Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Kwon_2 on December 22, 2014, 11:45:55 AM
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(http://40.media.tumblr.com/4ba2f4ba2e7b58e702b9ba7ddd603021/tumblr_n55qsxza8m1r2v3p8o2_500.jpg)
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just playing devils advocate here
http://www.latintimes.com/vatican-newspaper-calls-1500-year-old-bible-claim-jesus-was-not-crucified-probable-forgery-171831
Recent reports have revealed the discovery of a 1500-year-old bible in Turkey. The bible was reportedly retrieved over 14 years ago in 2000, when it was seized from smugglers in the Mediterranean area and held in a Turkish courthouse until safe transfer to the Ethnography Museum of Ankara could be arranged. The holy book allegedly contains the Gospel of Barnabas, who was a disciple of Jesus, in the work, claims that Jesus was not crucified, instead it says he ascended to heaven alive and Judas Iscariot was crucified in his place. Furthermore, the 1500-year-old bible states that Jesus Christ was not the Son of God, but simply a prophet who passed on the word of God.
The bible, which is said to be worth a whopping $28 million dollars, is an obvious hot commodity, so much so that the Vatican has requested an official application to access the alleged Gospel of Barnabas. According to the Christian Post, merely photocopies of the holy book’s pages are being sold for a staggering $1.7 million. In addition to the age and impeccable construction of the bible, the contents of the holy book are what make it so valuable. The Gospel of Barnabas is not included in the New Testament alongside Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. This work opposes the ideas proposed in the widely spread New Testament, and instead has noticeable similarities to the Muslim interpretation of Jesus.
Despite the interest and growing number of media reports confirming the authenticity of the holy book, the Vatican Insider, a project run by the newspaper “La Stampa,” claims that the book is a “hoax.” Vatican Insider believes that the holy book is not the Gospel of Barnabas, instead the site claims it is most likely the work of a forger, more specifically, a European -- Jewish scholar from the Middle Ages. Their main reason for claiming the work to be an “extraordinary hoax” is due to the main inscription on the 1500-year-old book.
According to their translation, the main inscription reads, “In the name of the Lord, this book is written by monks of the high monastery in Nineveh in the 1500th year of our Lord.” The main issue with the inscription that apparently deems the recently discovered Gospel of Barnabas a fake is the lack of the work ”bible” or even “holy book” in the inscription. According to their sources, who are unnamed, biblical works from 1500 years ago would not have been called a “book” instead; it is either referred to as “New Testament” or “Old Testament,” or “Holy Book.” Vatican Insider claims that the monk’s apparent oversight would have been unlikely when creating the Gospel of Barnabas.
The site continues to disprove the authenticity of the discovery by claiming that the media, specifically the Muslim media is confusing the age 1500-year old of the book with the year 1500 AD. The Muslim media has supposedly reported that “‘an ancient, 1500-year-old bible predicted the coming of Muhammad,” but once again the site disagrees. The Vatican Insider claims that media reports are confusing the 1500 years attributed by the media and the date of 1500 AD written in the book’s main inscription and due to this confusion, the Muslim beliefs and claim that The Gospel of Barnabas predicted a great prophecy are in their opinion null and void.
The debate between Christianity and the Muslin interpretation of Jesus is something that has raged on for centuries. The Gospel of Barnabas was not included in the New Testaments, reportedly due to its likenesses to the Muslim interpretation of Jesus. Due to this fact, many followers of Islam believe the Vatican Library repressed the original work.
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O, geee they have paper in those days ;D
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If Palumbo lived 1500 years ago, he would have sold fake HGH then too.
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If Palumbo lived 1500 years ago, he would have sold fake HGH then too.
Legit Jesustropin
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O, geee they have paper in those days ;D
It's written on leather.
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If Palumbo lived 1500 years ago, he would have sold fake HGH then too.
^^
You really hate him, huh???????????? ???
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Lots of false gospels and epistles.....Thomas, Barnabas, Enoch, Clement, Baruch, etc....these "lost books" are rediscovered every other year. They've all been hashed, rehashed, re-rehashed and re-re-hashed for a very long time.
Muslims love to challenge Christians with these "discoveries". "The book claims Jesus ascended to heaven alive, and that Judas Iscariot was crucified in his place." - this is standard stuff for Muslims to use against unsuspecting Christians. Most Christians don't even realize this material exists so they get blindsided with it in informal debate settings. It's nothing for believers to worry about. I've discussed the Gospel of Thomas on these boards a few times:
A great way to trust the age and accuracy of the biblical scriptures lies in the volume and age of the NT manuscripts that predate the council of Nicea by centuries and that all align with one another. These same manuscripts are the sources of the biblical translations that we know today and have been carbon dated and fully vetted and validated....the field of textual criticism specializes in this exact process. Textual critics specializing in ancient documents (including NT manuscripts) estimate the accuracy of biblical translations of today to be 99.6% accurate and tied to the source manuscripts just mentioned.
The early church actually omitted those texts that did not align with Christ and his apostles and that re-worded and added theology not present in the teachings of Christ and his apostles. The primary elimination were those texts aligned with the concepts of the gnostic cult. For example, the now infamous Gospel of Thomas is a heretical text from the 2nd century that aligns with gnosticism, but made famous in the modern world by those seeking to discredit Christianity and Jesus Christ. It's a prime example of a young audience of critics diving into an old (debunked) bag of tricks in an attempt to bring a "fresh, new perspective" to a young, naive audience using an ancient ploy long.....LONG....since rejected.
This is by no means an exhaustive reply on this subject, merely a high level overview.
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The whole thing is fucking stupid. There are how many variations/editions of the bible? There are how many Gospels that were kept out of the bible? (wouldn't that be considered blasphemy?)
They come right out and admit that leading church officials from around the christian world and Roman Emperor Constantine convened at the Council of Nicea in A.D. 325 to:
Its main accomplishments were settlement of the Christological issue of the nature of the Son of God and his relationship to God the Father,[3] the construction of the first part of the Creed of Nicaea, establishing uniform observance of the date of Easter,[6] and promulgation of early canon law.[4][7]
So basically the Emperor, and the most powerful clergymen of Christendom, gathered to decide the way Christianity would/should be followed from that day forward?
Sounds like they had the ability at that meeting to spin early Christianity any way they sought fit.
Any Christians would be fools to think that the bible they read, is in it's intended entirety.
Who knows if the bible was ever altered again during the Dark Ages, when it would have been easy to control the limited availability of books and the spread of information.
The bible is a collection of stories that have been altered too many times to be taken literally as the word of god.
God does not need an editor.
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^^
You really hate him, huh???????????? ???
Naw its a joke bro
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Moops Wiggs "expertise" is needed :D
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I guess that is why they call it "faith". I respect MOS's views on religion, but I would also like him to know that it is entirely possible that the bible and other key principles of Christianity could have been altered, changed, and even removed completely to benefit those involved, and we would have no idea.
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The whole thing is fucking stupid. There are how many variations/editions of the bible? There are how many Gospels that were kept out of the bible? (wouldn't that be considered blasphemy?)
They come right out and admit that leading church officials from around the christian world and Roman Emperor Constantine convened at the Council of Nicea in A.D. 325 to:
Its main accomplishments were settlement of the Christological issue of the nature of the Son of God and his relationship to God the Father,[3] the construction of the first part of the Creed of Nicaea, establishing uniform observance of the date of Easter,[6] and promulgation of early canon law.[4][7]
So basically the Emperor, and the most powerful clergymen of Christendom, gathered to decide the way Christianity would/should be followed from that day forward?
Sounds like they had the ability at that meeting to spin early Christianity any way they sought fit.
Any Christians would be fools to think that the bible they read, is in it's intended entirety.
Who knows if the bible was ever altered again during the Dark Ages, when it would have been easy to control the limited availability of books and the spread of information.
The bible is a collection of stories that have been altered too many times to be taken literally as the word of god.
God does not need an editor.
Here is the primary reason the council of nicea occurred:
So again, we're referring to the council of Nicea. So let's set the record straight.
For approximately 3 centuries prior to 325 AD Christians were severely persecuted for the scriptural doctrine of the Trinity they taught. They didn't use the term "Trinity" as it was later coined, but they absolutely discussed the coequal, coeternal persons of God in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. In the decade or so leading up to the Council of Nicea a presbyter named Arius spoke out against his church bishop and made the claim that Jesus, although on earth to fulfill a divine purpose, was in fact created by God and was therefore neither eternal nor was he deity. After several years of this opposing position being taught by Arius, it eventually reached Emporer Constantine's ears and he feared that this teaching would eventually split the Christian church that was enjoying a breif period of peace from all out persecution. That said, he convened 300 bishops to appear at a council in Nicea on June 19, 325 AD to discuss Arius' competing idea of Jesus' being created by God. The council convened and discussed the point and despite Arius' "silver tongue" he was unable to convince the vast majority of his position given the existing teachings of the father, son and spirit dating all the way back to Christ himself. That said, the trinity was not created in Nicea, but was merely upheld and reaffirmed there. I'll concede the concept may have been coined under the umbrella term of "Trinity" at this point, but the council certainly did not create the theology there...that's a twisted myth. In the years that followed, Arius' small group of believers eventually succumbed to infighting within their ranks and his unorthodox teachings fell to the wayside for the most part; although, today some small groups of "Christians" still deny the Trinity.
You're right that God does not need an editor, but he's called his church to act as representatives and to represent him faithfully. If false teachings present themselves the church is called to act.
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How is this connected to Wiggs assertion that the original Hebrews were African-American?
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Why are people stupid enough to believe in ignorant superstitions? That's all religion is. There is no god. The bible is a silly story book, not history at all.
Try reading THE SACRED MUSHROOM AND THE CROSS by John Allegro. You'll probably have to buy a copy, as christians are very good at stealing the Public Library copies, in the name of jesus, of course.
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Lots of false gospels and epistles.....Thomas, Barnabas, Enoch, Clement, Baruch, etc....these "lost books" are rediscovered every other year. They've all been hashed, rehashed, re-rehashed and re-re-hashed for a very long time.
Muslims love to challenge Christians with these "discoveries". "The book claims Jesus ascended to heaven alive, and that Judas Iscariot was crucified in his place." - this is standard stuff for Muslims to use against unsuspecting Christians. Most Christians don't even realize this material exists so they get blindsided with it in informal debate settings. It's nothing for believers to worry about. I've discussed the Gospel of Thomas on these boards a few times:
why does the vatican keep 50 miles of books hidden from public
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Ask me if I give a fuck...doo dah,doo dah!! :)
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Christ
Religion
LOL
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One day I will enter the Vatican's inner chambers and peek into their secret books.
I guess huge reptile guards might try to deter me from my truth seeking but I'm ready to thrown down... intergalactic fistfights... anybody, anywhere, anytime.
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Why are people stupid enough to believe in ignorant superstitions? That's all religion is. There is no god. The bible is a silly story book, not history at all.
Try reading THE SACRED MUSHROOM AND THE CROSS by John Allegro. You'll probably have to buy a copy, as christians are very good at stealing the Public Library copies, in the name of jesus, of course.
Look, there is a discussion about this "book". Not the whole "there is no god". Let's not derail it.
You nor I (nor any other "author") know definitively whether there is or is not a God. We can say that "we believe" as such. But, knowing, we do not.
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Look, there is a discussion about this "book". Not the whole "there is no god". Let's not derail it.
You nor I (nor any other "author") know definitively whether there is or is not a God. We can say that "we believe" as such. But, knowing, we do not.
I know that there is no god. The concept is stupid, and is designed to appeal to the simple minded. It's a way to control masses of people for the benefit of their masters. It's absurd, and sad, that billions of people waste their lives groveling in fear and pray to some kind of fiction.
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Eric falcon claims thers no god^^^^^^^^^
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This is why religion doesn't make any sense to me, too contradictory and nonsensical.
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One day I will enter the Vatican's inner chambers and peek into their secret books.
I guess huge reptile guards might try to deter me from my truth seeking but I'm ready to thrown down... intergalactic fistfights... anybody, anywhere, anytime.
If you bring a Grey with you you should be ok
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I know that there is no god. The concept is stupid, and is designed to appeal to the simple minded. It's a way to control masses of people for the benefit of their masters. It's absurd, and sad, that billions of people waste their lives groveling in fear and pray to some kind of fiction.
Look, there is a discussion about this "book". Not the whole "there is no god". Let's not derail it.
You nor I (nor any other "author") know definitively whether there is or is not a God. We can say that "we believe" as such. But, knowing, we do not.
Thou art That
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Ask me if I give a fuck...doo dah,doo dah!! :)
Did you ever train with Jeebus ? :D
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Sky gods and invisible creatures that guide your life
LOL :D
Fucking idiots. The world deserve 2014 and the state it's in. Thanks to fucking religion, 2 people are dead in Sydney. 108 school kids are murdered in Pakistan. A van drives into a Christmas markets in Nantes, France and injure 5 people seriously. A fucking Muslim kills two cops in NYC. And best of all, this all only the past week.
Tiny brains high on their beloved sky creature :-\
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I know that there is no god. The concept is stupid, and is designed to appeal to the simple minded. It's a way to control masses of people for the benefit of their masters. It's absurd, and sad, that billions of people waste their lives groveling in fear and pray to some kind of fiction.
Well, you have made the discovery of all time. Yet, there is no fanfare.
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Sky gods and invisible creatures that guide your life
LOL :D
Fucking idiots. The world deserve 2014 and the state it's in. Thanks to fucking religion, 2 people are dead in Sydney. 108 school kids are murdered in Pakistan. A van drives into a Christmas markets in Nantes, France and injure 5 people seriously. A fucking Muslim kills two cops in NYC. And best of all, this all only the past week.
Tiny brains high on their beloved sky creature :-\
I always find it interesting how you continually ridicule and dismiss believers and yet the username selected for your account that berates believers is fully biblical and establishes the foundation for how to treat others.
James 2:8
8 Yes indeed, it is good when you obey the royal law as found in the Scriptures: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”
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isn't there a book also that proves Jesus slept with marry Magdalene and may have had several kids by her?......wow, just when you thought the bible was safe.... ;D ;D
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Did you ever train with Jeebus ? :D
No but I`ve trained with a guy named Jesus Garcia!!
Happy Holidays Will. :)
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:) :)
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Sky gods and invisible creatures that guide your life
LOL :D
Fucking idiots. The world deserve 2014 and the state it's in. Thanks to fucking religion, 2 people are dead in Sydney. 108 school kids are murdered in Pakistan. A van drives into a Christmas markets in Nantes, France and injure 5 people seriously. A fucking Muslim kills two cops in NYC. And best of all, this all only the past week.
Tiny brains high on their beloved sky creature :-\
Heretic - no one can evade God's due punishment.
You can chose between being murdered or pay upfront.
Meet me at the local temple of worship to throw down the gantlet of the ancients!
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Sky gods and invisible creatures that guide your life
LOL :D
Fucking idiots. The world deserve 2014 and the state it's in. Thanks to fucking religion, 2 people are dead in Sydney. 108 school kids are murdered in Pakistan. A van drives into a Christmas markets in Nantes, France and injure 5 people seriously. A fucking Muslim kills two cops in NYC. And best of all, this all only the past week.
Tiny brains high on their beloved sky creature :-\
Did religion in general kill these folks, or was it, perhaps, a particular faith?
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hahaha, so he went to heaven alive. How are people today still dumb enough to believe this shit. You do realize people used to think heaven was in the clouds. We all know that ain't true.
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why does the vatican keep 50 miles of books hidden from public
Can't speak to it....know nothing about this.
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why does the vatican keep 50 miles of books hidden from public
You're reading too much Davinci code.
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hahaha, so he went to heaven alive. How are people today still dumb enough to believe this shit. You do realize people used to think heaven was in the clouds. We all know that ain't true.
Why do people believe in Christ today? Many have experienced the risen Christ in their lives.
God’s heaven is the “third heaven”.
The first heaven are the clouds and upper atmosphere. The second heaven is the universe beyond earth. The third heaven exists beyond the universe….God’s spiritual realm where he dwells. There is no man in the clouds as depicted in fairytales and other literature.
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maybe there wouldnt be much left of the books if they let the public put their greasy fingers on them ???
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maybe there wouldnt be much left of the books if they let the public put their greasy fingers on them ???
Maybe there would be more ???
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The whole thing is fucking stupid. There are how many variations/editions of the bible? There are how many Gospels that were kept out of the bible? (wouldn't that be considered blasphemy?)
They come right out and admit that leading church officials from around the christian world and Roman Emperor Constantine convened at the Council of Nicea in A.D. 325 to:
Its main accomplishments were settlement of the Christological issue of the nature of the Son of God and his relationship to God the Father,[3] the construction of the first part of the Creed of Nicaea, establishing uniform observance of the date of Easter,[6] and promulgation of early canon law.[4][7]
So basically the Emperor, and the most powerful clergymen of Christendom, gathered to decide the way Christianity would/should be followed from that day forward?
Sounds like they had the ability at that meeting to spin early Christianity any way they sought fit.
Any Christians would be fools to think that the bible they read, is in it's intended entirety.
Who knows if the bible was ever altered again during the Dark Ages, when it would have been easy to control the limited availability of books and the spread of information.
The bible is a collection of stories that have been altered too many times to be taken literally as the word of god.
God does not need an editor.
Dude, don't open your mouth in front of people with some knowledge, because you expose yourself as an ignorant dolt.
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Did religion in general kill these folks, or was it, perhaps, a particular faith?
There's an interesting question.
Most criticize extremist sects of Islam for their violent methods of enforcing Sharia law, the infamous "sword verse" against Christians, death for apostasy, etc....but I believe the majority of Muslims inherently feel this behavior is wrong.....they know it is. They concentrate on the positive aspects of Islam. Others criticize the church of Rome because of the crusades, but what really happened in this situation? Did the church order random murder?
Could it be it's neither the generalized concept of "religion" nor a specific "faith" and just misguided people choosing to commit evil?
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Well, you have made the discovery of all time. Yet, there is no fanfare.
True! The stupidity of the average Earthling is a disgrace. Their inability to deal with reality is appalling.
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True! The stupidity of the average Earthling is a disgrace. Their inability to deal with reality is appalling.
You consider yourself an intelligent, above average Earthling because of your ability to deal with reality?
How is it you handle reality better than the majority? What sets you apart?
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You consider yourself an intelligent, above average Earthling because of your ability to deal with reality?
How is it you handle reality better than the majority? What sets you apart?
A total lack of ignorant superstition in my life. That would work for you too.
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A total lack of ignorant superstition in my life. That would work for you too.
What type of superstitious behavior are you referring to?
Not walking under ladders, not letting black cats cross your path, avoiding breaking mirrors, throwing salt over your shoulder when it spills, etc...?
Those types of behaviors are not part of my life.
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I would MUCH RATHER live in a predominantly CHRISTIAN country than a predominantly MUSLIM country though :)
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What type of superstitious behavior are you referring to?
Not walking under ladders, not letting black cats cross your path, avoiding breaking mirrors, throwing salt over your shoulder when it spills, etc...?
Those types of behaviors are not part of my life.
That, and not believing in all of the religious nonsense that infests the minds of most humans, weakening their minds, as would a destructive computer virus in destroying their ability to use their computer.
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That, and not believing in all of the religious nonsense that infests the minds of most humans, weakening their minds, as would a destructive computer virus in destroying their ability to use their computer.
I see. So what you meant to say was "The stupidity of the average religious person is a disgrace. Their inability to deal with reality is appalling."
I also assume you meant to say "the religious nonsense that infects the minds of most humans" correct?
You weren't suggesting that religious folks have an infestation of insects in their heads were you? Or were you? You mentioned a computer virus so maybe you were.
I can assure you that believers don't have bugs in their heads.....maybe some have lice.
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Erik C is quickly becoming one of my favorite posters!
Great posts all around my friend.
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I see. So what you meant to say was "The stupidity of the average religious person is a disgrace. Their inability to deal with reality is appalling."
I also assume you meant to say "the religious nonsense that infects the minds of most humans" correct?
You weren't suggesting that religious folks have an infestation of insects in their heads were you? Or were you?
Hmm, insects in their heads? Well, cobwebs at least.
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Erik C is quickly becoming one of my favorite posters!
Great posts all around my friend.
LOL...the backup arrives
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I see. So what you meant to say was "The stupidity of the average religious person is a disgrace. Their inability to deal with reality is appalling."
I also assume you meant to say "the religious nonsense that infects the minds of most humans" correct?
You weren't suggesting that religious folks have an infestation of insects in their heads were you? Or were you? You mentioned a computer virus so maybe you were.
I can assure you that believers don't have bugs in their heads.....maybe some have lice.
Actually, there may be something wrong in the brain that causes one to want to believe such nonsense.
http://blog.al.com/wire/2014/01/religious_brains_function_diff.html
Is an atheist's brain the same as a believer's? New research says religious and non-religious minds work differently
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Actually, there may be something wrong in the brain that causes one to want to believe such nonsense.
http://blog.al.com/wire/2014/01/religious_brains_function_diff.html
Is an atheist's brain the same as a believer's? New research says religious and non-religious minds work differently
Are you saying our ancestors the Jews had something wrong upstairs? Do you think maybe it was a result of the sister/brother sexual unions?
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/books/10914137/What-God-does-to-your-brain.html
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Actually, there may be something wrong in the brain that causes one to want to believe such nonsense.
http://blog.al.com/wire/2014/01/religious_brains_function_diff.html
Is an atheist's brain the same as a believer's? New research says religious and non-religious minds work differently
Agreed, there are absolute differences and scripture suggests this:
1 Corinthians 2:14
14 But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means.
I don't mean for this to be insulting either, but I can attest to this notion as I've stood on both sides of it.
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Agreed, there are absolute differences and scripture suggests this:
1 Corinthians 2:14
14 But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means.
I don't mean for this to be insulting either, but I can attest to this notion as I've stood on both sides of it.
Atheists understand that spiritual means, lack of intellect, mental illness, brain injury, or some combination there of.
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Atheists understand that spiritual means, lack of intellect, mental illness, brain injury, or some combination there of.
You're a real class act Erik.....way to represent the atheist community.
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You're a real class act Erik.....way to represent the atheist community.
Thank you, however I represent myself, not any atheist community. Your biblical quote shows how some weak minds can be indoctrinated into religious beliefs. You take someone who is stupid and tell them that they're not stupid, they're actually spiritual! And that people who question "spirituality" don't understand (without saying that they don't understand, because they're not as stupid as you are), and that makes you special and chosen and saved or whatever. There's a sucker born every minute.
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Thank you, however I represent myself, not any atheist community. Your biblical quote shows how some weak minds can be indoctrinated into religious beliefs. You take someone who is stupid and tell them that they're not stupid, they're actually spiritual! And that people who question "spirituality" don't understand (without saying that they don't understand, because they're not as stupid as you are), and that makes you special and chosen and saved or whatever. There's a sucker born every minute.
The way you write it sounds like you are describing yourself at some point.
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Thank you, however I represent myself, not any atheist community. Your biblical quote shows how some weak minds can be indoctrinated into religious beliefs. You take someone who is stupid and tell them that they're not stupid, they're actually spiritual! And that people who question "spirituality" don't understand (without saying that they don't understand, because they're not as stupid as you are), and that makes you special and chosen and saved or whatever. There's a sucker born every minute.
Actually the scripture is discussing the idea of discernment. Those that choose to reject God will not be able to discern the things of God. They perceive the things of God as ridiculous, foolish or stupid.
It has nothing to do with intelligence. There are plenty of unintelligent theists and atheists.
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Actually the scripture is discussing the idea of discernment. Those that choose to reject God will not be able to discern the things of God. They perceive the things of God as ridiculous, foolish or stupid.
It has nothing to do with intelligence. There are plenty of unintelligent theists and atheists.
There is no god. Therefore, anyone who believes in a god, is at best, practicing self deception, and that is being stupid. Intelligent people do not go about spouting nonsense. There are no "things of god" except as figments of your broken mind.
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There is no god. Therefore, anyone who believes in a god, is at best, practicing self deception, and that is being stupid. Intelligent people do not go about spouting nonsense. There are no "things of god" except as figments of your broken mind.
Given the absolute nature of your statements I can only assume that you've humbled yourself and surrendered to the will of God according to his terms. That you genuinely desired to enter into a relationship with God, that you admitted your sin, you accepted Christ as Savior and asked that he reveal himself to you and you experienced absolutely nothing, correct?
Tell me more about that experience. I'm interested to understand your perspective.....I've actually never heard of someone experiencing that before.
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Given the absolute nature of your statements I can only assume that you've humbled yourself and surrendered to the will of God according to his terms. That you genuinely desired to enter into a relationship with God, that you admitted your sin, you accepted Christ as Savior and asked that he reveal himself to you and you experienced absolutely nothing, correct?
Tell me more about that experience. I'm interested to understand your perspective.....I've actually never heard of someone experiencing that before.
I've never had any desire to pretend that there is a god.
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You're a real class act Erik.....way to represent the atheist community.
He`s correct though.
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I've never had any desire to pretend that there is a god.
So on what grounds do you base your opinion? It can't be experience. It can't be direct knowledge. I'd also assume it's based on something far more concrete than the uninformed, inexperienced opinions of similar atheists.
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He`s correct though.
Don't worry TA, I'm fully aware that you support his opinion.......every member of this board is aware......I'd wager every guest/lurker over the last 5 years is aware.
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why does the vatican keep 50 miles of books hidden from public
Because they have gold coins, Cuba is the latest example ;D
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You're all fools, wasting your time. Just smoke some DMT, or do some ayahuasca. You'll see whats really going on.
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So on what grounds do you base your opinion? It can't be experience. It can't be direct knowledge. I'd also assume it's based on something far more concrete than the uninformed, inexperienced opinions of similar atheists.
I base my opinions on reality and STEM. Since there is no evidence for a god, and religious types have had thousands of years to present any such evidence, if it existed, and they haven't presented one piece of evidence to prove their case, the only intelligent opinion anyone can arrive at is that there is no god.
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I base my opinions on reality and STEM. Since there is no evidence for a god, and religious types have had thousands of years to present any such evidence, if it existed, and they haven't presented one piece of evidence to prove their case, the only intelligent opinion anyone can arrive at is that there is no god.
That is why its called, "Faith." Most pastors/ministers will tell you that is why you need faith to believe in a god, since the existence of a god cannot be proven in a lab. Unfortunately, faith is not good enough to make me into a believer. For some people, it is enough. Not for me.
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logical fallacy. you do not know the experiences of every atheist.
Tell that to the many atheists who were raised in strict religious homes. Matt Dillahunty from the Atheist Experience was studying to be a pastor for over 20 years.
dont make generalizations about atheists, because trust me, there are many generalizations about theists.
No logical fallacy because I purposefully said "uninformed, inexperienced opinions of similar atheists".........those similiar to Erik....not all atheists.
I've watched Matt Dillahunty and crew for years and he's admitted he never fully believed. He also did not study to be a pastor for 20 years. He was raised in a home of believers for about 20 years and during the end of that time he briefly pursued the seminary, but he couldn't get past his disbelief (I'm paraphrasing here).
Certainly Matt participated actively in church activities for all of his youth and I belief he gave it his all....I truly do. The difference I see is that he never surrendered to God and he never experienced the Holy Spirit. He's stated that he attended church events in which others around him experienced the presence of God and that he would close his eyes and try, but didn't.....again that nagging disbelief held him back and hence he could not discern the things of God.
Matt is a bit of an anomaly in the atheist circle, but certainly not irreconcilable in terms of theism. His works and disbelief certainly vet his supposed faith.
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That is why its called, "Faith." Most pastors/ministers will tell you that is why you need faith to believe in a god, since the existence of a god cannot be proven in a lab. Unfortunately, faith is not good enough to make me into a believer. For some people, it is enough. Not for me.
You and I have discussed this before also:
There's nothin to be sorry about.
Again, the body of believers sharing their divine experiences is not aligned with scientific evidence, but that doesn't negate it as evidence. It just doesn't meet your standard of criteria in that you want scientific, natural methods of man to prove out the transcendant and divine.
Can't produce God in a test tube and centrifuge or even the Hadron Collider.
Yes, you can use use sociology and anthropology to make a case for the history of religion...no argument.
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That is why its called, "Faith." Most pastors/ministers will tell you that is why you need faith to believe in a god, since the existence of a god cannot be proven in a lab. Unfortunately, faith is not good enough to make me into a believer. For some people, it is enough. Not for me.
When you have "faith," you have nothing at all.
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I always find it interesting how you continually ridicule and dismiss believers and yet the username selected for your account that berates believers is fully biblical and establishes the foundation for how to treat others.
James 2:8
8 Yes indeed, it is good when you obey the royal law as found in the Scriptures: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”
Haha, you're seeing your ghost everywhere. My name is James, and I was 28 when I joined the forum. I certainly didn't get my forum name in a children's book aimed at adults
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Given the absolute nature of your statements I can only assume that you've humbled yourself and surrendered to the will of God according to his terms. That you genuinely desired to enter into a relationship with God, that you admitted your sin, you accepted Christ as Savior and asked that he reveal himself to you and you experienced absolutely nothing, correct?
Tell me more about that experience. I'm interested to understand your perspective.....I've actually never heard of someone experiencing that before.
Did this god thing 'reveal' himself to you?
What does he look like?
Better yet, what drugs were you on?
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You and I have discussed this before also:
Quote from Man of Steel: "the body of believers sharing their divine experiences is not aligned with scientific evidence, but that doesn't negate it as evidence." You're wrong. Delusions are not evidence of anything, except mental illness. They are not scientific evidence, and would even be dismissed as hearsay in a court of law.
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I can feel Erik C reaching out in this thread. It is obvious he is hungry for something and hurting so bad inside. It breaks my heart to see confused kids like Eric who are BEGGING to be loved.
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Quote from Man of Steel: "the body of believers sharing their divine experiences is not aligned with scientific evidence, but that doesn't negate it as evidence." You're wrong. Delusions are not evidence of anything, except mental illness. They are not scientific evidence, and would even be dismissed as hearsay in a court of law.
Trust me 99.8% of this board doesn't care about my posts about "religion" LOL.
Had I not responded to this thread it would've gone into G&O oblivion by morning....now it'll just take a few hours longer to do so.
Even still, the folks that do have minimal interest don't have enough collective fingers and toes to count the times I've had these exact and similar discussions.
Thanks for today's religious trolling....it's been fun!
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At least Uberman snapped out of his religious delusions and admitted it was a load of shit all along. Maybe 2015 would be the MOS does the same and realise his prayers are just whispers into the wind.
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At least Uberman snapped out of his religious delusions and admitted it was a load of shit all along. Maybe 2015 would be the MOS does the same and realise his prayers are just whispers into the wind.
The only thing I'll say about uberman is that he made his choice to live for the all the world has to offer him.
Me, I already lived for the world and then I was changed by Jesus Christ.
I don't care how many ridicule me for my faith. All I care about is others coming to Christ.
Most won't. Some will. But I can assure you I'll exit this life living for Christ.
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The only thing I'll say about uberman is that he made his choice to live for the all the world has to offer him.
Me, I already lived for the world and then I was changed by Jesus Christ.
I don't care how many ridicule me for my faith. All I care about is others coming to Christ.
Most won't. Some will. But I can assure you I'll exit this life living for Christ.
All you care about is spreading ignorant superstitions? Misery loves company.
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All you care about is spreading ignorant superstitions? Misery loves company.
Dude never attacked you, did he? Why the insults?
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insulting is the main tactic used by types like Erika, very mature and rational ::)
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For those concerned. MOS insulted my intelligence. There is no god. Those who say otherwise, should present proof of this god. They can't, and don't, therefore they shouldn't be allowed to spread their lies. Think of all the children who are held back intellectually, by religious beliefs. Consider how much human progress has been held back by religion.
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Dude never attacked you, did he? Why the insults?
You quoted his reason why. Misery loves company. A miserable person attacks those that are opposite of themselves. Spreading their misery.
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there are only strong animals preying on weaker animals in this world, nothing else. You can be spiritual and moral without being religious. Spirituality and morality are useful to keep the animal society in check so it doesnt destroy itself.
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For those concerned. MOS insulted my intelligence. There is no god. Those who say otherwise, should present proof of this god. They can't, and don't, therefore they shouldn't be allowed to spread their lies. Think of all the children who are held back intellectually, by religious beliefs. Consider how much human progress has been held back by religion.
You make a statement that there is no God so can you prove that? Of course you don't have to because the burden of proof is on those who believe in God ::)
If you are not willing to step on the path and use the instrumentation that leads to divine perception you should just stay quite on such matters.
Have you ever investigated your sense of self, how your sense of I arises and where it comes from? No, you conclude it comes from your brains functioning.
The proof of God lays in the experience of God.
I am not even attached to the word God, call it what you like!
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You make a statement that there is no God so can you prove that? Of course you don't have to because the burden of proof is on those who believe in God ::)
If you are not willing to step on the path and use the instrumentation that leads to divine perception you should just stay quite on such matters.
Have you ever investigated your sense of self, how your sense of I arises and where it comes from? No, you conclude it comes from your brains functioning.
The proof of God lays in the experience of God.
I am not even attached to the word God, call it what you like!
Right, it is the clueless believers who must present evidence. It is scientifically impossible to prove a negative.
I have personally investigated all things concerned with my sense of self. I've never needed to go to ignorant superstitions for an "answer." Suggest your read: THE ORIGIN OF CONSCIOUSNESS, IN THE BREAK DOWN OF THE BICAMERAL MIND by Julian Jaynes. If you are really looking for answers.
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The only thing I'll say about uberman is that he made his choice to live for the all the world has to offer him.
Me, I already lived for the world and then I was changed by Jesus Christ.
I don't care how many ridicule me for my faith. All I care about is others coming to Christ.
Most won't. Some will. But I can assure you I'll exit this life living for Christ.
Meltdown.
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I know that there is no god. The concept is stupid, and is designed to appeal to the simple minded. It's a way to control masses of people for the benefit of their masters. It's absurd, and sad, that billions of people waste their lives groveling in fear and pray to some kind of fiction.
Perfectly stated.
Think about how utterly hilarious it is to imagine all the 'tards praying and dedicating themselves to a fictional character. ;D
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Many have experienced the risen Christ in their lives.
It's called a deep and delusional state, MoS.
Fuck me running.
2014 and we still have folks fabricating such nonsense in their lives.
::)
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Given the absolute nature of your statements I can only assume that you've humbled yourself and surrendered to the will of God according to his terms. That you genuinely desired to enter into a relationship with God, that you admitted your sin, you accepted Christ as Savior and asked that he reveal himself to you and you experienced absolutely nothing, correct?
I did. I was born a Catholic ... went to Sunday school, church ... the whole deal. Then when I was in my late-20s I did what you state above. I figured I'd reinvest in my faith and went at it with open heart and conviction.
I even "felt" the presence of god at various stages of my delusion. At the time it felt entirely real. In hindsight, my subconscious mind allowed me to believe all this shite because I wanted to.
Then after a couple of years, my intellect and strength of reason wouldn't let me continue such a farce.
With each passing year since, my awakening has been increasingly impacting, and for me to consider that I actually believed such utter nonsense is troubling.
Religion is horrific and a bane to all human existence.
As another says, it's a form of mental illness.
My mental health is VASTLY improved since allowing truth and reason to infiltrate my life.
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Right, it is the clueless believers who must present evidence. It is scientifically impossible to prove a negative.
I have personally investigated all things concerned with my sense of self. I've never needed to go to ignorant superstitions for an "answer." Suggest your read: THE ORIGIN OF CONSCIOUSNESS, IN THE BREAK DOWN OF THE BICAMERAL MIND by Julian Jaynes. If you are really looking for answers.
Experiencing the ORIGIN OF CONSCIOUSNESS is what is needed not reading about it.
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For those concerned. MOS insulted my intelligence. There is no god. Those who say otherwise, should present proof of this god. They can't, and don't, therefore they shouldn't be allowed to spread their lies. Think of all the children who are held back intellectually, by religious beliefs. Consider how much human progress has been held back by religion.
To raise a child in an environment where "god" is presented as a real thing is abuse, pure and simple.
It's brainwashing.
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I did. I was born a Catholic ... went to Sunday school, church ... the whole deal. Then when I was in my late-20s I did what you state above. I figured I'd reinvest in my faith and went at it with open heart and conviction.
I even "felt" the presence of god at various stages of my delusion. At the time it felt entirely real. In hindsight, my subconscious mind allowed me to believe all this shite because I wanted to.
Then after a couple of years, my intellect and strength of reason wouldn't let me continue such a farce.
With each passing year since, my awakening has been increasingly impacting, and for me to consider that I actually believed such utter nonsense is troubling.
Religion is horrific and a bane to all human existence.
As another says, it's a form of mental illness.
My mental health is VASTLY improved since allowing truth and reason to infiltrate my life.
This ^^^
People following a book about a magic man in the sky, mental... I dont believe in cults, exactly what all religions are.
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To raise a child in an environment where "god" is presented as a real thing is abuse, pure and simple.
It's brainwashing.
So you tell your kids that Santa is a hoax I hope (if you have kids)
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So you tell your kids that Santa is a hoax I hope (if you have kids)
No kids.
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Do any of you think that religion is dying out in the age of information?
Do you think only a fraction of civilized people will believe in the next 100-200 years?
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Christmas day,7 am & still no Jeezeus :-\
;D
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Information cannot quench the need for enlightenment!
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Experiencing the ORIGIN OF CONSCIOUSNESS is what is needed not reading about it.
Knowing that Consciousness is possible, will help you achieve it. So, reading about how it arose, will lead you in the right direction. Knowledge is power.
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Information cannot quench the need for enlightenment!
So what is your denomination Mr. Ro?
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Knowing that Consciousness is possible, will help you achieve it. So, reading about how it arose, will lead you in the right direction. Knowledge is power.
book knowledge is not power, meditation will lead you in the right direction...to knowledge born of direct recognition.
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So what is your denomination Mr. Ro?
I dont have one Mr Shizz
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I dont have one Mr Shizz
Neither do I. I think it is best that way.
There is no "right" religion. The fact that there are multiple religions (many of which are regional) tells you all you need to know.
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book knowledge is not power, meditation will lead you in the right direction...to knowledge born of direct recognition.
Spoken as a stupid lazy person, who doesn't read.
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I have read many books and enjoy reading, just not the type of books you would read.
The finger that points to the moon is not the moon.
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To raise a child in an environment where "god" is presented as a real thing is abuse, pure and simple.
It's brainwashing.
BS to raise a child ramming any beliefs down their throat is abuse. whether it be religion, anti-religion, politics or whatever else. you let your children know your beliefs but allow them to form their own.
i don't believe any person on this planet can be 100% sure whether there is some kind of higher force or not. science in reality has very few answers about how we got here, what we're doing here and even knows very little about what surrounds us.
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BS to raise a child ramming any beliefs down their throat is abuse. whether it be religion, anti-religion, politics or whatever else. you let your children know your beliefs but allow them to form their own.
i don't believe any person on this planet can be 100% sure whether there is some kind of higher force or not. science in reality has very few answers about how we got here, what we're doing here and even knows very little about what surrounds us.
truth
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I have read many books and enjoy reading, just not the type of books you would read.
The finger that points to the moon is not the moon.
Stop mooning the forum. And stop reading the comic books that you enjoy.
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BS to raise a child ramming any beliefs down their throat is abuse. whether it be religion, anti-religion, politics or whatever else. you let your children know your beliefs but allow them to form their own.
i don't believe any person on this planet can be 100% sure whether there is some kind of higher force or not. science in reality has very few answers about how we got here, what we're doing here and even knows very little about what surrounds us.
You know nothing about science. Without science, there would be no useful explanations. I'm 100% sure that there is no god. If you have proof to the contrary, then post it, or shut up.
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Stop mooning the forum. And stop reading the comic books that you enjoy.
the moon is the origin of consciousness, the finger pointing is me, now get meditating Erika
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the moon is the origin of consciousness, the finger pointing is me, now get meditating Erika
Wow, that's a stupid comment.
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wow
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You know nothing about science. Without science, there would be no useful explanations. I'm 100% sure that there is no god. If you have proof to the contrary, then post it, or shut up.
i know that science has far more questions than it has answers regarding our existence and surroundings, you dispute this FACT?...post up the evidence to disprove it...if you can't fk off back under your rock.
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i know that science has far more questions than it has answers regarding our existence and surroundings, you dispute this FACT?...post up the evidence to disprove it...if you can't fk off back under your rock.
Science has more questions than answers. That's how science gets answers. Yet it is only science that has any answers. Religion just demands faith, belief and obedience. Thinking for yourself isn't allowed in religion, unless you absolutely agree with the dogma you are told to believe. I've posted my evidence. You ignored it. Don't you feel stupid? No? Then you are brain dead.
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Science has more questions than answers. That's how science gets answers. Yet it is only science that has any answers. Religion just demands faith, belief and obedience. Thinking for yourself isn't allowed in religion, unless you absolutely agree with the dogma you are told to believe. I've posted my evidence. You ignored it. Don't you feel stupid? No? Then you are brain dead.
so you agree science has more questions than answers... but science is the best we have(?) so who the fuck is anyone to say they know "100%" that this or that couldn't be responsible for us coming to be here...
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I did. I was born a Catholic ... went to Sunday school, church ... the whole deal. Then when I was in my late-20s I did what you state above. I figured I'd reinvest in my faith and went at it with open heart and conviction.
I even "felt" the presence of god at various stages of my delusion. At the time it felt entirely real. In hindsight, my subconscious mind allowed me to believe all this shite because I wanted to.
Then after a couple of years, my intellect and strength of reason wouldn't let me continue such a farce.
With each passing year since, my awakening has been increasingly impacting, and for me to consider that I actually believed such utter nonsense is troubling.
Religion is horrific and a bane to all human existence.
As another says, it's a form of mental illness.
My mental health is VASTLY improved since allowing truth and reason to infiltrate my life.
I thank you for your story and applaud your courage. It's take a man of humble heart to disclose something as personal as suffering from mental illness and delusion. I'm glad you're on the road to recovery and I pray for your full recovery. I believe you'll get there!!
I often visit other forums of a religious nature as a more casual poster and lurker, but I've witnessed folks that claim they desired to know God and presented a compelling story about how they tried and tried and in the end they found absolutely nothing by way of a God experience. More mature believers/posters discussed the situation with folks and in the end the majority of folks were found to be lying about their "journeys to know God". Some just left the boards and weren't able to engage in further discussion.
Now, I don't at all believe you're lying. I absolutely believe you suffered from mental illness and delusion and fortunately your mind continues to heal. Unfortunately, within your developing clarity, you've chosen atheism. Regardless, I pray for a full recovery for you.
My father told me a story about a man he went to high school with that was a both a friend and believer in Christ. Their relationship as believers grew, but this friend of my father's became slowly colder yet somehow chaotic and sometimes frenzied. One evening at a church service he randomly whispered to my Dad and said, "We need to go. Do you see everyone's face in the choir and audience? They're all dead man.....they're all dead." He was clearly not well as I'm sure you can now clearly process.
Now, this old friend of my father was later diagnosed with a mental illness and eventually spent time in the state hospital. His condition improved slightly, but not as significantly as yours has. In fact he never fully recovered that I'm aware. Not everyone that is mentally ill recovers like you have....I'm grateful you have though...it's encouraging for other sufferers I'm sure.
One simple clarification I would make is that because the mental illness you suffered from incorporated some religious delusion doesn't mean everyone that is religious is also ill like you were. Like my father's friend, he was diagnosed with mental illness (coupled with delusions), but yet my father was never mentally ill. In time, with greater healing, I hope you'll begin to understand this.
Again thanks for sharing your story!!
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so you agree science has more questions than answers... but science is the best we have(?) so who the fuck is anyone to say they know "100%" that this or that couldn't be responsible for us coming to be here...
I can be 100% sure there isn't any god, because the god believers and promoters have provided zero evidence of their fictional god, unlike science, that has provided huge amounts of evidence about reality. Reality, something god believers can't deal with.
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All literature, cumulative, that was ingested over the time span from birth till adult hood...
Big Ro's book list...
"Donald And The Mystery Of Babylon"
"Qaba 4 Dummies - foreword by Levi Crypto Hassan"
"Sweat and beer - the gigolos armpit"
"The Sexual Energy Focus - how cold fusion doesn't work"
Book list of MOS...
"Destination Bethlehem"
"Fire Down Below - why Satan created the Benis"
"Crossing the border - Christianity and Hispanic Cuisine"
"Cloud Investment Plans - signed by Bernie Madoff"
Gee, I wonder if this list is real. :D
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I can be 100% sure there isn't any god, because the god believers and promoters have provided zero evidence of their fictional god, unlike science, that has provided huge amounts of evidence about reality. Reality, something god believers can't deal with.
odd how you say "unlike science", and then say provided huge amounts of evidence about reality, but cleverly didn't say the "absence of God".
You said that the others have provided "zero evidence, unlike science", which would denote that science has done the opposite, yet your phrasing...
Smh...
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I can be 100% sure there isn't any god, because the god believers and promoters have provided zero evidence of their fictional god, unlike science, that has provided huge amounts of evidence about reality. Reality, something god believers can't deal with.
Reality?
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Reality?
Yes reality. Obviously something that you are completely unfamiliar with.
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Listen son, your so called reality is nothing but data collected inside a dream, your still dreaming, wake up!
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heres my theory,once u found a religion that u believe in and u find it comforting and its helping u cope with lifes problems than i recommend staying with it. to many people are changing religions/faiths every year and r like blind fish swimmimg in the ocean,i stayed with my same faith since i was 15 yrs old and i dont care what they discover i already believe what i believe and NOTHINGS gonna change that.
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heres my theory,once u found a religion that u believe in and u find it comforting and its helping u cope with lifes problems than i recommend staying with it. to many people are changing religions/faiths every year and r like blind fish swimmimg in the ocean,i stayed with my same faith since i was 15 yrs old and i dont care what they discover i already believe what i believe and NOTHINGS gonna change that.
So you have no potential for growth? Great planning!
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heres my theory,once u found a religion that u believe in and u find it comforting and its helping u cope with lifes problems than i recommend staying with it. to many people are changing religions/faiths every year and r like blind fish swimmimg in the ocean,i stayed with my same faith since i was 15 yrs old and i dont care what they discover i already believe what i believe and NOTHINGS gonna change that.
"like"
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"like"
Why would an intelligent person "like" that? Unless you're not an intelligent person.
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Listen son, your so called reality is nothing but data collected inside a dream, your still dreaming, wake up!
Besides the son part, I agree with that.
I've read and watched about remote viewing and astral projection/travel and there seems some substance to the matter.
I once woke up inside a dream, because some people were copies of each other, and the "matrix" kinda dissolved. I was disappointed and after a few seconds I decided to leave the dream and go to sleep...
...I instantly woke up in my room and it was a pretty crazy feeling.
Very interesting, some of you will know what I'm talking about and some will say hallucination, crazy or such.
Nonetheless, very interesting.
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Besides the son part, I agree with that.
I've read and watched about remote viewing and astral projection/travel and there seems some substance to the matter.
I once woke up inside a dream, because some people were copies of each other, and the "matrix" kinda dissolved. I was disappointed and after a few seconds I decided to leave the dream and go to sleep...
...I instantly woke up in my room and it was a pretty crazy feeling.
Very interesting, some of you will know what I'm talking about and some will say hallucination, crazy or such.
Nonetheless, very interesting.
Yes, I know what you are talking about. You're clueless, and not too bright.
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Jesus was a GD liar :) .....http://www.evilbible.com/Jesus_Lied.htm
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Jesus was a GD liar :) .....http://www.evilbible.com/Jesus_Lied.htm
This person must have some form of mental illness.
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there was a funny story about an Atheist who was on a flight and suddenly, the plane encountered severe turbulence and started loosing altitude and was shaking violently and that Atheist shouted "God, please save us"...... ;D ;D....
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Why would an intelligent person "like" that? Unless you're not an intelligent person.
Stop with the trolling. Clearly you're a gimmick troll.
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Stop with the trolling. Clearly you're a gimmick troll.
Telling the truth isn't trolling. Christians and all religious nuts, should start telling the truth, and stop with the lies.
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Telling the truth isn't trolling. Christians and all religious nuts, should start telling the truth, and stop with the lies.
What is it I should start telling everyone?
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What is it I should start telling everyone?
That there is no god, and religion is all lies.
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there was a funny story about an Atheist who was on a flight and suddenly, the plane encountered severe turbulence and started loosing altitude and was shaking violently and that Atheist shouted "God, please save us"...... ;D ;D....
A story? Right, a made up story! Do you have any more lies to tell?
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That there is no god, and religion is all lies.
LOL!! Hope you've had some fun the last day or two!!
"THERE IS NO GOD AND RELIGION IS ALL LIES!!!!!!!!!" ~ random troll Erik C
;D Precious.
Have a night!
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LOL!! Hope you've had some fun the last day or two!!
"THERE IS NO GOD AND RELIGION IS ALL LIES!!!!!!!!!" ~ random troll Erik C
;D Precious.
Have a night!
A religious nut, calling anyone who tells the truth a troll. It's a shame that someone would choose to throw away his life, believing in such idiotic nonsense.
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A religious nut, calling anyone who tells the truth a troll. It's a shame that someone would choose to throw away his life, believing in such idiotic nonsense.
LOL!!
I've been engaging folks in conversation about religion for years now.
You speak in absolutes only. There is no "conversation" with you. Your first posts on the board attack religion, Christians, etc.... You engage me immediately as though you know me and do so with insults and assorted ad hominem attacks.
This ain't my first rodeo.......marks of the religious troll LOL!!
That said....enough. No conversation is boring.
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LOL!!
I've been engaging folks in conversation about religion for years now.
You speak in absolutes only. There is no "conversation" with you. Your first posts on the board attack religion, Christians, etc.... You engage me immediately as though you know me and do so with insults and assorted ad hominem attacks.
This ain't my first rodeo.......marks of the religious troll LOL!!
That said....enough. No conversation is boring.
You consider it an attack, that I question your beliefs, and you are unable to propose a logical argument to defend the accuracy of your beliefs?
How about this? I challenge your god to a fight to the death. Mano a mano. The winner gets to be the true god. How's that? I mean in the bible your god was always smoting people for this or that, so I should be no match for it. So here I am, calling out your god. Why doesn't he show up to face me? Is he a coward? Is he afraid to show his ugly face? Does he recognize my obvious superiority? What and how many excuses can you make for your non-existent god?
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You consider it an attack, that I question your beliefs, and you are unable to propose a logical argument to defend the accuracy of your beliefs?
How about this? I challenge your god to a fight to the death. Mano a mano. The winner gets to be the true god. How's that? I mean in the bible your god was always smoting people for this or that, so I should be no match for it. So here I am, calling out your god. Why doesn't he show up to face me? Is he a coward? Is he afraid to show his ugly face? Does he recognize my obvious superiority? What and how many excuses can you make for your non-existent god?
And that is what it has always boiled down to. In our society, the only obstacle from being God is God.
We are selfish gods, and want no other God telling us what to do and of course, taking attention away from us. Therefore it is convenient to say "God doesn't exist", because in our (your) mind, he doesn't for you are God.
And this, in itself was you garnering attention for your own Godhood.
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And that is what it has always boiled down to. In our society, the only obstacle from being God is God.
We are selfish gods, and want no other God telling us what to do and of course, taking attention away from us. Therefore it is convenient to say "God doesn't exist", because in our (your) mind, he doesn't for you are God.
And this, in itself was you garnering attention for your own Godhood.
Not really. It was a simple demonstration that god doesn't exist, and believers can't contradict it, without looking like even bigger fools, than they look already.
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No but I`ve trained with a guy named Jesus Garcia!!
Happy Holidays Will. :)
That's a cool name :o
To you also, hope you are well :)
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Do any of you think that religion is dying out in the age of information?
Do you think only a fraction of civilized people will believe in the next 100-200 years?
It is, indeed. However, there will always be those who suffer mental illness or a weak and fearful mind who require fairy tales to remain happy.
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BS to raise a child ramming any beliefs down their throat is abuse. whether it be religion, anti-religion, politics or whatever else. you let your children know your beliefs but allow them to form their own.
i don't believe any person on this planet can be 100% sure whether there is some kind of higher force or not. science in reality has very few answers about how we got here, what we're doing here and even knows very little about what surrounds us.
Point A) A parent's religious faith isn't something that tends to float by a child's radar in a way that allows him or her to hold it off until a mature and intelligent mind has been formed.
Point B) Sure, there very well COULD be a higher force, but WHY does any such entity have to be classified as a god?! WE create, too, and we are not gods. Is it not so difficult to comprehend that there could be other life forms out there that are perhaps trillions (or more) years beyond our level of sophistication?
Really, people. Come on.
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I thank you for your story and applaud your courage. It's take a man of humble heart to disclose something as personal as suffering from mental illness and delusion. I'm glad you're on the road to recovery and I pray for your full recovery. I believe you'll get there!!
I often visit other forums of a religious nature as a more casual poster and lurker, but I've witnessed folks that claim they desired to know God and presented a compelling story about how they tried and tried and in the end they found absolutely nothing by way of a God experience. More mature believers/posters discussed the situation with folks and in the end the majority of folks were found to be lying about their "journeys to know God". Some just left the boards and weren't able to engage in further discussion.
Now, I don't at all believe you're lying. I absolutely believe you suffered from mental illness and delusion and fortunately your mind continues to heal. Unfortunately, within your developing clarity, you've chosen atheism. Regardless, I pray for a full recovery for you.
My father told me a story about a man he went to high school with that was a both a friend and believer in Christ. Their relationship as believers grew, but this friend of my father's became slowly colder yet somehow chaotic and sometimes frenzied. One evening at a church service he randomly whispered to my Dad and said, "We need to go. Do you see everyone's face in the choir and audience? They're all dead man.....they're all dead." He was clearly not well as I'm sure you can now clearly process.
Now, this old friend of my father was later diagnosed with a mental illness and eventually spent time in the state hospital. His condition improved slightly, but not as significantly as yours has. In fact he never fully recovered that I'm aware. Not everyone that is mentally ill recovers like you have....I'm grateful you have though...it's encouraging for other sufferers I'm sure.
One simple clarification I would make is that because the mental illness you suffered from incorporated some religious delusion doesn't mean everyone that is religious is also ill like you were. Like my father's friend, he was diagnosed with mental illness (coupled with delusions), but yet my father was never mentally ill. In time, with greater healing, I hope you'll begin to understand this.
Again thanks for sharing your story!!
No problem, man. Thanks for your response (and I know, of course, it's been designed to highlight and distort what I wrote. But that's OK. What else have you got?).
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heres my theory,once u found a religion that u believe in and u find it comforting and its helping u cope with lifes problems than i recommend staying with it. to many people are changing religions/faiths every year and r like blind fish swimmimg in the ocean,i stayed with my same faith since i was 15 yrs old and i dont care what they discover i already believe what i believe and NOTHINGS gonna change that.
Dumbest statement in this thread, yet.
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there was a funny story about an Atheist who was on a flight and suddenly, the plane encountered severe turbulence and started loosing altitude and was shaking violently and that Atheist shouted "God, please save us"...... ;D ;D....
Yes, hilarious. So some random person claims to be an atheist yet obviously still retains thoughts of belief, and ... what?