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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: ether on May 12, 2006, 10:37:17 AM
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I was flipping through the new MD at the local bookstore and came accross and interview with Ronnie C.
He was asked how he kept his gut under control for this past olympia and he said that it was thanks to weider (Joe) advice to wear his weight belt for every excercise and to keep his stomach tight all day, ie. while driving, watching tv etc....
Obviously we all know he still had a pretty huge gut this time around, but I thought that it was significantly improved from the last time. Can the weight belt really make that big of a difference?
Also he said that he cut back his off season calories so that he wouldn't get as fat, but, ended up weighing more than the previous year with less fat and a calorie reduced diet.
HOW THE FUCC IS THAT POSSIBLE???????? ............ Unless he upped the Insulin, GH.
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Obviously we all know he still had a pretty huge gut this time around, but I thought that it was significantly improved from the last time. Can the weight belt really make that big of a difference?
the reason for the distended abdomen is one of two things: GH causing the internal organs to grow, or insulin causing an increase in fat between the organs within the abdomen. once the organs grow, not much you can do to make them small again. I wonder if stopping the insulin allows the intra abdominal fat to dissipate.
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I pondered the gut question before (whether insulin or GH was mostly to blame), and even posted it one a few message boards with no real answers. It was just recently I found at least an answer - GH. I have a friend at the gym who takes just about everything, he wants to turn pro. I always assumed he did slin, but I found our recently he doesn’t. He's got a huge gut, to where it sticks out past his chest, and very low bodyfat. He's been doing GH for over 2 years straight.
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I think the intestinal growth thing is BS. They may grow a little, but not enough to be the source of massive guts.
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I'm actually not sure if GH is to blame for Ronnies gut, or if he is just bloated because he is carrying more muscle than he should to remain huge without a pleasant waist and abs.
I still can't believe that you can win a bodybuilding contest with a gut!
Say what you want about levrone but, he never was caught with his gut hanging out alla Ronnie or Yates on stage.
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I'm actually not sure if GH is to blame for Ronnies gut, or if he is just bloated because he is carrying more muscle than he should to remain huge with a pleasant waist and abs.
I still can't believe that you can with a bodybuilding contest with a gut!
Say what you want about levrone but, he never was caught with his gut hanging out alla Ronnie or Yates on stage.
That's true, but big guts imply power so they shouldn't be marked down as much as a weak bodypart.
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I think the intestinal growth thing is BS. They may grow a little, but not enough to be the source of massive guts.
Wrong, they grow big time with heavy usage of GH, just like the jaw. Where did you think all the guts came from?
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it kind of grosses me out if you think about it, that has to be so unhealthy, all the gH makes the sport look even worse...sorry, not really a sport but you know what I mean
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GH would be great if they didn't abuse it. In low doses, it's fantastic with no noticable sides. The problem is, these guys are taking massive dosages because they can since it doesn't kill them (yet). I've love to know the dosage of an average pro, anybody know?
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Wrong, they grow big time with heavy usage of GH, just like the jaw. Where did you think all the guts came from?
People had guts before gh and I have a gut and I have never used it. They used to be called roid guts before gh use took off. Don't forget that.
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People had guts before gh and I have a gut and I have never used it. They used to be called roid guts before gh use took off. Don't forget that.
Ok, whatever. Think what you want to think.
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People had guts before gh and I have a gut and I have never used it. They used to be called roid guts before gh use took off. Don't forget that.
Show me a pic of a pro or top amateur bodybuilder with a gut prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Bodybuilders used massive amounts of steroids back then, but the "roid gut" didn't show up until they started using GH and insulin.
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MD did a very thorough article on this a couple months back. Based on what I read, Dingleberry and Mr. Fogarty both know what they're talking about so pay attention to what they say.
The only thing that surprised me in this month's issue of MD is that according to Dave Polumbo, Insulin is LEGAL in the US. He said you can get it at any pharmacy without a prescription. You have to ask for it becuase its usually refrigerated in back. The one bb use is called Humilin. Is this true????
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I hate gun control wacko's. 2nd Amendment, baby!! ;D
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People had guts before gh and I have a gut and I have never used it. They used to be called roid guts before gh use took off. Don't forget that.
Pro bodybuilding of 70's-80's ,steroids no gut
mid 90's and today steroids plus GH big gut.
Wake up
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lets not only blame GH .. it may be as simple as eatin massive amounts of food year round !
modern bodybuilders have to attain rediculous bodyweight to be competitive .. especially in the off season .. and thats a modern phenomena especially since dorian.
when i bulk my gut goes massive .. and i wouldnt dream of touchin GH ... and it stays massive ... past my chest with bulgin obliques. and thats on a scrawny 4500 to 5000 cal per day diet. these f'uckers pig out on obscene amounts of food and protein which must bloat them out of all proportion.
i think if bodybuilders were allowed to compete at the sane sizes of 70s and 80s they wouldnt have to be gluttons .. i dont care how much you ripp up .. when your gut is forced out like that from internal ingestation of massive diets .. it just dont go back down .. it is infact trained outwards.
hope this helps ...
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Show me a pic of a pro or top amateur bodybuilder with a gut prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Bodybuilders used massive amounts of steroids back then, but the "roid gut" didn't show up until they started using GH and insulin.
It's well known that Mentzer had a gut in the 1979 Mr. Olympia. ::) If gh causes guts then why do I have one? ::)
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Show me a pic of a pro or top amateur bodybuilder with a gut prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Bodybuilders used massive amounts of steroids back then, but the "roid gut" didn't show up until they started using GH and insulin.
I think there wasnt such a focus on eating like a large family back then. Guys these days pack away so much food is it any wonder hey have big guts offseason? Even around contest time they are so large they are still packing away quite a few meals a day. Thats going to have an effect on the size of someones gut.
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MD did a very thorough article on this a couple months back. Based on what I read, Dingleberry and Mr. Fogarty both know what they're talking about so pay attention to what they say.
The only thing that surprised me in this month's issue of MD is that according to Dave Polumbo, Insulin is LEGAL in the US. He said you can get it at any pharmacy without a prescription. You have to ask for it becuase its usually refrigerated in back. The one bb use is called Humilin. Is this true????
Yeah, I couldn't believe that when I read it.
I am a physician in Canada, i'm not certain about the US, but in Canada for certain insulin is available only by prescription....thank god.
Taking too much would certainly result in very low blood glucose, hypoglycemic shock and at the extreme death.
Humulin (or Humalog) is the very fast acting Insulin (which can be taken immediately prior to meals) rather than long lasting insulin like NPH or Lente.
I couldn't believe that Palumbo was giving this advice to readers (along with dosages for GH) I personally was insulted and disgusted by this, and the editors of this magazine should be ashamed, and held personally accountable for any person who follows this felon's advice and ends up causing serious damage to their lives and health.
That being said, i have to agree with prime and say that the massive amounts of food these "athletes" consume results in the distention we are seeing now, in addition to the GH, Roids and slin.
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Ronnie and any other BBer with gut control issues should be using "'cat-backs" and other exercises like them where you squeeze the belly button toward the spine and squeeze...
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lets not only blame GH .. it may be as simple as eatin massive amounts of food year round !
modern bodybuilders have to attain rediculous bodyweight to be competitive .. especially in the off season .. and thats a modern phenomena especially since dorian.
when i bulk my gut goes massive .. and i wouldnt dream of touchin GH ... and it stays massive ... past my chest with bulgin obliques. and thats on a scrawny 4500 to 5000 cal per day diet. these f'uckers pig out on obscene amounts of food and protein which must bloat them out of all proportion.
i think if bodybuilders were allowed to compete at the sane sizes of 70s and 80s they wouldnt have to be gluttons .. i dont care how much you ripp up .. when your gut is forced out like that from internal ingestation of massive diets .. it just dont go back down .. it is infact trained outwards.
hope this helps ...
Eat all you want :fat belly
Use GH : huge muscular belly
I hope you can see "something there"
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It's well known that Mentzer had a gut in the 1979 Mr. Olympia.
No, it is not well known. Show me a pic where he has a distended abdomen similar to the pros today.
If gh causes guts then why do I have one?
Are you a competition bodybuilder with 3% bodyfat? If not, then you're simply fat. Or perhaps you're on meds that cause an increase in intra abdominal fat.
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Yeah... I don't think guts like those today existed prior to the 1990s....
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MD did a very thorough article on this a couple months back. Based on what I read, Dingleberry and Mr. Fogarty both know what they're talking about so pay attention to what they say.
The only thing that surprised me in this month's issue of MD is that according to Dave Polumbo, Insulin is LEGAL in the US. He said you can get it at any pharmacy without a prescription. You have to ask for it becuase its usually refrigerated in back. The one bb use is called Humilin. Is this true????
Yes, anyone can buy humilin but not humalog (see below for differences)
I am a physician in Canada, i'm not certain about the US, but in Canada for certain insulin is available only by prescription....thank god.
As an American I would need a script to buy Humalog (lasts 2 hours, preferred since it’s out of the system sooner) in the US, but I could order it from a Canadian pharmacy all day long. A ton of people do.
Humulin (lasts 4 hours) is available to anyone without a script in the US.
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Yes, anyone can buy humilin but not humalog (see below for differences)
As an American I would need a script to buy Humalog (lasts 2 hours, preferred since it’s out of the system sooner) in the US, but I could order it from a Canadian pharmacy all day long. A ton of people do.
Humulin (lasts 4 hours) is available to anyone without a script in the US.
You're correct. Humalog lasts 4 hours, but its' peak action is 30 minutes after injection. Therefore it is used as a pre prandial insulin (rapid acting, similar to Lispro and Regular Toronto). Longer formulations such as Lente and NPH have their peak after about 8 hours and last for over 14 hours.
As for being able to get Insulin from canadian pharmacies all day long, i'm not sure about that, but it sounds highly embelished. Typically canadian pharmacies will only ship drugs to the US if the prescriptions have been co-signed by a canadian physician.
It's doubtfull the college would approve of co-signing insulin scripts.
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As for being able to get Insulin from canadian pharmacies all day long, i'm not sure about that, but it sounds highly embelished. Typically canadian pharmacies will only ship drugs to the US if the prescriptions have been co-signed by a canadian physician.
It's true, no embellishment here. Well, a little with the "all day long" statement. The only limitation is you can only buy so much per any given time period. I don’t know the specifics, but it’s enough to keep a real diabetic satisfied, and that's more than a body builder would use.
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That's crazy.
I mean, I had heard long time ago that they were using insulin....but....just seems a little over the top.
That could very well explain why they are getting the guts, build up of adipose tissue in the abdomenal viscera.....that is disgusting man.
I wonder if those "weird lumps" we see on bb'ers is their insulin injection sites, they are known to develop scar tissue after repeated injection, of course could also be the gear injection sites.
Man, I would love to see an abdominal CT of Ronnie Coleman or Jay Cutler, just to see how much fat lines their intestines.....
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I wonder if those "weird lumps" we see on bb'ers is their insulin injection sites, they are known to develop scar tissue after repeated injection, of course could also be the gear injection sites.
no. those are fatty tumors that we all have that are just visible on these guys when they have so little fat under the skin
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Visceral fat is the first fat to go on a diet. Maybe this changes in enhanced athletes to a degree but I doubt there is much visceral fat in a contest ready bodybuilder.
The main reason for the gut in contest shape is simple water retention. Why do you think they are carb loading with Vitargo, and some according to rumors use glucose drips? Because that way you don't pull as much water into the intestines. The high GH doses can cause massive water retention in the area.
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No, it is not well known. Show me a pic where he has a distended abdomen similar to the pros today.
Are you a competition bodybuilder with 3% bodyfat? If not, then you're simply fat. Or perhaps you're on meds that cause an increase in intra abdominal fat.
It is pretty well known to anyone familiar with that era of bodybuilding. Perhaps you are more of an expert on different eras. And no, I'm not fat ::) I have permanent abs, but I do get distention which I can suck back into abs when I want. Am I on gh? ::)
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but I do get distention which I can suck back into abs when I want. Am I on gh? ::)
the guys with GH gut can't suck it in if their life depended on it.
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its the heavy and excessive leg training that builds the guts...im telling you. ;D
it pushes out the abdominal wall.....the belt just helps keep it in. plus, he had said that he started his diet earlier and sacrificed some extra pounds of musscle to come in with a tiny gut.
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the guys with GH gut can't suck it in if their life depended on it.
Ronnie sure as hell can suck his in and so can Jay.
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These are still the best pictures I know of
(http://www.bbcenter.sk/images/gallery/muzi/greg_kovacs/greg_kovac_11.jpg)
(http://www.bbcenter.sk/images/gallery/muzi/greg_kovacs/greg_kovac_10.jpg)
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Ronnie sure as hell can suck his in and so can Jay.
Jay works on his moreso than Ronnie. But granted when they both relax their abs, their guts show. :'(
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Jay works on his moreso than Ronnie. But granted when they both relax their abs, their guts show. :'(
Jay's is more wide than anything. Ronnie's just flies straight out ;D
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Jay's is more wide than anything. Ronnie's just flies straight out ;D
Ronnie's does seem to almost jump at you.
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Ronnie's does seem to almost jump at you.
I'd like to know what's in there, but I'm not sure that Ronnie even knows ;D
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lets not only blame GH .. it may be as simple as eatin massive amounts of food year round !
modern bodybuilders have to attain rediculous bodyweight to be competitive .. especially in the off season .. and thats a modern phenomena especially since dorian.
when i bulk my gut goes massive .. and i wouldnt dream of touchin GH ... and it stays massive ... past my chest with bulgin obliques. and thats on a scrawny 4500 to 5000 cal per day diet. these f'uckers pig out on obscene amounts of food and protein which must bloat them out of all proportion.
i think if bodybuilders were allowed to compete at the sane sizes of 70s and 80s they wouldnt have to be gluttons .. i dont care how much you ripp up .. when your gut is forced out like that from internal ingestation of massive diets .. it just dont go back down .. it is infact trained outwards.
hope this helps ...
Exactly look at the diets of 70's and 80's bodybuilders their diets were smaller and not as many calories at once as today or over eating periods, dont try to kid yourself they they did not use gh,lol.
Dan no telling how many pounds of undigested food is in some of the bodybuilders today, also take a look at the protein shakes of today verse then and total calories,
Then....rheo blairs protein 25 grams of protein, zero carbs around 15 grams of fat coming from whipping cream.
Then later milk protein...casein protein...then, protein mixes...then whey, most bodybuilders made their own, shakes with powder milk ice cream and milk, not taking it over 500 calories.
Today....you have bodybuilders piling in over 1500 calorie shakes, walking around like they are fixing to pop or.and throw up.
Food has alot to do with it back then a word called moderation actually had a meaning and was applied, today more is better,so with it comes guts alot of them.
no way can you put over 250 pounds on a person low bodyfat also and them not have some sort of "protrusion"
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These are still the best pictures I know of
(http://www.bbcenter.sk/images/gallery/muzi/greg_kovacs/greg_kovac_11.jpg)
(http://www.bbcenter.sk/images/gallery/muzi/greg_kovacs/greg_kovac_10.jpg)
Monster "Athlete"
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I'd like to know what's in there, but I'm not sure that Ronnie even knows ;D
Live Chickens! :o
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Ronnie sure as hell can suck his in and so can Jay.
they could not do a vacuum pose. that was a pretty standard pose back in the day
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they could not do a vacuum pose. that was a pretty standard pose back in the day
Jay can do a semi-vacuum :-\. Ronnie can't do anything close to a vacuum. :'(
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Jay can do a semi-vacuum :-\. Ronnie can't do anything close to a vacuum. :'(
Bob has a mean vacuum. ;D
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Exactly look at the diets of 70's and 80's bodybuilders their diets were smaller and not as many calories at once as today or over eating periods,
all you have to do is read the old magazines to see that the top bodybuilders ate massive amounts of food
dont try to kid yourself they they did not use gh,lol.
you might have been able to get a few dozen IUs back in the early 1980s, but it was prohibitively expensive. one short course of GH is not going to cause a GH gut. it wasn't until synthetic rHGH became available in the late 1980s that bodybuilders could get it in quantity. And it wasn't until the early 1990s that they started using large doses with insulin. and that's when GH gut started appearing
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all you have to do is read the old magazines to see that the top bodybuilders ate massive amounts of food
you might have been able to get a few dozen IUs back in the early 1980s, but it was prohibitively expensive. one short course of GH is not going to cause a GH gut. it wasn't until synthetic rHGH became available in the late 1980s that bodybuilders could get it in quantity. And it wasn't until the early 1990s that they started using large doses with insulin. and that's when GH gut started appearing
Mike Mentzer had a gh gut at the 1979 Mr. Olympia ::)
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Mike Mentzer had a gh gut at the 1979 Mr. Olympia ::)
as I said before, prove it. show a pic
that you claim that you have a gh gut but have never used gh (so therefore gh mustn't cause gh gut) indicates that you can't even tell the difference between a relaxed stomach, a protruding stomach, and a distended stomach.
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as I said before, prove it. show a pic
that you claim that you have a gh gut but have never used gh (so therefore gh mustn't cause gh gut) indicates that you can't even tell the difference between a relaxed stomach, a protruding stomach, and a distended stomach.
I don't think he was being serious, I think he was being sarcastic while making a point as well. Try reading into it a bit more.
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as I said before, prove it. show a pic
that you claim that you have a gh gut but have never used gh (so therefore gh mustn't cause gh gut) indicates that you can't even tell the difference between a relaxed stomach, a protruding stomach, and a distended stomach.
I'm not saying that gh can't cause some gut mass increases, I'm saying that it's not the only thing. I'm serious about Mentzer having the gut. That is one of the things Arnold argued with Mentzer about at the 1980 Mr. Olympia. I'm not going to post a pic. You can read about it yourself.
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Mike Mentzer had a gh gut at the 1979 Mr. Olympia ::)
And then it totally disappeared at the 80 olympia ::)
I don't remember the story about mentzer in 79 but his gut problem can't be compared with the kind the pros experience today.
Didn't he over eat after the prejudging or something like that?
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And then it totally disappeared at the 80 olympia ::)
I don't remember the story about mentzer in 79 but his gut problem can't be compared with the kind the pros experience today.
Didn't he over eat after the prejudging or something like that?
It didn't disappear in 1980, he just held it in or ate differently. I think he did overeat and it caused the gut. I don't know how bad it was compared to today's guts, though.
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maybe ronnie doesn't like ab exercises :-\
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I'm serious about Mentzer having the gut. ... I'm not going to post a pic. You can read about it yourself.
You didn't say he had a gut. On multiple occasions you said he had a gh gut, implying just like bodybuilders do today. He did not. Since you're making the claim it's up to you to provide evidence. Your position is that bodybuilders have always had bloated stomachs, so therefore it is not a recent phenomena due to the current drug regime. There is no evidence to support your claim. There are no photos of top bodybuilders in competition shape with bloated stomachs prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Now most top bodybuilders have bloated stomachs of varying degress.
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mti/mti072.jpg) 1978
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mb/mb7903.jpg) 1979
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mmi/mmi020.jpg) 1980
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/im/im4101.jpg) 1981
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You didn't say he had a gut. On multiple occasions you said he had a gh gut, implying just like bodybuilders do today. He did not. Since you're making the claim it's up to you to provide evidence. Your position is that bodybuilders have always had bloated stomachs, so therefore it is not a recent phenomena due to the current drug regime. There is no evidence to support your claim. There are no photos of top bodybuilders in competition shape with bloated stomachs prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Now most top bodybuilders have bloated stomachs of varying degress.
You may not have seen the evidence, but it certainly exists. Guts are not a new thing. Haven't you heard of roid gut? You claimed that only modern bodybuilders had a gut. The burden of proof is on you to show that it's true.
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Tim, give it up man. Lucius will argue until the sun goes down, that's why I said "whatever" in my post. I and everyone else who knows about gear knows your right.
I bet he'd even argue a performance drug question with a professional bodybuilder ??? ::)
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You didn't say he had a gut. On multiple occasions you said he had a gh gut, implying just like bodybuilders do today. He did not. Since you're making the claim it's up to you to provide evidence. Your position is that bodybuilders have always had bloated stomachs, so therefore it is not a recent phenomena due to the current drug regime. There is no evidence to support your claim. There are no photos of top bodybuilders in competition shape with bloated stomachs prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Now most top bodybuilders have bloated stomachs of varying degress.
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mti/mti072.jpg) 1978
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mb/mb7903.jpg) 1979
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mmi/mmi020.jpg) 1980
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/im/im4101.jpg) 1981
I can hold in my gut, too ::)
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You didn't say he had a gut. On multiple occasions you said he had a gh gut, implying just like bodybuilders do today. He did not. Since you're making the claim it's up to you to provide evidence. Your position is that bodybuilders have always had bloated stomachs, so therefore it is not a recent phenomena due to the current drug regime. There is no evidence to support your claim. There are no photos of top bodybuilders in competition shape with bloated stomachs prior to the late 1980s or early 1990s. Now most top bodybuilders have bloated stomachs of varying degress.
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mti/mti072.jpg) 1978
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mb/mb7903.jpg) 1979
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/mmi/mmi020.jpg) 1980
(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/im/im4101.jpg) 1981
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Tim, give it up man. Lucius will argue until the sun goes down, that's why I said "whatever" in my post. I and everyone else who knows about gear knows your right.
I bet he'd even argue a performance drug question with a professional bodybuilder ??? ::)
I would because I know more about this stuff than a lot of pros.
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You may not have seen the evidence, but it certainly exists. Guts are not a new thing. Haven't you heard of roid gut?
roid gut was due to gh. like most things regarding performance enhancing drugs, it was not common knowledge that bodybuilders were using gh and insulin until about 10 years after the fact.
You claimed that only modern bodybuilders had a gut. The burden of proof is on you to show that it's true.
I can show you thousands of photos of bodybuilders (I suggest you start with the magazine covers at my website (http://musclememory.com)) from the pre gh era. all you got to do is find one to prove me wrong
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I can hold in my gut, too ::)
that's because you don't have gh gut
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roid gut was due to gh. like most things regarding performance enhancing drugs, it was not common knowledge that bodybuilders were using gh and insulin until about 10 years after the fact.
I can show you thousands of photos of bodybuilders (I suggest you start with the magazine covers at my website (http://musclememory.com)) from the pre gh era. all you got to do is find one to prove me wrong
And how many posts would I have to give up making while doing that? Unless you are calling Arnold a liar, I suggest that you admit that Mentzer had a gut. This is your last chance. ;D
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that's because you don't have gh gut
Maybe a number of pros with guts don't have gh guts. That's what I'm saying. gh isn't the only thing that can cause a gut.
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And how many posts would I have to give up making while doing that? Unless you are calling Arnold a liar, I suggest that you admit that Mentzer had a gut. This is your last chance. ;D
Don't start smiling now. I suggest you find some evidence to back up your claim since you know more about performance drugs than many pro's. ::)
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Unless you are calling Arnold a liar
I didn't vote for him.
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I'll concede that Mentzer had no permanent gut of any kind, but that's not what I said in the first place. I said he showed up to a contest with a gut, a.k.a. distended stomach.
And yes, I do know more about drugs than many pros. I've been reading about them on message boards for years. ::)
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I'll concede that Mentzer had no permanent gut of any kind, but that's not what I said in the first place. I said he showed up to a contest with a gut, a.k.a. distended stomach.
And yes, I do know more about drugs than many pros. I've been reading about them on message boards for years. ::)
LOL. Yeah.
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Fine. I'm just some dumb loser who lives in his parents' basement. I'm 160 pounds and weak and pathetic :-[ Is that what you wanted to hear? :-\
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Fine. I'm just some dumb loser who lives in his parents' basement. I'm 160 pounds and weak and pathetic :-[ Is that what you wanted to hear? :-\
No, not at all. Reading about things on the Internet doesn't make you an expert, living a situation makes you an expert. I just suggest that you don't argue points that you're not an expert on when you're clearly arguing against an expert, or at least someone who has more real life experience with the subject at hand.
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No, not at all. Reading about things on the Internet doesn't make you an expert, living a situation makes you an expert. I just suggest that you don't argue points that your not an expert on when you're clearly arguing against an expert, or at least someone who has more real life experience with the subject at hand.
I get your point, but I don't think anyone has conducted enough studies to know what's really going on with bodybuilders. After all, Dorian's gut is completely gone now, which shouldn't be the case if he had permanently enlarged intestines.
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After all, Dorian's gut is completely gone now, which shouldn't be the case if he had permanently enlarged intestines.
which means, once again, you really don't know what you're talking about.
if "gh gut" is due to the growth of internal organs, normal catabolic activity would reduce their size over time, but it would take a long time
if "gh gut" is due to intra abdominal fat, fat between the organs withing the abdomen, due to insulin sensitivity, then that could certainly dissipate once you stop using the insulin, but again, it would take a long time
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I get your point, but I don't think anyone has conducted enough studies to know what's really going on with bodybuilders. After all, Dorian's gut is completely gone now, which shouldn't be the case if he had permanently enlarged intestines.
Oh really?
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And yes, I do know more about drugs than many pros. I've been reading about them on message boards for years.
turn off the computer and go out and live life
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which means, once again, you really don't know what you're talking about.
if "gh gut" is due to the growth of internal organs, normal catabolic activity would reduce their size over time, but it would take a long time
if "gh gut" is due to intra abdominal fat, fat between the organs withing the abdomen, due to insulin sensitivity, then that could certainly dissipate once you stop using the insulin, but again, it would take a long time
The loss in size of the guts happens as soon as the bodies shrink down. It doesn't take a long time. You don't know what you are talking about. You're about as credible as a Muscletech scientist. ;D
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Oh really?
That's not a gh gut ::) It's just an overdeveloped abdomen. ::)
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turn off the computer and go out and live life
I live life all the time, Mr. Expert ::)
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That's not a gh gut ::) It's just an overdeveloped abdomen. ::)
No, that's you getting owned so hard you're posting delusional statements.
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No, that's you getting owned so hard you're posting delusional statements.
It looks flat to me. I'll admit that it does look weird though. But it doesn't stick out at all. We would have to have more than a picture to tell.
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which means, once again, you really don't know what you're talking about.
if "gh gut" is due to the growth of internal organs, normal catabolic activity would reduce their size over time, but it would take a long time
if "gh gut" is due to intra abdominal fat, fat between the organs withing the abdomen, due to insulin sensitivity, then that could certainly dissipate once you stop using the insulin, but again, it would take a long time
You sound very knowledgeable in this area, however, how exactly does Growth Hormone cause the internal organs to grow? and where have you gleaned this information from?
I am aware of several of the adverse effects of growth hormone (albeit only in Acromegaly), but, I was not aware that organomegaly was one of them.
I'm not saying you are wrong, just wondering where you are getting your sources. I did a brief medline search and there was no journal articles discussing this matter.....obviously something is going on, just curious how you know?
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I didn't vote for him.
ill say it once, ill say it again. im hardly a republican, but to associate yourself with the democratic party you must be mentally retarded.
quite telling that you didnt vote for him. :D
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You sound very knowledgeable in this area, however, how exactly does Growth Hormone cause the internal organs to grow? and where have you gleaned this information from?
I am aware of several of the adverse effects of growth hormone (albeit only in Acromegaly), but, I was not aware that organomegaly was one of them.
I'm not saying you are wrong, just wondering where you are getting your sources. I did a brief medline search and there was no journal articles discussing this matter.....obviously something is going on, just curious how you know?
Great post. I'm very skeptical about some of the armchair "research" that is done on this site. I'd like to hear from some experts about these matters.
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Here's a good article explaining what Tim and I have been talking about...
"I remember the physiques of the past, Arnold, Bob Birdsong, Franco Columbo, Bob Paris and Frank Zane achieved this dynamic look. Darin Lannaghan, Bill Davey and Stan McQuay have produced this look in modern day bodybuilding though they may never be seen at the Arnold Classic Competition.
So What's Changed?
In mid 80's, Human Growth Hormone (HGH) and Insulin became popular drugs with professional bodybuilders. The net result, with these top level competitors, is the "Roid Gut". Now days, we have bodybuilders sporting a 40-46" waists. I am guessing, of course, since no competitor would dare share the mammoth size of their waistlines. If they did, I would bet they would shave the number down an inch or two. Unfortunately, the Roid Gut has a repulsive appearance contrary to the original intent of the sport. When Jay Cutler in his early years hit national prominence, his youthful physique still had the small waist. Today, Jay's waist is absolutely gross. Sure he may weighs 270+ lbs, but also he sports a waist line of a sumo wrestler. Most of the top bodybuilders, Ronnie Coleman, Dorian Yates and Craig Titus, all exhibit this similar phenomenon. These competitors are simply meeting the expectation of what the judges are condoning and encouraging by accepting this look at as the "champion" physique.
I am writing this article to discourage the use of these drugs. They are sucking the lifeblood out of the Sport, destroying the potential aesthetics of the physique, and taking the bodybuilding back to the freak show era of the past. THIS SHOULD NOT BE!
HGH, "Huge Gut Hormone?"
Okay so what does HGH do to the body? In a normal person, HGH is produced by the body and causes the normal body growth process. The HGH drug was originally developed for children that exhibited stunted growth and were found to have a low production of this hormone. Doctors would administer HGH in small amounts to stimulate a normal growth pattern.
In a few people, HGH production is overactive (from birth) it can also create person of gigantic proportions. Andre the Giant had this condition. Robert Wadlow was another and he grew to be 7'11". He had many health problems and died at a very early age.
If HGH is administered to an adult, muscle growth restarts. HGH is very different than steroids. HGH causes production of new cells. Steroids cause only the enlargement of existing cells. The new cell growth seems to target only with the soft tissues and rarely skeletal system. Unfortunately, not only are the muscles cells multiplying but so are the internal muscles like the intestines and heart. Furthermore, organs, like the liver, kidneys and pancreas are growing too. When the growth of these internal muscles and organs occur in a fixed chest cavity, there is only one direction for this extra mass to go and that is out the abdominal area. Starting to get the picture?
Insulin's Additive Affect
Now what is insulin's affect on the body? Insulin is a super steroid that funnels the nutrients and sugar into muscle. When combined with hard workouts, recovery is very quick. Properly taken, it drives cell growth better than any other steroid. However if you screw up in taking insulin at the wrong time or dosage, you can throw yourself into insulin shock and die. Also long term use can make you a diabetic, a condition that shortens life. When Insulin is combined with HGH, the muscles are set to make significant gains.
The downside of insulin is that it is also active in creating the storage of fat in the body in the event of starvation. These fat deposits are stored internally to body and not on the exterior muscles. This is wonderful for the bodybuilder's appearance but not for this health. These fat deposits called visceral fat are found around the internal organs of the liver, pancreas, heart and kidneys. Couple this additional weight with growth of the internal muscles and organs and you have enough extra mass to create a really protruding Roid Gut."
http://ezinearticles.com/?Bodybuilding-and-Steriods---Roid-Gut-the-End-of-the-Aesthetic-Physique&id=138050 (http://ezinearticles.com/?Bodybuilding-and-Steriods---Roid-Gut-the-End-of-the-Aesthetic-Physique&id=138050)
Another article -
"o what is GH useful for? Well first of all its effects on reducing body-fat have been well-documented. Daily doses of 3 to 6 IU injected subcutaneous have actually been shown to spot reduce body-fat mass and have, at least for some athletes, proven invaluable in contest preparation time. This dose, for short periods of time, may be somewhat affordable to a truly dedicated athlete. But one can still wonder if it is really worth it. GH has also been shown to elicit extremely positive effects on erythropoeisis3, the manufacture of red blood cells. The administration of GH in older athletes with a strong decline in GH levels has shown a severe improvement in endurance. Since levels of GH decline by half every decade, a person of 60 has roughly 15-20% of the GH he had at age twenty. So HGH is especially beneficial to older athletes regarding the effects on endurance. But just how effective superdosing HGH in younger top athletes is, no one really knows. It would be virtually undetectable as well, so no doubt this has been experimented with.
Now in regards to muscle mass, I've yet to see anything prove the contrary of what the studies I provided claimed. I've not seen HGH increase muscle mass at all. Then again, I've never seen anyone use 10-12 IU per day the way some top level professionals do. Some claim that HGH can cause hyperplasia rather than hypertrophy. Hypertrophy is the growth of muscle cells, hyperplasia is the division and thus multiplication of cells. The theory goes that this does not increase size immediately, but in due time, due to the increase in the amount of cells, when they all do hypertrophy under the influence of steroids and insulin, the result will be much greater. Of course one side-effects of HGH is that it seems to increase the size of everything, including bones (which gives very ugly protrusions in people who have no growth left in them) and intestines (which explains the incredible increase in gut size of professional bodybuilders, despite low body-fat percentages). Now these side-effects alone would allow for several pounds increase. Stack that with 3 grams per week of testosterone and an equal dose of other steroids, some insulin, lots of rest and 8000 calorie diets, and I really don't see how much the HGH contributed in creating the muscle-weight these athletes have. I mean amateur and recreational users top 260 pounds, fairly lean using 1 gram of test and 1 gram of other drugs per week, maybe some insulin. It seems to me at least that HGH is a royal waste of money. Even if it did contribute 3 or 4 pounds, is it worth a habit of 150 dollars per day? Not in my book. "
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/cathuman.htm (http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/cathuman.htm)
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Thanks for posting those.
But what journals did they appear in? BB.com is not exactly the most reliable source.
I think 240 v. Chick is a prime example of that.