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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: 240 is Back on July 14, 2015, 04:59:55 AM
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Give us your reasons why you hate this deal. No positive praise for this historic agreement will be tolerated on this thread. Thanks in advance.
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Don't know the details but Israel isn't very happy
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Israel isn't really happy about anything anymore.
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Ok lets see....we caved. Can't verify every site. 8 years instead of 10 ban on enrichment. Limited inspections on military sites and it lifts sanctions. This will allow the military to buy the latest Russian air defense equipment, modernize their aging Air Force and further allow them to expand support to their proxy terrorist forces abroad. I don't a single one of you would support this deal if anybody other then Obongo was president.
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Don't know the details but Israel isn't very happy
Charles Schumer is the #1 pro-Isr person in congress... he still refuses to comment. "We have to look at this further" = awaiting orders on how to respond. Obama was very clear in the details. "I'm not sure yet" = doesn't want to contradict his bosses.
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Ok lets see....we caved. Can't verify every site. 8 years instead of 10 ban on enrichment. Limited inspections on military sites and it lifts sanctions. This will allow the military to buy the latest Russian air defense equipment, modernize their aging Air Force and further allow them to expand support to their proxy terrorist forces abroad. I don't a single one of you would support this deal if anybody other then Obongo was president.
I don't know all the details of the deal, but from what some repubs are saying its a bad deal. CNN was making it sound like Iran felt they got the better end of the deal.
Short of removing their government by war or repressing their economy and people i don't see how we can stop them from eventually getting nukes.
You would think that supporting terrorism would be a big issue in these negotiations.
Some were saying its no different than the NK talks that ended with NK having nukes eventually.
I hope a national debate occurs because of this, that's the only way a 2/3 vote could occur to stop OB, if in fact its a bad deal, but i think we will find a way to pay attention to something like the Kardashians or the latest hollywood scandal.
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Israel isn't really happy about anything anymore.
Maybe. But if there was a country close to us who has publicly stated that it wants our destruction I would have a pretty high standard of what i was happy about regarding them.
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I don't know all the details of the deal, but from what some repubs are saying its a bad deal. CNN was making it sound like Iran felt they got the better end of the deal.
Short of removing their government by war or repressing their economy and people i don't see how we can stop them from eventually getting nukes.
You would think that supporting terrorism would be a big issue in these negotiations.
Some were saying its no different than the NK talks that ended with NK having nukes eventually.
I hope a national debate occurs because of this, that's the only way a 2/3 vote could occur to stop OB, if in fact its a bad deal, but i think we will find a way to pay attention to something like the Kardashians or the latest hollywood scandal.
Please idiots...look at what he mentions. This should have been central. Instead Hamas and Hez will be re armed...Israel got fucked thrice on this deal.
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Is it true that experts believe gas will be down BELOW $2 a GALLON by the fall, thanks to this deal?
We haven't had iranian oil since 1995 or something... now we will?
If we asked the typical american consumer "would you rather stop bad guys from developing a weapon, or save $3 per gallon on gasoline?"... I believe most americans would take the petro savings.
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Yeah thats great.....enjoy your gass now and your nukes later.
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Looks like Republicans don't like it.
Marco Rubio, Scott Walker Say Next President Must Unwind Iran Nuclear Deal
(http://www.newsmax.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?guid=72a049f0-59f6-49e2-9d14-85cbaad8f686&SiteName=Newsmax&maxsidesize=600)
Image: Marco Rubio, Scott Walker Say Next President Must Unwind Iran Nuclear Deal (Justin Sullivan/Getty Images; Scott Olson/Getty Images)
Tuesday, 14 Jul 2015
Republican presidential candidates rushed to condemn the nuclear agreement between Iran and world powers reached Tuesday, with Senator Marco Rubio of Florida and Governor Scott Walker of Wisconsin saying it will fall to the next commander-in-chief to renew a tough U.S. stance.
“I expect that a significant majority in Congress will share my skepticism of this agreement and vote it down,” said Rubio, who sits on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, in a statement. “Failure by the President to obtain congressional support will tell the Iranians and the world that this is Barack Obama's deal, not an agreement with lasting support from the United States. It will then be left to the next President to return us to a position of American strength and re-impose sanctions on this despicable regime until it is truly willing to abandon its nuclear ambitions and is no longer a threat to international security.”
Walker, who formally joined the race on Monday, called on congressional leaders and his election rivals, including Democratic former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, “to repudiate this agreement.”
“Iran’s Supreme Leader should know that a future American president will not be bound by this diplomatic retreat,” Walker said in a statement. “Undoing the damage caused by this deal won’t be easy. But when the United States leads, and has a president who isn’t eager to embrace Iran, the world will follow. In order to ensure the safety of America and our allies, the next president must restore bipartisan and international opposition to Iran’s nuclear program while standing with our allies to roll back Iran’s destructive influence across the Middle East.”
In a statement, Texas Senator Ted Cruz did not say what he thinks the next president should do, but he urged the public to campaign against the deal during the congressional review period.
“Thankfully, it is not a done deal,” Cruz said. “We still have an opportunity to tell the truth about what [Israeli] Prime Minister Netanyahu called today a ‘bad mistake of historic proportion.’ Congress will have 60 days to review it, and the American people will have 60 days to tell their elected representatives just what they think of it. I urge all my fellow citizens to speak out and let their elected leaders know that even if President Obama won’t see it, we know the leaders of the Islamic Republic who lead crowds in chants of ‘Death to America’ and ‘Death to Israel’ are not our partners in peace, and must not be put on the path to a nuclear bomb.”
South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham, one of the most outspoken critics of the agreement, said that if Clinton supports it, “I think she's made herself dangerously naive.” Speaking on Capitol Hill Tuesday, Clinton said the agreement is an “important step” in putting the lid on Iran's nuclear program.
http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/rubio-walker-iran-deal/2015/07/14/id/656980/#ixzz3ftdwbP9r
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Don't know the details but Israel isn't very happy
Israel is NEVER happy except with the stuff they get away with
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The fact is, no embargo whatsoever will ever keep Iran from getting a nuke....look at North Korea for an example....its best to negotiate and make attempts to hold Iran to the strictest standards possible.....the other alternative is WAR......look how our last wars turned out....we can't keep sending American men and women to shed blood for the Arabs and Israelis......Israel and the Republicans are critical but THEY HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO ALTERNATIVE......even the pentagon does not want war with Iran......all of the great powers agreed on the deal...
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The fact is, no embargo whatsoever will ever keep Iran from getting a nuke....look at North Korea for an example....its best to negotiate and make attempts to hold Iran to the strictest standards possible.....the other alternative is WAR......look how our last wars turned out....we can't keep sending American men and women to shed blood for the Arabs and Israelis......Israel and the Republicans are critical but THEY HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO ALTERNATIVE......even the pentagon does not want war with Iran......all of the great powers agreed on the deal...
That's all good, but losing at the bargaining table is the real issue here. (we will see when the details are revealed and debated) I think everyone understands in the next half century one way or another Iran will get nukes.
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So lets cave and further weaken our hand...jesus fucking christ. Now when Israel has to go in and clean up our mess they'll be dealing with the latest anti air and interceptors that Iran can field from Russia and China...plus all the rockets Hamas and Hez can shoot from Beruit and the strip......yep...great
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That's all good, but losing at the bargaining table is the real issue here. (we will see when the details are revealed and debated) I think everyone understands in the next half century one way or another Iran will get nukes.
yes they will....if a country is detemiend to get them then they will......at least negotiations would slow that down somewhat......again WHO HAS A BETTER ALTERNATIVE???..if you leave Iran alone, they will get the nukes anyway....Obama has actually accomplished something that no other president could...getting the Iranians to agree to an agreement with the US..known to them as the great satan....
Even Reagan tried to make illegal deals with Iran during Iran-Contra which he actually should have been impeached for when you think about it
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So lets cave and further weaken our hand...jesus fucking christ. Now when Israel has to go in and clean up our mess they'll be dealing with the latest anti air and interceptors that Iran can field from Russia and China...plus all the rockets Hamas and Hez can shoot from Beruit and the strip......yep...great
Iran was going to get those anyway...the U.S knew that the arms embargo and sanctions against Iran was going to crumble soon anyway....we got the best deal that could be gotten under the cuircumstances....Russia and china weren't going to back us
Stop hating Obama and you may be able to think more clearly
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You fucking idiot...the sanctions were working...they just got everything they want. Nothing was slowed down....any of your friends die in Iraq.....anybody? I'm a tanker, the Iranians were brought in to kill our tanks.....I've lost friends to these guys...shit you libs cannpt understand. U don't make friends with your enemies...you stomp on their necks until they scub their history and make anime movies about giant robots. You don't cut deals...you win!!!!!
John Kerry denied it. So did Iran’s foreign minister. But the world’s most notorious spymaster stands to benefit—big time—from the accord with Tehran.
Among the big winners in the agreement to curtail Iran’s nuclear program, count a notorious and shadowy Iranian general who helped Shiite militias in Iraq kill American soldiers and who has come to the rescue of Syrian dictator Bashar al-Assad.
You’ll find his name, Qasem Soleimani, buried in an annex (PDF) of the unremittingly dense Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action, along with some of his colleagues from the senior ranks of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps, as well as its various divisions and corporate fronts. They’ll all be granted some sanctions relief as part of the U.S.-brokered deal to curtail Iran’s development of a nuclear weapon.
That Soleimani—who runs Iran’s elite paramilitary and covert operations group, the Quds Force—was even on the list appeared to catch some U.S. officials by surprise. A senior administration official briefing reporters on Tuesday morning didn’t have a ready response when asked when and why Soleimani was added. Secretary of State John Kerry reportedly denied that the 58-year-old general was on the list to be freed from the sanctions yoke. Iranian foreign minister Javad Zarif, agreed, saying Soleimani—whom the U.S. accused in 2011 of plotting to launch a terrorist attack in the United States—had been confused with someone else with a similar name.
They were all wrong—or maybe didn’t want to be right. Soleimani is, in fact, on the list, a Treasury Department official later confirmed to The Daily Beast. And his presence definitely surprised some powerful lawmakers, who are already sharpening their knives for a filleting of the Iran deal.
“He’s got American blood on his hands,” Sen. John Cornyn said of Soleimani. “I’m not sympathetic to lifting sanctions on him, that’s for sure.”
“Soleimani is the guy that sent the copper-tipped IEDs into Iraq,” said Senate Armed Services Committee Chairman John McCain, referring to powerful improvised explosive devices, which Marine Corps Commandant Gen. Joseph Dunford testified last week were responsible for the deaths of 500 soldiers and Marines. “That is really unbelievable,” McCain said when asked about Soleimani’s name showing up in the bowels of the Iran nuclear deal.
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You fucking idiot...the sanctions were working...they just got everything they want. Nothing was slowed down....any of your friends die in Iraq.....anybody? I'm a tanker, the Iranians were brought in to kill our tanks.....I've lost friends to these guys...shit you libs cannpt understand. U don't make friends with your enemies...you stomp on their necks until they scub their history and make anime movies about giant robots. You don't cut deals...you win!!!!!
John Kerry denied it. So did Iran’s foreign minister. But the world’s most notorious spymaster stands to benefit—big time—from the accord with Tehran.
Among the big winners in the agreement to curtail Iran’s nuclear program, count a notorious and shadowy Iranian general who helped Shiite militias in Iraq kill American soldiers and who has come to the rescue of Syrian dictator Bashar al-Assad.
You’ll find his name, Qasem Soleimani, buried in an annex (PDF) of the unremittingly dense Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action, along with some of his colleagues from the senior ranks of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps, as well as its various divisions and corporate fronts. They’ll all be granted some sanctions relief as part of the U.S.-brokered deal to curtail Iran’s development of a nuclear weapon.
That Soleimani—who runs Iran’s elite paramilitary and covert operations group, the Quds Force—was even on the list appeared to catch some U.S. officials by surprise. A senior administration official briefing reporters on Tuesday morning didn’t have a ready response when asked when and why Soleimani was added. Secretary of State John Kerry reportedly denied that the 58-year-old general was on the list to be freed from the sanctions yoke. Iranian foreign minister Javad Zarif, agreed, saying Soleimani—whom the U.S. accused in 2011 of plotting to launch a terrorist attack in the United States—had been confused with someone else with a similar name.
They were all wrong—or maybe didn’t want to be right. Soleimani is, in fact, on the list, a Treasury Department official later confirmed to The Daily Beast. And his presence definitely surprised some powerful lawmakers, who are already sharpening their knives for a filleting of the Iran deal.
“He’s got American blood on his hands,” Sen. John Cornyn said of Soleimani. “I’m not sympathetic to lifting sanctions on him, that’s for sure.”
“Soleimani is the guy that sent the copper-tipped IEDs into Iraq,” said Senate Armed Services Committee Chairman John McCain, referring to powerful improvised explosive devices, which Marine Corps Commandant Gen. Joseph Dunford testified last week were responsible for the deaths of 500 soldiers and Marines. “That is really unbelievable,” McCain said when asked about Soleimani’s name showing up in the bowels of the Iran nuclear deal.
DUDE...calm it down..you're melting.......I sympathize with you in that you're a soldier and Iran killed many of our guys, but thats war for you..we negotiated with Vietnam and they killed 50,000 of our guys..... from what i understand the US got a very good deal..not perfect for us but no negotiation is going to get you everything you want......the workld is not on our side...they don't share our values..they are greedy and care about doing business with Iran....we had to get an agreement or else the sanctions were going to crumble anyway...and don't think that China, Russia, North korea, etc aren't already smuggling stuff undercover to Iran
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yes they will....if a country is detemiend to get them then they will......at least negotiations would slow that down somewhat......again WHO HAS A BETTER ALTERNATIVE???..if you leave Iran alone, they will get the nukes anyway....Obama has actually accomplished something that no other president could...getting the Iranians to agree to an agreement with the US..known to them as the great satan....
Even Reagan tried to make illegal deals with Iran during Iran-Contra which he actually should have been impeached for when you think about it
The Reagan thing is not related at all. I shouldn't have to list all the reasons why that's a horrible supporting argument. That's like bringing the movie ARGO into this.
I have a better alternative:
Not allowing ourselves to be grateful we made a deal when the deal might be complete shit. Instead of focusing on a false gratitude for even making a deal lets examine the deal we made and ask ourselves is it good for us and the region????????????????????
BTW.... "ARGO go fuck yourself!" ;D
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You fucking idiot...the sanctions were working...they just got everything they want. Nothing was slowed down....any of your friends die in Iraq.....anybody? I'm a tanker, the Iranians were brought in to kill our tanks.....I've lost friends to these guys...shit you libs cannpt understand. U don't make friends with your enemies...you stomp on their necks until they scub their history and make anime movies about giant robots. You don't cut deals...you win!!!!!
Truth.
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The Reagan thing is not related at all. I shouldn't have to list all the reasons why that's a horrible supporting argument. That's like bringing the movie ARGO into this.
I have a better alternative:
Not allowing ourselves to be grateful we made a deal when the deal might be complete shit. Instead of focusing on a false gratitude for even making a deal lets examine the deal we made and ask ourselves is it good for us and the region????????????????????
BTW.... "ARGO go fuck yourself!" ;D
Iran Contra does relate in that it proves that for a very long while now, the US has been trying to make deals with Iran and work with them somewhat....Obama simply worked with them out in the open, not in secret...and remember teh Bush administration wanted to negotiate as well....and again, your alternative is not really an alternative...the fact is we can examine the deal from here until the end of the world.....Iran would STILL be able to get the bomb whether sanctions were on or not....the US did the bes tit could under the circumstances.....the rest of the world is not exactly a great help..although they did keep the sanctions on somewhat....
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Truth.
They weren't working....the sanctions were hurting the Iranian economy but the sanctions weren't stopping their nuclear program....the Iranians were basically on the verge of getting a nuke...their program was continuing to grow.....at least now with inspections we have some hope that we will know what they have and where it is in case we actuially do have to bomb later
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Iran Contra does relate in that it proves that for a very long while now, the US has been trying to make deals with Iran and work with them somewhat....Obama simply worked with them out in the open, not in secret...and remember teh Bush administration wanted to negotiate as well....and again, your alternative is not really an alternative...the fact is we can examine the deal from here until the end of the world.....Iran would STILL be able to get the bomb whether sanctions were on or not....the US did the bes tit could under the circumstances.....the rest of the world is not exactly a great help..although they did keep the sanctions on somewhat....
How do you know we did the best we could?
Do you know the details? Do you know what the negotiation points were? Do you what all of our options were?
Or are you just willing to forgo your intelligence and blindly accept a deal that many are calling bad?
It seems to me based on your arguments that's what you are doing:
1. Iran will get nukes no matter what
2. This is the best we could do
3. Reagan tried it too
That's being blind and typical of what some conservatives accuse Obamabots of.
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How do you know we did the best we could?
Do you know the details? Do you know what the negotiation points were? Do you what all of our options were?
Or are you just willing to forgo your intelligence and blindly accept a deal that many are calling bad?
It seems to me based on your arguments that's what you are doing:
1. Iran will get nukes no matter what
2. This is the best we could do
3. Reagan tried it too
That's being blind and typical of what some conservatives accuse Obamabots of.
just as you argue it might be a bad deal, I see A LOT of people saying it was a GOOD DEAL..you see what you want to see and I see what I want to see..simple...
don't get all high and mighty and think your opinion is the prevailing viewpoint ;)
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just as you argue it might be a bad deal, I see A LOT of people saying it was a GOOD DEAL..you see what you want to see and I see what I want to see..simple...
don't get all high and mighty and think your opinion is the prevailing viewpoint ;)
You mean the opinion that says until we know the details we shouldn't be quick to judge?.... which is what you are doing. ;)
Or how I outlined your reasoning and showed how it looks like you just fell in line like you were told to do?
Just saying............ :D
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You mean the opinion that says until we know the details we shouldn't be quick to judge?.... which is what you are doing. ;)
Or how I outlined your reasoning and showed how it looks like you just fell in line like you were told to do?
Just saying............ :D
The fact is that Iran is entitled to get a nuke if it so pleases to do so.....we can't delegitimize their whole nuke program.....Pakistan, North Korea, and Israel got the bomb and no one did anything
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Even Reagan tried to make illegal deals with Iran during Iran-Contra which he actually should have been impeached for when you think about it
Obama is almost as bad as Reagan. Obama made his deal in the open. Reagan's illegal deals with Iran were secret.
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The fact is that Iran is entitled to get a nuke if it so pleases to do so.....we can't delegitimize their whole nuke program.....Pakistan, North Korea, and Israel got the bomb and no one did anything
Where am i arguing that? ::)
WHAT ABOUT ANY OF MY FUCKING POSTS SAYS I AM ARGUING THAT?
(in caps for effect ;))
I can argue that aspect of it if you want, because i see that you don't want to talk about your poor reasoning regarding the nuke deal.
Here, I will help you get started: None of those 3 should have nukes.
next...
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Where am i arguing that? ::)
WHAT ABOUT ANY OF MY FUCKING POSTS SAYS I AM ARGUING THAT?
(in caps for effect ;))
I can argue that aspect of it if you want, because i see that you don't want to talk about your poor reasoning regarding the nuke deal.
Here, I will help you get started: None of those 3 should have nukes.
next...
Ozmo, you want to argue about stuff in a vacuum and you can't do that....you have to draw on history in order to make a contrast and to put things in context....I' just saying that as a matter of law, the U.s does not have the right to deny anyone nuclear energy and by extension, a nuclear bomb.....oh sure theres the non-proliferation treaty but lets face it everyone ignores that...Israel sure did.....so now we are supposed to go to war ONCE AGAIN in the middle east to prevent Iran from getting nukes.....no one wnats that....better to negotiatewhich we did....
we have to stop believing that we ALWAYS come out on the short end of the stick when we negotiate with other countries..they are no smarter than we are... many of the people who came out againast the deal, did so BEFORE THE DEAL WAS EVEN DONE AND BEFORE THEY EVEN TOOK A LOOK AT IT......so why I am villified for feeling we got the best deal possible?
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Ozmo, you want to argue about stuff in a vacuum and you can't do that....you have to draw on history in order to make a contrast and to put things in context....I' just saying that as a matter of law, the U.s does not have the right to deny anyone nuclear energy and by extension, a nuclear bomb.....oh sure theres the non-proliferation treaty but lets face it everyone ignores that...Israel sure did.....so now we are supposed to go to war ONCE AGAIN in the middle east to prevent Iran from getting nukes.....no one wnats that....better to negotiatewhich we did....
we have to stop believing that we ALWAYS come out on the short end of the stick when we negotiate with other countries..they are no smarter than we are... many of the people who came out againast the deal, did so BEFORE THE DEAL WAS EVEN DONE AND BEFORE THEY EVEN TOOK A LOOK AT IT......so why I am villified for feeling we got the best deal possible?
You are saying it without looking at the details of the deal.
If you are ever interested in buying a house, a car, land, stocks, etc. Lemme know, I will tie Obama into somehow and you will think its the best deal possible.
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You are saying it without looking at the details of the deal.
If you are ever interested in buying a house, a car, land, stocks, etc. Lemme know, I will tie Obama into somehow and you will think its the best deal possible.
Thats funny ;)...but again I am realistic about what the deal will accomplish...we won't get everything we want but neither will Iran....if one side gets EVERYTHING they wanted then its a bad deal and one-sided.....
The days when the United States could bully the world is OVER...I'm not willing to fight endless wars while Russia, China, the EU, and Israel benefit from the blood of our soldiers
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Thats funny ;)...but again I am realistic about what the deal will accomplish...we won't get everything we want but neither will Iran....if one side gets EVERYTHING they wanted then its a bad deal and one-sided.....
The days when the United States could bully the world is OVER...I'm not willing to fight endless wars while Russia, China, the EU, and Israel benefit from the blood of our soldiers
How do you know what the deal will accomplish if you don't know the details?
Why are you now trying to make a weak all or nothing argument?
And why are you hyperbole-ing also?
This is what your arguments have come down to now Andre?
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Meanwhile 4 American citizens being STILL being held in Iran. We couldn't even get them out there on this deal?
But according to Andre this is a great deal.
If anyone wants to make an easy buck, if you know Andre in person, he'll buy anything without using his head or any critical thinking if Obama is related to it somehow. You can sell him on anything!
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Meanwhile 4 American citizens being STILL being held in Iran. We couldn't even get them out there on this deal?
But according to Andre this is a great deal.
If anyone wants to make an easy buck, if you know Andre in person, he'll buy anything without using his head or any critical thinking if Obama is related to it somehow. You can sell him on anything!
so what is your solution? have not read the whole thread to be fair but what should the US Gov do ?
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Meanwhile 4 American citizens being STILL being held in Iran. We couldn't even get them out there on this deal?
But according to Andre this is a great deal.
If anyone wants to make an easy buck, if you know Andre in person, he'll buy anything without using his head or any critical thinking if Obama is related to it somehow. You can sell him on anything!
Negotiation 101...you don'muddy the water with outside issues...the three people being held has nothing to do with the nuclear issue.....also with your acusation about me accepting anything Obama does, whose hyperboling now?
The deal saves us from another war...sounds good to me...if I see things in the deal I don't like I wil change my opinion...right now, I'm taking the side of those who say the deal is good
I'm not used to seeing you melting ;)
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Negotiation 101...you don'muddy the water with outside issues...the three people being held has nothing to do with the nuclear issue.....also with your acusation about me accepting anything Obama does, whose hyperboling now?
The deal saves us from another war...sounds good to me...if I see things in the deal I don't like I wil change my opinion...right now, I'm taking the side of those who say the deal is good
I'm not used to seeing you melting ;)
::)
Negotiation Reality: You use what ever you can to negotiate with.
Obviously, you don't know anything about negotiation.
Further more, you assume with out the deal we were certainly heading for war. I am not surprised by this coming from you seeing everything you quickly and easily allow your self to believe.
Now, all you have left to to accuse me of melting down.
Get something straight, when i show you how flawed your thinking is, its not me melting down. But if you need to tell yourself that to keep your delusion going feel free.
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so what is your solution? have not read the whole thread to be fair but what should the US Gov do ?
I don't know the full details of the deal yet. But i do know that 4 Americans held should have been part of it.
We will see the details in the coming weeks as congress hashes it out.
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I don't know the full details of the deal yet. But i do know that 4 Americans held should have been part of it.
We will see the details in the coming weeks as congress hashes it out.
Agreed
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::)
Negotiation Reality: You use what ever you can to negotiate with.
Obviously, you don't know anything about negotiation.
Further more, you assume with out the deal we were certainly heading for war. I am not surprised by this coming from you seeing everything you quickly and easily allow your self to believe.
Now, all you have left to to accuse me of melting down.
Get something straight, when i show you how flawed your thinking is, its not me melting down. But if you need to tell yourself that to keep your delusion going feel free.
I was obviously kidding around with you but now I see you're REALLY melting down....I like the deal..you're not so sure....lets leave it at that
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"We dont make deals like this with our friends".
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I was obviously kidding around with you but now I see you're REALLY melting down....I like the deal..you're not so sure....lets leave it at that
Keep telling yourself that.
BTW, i got this Obama approved toll bridge for sale..........
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I don't know the full details of the deal yet. But i do know that 4 Americans held should have been part of it.
We will see the details in the coming weeks as congress hashes it out.
Agreed
x 2
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Watch: Netanyahu Goes On U.S. TV And Reveals What He Told Obama After Iran Deal
"Iran is different. It's a zealot country. It is governed by a group that believes in militant Islamic fundamentalism."
Randy DeSoto
July 15, 2015
Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has not held back in voicing his grave concerns with the nuclear agreement reached with Iran, which was announced by the Obama administration Tuesday.
Even as the structure of the agreement was taking shape, Netanyahu saw it as a threat to the security of Israel and the region. In an address before a joint session of Congress in March, Netanyahu said the proposed agreement “doesn’t block Iran’s path to the bomb, it paves Iran’s path to the bomb.”
Now that the actual agreement has been reached, the Israeli Prime Minister’s concerns have only been heightened.
In an interview with NBC News’ Lester Holt, the prime minister said he told President Obama in a phone call on Tuesday that the agreement “poses a great danger to Israel, and I believe it poses a great danger to America and the world.”
Obama reportedly told him that the deal “will verifiably prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon while ensuring the peaceful nature of Iran’s nuclear program going forward.”
It lifts economic sanctions against the rogue regime.
It keeps Iran’s nuclear infrastructure in place.
It gives Iran 24 days to respond to any inspection of facilities by the U.N.
Netanyahu explained: “When you let the number one terrorist regime in the world have a sure path to the bomb and hundreds of billions of dollars to finance its terrorism around the world, that’s not good for any of us.”
Regarding inspections, he added: “Can you imagine giving a drug dealer 24 days’ notice before you inspect the premises? That’s a lot of time to flush a lot of meth down the toilet.”
Netanyahu said a good deal would have linked Iran’s conduct with the lifting of sanctions. “There is no linkage to Iran’s change of behavior,” he said. “They can continue their regional aggression, their terrorism worldwide, subversion in so many countries, in so many lands. In fact they’re going to get 100s of billions of dollars to fuel their terror and military machine, and they don’t have to change anything. They are even going to get their arms embargo lifted in a few years.”
He also pointed out that “Iran is building intercontinental ballistic missiles, not to reach us, they already have those missiles, but to reach the United States. The Supreme Leader of Iran said the battle will continue with the United States even after the deal. For them, we’re the little satan, you are the great satan.”
He observed that “just five days ago, the so-called moderate president of Iran was at a rally in Tehran where they burnt American flags and chanted death to America.”
Israel’s Labor Party leader and fierce critic of the prime minister, Isaac Herzog, stands with him concerning the agreement. “I had a meeting yesterday where I learned about the deal and I think it is bad for Israel. [Netanyahu and myself] will certainly cooperate when it comes to the security of Israel. As an Israeli patriot, this deal is dangerous,” the Times of Israel reports him saying.
NBC News noted that Netanyahu’s wariness about the deal is also “shared by the Arab world, where countries expressed skepticism that a deal would really prevent Iran from gaining a nuclear weapon, and voiced fears that Iran would only gain more in the region without economic sanctions.”
“It doesn’t happen very often in history, but when Arabs and Israelis agree, it’s worth paying attention,” Netanyahu told Holt. “Iran is different. It’s a zealot country,” he said. “It is governed by a group that believes in militant Islamic fundamentalism. It’s killed a lot of Americans. It’s killing everybody in sight in the Middle East.”
http://www.westernjournalism.com/watch-netanyahu-goes-on-u-s-tv-and-reveals-what-he-told-obama-after-iran-deal/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=WesternJournalism&utm_content=2015-07-19
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This is a great deal, what's wrong with you. America cant have everything it wants. This is better than getting into a war with Russia and China. I loved BUSH.
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This is a great deal, what's wrong with you. America cant have everything it wants. This is better than getting into a war with Russia and China. I loved BUSH.
whats your alternative smart guy?....the fact is there is absolutely no way short of war that we could have stopped Iran from getting Nukes.....negotiation is the best way to go and the other powers, INCLUDING FRANCE AND BRITAIN wanted this deal as well....war has not worked in the middle east.....we can't go down that road again......and yes it appears to be a great deal under the circumstances.....the U.S. has to go along with the rest of the world on this because the rest of the world was going to break ranks and start trading with Iran again if there wasn't a deal
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whats your alternative smart guy?....the fact is there is absolutely no way short of war that we could have stopped Iran from getting Nukes.....negotiation is the best way to go and the other powers, INCLUDING FRANCE AND BRITAIN wanted this deal as well....war has not worked in the middle east.....we can't go down that road again......and yes it appears to be a great deal under the circumstances.....the U.S. has to go along with the rest of the world on this because the rest of the world was going to break ranks and start trading with Iran again if there wasn't a deal
Dude stop melting down. ;)
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Dude stop melting down. ;)
and your obvious sarcasm isn't melting down??? ;)..I'm just challenging you
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and your obvious sarcasm isn't melting down??? ;)..I'm just challenging you
You aren't challenging anyone. You still haven't addressed your crappy arguments from earlier I the thread. :D
You know you are virtually the same as 3333. Just on the other side of the spectrum. Lol
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You aren't challenging anyone. You still haven't addressed your crappy arguments from earlier I the thread. :D
You know you are virtually the same as 3333. Just on the other side of the spectrum. Lol
no way :)..contrary to what you might think, my arguments are based on evidence and rationality....
France and Britain , our two greatest allies in the world think its a great deal and remember France a few months ago stated loudly that they didn't like the deal...they have now come onboard......the deal was written by nuclear experts
Uzi Even, who is a nuclear physicist who used to work in the Iranian facilities stated "the deal blocks every pathway to a bomb that I know of......the Iranians maybe celebrating but they have in fact swallowed a very bitter pill.....more so than they would like to let on...."
Many other experts that I've seen on CNN stated that the deal is good for America and grants access to facilities that are unheard of..
so I think I have reason to take the position that I have
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no way :)..contrary to what you might think, my arguments are based on evidence and rationality....
France and Britain , our two greatest allies in the world think its a great deal and remember France a few months ago stated loudly that they didn't like the deal...they have now come onboard......the deal was written by nuclear experts
Uzi Even, who is a nuclear physicist who used to work in the Iranian facilities stated "the deal blocks every pathway to a bomb that I know of......the Iranians maybe celebrating but they have in fact swallowed a very bitter pill.....more so than they would like to let on...."
Many other experts that I've seen on CNN stated that the deal is good for America and grants access to facilities that are unheard of..
so I think I have reason to take the position that I have
No they are not.
First, you failed to see my position on the whole thing repeatedly.
Then you assumed it was a great deal without knowing any of the details.
Pretty much what you have done is what 33333 used to do all the time: exchange common sense and rationality for bias
Now that its been a few days all you are doing is regurgitating what you've seen other peeps say (likely mostly opinion based stuff). And you are probably, because you made your mind up early to fall in line with your parties status quo, you are only paying attention to stuff that supports your premature conclusions of a few days ago. Just like 33333 used to do all the time.
Yes, Andre you are no different than 3333 in this respect.
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No they are not.
First, you failed to see my position on the whole thing repeatedly.
Then you assumed it was a great deal without knowing any of the details.
Pretty much what you have done is what 33333 used to do all the time: exchange common sense and rationality for bias
Now that its been a few days all you are doing is regurgitating what you've seen other peeps say (likely mostly opinion based stuff). And you are probably, because you made your mind up early to fall in line with your parties status quo, you are only paying attention to stuff that supports your premature conclusions of a few days ago. Just like 33333 used to do all the time.
Yes, Andre you are no different than 3333 in this respect.
you're going way overboard and I presented why I'm for the agreement...you haven't presented anything yet..you're on the fence and that's fine but Im taking a stand and based on what I've heard so far, I like the deal....as for "waiting to read it first" that's a red herring and you know it...you nor anybody else on GetBig is going to read a document that is likely to run hundreds if not thousands of pages....and you wouldn't understand what you're reading anyway unless the great Ozmo is also a nuclear scientist :D
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you're going way overboard and I presented why I'm for the agreement...you haven't presented anything yet..you're on the fence and that's fine but Im taking a stand and based on what I've heard so far, I like the deal....as for "waiting to read it first" that's a red herring and you know it...you nor anybody else on GetBig is going to read a document that is likely to run hundreds if not thousands of pages....and you wouldn't understand what you're reading anyway unless the great Ozmo is also a nuclear scientist :D
You took a stand before you heard anything of substance. At least admit it homes. 8) (you seem to forget, only Coach is left here these days, 333 is long gone, no need to post as if he's still here)
Congress is going to hash it out. During that process much will be revealed in a way that's easy to understand about the treaty.
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America cant have everything it wants.
They believe reagan won 100% of the battles he fought with our adversaries and never compromised, ever.
their recollection of 1980 to 1988 wsa mostly doing coke and voting mondale, but today they loves them some reagan lol.
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http://www.aol.com/article/2015/07/21/kerry-says-iran-vow-to-defy-u-s-is-very-disturbing/21211758/
Fucking lol.
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You took a stand before you heard anything of substance. At least admit it homes. 8) (you seem to forget, only Coach is left here these days, 333 is long gone, no need to post as if he's still here)
Congress is going to hash it out. During that process much will be revealed in a way that's easy to understand about the treaty.
I guess we can add "mindreader" to your credentials as a getbig Mod and Nuclear physicist......I've been following this for the past few months and listening to opinions from pundits on various media shows.....I devour news practically 24/7....so I do have some info to go on in forming an opinion....as for substance I have already given you substance for my arguments....you just refuse to accept it as such because you chose to be argumentative....
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I guess we can add "mindreader" to your credentials as a getbig Mod and Nuclear physicist......I've been following this for the past few months and listening to opinions from pundits on various media shows.....I devour news practically 24/7....so I do have some info to go on in forming an opinion....as for substance I have already given you substance for my arguments....you just refuse to accept it as such because you chose to be argumentative....
Oh yeah they were releasing details of these public (behind closed doors) negotiations as they were happening. Right. ::) :) lol
You just hopped on the band wagon the minute your precious OB was attacked without looking to see where the wagon was heading. Plain and simple.
I am not choosing to be argumentative. I am pointing out BS when i see it.
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Oh yeah they were releasing details of these public (behind closed doors) negotiations as they were happening. Right. ::) :) lol
You just hopped on the band wagon the minute your precious OB was attacked without looking to see where the wagon was heading. Plain and simple.
I am not choosing to be argumentative. I am pointing out BS when i see it.
theres no BS my friend...I have always been for an agreement that keeps us out of war....and I'm for the agreement now....I've been consistent.....if anything conservatives who don't like the deal but are all over the news being agaisnt the deal haven't seen it either..yet they are still giving their opinion about it..I'm just doing the same....yet you're villifying me....
and if there is no deal then again WHATS YOUR ALTERNATIVE???????
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theres no BS my friend...I have always been for an agreement that keeps us out of war....
Stay on point there homes, that's not what this discussion is about. heheheh HAHAHAHAHAHAH
....yet you're villifying me....
No i am just showing how full of shit you are.
and if there is no deal then again WHATS YOUR ALTERNATIVE???????
This isn't an all or nothing issue. Dam you sound so republican right now. cracking me up!
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Stay on point there homes, that's not what this discussion is about. heheheh HAHAHAHAHAHAH
No i am just showing how full of shit you are.
This isn't an all or nothing issue. Dam you sound so republican right now. cracking me up!
sigh.....you're evading..........going in circles
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sigh.....you're evading..........going in circles
how am i going in circles? lol
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and if there is no deal then again WHATS YOUR ALTERNATIVE???????
Democrat logic. Lets create phony urgency and do something stupid just to get something done.
The alternative is no deal. Don't be in a hurry to lift the sanctions. There's no reason to. A deal, even a good deal, benefits Iran way more than it does us...and you can't trust them worth a shit to abide by the deal anyway.
Obama and his team of stooges have to be the worst negotiators in the history of time.
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Democrat logic. Lets create phony urgency and do something stupid just to get something done.
The alternative is no deal. Don't be in a hurry to lift the sanctions. There's no reason to. A deal, even a good deal, benefits Iran way more than it does us...and you can't trust them worth a shit to abide by the deal anyway.
Obama and his team of stooges have to be the worst negotiators in the history of time.
sigh....you act as if NO DEAL means they won't get the bomb...THEY WILL>>.....North Korea.....Israel.....and Pakistan got the bomb....Japan and South Korea could get it if they wanted to...they have the technology......Continue d sanctions won't stop them from getting nukes.....Negotiation is the only way short of war....also BRITAIN AND FRANCE WANT THE DEAL....Russia and China want it as well or they are going to break sanctions and start selling Iran all the shit they will need to develop a weapon
what your alternative
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The former leader of Shin Bet (Israel's intelligence service), Ami Ayalon, just came out and said "The Iran deal is good for Israel" 8)...he also stated that he knows many other officials in Shin Bet and in the Mossad (Israel's equivalent of the CIA) who agree with him and think the deal is best for Israel... Quote "when it comes to Iran's nuclear capability, this deal is the best option"
If its good enough for him and for the other members of the Mossad and Shin Bet, its good enough for me. 8)
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/21/ex-intel-chief-iran-deal-good-for-israel.html
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sigh....you act as if NO DEAL means they won't get the bomb...THEY WILL>>.....North Korea.....Israel.....and Pakistan got the bomb....Japan and South Korea could get it if they wanted to...they have the technology......Continue d sanctions won't stop them from getting nukes.....Negotiation is the only way short of war....also BRITAIN AND FRANCE WANT THE DEAL....Russia and China want it as well or they are going to break sanctions and start selling Iran all the shit they will need to develop a weapon
what your alternative
Two tactics being used.
1. Pretending that it's inevitable so we must help them speed the process along.
2. Pretending that we must either take this deal or come up with an alternative immediately. Phony urgency.
Both false.
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Two tactics being used.
1. Pretending that it's inevitable so we must help them speed the process along.
2. Pretending that we must either take this deal or come up with an alternative immediately. Phony urgency.
Both false.
Dude...it definitely is inevitiable....even with sanctions, Iran was progressing nicely toward a nuke.....it would happen eventually...nothing can prevent that short of war......The American people consistently have said they do not want to go to war again in the middle east.....if teh moderate middle eastern countries were smart, they would partner up with Israel and restore diplomatic relations with them....and then they could present a united front against Iran...but Israel would also have to finally deal seriiously with teh Palestinian problem..so therin lies the problem
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How...explain how it was inevitiable. No name calling...no bullshit...explain how it was this deal or no deal.
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The former leader of Shin Bet (Israel's intelligence service), Ami Ayalon, just came out and said "The Iran deal is good for Israel" 8)...he also stated that he knows many other officials in Shin Bet and in the Mossad (Israel's equivalent of the CIA) who agree with him and think the deal is best for Israel... Quote "when it comes to Iran's nuclear capability, this deal is the best option"
If its good enough for him and for the other members of the Mossad and Shin Bet, its good enough for me. 8)
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/21/ex-intel-chief-iran-deal-good-for-israel.html
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wow. I don't know enough about this topic to debate deeply, but it seems like that person would know what they are talking about more than getbiggers.
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How...explain how it was inevitiable. No name calling...no bullshit...explain how it was this deal or no deal.
okay....Headhunter, you gotta look at the facts.....NORTH KOREA has the worst economy on earth and has had crippling sanctions on them forever...YET...they were able to engineer nukes and are still adding to that arsenal today........Pakistan too...they were able to engineer nukes as well even though they are basically a third world country...so was Israel even though half the world doesn't trade with them.......
Even china was an extremely poor country when they developed nukes back in the 1950's...sanctions didn't work against them either
Sanctions and having a poor economy DOES NOT WORK to keep countries from acquiring nukes...
at least this treaty gives us access to their facilities and gives us some idea of what they've got and where its all hidden....this will come in handy later on in case we REALLY DO have to bomb them if they break the treaty......also it prevents them from spreading this nuclear technology to others because we will know what they have, and how much so NOTHING CAN BE DIVERTED
Plus we have to begin to move on and establish some type of relationship with Iran like we've done with Cuba.....we can't afford to have permanent enemies.....we dealt with STALIN who was probably the worse mass murderer in history so he could help us against Hitler....we dealt with MAO who murdered millions as well.....surely we can deal with IRAN
and again if you read my post above, many members of Shin Bet and the Mossad are actually for the deal....if its fine with them and they say that Netanyahu is wrong, then why are we so against it??????????...also these talks began in the BUSH ADMINISTRATION....Bush wanted this deal as well....but Obama MADE IT HAPPEN...the opposition to this deal is mostly because of the hostility toward Obama...plain and simple..its politics...NOT substance.Bush could not go against his own party....give Obama credit for having the balls to see it through to the end..also for saving the lives of countless American soldiers
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We can't?.....we did for 50 years with the russians and they collapsed...history much? These people sponsor terrorism around the world. This treaty gives us no friggen access as they have banned US inspectors. You trust the UN? The two guys Stalin and Mao......they represented political ideologies...this is a murderous poli/rel ideology that can't be reasoned with. There are no reliable checks to stop them. Sanctions worked..threat of attacks worked...Iran is not NK. NK had china the entire time.
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We can't?.....we did for 50 years with the russians and they collapsed...history much? These people sponsor terrorism around the world. This treaty gives us no friggen access as they have banned US inspectors. You trust the UN? The two guys Stalin and Mao......they represented political ideologies...this is a murderous poli/rel ideology that can't be reasoned with. There are no reliable checks to stop them. Sanctions worked..threat of attacks worked...Iran is not NK. NK had china the entire time.
Sanctions were NOT working...you are living in a fantasy..if sanctions were working why was Israel threatening to Bomb the Iranian facilities ?????..and yes communism was a murderous ideology....Stalin murdered tens of millions including 20 million in the famine he purposely created in the Ukraine....Mao murdered millions in the Cultural Revolution....again we have to at least try with the agreement.....yes they sponsor terrorism but we can only moderate their behavior later on if we begin to lessen tensions now.....your only alternative is war..the American people do not want that
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What do those two have in common...they were murdering their own people...if the Irainins mudered 20 million of their own we could move right in. So in your mind...Irans' inability to harden their nuke sites with the latest Russian Anti Air or re equip Hamas or Hezbollah adequatly enough to continue to fuck with Israel as in affective. They worked well enough but now there are no sanctions and they can do whatever they want. Where since 1979 has it been shown that these guys can be appeased....you can't show it because they cannot be appeased. People like this understand one thing....a goddam punch in the nuts.
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What do those two have in common...they were murdering their own people...if the Irainins mudered 20 million of their own we could move right in. So in your mind...Irans' inability to harden their nuke sites with the latest Russian Anti Air or re equip Hamas or Hezbollah adequatly enough to continue to fuck with Israel as in affective. They worked well enough but now there are no sanctions and they can do whatever they want. Where since 1979 has it been shown that these guys can be appeased....you can't show it because they cannot be appeased. People like this understand one thing....a goddam punch in the nuts.
Making a deal with your enemy is not always appeasement,,,its self- preservation.......bette r to make a deal and bring Iran back into the family of nations or they could just sell their technology to the crazies out there..
Again...leaders of Shin Bet and the Mossad say the deal is fine....and they are the ones who are directly threatened....
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Good job