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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: pellius on December 04, 2018, 10:22:58 PM
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I just did legs and just feel like crap. Not the drained, fatigued feeling you great following a hard workout but actually kind of light-headed, nauseous, and sick with diarrhea feeling.
I started out full of fire. After some warm-ups, I did one set of leg curls followed by one set of the standing Hammer squat, then back to single leg curls, followed by super setting leg extensions with the Hammer seated press. All were done to failure with forced reps, rest pause, and partials along with body weight full squats following both the Hammer Squat and Hammer leg press. I finished off with a set of stiff leg deads.
I don't even feel like eating and could barely down a whey protein drink along with a banana.
Blood pressure seems abnormally low. Fortunately, I'm off until Friday.
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Go to the hospital.
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Go to the hospital.
I concur. Go now
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PIP.
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You shouldn't feel like crap after doing leg work. Perhaps you were coming down with something that was compromising your workout...like a virus.
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I just did legs and just feel like crap. Not the drained, fatigued feeling you great following a hard workout but actually kind of light-headed, nauseous, and sick with diarrhea feeling.
I started out full of fire. After some warm-ups, I did one set of leg curls followed by one set of the standing Hammer squat, then back to single leg curls, followed by super setting leg extensions with the Hammer seated press. All were done to failure with forced reps, rest pause, and partials along with body weight full squats following both the Hammer Squat and Hammer leg press. I finished off with a set of stiff leg deads.
I don't even feel like eating and could barely down a whey protein drink along with a banana.
Blood pressure seems abnormally low. Fortunately, I'm off until Friday.
Your body is in shock. At your age doing tons of beyond failure training in such volume is suicide. Go heavy on one exercise and moderate on the rest. You will look worse training like Tom Platz. I really hope you didn't have a minor heart attack. Get checked!
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You shouldn't feel like crap after doing leg work. Perhaps you were coming down with something that was compromising your workout...like a virus.
No, no virsus. You don't get a virus training legs or training anything. And if I was coming down with anything I would feel it before I get to the gym. I know when I'm starting to get sick. I came into the gym eager and anxious to blast. When you take a set, especially for a large muscle group like legs, to positive failure. Meaning you can't eek out another rep to save your life, then you do a few forced reps, then rest pauses where you lock out, take three deep breaths and bang out another forced rep, do that for four more reps, with every rep lowered in a slow, deliberate fashion so that it burns going down, then immediately grab a 45lb plate holding it between your legs for wide leg Sumo-type squats for another 15 reps, then do some bodyweight squats until your ready to drop to the floor --- for the first set. Then leg curls again with forced reps, rest pause, burns. Then a superset of extensions and leg press in the same fashion with the Sumo squats and bodyweight squats, followed by a set of stiff leg deads -- then it was probably more overexertion then a virus. I'm almost sixty goddamn years old now!
I feel much, much better now from just lying on the couch for a couple of hours to give my body a chance to normalize. I was thinking if maybe this was how Sergio Oliva felt after Arthur Jones' put him through his infamous quad routine which consisted of one set of leg press, followed immediately by one set of leg extension, then heading straight to the squat rack. Every set done to the death under Jones' watchful and demanding eye. Witnesses said that after finishing up with squats Sergio fell to the floor and didn't move for twenty minutes. Sergio claimed he was in his biggest and best shape training under Jones in Deland, Florida.
Anyway, I got my appetite back and had some chicken, rice, steamed vegetables (broccoli, cauliflower and carrots) and three oatmeal raisin cookies. I'm now in that pleasantly fatigued relaxed mode and already drifting off to sleep.
Two days of loafing and recovering and I'll be back Friday ready to go full on HIT Arthur Jones' style for chest, back, and shoulders.
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No, no virsus. You don't get a virus training legs or training anything. And if I was coming down with anything I would feel it before I get to the gym. I know when I'm starting to get sick. I came into the gym eager and anxious to blast. When you take a set, especially for a large muscle group like legs, to positive failure. Meaning you can't eek out another rep to save your life, then you do a few forced reps, then rest pauses where you lock out, take three deep breaths and bang out another forced rep, do that for four more reps, with every rep lowered in a slow, deliberate fashion so that it burns going down, then immediately grab a 45lb plate holding it between your legs for wide leg Sumo-type squats for another 15 reps, then do some bodyweight squats until your ready to drop to the floor --- for the first set. Then leg curls again with forced reps, rest pause, burns. Then a superset of extensions and leg press in the same fashion with the Sumo squats and bodyweight squats, followed by a set of stiff leg deads -- then it was probably more overexertion then a virus. I'm almost sixty goddamn years old now!
I feel much, much better now from just lying on the couch for a couple of hours to give my body a chance to normalize. I was thinking if maybe this was how Sergio Oliva felt after Arthur Jones' put him through his infamous quad routine which consisted of one set of leg press, followed immediately by one set of leg extension, then heading straight to the squat rack. Every set done to the death under Jones' watchful and demanding eye. Witnesses said that after finishing up with squats Sergio fell to the floor and didn't move for twenty minutes. Sergio claimed he was in his biggest and best shape training under Jones in Deland, Florida.
Anyway, I got my appetite back and had some chicken, rice, steamed vegetables (broccoli, cauliflower and carrots) and three oatmeal raisin cookies. I'm now in that pleasantly fatigued relaxed mode and already drifting off to sleep.
Two days of loafing and recovering and I'll be back Friday ready to go full on HIT Arthur Jones' style for chest, back, and shoulders.
This is insanity. I'm surprised you aren't injured and burnt out to oblivion training like this.
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Your body is in shock. At your age doing tons of beyond failure training in such volume is suicide. Go heavy on one exercise and moderate on the rest. You will look worse training like Tom Platz. I really hope you didn't have a minor heart attack. Get checked!
I'm still alive. I've been training HIT style for decades. Whether it's the optimal way for muscle hypertrophy is subject for debate but for conditioning and physical and mental toughness it can't be beat. Your body puts up enough barriers to prevent you from killing yourself. You'll drop from exhaustion before your heart shuts down (if you are in shape). And I don't know what you mean by looking worse training like Platz. Platz, though not genetically gifted, achieved a very high level and should have been either first or second in the 1981 Olympia. For my age, or any age, I am in pretty good condition and have blood work every 3-4 months and everything is on point. I've been training with weights non stop for 46 years and even before that I was doing pullups, pushups, bodyweight squats as a preteen.
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This is insanity. I'm surprised you aren't injured and burnt out to oblivion training like this.
I'm a lot tougher than I look. And you know how tough I look already. ;D
BTW, I only train twice a week so I get a lot of systemic recovery. Of the three factors in resistance training: frequency (how often you train), duration (how long you train), and intensity (how hard you train). By far, by faaaaaaar, the most neglected is intensity. People spend hours in the gym, day after day but when they terminate a set they haven't come even remotely close to approaching the limits of their ability. Most are there at the gym year after year like clockwork yet never look like they've ever picked up a weight in their life. One thing that Jones said that stuck with me was that as long as you are working WITHIN your functional ability. Doing things that are already easy. Exercise will do little or nothing by way of increasing muscle size, strength, and functional ability.
If you can do ten pull-ups and continue to just do ten, never attempting an 11th, there is nothing for your body to adapt to. Nothing to stimulate an adaptive response. But to make matters worse, most people, though capable, don't even do those ten reps. Watch people in the gym. Watch when they terminate a set. For 95% of them, they have at least another good 4 or 5 more reps. Forget about intensity variables like drop sets, forced reps, burns... Then of course after about 15-20 seconds of subpar exertion, they will sit on their ass watching the TV or tapping on their phones for 3-4 minutes before going through another half ass set of robotic motions again. Set after pointless set before I have to tell them if I can jump in for one set while they are sitting around. They may be in the gym for two hours but 90% of the time (if they resting 3 minutes) they are doing nothing. Nothing but being in my way.
Most conflate duration for intensity. Thinking that training long is training hard when in fact they are inversely proportional. The harder you train the shorter the duration has to be. The difference between sprinting and jogging. People can jog for miles and mile. How far and how long can you go in a full sprint. Compare the physique of a sprinter versus a marathoner.
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Your body is in shock. At your age doing tons of beyond failure training in such volume is suicide. Go heavy on one exercise and moderate on the rest. You will look worse training like Tom Platz. I really hope you didn't have a minor heart attack. Get checked!
BTW, I don't know what you mean by "such volume". Two sets of leg curls, one set of Hammer Squats with burn outs, one pre-exhaust super set and one set of stiff leg deads. Takes about twenty minutes (I rest between sets so I don't exactly do it A.J. style with no rest). I do arms first which consists of two curling movements and two tri extensions movements taking less than 15 minutes. Arms don't really tax my body systemically to compromise my leg routine but it does get the blood flowing so I'm warmed up and in the groove for the tough stuff.
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What‘s the point of going to the gym after u hit let‘s say 55, 60?
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What‘s the point of going to the gym after u hit let‘s say 55, 60?
For you? None. Just sit on the couch eating Cheetos and watching Seinfeld reruns.
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I'm still alive. I've been training HIT style for decades. Whether it's the optimal way for muscle hypertrophy is subject for debate but for conditioning and physical and mental toughness it can't be beat. Your body puts up enough barriers to prevent you from killing yourself. You'll drop from exhaustion before your heart shuts down (if you are in shape). And I don't know what you mean by looking worse training like Platz. Platz, though not genetically gifted, achieved a very high level and should have been either first or second in the 1981 Olympia. For my age, or any age, I am in pretty good condition and have blood work every 3-4 months and everything is on point. I've been training with weights non stop for 46 years and even before that I was doing pullups, pushups, bodyweight squats as a preteen.
Training to failure is a waste. You can make the same gains training much easier.
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For you? None. Just sit on the couch eating Cheetos and watching Seinfeld reruns.
Fuck, I’m 37 and that sounds good. Crunchy or puffed Cheetos though?
You probably should go to your doctor just to get checked out.
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Training to failure is a waste. You can make the same gains training much easier.
It's not a waste, but you can run yourself down very quickly doing every set to failure past age 45. I've done this many times. I still train hard and go to failure, but what really made me feel better was cutting the number of sets by 30-50%. I'm still able to maintain a decent physique doing this. Also, if you are training 4-5x per week you should be in the gym no more than 1 hour at a time.
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Sounds like you sent your central nervous system into shock
Maybe depleted carb stores also.
You’ve rested & your cns has recovered from that state allowing you to eat & you’re already feeling
Much improved from where you were.
Training in that manner is brutally hard on your cns let alone mentally & physically
I doubt there are very many who are capable of training / pushing themselves that hard.
I don’t see it as wrong - That’s how you train on a regular basis mentally you’re prepared
And able to push yourself physically that hard.
Taking someone who does multi sets / multi reps pumping style & even attempting to get
Them to do a similar workout would very likely put them off ever training again.
And there attempt would fall far short of your exertion level as they’d not be able to physically
Let alone mentally challeng themselves to the same degree.
It work for you & you enjoy it - that good.
Weather it’s necessary to go that limit for muscular growth is an entirely different subject.
If you are “Natural” & “Drug free” increasing rest days between workouts may be of benefit
Though reading you I’ve no doubt you’ve already considered/ tried this.
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It's not a waste, but you can run yourself down very quickly doing every set to failure past age 45. I've done this many times. I still train hard and go to failure, but what really made me feel better was cutting the number of sets by 30-50%. I'm still able to maintain a decent physique doing this. Also, if you are training 4-5x per week you should be in the gym no more than 1 hour at a time.
I did HIT training until about age 35 and then scaled back the intensity while still doing lower volume and it made no difference in muscle size plus I have more energy and enjoy training more. One reason people quit training when they get older is they don't enjoy it and if your workout are brutal all the time you probably won't enjoy it. Look at all the HIT guys who were injured or just quit early. I'm reading a book on Arthur Jones now and he would go years between workouts because if he couldn't go all out he couldn't train at all.
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I did HIT training until about age 35 and then scaled back the intensity while still doing lower volume and it made no difference in muscle size plus I have more energy and enjoy training more. One reason people quit training when they get older is they don't enjoy it and if your workout are brutal all the time you probably won't enjoy it. Look at all the HIT guys who were injured or just quit early. I'm reading a book on Arthur Jones now and he would go years between workouts because if he couldn't go all out he couldn't train at all.
Nail on the head - If You Enjoy It
Very Clearly He Does or he’d not be pushing himself that hard
The Enjoyment aspect of training is highly important to the continuation of going to the gym
As well as the wanting to look a certain way or achieve certain goals.
That extremely intense style of training isn’t for very many as they’d not be able to cope
Mentally or physically pushing themselves that hard, He does & it works for Him I don’t
Think he’s asking / telling everyone to do as he does.
He just suffered an adverse reaction to his workout on that occasion likely a few factors
Caused it - He’s not saying this is a regular occurrence after train if it is then that’s cause
For concern or should be for Him.
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Check for artery calcification
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I did HIT training until about age 35 and then scaled back the intensity while still doing lower volume and it made no difference in muscle size plus I have more energy and enjoy training more. One reason people quit training when they get older is they don't enjoy it and if your workout are brutal all the time you probably won't enjoy it. Look at all the HIT guys who were injured or just quit early. I'm reading a book on Arthur Jones now and he would go years between workouts because if he couldn't go all out he couldn't train at all.
I started training at 19. I was doing HIT the entire time until I was about 45. After that I started getting injured more frequently, and very tired. Now at 52, I simply cannot train all-out anymore. Even with a good diet and plenty of rest it takes days to recover. Getting old truly sucks. Still, it's better to be a 'has-been' than a 'wanna-be'. I'm going to hold off on TRT for as long as possible.
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All joking aside, that BP is low enough to warrant a trip to the ER. You should go to the hospital.
On a side note, I'm highly surprised Coach didn't advise you to eat some cereal. :D
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Pretty low blood pressure but I guess it doesn't always mean you are in imminent danger. This is from the Mayo Clinic:
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/low-blood-pressure/symptoms-causes/syc-20355465
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Hope you’re feeling better.
Some good advice in this thread.
The ball-out lifting we do when we’re young is usually counterproductive, in general.
Train intensely but with consideration for what you expend and what it’ll take to bring balance back to your body.
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You’re going to die. HTH. :)
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I started training at 19. I was doing HIT the entire time until I was about 45. After that I started getting injured more frequently, and very tired. Now at 52, I simply cannot train all-out anymore. Even with a good diet and plenty of rest it takes days to recover. Getting old truly sucks. Still, it's better to be a 'has-been' than a 'wanna-be'. I'm going to hold off on TRT for as long as possible.
This may sound weak but using Charles Atlas principles applied to weight training works well. Train don't strain and do something everyday. After workouts you should feel pumped and invigorated not run down and exhausted. Use these principles for weight training (not dynamic tension) and you will hang on for a lot longer and not need TRT. The problem with TRT is once you go on it's for life because if you are on for years and come off you will really feel fat, weak and low energy.
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No, no virsus. You don't get a virus training legs or training anything. And if I was coming down with anything I would feel it before I get to the gym. I know when I'm starting to get sick. I came into the gym eager and anxious to blast. When you take a set, especially for a large muscle group like legs, to positive failure. Meaning you can't eek out another rep to save your life, then you do a few forced reps, then rest pauses where you lock out, take three deep breaths and bang out another forced rep, do that for four more reps, with every rep lowered in a slow, deliberate fashion so that it burns going down, then immediately grab a 45lb plate holding it between your legs for wide leg Sumo-type squats for another 15 reps, then do some bodyweight squats until your ready to drop to the floor --- for the first set. Then leg curls again with forced reps, rest pause, burns. Then a superset of extensions and leg press in the same fashion with the Sumo squats and bodyweight squats, followed by a set of stiff leg deads -- then it was probably more overexertion then a virus. I'm almost sixty goddamn years old now!
move for twenty minutes. Sergio claimed he was in his biggest and best shape training under Jones in Deland, Florida.
Anyway, I got my appetite back and had some chicken, rice, steamed vegetables (broccoli, cauliflower and carrots) and three oatmeal raisin cookies. I'm now in that
I feel much, much better now from just lying on the couch for a couple of hours to give my body a chance to normalize. I was thinking if maybe this was how Sergio Oliva felt after Arthur Jones' put him through his infamous quad routine which consisted of one set of leg press, followed immediately by one set of leg extension, then heading straight to the squat rack. Every set done to the death under Jones' watchful and demanding eye. Witnesses said that after finishing up with squats Sergio fell to the floor and didn't pleasantly fatigued relaxed mode and already drifting off to sleep.
Two days of loafing and recovering and I'll be back Friday ready to go full on HIT Arthur Jones' style for chest, back, and shoulders.
Good to know you are feeling better.
It's not about when you catch a virus; it is about when symptoms start which can be anytime, even in the middle of a workout.
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It's probably just aids. Don't worry too much they have goods drugs for it now.
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Interesting how two of our knowledgeable trainees are experiencing problems as they age.
First the Coach and now Pellius.
Seems to me Pellius is too set in his ways re training and diet. A recipe for problems.
I agree that each workout should aim at getting a training effect and that requires a big effort.
With any moving system differences occur which means you cannot always repeat what you did before.
Knowing what to do and what not to do takes experience and we have to be ready to learn no matter how old we are.
Pellius could use some safety fat. He is paying now for all that combat training over the years.
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Gains never continue forever for anyone but especially for naturals. A person has to change their mindset from growth to maintenance once they reach their peak. This is very difficult for many and impossible for some. This is why HIT is a failure over the long run as a trainer thinks he has to beat the last workout continuously and this is simply not possible.
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Interesting how two of our knowledgeable trainees are experiencing problems as they age.
First the Coach and now Pellius.
Seems to me Pellius is too set in his ways re training and diet. A recipe for problems.
I agree that each workout should aim at getting a training effect and that requires a big effort.
With any moving system differences occur which means you cannot always repeat what you did before.
Knowing what to do and what not to do takes experience and we have to be ready to learn no matter how old we are.
Pellius could use some safety fat. He is paying now for all that combat training over the years.
They're old, let's list your health issues, tubby.
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Training to failure is a waste. You can make the same gains training much easier.
I'm not sure what you mean by "a waste". You don't think there is any benefit at all? At my age, I don't expect to make "gains". What kind of gains have you made in the last year? What I consider a waste is the countless hours people spend in the gym every day with very little to no results. I train just twice a week for barely an hour. I have a lot of time out of the gym to rest and do other things in life.
Sounds like you sent your central nervous system into shock
Maybe depleted carb stores also.
You’ve rested & your cns has recovered from that state allowing you to eat & you’re already feeling
Much improved from where you were.
Training in that manner is brutally hard on your cns let alone mentally & physically
I doubt there are very many who are capable of training / pushing themselves that hard.
I don’t see it as wrong - That’s how you train on a regular basis mentally you’re prepared
And able to push yourself physically that hard.
Taking someone who does multi sets / multi reps pumping style & even attempting to get
Them to do a similar workout would very likely put them off ever training again.
And there attempt would fall far short of your exertion level as they’d not be able to physically
Let alone mentally challeng themselves to the same degree.
It work for you & you enjoy it - that good.
Weather it’s necessary to go that limit for muscular growth is an entirely different subject.
If you are “Natural” & “Drug free” increasing rest days between workouts may be of benefit
Though reading you I’ve no doubt you’ve already considered/ tried this.
I still haven't recovered from Thanksgiving and have been eating cookies, ice-cream, doughnuts, brownies... That's why I have to avoid sugar. Once I start I'm like an addict. So I was -- am -- pretty carbed up.
I'm not sure if it is the optimal way to stimulate muscle hypertrophy. I mean, other than Dorian, all the top of the top bbers in history trained in the traditional multi-set volume type approach.
I prefer this type of approach because I also want to develop and maintain some mental and physical toughness. Being accustom to pushing myself and have my body conditioned for physical exertion.
And I don't consider myself natural as I've been on TRT for the last 15 years. But I have no reverence for the concept of natural. Very little of what we do and have is "natural."
I did HIT training until about age 35 and then scaled back the intensity while still doing lower volume and it made no difference in muscle size plus I have more energy and enjoy training more. One reason people quit training when they get older is they don't enjoy it and if your workout are brutal all the time you probably won't enjoy it. Look at all the HIT guys who were injured or just quit early. I'm reading a book on Arthur Jones now and he would go years between workouts because if he couldn't go all out he couldn't train at all.
It's true, intense training, or any kind of training for that matter, is something not many keep up with their entire lives. When I think of the original gang that I hung with back in the day there is only one other guy that still keeps it up. Because I don't train every day and do take a week break every three months or so I don't really get burnt out. As I mentioned before, I've been training consistently with weights for over 46 years so it's just part of my life and I would feel a big void if I just quit altogether.
I can relate to Jones. If I don't push myself I rather just stay home and take a break. Why waste my time just going through the motions. My mentality when doing a set is that once I reach positive failure, when I can't do another strict rep, I say to myself, "And now it begins." Meaning now we get serious this when it counts.
He just suffered an adverse reaction to his workout on that occasion likely a few factors
Caused it - He’s not saying this is a regular occurrence after train if it is then that’s cause
For concern or should be for Him.
Yes, this is not a common occurrence. The last time it happened when I got sick was maybe about 8 years ago after my first work set which again was legs. Back then I was more focused on progression and was stuck at a certain weight for a certain number of reps. This time I was determined to break that plateau. I was psyching myself up all week for that set. It was squats done on a Smith Machine for safety reasons so if I got stuck I could just rack it. But I approach that bar with a do or die attitude. I was going to get those reps no matter what.
I did barely get that extra damn rep but after I racked it I felt so light headed and dizzy and had to lay flat on the ground for about five minutes until someone asked me if I was all right. I said I was just being lazy and got up but could barely walk to the corner where I just sat there for about a half an hour before I felt I could drive back home safely.
Other than that and yesterday I never really got sick from training. I've gotten pretty exhausted where I had to sit down to get my breath but not sick.
All joking aside, that BP is low enough to warrant a trip to the ER. You should go to the hospital.
On a side note, I'm highly surprised Coach didn't advise you to eat some cereal. :D
I'm fine now. Everything is back to normal. BP at 115/80.
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You’re going to die. HTH. :)
I know. We're all going to die.
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Interesting how two of our knowledgeable trainees are experiencing problems as they age.
First the Coach and now Pellius.
Seems to me Pellius is too set in his ways re training and diet. A recipe for problems.
I agree that each workout should aim at getting a training effect and that requires a big effort.
With any moving system differences occur which means you cannot always repeat what you did before.
Knowing what to do and what not to do takes experience and we have to be ready to learn no matter how old we are.
Pellius could use some safety fat. He is paying now for all that combat training over the years.
Vince, Vince, Vince, Why do you keep saying things that you know are simply not true? I am too set in my ways with regard to training and diet. Have you forgotten that no small part due to you I've cut my protein intake from 350-400 grams a day to about 90? My training has varied from 4x/wk, once every 3 days, 3 times per week, once every two days, to my now present twice a week which I've been doing for about six months. My rep scheme and exercise choices changes constantly. My intensity variables also vary from workout to workout. I've made more changes to both diet and training in the last year than you have in your life. It is you who are stuck on your unproven training theories.
And yes, I am paying for the decades of getting beat up every day. There's more to life than just being safe and avoid getting hurt. Those years were the best years of my life and has given me memories and experiences that I will cherish forever.
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Vince, Vince, Vince, Why do you keep saying things that you know are simply not true? I am too set in my ways with regard to training and diet. Have you forgotten that no small part due to you I've cut my protein intake from 350-400 grams a day to about 90? My training has varied from 4x/wk, once every 3 days, 3 times per week, once every two days, to my now present twice a week which I've been doing for about six months. My rep scheme and exercise choices changes constantly. My intensity variables also vary from workout to workout. I've made more changes to both diet and training in the last year than you have in your life. It is you who are stuck on your unproven training theories.
And yes, I am paying for the decades of getting beat up every day. There's more to life than just being safe and avoid getting hurt. Those years were the best years of my life and has given me memories and experiences that I will cherish forever.
Pellius, you are are in wayyyy better shape than Vince so I wouldn't worry about it.
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Pellius have you tried cutting out most of your training? Like too much protein, I feel most trainees do too many body parts. Pointless and taxing.
Have you gained any muscle size in the last 20 or 30 years? That should always be a goal. Well, staying the same is an achievement as we get old.
Part of the fountain of youth is to consistently trigger growth without any drugs. Your body will provide what you need.
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(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=395976.0;attach=440887;image)
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Gains never continue forever for anyone but especially for naturals. A person has to change their mindset from growth to maintenance once they reach their peak. This is very difficult for many and impossible for some. This is why HIT is a failure over the long run as a trainer thinks he has to beat the last workout continuously and this is simply not possible.
Again, the purpose for me is not to get bigger muscles but to condition my body for intense physical exertion and to have a strong and determined mental attitude that I can use for other challenges in life. I want to develop and maintain an aggressive and resolute mentality for anything that I do in life. I look at all the people on their cell phones, watching TV, sitting on machines just sleepwalking through their workouts. Just like how they probably do in life. I was told once by a gym owner, Mr. Barlow, that he could tell what kind of people they were by watching them train. Most just sleepwalk through life always taking the easiest road to travel waiting to be told what to do.
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Pellius have you tried cutting out most of your training? Like too much protein, I feel most trainees do too many body parts. Pointless and taxing.
Have you gained any muscle size in the last 20 or 30 years? That should always be a goal. Well, staying the same is an achievement as we get old.
Part of the fountain of youth is to consistently trigger growth without any drugs. Your body will provide what you need.
Vincent, please pay attention. I train twice a week and my workouts are less than an hour. How much more can I cut from my training?
No, I have not gained much muscle size in the last 20-30 years. In fact, I have lost about twenty pounds since my pristine peak when I was in my mid-thirties. Your point?
You refuse to accept the indisputable fact that you will lose muscle, strength, height, cognitive function... EVERYTHING! as you get older until you finally waste away and die.
As you get older your body WILL NOT provide everything you need to trigger growth. Your HGH levels and Testosterone levels decline with age. You need these hormones for growth. And ever that is not enough! Even guys that are juiced to the gills lose muscle as they age. Look at Jay Cutler's or Branch Warren's last Olympia outing. I'm sure Jay was on more gear than he was when he first made a splash in 2001.
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What a bunch of non-training pussies in this thread!! :(
If I can`t train balls out,I don`t train at all.
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What a bunch of non-training pussies in this thread!! :(
If I can`t train balls out,I don`t train at all.
LOL! Remember the old days when guys use to puke in the rubbish can while doing squats. I remember Benny Podda eeking out one more rep with 495 when blood squirted out of his nose. No wonder why those guys in the 80s and 90s look like they had real muscle than the bloated mess today.
Just think, back in the early 80s, 35 years ago, these guys never got their pro card.
(https://www.greatestphysiques.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/Rory-2-619x1024.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/4ZGLBjl.jpg)
(https://external-preview.redd.it/CC3_Nd44FJfKVVwx1zKWFylRrSPleHZuR0IuaaDOF2A.jpg?auto=webp&s=4d10087fa8dc1746c8c6194302f31e24dc0d558f)
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Pellius whats your daily routine like outside of the gym?
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Vincent, please pay attention. I train twice a week and my workouts are less than an hour. How much more can I cut from my training?
No, I have not gained much muscle size in the last 20-30 years. In fact, I have lost about twenty pounds since my pristine peak when I was in my mid-thirties. Your point?
You refuse to accept the indisputable fact that you will lose muscle, strength, height, cognitive function... EVERYTHING! as you get older until you finally waste away and die.
As you get older your body WILL NOT provide everything you need to trigger growth. Your HGH levels and Testosterone levels decline with age. You need these hormones for growth. And ever that is not enough! Even guys that are juiced to the gills lose muscle as they age. Look at Jay Cutler's or Branch Warren's last Olympia outing. I'm sure Jay was on more gear than he was when he first made a splash in 2001.
Pellius I don't understand why you resist taking good advice from someone who thinks differently from you.
Since you are steadily declining over the years what does that tell you? You are doing something wrong.
You need a goal such as gaining one inch on your arms. Then set about to achieve that. Shouldn't be that difficult.
After you see that you can still grow it will change what you do. There is no point getting a consistency award
because of repeating the same old workouts. Try to gain some size. It is not a given that as we age we lose muscle
size. I have proven it to myself. So it could be possible for diehards like yourself. I don't take any drugs or supplements.
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What a bunch of non-training pussies in this thread!! :(
If I can`t train balls out,I don`t train at all.
Typical 70 year old in the gym. Always training with balls out. :-\
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Typical 70 year old in the gym. Always training with balls out. :-\
(http://funkyimg.com/i/2NUr8.jpg)
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No homo here!
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A lot of injured and out of shape guys telling the old ripped guy how to live in here.
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A lot of injured and out of shape guys telling the old ripped guy how to live in here.
There are two things daunting for most blokes. Getting up on stage competing, and posting a photo on Getbig. What you!
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"Sergio claimed he was in his biggest and best shape training under Jones in Deland, Florida."
He was only there for a couple of weeks. He then competed against Bill Pearl for the Mr. Universe in 71. Sergio wasn't at his best and Pearl was at his all time best. Later that year Sergio took his body to insane levels. Sergio competed for so many years in various states of size and condition. At his best he was untouchable. Anyone who has seen him train through the years will vouch that he trained with volume and a lot of it. Sergio always had a fondness for Arthur Jones. He was one of the few in bodybuilding that actually paid him a decent buck.
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Gains never continue forever for anyone but especially for naturals. A person has to change their mindset from growth to maintenance once they reach their peak. This is very difficult for many and impossible for some. This is why HIT is a failure over the long run as a trainer thinks he has to beat the last workout continuously and this is simply not possible.
Is Pellius actually still looking for gains? If he is, I understand because it is what motivated many of us from the beginning. At some point, which I thought Pellius had reached, weight training goals become more precise. By the time one gets to my age, the just want to maintain as much good health and fitness as possible. It is important, regardless of age, to be realistic. Not everyone will become the next Arnold or whomever they idolize.
After too long of a layoff, I went to the gym and worked arms; triceps, biceps and forearms by jumping right back into my old routine. The workout went fine. For the whole of the next week I was in pain. So much so that I failed because of lost ambition to continue going to the gym. Moral of this story is that sometimes, too much is really too much. This is when it becomes counterproductive.
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Again, the purpose for me is not to get bigger muscles but to condition my body for intense physical exertion and to have a strong and determined mental attitude that I can use for other challenges in life. I want to develop and maintain an aggressive and resolute mentality for anything that I do in life. I look at all the people on their cell phones, watching TV, sitting on machines just sleepwalking through their workouts. Just like how they probably do in life. I was told once by a gym owner, Mr. Barlow, that he could tell what kind of people they were by watching them train. Most just sleepwalk through life always taking the easiest road to travel waiting to be told what to do.
The people you speak of are not you and you will never be them. This doesn't mean you to have take an extreme opposite approach to be what you want to be. There's nothing wrong with focusing on the task at hand. If one is "sleep walking" though their workout, they'll end up disappointed with the results.
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What a bunch of non-training pussies in this thread!! :(
If I can`t train balls out,I don`t train at all.
Good. How often can you not train at all?
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Pellius I don't understand why you resist taking good advice from someone who thinks differently from you.
Since you are steadily declining over the years what does that tell you? You are doing something wrong.
You need a goal such as gaining one inch on your arms. Then set about to achieve that. Shouldn't be that difficult.
After you see that you can still grow it will change what you do. There is no point getting a consistency award
because of repeating the same old workouts. Try to gain some size. It is not a given that as we age we lose muscle
size. I have proven it to myself. So it could be possible for diehards like yourself. I don't take any drugs or supplements.
Stepping in here, sorry. Size may be what motivates you, but it isn't everyone's goal. Not to be rude, but you look like a fellow who'd have ended up with "safety fat" no matter what. It's your genetics. You definitely haven't maintained the physique you had in the past...none of us more mature dudes have.
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Pellius I don't understand why you resist taking good advice from someone who thinks differently from you.
Since you are steadily declining over the years what does that tell you? You are doing something wrong.
You need a goal such as gaining one inch on your arms. Then set about to achieve that. Shouldn't be that difficult.
After you see that you can still grow it will change what you do. There is no point getting a consistency award
because of repeating the same old workouts. Try to gain some size. It is not a given that as we age we lose muscle
size. I have proven it to myself. So it could be possible for diehards like yourself. I don't take any drugs or supplements.
What good advice? Please enlightening me.
And what do you mean I am doing something wrong because I've been declining? I'm getting old. We all decline with age. You must be doing something very, very wrong because I haven't changed that much in the last twenty years whereas you look like a completely different person. With me it's a 15-20 lb difference. With you it's more like thirty pounds with a complete rearrangement in body composition. I still look somewhat fit and lean just as I did in my thirties.
And there you go again saying that I kept doing the same thing. How many times do I have to tell you that I constantly switch up my training protocol and routine? I just recently joined another gym just so I could use the different types of equipment they have that I don't. And my diet has changed radically since five years ago.
If you say one more time that I don't think about what I do, I don't make constant adjustments in frequency, duration and intensity variables; I am going to personally fly out to your neck of the woods and kick you in the balls.
It is YOU! YOU! That keeps preaching the same old, tired, already refuted, training theories that you've never proven and every attempt you have made has failed. I have a track record of success by constantly figuring out different ways to cause an adaptive response in a muscle group that is notoriously noted for being unresponsive to training.
I believe this would also work for other muscle groups as well. Why wouldn't it when those other muscles are much more responsive. I just no longer have the drive and mentality to push myself with the obsessive and psychotic intensity and commitment that I did during my calf obsession.
I proved my "theory" of hypertrophy. You have not.
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A lot of injured and out of shape guys telling the old ripped guy how to live in here.
If you think something works, it is only human nature to want to share it. Pellius looks great, no doubt about it. So whatever his routine and diet are he's doing something right or he is just lucky. I thought the comment he offered was that after he worked legs, he felt like crap. Maybe some people think feeling like crap means you had a good workout, but I think there is a possibility they simply over did it. Read somewhere that you should end your workout wanting to do more because it will motivate you to come back time after time.
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The people you speak of are not you and you will never be them. This doesn't mean you to have take an extreme opposite approach to be what you want to be. There's nothing wrong with focusing on the task at hand. If one is "sleep walking" though their workout, they'll end up disappointed with the results.
They are not disappointed. They are unaware. They don't even think about what they are doing and how it affects or not affects them. They are like zombies just going through the motions of life.
One thing that really surprised me as I got older and started getting people's opinion on things like the afterlife, the meaning of life, is there a God, what happens when you die...
I was shocked at how many people don't even consider these issues. It's a non-issue for them. They just pretty much live their lives by how they were raised. Never questioning. Never a moment of self-awareness. That's how they are in the gym. Going through the motions, some not even knowing what muscles are being worked.
As Socrates once said, "The unexamined life is not worth living."
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"Sergio claimed he was in his biggest and best shape training under Jones in Deland, Florida."
He was only there for a couple of weeks. He then competed against Bill Pearl for the Mr. Universe in 71. Sergio wasn't at his best and Pearl was at his all time best. Later that year Sergio took his body to insane levels. Sergio competed for so many years in various states of size and condition. At his best he was untouchable. Anyone who has seen him train through the years will vouch that he trained with volume and a lot of it. Sergio always had a fondness for Arthur Jones. He was one of the few in bodybuilding that actually paid him a decent buck.
By all accounts, Jones was not an easy maqn to get along with. He appeared to be a very demanding, no-nonsense, bit of a tyrant who had very little patience for those who thought were fools. And it seems in his eyes most were fools. It seems most did not personally like him and I think that hurt him as far as not being as famous as he should be. I have never met anybody under 40 years old that have even heard of him. But Sergio liked him. He liked that he was an honest straight shooter and did what he said and said what he did. The following is a couple of excerpts of an interview done by Brian David Johnson.
BDJ: Judging from past photos, I believe you were your biggest while training with Jones.
Oliva: No question about it. And it’s too bad… I should have stayed with him. When I went to London in 1970 for the Mr. Universe, everyone knew I beat those guys, including Bill Pearl… I was given second place. From there I was to go to the 1971 Mr. Olympia, in Paris. I spoke to Serge Nubret who asked that I go to the Mr. Olympia since Joe Weider wouldn’t be there to fix the contest. I then flew to Paris, and while there Joe found out I was going to compete. And he refused… he would not let me compete. He said I was suspended for a year because I competed in the non-IFBB sanctioned Mr. Universe in London the year before. He used any kind of trick. He allowed me to do a posing exhibition, but not compete. In 1972, the Mr. Olympia promoter called everyone to go, and everyone did. But Joe didn’t want Arnold to go, but Arnold wanted to compete. (I have nothing against Arnold, he has done very well; many people used him in the beginning, then he used them.) Arnold competed in Essen. By that time, the training I had with Jones allowed me to win the contest by miles. People are still talking about Essen ’72. Even Arnold himself said that he didn’t win, that it was nothing but politics… it was nothing but politics, but they gave it to him. After that contest Weider put the promoter out of the promotion business. Serge Nubret used to be the big man when it came to running contests. Weider also put him out of the business because Serge did not want to run the contests the way Weider wanted to run them his way with the placings predetermined.
BDJ: What opinion do you have of Arthur Jones?
SO: Anything I have to say about Jones is good. He is the only honest man I met in bodybuilding. If he says “I’m going to pay you so much”, he does. If he says that he’s going to train you a particular way, and next year you’re going to look a certain way, then you will look that way. He’s the type of person you like to be around; the type of person you like to deal with since he won’t screw you or use you. Totally different from those other assholes. And everyone who went down to Florida knows that. And it’s too bad… if Jones was the one running all the competitions, there would have been a lot of changes. He should have been the one to run the Mr. Olympia and other contests.
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Pellius I don't understand why you resist taking good advice from someone who thinks differently from you.
Since you are steadily declining over the years what does that tell you? You are doing something wrong.
You need a goal such as gaining one inch on your arms. Then set about to achieve that. Shouldn't be that difficult.
After you see that you can still grow it will change what you do. There is no point getting a consistency award
because of repeating the same old workouts. Try to gain some size. It is not a given that as we age we lose muscle
size. I have proven it to myself. So it could be possible for diehards like yourself. I don't take any drugs or supplements.
Vince, you look like you have more muscle than most men in your age group but are not anywhere close to Pellius's shape. You have some good ideas on hypertrophy training that you've written about in the past. The problem with your idea is that no one can continue to work a muscle every other day to failure for that volume continuously without developing severe tendonitis in the joints. You've even mentioned it before how your elbows can't handle that workout for long. For a young person it may work fine.
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I know. We're all going to die.
You’ll go first old man.
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This is nothing a few Big Macs won't fix.
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It is great to see that pellius has survived this ordeal.
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They are not disappointed. They are unaware. They don't even think about what they are doing and how it affects or not affects them. They are like zombies just going through the motions of life.
One thing that really surprised me as I got older and started getting people's opinion on things like the afterlife, the meaning of life, is there a God, what happens when you die...
I was shocked at how many people don't even consider these issues. It's a non-issue for them. They just pretty much live their lives by how they were raised. Never questioning. Never a moment of self-awareness. That's how they are in the gym. Going through the motions, some not even knowing what muscles are being worked.
As Socrates once said, "The unexamined life is not worth living."
This begs the question, why go to the gym at all if they are that disinterested in working out or the results? Is just for the camaraderie?
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A lot of injured and out of shape guys telling the old ripped guy how to live in here.
End thread!! LOL :)
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Vince, you look like you have more muscle than most men in your age group but are not anywhere close to Pellius's shape. You have some good ideas on hypertrophy training that you've written about in the past. The problem with your idea is that no one can continue to work a muscle every other day to failure for that volume continuously without developing severe tendonitis in the joints. You've even mentioned it before how your elbows can't handle that workout for long. For a young person it may work fine.
Some say that Pellius looks "great". No, but he is lean. That isn't easy to maintain as most of us get older. If we diet the muscle disappears. Quite strange how the body clings to fat and sheds muscle.
What every trainee aims for is the most efficient and effective way to grow muscles. That is what bodybuilding is all about. Well, as we all know, gains can be made over several years just
going to a gym and training hard. However, the goal of maximum hypertrophy is something most never achieve. Why is that? Why do so many train so hard and so long but fail to get big arms for example? Most here have no clue. Pellius does all manner of different things but stays the same. Whatever is the purpose of doing that?
Here is a question that I doubt anyone here can answer. Why does DOMS occur? Why does DOMS occur in advanced trainees? If you think about that phenomenon you might grasp where
I am coming from. Understanding DOMS is the key to maximum hypertrophy. Sure, it is possible to get bigger without getting very sore. However, how then does one get even bigger than
before?
I don't advocate training a muscle every second day but every third day. This is important. Pellius insists on waiting for a muscle to adapt or recover before retraining it. I retrain the muscle even though sore. In this way I hope to keep the muscle in a state of steady growth. I know this works. Sore elbows were caused by keeping the elbows on a bench as Larry Scott recommended. Nope, never let the elbows touch pads because you will damage the delicate sheath that goes over the joint. Elbows and knees have the same concerns. Friction under loads causes damage. For calves avoid ballistic movements done in any volume.
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Some say that Pellius looks "great". No, but he is lean. That isn't easy to maintain as most of us get older. If we diet the muscle disappears. Quite strange how the body clings to fat and sheds muscle.
What every trainee aims for is the most efficient and effective way to grow muscles. That is what bodybuilding is all about. Well, as we all know, gains can be made over several years just
going to a gym and training hard. However, the goal of maximum hypertrophy is something most never achieve. Why is that? Why do so many train so hard and so long but fail to get big arms for example? Most here have no clue. Pellius does all manner of different things but stays the same. Whatever is the purpose of doing that?
Here is a question that I doubt anyone here can answer. Why does DOMS occur? Why does DOMS occur in advanced trainees? If you think about that phenomenon you might grasp where
I am coming from. Understanding DOMS is the key to maximum hypertrophy. Sure, it is possible to get bigger without getting very sore. However, how then does one get even bigger than
before?
I don't advocate training a muscle every second day but every third day. This is important. Pellius insists on waiting for a muscle to adapt or recover before retraining it. I retrain the muscle even though sore. In this way I hope to keep the muscle in a state of steady growth. I know this works. Sore elbows were caused by keeping the elbows on a bench as Larry Scott recommended. Nope, never let the elbows touch pads because you will damage the delicate sheath that goes over the joint. Elbows and knees have the same concerns. Friction under loads causes damage. For calves avoid ballistic movements done in any volume.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/10AXOi45HTCdQk/giphy.gif)
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LOL ;D
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Some reading for the broscience community....includes 99% of Getbiggers!
http://www.arthurjonesexercise.com/First_Half/1.PDF
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Some say that Pellius looks "great". No, but he is lean. That isn't easy to maintain as most of us get older. If we diet the muscle disappears. Quite strange how the body clings to fat and sheds muscle.
What every trainee aims for is the most efficient and effective way to grow muscles. That is what bodybuilding is all about. Well, as we all know, gains can be made over several years just
going to a gym and training hard. However, the goal of maximum hypertrophy is something most never achieve. Why is that? Why do so many train so hard and so long but fail to get big arms for example? Most here have no clue. Pellius does all manner of different things but stays the same. Whatever is the purpose of doing that?
Here is a question that I doubt anyone here can answer. Why does DOMS occur? Why does DOMS occur in advanced trainees? If you think about that phenomenon you might grasp where
I am coming from. Understanding DOMS is the key to maximum hypertrophy. Sure, it is possible to get bigger without getting very sore. However, how then does one get even bigger than
before?
I don't advocate training a muscle every second day but every third day. This is important. Pellius insists on waiting for a muscle to adapt or recover before retraining it. I retrain the muscle even though sore. In this way I hope to keep the muscle in a state of steady growth. I know this works. Sore elbows were caused by keeping the elbows on a bench as Larry Scott recommended. Nope, never let the elbows touch pads because you will damage the delicate sheath that goes over the joint. Elbows and knees have the same concerns. Friction under loads causes damage. For calves avoid ballistic movements done in any volume.
All that knowledge you have. All that first class equipment. All the free time in the world. Yet, you get worse. You do nothing, get softer and weaker, yet you preach and lecture to me, someone who is way above average for my age, as to what I should be doing and how I am wasting my time.
Tomorrow I will be at the gym doing a workout that I truly believe would kill you. You will continue to shake your head at how no one recognizes and appreciates your genius.
Who is the one wasting their time and their life?
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The people you speak of are not you and you will never be them. This doesn't mean you to have take an extreme opposite approach to be what you want to be. There's nothing wrong with focusing on the task at hand. If one is "sleep walking" though their workout, they'll end up disappointed with the results.
Phil Heath sleep walked through half of his work outs and won 7 titles
Chris Cormier was on the phone half of the time and looking at hoes and won 4 iron man titles and finished top 3 twice at the O
Flex Wheeler half assed his work outs and did exercises entirely on smith machines and ended up one of the best ever
Kevin Levrone took months off and showed up at the O placing top 5 many times
Jay cutler and dexter, training like they could put you to sleep their entire career, all about the pump sets won multiple sets
Many more come to mind
The whole training balls to the walls and about the “old days” is pure nonsense
However, if you enjoy training and just like lifting go right on ahead, just don’t follow Ronnie’s foot steps
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Some say that Pellius looks "great". No, but he is lean. That isn't easy to maintain as most of us get older. If we diet the muscle disappears. Quite strange how the body clings to fat and sheds muscle.
What every trainee aims for is the most efficient and effective way to grow muscles. That is what bodybuilding is all about. Well, as we all know, gains can be made over several years just
going to a gym and training hard. However, the goal of maximum hypertrophy is something most never achieve. Why is that? Why do so many train so hard and so long but fail to get big arms for example? Most here have no clue. Pellius does all manner of different things but stays the same. Whatever is the purpose of doing that?
Here is a question that I doubt anyone here can answer. Why does DOMS occur? Why does DOMS occur in advanced trainees? If you think about that phenomenon you might grasp where
I am coming from. Understanding DOMS is the key to maximum hypertrophy. Sure, it is possible to get bigger without getting very sore. However, how then does one get even bigger than
before?
I don't advocate training a muscle every second day but every third day. This is important. Pellius insists on waiting for a muscle to adapt or recover before retraining it. I retrain the muscle even though sore. In this way I hope to keep the muscle in a state of steady growth. I know this works. Sore elbows were caused by keeping the elbows on a bench as Larry Scott recommended. Nope, never let the elbows touch pads because you will damage the delicate sheath that goes over the joint. Elbows and knees have the same concerns. Friction under loads causes damage. For calves avoid ballistic movements done in any volume.
Here's the point I think you are missing, some of us old guys just want to be healthy and fit. You may still desire to increase muscle mass (against all odds) and are willing to pad them with a layer of necessary fat. That's fine...do your thing. What I suspect your are ignoring is that your goals are not everyone's nor are they the be all, end all.
I could be way off, but it seems like you are focused on recapturing the desires and accomplishments of your youth. Hate to disappoint you, but unless you have some magic pill (or machine), this is never going to happen. But hey, whatever floats your boat. It's all good.
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Pellius I don't understand why you resist taking good advice from someone who thinks differently from you.
Since you are steadily declining over the years what does that tell you? You are doing something wrong.
You need a goal such as gaining one inch on your arms. Then set about to achieve that. Shouldn't be that difficult.
After you see that you can still grow it will change what you do. There is no point getting a consistency award
because of repeating the same old workouts. Try to gain some size. It is not a given that as we age we lose muscle
size. I have proven it to myself. So it could be possible for diehards like yourself. I don't take any drugs or supplements.
You look like a normal, old, fat guy. Do you even lift?
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Here's the point I think you are missing, some of us old guys just want to be healthy and fit. You may still desire to increase muscle mass (against all odds) and are willing to pad them with a layer of necessary fat. That's fine...do your thing. What I suspect your are ignoring is that your goals are not everyone's nor are they the be all, end all.
I could be way off, but it seems like you are focused on recapturing the desires and accomplishments of your youth. Hate to disappoint you, but unless you have some magic pill (or machine), this is never going to happen. But hey, whatever floats your boat. It's all good.
I swear, Prime, you come across as a dense individual. The point of trying to trigger hypertrophy in muscles as we age is to get the hormones that are produced in muscular growth. A simple shortcut to the fountain of youth. I don't need any injections or pills or supplements or even a special diet. Compare what I do to what you do. Sure it requires knowledge and heaps of effort but the rewards are there for those who dare.
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All that knowledge you have. All that first class equipment. All the free time in the world. Yet, you get worse. You do nothing, get softer and weaker, yet you preach and lecture to me, someone who is way above average for my age, as to what I should be doing and how I am wasting my time.
Tomorrow I will be at the gym doing a workout that I truly believe would kill you. You will continue to shake your head at how no one recognizes and appreciates your genius.
Who is the one wasting their time and their life?
Pellius is demonstrating his foolish training methods. Why on earth put yourself through workouts that would kill me? What is the purpose of going to that extreme? Beats me. Years ago you insisted trainees needed heaps of protein. I pointed out that this was a waste of resources. You need more energy foods and what happens is the body will convert unneeded extra protein to energy. You altered your diet and haven't suffered. So you do have a limited capacity to actually learn new things.
So please explain why you need those brutal workouts? Seems to be ego driven to impress lower mortals at your gyms.
What I advocate is for Pellius to look in the mirror and flex his biggest arm. Impressive? Probably not. Well, try to make them grow an inch and see how long it takes you. Then come
back and post about your experience. You will have to change what you believe about hypertrophy and the ageing male. You will also not require any chemical assistance that you now depend on re your being influenced by gh15.
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Here's the point I think you are missing, some of us old guys just want to be healthy and fit. You may still desire to increase muscle mass (against all odds) and are willing to pad them with a layer of necessary fat. That's fine...do your thing. What I suspect your are ignoring is that your goals are not everyone's nor are they the be all, end all.
I could be way off, but it seems like you are focused on recapturing the desires and accomplishments of your youth. Hate to disappoint you, but unless you have some magic pill (or machine), this is never going to happen. But hey, whatever floats your boat. It's all good.
Oh brother. Its amazing how much I say goes over people's head when I try be as clear as possible. I have stated countless times that I am not a bber per se. I am not trying to get bigger muscles. I only eat two meals a day FFS! I've stressed many times that I am much more focused on health, fitness and functional ability.
I push myself because I have the will and desire. As I've stated here and elsewhere that I want to condition both my mind and body to endure physical exertion. To develop some physical and mental toughness in our cushy and pampered lives.
Basile only cares about appearance. Big muscles. Specifically, big arm muscles. Always talks about big arms. Only trains arms. There is way more to resistance training than big arms to show off. He completely neglects and has no concern to what I believe is the most important aspect to physical training. That being physical fitness, health, athletic and functional ability. Some of the greatest athletes don't have huge muscles but at least they can go up a flight of stairs without getting winded or pull their over developed hamstrings doing a sprint.
Yes, I have not gotten bigger muscles over the years. Vince thinks we can keep growing indefinitely and if you're not you're doing something wrong, i.e., not listening to him. But at least I can perform physically at a much higher level than most my age or any age.
Only in 2018 that people will cite how lazy some are, though still successful due to God given gifts, and think that is something to emulate, and in the same breath criticize and discourage someone who still believes in hard work and trying to push yourself. Not to relive any past perceived glory but simply to better one's self. To challenge one's self and experience the exhilaration of just being alive.
BTW Vince, when I was able to I trained 1:30 am so I could train by myself. I prefer to train alone in an empty gym so I can move faster and not wait on other people sleep walking, taking up space and getting in the way. I'm not trying to impress anyone. I'll leave that to you and your big arms.
Now this is a meltdown.
What you?
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Fear no man, Pellius! I merely give you a possible way to do something interesting and beneficial at the same time. The word 'fitness' is somewhat controversial because we can always ask fit for what? If you use physical culture to prepare you for any attack or calamity then good for you. I don't knock others who do extreme things. Gives those people a purpose and direction. All I am arguing is that hypertrophy is possible in old age. This isn't what we believed in the past and many today still don't believe it. Why not do an experiment with your own body to see what the reality is? Of course, no additional size will appear unless one eats enough to make that possible.
The awful truth about hypertrophy training for advanced trainees is it is brutal and taxing. Not at all something one looks forward to. Especially when you have to keep pushing the limits regarding reps and resistance. Always towards progression. Yes, a lot to go through for very little gain. However, it is nice to look at most males out there and know you have bigger arms than them and are vastly stronger as well. I have a friend who hasn't seen me in a couple of years. He was astonished at the size of my triceps. So there you are gains are still possible even when you are 76 years old.
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Fear no man, Pellius! I merely give you a possible way to do something interesting and beneficial at the same time. The word 'fitness' is somewhat controversial because we can always ask fit for what? If you use physical culture to prepare you for any attack or calamity then good for you. I don't knock others who do extreme things. Gives those people a purpose and direction. All I am arguing is that hypertrophy is possible in old age. This isn't what we believed in the past and many today still don't believe it. Why not do an experiment with your own body to see what the reality is? Of course, no additional size will appear unless one eats enough to make that possible.
The awful truth about hypertrophy training for advanced trainees is it is brutal and taxing. Not at all something one looks forward to. Especially when you have to keep pushing the limits regarding reps and resistance. Always towards progression. Yes, a lot to go through for very little gain. However, it is nice to look at most males out there and know you have bigger arms than them and are vastly stronger as well. I have a friend who hasn't seen me in a couple of years. He was astonished at the size of my triceps. So there you are gains are still possible even when you are 76 years old.
Do the experiment on yourself first. That's what I did on my calves and it worked. Something you have never seen anyone do on their calves in the the decades you've been involved in bbing.
And as far as your "astonishingly" large arms, you know Arthur Jones, the real genius in this game, "You can't flex fat."
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Sorry Prime, I just realized you were talking to Vince and not me.
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Do the experiment on yourself first. That's what I did on my calves and it worked. Something you have never seen anyone do on their calves in the the decades you've been involved in bbing.
And as far as your "astonishingly" large arms, you know Arthur Jones, the real genius in this game, "You can't flex fat."
When I last competed I enjoyed having reasonably big arms. That was 43 years ago. In 1999 I had another go at my arms and got them bigger than ever which was satisfying. Over the last 2 years I trained arms once a week. They are strong and solid. Triceps are stronger than ever which is an achievement at my age.
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Fear no man, Pellius! I merely give you a possible way to do something interesting and beneficial at the same time. The word 'fitness' is somewhat controversial because we can always ask fit for what? If you use physical culture to prepare you for any attack or calamity then good for you. I don't knock others who do extreme things. Gives those people a purpose and direction. All I am arguing is that hypertrophy is possible in old age. This isn't what we believed in the past and many today still don't believe it. Why not do an experiment with your own body to see what the reality is? Of course, no additional size will appear unless one eats enough to make that possible.
The awful truth about hypertrophy training for advanced trainees is it is brutal and taxing. Not at all something one looks forward to. Especially when you have to keep pushing the limits regarding reps and resistance. Always towards progression. Yes, a lot to go through for very little gain. However, it is nice to look at most males out there and know you have bigger arms than them and are vastly stronger as well. I have a friend who hasn't seen me in a couple of years. He was astonished at the size of my triceps. So there you are gains are still possible even when you are 76 years old.
Do you ever listen to yourself? Do you step outside of yourself for some self-reflection and ponder what you say? How many times you contradict yourself or say something that is just patently wrong and has been proven wrong by real scientific result and real-world observable results.
"Pellius does all manner of different things but stays the same. Whatever is the purpose of doing that?"
Then you say even after I gave you credit for cutting back my protein intake by over 50%.
"Seems to me Pellius is too set in his ways re training and diet.
"because of repeating the same old workouts.
"With any moving system differences occur which means you cannot always repeat what you did before."
"Pellius have you tried cutting out most of your training? "
Even after I said that I train twice a week and hour per session. You're sound like Mentzer later in life when he took Jones' concept of infrequent training to an extreme.
"I retrain the muscle even though sore. In this way, I hope to keep the muscle in a state of steady growth. I know this works."
No you don't. It never works. When your muscle is sore it's still in a catabolic state not in a state of growth. It's still broken down. You have to heal it first before you can build upon that. You watched the vid where John Meadows explains this. It has been proven scientifically, and it comports with common sense. "You have to fill the hole first before you can make it into a hill. You relate some unproven experiment where you say your arms have gotten larger. If this was such a breakthrough where are the pics? Anybody can get larger arms by just gaining weight. My neighbor, a woman, has arms that easily exceed 20 inches. In contrast, I have proven my "hypertrophy theory" and put on real lean substantial muscle with no change in body weight by constantly finding new ways to increase intensity and stimulate the muscle and always -- ALWAYS -- being sure I was fully recovered and any latent soreness was completely gone.
"Try to gain some size. It is not a given that as we age we lose muscle"
It's really puzzling that someone I consider a thinker and intelligent could make such a colossally ignorant statement. One that is proven wrong by real scientific evidence with billions of real-world examples of how, no matter what you do, you will grow old weak, lose bodily and cognitive function, and yes, lose muscle, and then you die. You lose so much credibility when you make a claim that everybody knows, observes, and will experience, is wrong. It just goes to show that when someone has an agenda they will even lie to themselves than seek the, in this case, obvious truth.
"So please explain why you need those brutal workouts?"
I'll let you explain it.
"The awful truth about hypertrophy training for advanced trainees is it is brutal and taxing. Not at all something one looks forward to. Especially when you have to keep pushing the limits regarding reps and resistance. Always towards progression."
Everybody clearly sees and understands the point I am making here. Your inconsistencies and torrential flow of illogic. But you don't. The sad part is that you will go to your grave believing you were right and the rest of the world was wrong.
You may get away with lying to yourself but nobody here -- absolutely nobody -- buys into your nonsense.
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When I last competed I enjoyed having reasonably big arms. That was 43 years ago. In 1999 I had another go at my arms and got them bigger than ever which was satisfying. Over the last 2 years I trained arms once a week. They are strong and solid. Triceps are stronger than ever which is an achievement at my age.
Nobody notices any difference in your arm development over the last ten years. You can say anything you want. How strong they are, how solid, how your triceps are stronger but none of this can be proven by pics nor by function. And nobody here takes you seriously. You are becoming an ongoing joke on this board and being dismissed as a senile old man living in a fantasy wolrd. This bothers me because I would think a man with your past and history would have more dignity.
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Nobody notices any difference in your arm development over the last ten years. You can say anything you want. How strong they are, how solid, how your triceps are stronger but none of this can be proven by pics nor by function. And nobody here takes you seriously. You are becoming an ongoing joke on this board and being dismissed as a senile old man living in a fantasy wolrd. This bothers me because I would think a man with your past and history would have more dignity.
Pellius, stick to things that can be demonstrated by practice and or experiment. When considering a new idea we have to set what we believe aside. We mainly differ about so called recovery. If the body stops synthesising protein after 36 to 48 hours post training why wait longer to train that muscle again? Yes, on the third day. I know this schedule works. I believe Mike Mentzer and Arthur Jones were mistaken about hypertrophy. Intensity is an essential but not sufficient factor. You also need plenty of volume.
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Some say that Pellius looks "great". No, but he is lean. That isn't easy to maintain as most of us get older. If we diet the muscle disappears. Quite strange how the body clings to fat and sheds muscle.
What every trainee aims for is the most efficient and effective way to grow muscles. That is what bodybuilding is all about. Well, as we all know, gains can be made over several years just
going to a gym and training hard. However, the goal of maximum hypertrophy is something most never achieve. Why is that? Why do so many train so hard and so long but fail to get big arms for example? Most here have no clue. Pellius does all manner of different things but stays the same. Whatever is the purpose of doing that?
Here is a question that I doubt anyone here can answer. Why does DOMS occur? Why does DOMS occur in advanced trainees? If you think about that phenomenon you might grasp where
I am coming from. Understanding DOMS is the key to maximum hypertrophy. Sure, it is possible to get bigger without getting very sore. However, how then does one get even bigger than
before?
I don't advocate training a muscle every second day but every third day. This is important. Pellius insists on waiting for a muscle to adapt or recover before retraining it. I retrain the muscle even though sore. In this way I hope to keep the muscle in a state of steady growth. I know this works. Sore elsheath that goes over the joint. Elbows and knees have the same concerns. Friction under loads causes damage. For calves avoid ballistic movements done in any volume.
Vince, I kind of agree with your training theory on hypertrophy except for the fact that it assumes you can continue growth throughout life and this is just not possible.Most people start training at a young age and errantly believe it was the training for all their growth when the reality is they probably would weigh the same amount as an adult anyway just with a higher % of body fat and lower % of muscle. Any adult who has trained 2 years or more is probably maxed out in muscle gains.
Professional bodybuilders might gain a couple pounds of muscle each year from contest to contest and they are juiced to the gills and do bodybuilding full time. If they are gaining that small amount how could a natural who doesn't lift, eat and juice full time expect to gain anything?
Nick's strength and health youtube channel chronicles his journey to win a natty bodybuilding contest and he went from like 220 lbs all the way down to like 140 lbs. He looked like a concentration camp prisoner. This is what really happens when a natty gets in contest shape.
It is great that you are still training and keeping your muscle mass but if you got in "contest" shape you would see that you are much smaller than your Mr. Canada contest shape four decades ago. I can guarantee your arms would be at least an inch smaller now (real muscle) than they measured in the 70's. There is simply no way you have gained muscle over the years but just body weight.
After age 35 or 40 most guys are just trying to hang on to past gains. People let themselves get out of shape and then when they get back in shape they think they are making gains when the reality is they are just going back to where they were before. I used to think that natty website guy was a pussy but the more articles I read on there the more I realize how right he actually is.
http://nattyornot.com/
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HN, bodybuilding and age are not the subject of much research. I look at the past champions and most are way down on what they used to be. Well, most stop training like they did when they competed. Muscles atrophy if not stimulated by resistance training. I know protocols that are effective. When applied they enable old men to build larger, stronger muscles. It comes as a surprise to me to find myself getting much stronger in some exercises than when I competed. The hypertrophy training causes real growth without needing any chemical assistance. So many older men resort to HRT and what a pity that is. People prefer the easy way instead of earning muscle growth. As we have seen in this thread most people are unwilling to change what they believe. I am talking to a deaf audience.
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HN, bodybuilding and age are not the subject of much research. I look at the past champions and most are way down on what they used to be. Well, most stop training like they did when they competed. Muscles atrophy if not stimulated by resistance training. I know protocols that are effective. When applied they enable old men to build larger, stronger muscles. It comes as a surprise to me to find myself getting much stronger in some exercises that when I competed. The hypertrophy training causes real growth without needing any chemical assistance. So many older men resort to HRT and what a pity that is. People prefer the easy way instead of earning muscle growth. As we have seen in this thread most people are unwilling to change what they believe. I am talking to a deaf audience.
Some are listening and testing your training theory. A few years ago when you first posted that info I was a lurker and actually started training the arms program you put out. I think the DOMS theory may be right especially for someone new to training but after a few years we reach our peak.
Do you think there is a genetic limit or do you think humans can continue growth until death? I have already stated that I think natties are maxed after only a few years of training.
Do you believe you have actually increased muscle mass in the last 10 years or just strength? Again, I do not think this is possible. Strength can be increased without muscle gain even though Jones and Mentzer believed otherwise.
If you got down to the body fat % of your Mr. Canada competition do you think you would have larger muscles than you had then? I would think your arms and legs would be considerably smaller.
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Some are listening and testing your training theory. A few years ago when you first posted that info I was a lurker and actually started training the arms program you put out. I think the DOMS theory may be right especially for someone new to training but after a few years we reach our peak.
Do you think there is a genetic limit or do you think humans can continue growth until death? I have already stated that I think natties are maxed after only a few years of training.
Do you believe you have actually increased muscle mass in the last 10 years or just strength? Again, I do not think this is possible. Strength can be increased without muscle gain even though Jones and Mentzer believed otherwise.
If you got down to the body fat % of your Mr. Canada competition do you think you would have larger muscles than you had then? I would think your arms and legs would be considerably smaller.
My crucial point re hypertrophy is that growth can occur if DOMS is present the following 2 or three days after a workout. This applies to advanced trainees as well. Sure, it isn’t easy to get a muscle like biceps sore, but if you can then growth will follow.
My triceps are far bigger now than when I competed. I conclude that my ideas are correct. Others might dismiss my methods but there you are, everyone is an expert!
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All that knowledge you have. All that first class equipment. All the free time in the world. Yet, you get worse. You do nothing, get softer and weaker, yet you preach and lecture to me, someone who is way above average for my age, as to what I should be doing and how I am wasting my time.
Tomorrow I will be at the gym doing a workout that I truly believe would kill you. You will continue to shake your head at how no one recognizes and appreciates your genius.
Who is the one wasting their time and their life?
:D
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Vince instead of having a go at everyone
Why don’t you do an experiment A before & after training your whole body
Not just Arms.
Take full body pics now + weight + body-fat % + body-part measurements
Embark on Your training & diet theories
And say in 16 wks Let’s See the transformation along with weight / bodyfat & bodypart measurements
That would be a good way to silence a few & add credibility to what you are saying
In your current state of bodyfat percentage it’s meaningless to say you’ve gained this or that.
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The old volume vs intensity argument. If intensity was the magic bullet and the most effective way to train the majority of bodybuilders would be training that way. The majority train with volume. Arthur Jones would find a volume trainer and invite them down to Florida then take credit for their success. When Viator was no long on Jones's pay roll he trained with volume. His third place in the Olympia was by far his best ever physique. He was doing volume and a lot of it. Joe Means is featured throughout the Nautilus book and was another bodybuilder invited down to Florida. For his contests he did use Nautilus along with conventional weights but he used volume. Sergio is not a product of Nautilus. He spent a couple of weeks down in Florida and was highly paid for that. He trained with a ton of volume prior to Arthur Jones and after Arthur Jones. Even Mentzer in his best condition trained 4 to 6 work sets a body part. The only ones I can see that truly embraced the Jones intensity were guys like Yates, Cardillo (Mr. Canada) and Dave Mastorakis. Here's where someone says they saw the Yates tape and he did plenty of sets. Nope, one set to failure. Those are warm up. You don't take 410lbs for inclines with no warm up sets.
There is no true definition of high intensity. For some it's one set to failure. For someone like Lee Labrada it's three sets to failure per exercise. Some say train a body part once every 7 to 10 days and others say 2 to 3 times a week. 3 times a week is going back to Darden's many early books. No, we don't have training facts in bodybuilding. We have training theories. If we had training facts we would all doing the same training routine using the same exercises barring injuries and sets. If intensity was the magic bullet then we would do the most intense training we could do. It would be something like 4 sets of one rep per exercise. Highest intensity achieved. Olympic and Power lifters do not train to failure every training session. They cycle their training.
Let me preface what I wrote is that I have been heavily influenced by Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer. When Jones burst onto the scene I read everything he wrote. Ironman Magazine was his platform. I still have his original book that was put together with staples to hold the papers. I still train with low sets. I remember back in the day being selected from my job to go through a high intensity workout by a guy who owned a pure Nautilus and MedX gym. I still think he was trying to kill me. It was a whole body routine. One set to failure and beyond. No warm up. No rest between exercises. I nearly threw up and down on the floor at the end knowing I couldn't stand. There was no way anyone could train like that on a regular basis hence his suggested once every 5 day training session.
My empirical conclusions based on over 40 years of training. Volume has merit. A lot of merit. It's not easy as HIT followers claim. It's like a 400 meter runner saying to a marathoner your training is easy. The 400 meter runner knows he trains more intensely but he would be in world of hurt trying to train like a good marathoner.
My conclusions it that a bodybuider's muscle is a result of muscular endurance training. This is not to be confused with aerobic cardio training. Yes, two sets is better than one set. Three sets is also better than two but it's better fractionally. You reach a point of diminishing returns. I think all bodybuilders would be better off cycling their their training between volume and intensity. Many volume trainers use heavy days as their concession to intensity. Arnold wrote many times he would take an exercise like a bench or deadlift to it's one rep max on a heavy day.
In the end this is nothing but a hobby for the majority of us. Train the way you feel is most effective and gives you the most satisfaction. To say you found the most effective way to train and all should follow your lead is foolish. Like I said before. We have training theories and not training facts. A hard core work ethic will take you far with the only limitations is of course genetic predisposition. On a side note be wary of training advice from steroid users. Consider what they look like if they are clean for 6 months then reevaluate their advice.
On a side note Arthur Jones did not invent the cam he used on his machine. He did not invent pre exhaust. He did not invent selectorized plates on his machine. Not saying this as a dig. His achievements stand on their own.
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Sorry Prime, I just realized you were talking to Vince and not me.
Happens with old age...
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The old volume vs intensity argument. If intensity was the magic bullet and the most effective way to train the majority of bodybuilders would be training that way. The majority train with volume. Arthur Jones would find a volume trainer and invite them down to Florida then take credit for their success. When Viator was no long on Jones's pay roll he trained with volume. His third place in the Olympia was by far his best ever physique. He was doing volume and a lot of it. Joe Means is featured throughout the Nautilus book and was another bodybuilder invited down to Florida. For his contests he did use Nautilus along with conventional weights but he used volume. Sergio is not a product of Nautilus. He spent a couple of weeks down in Florida and was highly paid for that. He trained with a ton of volume prior to Arthur Jones and after Arthur Jones. Even Mentzer in his best condition trained 4 to 6 work sets a body part. The only ones I can see that truly embraced the Jones intensity were guys like Yates, Cardillo (Mr. Canada) and Dave Mastorakis. Here's where someone says they saw the Yates tape and he did plenty of sets. Nope, one set to failure. Those are warm up. You don't take 410lbs for inclines with no warm up sets.
There is no true definition of high intensity. For some it's one set to failure. For someone like Lee Labrada it's three sets to failure per exercise. Some say train a body part once every 7 to 10 days and others say 2 to 3 times a week. 3 times a week is going back to Darden's many early books. No, we don't have training facts in bodybuilding. We have training theories. If we had training facts we would all doing the same training routine using the same exercises barring injuries and sets. If intensity was the magic bullet then we would do the most intense training we could do. It would be something like 4 sets of one rep per exercise. Highest intensity achieved. Olympic and Power lifters do not train to failure every training session. They cycle their training.
Let me preface what I wrote is that I have been heavily influenced by Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer. When Jones burst onto the scene I read everything he wrote. Ironman Magazine was his platform. I still have his original book that was put together with staples to hold the papers. I still train with low sets. I remember back in the day being selected from my job to go through a high intensity workout by a guy who owned a pure Nautilus and MedX gym. I still think he was trying to kill me. It was a whole body routine. One set to failure and beyond. No warm up. No rest between exercises. I nearly threw up and down on the floor at the end knowing I couldn't stand. There was no way anyone could train like that on a regular basis hence his suggested once every 5 day training session.
My empirical conclusions based on over 40 years of training. Volume has merit. A lot of merit. It's not easy as HIT followers claim. It's like a 400 meter runner saying to a marathoner your training is easy. The 400 meter runner knows he trains more intensely but he would be in world of hurt trying to train like a good marathoner.
My conclusions it that a bodybuider's muscle is a result of muscular endurance training. This is not to be confused with aerobic cardio training. Yes, two sets is better than one set. Three sets is also better than two but it's better fractionally. You reach a point of diminishing returns. I think all bodybuilders would be better off cycling their their training between volume and intensity. Many volume trainers use heavy days as their concession to intensity. Arnold wrote many times he would take an exercise like a bench or deadlift to it's one rep max on a heavy day.
In the end this is nothing but a hobby for the majority of us. Train the way you feel is most effective and gives you the most satisfaction. To say you found the most effective way to train and all should follow your lead is foolish. Like I said before. We have training theories and not training facts. A hard core work ethic will take you far with the only limitations is of course genetic predisposition. On a side note be wary of training advice from steroid users. Consider what they look like if they are clean for 6 months then reevaluate their advice.
On a side note Arthur Jones did not invent the cam he used on his machine. He did not invent pre exhaust. He did not invent selectorized plates on his machine. Not saying this as a dig. His achievements stand on their own.
Agreed. I think Jones was a marketing genius not a scientific genius. He convinced millions of trainers that working on a Nautilus machine was superior to barbells and dumbbells. As you said Viator and Olivia both went back to training volume training for their best placings. Even Mentzer and Yates did split routines which Jones said was unnecessary. This worked for gym owners as well because the common populace thought they were doing some magical training with the big blue machines.
Almost 50 years after Nautilus was created along with Jones's training theory not a single NFL, NHL, NBA, college football program, olympic weightlifting team, any world class powerlifter, any sprinter or speed athlete on summer or winter olympic teams and any world strongest man contestant trains exclusively like this or with machines. If Jones were alive today he probably would just say were all idiots and if they trained his way they would be better.
Working 2-3 weeks with volume and then having 1 week of HIT for me seems to work as it shocks the body and also is a nice mental change of pace.
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I swear, Prime, you come across as a dense individual. The point of trying to trigger hypertrophy in muscles as we age is to get the hormones that are produced in muscular growth. A simple shortcut to the fountain of youth. I don't need any injections or pills or supplements or even a special diet. Compare what I do to what you do. Sure it requires knowledge and heaps of effort but the rewards are there for those who dare.
Tell you what. You do your thing and I'll stick with mine.
Resistance training has been shown to induce significant endogenous hormonal (testosterone (T), GH, IGF-1) elevations. Which is one of the reasons I work out. The reason I'm on TRT is because I have hypogonadism as the result of having had the mumps during puberty which killed my right testicle. Unfortunately, resistance training can't fix that. I've had low test levels my entire adult life.
I tease you about your "safety fat" remark because I think it is funny. A little fat has some benefits. Eons ago when humans had to hunt for food, that fat storage helped us survive through the winters. Fat-soluble vitamins — A, E, D and K are absorbed in our fat tissue. However, it's less about having the fat, and more about consuming foods that have fat. Fat produces energy. How much fat is stored depends on how much you burn. People have different metabolisms.
Here's the thing, how do you know how much safety fat is actually safe, in terms of good health. Another thing, our natural body types aren't all alike. Some people, like you, tend to be fatter than other people who tend to be slim, like me.
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Vince has got to be taking the piss, unless he is mentally ill it is impossible for him to look in the mirror and see anything other than a fat sack of shit.
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I started training at 19. I was doing HIT the entire time until I was about 45. After that I started getting injured more frequently, and very tired. Now at 52, I simply cannot train all-out anymore. Even with a good diet and plenty of rest it takes days to recover. Getting old truly sucks. Still, it's better to be a 'has-been' than a 'wanna-be'. I'm going to hold off on TRT for as long as possible.
Lol...at 52 Groink was training balls to the wall and was the best built man on Getbig.
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Vince has got to be taking the piss, unless he is mentally ill it is impossible for him to look in the mirror and see anything other than a fat sack of shit.
I would love to hit him in the face with an axe.
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I would love to hit him in the face with an axe.
Haha and he would thoroughly deserve it, I’d gladly settle for landing a swift well placed uppercut to the underside of his fat saggy 110 year old jaw
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Fuck Groink......... 57 years old best shape of my life.
2011,two weeks after my last contests.
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Fuck Groink......... 57 years old best shape of my life.
2011,two weeks after my last contests.
Yeah but Groink was natural and you're a walking pharmacy in that picture.
Bicep looks spongy and squishy
"Elf"....LMFAO....get a fucking life.
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Yeah but Groink was natural and you're a walking pharmacy in that picture.
Bicep looks spongy and squishy
"Elf"....LMFAO....get a fucking life.
Do you have a comparison photo sir?
I thought so.
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Yeah but Groink was natural and you're a walking pharmacy in that picture.
Bicep looks spongy and squishy
"Elf"....LMFAO....get a fucking life.
What’s Grionk been up to these days?
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Do you have a comparison photo sir?
I thought so.
Comparing you to Groink? You look like shit. HTH
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HN, bodybuilding and age are not the subject of much research. I look at the past champions and most are way down on what they used to be. Well, most stop training like they did when they competed. Muscles atrophy if not stimulated by resistance training. I know protocols that are effective. When applied they enable old men to build larger, stronger muscles. It comes as a surprise to me to find myself getting much stronger in some exercises than when I competed. The hypertrophy training causes real growth without needing any chemical assistance. So many older men resort to HRT and what a pity that is. People prefer the easy way instead of earning muscle growth. As we have seen in this thread most people are unwilling to change what they believe. I am talking to a deaf audience.
The exact same thing can be said about you. Nobody is more unwilling, more dogmatic, and more closed minded than you are. You think you have all the answers, none of which have been proven. And you are so behind in scientific research because you simply have interest in learning. And why should you when you think you know everything already.
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Pellius do you do any cardio? If not, how active are you during the day?
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My crucial point re hypertrophy is that growth can occur if DOMS is present the following 2 or three days after a workout. This applies to advanced trainees as well. Sure, it isn’t easy to get a muscle like biceps sore, but if you can then growth will follow.
My triceps are far bigger now than when I competed. I conclude that my ideas are correct. Others might dismiss my methods but there you are, everyone is an expert!
And there you are. Only you are an expert.
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The exact same thing can be said about you. Nobody is more unwilling, more dogmatic, and more closed minded than you are. You think you have all the answers, none of which have been proven. And you are so behind in scientific research because you simply have interest in learning. And why should you when you think you know everything already.
Why the personal attack? You have to kill my theory not me as a person. If you refute what I claim I will definitely change what I believe. Not many here will even try my method. Being able to grow muscle in old age is important. I am talking about bodybuilding gains over many years which is an area seldom covered in scientific experiments.
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Yeah but Groink was natural and you're a walking pharmacy in that picture.
Bicep looks spongy and squishy
"Elf"....LMFAO....get a fucking life.
You're an idiot. Groink was never natural. He use to hit me up for gh and gear sources when I was a mod on the gh15 board. I still have the PMs where I had to walk him through the ordering process for Nordic because he was too much of a moron to follow simple directions.
Tren and gh were heavy on the menu.
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Why the personal attack? You have to kill my theory not me as a person. If you refute what I claim I will definitely change what I believe. Not many here will even try my method. Being able to grow muscle in old age is important. I am talking about bodybuilding gains over many years which is an area seldom covered in scientific experiments.
I am calling you what you always call the rest of us. I've already tried your theory. I've tried every theory in my my over 46 years of continuous training. I am far more experienced and educated than you are regarding resistance training and keep up with journals and website which analyze and discuss their findings. When you say nonsense like few studies have been done on topics like age, muscle atrophy/hypertrophy, protein intake, how certain exercises stimulate specific muscle groups.... None of this you are aware of because you think you know everything.
And, lastly, I am there in the gym actually working out. You haven't trained serious for decades.
You should be coming to me for advice.
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I am calling you what you always call the rest of us. I've already tried your theory. I've tried every theory in my my over 46 years of continuous training. I am far more experienced and educated than you are regarding resistance training and keep up with journals and website which analyze and discuss their findings. When you say nonsense like few studies have been done on topics like age, muscle atrophy/hypertrophy, protein intake, how certain exercises stimulate specific muscle groups.... None of this you are aware of because you think you know everything.
And, lastly, I am there in the gym actually working out. You haven't trained serious for decades.
You should be coming to me for advice.
That was a great freaking answer Pellius, lol.
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I am calling you what you always call the rest of us. I've already tried your theory. I've tried every theory in my my over 46 years of continuous training. I am far more experienced and educated than you are regarding resistance training and keep up with journals and website which analyze and discuss their findings. When you say nonsense like few studies have been done on topics like age, muscle atrophy/hypertrophy, protein intake, how certain exercises stimulate specific muscle groups.... None of this you are aware of because you think you know everything.
And, lastly, I am there in the gym actually working out. You haven't trained serious for decades.
You should be coming to me for advice.
Lol! Pellius I am the master here. You are a reluctant deciple. Your recalcitrance is quite annoying. Please show me the respect I deserve.
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Comparing you to Groink? You look like shit. HTH
No,comparing me to you !
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I am calling you what you always call the rest of us. I've already tried your theory. I've tried every theory in my my over 46 years of continuous training. I am far more experienced and educated than you are regarding resistance training and keep up with journals and website which analyze and discuss their findings. When you say nonsense like few studies have been done on topics like age, muscle atrophy/hypertrophy, protein intake, how certain exercises stimulate specific muscle groups.... None of this you are aware of because you think you know everything.
And, lastly, I am there in the gym actually working out. You haven't trained serious for decades.
You should be coming to me for advice.
Lol! Pellius I am the master here. You are a reluctant deciple. Your recalcitrance is quite annoying. Please show me the respect I deserve.
(https://i.chzbgr.com/full/5307217920/hDCCA1453/)
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No,comparing me to you !
You're about 4 decades over the hill old man. Give it up.
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You're an idiot. Groink was never natural. He use to hit me up for gh and gear sources when I was a mod on the gh15 board. I still have the PMs where I had to walk him through the ordering process for Nordic because he was too much of a moron to follow simple directions.
Tren and gh were heavy on the menu.
Another "elf". What an embarrassment.
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Lol! Pellius I am the master here. You are a reluctant deciple. Your recalcitrance is quite annoying. Please show me the respect I deserve.
I'm convinced the entire post history of the Vince B account is one giant troll effort.
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I'm convinced the entire post history of the Vince B account is one giant troll effort.
You really are one dense entity. I NEVER joke about hypertrophy, training, gyms or gym equipment.
What you!
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5 pages about arguing whose dick is bigger is getting old. Bodybuilding is a strange community. Yes, I type here too so I must be just as fucked up.
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Free Ebook that might help Pellius and other who have very set ideas about hypertrophy. Read the principle about frequency. It is supported by scientific research.
http://www.mediafire.com/download/nz28u6ifk7h36he/HST_Ebook.pdf
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Arnold, Sergio, Padilla, Dickerson, and many others trained a body part three times a week.
Larry Scott, Robby,Coleman and others trained body parts twice a week.
Yates and a bunch of others once a week.
Which one was limiting their muscle growth?
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Arnold, Sergio, Padilla, Dickerson, and many others trained a body part three times a week.
Larry Scott, Robby,Coleman and others trained body parts twice a week.
Yates and a bunch of others once a week.
Which one was limiting their muscle growth?
And each one was bigger than the previous. They should be training each bodypart once every 9-10 days by now.
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And each one was bigger than the previous. They should be training each bodypart once every 9-10 days by now.
I went from 3X a week to 2X and improved. When I went from 2X to 1X I actually saw some strength losses. I even tried once every 9-10 days and it was worse. I now train the whole body every 5 days and feel great with noticeable increases in strength.
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Pellius do you do any cardio? If not, how active are you during the day?
I think I do though others differ. I follow the Arthur Jones principle of training your individual muscles anaerobically and your body as a whole aerobically. That means I train my muscles anaerobically during a set. A short high-intensity burst of effort then I move on to another exercise with the only rest being walking to the equipment. Even when I need to catch my breath, especially after a set of legs, I walk back and forth in the gym until I get my breath back and I'm ready to go. The main thing is to keep moving. Keep the fire burning. None of this sitting around on your phone or watching the TV monitor. No way I'm going to walk on the treadmill or ride the stationary bike for a 30/45 minutes.
I quit my job at City Mill so on the 5 days of the week when I don't go to the gym I just do regular day to day things. I spend a lot of time on the computer and I read a lot. Then there are household chores and running various errands. I'm kind of half-heartedly looking for another part-time job. I just don't feel right not working and it's a good way to interact with people other than family. I do some charity work that I mentioned before in which we try to help homeless people, and people in general, that are in the advanced stages of diabetes. I look for the ones with swollen discolored lower legs.
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Lol! Pellius I am the master here. You are a reluctant deciple. Your recalcitrance is quite annoying. Please show me the respect I deserve.
LOL, no you are not. You are no master and nobody recognizes you as such. You have a lot to learn but you have such a closed and dogmatic mind. You have an exaggerated sense of self-importance and need to get off your high horse and drop the condescending attitude you have toward everybody here. You are not better or more intelligent than the rest of us.
I am far more educated and well-read than you are regarding physical training. I keep an open mind and explore and experiment with new ideas. And I have vastly -- VASTLY -- more hands-on and real-world experience than you will ever have unless you start training now and live to be a 125 years old.
While you sit behind a computer preaching and lecturing to me as to what I should be doing I am in the gym today actually doing.
You need to do more doing and less yapping.
Just ended a chest, back, and delt workout here. Feeling pretty spent and worn out but Jack-in-the-Box is giving out free milkshakes with any purchase. It will go good with my Double Whopper and fries. I don't make 20 grand a month which is the minimum some getbiggers need to survive so I always look for good deals Goodrum style. In a couple of hours I'll be fine and in a couple of days, I'll be ready to hit arms and legs again HIT style.
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Pellius, here you are on Getbig and look like a wasting away urchin. Why not have a goal to put two inches on your arms? That would impress us here and perhaps help you get some needed self-esteem.
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Pellius, here you are on Getbig and look like a wasting away urchin. Why not have a goal to put two inches on your arms? That would impress us here and perhaps help you get some needed self-esteem.
You're right, he needs more safety fat, like you Vince.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=146902.0;attach=163489;image)
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LOL, no you are not. You are no master and nobody recognizes you as such. You have a lot to learn but you have such a close and dogmatic mind. You have an exaggerated sense of self-importance and need to get off your high horse and drop the condescending attitude you have toward everybody here. You are not better or more intelligent than the rest of us.
I am far more educated and well-read than you are regarding physical training. I keep an open mind and explore and experiment with new ideas. And I have vastly -- VASTLY -- more hands-on and real-world experience than you will ever have unless you start training now and live to be a 125 years old.
While you sit behind a computer preaching and lecturing to me as to what I should be doing I am in the gym today actually doing.
You need to do more doing and less yapping.
Just ended a chest, back, and delt workout here. Feeling pretty spent and worn out but Jack-in-the-Box is giving out free milkshakes with any purchase. It will go good with my Double Whopper and fries. I don't make 20 grand a month which is the minimum some getbiggers need to survive so I always look for good deal Goodrum style. In a couple of hours I'll be fine and in a couple of days I'll be ready to hit arms and legs again HIT style.
Looking good. Keep going.
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I think someone may have hacked Vince B's account.
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Pellius has those "what you" blockas on.
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/xXFb0sBu0o8/hqdefault.jpg)
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Fuck Groink......... 57 years old best shape of my life.
2011,two weeks after my last contests.
Hmm, Where is your "safety fat"at? You must be doing something wrong. ;D ;D
I can assure you that my body didn't look like this when I was 57 years old which was 22 years ago.
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Pellius looks as fit as a fiddle for any age but it is a huge accomplishment for an advanced traineee.
A lifetime of training is more than worth it.
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Yes, Pellius is an inspiration.
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Pellius looks as fit as a fiddle for any age but it is a huge accomplishment for an advanced traineee.
A lifetime of training is more than worth it.
I showed both Pellius's and your pictures to this chick I hook up with. All she could say was "gross".
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I showed both Pellius's and your pictures to this chick I hook up with. All she could say was "gross".
Assuming your hookup likes how you look and thinks these two very fit dudes are gross looking, what does this say about your physique and/or fitness level?
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The old volume vs intensity argument. If intensity was the magic bullet and the most effective way to train the majority of bodybuilders would be training that way. The majority train with volume. Arthur Jones would find a volume trainer and invite them down to Florida then take credit for their success. When Viator was no long on Jones's pay roll he trained with volume. His third place in the Olympia was by far his best ever physique. He was doing volume and a lot of it. Joe Means is featured throughout the Nautilus book and was another bodybuilder invited down to Florida. For his contests he did use Nautilus along with conventional weights but he used volume. Sergio is not a product of Nautilus. He spent a couple of weeks down in Florida and was highly paid for that. He trained with a ton of volume prior to Arthur Jones and after Arthur Jones. Even Mentzer in his best condition trained 4 to 6 work sets a body part. The only ones I can see that truly embraced the Jones intensity were guys like Yates, Cardillo (Mr. Canada) and Dave Mastorakis. Here's where someone says they saw the Yates tape and he did plenty of sets. Nope, one set to failure. Those are warm up. You don't take 410lbs for inclines with no warm up sets.
There is no true definition of high intensity. For some it's one set to failure. For someone like Lee Labrada it's three sets to failure per exercise. Some say train a body part once every 7 to 10 days and others say 2 to 3 times a week. 3 times a week is going back to Darden's many early books. No, we don't have training facts in bodybuilding. We have training theories. If we had training facts we would all doing the same training routine using the same exercises barring injuries and sets. If intensity was the magic bullet then we would do the most intense training we could do. It would be something like 4 sets of one rep per exercise. Highest intensity achieved. Olympic and Power lifters do not train to failure every training session. They cycle their training.
Let me preface what I wrote is that I have been heavily influenced by Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer. When Jones burst onto the scene I read everything he wrote. Ironman Magazine was his platform. I still have his original book that was put together with staples to hold the papers. I still train with low sets. I remember back in the day being selected from my job to go through a high intensity workout by a guy who owned a pure Nautilus and MedX gym. I still think he was trying to kill me. It was a whole body routine. One set to failure and beyond. No warm up. No rest between exercises. I nearly threw up and down on the floor at the end knowing I couldn't stand. There was no way anyone could train like that on a regular basis hence his suggested once every 5 day training session.
My empirical conclusions based on over 40 years of training. Volume has merit. A lot of merit. It's not easy as HIT followers claim. It's like a 400 meter runner saying to a marathoner your training is easy. The 400 meter runner knows he trains more intensely but he would be in world of hurt trying to train like a good marathoner.
My conclusions it that a bodybuider's muscle is a result of muscular endurance training. This is not to be confused with aerobic cardio training. Yes, two sets is better than one set. Three sets is also better than two but it's better fractionally. You reach a point of diminishing returns. I think all bodybuilders would be better off cycling their their training between volume and intensity. Many volume trainers use heavy days as their concession to intensity. Arnold wrote many times he would take an exercise like a bench or deadlift to it's one rep max on a heavy day.
In the end this is nothing but a hobby for the majority of us. Train the way you feel is most effective and gives you the most satisfaction. To say you found the most effective way to train and all should follow your lead is foolish. Like I said before. We have training theories and not training facts. A hard core work ethic will take you far with the only limitations is of course genetic predisposition. On a side note be wary of training advice from steroid users. Consider what they look like if they are clean for 6 months then reevaluate their advice.
On a side note Arthur Jones did not invent the cam he used on his machine. He did not invent pre exhaust. He did not invent selectorized plates on his machine. Not saying this as a dig. His achievements stand on their own.
This is a good summary of training over the last 50 or so years. You conclude that "a bodybuider's muscle is a result of muscular endurance training". Yes, this is correct but needs to be qualified. The particular kind of muscular endurance sought is that using significant resistance, eg, reasonably heavy weights. Warm up, then do many sets with the heavy resistance for 10 or more reps. Why more than 10? Twofold, first to help get a pump and second to compensate for the drop in reps after the third maximum set. There is no need to cycle intensity and volume. You must combine both. HST theory recommends taking a layoff regularly to allow the body to be able to grow more. I am not so sure about this strategic deconditioning.
I agree there are many theories and methods about gaining large muscles. In the confusion we find that just about everyone considers themselves experts.
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I think someone may have hacked Vince B's account.
Only someone new to Getbig would think this. What you!
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Only someone new to Getbig would think this. What you!
Your posts seemed different earlier, not the usual writing style.
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I am far more educated and well-read than you are regarding physical training. I keep an open mind and explore and experiment with new ideas. And I have vastly -- VASTLY -- more hands-on and real-world experience than you will ever have unless you start training now and live to be a 125 years old.
Ah, it is always refreshing to hear the words of a true expert! 2018 marks the 60th anniversary of bodybuilding for me.
I used to think that Pellius was an ok guy who got picked on here at Getbig. He replies to criticism to the bitter end.
Now I see he is quite an aggressive critic which disappoints me. Instead of debating hypertrophy he attacks me as a person.
What you, Pellius!
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Your posts seemed different earlier, not the usual writing style.
You are an expert re writing styles? Amazing.
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You are an expert re writing styles? Amazing.
You seem very annoyed lately. Is everyone getting under your skin?
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A lot of reinventing the wheel
Go to the gym 3-4 per week consistently. Lift up heavy weights and put them down. Don't train like a pussy.
How big your muscles will get will be dependent on how much drugs you take and genetics.
Thread/
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This is a good summary of training over the last 50 or so years. You conclude that "a bodybuider's muscle is a result of muscular endurance training". Yes, this is correct but needs to be qualified. The particular kind of muscular endurance sought is that using significant resistance, eg, reasonably heavy weights. Warm up, then do many sets with the heavy resistance for 10 or more reps. Why more than 10? Twofold, first to help get a pump and second to compensate for the drop in reps after the third maximum set. There is no need to cycle intensity and volume. You must combine both. HST theory recommends taking a layoff regularly to allow the body to be able to grow more. I am not so sure about this strategic deconditioning.
I agree there are many theories and methods about gaining large muscles. In the confusion we find that just about everyone considers themselves experts.
"I am not so sure about this strategic deconditioning."
Really? Then why have you been in deconditioning mode for the last 30 year?
"In the confusion we find that just about everyone considers themselves experts.
Although people like Coach, Vanb, myself and others are far more knowledgeable than you are, none of us ever referred to ourselves as experts. You, and ONLY YOU, are the only one that refers to himself as a hypertrophy expert. How you can preach and lecture to others looking like you do shows how grossly unaware you are. Such gall and nerve. And you wonder why people don't respect you and you had to beg for years for "stars".
One thing GetBig has never tolerated and that is poseurs.
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A lot of reinventing the wheel
Go to the gym 3-4 per week consistently. Lift up heavy weights and put them down. Don't train like a pussy.
How big your muscles will get will be dependent on how much drugs you take and genetics.
Thread/
True but nobody wants to talk about the drugs needed. True natties can only gain 10-20 pounds of muscle over a lifetime but they don't want to admit this. Vince seems to believe he is still packing on muscle at his age with no steroids. If he got down to the bodyfat % he was at when he won the Mr. Canada he would be shocked how small he really is.
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Ah, it is always refreshing to hear the words of a true expert! 2018 marks the 60th anniversary of bodybuilding for me.
I used to think that Pellius was an ok guy who got picked on here at Getbig. He replies to criticism to the bitter end.
Now I see he is quite an aggressive critic which disappoints me. Instead of debating hypertrophy he attacks me as a person.
What you, Pellius!
You haven't bodybuild since the mid 1980s.
Unlike me, you have never addressed any arguments that I made. You completely ignored all the inconsistencies you said about me on this very thread. You are the one that constantly attacks others personally by constantly referring to us as "self-proclaimed experts", floatsam, you just called Prime "dumb" on this thread. He never insulted you. But when it is turned around and you get a bit of your own medicine you cry like a baby.
You don' debate. You don't consider any other ideas. You dismiss categorically any and all real scientific studies. You just keep lecturing us on our ignorance and your tired, old, unproven theories.
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You are an expert re writing styles? Amazing.
I am, fwiw.
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You haven't bodybuild since the mid 1980s.
Unlike me, you have never addressed any arguments that I made. You completely ignored all the inconsistencies you said about me on this very thread. You are the one that constantly attacks others personally by constantly referring to us as "self-proclaimed experts", floatsam, you just called Prime "dumb" on this thread. He never insulted you. But when it is turned around and you get a bit of your own medicine you cry like a baby.
You don' debate. You don't consider any other ideas. You dismiss categorically any and all real scientific studies. You just keep lecturing us on our ignorance and you tired, old, unproven theories.
Amen.
I like Vince, but I'm beyond tired of the "everybody's an expert, hur hur!" We hominenizing he employs.
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Hmm, Where is your "safety fat"at? You must be doing something wrong. ;D ;D
I can assure you that my body didn't look like this when I was 57 years old which was 22 years ago.
You really 79 years old?
Ah, it is always refreshing to hear the words of a true expert! 2018 marks the 60th anniversary of bodybuilding for me.
I used to think that Pellius was an ok guy who got picked on here at Getbig. He replies to criticism to the bitter end.
Now I see he is quite an aggressive critic which disappoints me. Instead of debating hypertrophy he attacks me as a person.
What you, Pellius!
You really shouldn't call yourself a bodybuilder. I mean if you actually lift, you could call yourself a weightlifter. But you are no bodybuilder.
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Assuming your hookup likes how you look and thinks these two very fit dudes are gross looking, what does this say about your physique and/or fitness level?
She likes my strong natural physique, big dick and my good looks. She thought Wes looked like a desperate older gay man trying to hold on to youth via steroids and she couldn't even look at Pelius. She thought the veins were gross.
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She likes my strong natural physique, big dick and my good looks. She thought Wes looked like a desperate older gay man trying to hold on to youth via steroids and she couldn't even look at Pelius. She thought the veins were gross.
So - And your point is ?
Other than she doesn’t like the look of their physiques
1, I doubt very much they are bothered either way if she does or doesn’t approve
2, They May also not like / dislike her physique
3, They Very Likely do like how they look & are actively working on any improvements they think are needed
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So - And your point is ?
Other than she doesn’t like the look of their physiques
1, I doubt very much they are bothered either way if she does or doesn’t approve
2, They May also not like / dislike her physique
3, They Very Likely do like how they look & are actively working on any improvements they think are needed
The post was in response to a very specific question, shit-for-brains.
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She likes my strong natural physique, big dick and my good looks. She thought Wes looked like a desperate older gay man trying to hold on to youth via steroids and she couldn't even look at Pelius. She thought the veins were gross.
Yes, I've said repeatedly that most women do not find veins attractive.
BTW, have you ever posted a picture of your strong natural physique?
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Yes, I've said repeatedly that most women do not find veins attractive.
BTW, have you ever posted a picture of your strong natural physique?
Why would I? I find the men here who plaster their photos to be very foolish. No, I seek no validation from strangers.
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Why would I? I find the men here who plaster their photos to be very foolish. No, I seek no validation from strangers.
No bbing site would survive more than a day if no pictures were posted. It's the defining point of all things bbing. And they absolutely do seek admiration from strangers. Hence, the t-back tank tops and muscle shirts. A Kai Green all bundled up in a full on sweat suit is a notable exception to the rule.
What you are really saying is that despite all your training you are ashamed of what your body looks like. Besides, we already know who you are and what you look like. But nice try. We all knew you couldn't stay off this board for long.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=615860.0;attach=690053;image)
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No bbing site would survive more than a day if no pictures were posted. It's the defining point of all things bbing. And they absolutely do seek admiration from strangers. Hence, the t-back tank tops and muscle shirts. A Kai Green all bundled up in a full on sweat suit is a notable exception to the rule.
What you are really saying is that despite all your training you are ashamed of what your body looks like. Besides, we already know who you are and what you look like. But nice try. We all knew you couldn't stay off this board for long.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=615860.0;attach=690053;image)
You really are a nitwit.
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You really are a nitwit.
Hurts to be expose, eh, tubby.
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The post was in response to a very specific question, shit-for-brains.
Your an incredibly foul mouthed & Stupid gimmick.
Run along little boy Men are Talking.
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Hurts to be expose, eh, tubby.
Wonderful grammar.
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Your an incredibly foul mouthed & Stupid gimmick.
Run along little boy Men are Talking.
Did you go to the same school as pellius?
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She likes my strong natural physique, big dick and my good looks. She thought Wes looked like a desperate older gay man trying to hold on to youth via steroids and she couldn't even look at Pelius. She thought the veins were gross.
Good luck with her when you big dick won't work. Why do I think you influenced you gal's opinion? You should post a photo of your strong natural physique on Getbig (big dick not included). Lets see if you can stand the heat. :)
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Good luck with her when you big dick won't work. Why do I think you influenced you gal's opinion? You should post a photo of your strong natural physique on Getbig (big dick not included). Lets see if you can stand the heat. :)
He's a gimmick......so.
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No bbing site would survive more than a day if no pictures were posted. It's the defining point of all things bbing. And they absolutely do seek admiration from strangers. Hence, the t-back tank tops and muscle shirts. A Kai Green all bundled up in a full on sweat suit is a notable exception to the rule.
What you are really saying is that despite all your training you are ashamed of what your body looks like. Besides, we already know who you are and what you look like. But nice try. We all knew you couldn't stay off this board for long.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=615860.0;attach=690053;image)
Haha Shizzo/Brian has perhaps the shittiest physique of anyone ever to post on a bodybuilding board, even Vince basils current physique is superior to shizzos
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Good luck with her when you big dick won't work. Why do I think you influenced you gal's opinion? You should post a photo of your strong natural physique on Getbig (big dick not included). Lets see if you can stand the heat. :)
As I indicated earlier, only a fool would plaster pictures all over the internet. I have zero need for the approval of homos like yourself. My validation comes from the women I hook up with. Not middle age desperate men.
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As I indicated earlier, only a fool would plaster pictures all over the internet. I have zero need for the approval of homos like yourself. My validation comes from the women I hook up with. Not middle age desperate men.
Cool....then it's okay for me to continue to think you are just another tub of lard who's full of crap. BTW, you could obscure your face to protect your identity. I'm not buying your lame excuse. What makes you think I would approve of your physique? (no homo)
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As I indicated earlier, only a fool would plaster pictures all over the internet. I have zero need for the approval of homos like yourself. My validation comes from the women I hook up with. Not middle age desperate men.
As much as I dislike your opinions I totally agree with you on this.