. You don't have to continue to do so. Sometimes it seems like you take it as a personal challenge to reach new levels.
But this entire beat down you are getting isn't over the % of docs that hate Obamacare. It is over the % who are quitting. Walking off their jobs. Or so you claim.
Guess what? 100% of docs hate their malpractice insurance rates. Does that mean 100% of docs are walking off their jobs to riot in the street simply because they HATE something? No, it doesn't. It is a complete different argument there. You got your ass handed to you and tried to shift gears and deflect it onto a completely different subject in order to be "right". FAIL
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I know you are stupid. You have proven it. You don't have to continue to do so. Sometimes it seems like you take it as a personal challenge to reach new levels.
But this entire beat down you are getting isn't over the % of docs that hate Obamacare. It is over the % who are quitting. Walking off their jobs. Or so you claim.
Guess what? 100% of docs hate their malpractice insurance rates. Does that mean 100% of docs are walking off their jobs to riot in the street simply because they HATE something? No, it doesn't. It is a complete different argument there. You got your ass handed to you and tried to shift gears and deflect it onto a completely different subject in order to be "right". FAIL
I posted a survey that has been widely reported.
Yeah, real fail for me. ::) ::)
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I asked that question because many in the GOP fought back on GWB w amnesty for illegals, harriet meirs, dubai ports, etc etc.
The democratic party doesnt have a lot of independent thinkers i guess :)
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I posted a survey that has been widely reported.
Yeah, real fail for me. ::) ::)
Bullshit is always widely reported. Doesn't mean it is true.
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Bullshit is always widely reported. Doesn't mean it is true.
So true so true - remember that thingy about Obama being the most intelligent person ever to become POTUS?
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Yeah. How many times did I say that again? Remind me.... was it ZERO?
You can't attribute that lie to me.
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romney said in 08 that it's because so many irresponsible people CHOOSE not to buy health insurance.
was he wrong about this?
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I posted a survey that has been widely reported.
Yeah, real fail for me. ::) ::)
Dude be smarter than that. Just because its said over and over in the same circles doesnt make it accurate..
Please tell me you understand that? This shit gets tiring at times.. you just dont care.. you will Dumb out from sun up to sun down
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Dude be smarter than that. Just because its said over and over in the same circles doesnt make it accurate..
Please tell me you understand that? This shit gets tiring at times.. you just dont care.. you will Dumb out from sun up to sun down
Its one survey - there are others out there too. Is 83% probably too high? Sure.
But almost every single pollfrom 2010 to the present date show that most docs, patients, and taxpayers absolutely hate obamacare.
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We are not discussing your claim of how many docs hate obamacare. We are discussing your claim of how many docs are quitting their jobs.
Two separate issues. Stick to the one that you started this thread on.
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We are not discussing your claim of how many docs hate obamacare. We are discussing your claim of how many docs are quitting their jobs.
Two separate issues. Stick to the one that you started this thread on.
Read the headline fool.
Does it say "WILL QUIT"?
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romney is so much like obama, it's not funny.
when you hear repubs screaming "we have to STOP Obama, only romney can do that now!"
What the hell in romney's past makes you think he'll be any different?
he signed an anti-gun law. he wrote obamacare and said it'd be great for the nation. He said a woman has a right to kill an unborn child.
These aren't distortions of the leftist media - these are romney's actual positions for decades. i guess it's like having your woman secretly work as a porn star for 25 years, get caught, a week later you're ready to open-mouth kiss her because "well, it beats being alone..."
Romney is the cocksweat of 10,000 men, after a nice spraying of fabreeze. Enjoy it, you dipshits nominated him.
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Read the headline fool.
Does it say "WILL QUIT"?
That's like saying the issues is WILL HATE instead of WILL QUIT.
Does the headline contain a % number and the word QUIT?
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I posted a survey that has been widely reported.
Yeah, real fail for me. ::) ::)
Its not fail for you.
SPIN COCK is just the norm for you.
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Virtually all physicians walked out of Obamacare session at national conference
Virtually all physicians walked out of Obamacare session at national conference
April 22, 2013 by Janeen Capizola 1 Comment
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Ophthalmologists from across the country walked out of a session on Obamacare Sunday during a national conference being held in San Francisco.
Twitchy reported ophthalmologist Dr. Kris Held sent live-tweets from the “Government relations” session on “implementing and complying with Obamacare,” saying virtually all the physicians walked out of the speech in disgust.
http://www.bizpacreview.com/2013/04/22/virtually-all-physicians-walked-out-of-obamacare-session-at-national-conference-63765
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ill give this a day before the real truth comes out... then youll say "but but but.. thats what was reported.. take it up with them"... ::)
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ill give this a day before the real truth comes out... then youll say "but but but.. thats what was reported.. take it up with them"... ::)
Keep staying in denial and delusion of the wreckage your two votes helped create - FORWARD!!!!!
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Keep staying in denial and delusion of the wreckage your two votes helped create - FORWARD!!!!!
ok... im just going by your track record
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ok... im just going by your track record
Go to the link.
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Go to the link.
i went... and i also checked the source :o
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i went... and i also checked the source :o
Yeah people at the place are all tweeting lies. Got it ::) ::)
How does it feel knowing all the debt you racked up for a profession now destroyed by the scumbag you voted for TWICE!
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the notion that doctors, especially self employed health practitioners, don't like Obamacare is not a big fucking secret you guys. i have a bunch of clients that are doctors. They all bitch about the same things. the harder it is to get paid, the less lucrative the work becomes.
also 83% sounds really high. thats why a lot of you are dismissing this number outright. what you fail to understand is that these doctors are, for the most part, intelligent, highly educated people who can more easily make a transition into something else. they don't have to leave the MEDICAL industry to make that change. the danger is that they will pull out of the HEALTHCARE industry. when the best and brightest have better options within the medical field other than healthcare, thats where the danger comes in.
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http://money.cnn.com/2013/04/25/smallbusiness/doctor-quit-healthcare/index.html
Hope and Change SUCKERS!!!!!!!
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How Government Killed the Medical Profession
Reason ^ | Apr. 22, 2013 | Jeffrey A. Singer
Posted on Tuesday, April 23, 2013 11:01:21 PM by neverdem
As health care gets more bureaucratic, will doctors go Galt?
I am a general surgeon with more than three decades in private clinical practice. And I am fed up. Since the late 1970s, I have witnessed remarkable technological revolutions in medicine, from CT scans to robot-assisted surgery. But I have also watched as medicine slowly evolved into the domain of technicians, bookkeepers, and clerks.
Government interventions over the past four decades have yielded a cascade of perverse incentives, bureaucratic diktats, and economic pressures that together are forcing doctors to sacrifice their independent professional medical judgment, and their integrity. The consequence is clear: Many doctors from my generation are exiting the field. Others are seeing their private practices threatened with bankruptcy, or are giving up their autonomy for the life of a shift-working hospital employee. Governments and hospital administrators hold all the power, while doctors—and worse still, patients—hold none.
The Coding Revolution
At first, the decay was subtle. In the 1980s, Medicare imposed price controls upon physicians who treated anyone over 65. Any provider wishing to get compensated was required to use International Statistical Classification of Diseases (ICD) and Current Procedural Terminology (CPT) codes to describe the service when submitting a bill. The designers of these systems believed that standardized classifications would lead to more accurate adjudication of Medicare claims.
What it actually did was force doctors to wedge their patients and their services into predetermined, ill-fitting categories. This approach resembled the command-and-control models used in the Soviet bloc and the People’s Republic of China, models that were already failing spectacularly by the end of the 1980s.
Before long, these codes were attached to a fee schedule based upon the amount of time a medical professional had to devote to each patient, a concept perilously close to another Marxist relic: the labor theory of value. Named the Resource-Based Relative Value System (RBRVS), each procedure code was assigned a specific value, by a panel of experts, based supposedly upon the amount of time and labor it required. It didn’t matter if an operation was being performed by a renowned surgical expert—perhaps the inventor of the procedure—or by a doctor just out of residency doing the operation for the first time. They both got paid the same.
Hospitals’ reimbursements for their Medicare-patient treatments were based on another coding system: the Diagnosis Related Group (DRG). Each diagnostic code is assigned a specific monetary value, and the hospital is paid based on one or a combination of diagnostic codes used to describe the reason for a patient’s hospitalization. If, say, the diagnosis is pneumonia, then the hospital is given a flat amount for that diagnosis, regardless of the amount of equipment, staffing, and days used to treat a particular patient.
As a result, the hospital is incentivized to attach as many adjunct diagnostic codes as possible to try to increase the Medicare payday. It is common for hospital coders to contact the attending physicians and try to coax them into adding a few more diagnoses into the hospital record.
Medicare has used these two price-setting systems (RBRVS for doctors, DRG for hospitals) to maintain its price control system for more than 20 years. Doctors and their advocacy associations cooperated, trading their professional latitude for the lure of maintaining monopoly control of the ICD and CPT codes that determine their payday. The goal of setting their own prices has proved elusive, though—every year the industry’s biggest trade group, the American Medical Association, squabbles with various medical specialty associations and the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS) over fees.
As goes Medicare, so goes the private insurance industry. Insurers, starting in the late 1980s, began the practice of using the Medicare fee schedule to serve as the basis for negotiation of compensation with the doctors and hospitals on their preferred provider lists. An insurance company might offer a hospital 130 percent of Medicare’s reimbursement for a specific procedure code, for instance.
The coding system was supposed to improve the accuracy of adjudicating claims submitted by doctors and hospitals to Medicare, and later to non-Medicare insurance companies. Instead, it gave doctors and hospitals an incentive to find ways of describing procedures and services with the cluster of codes that would yield the biggest payment. Sometimes this required the assistance of consulting firms. A cottage industry of fee-maximizing advisors and seminars bloomed.
I recall more than one occasion when I discovered at such a seminar that I was “undercoding” for procedures I routinely perform; a small tweak meant a bigger check for me. That fact encouraged me to keep one eye on the codes at all times, leaving less attention for my patients. Today, most doctors in private practice employ coding specialists, a relatively new occupation, to oversee their billing departments.
Another goal of the coding system was to provide Medicare, regulatory agencies, research organizations, and insurance companies with a standardized method of collecting epidemiological data—the information medical professionals use to track ailments across different regions and populations. However, the developers of the coding system did not anticipate the unintended consequence of linking the laudable goal of epidemiologic data mining with a system of financial reward.
This coding system leads inevitably to distortions in epidemiological data. Because doctors are required to come up with a diagnostic code on each bill submitted in order to get paid, they pick the code that comes closest to describing the patient’s problem while yielding maximum remuneration. The same process plays out when it comes to submitting procedure codes on bills. As a result, the accuracy of the data collected since the advent of compensation coding is suspect.
Command and Control
Coding was one of the earliest manifestations of the cancer consuming the medical profession, but the disease is much more broad-based and systemic. The root of the problem is that patients are not payers. Through myriad tax and regulatory policies adopted on the federal and state level, the system rarely sees a direct interaction between a consumer and a provider of a health care good or service. Instead, a third party—either a private insurance company or a government payer, such as Medicare or Medicaid—covers almost all the costs. According to the National Center for Policy Analysis, on average, the consumer pays only 12 percent of the total health care bill directly out of pocket. There is no incentive, through a market system with transparent prices, for either the provider or the consumer to be cost-effective.
As the third party payment system led health care costs to escalate, the people footing the bill have attempted to rein in costs with yet more command-and-control solutions. In the 1990s, private insurance carriers did this through a form of health plan called a health maintenance organization, or HMO. Strict oversight, rationing, and practice protocols were imposed on both physicians and patients. Both groups protested loudly. Eventually, most of these top-down regulations were set aside, and many HMOs were watered down into little more than expensive prepaid health plans.
Then, as the 1990s gave way to the 21st century, demographic reality caught up with Medicare and Medicaid, the two principal drivers of federal health care spending.
Twenty years after the fall of the Iron Curtain, protocols and regimentation were imposed on America’s physicians through a centralized bureaucracy. Using so-called “evidence-based medicine,” algorithms and protocols were based on statistically generalized, rather than individualized, outcomes in large population groups.
While all physicians appreciate the development of general approaches to the work-up and treatment of various illnesses and disorders, we also realize that everyone is an individual—that every protocol or algorithm is based on the average, typical case. We want to be able to use our knowledge, years of experience, and sometimes even our intuition to deal with each patient as a unique person while bearing in mind what the data and research reveal.
Being pressured into following a pre-determined set of protocols inhibits clinical judgment, especially when it comes to atypical problems. Some medical educators are concerned that excessive reliance on these protocols could make students less likely to recognize and deal with complicated clinical presentations that don’t follow standard patterns. It is easy to standardize treatment protocols. But it is difficult to standardize patients.
What began as guidelines eventually grew into requirements. In order for hospitals to maintain their Medicare certification, the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services began to require their medical staff to follow these protocols or face financial retribution.
Once again, the medical profession cooperated. The American College of Surgeons helped develop Surgical Care Improvement Project (SCIP) protocols, directing surgeons as to what antibiotics they may use and the day-to-day post-operative decisions they must make. If a surgeon deviates from the guidelines, he is usually required to document in the medical record an acceptable justification for that decision.
These requirements have consequences. On more than one occasion I have seen patients develop dramatic postoperative bruising and bleeding because of protocol-mandated therapies aimed at preventing the development of blood clots in the legs after surgery. Had these therapies been left up to the clinical judgment of the surgeon, many of these patients might not have had the complication.
Operating room and endoscopy suites now must follow protocols developed by the global World Health Organization—an even more remote agency. There are protocols for cardiac catheterization, stenting, and respirator management, just to name a few.
Patients should worry about doctors trying to make symptoms fit into a standardized clinical model and ignoring the vital nuances of their complaints. Even more, they should be alarmed that the protocols being used don’t provide any measurable health benefits. Most were designed and implemented before any objective evidence existed as to their effectiveness.
A large Veterans Administration study released in March 2011 showed that SCIP protocols led to no improvement in surgical-site infection rate. If past is prologue, we should not expect the SCIP protocols to be repealed, just “improved”—or expanded, adding to the already existing glut.
These rules are being bred into the system. Young doctors and medical students are being trained to follow protocol. To them, command and control is normal. But to older physicians who have lived through the decline of medical culture, this only contributes to our angst.
One of my colleagues, a noted pulmonologist with over 30 years’ experience, fears that teaching young physicians to follow guidelines and practice protocols discourages creative medical thinking and may lead to a decrease in diagnostic and therapeutic excellence. He laments that “ ‘evidence-based’ means you are not interested in listening to anyone.” Another colleague, a North Phoenix orthopedist of many years, decries the “cookie-cutter” approach mandated by protocols.
A noted gastroenterologist who has practiced more than 35 years has a more cynical take on things. He believes that the increased regimentation and regularization of medicine is a prelude to the replacement of physicians by nurse practitioners and physician-assistants, and that these people will be even more likely to follow the directives proclaimed by regulatory bureaus. It is true that, in many cases, routine medical problems can be handled more cheaply and efficiently by paraprofessionals. But these practitioners are also limited by depth of knowledge, understanding, and experience. Patients should be able to decide for themselves if they want to be seen by a doctor. It is increasingly rare that patients are given a choice about such things.
The partners in my practice all believe that protocols and guidelines will accomplish nothing more than giving us more work to do and more rules to comply with. But they implore me to keep my mouth shut—rather than risk angering hospital administrators, insurance company executives, and the other powerful entities that control our fates.
Electronic Records and Financial Burdens
When Congress passed the stimulus, a.k.a. the American Reinvestment and Recovery Act of 2009, it included a requirement that all physicians and hospitals convert to electronic medical records (EMR) by 2014 or face Medicare reimbursement penalties. There has never been a peer-reviewed study clearly demonstrating that requiring all doctors and hospitals to switch to electronic records will decrease error and increase efficiency, but that didn’t stop Washington policymakers from repeating that claim over and over again in advance of the stimulus.
Some institutions, such as Kaiser Permanente Health Systems, the Mayo Clinic, and the Veterans Administration Hospitals, have seen big benefits after going digital voluntarily. But if the same benefits could reasonably be expected to play out universally, government coercion would not be needed.
Instead, Congress made that business decision on behalf of thousands of doctors and hospitals, who must now spend huge sums on the purchase of EMR systems and take staff off other important jobs to task them with entering thousands of old-style paper medical records into the new database. For a period of weeks or months after the new system is in place, doctors must see fewer patients as they adapt to the demands of the technology.
The persistence of price controls has coincided with a steady ratcheting down of fees for doctors. As a result, private insurance payments, which are typically pegged to Medicare payment schedules, have been ratcheting down as well. Meanwhile, Medicare’s regulatory burdens on physician practices continue to increase, adding on compliance costs. Medicare continues to demand that specific coded services be redefined and subdivided into ever-increasing levels of complexity. Harsh penalties are imposed on providers who accidentally use the wrong level code to bill for a service. Sometimes—as in the case of John Natale of Arlington, Illinois, who began a 10-month sentence in November because he miscoded bills on five patients upon whom he repaired complicated abdominal aortic aneurysms—the penalty can even include prison.
For many physicians in private practice, the EMR requirement is the final straw. Doctors are increasingly selling their practices to hospitals, thus becoming hospital employees. This allows them to offload the high costs of regulatory compliance and converting to EMR.
As doctors become shift workers, they work less intensely and watch the clock much more than they did when they were in private practice. Additionally, the doctor-patient relationship is adversely affected as doctors come to increasingly view their customers as the hospitals’ patients rather than their own.
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Docs resisting ObamaCare
By Carl Campanile
October 29, 2013 | 5:23am
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Modal Trigger
Docs resisting ObamaCare
Photo: AP
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New York doctors are treating ObamaCare like the plague, a new survey reveals.
A poll conducted by the New York State Medical Society finds that 44 percent of MDs said they are not participating in the nation’s new health-care plan.
Another 33 percent say they’re still not sure whether to become ObamaCare providers.
Only 23 percent of the 409 physicians queried said they’re taking patients who signed up through health exchanges.
“This is so poorly designed that a lot of doctors are afraid to participate,” said Dr. Sam Unterricht, president of the 29,000-member organization. “There’s a lot of resistance. Doctors don’t know what they’re going to get paid.”
Three out of four doctors who are participating in the program said they “had to participate” because of existing contractual obligations with an insurer or medical provider, not because they wanted to.
Only one in four “affirmatively” chose to sign up for the exchanges.
Nearly eight in 10 — 77 percent — said they had not been given a fee schedule to show much they’ll get paid if they sign up.
The survey invited doctors to anonymously share opinions about the new health care law, and many took time out of their busy days to vent.
“Obama Care wants to start right away, but who see all these new patients???? Not me,” e-mailed one doc.
Another said, “I plan to retire if this disaster is implemented. This is a train wreck.”
“I refuse to participate in the exchange plans! I am completely opposed to this new law,” said a third respondent.
One doctor recycled the mantra used to attack addictions: “The solution is simple: Just say no.”
One physician was so disgusted, he threatened to taken only cash patients going forward.
“I am seriously considering opting out of all insurance plans including Medicare because of [ObamaCare].”
Some physicians said the pressure on insurance carriers to control costs is leading to rationed care.
“OBAMACARE is a disaster. I have already seen denial of medication, denial of referrals,” one doc said.
And they worry that stingy payments for medical services offered by insurers could put some doctors out of business and force others into retirement.
“Any doctor who accepts the exchange is just a bad businessman/woman. Pays terrible,” argued one doctor.
Said another MD, “Can’t imagine any doctors would be willing to work for so little money? All doctors should boycott.”
Doctors complained they’ve gotten the shaft for years even before ObamaCare.
“I get screwed from insurance companies already. I refuse to get screwed any longer,” one doctor said.
Others said they don’t have enough information to make an informed choice.
“This is a joke. We are flying blind,” said one doctor.
http://nypost.com/2013/10/29/docs-resisting-obamacare
lurker Straw and MalFAIL - eat shit fools
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Pole Toucher = skell fail. Again.
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i'm not saying that this article seals the fate of Obamacare in my head but I find it disturbing that the people who voted for Obama are going to simply dismiss stuff like this as bullshit just to save some semblance of pride in the fact that they voted for gay marriage and abortion, NOT Obama or Obamacare.
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http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2010/01/the-new-federal-wedding-tax-how-obamacare-would-dramatically-penalize-marriage#.UnKoPOtLzAE.facebook
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I can garrantee that not 1 single doctor will quit....not one. Being a doctor is way too lucrative and I would seriously doubt someone would throw away all those years of work to get that sheepskin
They already are quitting. I work with them and more than a few are making plans to get out for sure and a number have actually transitioned into research rather than clinical care. I am not speaking in hyperbole here, I work with MD's and MDPHD's and A LOT are giving up because they see where it is going. Specialists will be limited and all primary care will be clinic based. No more private practice. It cannot exist with the rules of obummercare. I don't give a shit about lib vs conservative I only know that this criminal law will destroy quality healthcare in this country. For sure 100%.
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June 15, 2011 at 8:30 am Aaron Carroll
This is an ongoing series on health care system “memes” that continue to permeate our debate, even when evidence shows them to be false. The introductory post contains links to all entries.
This meme appeared recently as part of Governor Romney’s health care plan. It’s a common one, brought out often to argue that deregulation is the answer to lowering health care costs.
But let’s think this through.
The reason that insurance can’t be sold across state lines right now is that states have the right to regulate their own insurance markets. Yes, states – not the feds – get to set their own rules when it comes to the individual insurance market.
Since states differ in terms of local politics, and local needs, they set different rules for insurance. Some states want to have an insurance market where you can’t be denied insurance for any reason, and you can’t be charged more for being sick. Other states want to limit the difference you can be charged for being older or sicker if you want a policy.
I say “want” because we still live in a democracy, where people vote for what they think they need. These states have these policies because they were enacted by local governments elected by their residents. So, unless you no longer believe in state government, this is how it goes.
Right now, there’s nothing stopping an insurance company from selling policies in every state in the nation. They just have to create policies within each state that comply with local laws. Many insurance companies do this, finding a way to be profitable in each market.
This is the first problem with the “sell insurance across state lines” argument. If you support this, you’re effectively telling states that they cannot make their own decisions. They can’t set any standards for themselves locally. They have to abide by the decisions of other states when it comes to insurance.
Because, make no mistake about it, if you remove the state regulatory boundaries, all the insurance companies will set up shop in the state with the fewest regulations and start to sell insurance nationally. This is exactly what happened with the credit card industry.
Perhaps this doesn’t bother you. Perhaps you’re fine with this because you believe that it will lower costs, and that is paramount. So let’s deal with that side of the issue.
There is no doubt that when you set community ratings and guaranteed issue that the cheapest policy will be much more expensive than the cheapest policy in a state without those regulations. Let me explain. If I created an insurance company in a state without any regulations, then I could choose to cover only completely healthy young males. I could be assured none would get pregnant. None would need pelvic exams, or mammograms, or Pap smears. I could refuse to cover anyone who had ever been ill, or who had ever had a family member who had been ill.
As you can imagine, it would be really cheap to care for this population, and so the insurance I’d sell would be really, really inexpensive. Everyone else, however, would be out of luck. And anyone who tried to insure that population would find a skewed risk pool, making the average policy created for it really expensive.
Now, if I’m a healthy, young male in a regulated state it might be attractive to me to buy a policy from that unregulated state. But if I were a female with diabetes, I’d be totally screwed. Moreover, as all the healthy people snapped up cheap policies, the remaining people would form an uninsurable risk pool.
About 20% of the population is responsible for about 80% of health care spending. Would they be any less ill? Would their medicines cost less? Would their procedures? What exactly about health care would be cheaper in this alternate reality?
No one would want to insure them.
What we would have is a world where it would be likely cheaper for those who don’t need health care to get insurance. For everyone else, especially those who need care, insurance would be more expensive, and care harder to obtain.
There’s no example of this working out well, anywhere in the world. It’s rhetoric that sounds good, but would lead to terrible outcomes.
Holy shit, this guy is too smart for getbig.
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They already are quitting. I work with them and more than a few are making plans to get out for sure and a number have actually transitioned into research rather than clinical care. I am not speaking in hyperbole here, I work with MD's and MDPHD's and A LOT are giving up because they see where it is going. Specialists will be limited and all primary care will be clinic based. No more private practice. It cannot exist with the rules of obummercare. I don't give a shit about lib vs conservative I only know that this criminal law will destroy quality healthcare in this country. For sure 100%.
Good...we need more drivers for Pizza Hut
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Good...we need more drivers for Pizza Hut
Typical of a communist mentality
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Typical of a communist mentality
Exactly. We should be grateful for whatever crumbs our good leader bestows upon us with his divine powers. It's only fair after all because so many rich people have so much and the poor deserve that money. What do the rich NEED so much money for? Fuck me we are in trouble in this country when people have really drunk the koolaid and go back for another glass. SoulCrusher keep up the good work. I am a newb I know and I get attacked by twink asspounders who somehow only value what someone says if they have 900,000 posts, but it is mainly because they know they are on a sinking ship and refuse to ask for help to save themselves. On the contrary, they want to take us all with them.
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http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/11/09/real-cost-obamacare-loss-good-doctors
Boom
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Typical of a communist mentality
and typical of someone like you who roots against our country just because he doesn't like the president and wants to see him fail, meanwhile going on and on about what a patriot he is
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and typical of someone like you who roots against our country just because he doesn't like the president and wants to see him fail, meanwhile going on and on about what a patriot he is
Thousands were just dropped on United Health due to 95er CARE
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Thousands were just dropped on United Health due to 95er CARE
Thats great right?
The less lazy, commie, lesbian and guilt-ridden whites who has health insurance the better right?
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Thats great right?
The less lazy, commie, lesbian and guilt-ridden whites who has health insurance the better right?
Eat it commie
http://news.yahoo.com/unitedhealth-drops-thousands-doctors-insurance-plans-wsj-030014903--finance.html
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Thats great right?
The less lazy, commie, lesbian and guilt-ridden whites who has health insurance the better right?
:D
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http://dailycaller.com/2013/11/25/top-4-u-s-hospital-laying-off-staff-due-to-obamacare
Hospital playing off staff due to 95'erCare
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http://dailycaller.com/2013/11/25/top-4-u-s-hospital-laying-off-staff-due-to-obamacare
Hospital playing off staff due to 95'erCare
Fox News host Greta Van Susteren admitted that the network may have taken the Cleveland Clinic medical center's decision to cut jobs out of context after Fox repeatedly hyped the story to demonize the Affordable Care Act.
Reuters reported on September 18 that the Cleveland Clinic medical center announced plans to reduce its staff and budget in order to prepare for the implementation of the Affordable Care Act (ACA), also known as Obamacare. Fox News repeatedly hyped the news as evidence that the ACA destroys jobs.
However, even the Cleveland Clinic itself didn't buy into Fox's narrative. The Atlantic reached out to the Cleveland Clinic and found that Eileen Sheil, the clinic's Executive Director of Corporate Communications, "seemed a bit confused by the emphasis on Obamacare" in the media coverage of the center's actions. Sheil told the publication, "We've been working on reducing costs for years ... We felt health-care reform was absolutely necessary." The Atlantic explained (emphasis added):
Actually, much of what the Cleveland Clinic system is doing follows the recommendations of health-care analysts closely. For example, it has consolidated closely located neonatal intensive care units, because high volumes tend to lead to better results. It's working to reduce the number of procedures its staff performs, since in the current system "physicians are rewarded to do more, not to do the right thing for the patient," as Sheil put it. And there's a new focus on chronic diseases, which are an increasingly important and costly area for treatment.
Think of it this way: These are all steps that the Cleveland Clinic was likely to take, but Obamacare implementation is acting as a catalyst, spurring the clinic to adopt them now rather than on a slower timeline.
Yet Fox's flawed reporting made its way to at least one member of Congress. On the September 24 edition of Fox News' On The Record, U.S. Sen. John Barrasso (R-WY) told Van Susteren of the ACA, "The Cleveland Clinic announced this week they are laying off many employees. They're cutting $300 million of expenses because of the implementation -- because of the health care law."
Van Susteren then admitted to the network's misleading reporting on the clinic, telling the senator, "I don't know if Toby Cosgrove, who's the CEO, whether he's backpedaling or not, but I talked to him a couple hours later and he sort of thought that we were taking a little bit out of context what he meant."
http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/09/25/foxs-shoddy-reporting-on-cleveland-clinic-and-o/196066
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http://dailycaller.com/2013/11/25/top-4-u-s-hospital-laying-off-staff-due-to-obamacare
Hospital playing off staff due to 95'erCare
lol
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/09/obamacare-isnt-really-taking-away-jobs-cleveland-clinic-edition/279834/
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Media Matters? LMFAO - this skell just ruined your profession and this is the best you can do?
T Y P I C A L obamabot socialist serf mentality
Here you go - a little more I Told You So to the idiots who voted for O-TWINK
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/26/aurora-health-care-obamacare_n_2559120.html
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Media Matters? LMFAO - this skell just ruined your profession and this is the best you can do?
T Y P I C A L obamabot socialist serf mentality
Here you go - a little more I Told You So to the idiots who voted for O-TWINK
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/26/aurora-health-care-obamacare_n_2559120.html
im not defending anything...Something just didnt look right about that report. Cuts and budgets take years to be implimented.
Its kind of like that "letter" you got from Atlantis
now you can admit that this one particular story was wrong....or i can devote my day off to destroying your bullshit...ive been off the boards for a bit..
So again... if you want me to let it go...just say "yeah they misrepresented this one.." if not..ill go Retro-Mal on your ass and demolish you...
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im not defending anything...Something just didnt look right about that report. Cuts and budgets take years to be implimented.
Its kind of like that "letter" you got from Atlantis
now you can admit that this one particular story was wrong....or i can devote my day off to destroying your bullshit...ive been off the boards for a bit..
So again... if you want me to let it go...just say "yeah they misrepresented this one.." if not..ill go Retro-Mal on your ass and demolish you...
If 30 million NEW people are going to be insured - tell me how does revenue go down by so much if ObamaCare is good for doctors? hhhmmm???
Guess what - its going to be a DISASTER for doctors since most of the new people are medicade and you wont be paid jack shit - congrats - YOU VOTED FOR THIS!!!!
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If 30 million NEW people are going to be insured - tell me how does revenue go down by so much if ObamaCare is good for doctors? hhhmmm???
Guess what - its going to be a DISASTER for doctors since most of the new people are medicade and you wont be paid jack shit - congrats - YOU VOTED FOR THIS!!!!
OK...This story about The Cleveland Clinic, would you admit that it was inaccurate? This single story...Quit dancing
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OK...This story about The Cleveland Clinic, would you admit that it was inaccurate? This single story...Quit dancing
The clinic is anticipating drastically lower revenue why again?
ObamaCare! you think living in the fascist state we are in that they are going to directly name Obamacare as the culprit? LOL.
Yeah - revenues going down so that they have to cut staff - yup obamacare zero to do with it. LMFAO. I guess the Bush years weren't so bad after all.
Hope and Change -YOU VOTED FOR THIS
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The clinic is anticipating drastically lower revenue why again?
ObamaCare! you think living in the fascist state we are in that they are going to directly name Obamacare as the culprit? LOL.
Yeah - revenues going down so that they have to cut staff - yup obamacare zero to do with it. LMFAO. I guess the Bush years weren't so bad after all.
Hope and Change -YOU VOTED FOR THIS
Dance puppet...dance
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Dance puppet...dance
LOL - I love it when people like yourself who shed tears of joy in 2008 ver Obama still are in denial over the disaster this communist ghetto pos has been, even to the point he is destroying your profession.
Like I said - you would follow him into bondage if he asked you to.
If there are supposedly 30 million new patients and customers due to ChoomerCare, why would the clinic be forced to cut staff and take 300 million out of its budget in anticipation of drastically lower revenue?
Its a simple question Obamabot.
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LOL - I love it when people like yourself who shed tears of joy in 2008 ver Obama still are in denial over the disaster this communist ghetto pos has been, even to the point he is destroying your profession.
Like I said - you would follow him into bondage if he asked you to.
If there are supposedly 30 million new patients and customers due to ChoomerCare, why would the clinic be forced to cut staff and take 300 million out of its budget in anticipation of drastically lower revenue?
Its a simple question Obamabot.
you havent answered my question....i did 20 seconds of digging and found that your post was a lie....so now you jusr wont address it and youll use foolishness and dance around.
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you havent answered my question....i did 20 seconds of digging and found that your post was a lie....so now you jusr wont address it and youll use foolishness and dance around.
A lie? LMFAO? You go to far left outlets spinning this mess and polishing a turd and think you refuted anything?
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/09/18/us-usa-health-clevelandclinic-idUSBRE98H14V20130918
The clinic is Cleveland's largest employer and the second largest in Ohio after Wal-Mart. It is the largest provider in Ohio of Medicaid health coverage for the poor, the program that will expand to cover uninsured Americans under Obamacare.
"We know we are going to be reimbursed less," under Medicaid, Sheil said.
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you havent answered my question....i did 20 seconds of digging and found that your post was a lie....so now you jusr wont address it and youll use foolishness and dance around.
Talk about a red herring.
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The clinic is Cleveland's largest employer and the second largest in Ohio after Wal-Mart. It is the largest provider in Ohio of Medicaid health coverage for the poor, the program that will expand to cover uninsured Americans under Obamacare.
"We know we are going to be reimbursed less," under Medicaid, Sheil said.
Option Dunce simply cant or refuses to see the writing on the wall
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However, even the Cleveland Clinic itself didn't buy into Fox's narrative. The Atlantic reached out to the Cleveland Clinic and found that Eileen Sheil, the clinic's Executive Director of Corporate Communications, "seemed a bit confused by the emphasis on Obamacare" in the media coverage of the center's actions. Sheil told the publication, "We've been working on reducing costs for years ... We felt health-care reform was absolutely necessary."
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However, even the Cleveland Clinic itself didn't buy into Fox's narrative. The Atlantic reached out to the Cleveland Clinic and found that Eileen Sheil, the clinic's Executive Director of Corporate Communications, "seemed a bit confused by the emphasis on Obamacare" in the media coverage of the center's actions. Sheil told the publication, "We've been working on reducing costs for years ... We felt health-care reform was absolutely necessary."
LOL "REFORM" - The CEO said even as of a few weeks ago obamacare is such a mess it will take YEARS to fix, or more
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LOL "REFORM" - The CEO said even as of a few weeks ago obamacare is such a mess it will take YEARS to fix, or more
um...ok....but it still makes your post a lie
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um...ok....but it still makes your post a lie
LOL - believe what you want - you are a sheep, a follower, a part of herd, and a lemming.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/29/new-york-doctors-flee-obamacare-i-plan-retire
Quitting due to obamacare
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LOL - believe what you want - you are a sheep, a follower, a part of herd, and a lemming.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/29/new-york-doctors-flee-obamacare-i-plan-retire
Quitting due to obamacare
yeah but im talking about that article about the cleveland hospital
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LOL - I love it when people like yourself who shed tears of joy in 2008 ver Obama still are in denial over the disaster this communist ghetto pos has been, even to the point he is destroying your profession.
Like I said - you would follow him into bondage if he asked you to.
If there are supposedly 30 million new patients and customers due to ChoomerCare, why would the clinic be forced to cut staff and take 300 million out of its budget in anticipation of drastically lower revenue?
Its a simple question Obamabot.
and we're still amused by your shedding of tears over the last eight years. cant wait for the total breakdown when the GOP loses the WH again in '16.
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http://nypost.com/2013/11/25/obamacare-hits-doctor-with-double-whammy
This doc and her patients - getting FUCKED!!!
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http://nypost.com/2013/11/25/obamacare-hits-doctor-with-double-whammy
This doc and her patients - getting FUCKED!!!
at least they are to use your words - getting fucked.
perhaps if you were, you would be in a better mood??!!
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at least they are to use your words - getting fucked.
perhaps if you were, you would be in a better mood??!!
I have been training my fucking ass off for months harder than anyone can imagine for next weeks' Grand Finale. Leave me alone - im tired and hungry and want this to be over.
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and we're still amused by your shedding of tears over the last eight years. cant wait for the total breakdown when the GOP loses the WH again in '16.
In 2016? Fat chance.
I have it on good authority that conservatives will own the libtards in every way in 2016.
To quote my infallible source directly, "Landslide coming!" ;D
(He may have added, "Boom!" but his mom was yelling something at him at the time so I can't be sure I heard that correctly.)
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http://washingtonexaminer.com/survey-doctors-rebelling-against-obamacare-hospitals-declining-to-join/article/2539830
Good job Option FAIL - you voted for your own demise. Stew in it moron
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In 2016? Fat chance.
I have it on good authority that conservatives will own the libtards in every way in 2016.
To quote my infallible source directly, "Landslide coming!" ;D
(He may have added, "Boom!" but his mom was yelling something at him at the time so I can't be sure I heard that correctly.)
actually, it think it would be a fun political scene of the GOP ran everything again. I'd tune into Hannity and Levin more often and hear how they will now have to support all the ideas. pendulum swings both ways. After president Santorum tries to eliminate birth control the hilarity ensues.
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http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-12-07/70-calfornias-doctors-expected-boycott-obamacare
70% of california docs expected to boycott ThugCare
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http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-12-07/70-calfornias-doctors-expected-boycott-obamacare
70% of california docs expected to boycott ThugCare
Washington examiner...thats cool...
but i still havent been able to pull these numbers they are talking about. No source.
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Washington examiner...thats cool...
but i still havent been able to pull these numbers they are talking about. No source.
soul / 3333 has his own sources . In his head.
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soul / 3333 has his own sources . In his head.
Yeah - obamacare is such a huge success. LOL
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http://dailycaller.com/2014/09/21/alaska-physician-shuts-down-practice-citing-obamacare
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Over 214,000 Doctors Opt Out of Obamacare Exchanges
October 28, 2014 - 11:28 AM
By Barbara Boland
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Over 214,000 doctors won't participate in the new plans under the Affordable Care Act (ACA,) analysis of a new survey by Medical Group Management Association shows. That number of 214,524, estimated by American Action Forum, is through May 2014, but appears to be growing due to plans that force doctors to take on burdensome costs. It's also about a quarter of the total number of 893,851 active professional physicians reported by the Kaiser Family Foundation.
In January, an estimated 70% of California's physicians were not participating in Covered California plans.
Here are some of the reasons why:
1. Reimbursements under Obamacare are at bottom-dollar - they are even lower than Medicare reimbursements, which are already significantly below market rates. "It is estimated that where private plans pay $1.00 for a service, Medicare pays $0.80, and ACA exchange plans are now paying about $0.60," a study by the think-tank American Action Forum finds. "For example, Covered California plans are setting their plan fee schedules in line with that of Medi-Cal-California's Medicaid Program-which means exchange plans are cutting provider reimbursement by up to 40 percent."
2. Doctors are expected to take on more patients to make up for the lost revenue, but that's not happening, because primary care doctors already have more patients than they can handle. "Furthermore, physicians are worried that exchange plan patients will be sicker than the average patient because they may have been without insurance for extended periods of time, and therefore will require more of the PCPs time at lower pay," says the study.
The study also points to two reasons that doctors might not get paid at all:
3. An MGMA study indicates that 75% of ACA patients that had seen doctors had chosen plans with high deductibles. Given that most of the patients are low-income, doctors are concerned that the patients cannot meet the deductibles and they will get stuck with the bill.
4. HHS requires that insurers cover customers for an additional 90 days after they have stopped paying their premiums: the insurer covers the first 30 - but, it's up to the doctor to recoup payment for the last 60 days. This is the number one reason providers are opting to not participate in the exchange plans. Currently, about a million people have failed to pay their premiums and had their plans canceled.
So, Obamacare is asking doctors to take on sicker patients for less money, with the risk of not getting paid at all? No wonder doctors are running from these plans!
The business and economic reporting of CNSNews.com is funded in part with a gift made in memory of Dr. Keith C. Wold.
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Over 214,000 Doctors Opt Out of Obamacare Exchanges
October 28, 2014 - 11:28 AM
By Barbara Boland
Subscribe to Barbara Boland RSS
Share on Facebook Share on Twitter
More Sharing Services
312
Over 214,000 doctors won't participate in the new plans under the Affordable Care Act (ACA,) analysis of a new survey by Medical Group Management Association shows. That number of 214,524, estimated by American Action Forum, is through May 2014, but appears to be growing due to plans that force doctors to take on burdensome costs. It's also about a quarter of the total number of 893,851 active professional physicians reported by the Kaiser Family Foundation.
In January, an estimated 70% of California's physicians were not participating in Covered California plans.
Here are some of the reasons why:
1. Reimbursements under Obamacare are at bottom-dollar - they are even lower than Medicare reimbursements, which are already significantly below market rates. "It is estimated that where private plans pay $1.00 for a service, Medicare pays $0.80, and ACA exchange plans are now paying about $0.60," a study by the think-tank American Action Forum finds. "For example, Covered California plans are setting their plan fee schedules in line with that of Medi-Cal-California's Medicaid Program-which means exchange plans are cutting provider reimbursement by up to 40 percent."
2. Doctors are expected to take on more patients to make up for the lost revenue, but that's not happening, because primary care doctors already have more patients than they can handle. "Furthermore, physicians are worried that exchange plan patients will be sicker than the average patient because they may have been without insurance for extended periods of time, and therefore will require more of the PCPs time at lower pay," says the study.
The study also points to two reasons that doctors might not get paid at all:
3. An MGMA study indicates that 75% of ACA patients that had seen doctors had chosen plans with high deductibles. Given that most of the patients are low-income, doctors are concerned that the patients cannot meet the deductibles and they will get stuck with the bill.
4. HHS requires that insurers cover customers for an additional 90 days after they have stopped paying their premiums: the insurer covers the first 30 - but, it's up to the doctor to recoup payment for the last 60 days. This is the number one reason providers are opting to not participate in the exchange plans. Currently, about a million people have failed to pay their premiums and had their plans canceled.
So, Obamacare is asking doctors to take on sicker patients for less money, with the risk of not getting paid at all? No wonder doctors are running from these plans!
The business and economic reporting of CNSNews.com is funded in part with a gift made in memory of Dr. Keith C. Wold.
Doctors are not special people....they have to take a hit in pay and salary just like the rest of us have over the past 20 years or so....
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Typical communist mentality
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Typical communist mentality
Typical truth........we are all under the same economy....everybody except for corporate sharks and execs are making less....do you EVER acknowledge the truth?????????????????????????????????????????????????
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Typical truth........we are all under the same economy....everybody except for corporate sharks and execs are making less....do you EVER acknowledge the truth?????????????????????????????????????????????????
How are kenyan doctors doing?
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How are kenyan doctors doing?
sigh.................... ........................ ........................ ........................ .......why do I even try?
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sigh...................................................................................................why do I even try?
Obamacare was designed by a kenyan based upon his experiences being born in Kenya so it's a valid question
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Typical communist mentality
would you say liberals are communist, marxist, or socialist? Or all 3?
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Obamacare was designed by a kenyan based upon his experiences being born in Kenya so it's a valid question
I guess Mitt Romney is a Kenyan ???
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I guess Mitt Romney is a Kenyan ???
zing boom
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zing boom
ObamadontCare is a lot more than what romneycare was,
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Typical truth........we are all under the same economy....everybody except for corporate sharks and execs are making less....do you EVER acknowledge the truth?????????????????????????????????????????????????
yeah corporations are bad man. ::)
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ObamadontCare is a lot more than what romneycare was,
you're bending the truth again...it was pretty much stolen intact by Obama but yes Obama did add some more to it...Romney was the originator of the program..why can't you and conservatives admit that??????????????????????????
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you're bending the truth again...it was pretty much stolen intact by Obama but yes Obama did add some more to it...Romney was the originator of the program..why can't you and conservatives admit that??????????????????????????
We did many times and that part of why Romney lost. So the best you leftist cultists and Obama ballwashers can do is defend this Kenyan twink on the basis that he took a horrible idea from a flawed candidtate and made it his own? And that is supposed to be a good thing?
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I guess Mitt Romney is a Kenyan ???
He might own a few Kenyan's.
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yeah corporations are bad man. ::)
I don't know where you got that from....just stating facts...I never said they were bad or that making money is bad
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We did many times and that part of why Romney lost. So the best you leftist cultists and Obama ballwashers can do is defend this Kenyan twink on the basis that he took a horrible idea from a flawed candidtate and made it his own? And that is supposed to be a good thing?
No its simply to refute your own stupidity that Universal healthcare was invented by Obama the Kenyan...you just refuted above your own earlier statement...
BOOM
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ObamaCare’s Threat to Private Practice
The payment system is forcing doctors to sell out to hospitals. The trend, and the law, will be unstoppable without reform.
By
Scott Gottlieb
Dec. 7, 2014 5:12 p.m. ET
233 COMMENTS
Here’s a dirty little secret about recent attempts to fix ObamaCare. The “reforms,” approved by Senate and House leaders this summer and set to advance in the next Congress, adopt many of the Medicare payment reforms already in the Affordable Care Act. Both favor the consolidation of previously independent doctors into salaried roles inside larger institutions, usually tied to a central hospital, in effect ending independent medical practices.
Republicans must embrace a different vision to this forced reorganization of how medicine is practiced in America if they want to offer an alternative to ObamaCare. The law’s defenders view this consolidation as a necessary step to enable payment provisions that shift the financial risk of delivering medical care onto providers and away from government programs like Medicare. The law’s architects believe that doctors, to better bear financial risk, need to be part of larger, and presumably better-capitalized institutions. Indeed, the law has already gone a long way in achieving that outcome.
A recent Physicians Foundation survey of some 20,000 U.S. doctors found that 35% described themselves as independent, down from 49% in 2012 and 62% in 2008. Once independent doctors become the exception rather than the rule, the continued advance of the ObamaCare agenda will become virtually unstoppable.
Local competition between providers, who vie to contract with health plans, is largely eliminated by these consolidated health systems. Since all health care is local, the lack of competition will soon make it much harder to implement a market-based alternative to ObamaCare. The resulting medical monopolies will make more regulation the most obvious solution to the inevitable cost and quality problems.
A true legislative alternative to ObamaCare would support physician ownership of independent medical practices, and preserve local competition between doctors and choice for patients.
First, Congress should remove the pervasive biases in ObamaCare that favor hospital ownership of medical practices. Payment reforms that create incentives for the coordinated delivery of medical care (like Accountable Care Organizations and payment “bundles”) all turn on arrangements where a single institution owns the doctors. They’re biased against less centralized engagements where independent doctors enter into contractual relationships among themselves.
These ObamaCare payment reforms are fashioned after 1990s-style health maintenance organizations, or HMOs, in which entities like hospitals would get a lump sum of money from Medicare (or now, ObamaCare) for taking on the risk of caring for a large pool of patients. But right now all of these payment schemes are tilted far in favor of having hospitals pool that risk, and not looser networks of doctors.
For one thing, providers who want to participate in the “reformed” physician payment plan must control their own IT infrastructure to comply, as opposed to collaborating freely across space rented in the cloud. This practical need can require IT infrastructure that costs millions of dollars. It makes participation absurdly expensive for anyone but a hospital that already has its own server hub.
Also, waivers of certain anti-kickback provisions (that prevent doctors from forming needed business partnerships) only apply when providers qualify as an Accountable Care Organization. Not surprisingly, ACA qualification is largely dependent on requirements that create the same need for physical infrastructure and bureaucratic overhead that is hard to replicate outside the hospital setting.
To implement real reform, Congress must give independent, private-practice doctors an equal footing. One legislative proposal would let a new class of “independent risk managers” act as third parties to help individual doctors analyze and share the risk of caring for these patient pools. This would make it possible for independent medical offices to band together and bid against hospitals for a pool of patients. Private companies specializing in analyzing and pricing medical risk could serve as brokers and help the doctors know what they’re getting into. But ObamaCare deliberately crowds out this sort of market innovation in favor of hospitals and their existing networks.
Individual, provider-owned medical practices also deserve equal footing when it comes to reimbursement. Right now, Medicare is paying much more for many procedures when performed in a hospital outpatient clinic rather than an independently owned medical office. Things as common as heart scans ($749 versus $503), colonoscopies ($876 versus $402) and even a 15-minute doctor visit ($124 versus $70) all pay more when done by a hospital-based doctor than a privately owned medical office. Obama officials know that hospitals are buying doctor practices to take advantage of this difference. But they favor hospital ownership of doctors and see it as a small cost to pay to drive that migration.
When I talk to physician colleagues, Republican or Democrat, a frequent refrain is that their professional strain would be the same regardless of what happens to ObamaCare. They are wrong. ObamaCare has accelerated many of the detrimental trends doctors see in their profession, and introduced new ones.
Reformers in Washington need to do a better job of explaining how market-based alternatives to ObamaCare are a better outcome for the structure and delivery of health care. And how they intend to preserve the entrepreneurship, autonomy and physician ownership that have long been the hallmark of American medicine.
Dr. Gottlieb, a physician and resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, is a member of the Health IT Policy Committee that advises the Department of Health and Human Services. He also invests in and advises health-care companies.