Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: affeman on August 28, 2021, 05:56:08 AM
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Someone taught him his drug regime or he would have fried his insides by 18 yrs old. Come on, Shawn. Are you talking diet or drugs? Anybody can figure out how to lift.
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Gurus are code for steroid drug dealers.
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Gurus are code for steroid drug dealers.
Same thing with "bodybuilding coaches".
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Shawn is absolutely correct here. It's getting ridiculous how many deaths there have been, and for what a plastic trophy.
It's great that he's calling people out by NAME!
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Gurus are code for steroid drug dealers.
This has always been my assumption as well.
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The word "protocol" was used a lot here. lol The he/she in a Palumbo video also misused the term repeatedly.
Guess it sounds better than: Illegal drug use preparing for a contest.
The bodybuilders and their "coach" or "guru" are equally to blame for this situation. Who the hell needs a bodybuilding coach?
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Shawn is absolutely correct here. It's getting ridiculous how many deaths there have been, and for what a plastic trophy.
It's great that he's calling people out by NAME!
I can't listen to it atm but who did he call out by name?
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I can't listen to it atm but who did he call out by name?
Palumbo, Aceto, and Milos were three I remember. He refered to "THE CHAD" but I don't think he called him out by name. I will add time stamps and names later tonight when I get a chance, but he does name names.
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He is 100% spot on you need to learn your own body and how it reacts to things you can't just start doing what someone else did and expect the same results. Who knows your body better than you?
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Palumbo, Aceto, and Milos were three I remember. He refered to "THE CHAD" but I don't think he called him out by name. I will add time stamps and names later tonight when I get a chance, but he does name names.
It was always rumored that Milos "secret" was heavy insulin use. Didn't Kamali brag about that? I know that even though he and Milos apparently hated each other for a while, he started using Milos for a bit later on.
I know someone who personally used Palumbo as a diet coach. It was most def "all drugs" Palumbo had the guy eating 25 grams of carbs per day for over 8 weeks. It worked for sure, the dude looked amazing. But he was miserable. I am talking like "God take me now." kind of misery. I mean, 99% of any other people who tried this diet would have failed. But his will power was like iron. And while this will sound disgusting and it is NOT because he was not a clean person, about week 5, he just had an "odd" odor to him. Not his breath or smelling sweaty or bad B.O.,... but just a weird smell coming from him. Sort of like a kitchen chef when they have been chopping onions, turnips and cabbage all day. But a lot stronger. He was embarrassed about it.
Aceto, don't know much about him but he has had some high profile clients I believed. Some that did very well in the pro leagues.
Chad of course apparently doesn't give a shit about his clients long term health and has had some clients that suffered on down the road to show for it.
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Chad is a straight up serial killer
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Aceto, don't know much about him but he has had some high profile clients I believed. Some that did very well in the pro leagues.
Aceto trained his wife Laura Creavalle as well as Jay Cutler.....just to name a couple.
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Does anyone even know who this guy is anymore ???
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He is 100% spot on you need to learn your own body and how it reacts to things you can't just start doing what someone else did and expect the same results. Who knows your body better than you?
you actually got a point.
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It was always rumored that Milos "secret" was heavy insulin use. Didn't Kamali brag about that? I know that even though he and Milos apparently hated each other for a while, he started using Milos for a bit later on.
I know someone who personally used Palumbo as a diet coach. It was most def "all drugs" Palumbo had the guy eating 25 grams of carbs per day for over 8 weeks. It worked for sure, the dude looked amazing. But he was miserable. I am talking like "God take me now." kind of misery. I mean, 99% of any other people who tried this diet would have failed. But his will power was like iron. And while this will sound disgusting and it is NOT because he was not a clean person, about week 5, he just had an "odd" odor to him. Not his breath or smelling sweaty or bad B.O.,... but just a weird smell coming from him. Sort of like a kitchen chef when they have been chopping onions, turnips and cabbage all day. But a lot stronger. He was embarrassed about it.
Aceto, don't know much about him but he has had some high profile clients I believed. Some that did very well in the pro leagues.
Chad of course apparently doesn't give a shit about his clients long term health and has had some clients that suffered on down the road to show for it.
Milos of course is known for his insulin protocols. They are simple, just take a dose before and after training. Train twice a day preferably. Anyway, a bodybuilder recently attacked Milos, said his protocols caused cardiomyopathy. A ridiculous charge. The guy had been doing 3,000mg of testosterone and a dozen other compounds on top. Milos told him to drop doses down to like 500mg twice weekly but shoot 30-50iu of insulin daily. This dose of insulin is nothing great, maybe a half of what a diabetic might shoot in a day. This bb was a complete retard.
Palumbo uses a cookie-cutter approach, same diet to a 130lbs female as well as a 300lbs male. Gear doses are the same for all males pretty much, nothing individualized.
Aceto gives clients crazy diuretic protocols without understanding the compounds. These are drugs that kill. Luke Sandoe almost died from an Aceto protocol. Sometimes he doesn't give clients much diuretics but has them not drink for 3 days.
I'm sure you know this but that smell comes from ketosis, IIRC it's acetone that smells.
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I can't listen to it atm but who did he call out by name?
He drops names a few times, but there's a round-up starting around the 5:50 mark
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I can't listen to it atm but who did he call out by name?
@3:37
"There's a body count along the way working with this coach. There are kidneys missing, transplants that had to take place on high level bodybuilders that I felt was a direct correlation to working with this coach who's still in business today."
sounds like Chad Nicholls
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Does anyone even know who this guy is anymore ???
One of the best and most complete BB of all time ::)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-PG1R0TLjaus/T57O2s3pIOI/AAAAAAAABso/i-xi8IfhJtQ/s1600/1994SHAWNRAY-olympia.jpg)
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Milos of course is known for his insulin protocols. They are simple, just take a dose before and after training. Train twice a day preferably. Anyway, a bodybuilder recently attacked Milos, said his protocols caused cardiomyopathy. A ridiculous charge. The guy had been doing 3,000mg of testosterone and a dozen other compounds on top. Milos told him to drop doses down to like 500mg twice weekly but shoot 30-50iu of insulin daily. This dose of insulin is nothing great, maybe a half of what a diabetic might shoot in a day. This bb was a complete retard.
Palumbo uses a cookie-cutter approach, same diet to a 130lbs female as well as a 300lbs male. Gear doses are the same for all males pretty much, nothing individualized.
Aceto gives clients crazy diuretic protocols without understanding the compounds. These are drugs that kill. Luke Sandoe almost died from an Aceto protocol. Sometimes he doesn't give clients much diuretics but has them not drink for 3 days.
I'm sure you know this but that smell comes from ketosis, IIRC it's acetone that smells.
Not so sure about if it was cookie cutter or not. I saw the basic outline of the program when he started and saw this guy's blood work later on at the end of the cycle. Drawn the Friday morning before his show, his test levels were over 42,000 and hematocrit levels were 59.3 600 grams protein daily, 25 grams carbs daily in the morning. (I do not recall how much fat he was allowed.) One hour cardio in the morning, weight training and half hour cardio at night. AAS was orals and short acting esters only, TNE, winstrol, var, tren, npp. No HGH or clen/T3. Guy started out about 250 and showed up 239 shredded beyond belief. He looked great. He won and later said that he would never ever compete again if that is what it took.
I know about keto smells, but this was not the same thing.
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Not so sure about if it was cookie cutter or not. I saw the basic outline of the program when he started and saw this guy's blood work later on at the end of the cycle. Drawn the Friday morning before his show, his test levels were over 42,000 and hematocrit levels were 59.3 600 grams protein daily, 25 grams carbs daily in the morning. (I do not recall how much fat he was allowed.) One hour cardio in the morning, weight training and half hour cardio at night. AAS was orals and short acting esters only, TNE, winstrol, var, tren, npp. No HGH or clen/T3. Guy started out about 250 and showed up 239 shredded beyond belief. He looked great. He won and later said that he would never ever compete again if that is what it took.
I know about keto smells, but this was not the same thing.
That's nuts about 600 grams of protein, I want to say it's not right but can't say for sure. Palumbo himself never ate 600 grams of protein. Really, that's a crazy amount. His baseline contest prep diet has been posted all over. Egg meals, one salmon meal, protein shakes I think, almost no carbs.
Bostin Loyd for whom Palumbo had been like a mentor said his prep diet, the amounts, didn't change once over 12 weeks. Cardio increased a little, T3 and clen increased progressively. Supposedly Palumbo doesn't like to touch the diet at all.
Palumbo thinks McDonalds quarter pounders are somehow very anabolic, contain some special type of salt :D
I've told this story many times here but I just think it was hilarious. Bob Chick was asked what he thought of Palumbo's diet, did he see anything wrong with it. Bob goes, "what's right about it?" :D
It was McDonalds a couple of times a day, Carbo fuel drinks and protein shakes.
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That's nuts about 600 grams of protein, I want to say it's not right but can't say for sure. Palumbo himself never ate 600 grams of protein. Really, that's a crazy amount. His baseline contest prep diet has been posted all over. Egg meals, one salmon meal, protein shakes I think, almost no carbs.
Bostin Loyd for whom Palumbo had been like a mentor said his prep diet, the amounts, didn't change once over 12 weeks. Cardio increased a little, T3 and clen increased progressively. Supposedly Palumbo doesn't like to touch the diet at all.
Palumbo thinks McDonalds quarter pounders are somehow very anabolic, contain some special type of salt :D
I've told this story many times here but I just think it was hilarious. Bob Chick was asked what he thought of Palumbo's diet, did he see anything wrong with it. Bob goes, "what's right about it?" :D
It was McDonalds a couple of times a day, Carbo fuel drinks and protein shakes.
Damn that is interesting. I saw this guy's email from Dave and that was what was in it. The goal was to try to "eat up" for size coming into the show. But there was no McDonalds at all in it. I do know that it said no clen or T3. Keep in mind this was 8 weeks or so out and it could have been adjusted or changed. I do know the guy was completely wiped out and if not for adderall, he would not have been able to get out of bed most days on this.
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lol he's actually quite tame and composed there
watch this one where he goes all out ;D
"i am a misfit too because this is a cult sport, just to be in this, parading around naked and looking at yourself in the mirror and flexing all the time it's not normal" ;D ;D
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Someone taught him his drug regime or he would have fried his insides by 18 yrs old. Come on, Shawn. Are you talking diet or drugs? Anybody can figure out how to lift.
John Brown helped Shawn early on.
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Does anyone even know who this guy is anymore ???
Didn't Milo's take you under his wing?
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An hour? :o Any chance of a pointer to the good bits from anyone please? 🙏
lol he's actually quite tame and composed there
watch this one where he goes all out ;D
"i am a misfit too because this is a cult sport, just to be in this, parading around naked and looking at yourself in the mirror and flexing all the time it's not normal" ;D ;D
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I'm surprised none of these gurus/coaches have been criminally charged for deaths.
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Big Shawn on point
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Shawn is right here. Retards writing other retards drug protocols from their cell-phone.
And the dumb-asses listening to them and drugging as they say.
May have a hand in deaths (these guru's) like Michael Jacksons Dr. (Not quite, but sort of similar).
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Shawn is a bitter dinosaur. When the coaches came on the scene mid 90's he started getting beat by all the bb's they coached. Every sport has coaches, why not bb? Yeah yeah I know it's not a real sport but you get my point
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An hour? :o Any chance of a pointer to the good bits from anyone please? 🙏
He sucks Charles Glass's dick hard in the first 5 minutes.
Says the gurus should call themselves out by their specialty - diuretics guy, steroids guy, etc.... Mentions Chad and Milos.
Shits on Dan Duchaine 7 or so minutes in.
Oldman rant about training yourself for about 5 -7 minutes.
More bitching about gurus. No naming.
23 minute in or so, Chad and Ronnie ice bath story.
More old man rants.
39 in - Calls out Shelby Starnes for a second, back to Chad, shits on Chad hard.
46 in - More Starnes talk.
More old man rants.
End - Shawn says he's going to call these guys out all the time.
Boring interview for the most part. I FFwd through it in about 5 minutes. It should really be called the "Shawn hates Chad Sideshow", because that's who's getting the brunt of Shawn's ire.
That Leo and Longevity guy is way better at this type of stuff.
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He sucks Charles Glass's dick hard in the first 5 minutes.
Says the gurus should call themselves out by their specialty - diuretics guy, steroids guy, etc.... Mentions Chad and Milos.
Shits on Dan Duchaine 7 or so minutes in.
Oldman rant about training yourself for about 5 -7 minutes.
More bitching about gurus. No naming.
23 minute in or so, Chad and Ronnie ice bath story.
More old man rants.
39 in - Calls out Shelby Starnes for a second, back to Chad, shits on Chad hard.
46 in - More Starnes talk.
More old man rants.
End - Shawn says he's going to call these guys out all the time.
Boring interview for the most part. I FFwd through it in about 5 minutes. It should really be called the "Shawn hates Chad Sideshow", because that's who's getting the brunt of Shawn's ire.
That Leo and Longevity guy is way better at this type of stuff.
Leo sounds like a pussy though. His real name is Asad or something as well.
His point is the coath's were pencil neck geeks who pushed the drugs past the threshold. Shawn might have been behind ronnie, but look how they've both ended up and also how shawn holds up against his other peers.
Sugar Shawn swapped the crutch of steroids for safety fat, and is still solid and healthy in his mid-50s.
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Not so sure about if it was cookie cutter or not. I saw the basic outline of the program when he started and saw this guy's blood work later on at the end of the cycle. Drawn the Friday morning before his show, his test levels were over 42,000 and hematocrit levels were 59.3 600 grams protein daily, 25 grams carbs daily in the morning. (I do not recall how much fat he was allowed.) One hour cardio in the morning, weight training and half hour cardio at night. AAS was orals and short acting esters only, TNE, winstrol, var, tren, npp. No HGH or clen/T3. Guy started out about 250 and showed up 239 shredded beyond belief. He looked great. He won and later said that he would never ever compete again if that is what it took.
I know about keto smells, but this was not the same thing.
How much test to get to 42,000? Is that even possible? I heard Kamali claim he was at 3,000 banging test 3 times a week. 42k doesn't even seem possible
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I didn’t watch the video. However, any adult who takes illegal drugs under the supervision of an unqualified gym-rat “doctor”, probably doesn’t care about their own health at all. They probably would’ve done crazy things with or without the guru’s help. It’s the life that they chose. They probably had fun during the 80’s & 90’s.
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These women are total sheep.
@ 13:00 she says Shelby has 480 clients at $500 a month.
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How much test to get to 42,000? Is that even possible? I heard Kamali claim he was at 3,000 banging test 3 times a week. 42k doesn't even seem possible
Dallas McCarver had 55,000 so I guess it's possible. Say if Dallas was doing a gram a day of which perhaps a good amount was a dose of test base. It takes work.
These women are total sheep.
@ 13:00 she says Shelby has 480 clients at $500 a month.
That's $240,000 a month. Pretty good gig if you can handle sitting at a computer constantly.
I didn’t watch the video. However, any adult who takes illegal drugs under the supervision of an unqualified gym-rat “doctor”, probably doesn’t care about their own health at all. They probably would’ve done crazy things with or without the guru’s help. It’s the life that they chose. They probably had fun during the 80’s & 90’s.
Demanding they not prescribe drugs would just drive the whole thing underground. Wouldn't stop shit.
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These women are total sheep.
@ 13:00 she says Shelby has 480 clients at $500 a month.
@ 52:30: When she was telling Shelby that she was already pissing dark brown, and his answer was: "Welcome to pro-level conditioning" :D
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Dallas McCarver had 55,000 so I guess it's possible. Say if Dallas was doing a gram a day of which perhaps a good amount was a dose of test base. It takes work.
That's $240,000 a month. Pretty good gig if you can handle sitting at a computer constantly.
Demanding they not prescribe drugs would just drive the whole thing underground. Wouldn't stop shit.
I'd retire after 6 months.
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jeez... so many people paying 500 bux a month to have some moron kill them prematurely.
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lol he's actually quite tame and composed there
watch this one where he goes all out ;D
"i am a misfit too because this is a cult sport, just to be in this, parading around naked and looking at yourself in the mirror and flexing all the time it's not normal" ;D ;D
To be fair. This is 'normal'.
(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/11/26/article-2066616-0EF248CE00000578-241_468x303.jpg)
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How much test to get to 42,000? Is that even possible? I heard Kamali claim he was at 3,000 banging test 3 times a week. 42k doesn't even seem possible
Unsure of how much he was using. I know that generally one shot of test cyp 200mg will put you at 1000-1200 afterwards before the half life kicks in. I have no idea about what other compounds like test no ester (suspension) does.
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He is 100% spot on you need to learn your own body and how it reacts to things you can't just start doing what someone else did and expect the same results. Who knows your body better than you?
Bhank, Shawn is talking about using illegal steroids (pills, injections and whatnot) and various other illicit compounds, NOT legal steroids. As a natural you should avoid these topics because people will get the wrong idea.
Also with your list of injuries illegal steroid use may cause you to take your training to the next level of intensity causing you even more bodily harm. Train smarter not harder!
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One of the best and most complete BB of all time ::)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-PG1R0TLjaus/T57O2s3pIOI/AAAAAAAABso/i-xi8IfhJtQ/s1600/1994SHAWNRAY-olympia.jpg)
I think more people know Asia now.
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lol he's actually quite tame and composed there
watch this one where he goes all out ;D
"i am a misfit too because this is a cult sport, just to be in this, parading around naked and looking at yourself in the mirror and flexing all the time it's not normal" ;D ;D
Who's the guy in the bottom right?
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Didn’t Don Long get a kidney transplant... and then go back into the drugs? Are we supposed to blame a guru for that?
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Didn’t Don Long get a kidney transplant... and then go back into the drugs? Are we supposed to blame a guru for that?
I don't know if he got the transplant but he competed with the fistula or whatever it's called, for the dialysis machine. He looked real good too. If the kidneys are gone the steroids may only help you.
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I'd retire after 6 months.
He made enough to have a middle class income from passive investments. He should just disappear and move next to a beach somewhere.
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I wanna be the next guru
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Didn’t Don Long get a kidney transplant... and then go back into the drugs? Are we supposed to blame a guru for that?
Well, Don long is a “guru” and is his own guru
There’s also that short fucker “guru” Middle East guy that bragged that he is 260+ pounds year round, got into health/kidney issues and blamed it on working too much ;D another BS cookie cutter routine guys
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Great videos by Shawn Ray. Everyone is quiet about the enlarged prostates, heart attacks, sky high blood pressure, strokes, liver problems; kidney problems and becoming a diabetic. You have guys that permanently shutting down their testosterone production then supplementing with more testosterone than any legit doctor would prescribe claiming it's HRT and they are in their 40's.
In a sport based on drug use taking the advice of dealers of the drugs is insanity. Back in the day guys would use drugs for three months then the rest of the year they would stay away from it. That's why so many in the 70's had massive loses months after the show. Look at the size loss of Arnold and Zane after a contest. It was a healthier way of competing back then. Now guys are on year round. Heavy for the contest and less for the rest of the year.
The sad part is that they all about how they look putting up pictures but they won't dare put up what they really look like without the assist. All of a sudden all that diet and training knowledge means nothing. It's just the drug use.
Best line in the second video was we are a bunch of misfits. Describes get big to a tee.
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Great videos by Shawn Ray. Everyone is quiet about the enlarged prostates, heart attacks, sky high blood pressure, strokes, liver problems; kidney problems and becoming a diabetic. You have guys that permanently shutting down their testosterone production then supplementing with more testosterone than any legit doctor would prescribe claiming it's HRT and they are in their 40's.
In a sport based on drug use taking the advice of dealers of the drugs is insanity. Back in the day guys would use drugs for three months then the rest of the year they would stay away from it. That's why so many in the 70's had massive loses months after the show. Look at the size loss of Arnold and Zane after a contest. It was a healthier way of competing back then. Now guys are on year round. Heavy for the contest and less for the rest of the year.
The sad part is that they all about how they look putting up pictures but they won't dare put up what they really look like without the assist. All of a sudden all that diet and training knowledge means nothing. It's just the drug use.
Best line in the second video was we are a bunch of misfits. Describes get big to a tee.
Remember it’s all predisposed, genetics, it’s never the drugs, NEVER
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To be fair. This is 'normal'.
(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/11/26/article-2066616-0EF248CE00000578-241_468x303.jpg)
And all three will likely live longer than modern bbers
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He sucks Charles Glass's dick hard in the first 5 minutes.
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Boring interview for the most part. I FFwd through it in about 5 minutes. It should really be called the "Shawn hates Chad Sideshow", because that's who's getting the brunt of Shawn's ire.
That Leo and Longevity guy is way better at this type of stuff.
Thanks BB - first comment made me legit LOL
These women are total sheep.
@ 13:00 she says Shelby has 480 clients at $500 a month.
Rare that I'd go through something this long, but I'm glad I did - the combination/simultaneous use of the various cutting/stimulant things he has them on is literally insane - 180mcg T3 for 8 weeks at a time, along with >100mcg clen, DNP, and all types of diuretic, including one I was unfamiliar with - Bumex? (sp) They were all shocked when she told them that was part of the 'protocol' because it's so strong?... And all this on only 700 protein-only calories a day for those 8 weeks with 2 or 3 hours daily cardio... :o
I also hadn't realised that it was this guy involved in the death of a female competitor I was a bit of a fan of - Tracey Hess - couple of years back.
(http://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse4.explicit.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.b3vHGUKZPp6Ru69oLrU5FgHaLH%26pid%3DApi&f=1)
They weren't sure if the death toll was 3 or 4 in the last few years, and nobody has a clear idea of the number of hospitalisations...
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You know there is such a thing as Darwinism if you listen to an idiot that makes you an idiot as well
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These women are total sheep.
@ 13:00 she says Shelby has 480 clients at $500 a month.
That's $240,000 a month. Pretty good gig if you can handle sitting at a computer constantly.
I'd retire after 6 months.
He made enough to have a middle class income from passive investments. He should just disappear and move next to a beach somewhere.
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I wonder if he reported all that to the IRS.
Shawn Ray might have to call Crime Stoppers, and get himself one of those sweet rewards.
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Remember when Shawn Ray had “breakfast” with DEA officials? And Milos confronted Shawn on getbig? Shawn was definitely in the drug business himself.
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I wonder if he reported all that to the IRS.
Shawn Ray might have to call Crime Stoppers, and get himself one of those sweet rewards.
Do you really think he would provide drug related information to the authorities?
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Do you really think he would provide drug related information to the authorities?
Absolutely Authorities : tell us what you know or go to jail Everyone : What do you want to know
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Do you really think he would provide drug related information to the authorities?
It's a joke based on an old Chad Nichols post -
"So, now let's talk about Shawn Ray the person. All my problems from '98 stem from YOU! Let me see 5 calls to Crime Stoppers, 2 of them mentioning plasma expanders and they all came from Placentia, CA - you figure that out ?! I'm sure you had NOTHING to do with that! The funny thing is - here again you go on in your e-mail you spew again about what supposedly happened with that whole scenario. Actually nothing happened - It cost me a little money - but everything is gone - nothing ever came of it - because they couldn't prove anything. If you don't do anything wrong - you don't have anything to worry about.
It takes a pretty insecure person to go as far as to call Crime Stoppers just to eliminate competition. Do you know who this person is ??? Shawn, do you know anyone who lived in the Placentia area around the time of 1998? Maybe you can help me out on this one - maybe you can call Crime Stoppers again and give them a tip on who might have given them false information.
So, there's the truth side of everything - I'm sure you can spin that into your web of lies. --And, I'm sure that some will actually buy your bit of rambling bullshit. Trust me, you can talk all the bullshit you want about me, and I've heard all of it. In this sport, you can't say anything without it getting right back to the person.
By the way, you attack me saying that I'm so quick to rebut everytime someone says something about me. No - just you because, Shawn, what have I ever said about you that wasn't prompted from you first, NOTHING - you started this whole thing back in 1998 and here it is 5 years later and your mouth is still running - replaying the same crap that you rambled about in 1998 - that's kind of strange that you are that obsessed with this whole thing. You say that I'm not on your mind, yet every chance you have to say somehting about me - you say it. The truth is any type of controversial bullshit scenario you can throw out there keeps you in the public eye - and it's true. Hate you or love you - as long as you are talking shit, people listen. Anyone that truly knows me knows that I don't bullshit, I tell it exactly like it is - don't sugar coat things - so like me or not - at least respect that I tell the truth. You on the other hand, never tell the truth - or at least you tell Shawn's truth - whatever will make you feel better.
The other funny thing is, I'm kind of curious, you speak of all these "drug gurus" in the sport hurting the sport, yet your buddy and new training partner, Milos is very honest and open about being one of these "gurus "- so let's not play favorites here - either we are all good or all bad - which is it, Shawn. And before you try to turn this into a problem between Milos and I - don't even think about - I like Milos - he comes to the board quite often and even though we have different views on some things, he is one of the few straight forward guys in the sport."
Original post is gone, but this Russian bodybuilding forum c/p it - https://forum.steelfactor.ru/index.php?showtopic=309 , post 15.
For a couple of years, you couldn't mention Shawn Ray without "Rat" posts.
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As for Starnes, if he really made that much, I'd retire. The IRS thing is real, and now he's got a ton more eyes on him. Maybe it's best to fade away for a while.
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It's a joke based on an old Chad Nichols post -
"So, now let's talk about Shawn Ray the person. All my problems from '98 stem from YOU! Let me see 5 calls to Crime Stoppers, 2 of them mentioning plasma expanders and they all came from Placentia, CA - you figure that out ?! I'm sure you had NOTHING to do with that! The funny thing is - here again you go on in your e-mail you spew again about what supposedly happened with that whole scenario. Actually nothing happened - It cost me a little money - but everything is gone - nothing ever came of it - because they couldn't prove anything. If you don't do anything wrong - you don't have anything to worry about.
It takes a pretty insecure person to go as far as to call Crime Stoppers just to eliminate competition. Do you know who this person is ??? Shawn, do you know anyone who lived in the Placentia area around the time of 1998? Maybe you can help me out on this one - maybe you can call Crime Stoppers again and give them a tip on who might have given them false information.
So, there's the truth side of everything - I'm sure you can spin that into your web of lies. --And, I'm sure that some will actually buy your bit of rambling bullshit. Trust me, you can talk all the bullshit you want about me, and I've heard all of it. In this sport, you can't say anything without it getting right back to the person.
By the way, you attack me saying that I'm so quick to rebut everytime someone says something about me. No - just you because, Shawn, what have I ever said about you that wasn't prompted from you first, NOTHING - you started this whole thing back in 1998 and here it is 5 years later and your mouth is still running - replaying the same crap that you rambled about in 1998 - that's kind of strange that you are that obsessed with this whole thing. You say that I'm not on your mind, yet every chance you have to say somehting about me - you say it. The truth is any type of controversial bullshit scenario you can throw out there keeps you in the public eye - and it's true. Hate you or love you - as long as you are talking shit, people listen. Anyone that truly knows me knows that I don't bullshit, I tell it exactly like it is - don't sugar coat things - so like me or not - at least respect that I tell the truth. You on the other hand, never tell the truth - or at least you tell Shawn's truth - whatever will make you feel better.
The other funny thing is, I'm kind of curious, you speak of all these "drug gurus" in the sport hurting the sport, yet your buddy and new training partner, Milos is very honest and open about being one of these "gurus "- so let's not play favorites here - either we are all good or all bad - which is it, Shawn. And before you try to turn this into a problem between Milos and I - don't even think about - I like Milos - he comes to the board quite often and even though we have different views on some things, he is one of the few straight forward guys in the sport."
Original post is gone, but this Russian bodybuilding forum c/p it - https://forum.steelfactor.ru/index.php?showtopic=309 , post 15.
For a couple of years, you couldn't mention Shawn Ray without "Rat" posts.
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As for Starnes, if he really made that much, I'd retire. The IRS thing is real, and now he's got a ton more eyes on him. Maybe it's best to fade away for a while.
It is very satisfying to know that Haney, Dorian, and Ronnie kept Shawn from winning the Mr Olympia title. Let’s be honest, Dorian and Ronnie trained harder than Shawn. Shawn may have been able to equal Haney’s workout intensity, But Haney had superior genetics.
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He sucks Charles Glass's dick hard in the first 5 minutes.
Says the gurus should call themselves out by their specialty - diuretics guy, steroids guy, etc.... Mentions Chad and Milos.
Shits on Dan Duchaine 7 or so minutes in.
Oldman rant about training yourself for about 5 -7 minutes.
More bitching about gurus. No naming.
23 minute in or so, Chad and Ronnie ice bath story.
More old man rants.
39 in - Calls out Shelby Starnes for a second, back to Chad, shits on Chad hard.
46 in - More Starnes talk.
More old man rants.
End - Shawn says he's going to call these guys out all the time.
Boring interview for the most part. I FFwd through it in about 5 minutes. It should really be called the "Shawn hates Chad Sideshow", because that's who's getting the brunt of Shawn's ire.
That Leo and Longevity guy is way better at this type of stuff.
This ranting is all rooted the fact that he never won an Olympia title.
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It's a joke based on an old Chad Nichols post -
Man you are amazing at finding old stuff. Wasn't Shawn supposedly involved in getting the DEA or just cops to the Arnold Classic? I seem to remember they came to the show and interviewed all the competitors.
I wish I could find my post on Musclemayhem that kicked off the insulin debates. A few of the posts were sensitive enough for Chad to remove parts of the discussion. Milos' posts. I had deduced that Milos' insulin protocols were something that changed the sport and Chad had his own ideas on how to best utilize insulin so I asked about it. One of the very first posts on the forum. Chad thought it should only be used a couple of times a week and Milos thought it could be used every single workout pretty much, from the time your career started to the end. Milos has been showed to be more right, you can use a ton of insulin without getting desensitized.
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Man you are amazing at finding old stuff. Wasn't Shawn supposedly involved in getting the DEA or just cops to the Arnold Classic? I seem to remember they came to the show and interviewed all the competitors.
From the old "Undercover Pro" series on Bodybuilding.com from 2004 ( https://keskustelu.pakkotoisto.com/threads/dennis-james.9980/page-7 post 128 ) -
"Arnold Classic DEA Subpoenas
Now onto the next unbelievable news flash; at the Arnold Classic in Columbus, Ohio the D.E.A. proceeded to serve subpoenas to various pro bodybuilders all in connection with Milos Sarcev. In December, agents from the Federal Drug Enforcement Agency raided the home of champion bodybuilder, Milos Sarcev in Fullerton, California. The DEA took his computer among many other things and the shit has hit the fan from there.
Sarcev trained Balco Labs client, Tim Montgomery just before he set the world record in the 100 meter event back in September in 2002. Sarcev has also prepared several pro bodybuilders for competitions apparently leaving this information for the DEA to read on his computer. It doesn't take a genius to know where all these subpoenas are stemming from. Rick Collins, Sarcev's attorney has stated that it is possible his client is the target of this investigation. I'm here to tell you it's not only possible but it's exactly what's going on. Several of the IFBB Pros who have received subpoenas say that the agents were asking what their relations were to Milo Sarcev.
The bodybuilders went on to say the agents also asked what their relations to Dennis James were and if they knew any information in regards to any illegal activity between Sarcev and James. Sources say this is an on going investigation in an attempt to try to build a case against Sarcev. My sources say the case has to do with steroid distribution which is a federal offense. Sources also say the agents were at Shawn Ray's home several weeks ago talking with Shawn for over an hour. Being that Shawn Ray was not served a subpoena and the agents possessed no warrant to enter his home, what exactly was the reason for Mr. Ray's co-operation. I would have loved to be a fly on the wall that day.
It's a sad day when pro bodybuilders have to be bothered by the DEA or any other type of law enforcement while trying to prepare for their show. Can you imagine how some of them may have felt? Imagine being in the hotel room the night before your show and the police knock on your door to ask you about a possible connection with steroid sales... holy shit! Talk about stress levels sky rocketing. I for one hope that my name was not on Mr. Sarcev's computer! The grand jury is set for March 24th in Iowa. Only time will tell who got served and how many IFBB Pros will actually testify.
To make matters worse, Arnold's police security along with their dogs were walking around back stage and in the hotel smelling every bag they could get close to. This put a very thick layer of tension in the air making this year's Arnold Classic very weird to say the least. "
Shawn admits talking, but not saying much -
https://books.google.com/books?id=4ocvvGDWDTAC&pg=PT145&lpg=PT145&dq=dea+arnold+classic+undercover+pro&source=bl&ots=eEBEc7bIZK&sig=ACfU3U1sbeBSccF3rT-ScRCifTRh9yruag&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirkozvm9jyAhWoSTABHTlPAXEQ6AF6BAgeEAM#v=onepage&q=dea%20arnold%20classic%20undercover%20pro&f=false .
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I remember people were pissed, the DEA stayed all weekend talking and eye balling people.
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Shawn was in the drug business, and he was cooperating in order to save himself
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It is very satisfying to know that Haney, Dorian, and Ronnie kept Shawn from winning the Mr Olympia title. Let’s be honest, Dorian and Ronnie trained harder than Shawn. Shawn may have been able to equal Haney’s workout intensity, But Haney had superior genetics.
Training harder would not have changed anything. He maxed out his potential.
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Training harder would not have changed anything. He maxed out his potential.
Shawn Ray’s back would not have improved if trained harder and worked up to 405LB barbell rows and 200LB dumbbell rows ? ? ?
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Shawn Ray’s back would not have improved if trained harder and worked up to 405LB barbell rows and 200LB dumbbell rows ? ? ?
Nope. There are two main reasons he never won an Olympia.
1) Genetics: he was considerably shorter than Haney, Yates and Ronnie. He also had a blocky physique and with the exception of either 94 or 96 when he came in 2nd place he usually had a bloofy or watery look to him.
2) He was a 80's bodybuilder who transitioned into the 90's and didn't use the crazy drug cycles guys like Yates used and this is probably why he never had the hard look.
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Shawn Ray was an incredible bodybuilder. He got 100% out of the body he had. Just the roll of the dice there were a few with more genetic gifts. He is one of the few bodybuilders that competed at 95% to 100% of conditioning. He trained hard. Look at his early training tape.
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He would have been mr olympia if he upped his dose from 1cc of winny a week
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Nope. There are two main reasons he never won an Olympia.
1) Genetics: he was considerably shorter than Haney, Yates and Ronnie. He also had a blocky physique and with the exception of either 94 or 96 when he came in 2nd place he usually had a bloofy or watery look to him.
2) He was a 80's bodybuilder who transitioned into the 90's and didn't use the crazy drug cycles guys like Yates used and this is probably why he never had the hard look.
He was squatting 585 at one point. His physique did not become blocky from the heavy squatting
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Shawn Ray was an incredible bodybuilder. He got 100% out of the body he had. Just the roll of the dice there were a few with more genetic gifts. He is one of the few bodybuilders that competed at 95% to 100% of conditioning. He trained hard. Look at his early training tape.
He just didn’t train as hard as Ronnie or Dorian
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He was aesthetic, just a tiny bit short legs.
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Man you are amazing at finding old stuff. Wasn't Shawn supposedly involved in getting the DEA or just cops to the Arnold Classic? I seem to remember they came to the show and interviewed all the competitors.
I wish I could find my post on Musclemayhem that kicked off the insulin debates. A few of the posts were sensitive enough for Chad to remove parts of the discussion. Milos' posts. I had deduced that Milos' insulin protocols were something that changed the sport and Chad had his own ideas on how to best utilize insulin so I asked about it. One of the very first posts on the forum. Chad thought it should only be used a couple of times a week and Milos thought it could be used every single workout pretty much, from the time your career started to the end. Milos has been showed to be more right, you can use a ton of insulin without getting desensitized.
Just remember before labeling him a Genius Guru Milos is the same idiot who nearly died injecting so called SEO into a vein in his arm. The Flex Magazine article on it is one of the reasons I never tried and will never try so called SEO. So no I am not going to play with Insulin either. Lee Haney didn't use Insulin or SEO and he looked great.
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Just remember before labeling him a Genius Guru Milos is the same idiot who nearly died injecting so called SEO into a vein in his arm. The Flex Magazine article on it is one of the reasons I never tried and will never try so called SEO. So no I am not going to play with Insulin either. Lee Haney didn't use Insulin or SEO and he looked great.
You’re getting a little defensive.
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Good video
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He was squatting 585 at one point. His physique did not become blocky from the heavy squatting
I never said it did. He had a blocky physique genetically.
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Just remember before labeling him a Genius Guru Milos is the same idiot who nearly died injecting so called SEO into a vein in his arm. The Flex Magazine article on it is one of the reasons I never tried and will never try so called SEO. So no I am not going to play with Insulin either. Lee Haney didn't use Insulin or SEO and he looked great.
Insulin is a nontoxic compound that works great with gh. Little side effects. If you did Lantus daily with Humalog or Novolog before workouts now for a couple of months before you next show it could give you a considerable advantage. Like I said it has virtually no sides which many don't believe but it's the truth. :D
I'm not calling Milos a genius but that Synthol mishap was not really due to "Synthol" as such, it was due to mistakenly hitting a vein going into his tricep. Not that I'm defending Synthol, the main disadvantage witth the stuff is that it looks like shit. Though if you use low amounts it can help a little.
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It is very satisfying to know that Haney, Dorian, and Ronnie kept Shawn from winning the Mr Olympia title. Let’s be honest, Dorian and Ronnie trained harder than Shawn. Shawn may have been able to equal Haney’s workout intensity, But Haney had superior genetics.
They kept flex and Kevin from winning too
I disagree they trained harder than Shawn, I’ve seen Shawn train daily back then, no BS guy, if anything they are all equal, a bit different in training styles
Shawn, flex and Kevin should have at least 1 Olympia each
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They kept flex and Kevin from winning too
I disagree they trained harder than Shawn, I’ve seen Shawn train daily back then, no BS guy, if anything they are all equal, a bit different in training styles
Shawn, flex and Kevin should have at least 1 Olympia each
Kevin pressed Ronnie one year but he didn't have legs and a back.
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Kevin pressed Ronnie one year but he didn't have legs and a back.
Politics, just like Gunter beating Ronnie, trying to hype the the upcoming O up , even though Gunter looked amazing in the show of strength.
It’s like when Wolfe started winning, he was far from his best which was when he peaked around 2007, paid his dues
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Politics, just like Gunter beating Ronnie, trying to hype the the upcoming O up , even though Gunter looked amazing in the show of strength.
It’s like when Wolfe started winning, he was far from his best which was when he peaked around 2007, paid his dues
Gunter legit looked awesome at the GNC show of strength. Ronnie was mad but It was no robbery
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It is very satisfying to know that Haney, Dorian, and Ronnie kept Shawn from winning the Mr Olympia title. Let’s be honest, Dorian and Ronnie trained harder than Shawn. Shawn may have been able to equal Haney’s workout intensity, But Haney had superior genetics.
Shawn is very clever at marketing himself as something more than what he was. He mentioned in that interview that he was a " Hall of fame bodybuilder " As is that's something to be proud of? That's his accomplishment? He won 2 pro shows in 14 fucking years. NOT impressive at all. Lee Labrada 7 pro wins , never placed below 5th in ANY professional show. Was runner-up in 2 Olympias. Yet Shawn acts like he's exceptional ::) Vince Taylor 21 fucking pro wins!! And Shawn acts like he's in his league? ::) Porter Cottrell has 4 pro wins and no one would think to compare him to Shawn , when in fact his career shits on Shawns and his physique comes very close
Shawn Ray is the textbook definition of the word overrated. Awesome physique , incredible poser etc but so fucking overrated
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Gunter legit looked awesome at the GNC show of strength. Ronnie was mad but It was no robbery
Gunther raped Ronnie in 2002. Ronnie got way to complacent like Flex , just daring the judges to mark him down and his luck ran out. Jay the dummy should've competed in the 2002 Olympia instead of boycotting it and he wouldn't have waited until 2006 to beat Ronnie. Ronnie was ripe for the pickens in 2002
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Shawn is very clever at marketing himself as something more than what he was. He mentioned in that interview that he was a " Hall of fame bodybuilder " As is that's something to be proud of? That's his accomplishment? He won 2 pro shows in 14 fucking years. NOT impressive at all. Lee Labrada 7 pro wins , never placed below 5th in ANY professional show. Was runner-up in 2 Olympias. Yet Shawn acts like he's exceptional ::) Vince Taylor 21 fucking pro wins!! And Shawn acts like he's in his league? ::) Porter Cottrell has 4 pro wins and no one would think to compare him to Shawn , when in fact his career shits on Shawns and his physique comes very close
Shawn Ray is the textbook definition of the word overrated. Awesome physique , incredible poser etc but so fucking overrated
Wow, I'd never thought of it in those terms...
Do you think that's mostly because Shawn chose to just do the Arnold and the Olympia each year, while most of the guys went on the Grand Prix tour after the O..? So people like Cottrell (great physique BTW) had more opportunities to place/win...
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Shawn is very clever at marketing himself as something more than what he was. He mentioned in that interview that he was a " Hall of fame bodybuilder " As is that's something to be proud of? That's his accomplishment? He won 2 pro shows in 14 fucking years. NOT impressive at all. Lee Labrada 7 pro wins , never placed below 5th in ANY professional show. Was runner-up in 2 Olympias. Yet Shawn acts like he's exceptional ::) Vince Taylor 21 fucking pro wins!! And Shawn acts like he's in his league? ::) Porter Cottrell has 4 pro wins and no one would think to compare him to Shawn , when in fact his career shits on Shawns and his physique comes very close
Shawn Ray is the textbook definition of the word overrated. Awesome physique , incredible poser etc but so fucking overrated
Yet Shawn was the inspiration to guys like kevin, flex, dexter and even Ronnie who all admitted that, especially Ronnie who said it was Shawn who he looked at as far as physiques go
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Wow, I'd never thought of it in those terms...
Do you think that's mostly because Shawn chose to just do the Arnold and the Olympia each year, while most of the guys went on the Grand Prix tour after the O..? So people like Cottrell (great physique BTW) had more opportunities to place/win...
Shawn put all his eggs in one basket on a feeble attempt to win the Olympia. He wasn't going to win it , not against Haney , Yates or Coleman. The few times he did venture out to other shows , guess what? He got beat. 1988 NOC 4th place, 1996 ASC 5th , 1996 Ironman 3rd. He had an outstanding physique but he wasn't Olympia winner material at that point , Maybe 1983 and before but after Haney era nope.
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Yet Shawn was the inspiration to guys like kevin, flex, dexter and even Ronnie who all admitted that, especially Ronnie who said it was Shawn who he looked at as far as physiques go
He was the senior pro and they were up-and-comers they were paying lip-service. They were inspired by Shawn , whatever that means. All of them managed to have exceptional careers , Shawn didn't. Great physique but not Olympia caliber winner. One can argue his type of physique should represent the Olympia ideal but that's another story.
2 pro wins in 14 years of competing? technically 3 but he pissed hot so that's not in the record books. Momo 8 pro wins in 5 years of competing. Mike Francois , Kevin and Flex won just as many pro shows in their rookie year than Shawn did in 14 fucking years!!
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He was the senior pro and they were up-and-comers they were paying lip-service. They were inspired by Shawn , whatever that means. All of them managed to have exceptional careers , Shawn didn't. Great physique but not Olympia caliber winner. One can argue his type of physique should represent the Olympia ideal but that's another story.
2 pro wins in 14 years of competing? technically 3 but he pissed hot so that's not in the record books. Momo 8 pro wins in 5 years of competing. Mike Francois , Kevin and Flex won just as many pro shows in their rookie year than Shawn did in 14 fucking years!!
I agree with you in terms of bbing career and accomplishments go to
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He was the senior pro and they were up-and-comers they were paying lip-service. They were inspired by Shawn , whatever that means. All of them managed to have exceptional careers , Shawn didn't. Great physique but not Olympia caliber winner. One can argue his type of physique should represent the Olympia ideal but that's another story.
2 pro wins in 14 years of competing? technically 3 but he pissed hot so that's not in the record books. Momo 8 pro wins in 5 years of competing. Mike Francois , Kevin and Flex won just as many pro shows in their rookie year than Shawn did in 14 fucking years!!
To be fair, he only competed 1 or 2 times a year in the toughest contests. He would have won a lot of shows if he competed at the smaller ones.
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Imagine if Shawn had put his ego aside and went to MetroFlex Gym in Arlington Texas to train with Ronnie Coleman. Super heavy T-Bar rows and Deadlifts. Parking lot lunges with 315. Shrugs with 600. One arm rows with 200.
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Imagine if Shawn had put his ego aside and went to MetroFlex Gym in Arlington Texas to train with Ronnie Coleman. Super heavy T-Bar rows and Deadlifts. Parking lot lunges with 315. Shrugs with 600. One arm rows with 200.
He would probably be sitting next to Ronnie in a wheelchair
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He would probably be sitting next to Ronnie in a wheelchair
This ^^
Not many (Ronnie included) can handle that for very long... Its body-wreckoning...
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This ^^
Not many (Ronnie included) can handle that for very long... Its body-wreckoning...
Shawn Ray was squatting 585 for reps at one point.
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He would probably be sitting next to Ronnie in a wheelchair
Yup.
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He would probably be sitting next to Ronnie in a wheelchair
Actually, I don't think he'd have his own, for some reason I seem him sitting on Ronnies knee, like a little ventriloquist dummy, but dressed in striped spandex and sporting a colorful bandana...
If I had the PhotoShop chops, I'd try to illustrate my point... ;D
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Shawn is very clever at marketing himself as something more than what he was. He mentioned in that interview that he was a " Hall of fame bodybuilder " As is that's something to be proud of? That's his accomplishment? He won 2 pro shows in 14 fucking years. NOT impressive at all. Lee Labrada 7 pro wins , never placed below 5th in ANY professional show. Was runner-up in 2 Olympias. Yet Shawn acts like he's exceptional ::) Vince Taylor 21 fucking pro wins!! And Shawn acts like he's in his league? ::) Porter Cottrell has 4 pro wins and no one would think to compare him to Shawn , when in fact his career shits on Shawns and his physique comes very close
Shawn Ray is the textbook definition of the word overrated. Awesome physique , incredible poser etc but so fucking overrated
Shawn was only interested in the big shows, he was a business man
He didnt want to fly all over the world for $10k for winning a show
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They kept flex and Kevin from winning too
I disagree they trained harder than Shawn, I’ve seen Shawn train daily back then, no BS guy, if anything they are all equal, a bit different in training styles
Shawn, flex and Kevin should have at least 1 Olympia each
That uncrowned Mr. Olympia shit. That only applies when there was a year they pushed the winner and "should have" won. What year was it arguable that Flex won?
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That uncrowned Mr. Olympia shit. That only applies when there was a year they pushed the winner and "should have" won. What year was it arguable that Flex won?
1976 Olympia
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That uncrowned Mr. Olympia shit. That only applies when there was a year they pushed the winner and "should have" won. What year was it arguable that Flex won?
Some would say 1998. Ronnie beat him by the skin of his teeth.
I'd say 1993. To me, Wheeler looked better than Yates. It was the shock factor of Yates' being 15 pounds bigger than the previous year. (or at least, as he put it, he didn't lose as much weight in 1993 as he did in 1992) that gave him the title, in my opinion.
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Kevin pressed Ronnie one year but he didn't have legs and a back.
Levrone has always had legs and a back. His last win against Coleman was the 1998 San Francisco Pro.
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Levrone has always had legs and a back. His last win against Coleman was the 1998 San Francisco Pro.
His legs and back were subpar in his later years especially in 2002 where he placed 2nd at the O
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He was the senior pro and they were up-and-comers they were paying lip-service. They were inspired by Shawn , whatever that means. All of them managed to have exceptional careers , Shawn didn't. Great physique but not Olympia caliber winner. One can argue his type of physique should represent the Olympia ideal but that's another story.
2 pro wins in 14 years of competing? technically 3 but he pissed hot so that's not in the record books. Momo 8 pro wins in 5 years of competing. Mike Francois , Kevin and Flex won just as many pro shows in their rookie year than Shawn did in 14 fucking years!!
That's because Shawn Ray was from that mid/late 80s era where a lot of guys only competed in the Olympia, especially since (back then and until 2003) placing top 10 qualified you for the next year's show.
Ray was in the top 5 every year, except his rookie one. So, to him, winning the Olympia was all that mattered. Placing top 10 was better than winning a smaller show.
Mike Quinn never won a pro show. But, he placed top 10 at the O multiple times. So, he was still considered among the best in the world. Tom Platz was similar.
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Some would say 1998. Ronnie beat him by the skin of his teeth.
I'd say 1993. To me, Wheeler looked better than Yates. It was the shock factor of Yates' being 15 pounds bigger than the previous year. (or at least, as he put it, he didn't lose as much weight in 1993 as he did in 1992) that gave him the title, in my opinion.
WHEELER if you remember turned his back to judges as coleman dropped to the floor 'when he won'and flex was soft 'no homo'top to bottom compared to coleman.ronnie 98/99 was light yrs ahead size/freakiness wise by the.i wasnt a coleman fan whatsoever but he was freaky ..
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WHEELER if you remember turned his back to judges as coleman dropped to the floor 'when he won'and flex was soft 'no homo'top to bottom compared to coleman.ronnie 98/99 was light yrs ahead size/freakiness wise by the.i wasnt a coleman fan whatsoever but he was freaky ..
Wheeler was ahead of Coleman after the prejudging in 1998. That was a nip-and-tuck show. Up to that point, Wheeler would usually beat Coleman handily; whereas Coleman would upset Wheeler (i.e. 1996 Canada Pro cup, where it took a tie-breaker and Coleman won by ONE POINT).
Ronnie Coleman dropped the floor for a reason. Wheeler went into that show the heavy favorite and initially it looked to be his.
Coleman was not light years ahead of anybody that year. Again, Levrone beat him in 1998 and swept him in all those 1997 Grand Prix shows (except the last one).
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That's because Shawn Ray was from that mid/late 80s era where a lot of guys only competed in the Olympia, especially since (back then and until 2003) placing top 10 qualified you for the next year's show.
Ray was in the top 5 every year, except his rookie one. So, to him, winning the Olympia was all that mattered. Placing top 10 was better than winning a smaller show.
Mike Quinn never won a pro show. But, he placed top 10 at the O multiple times. So, he was still considered among the best in the world. Tom Platz was similar.
true,,,but also alot of guys cleaned up'labrada'wins mostly were grand prix tours,they were popular then too,shawn couldn't be bothered.i guess he would 'clean out'get soft and would not offseason drug ,then like leverone would go 16 wkks or so and look awesome again.
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Wheeler was ahead of Coleman after the prejudging in 1998. That was a nip-and-tuck show. Up to that point, Wheeler would usually beat Coleman handily; whereas Coleman would upset Wheeler (i.e. 1996 Canada Pro cup, where it took a tie-breaker and Coleman won by ONE POINT).
Ronnie Coleman dropped the floor for a reason. Wheeler went into that show the heavy favorite and initially it looked to be his.
Coleman was not light years ahead of anybody that year. Again, Levrone beat him in 1998 and swept him in all those 1997 Grand Prix shows (except the last one).
wheeler can outshape just about anybody ,ronnie looked like a different bber than 96/97 versions.wheeler was 'oil'delts and arms and getting smoother by then.
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wheeler can outshape just about anybody ,ronnie looked like a different bber than 96/97 versions.wheeler was 'oil'delts and arms and getting smoother by then.
That's odd. You're taking six months? At the 1998 ASC, Wheeler looked unreal, frog-stomping Nasser El-Sonbaty and everyone else on that stage. And with Yates retired, the smart money was on Wheeler to win the big one.
And, if you believe in "politics", Wheeler was a Weider guy; Ronnie was with MET-Rx. So, many thought that, as long as Wheeler showed up with a pulse and in decent shape, it's a wrap.
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That's odd. You're taking six months? At the 1998 ASC, Wheeler looked unreal, frog-stomping Nasser El-Sonbaty and everyone else on that stage. And with Yates retired, the smart money was on Wheeler to win the big one.
And, if you believe in "politics", Wheeler was a Weider guy; Ronnie was with MET-Rx. So, many thought that, as long as Wheeler showed up with a pulse and in decent shape, it's a wrap.
i'm not totally disagreeing i knew more of wheeler than coleman at that point as well,ronnie really started gaing steam parts 95 on up ,imo coleman looked so freaky and flex had narrow torso and thickness compared to coleman and ,wheelers legs were getting smooth .again i see your point as wheeler winning u until they called winner,also maybe i;m thinking 99 as a lesser wheeler to an extent.
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That's odd. You're taking six months? At the 1998 ASC, Wheeler looked unreal, frog-stomping Nasser El-Sonbaty and everyone else on that stage. And with Yates retired, the smart money was on Wheeler to win the big one.
And, if you believe in "politics", Wheeler was a Weider guy; Ronnie was with MET-Rx. So, many thought that, as long as Wheeler showed up with a pulse and in decent shape, it's a wrap.
Wheeler must have pissed off a lot of people on “top” they were never going to let him win the big one
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Should Wheeler have won? With all that Synthol completely mutilating his body plus a soft ass?
This version, maybe
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CShNtIFnNVX/?utm_medium=copy_link
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Shawn was only interested in the big shows, he was a business man
He didnt want to fly all over the world for $10k for winning a show
He competed in Ironman , and the Night of Champions. And he didn't fare so well and didn't have Dorian to blame or the judges.
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Actually, I don't think he'd have his own, for some reason I seem him sitting on Ronnies knee, like a little ventriloquist dummy, but dressed in striped spandex and sporting a colorful bandana...
If I had the PhotoShop chops, I'd try to illustrate my point... ;D
;D
Someone needs to make this happen.
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He competed in Ironman , and the Night of Champions. And he didn't fare so well and didn't have Dorian to blame or the judges.
He won the IronMan once in 1990.
Again, he placed top 5 at every Olympia in which he competed except one.
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He won the IronMan once in 1990.
Again, he placed top 5 at every Olympia in which he competed except one.
Competed at the 1996 Ironman as well , placed 3rd and placed 5th at the 1996 ASC.
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Competed at the 1996 Ironman as well , placed 3rd and placed 5th at the 1996 ASC.
He placed 2nd to Yates again that year. The other was that debacle in 1994, where Yates looked like garbage but still "won" with straight firsts.
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Wheeler must have pissed off a lot of people on “top” they were never going to let him win the big one
And who would that be?
He just smoked every one at the Arnold. He was a Weider guy. With Yates gone, everybody and their mammy had Wheeler winning it all.
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And who would that be?
He just smoked every one at the Arnold. He was a Weider guy. With Yates gone, everybody and their mammy had Wheeler winning it all.
He signed with another supplement company after the Arnold, cant remember which, probably pissed of Weiders
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wheelers problem, was he never could peak for the olympia he always was usually in his top shape at the asc classic, i think the reason wheeler usually competed at the asc classic was he made him stay in better shape and two he was always broke with his spending problems. still i think the 93 asc version of wheeler was the most eye appealing build to step foot on the stage in the past 30 years.
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He placed 2nd to Yates again that year. The other was that debacle in 1994, where Yates looked like garbage but still "won" with straight firsts.
Technically 3rd until Nasser pissed hot. easy to win with straight firsts considering the high & low scores are tossed out. Shawn had a outstanding physique he wasn't anywhere near the legend he pretends to be.
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In 1994, Levrone crushed Ray at the Olympia.. not even close. If anyone had beat Yates in 1994, it should have been Levrone
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Technically 3rd until Nasser pissed hot. easy to win with straight firsts considering the high & low scores are tossed out. Shawn had a outstanding physique he wasn't anywhere near the legend he pretends to be.
Nasser placed 3rd before the drug test results. That's how Ronnie Coleman got bumped from 7th to 6th, Paul Dillett hopped from 6th to 5th, Flex Wheeler went from 5th to 4th, and Kevin Levrone went from 4th to 3rd.
In 1994, Levrone crushed Ray at the Olympia.. not even close. If anyone had beat Yates in 1994, it should have been Levrone
Either way, Yates should have LOST in 1994. Wide waist, holding more water than the Hoover Dam, and half a right arm. NO WAY that gets straight firsts.
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I would have absolutely no problem with Levrone winning the 1994 Olympia
Levrone’s routine at the Olympia that year...
https://www.team-andro.com/tube/v/681/
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For all the talk about about questionable posing routines from folks like Kai Greene, notice how nobody gives Ronnie Coleman any grief for his 1994 Olympia routine.
https://www.team-andro.com/tube/v/893/
OR, his 2003 O routine....the same one where he was at his FREAKIEST....literally!!!
WOW! What a difference from 1994 (when he placed 15th) and 2003 (winning title #5).....at least 50 POUNDS!!
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Wheeler must have pissed off a lot of people on “top” they were never going to let him win the big one
Respectfully, how would you know they were never gonna let him win the big one? He never showed deserving to win the big one. His best showing was 93 and Yates was bigger and better in every way. 98? Judges must have filled out the round 1 score cards prior to pre judging. No way in hell in any way shape or form Flex was better than Ronnie at any time that day. At the end of the day, if Flex slid to 3rd in 98 it would have been less controversial than if he had won. Ronnie destroyed the field.
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Some would say 1998. Ronnie beat him by the skin of his teeth.
I'd say 1993. To me, Wheeler looked better than Yates. It was the shock factor of Yates' being 15 pounds bigger than the previous year. (or at least, as he put it, he didn't lose as much weight in 1993 as he did in 1992) that gave him the title, in my opinion.
On the score cards it was close? Because really Ronnie DESTROYED him. Ronnie was like granite. I go back and watch those shows and all I think is how overated Flex was. Fat ass and soft hams. Just a soft build in general. He never worked hard and came in totally peeled just relied on his amazing genetics. He wasn't close to Dorian either. He was prettier. But got buried if you go by judging criteria
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Wheeler was ahead of Coleman after the prejudging in 1998. That was a nip-and-tuck show. Up to that point, Wheeler would usually beat Coleman handily; whereas Coleman would upset Wheeler (i.e. 1996 Canada Pro cup, where it took a tie-breaker and Coleman won by ONE POINT).
Ronnie Coleman dropped the floor for a reason. Wheeler went into that show the heavy favorite and initially it looked to be his.
Coleman was not light years ahead of anybody that year. Again, Levrone beat him in 1998 and swept him in all those 1997 Grand Prix shows (except the last one).
The only reason Flex was ahead was he was a fav of the judges and it was supposed to be his show to win. As the show went on they couldn't deny Coleman was on another level. '98-99 Ronnie will never be matched
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Respectfully, how would you know they were never gonna let him win the big one? He never showed deserving to win the big one. His best showing was 93 and Yates was bigger and better in every way. 98? Judges must have filled out the round 1 score cards prior to pre judging. No way in hell in any way shape or form Flex was better than Ronnie at any time that day. At the end of the day, if Flex slid to 3rd in 98 it would have been less controversial than if he had won. Ronnie destroyed the field.
He was always one of the favs and at the time , 4x arnold champion and numerous wins at other shows, he was very popular
I doubt it. if they gave the win to flex in 98, no one would really care, it would be controversial. Just like kai losing to Phil, Jay losing to Ronnie in 01, etc….. been happening forever in a subjective “sport”
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The only reason Flex was ahead was he was a fav of the judges and it was supposed to be his show to win. As the show went on they couldn't deny Coleman was on another level. '98-99 Ronnie will never be matched
Maybe from 1999 onward, he was.
But, in 1998 he barely got by Wheeler and lost to Levrone earlier that year in San Francisco before tightening up and beating Levrone in Toronto, the NOC and, of course, the Olympia.
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On the score cards it was close? Because really Ronnie DESTROYED him. Ronnie was like granite. I go back and watch those shows and all I think is how overated Flex was. Fat ass and soft hams. Just a soft build in general. He never worked hard and came in totally peeled just relied on his amazing genetics. He wasn't close to Dorian either. He was prettier. But got buried if you go by judging criteria
His torso was very slim as well. He looked like a gnat next to Dorian and Ronnie.
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On the score cards it was close? Because really Ronnie DESTROYED him. Ronnie was like granite. I go back and watch those shows and all I think is how overated Flex was. Fat ass and soft hams. Just a soft build in general. He never worked hard and came in totally peeled just relied on his amazing genetics. He wasn't close to Dorian either. He was prettier. But got buried if you go by judging criteria
It was close. Ronnie beat Flex by three points. That's usually how it went since 1996. Flex would beat Ronnie decisively. Ronnie would squeak by Flex on occasion (he beat Flex by one point at the 1996 Canada Cup).
How can you say he didn't work hard? He placed 2nd at the O three times and won four ASC shows (especially in 1998; he looked unstoppable). Add to that, NOC, IronMan, Florida Pro, and a slew of other shows.
He won everything except the Olympia and he came within a whisker of doing that.
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His torso was very slim as well. He looked like a gnat next to Dorian and Ronnie.
Well he was always a super-ecto, wasn't he
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Yes, he was. Look at how thin he was before he started training. Even when he won the California on ESPN he was skinny.
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It was close. Ronnie beat Flex by three points. That's usually how it went since 1996. Flex would beat Ronnie decisively. Ronnie would squeak by Flex on occasion (he beat Flex by one point at the 1996 Canada Cup).
How can you say he didn't work hard? He placed 2nd at the O three times and won four ASC shows (especially in 1998; he looked unstoppable). Add to that, NOC, IronMan, Florida Pro, and a slew of other shows.
He won everything except the Olympia and he came within a whisker of doing that.
Him beating Ronnie pre '98 is meaningless. That was Ronnie before he mutated. They all but engraved his name on the Sandow for '98 before they even had the show. All he had to do was come in in shape. I didn't realize the show was that close on the score sheets so I was wrong there. But anyone who watched the show know he got smoked. Everyone did by Ronnie. Shredded and just a freak that we won't ever see anything like that again. Flex looked like his little brother in size without even at least being conditioned
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Him beating Ronnie pre '98 is meaningless. That was Ronnie before he mutated. They all but engraved his name on the Sandow for '98 before they even had the show. All he had to do was come in in shape. I didn't realize the show was that close on the score sheets so I was wrong there. But anyone who watched the show know he got smoked. Everyone did by Ronnie. Shredded and just a freak that we won't ever see anything like that again. Flex looked like his little brother in size without even at least being conditioned
Ronnie had already morphed to a degree. He looked great at NOC and Toronto. But, he did get beat by Kevin Levrone in San Francisco, prior to that.
That Olympia was truly up for grabs. Ronnie squeaked through and won it that night. He would smoke the competition in later Olympias. But not in 1998. After pre-judging, the smart money said Wheeler's coronation was merely a formality.
The crowd reaction told the story too. Many people thought Flex had it. There was utter shock/surprise when he was announced 2nd.
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Yes, he was. Look at how thin he was before he started training. Even when he won the California on ESPN he was skinny.
Absolutely - and I know it's been posted a thousand times, but it's always taking another look at this pic and noting just how Goddamn skinny he was - and would have been forever - without year after year of bio-identical supra-physiological hormone therapy gear...
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Crazy - must have doubled his bodyweight within a couple of years (oh, and drugs are just the finishing touch btw)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=674322.0;attach=1325168;image) (https://planetbodybuilding.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/flex-wheeler-6.jpg)
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All Weider supplements while applying the Weider principles to training.
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That's nuts about 600 grams of protein, I want to say it's not right but can't say for sure. Palumbo himself never ate 600 grams of protein. Really, that's a crazy amount. His baseline contest prep diet has been posted all over. Egg meals, one salmon meal, protein shakes I think, almost no carbs.
Bostin Loyd for whom Palumbo had been like a mentor said his prep diet, the amounts, didn't change once over 12 weeks. Cardio increased a little, T3 and clen increased progressively. Supposedly Palumbo doesn't like to touch the diet at all.
Palumbo thinks McDonalds quarter pounders are somehow very anabolic, contain some special type of salt :D
I've told this story many times here but I just think it was hilarious. Bob Chick was asked what he thought of Palumbo's diet, did he see anything wrong with it. Bob goes, "what's right about it?" :D
It was McDonalds a couple of times a day, Carbo fuel drinks and protein shakes.
I like the sound of that.
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Absolutely - and I know it's been posted a thousand times, but it's always taking another look at this pic and noting just how Goddamn skinny he was - and would have been forever - without year after year of bio-identical supra-physiological hormone therapy gear...
Notwithstanding that Flex is hardly "skinny", he'd just started training. What did you expect him to turn into a monster in a year or two?
Crazy - must have doubled his bodyweight within a couple of years (oh, and drugs are just the finishing touch btw)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=674322.0;attach=1325168;image) (https://planetbodybuilding.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/flex-wheeler-6.jpg)
There's at least a DECADE'S difference between those two pictures. So, just ignore the eating, the training, the sleeping.....all the other stuff.
All Flex did was inject steroids and POOF!!! Instant monster!! ::)
Notice how nobody compares Dorian Yates' high school pics to his Olympia form and claim he's "all drugs" or sarcastically claim that "drugs are just the finishing touch".
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His torso was very slim as well. He looked like a gnat next to Dorian and Ronnie.
Him beating Ronnie pre '98 is meaningless. That was Ronnie before he mutated. They all but engraved his name on the Sandow for '98 before they even had the show. All he had to do was come in in shape. I didn't realize the show was that close on the score sheets so I was wrong there. But anyone who watched the show know he got smoked. Everyone did by Ronnie. Shredded and just a freak that we won't ever see anything like that again. Flex looked like his little brother in size without even at least being conditioned
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/_mC1TEdZ4gks/Su22BjU2aqI/AAAAAAAABd4/Lcyb9ThQTLo/s400/1998-mr-olympia-238_20090830.JPG)
Gnat? Little brother? I don't think so.
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He looked very thin from the side. His torso was much thinner than Dorian or Ronnie or Levrone or Dillett or.............
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Notwithstanding that Flex is hardly "skinny", he'd just started training. What did you expect him to turn into a monster in a year or two?
He was eating grass fed beef (rinsed of course) and wala wala onions.
Obviously AAS only accounted for the last 5% or so.
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Notwithstanding that Flex is hardly "skinny", he'd just started training. What did you expect him to turn into a monster in a year or two?
There's at least a DECADE'S difference between those two pictures. So, just ignore the eating, the training, the sleeping.....all the other stuff.
All Flex did was inject steroids and POOF!!! Instant monster!! ::)
Notice how nobody compares Dorian Yates' high school pics to his Olympia form and claim he's "all drugs" or sarcastically claim that "drugs are just the finishing touch".
a. That wasn't my point - I meant that he started off very skinny, was all - didn't criticise him in any way (or mention a time frame)
b. I would say the same for Dorian actually - they are all all drugs - again, not a criticism, I love drugs!
Y so salty, Bro? Need a hug? ;D
Edit: how about this pic of Dorian when he was younger compared to his Olympia days..? "Just the finishing touch" ;)