Matt, why bring up steroids in your review? Haven't you read what Phillipians 4:13 (http://bible.cc/philippians/4-13.htm) says? Why do you think SethKodiak is wearing that shirt? He wants people to know that Jesus is just like milk . . . but only better, b/c he's not produced by the hormone-tainted cows you refer to in your review. ;D
(http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/markdugdaledrivendvd/25.jpg)
Oh brother. "Got Jesus". Who would watch this crap?
Not only that, he is a great father, husband, business owner........and human being. He has set the bar VERY high.
Then again, like most Christians I'm sure Mark follows the parts of the bible he likes and conveniently ignores the others. But in that case why be a Christian to begin with?
No Christian should be a pro.
One word which probably describes Mark's feelings of himself: cognitive dissonance.
Good call. IMO, if a person chooses to engage in criminal (or loopholed from a doc with hi oh-so- low test levels), he and his camp should at the very least not be preachy to others. Haney was a strong Christian and sure, he used. But he wasn't on message boards banning people for disagreeing with a one-sided argument, as the Camp Rugdale did yesterday.what happened there, 240?
What she said about pornography causing erectile dysfunction was completely erroneous. I get the point though: pornography has the potential to distort a man's views on women and sex. Valid enough.
She obviously can't accept any debate about her religion. That goes back to living in a fantasty world like I said.
She seems nice though. Nice looking and nice demeanor. She might not be the most consistent debater out there but nobody is forcing me to debate with her so I don't care too much.
She did say in the DVD that at first she thought Mark just wanted to get in her pants (not in those words). I HATE when girls say this shit. It almost implies that they are doing men a favour by having sex with us and they don't want it themselves. ::) Meanwhile, according to her posts on mayhem, Christina is probably the horniest woman I've ever heard about and needs sex like air and water.
LOL! The bible is a nice touch.
Christians should not pick and choose what part of the bible they agree with. In fact, Mark himself said this in the DVD!! I have nothing against Mark's steroid use AT ALL. It's a personal choice, but I don't see how he can live with himself if it contradicts something he holds so dear.
Why was this pic deleted? It is a joke. Dugdale deleted my posts that I originally put in the thread. If not him one of the mods. They where not hateful at all.Where is the baseless attack? alot of people question Mark and 3g's hypocrisy. They are allowed to influence with religion but i cannot make a caricature?
Questions where raised about Mark using steroids yet being so religious. it was all asked in a respectful way by Matt and myself. Why was it deleted? Like I said Mark is a great guy and I am sure his wife is a great person also. But the hypocrisy should be called out!!!!!!!!!!!
what gives?
What gives anyway? ???
Our job on getbig is not to protect anyone who has a fragile ego!
I cannot STAND people who can't take the TRUTH. Say whatever you will about me, and I'll keep listening if it is constructive or reality based.
I said to a girl once that she bases her self esteem on what others think about her (utter truth) and she had a fit. I find it incredibly annoying when people can't take it as it is.
What disrespectful comments?
I think Mark is talking about truthful comments that Christina doesn't want to hear.
It's somewhat sad and very unrealistic if he expects that Christina will be living under a rock which is mayhem for the rest of her life.
Truth hurts.
I have respect for both of them as should be obvious from my review, but I sure as hell will not be a yes man.
you people do realize he met her at a bar while she was getting tanked by herself right?Actually she was with a group of friends and we were meeting them at the bar. She does enjoy a margarita ;) Any more questions?
Some people are like that. To be honest with you I simply cannot befriend people like that. I refuse to be forced to give people what they want to hear all the time. If you do something that I can't respect for one reason or another I WILL CALL YOU ON IT, and I couldn't care less if it's the last time we speak. End result: I befriend a lot of very confident and secure people and the insecure ones are not a part of my life.Actually Matt, I sent you a copy of my DVD to review, but I got a bargin... you reviewed my entire life, wife, kids, religion, drug use. So if I understand this correctly your "ace in the hole" is your personal interpretation of Romans? Come on dude, I bet you can do better than that.
Even if someone is an amazing person in every other area of life, that one flaw (not being able to accept constructive criticism) is enough for me not to want to associate with that person.
Mark should really come on here and engage in open minded discussion about this topic. What are we going to do - bite him? Well maybe some on here would LOL.
Thats what Im saying, Im with you Mark ..cant a lady enjoy a drinkShe's usually enjoying a good red wine... for all your religious rightwing nuts... wine is cool, Jesus knew how to throw a party... he turned the water into it as his first miracle. ;)
Actually Matt, I sent you a copy of my DVD to review, but I got a bargin... you reviewed my entire life, wife, kids, religion, drug use. So if I understand this correctly your "ace in the hole" is your personal interpretation of Romans? Come on dude, I bet you can do better than that.
you people do realize he met her at a bar while she was getting tanked by herself right?So he met his wife in a bar-really strange that ::) Maybe Power Rod needs to adopt the English 'pub' culture and stop getting hung up about such things.Where do you meet women-in church ;)
Mark, I didn't review your drug use, I just said it opposes the word of the bible. You aren't arguing this are you?Quote it brother Matt! I want to hear that one verse from Romans. Bring it home, brother, I'm almost feeeeeling the Holy Ghost now. :o
As for Christina, I said she can't accept debate.
Is anything I said untrue?
She's usually enjoying a good red wine... for all your religious rightwing nuts... wine is cool, Jesus knew how to throw a party... he turned the water into it as his first miracle. ;)
I love it how, once you say that your a Christian...automaticall y your being reviewed for sainthood.......
Hey Mark, do you see anything wrong with this picture?Oh hell... I can't see anything. All I got in my mind is a picture of you Naked4Jesus and I REALLY wish you would put your pants back on... it's grossing me out. >:(
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=79411.0;attach=85494;image)
One of the people are doing their own thing, tell me can you guess which one. Can you guess which one is doing there own thing, tell me can you guess which one... before my song is done?
Actually she was with a group of friends and we were meeting them at the bar. She does enjoy a margarita ;) Any more questions?
What's your thought on this... Who's the bigger hyprocrite? The guy who claims to be a Christian, but fails to meet the non-Christians biblical interpretation of the bible. They are drawing a line in the sand over a matter of conscious based on Paul's one verse in Romans, yet they think the book is a fraud. That's weird.... but amusing.
I have nothing against Mark either. Honestly his wife is also a great person. The hypocrisy is annoying tho!
Quote it brother Matt! I want to hear that one verse from Romans. Bring it home, brother, I'm almost feeeeeling the Holy Ghost now. :o
Are you kidding? She is constantly debating in the debate section of Mayhem... so much so it gives me a headache. Which ever of you fellas is Purge, she didn't ban you from the OT section either. However, I must have missed the debate class where when you feel cornered, change subjects and make charges against our opponents spouse... I must admit that was pretty cool. You should run for office. ;D
Oh hell... I can't see anything. All I got in my mind is a picture of you Naked4Jesus and I REALLY wish you would put your pants back on... it's grossing me out. >:(
that is NOT the story she said. she said she was getting sloppy at a bar "at the end of her road" and you "miarculously" showed up. Come on man.Damn are you a magnifying glass... i think your looking into too much....its not that deep ..let the man breath you dickheads he is a bb not the pope!!
that is NOT the story she said. she said she was getting sloppy at a bar "at the end of her road" and you "miarculously" showed up. Come on man.Get over it already, bro.... would you please? We all know you are envious (notice I didn't say jealous, 'cause jealousy's a sin and then I would be preaching) that you failed to show up before me. ;D I've seen your posts about what you want to do sexually with my wife. Move along, you will be less frustrated.
Bahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahaha! Don't be so Envious Mark, it's one of the seven deadly sins you know! Bahahahahahahahahahahaha!I thought it was jealousy, not envy? Well, you are naked4jesus, so you probably no better than me.
I thought it was jealousy, not envy? Well, you are naked4jesus, so you probably no better than me.
Mark, you probably have a prescription for your supplements, which would make them legal for you to use, but not ethical . . . your physician might justify his behavior somehow, but he is not living up to the code of conduct of the medical profession, and could get disbarred if someone felt the matter was worth pursuing. What he is doing--prescribing supplements you don't need--is illegal (ask Rush Limbaugh). So here's a verse for you:I personally don't think I am causing my doctor to sin. We can agree to disagree. I get plenty of emails from kids wanting drug advice and they all get the same response... seek the advice of a medical professional. When asked if they can turn pro naturally, I suggest the Team Universe. We all have options and choices to make in life... you are all free to make your own choice. I don't think you have seen my blood work that I get done every 4 months, so you can only make assumptions as to my health.
MT 18:7 "Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but woe to the man through whom they come! 8 If your hand or your foot causes you to sin cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. 9 And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.
Ask yourself, are you causing your physician to sin?
Do you feel that abusing supplements--you don't need them after all--makes you a good role model for all the young people who meet you? Remember what Christ said about those who cause the children to stumble?
You justify your choices, and proclaim your health, but are you willing to be responsible for someone who follows in your path w/o your particular resources? As a public figure, this verse should make you particularly wary.
MT 18:5 "And whoever welcomes a little child like this in my name welcomes me. 6 But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.
Yes Mark I do KNOW better so now you owe me a favor since I corrected your error. What do you think of my current trap development and what can I do to turn them into massive mounds of muscle?Please tell me that isn't you.
(http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=RETARDED+FACE/v=2/SID=w/l=IVS/;_ylt=A9G_RtsVaRBEpH8B1ZujzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTA4NDgyNWN0BHNlYwNwcm9m/SIG=12m6d1muk/EXP=1142012565/*-http%3A//img75.photobucket.com/albums/v229/Euniceloh/dadretarded.jpg)
Please tell me that isn't you.
Please tell me that isn't you.
a very eloquent response, Mark. Thanks. ::) ;DI'm not out to impress people... that would imply Pride.
I'm sure all the people who read this thread will be very impressed w you.
I thought the muslim fella was going to quote it, but he wants me to cut off my arm.
mark, if you go back and look at my post, I asked you some questions in a civil fashion. You respond to me in the manner of some thickheaded high school jock. What gives?You are right Al-Gebra. I was off base on that comment. I will go change it and apologize for not using your name. I personally disagree with your interpretation and logic with those pieces of scripture.
I personally disagree with your interpretation and logic with those pieces of scripture.
Are'nt you supposed to be a nice hardworking person, religious and respectful of everybody? ::)Are you judging me? Don't make me extend the right hand of fellowship to your jaw.
Get over it already, bro.... would you please? We all know you are envious (notice I didn't say jealous, 'cause jealousy's a sin and then I would be preaching) that you failed to show up before me. ;D I've seen your posts about what you want to do sexually with my wife. Move along, you will be less frustrated.I have no dog in this fight, but I thought this was rather amusing. Good job Mark! :D
I have no dog in this fight, but I thought this was rather amusing. Good job Mark! :DActually I have to get some work done... go back to photoshopping pics of Kamali or something. You see, this too is a joke... King has always been a cool dude to me.
OK, you all can continue bashing Mark or continuing on with whatever this entertaining thread is supposed to be about...
Are you judging me? Don't make me extend the right hand of fellowship to your jaw.
THIS IS A JOKE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Actually I have to get some work done... go back to photoshopping pics of Kamali or something. You see, this too is a joke... King has always been a cool dude to me.Ya' lost me, bro. I have nothing to do with photoshopping any Kamali pics. I was COMPLIMENTING you on your sense of humor in the above post, so I'm not sure why you're quoting me.
Bye, Bye
Ya' lost me, bro. I have nothing to do with photoshopping any Kamali pics. I was COMPLIMENTING you on your sense of humor in the above post, so I'm not sure why you're quoting me.Darn it! I peeked and now I'm a liar because I am back again. I promise I am leaving now. No, no I was just quoting you because you said we could go back to our banter, but I had to leave.
Darn it! I peeked and now I'm a liar because I am back again. I promise I am leaving now. No, no I was just quoting you because you said we could go back to our banter, but I had to leave.
Darn it! I peeked and now I'm a liar because I am back again. I promise I am leaving now. No, no I was just quoting you because you said we could go back to our banter, but I had to leave.OK, I understand.
Some people are like that. To be honest with you I simply cannot befriend people like that. I refuse to be forced to give people what they want to hear all the time. If you do something that I can't respect for one reason or another I WILL CALL YOU ON IT, and I couldn't care less if it's the last time we speak. End result: I befriend a lot of very confident and secure people and the insecure ones are not a part of my life.
Even if someone is an amazing person in every other area of life, that one flaw (not being able to accept constructive criticism) is enough for me not to want to associate with that person.
Mark should really come on here and engage in open minded discussion about this topic. What are we going to do - bite him? Well maybe some on here would LOL.
I thought it was very tacky that Matt inserted himself on whats supposed to be a reveiw of Mark Dugdales DVD , and Matt if you're so opposed to Mark taking steroids why would let him send you a DVD ? very unprofessional of you to insert your personal opinion into whats supposed to be an unbiased reveiw .Matt seems to have a very personal animosity towards all organized religion, and that's cool. Well, actually when Christianity is defamed it's NOT cool with me, but there is little to gain from arguing about it on a message board where anyone can spout an opinion. Matt obviously feels he is intellectually superior to the non-enlightened masses who believe in a higher power. There seems to be many atheists on these boards. To each his own, but don't let me hear you mutter, "Oh, Jesus", or "Oh, God" when you or someone else screws something up. That's your true conciousness manifesting itself that you try so hard to deny, you hypocrites. ;D
Do you see people on here making similar comments about Dexter or Johnnie O. Jackson who are not as openly religious as you are?
Please quote what I said which you think is inappropriate. I am not opposed to steroid use and I personally am not opposed to Mark taking them. I'm saying that by Mark's own standards I don't see how he can come to terms with using them. Is this clear?post of the century, best thing i've ever read on here.
If I said I was against alcohol and said this with a beer in my hand would you not question me?
I don't use laws or books to formulate my morality. I use the concept of "consent". If no unconsenting person is being hurt, there is no crime.
Let this be clear: I reviewed Mark's DVD and everything that came with it. Re-reading my review, I don't see anything particularly inappropriate about it.
As for religion, I am no atheist or no religious person for that matter. Is it safe to say that we as human beings don't have the answers to everything? That is not to say there is no higher power and it's not to say we can just invent one to make us feel more comfortable. It is safest for society to acknowledge that we don't know everything and use science and logic to try to fill in the blanks. Is this stance so unreasonable? If everyone felt as I did, years of bloodshed caused by religious wars and millions of dead would never have happened. I think my point of view on religious matters is a quite reasonable one.
Forgive me for using science and logic to formulate what I do in my life. Funny thing is, Christians use science and logic in every other area of their life - I just happen to take it a step further and also use it when speaking of the existence of deities. So am I really that much different from a religious person?
Thanks sarcasm. While disagreements are understandable I can't see anyone having any major qualms with anything I say on here.everything i've ever read that you've written either on here or in the BB video reviews has been accurate and brutally honest in terms of poundages lifted, food eaten, bodyweight, height, financial situation, etc.
I've had pros call me to discuss stuff I've written about them and I think it only takes a few minutes of speaking with me for them to understand I'm a reasonable person and not just here to hate.
I've seen pros really get roasted on here and in comparison, this one is mild.
I'm not jealous of you walking in first into that bar that night, Mark.LOL!!! You win, Power Rod. I can't compete with that. If you come to Seattle I will take you to Capital Hill and buy you a beer.
I have a boyfriend.
LOL!!! You win, Power Rod. I can't compete with that. If you come to Seattle I will take you to Capital Hill and buy you a beer.
My crystal ball says matt C will soon be reviewing a Muscle gallery title starring DigDug and powerRod.240, your posts are as predictable and as smelly as my bowel movements. :-X
Welcome back, Matt. Your review was on point, but some of your posts got a bit off track, but hey, I agree with you. When you put yourself out there and call yourself a Christian people are going to come after you. Jesus himself said, "They will hate you because of me." I'm cool with that. I might be a hyprocrite to some of you, but I would be a bigger one if I denied my own beliefs. I take exception to people saying I am preachy. You ask me what I believe and I will give you an answer, but I'm not out to stone anyone with scripture or "sell" Jesus. Everyone is free to make their own choices. Truth be told we are all extremely religious, yourself included Matt. I put my faith in Jesus, you put your faith in logic, reason and science.
240, your posts are as predictable and as smelly as my bowel movements. :-X
Mark, what if your girls were to ask about your drug use. Would you, just tell them that its okay because they're prescription? Does that justify it?
Welcome back, Matt. Your review was on point, but some of your posts got a bit off track, but hey, I agree with you. When you put yourself out there and call yourself a Christian people are going to come after you. Jesus himself said, "They will hate you because of me." I'm cool with that. I might be a hyprocrite to some of you, but I would be a bigger one if I denied my own beliefs. I take exception to people saying I am preachy. You ask me what I believe and I will give you an answer, but I'm not out to stone anyone with scripture or "sell" Jesus. Everyone is free to make their own choices. Truth be told we are all extremely religious, yourself included Matt. I put my faith in Jesus, you put your faith in logic, reason and science.
Mark the Christian thing to do would have been to acknowledge my 2 posts I wrote to you >:( ;)Why? Do you have a fragile ego and need some reassurance that we are friends? Just stealing some of the language of the scholars on here. All joking aside... it's cool. I don't feel like I'm being attacked at all... this entire thread has been very encouraging. :)
Mark,My medical history is private.
Sorry if this has been asked already, but do you supplement with Testosterone? Is it just enough to keep your body functioning normal or is it over that amount where it falls under juicing? I ask this because if you are in need of hormone replacement therapy, then that means that your natural hormone production is probably low to begin with, so supplementation of it will only bring you right to where you need to be in orderto be healthy. Yet, if you can get that big (Professional Bodybuilder Big) then you obviously must have more than just the needed Test running through your body. If you are using more than your body needs, is that not a sin? Does the thought of vanity ever trouble you?
Im trying to be neutral here Mark, I like the package you bring to stage and so Id like to be objective here..
I have no problem at all with you thinking that I am neurotic.I don't.
And it seems to humor comes to you about as naturally as any bodyweight over 160 ;)Thick skin!!!! Are you saying I'm on GH? >:( Actually, it's getting kind of boring hearing the same old argument over and over again.
nice to have ya here man! it's a tough place but if you have the skin for it, you'll stand out from many of your peers.
Why? Do you have a fragile ego and need some reassurance that we are friends? Just stealing some of the language of the scholars on here. All joking aside... it's cool. I don't feel like I'm being attacked at all... this entire thread has been very encouraging. :)
Thick skin!!!! Are you saying I'm on GH? >:( Actually, it's getting kind of boring hearing the same old argument over and over again.
This heated ongoing debate has shown for the umptieth time that Jesus Christ is Lord forever and ever more, and Creator of all!
Mark,Ummm... T-Bar Rows.
Since you couldn't answer my previous question, why don't you tell us what the fvck is going on here?
(http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/markdugdaledrivendvd/78.jpg)
wow...and you guys wonder why no pro's post here....unbelievable ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
Love it or hate this board is the best of them all.0pt]
it appears Mark is performing an enema on the gentleman wearing the gray t-shirt.Hey, what's up Bast? I'm a little dissappointed you did say I was looking for my SprayFlex in the corner. You get tired of that? So tell me what's new? You still living with your mom and dad eatin' spagetti?
Hey, what's up Bast? I'm a little dissappointed you did say I was looking for my SprayFlex in the corner. You get tired of that? So tell me what's new? You still living with your mom and dad eatin' spagetti?
Mark how did you get into bodybuilding? Was it through sports or just love of the gym?I always enjoyed lifting weights. I bought my first bench from my junior high science teacher. Here is his competition record:
I always enjoyed lifting weights. I bought my first bench from my junior high science teacher. Here is his competition record:
John Burkholder
1975
Mr America - AAU, Short, 8th
Junior Mr USA - AAU, 3rd
1976
Mr America - IFBB, Short, 4th
1977
Mr USA - IFBB, LightWeight, 1st
1978
Mr International - IFBB, LightWeight, 3rd
North American Championships - IFBB, Short, 2nd
1979
Mr International - IFBB, MiddleWeight, 8th
1980
Mr America - AAU, LightWeight, 2nd
Then my cousin married a bodybuilder who gave me John Parillo's Nutrition Manual and let me come to Alaska and train with him for a week when I was 17.
My true love was soccer, but living is the US the glory was in football. So I played both until I severely sprained my ankle playing football and was unable to play soccer either. I ended up in the gym. Never had plans on being a pro, just enjoyed lifting weights.
Call a brudda back bro!
Mark if Christ ever comes back, whatcha gonna do if he catches you with your pants around your ankles and your wife injecting you in the butt with testosterone? Will you pull your pants back up? Or finish the shot first?Wow, very witty post... how long did that take you to think up?
Wow, very witty post... how long did that take you to think up?
Looking at Christianity from a sociological perspective it has sold so well because it promises hell for the non-believers and an eternity of bliss for the believers.
Would it have been as popular if non-believers just simply died and believers were given a bran muffin?
That's what's so great about being an intellectual grown-up. No cowardly fears of a sky-God torturing us for eternity for disobeying his petty commands.First, you have seen my DVD? Second, are you saying I should hide my beliefs because they are not the same as yours? I would like to now present you with the award for.... (drum roll) ....for the Intellectual Grown-Up of the Year.
But let's get down to brass tacks. You're the one who chose to preach this Jeebus nonsense on your video. If the better adjusted among us like to amuse ourselves by ridiculing your childish beliefs, well it's nothing that He didn't tell you to expect.
"JEEBUS IS COMING TO JUDGE YOU. SAY YOU LUV JEEBUS OR YOU'LL BE REALLY SORRY."
Jeebus, who died before the gospel writers [the ones who made the final cut anyway] had a chance to decide what shit they were going to make up about him
I always hear that Christians are self-righteous and judgemental. Getbig is like coming to a bible study. ;)
We're not so judgemental. It's sort of like the Divinci Code, you have to read between the lines. Oh, and before I forget... what do you recommend I do to develop massive traps?Are you stoned or just sleepy? Either take a nap or lay off the weed and then we can address your traps. ;)
(http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96062883/K=RETARDED+FACE/v=2/SID=w/l=IVS/;_ylt=A9G_RtsVaRBEpH8B1ZujzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTA4NDgyNWN0BHNlYwNwcm9m/SIG=12m6d1muk/EXP=1142012565/*-http%3A//img75.photobucket.com/albums/v229/Euniceloh/dadretarded.jpg)
First, you have seen my DVD? Second, are you saying I should hide my beliefs because they are not the same as yours? I would like to now present you with the award for.... (drum roll) ....for the Intellectual Grown-Up of the Year.
Hey, what's up Bast? I'm a little dissappointed you did say I was looking for my SprayFlex in the corner. You get tired of that? So tell me what's new? You still living with your mom and dad eatin' spagetti youguidoitalian mutha? Tell GinnytheGino I said HI
You like me! You really like me!Fair enough. I was reading The Seven Silly Eater's in the DVD to my daughters... it's about 7 kids who make a cake for their mom's birthday. Yes, it was a test of my faith to read a book concerning cake baking while dieting.
But seriously, your two challenges seem to cancel each other out. If your beliefs are featured on the DVD [let's say, a scene of you and your wife reading that book of children's Bible stories she reviewed on Amazon] - and your second question seems to imply that they are - what difference would it make whether or not I eyeballed it personally? [For the record: no, I haven't - though I respect the physique and I'm sure the disc is a fine consumer value.]
Please don't mistake my admittedly juvenile and mean-spriited ridiculing of your beliefs as some argument that you shouldn't express them. Jeebus said you should spread the Good Word, so you'd be negligent if you didn't. But inasmuch as the Christofascists are making my country an increasingly crappy place to live, I resent all the promoters of their agenda - even the humble footsoldiers like yourself.
Please quote what I said which you think is inappropriate. I am not opposed to steroid use and I personally am not opposed to Mark taking them. I'm saying that by Mark's own standards I don't see how he can come to terms with using them. Is this clear?
If I said I was against alcohol and said this with a beer in my hand would you not question me?
I don't use laws or books to formulate my morality. I use the concept of "consent". If no unconsenting person is being hurt, there is no crime.
Let this be clear: I reviewed Mark's DVD and everything that came with it. Re-reading my review, I don't see anything particularly inappropriate about it.
As for religion, I am no atheist or no religious person for that matter. Is it safe to say that we as human beings don't have the answers to everything? That is not to say there is no higher power and it's not to say we can just invent one to make us feel more comfortable. It is safest for society to acknowledge that we don't know everything and use science and logic to try to fill in the blanks. Is this stance so unreasonable? If everyone felt as I did, years of bloodshed caused by religious wars and millions of dead would never have happened. I think my point of view on religious matters is a quite reasonable one.
Forgive me for using science and logic to formulate what I do in my life. Funny thing is, Christians use science and logic in every other area of their life - I just happen to take it a step further and also use it when speaking of the existence of deities. So am I really that much different from a religious person?
Wow, you tracked down my wife's review of a Christian children's book on Amazon... that almost qualifies as stalking. :)
What I think is kind of odd is how much you add yourself into the reveiw of someones else DVD more Dugdale and less Canning :P
Yeah but according to Christian morality, Hitler could have been born again during the last year of his life and be in heaven to this day. Also, Gandhi is in hell right now.
This system isn't too appealing to me. :-\
It's good to see a pro who is actually fulfilled in other areas of his life outside the bodybuilding stage.
never has it been stated that mark is Jesus
Actually, Big Poppa started a thread called "Mark Dugdale is Jesus" but the moderator removed it.Really? Time out, I never said my home was heaven, that I came to earth as fully man and fully God, lived a sinless life, died on a cross for those I chose before the foundation of the world, rose from the dead - conquering sin, satan, and death, and hung out with a few hundred people before assending back into heaven. You must have me confused with someone else.
Really? Time out, I never said my home was heaven, that I came to earth as fully man and fully God, lived a sinless life, died on a cross for those I chose before the foundation of the world, rose from the dead - conquering sin, satan, and death, and hung out with a few hundred people before assending back into heaven. You must have me confused with someone else.
I never said my home was heaven, that I came to earth as fully man and fully God, lived a sinless life, died on a cross for those I chose before the foundation of the world, rose from the dead - conquering sin, satan, and death, and hung out with a few hundred people before assending back into heaven.
who cares if mark is a christian and how he lives his life? who is anybody hear to say that all christians are evil or crazy? someone here even stated something about teaching kids christianity. yeah, that would be awful. i'd hate to live in a world that tried to follow what the bible says. i'd much rather live in a world of people who murder for no reason, pedophiles and etc. it is known that mark is a christian. never has it been stated that mark is Jesus or perfect or anything. you guys will try and tear down anyone you want to. i have never seen mark come across negatively so why jump all over him? obviously everything you guys do in your own lives is how everyone else should live. have fun.i totaly agree with this post, from what i've seen of Mark on here he conducts himself with respect and i respect him for that, he's also a great bodybuilder.
Really? Time out, I never said my home was heaven, that I came to earth as fully man and fully God, lived a sinless life, died on a cross for those I chose before the foundation of the world, rose from the dead - conquering sin, satan, and death, and hung out with a few hundred people before assending back into heaven. You must have me confused with someone else.
i totaly agree with this post, from what i've seen of Mark on here he conducts himself with respect and i respect him for that, he's also a great bodybuilder.
i got to meet mark this year at the arnold and thought he was a very friendly and cool guy. i've also met non christians who i thought the same thing about. i don't put too much thought into ones thoughts and beliefs but more into what kind of person they are and how they act and treat others. christian or non. now i understand where some people come from when then talk down about christians. just remember to not judge every christian on a couple of bad ones that you've met.
not all christians are bad...just most and dug is nice
What I see in him is a man who genuinely loves his family and pursues Christlikeness.
WWJB
"What Would Jesus Bench?"
The weight of all of the sin of mankind. Now that is heavy!
What you must understand Oak......is that some people are better than others.............it's a fact. Visit a maximum security prison sometime. My brother worked in one for several years, There are "unfixable" people.....the worst of the worst, they simply cannot be rehabilitated. And for that matter, why should these certain type of individuals be "rehabbed" on our dime? Someone messes with my son, your family............do you want him rehabilitated? There is a significant difference in people. People like the Dugdale's, who basically have it all...health, happiness, good looks, money, great family, great careers...a great support system...and they TREAT everyone like they are no different from them. That is my definition of exceptional.
People are jealous of success........monetaril y or career wise. Most of us are competitive by nature. The idiot's that bag on Mark are simply jealous....plain and simple. I know him.........and he really is a genuine guy and a class act.
Organized religion has been the bane of humanity. It has caused more destruction and bloodshed than literally any other factor.
Time to start thinking using logic and science and not with fairie tales that bring us comfort. Ironically, the world would be more god like if we did just that.
Does God command something because it is right, or is something right because God commands it? Answer that and you'll figure out the streets. ???
Must be the latter.
Implying "God commands what is right" would be an error since it indicates that God is not sovereign. There would be this outlying principle entirely outside of his realm of jurisdiction.
The monotheistic God MUST be all-powerful.
So something is right since God commands it, which makes Christianity all the more "petty".
Assuming though, that the monotheistic God is also all-knowing, then his command MUST be right since He is infallible by necessity. So basically, its really both AND neither, simultaneously.
Must be the latter.
Implying "God commands what is right" would be an error since it indicates that God is not sovereign. There would be this outlying principle entirely outside of his realm of jurisdiction.
The monotheistic God MUST be all-powerful.
So something is right since God commands it, which makes Christianity all the more "petty".
Assuming though, that the monotheistic God is also all-knowing, then his command MUST be right since He is infallible by necessity. So basically, its really both AND neither, simultaneously.
Haha, i know why i stick to buddhism... ;D
Desire Is The Root Of All Suffering ... great stuff! ;D
I tried to convince myself of that on my drive to the ER with a split lip and broken facial bones. It Didn't work :-\
Altogether though, I think its a great philosophy, since the only thing we can really control is our perception / reaction to external events. We will never be able to control the outside forces themselves.
Personally, I'm into Immanuel Kant these days.
Morality is in the very sense of "ought", not what is to be "ought'ed"
The September 11th terrorists felt their faith was just as justified and true as countless Christians consider their faith to be. The one thing that both have in common is that their teachings are unproven and based on "faith".
Good discussion guys.
I wish parents would just let their kids determine for themselves whether or not there is a god. If from birth I brainwashed my kids into believing that all black people were evil and needed to be exterminated, my kids have a good chance of believing it - hell, it's happened before.
Indoctrinating your children in any manner at all is wrong. You might say that a Christian couple are good people and their children will probably turn out ok, but that isn't the point. The second you stray from reason and logic is the second you open the door to all kinds of horrible things.
The September 11th terrorists felt their faith was just as justified and true as countless Christians consider their faith to be. The one thing that both have in common is that their teachings are unproven and based on "faith".
Plus, let's not pretend Christian morality is in every way moral. I hate seeing these Christian leaders who hate gay people go on that "we love gay people" and all this crap. I just want to say "shut up and admit you are prejudice you homophobe".
Conspiracy theory?
Same here. My mom has a hard time accepting that I have a better and more fulfilled life than the majority of Christians she knows. She just doesn't get how I can be so happy and passionate about life despite not following her god. This is exactly how Christianity is contagious because it gets people to think like she does where Christianity is the only way to go.
Conspiracy theory?
How do you as an American abide by the law when your government does not?
After the liberal party conservative scandal, I've decided I make my own moral system. I would BE IN JAIL if I laundered the millions of dollars that Paul Martin did - yet he is immune to the law for some reason??
I'm sorry, but if my government can't set an example in following law and doing only what they consider to be ok, I will also ignore law and do only what I consider to be ok.
It just so happens that for the most part my moral system coincides well with the legal one.
Then when the Christians die they realize it was the Muslim god who was the correct one and there they are, burning in hell for eternity.
Oh snap.
Pascal's wager anyone? ::)
Then when the Christians die they realize it was the Muslim god who was the correct one and there they are, burning in hell for eternity.
Oh snap.
Pascal's wager anyone? ::)
Matt FYI Christians & Muslims believe in the same God and they believe in Jesus as well , but thier take on the whole story is different .
Actually, I've heard many Christians say that they don't worship the same God that Muslims do. Do they actually know what God they are worshipping? Do they get a receipt after praying so they can find out for sure? :D
See that is part of the problem Christians think their take is better than the Catholics and the Muslims and the Greek Orthodox , the Jews only follow the old testament and don't buy into the ' new ' one The Christians buy into the old & new testament . everyone loves the same God but hate everyone else .
Are you saying that Allah answers the prayers of Christians who say that they don't worship him??? Blasphemy! :D
Yes, so going to hell is a matter of semantics lol.
Hell isn't about scaring people into becoming Christians, it's about personal responsibility.
We have the free will to choose between right and wrong. Our actions are our own and they have consequences, both good and bad.
Heaven and Hell are less about reward vs. punishment; they are the natural consequences of one's choices in life
LOL....natural would be going into the ground and decomposing. Actions having consequences doesn't imply that heaven and hell are reasonable outcomes in light of said actions.
You claim that you do not beleive in God because you have no "proof". You assert that because you cannot see, hear, or feel God he doesn't exist.
Consider love. You can't see love in the same way you can see your computer screen in front of you. That, however, does not prove love is nonexistent. It's possible to see the effects of love. You can see a couple together who love each other and in a child, the product of their love. You can feel love for another. Love is a complicated concept that cannot be easily defined nor explained - you just know when its there.
The same is true of God. Though you cannot see Him directly, you can see his work. The world is full of beauty and good. From a benign sunset to the miracle of birth, God can be seen everwhere. And yes, if you open yourself to Him you can feel the presense of the Lord inside you. You just have to believe.
And what prevents you from simply having faith? Pride? Anger? Fear?
Though it may mean little to you, I will pray for all of you - my misguided Getbig friends.
Why is it that when someone doesn't share your ' faith ' its out of pride , anger or fear ? why can't it be out of intelligence , commonsense , and honesty? why is there a negative connotation attached?
You claim that you do not beleive in God because you have no "proof". You assert that because you cannot see, hear, or feel God he doesn't exist.
Consider love. You can't see love in the same way you can see your computer screen in front of you. That, however, does not prove love is nonexistent. It's possible to see the effects of love. You can see a couple together who love each other and in a child, the product of their love. You can feel love for another. Love is a complicated concept that cannot be easily defined nor explained - you just know when its there.
The same is true of God. Though you cannot see Him directly, you can see his work. The world is full of beauty and good. From a benign sunset to the miracle of birth, God can be seen everwhere. And yes, if you open yourself to Him you can feel the presense of the Lord inside you. You just have to believe.
And what prevents you from simply having faith? Pride? Anger? Fear?
Though it may mean little to you, I will pray for all of you - my misguided Getbig friends.
Ask yourself: what truly prevents you from having faith?
Often people are too proud to accept that there is something higher than them. It's difficult for some to concede that they are not the most important person in the universe. Pride prevents people from from putting aside their desires and putting God's will above their own. It is selfishness, greed, and pride that drive people to commiting acts of evil. Their pride won't allow them to surrender themselves to the Lord and allow Him to work through them.
Anger prevents a lot of people from believing in an all loving all knowing God. The evils and injustice's they see in the world angers them. They declare: "How can there be a God when the world is such an aweful place? If God was so great, he would stop suffereing and end all that is bad once and for all." Perhaps they were molested as a child or had a traumatic thing happen to them. "If God existed, why would he let this happen to me?" Thus all of their anger that has built up has also built up a wall between them and God. This blocks their path to him and prevents them from having faith.
Fear is another emotion that can prevent people from having faith. They are afraid that if God truly exists, they're perception on reality will be torn asunder. Some people are afraid to accept Jesus because it is more comfortable to deny him and live a life of sin. Having faith and doing the Lord's work are very difficult. Perhaps some are just afraid of getting their hands dirty.
When you accept Jesus, you cast aside all your negativity, all of your despair, and all of your pain. When you allow Him to enter your life and act according to His way, only then can you be truly fullfilled.
Your so-called "intelligence", "commonsense", and "honesty" are nothing more than words you use to deny what is in your heart. Jesus and the love of God is inside each and every one of you. You just have to choose to release it. You have to have faith.
(http://community.dcmag.co.uk/photos/dave_morriss_gallery/images/122977/500x263.aspx)
Ask yourself: what truly prevents you from having faith?
I'm not an atheist. More of a rationalist if anything.
I don't believe in a god for the same reason you don't believe in Santa Claus. Sure maybe he exists some place or somewhere but show me the proof first. You wouldn't be expected to believe in Santa without proof and I don't believe in a god without proof. But I'm not saying one doesn't exist either. Here's something: I don't know. And neither do you or anyone else for that matter and no matter how much you want it to be true, it doesn't make it true. But it doesn't make it untrue either. But we don't know and that is logical reality.
I think it's funny that religious people use logic and rationality to formulate all their worldview EXCEPT for religion. Seems like a double standard to me.
Here is a good quote:
"I contend we are both atheists— I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you reject all other gods, you will understand why I reject yours as well." - Stephen F. Roberts
How about this?
1) A key passage in Jesus' conversation with Nicodemus doesn't make sense in Aramaic.
However, it makes perfect sense in GREEK, so scholars acknowledge that Jesus did not really have this conversation, rather it was some the product of the imagination of some Greek scribe.
2) Several books in the Bible (particularly the Pauline epistles) are not really written by the alleged author. Its called pseudepigrapha, writing under a famous author's name, in this case the apostle Paul. How do I trust the content of the Bible if the authors are perfectly comfortable assuming another's identity??
3) The Bible is two-faced ... even the New Testament.
It supports racism, slavery, misogyny ... unacceptable in my eyes under any circumstance.
Read 2 Timothy if you don't believe me. Slaves were the physical property of their masters, so the master had every right to abuse them sexually. Even Abraham had sex slaves.
4) Matthew and Luke have entirely different, completely irreconcilable birth narratives.
... couple that with the fact that Homo sapiens is really a primate (since our genetic makeup is 99% synonymous to the others), abiogenesis has been documented, the Earth is billions of years old, not 6000 ... and lastly, the useless slaughter of innocent animals to appease an invincible God (speciesism).
No thank you. Even IF God existed, which he doesn't, I would not accept his salvation.
"Man created in God's image" ... what a carnal notion ::)
Ask yourself: what truly prevents you from having faith?
Often people are too proud to accept that there is something higher than them. It's difficult for some to concede that they are not the most important person in the universe. Pride prevents people from from putting aside their desires and putting God's will above their own. It is selfishness, greed, and pride that drive people to commiting acts of evil. Their pride won't allow them to surrender themselves to the Lord and allow Him to work through them.
Anger prevents a lot of people from believing in an all loving all knowing God. The evils and injustice's they see in the world angers them. They declare: "How can there be a God when the world is such an aweful place? If God was so great, he would stop suffereing and end all that is bad once and for all." Perhaps they were molested as a child or had a traumatic thing happen to them. "If God existed, why would he let this happen to me?" Thus all of their anger that has built up has also built up a wall between them and God. This blocks their path to him and prevents them from having faith.
Fear is another emotion that can prevent people from having faith. They are afraid that if God truly exists, they're perception on reality will be torn asunder. Some people are afraid to accept Jesus because it is more comfortable to deny him and live a life of sin. Having faith and doing the Lord's work are very difficult. Perhaps some are just afraid of getting their hands dirty.
When you accept Jesus, you cast aside all your negativity, all of your despair, and all of your pain. When you allow Him to enter your life and act according to His way, only then can you be truly fullfilled.
Your so-called "intelligence", "commonsense", and "honesty" are nothing more than words you use to deny what is in your heart. Jesus and the love of God is inside each and every one of you. You just have to choose to release it. You have to have faith.
(http://community.dcmag.co.uk/photos/dave_morriss_gallery/images/122977/500x263.aspx)
Ask yourself: what truly prevents you from having faith?
you're forgeting the cultural context of when and where these passages were written (ie: slavery, animal sacrifices, etc . . .)
furthermore, the Roman Catholic Church accepts the theory of evolution
lastly, God creating the universe is compatible with the Big Bang theory. Who do you think caused it? I'll give you hint . . .
I don't understand how everything and anything people don't understand is readily attributed to some higher power.
Hell, I don't really know how my computer terminal registers the inputs when I tap these keys, but does it mean Jesus is secretly behind the scenes, manipulating, encoding and deciphering the electrical impulses responsible??
Guess what, they did this same thing thousands of years ago too.
Natural selection and speciation (i.e. Darwinian principles) etc. had not been observed.
Demons and spirits were believed to cause illness. Now we recognize that microscopic lifeforms (microbes, bacteria, etc.) and/or DNA cores with a protein shell (viruses) are responsible for sickness.
Well thats stupid, you basically acknowledged that your own creation narrative is wrong.
If you can't vouch for Genesis 1 - 11, why would you consider defending John 3:16 then?
Genesis says quite clearly that God formed man from the dust of the Earth, AFTER he had already created the animals and vegetation. Man was ALWAYS a separate entity from beast.
The concessions are lame, you basically let go of everything science can EMPIRICALLY PROVE is wrong, yet still hold on to these antiquated notions that extend well beyond the bounds of modern science (i.e: the spiritual realm).
so you believe that everything can be measured, explained and rationalized with science. you believe this despite the fact that there is much science has yet to prove, yet you have faith that it will.
religion doesn't attempt to explain scientific phenomenon. you are describing superstiton, not religion - there is a difference
You are absolutely right. Science has only cracked the surface.
However, the science that has already been established can readily dismantle the outstanding majority of the Bible.
Yes it does. Jesus attributed illness to demons.
He commanded a demon to leave the boy with epilepsy.
Epilepsy is a neurological disorder, so it CAN be measured, explained, rationalized by science.
Even IF Jesus healed the epileptic, which he DIDN'T, he was wrong as to the cause.
Jesus was resurrected.
Matter can neither be created nor destroyed.
His body was missing from the tomb. Either it was stolen (but the Bible never even hints at this as a possibility, in fact the suggestion would have been considered heresy), the myth was invented (likely, Jesus' body is in some obscure Palestinian grave as we speak), or his body disappeared, which is a scientific impossibility.
So as you see, Religion DOES attempt to provide explanations for scientific phenomenon.
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There is no such thing as sin or evil. Matter is not created or destroyed, merely changes form.
The relative arrangement of atomic particles is irrelevant - it is a subjective value judgment.
If I shoot you, eat you, or vaporize you (of course I wouldn't! just an analogy) means nothing, no matter is destroyed, nothing is lost other than the electrical association between various particles, but this energy is compensated for by reducing the amount stolen from the adjacent environment.
Life is nothing more than an indifferent series of chemical reactions and atomic interaction.
There is no such thing as sin or evil. Matter is not created or destroyed, merely changes form.
The relative arrangement of atomic particles is irrelevant - it is a subjective value judgment.
If I shoot you, eat you, or vaporize you (of course I wouldn't! just an analogy) means nothing, no matter is destroyed, nothing is lost other than the electrical association between various particles, but this energy is compensated for by reducing the amount stolen from the adjacent environment.
Life is nothing more than an indifferent series of chemical reactions and atomic interaction.
I do not subscribe to moral relativism. The Church believes in moral absolutes. The actions you described are wrong. The scientific explanation of how it happens does not negate that. Science has no moral imperative - it can't be right or wrong.
Yes it does. Jesus attributed illness to demons.
He commanded a demon to leave the boy with epilepsy.
Epilepsy is a neurological disorder, so it CAN be measured, explained, rationalized by science.
Even IF Jesus healed the epileptic, which he DIDN'T, he was wrong as to the cause.
Jesus was resurrected.
Matter can neither be created nor destroyed.
His body was missing from the tomb. Either it was stolen (but the Bible never even hints at this as a possibility, in fact the suggestion would have been considered heresy), the myth was invented (likely, Jesus' body is in some obscure Palestinian grave as we speak), or his body disappeared, which is a scientific impossibility.
Big Poppa J:
Its cool though. I respect your beliefs. I have been there too.
Jesus fulfills some 300+ Old Testament prophecies.
In my mind, that alone was a direct testament to his identity.
However, then I learned that the most pivotal conversation in Christianity - Jesus & Nicodemus -, John 2:22, directly preceding the most famous verse in history, John 3:16, doesn't actually make any sense in Jesus' native language, but PERFECT sense in Greek.
If you can confront that detail, yet still retain your faith, you are a better man.
You're attributing this to the language used. You are looking at the literal word used as opposed to the meaning of what's being said.
More importantly, when did you prove Jesus didn't cure the boy? You say he didn't but how would you know? You haven't proven anything
Jesus died, was resurrected, and rose to heaven. How does the Resurrection involve matter being destroyed?
By the way Poppa J, ignore my tone please.
I'm not angry with you and certainly don't intend to belittle your beliefs or arguments.
This is simply a contentious issue in my mind, one that I have struggled with for years.
I recognize that many tenets of Christianity are entirely valid.
There are simply some caveats I cannot yet bring myself to confront or accept.
I'm glad you guys know so much about how/why the world exists....and that you want to tell all of the other lonely ding-bats your "opinions" through a bunch of pshyco-babble . Why don't you spend more time with your family........or bettering yourself for the benefit of your family, like Mark does. While some of you have great responses, this is a thread about Mark Dugdale and his DVD...........his DVD...........his DVD.
Big Poppa J keeps getting pw3nd or however you guys say it. Yeah buddy, piss and moan, but will you send me $500 if I tell you Jesus said it needed to happen? ;D
You're full of shit, Nutz. If you're blind to the truth, then I feel sorry for you.
(http://www.latinmass.bravepages.com/images/resurrection.jpg)
Yes.
So, first you have to ask yourself if there is any possibility that you are wrong. If the possibility exists then there are a few directions you can take....
1) You wait for someone to come along that can convince you otherwise
2) You take the initiative to find the most credible people possible with the opposing view, open your mind, ask your questions, and listen.
3) You do nothing and nobody comes along attempting to persuade you. You end your life with doubt.
Lots of people are going to read this and think, "any rational person can see that it's not true." Well, there are lots of highly intelligent and rational people who do believe. That is unimportant though. The bottom line is are you sure.... and if not, you ought to do something about it.
Of course I'm not sure and still seeking answers. It doesn't mean I'm going to believe in unproven fairie tales for comfort.
Of course I'm not sure and still seeking answers. It doesn't mean I'm going to believe in unproven fairie tales for comfort.
So by this logic I should thoroughly investigate every unsubstantiated claim before dismissing it. I should "keep an open mind" when it comes to leprechauns before dismissing them.
It doesn't work like that - if you make a positive claim, you show me positive physical evidence to show it exists.
Look - this is simple. IF the Christian god exists, or if ANYTHING is true for that matter, it shouldn't be difficult to PROVE IT. If I claimed I owned a car I would be able to show you that car and so on.
This is simple:post of the century.
Show me the physical evidence.
"Search and you will find it" means nothing to me.
EVERY religion says the same thing. If you indoctrinate yourself for long enough you will believe anything. If you indoctrinate your children since a young age they will believe anything. If I wanted to teach my children that black people are no better than animals they would grow up believing it.
The same thing is said about every religion. Some Mormons said the same thing to me recently. Muslims, Jehovah's witnesses, Christians - all of you think you are right. But that's the gag! God is like a highlander - there can only be one! So only one of you is right and EVERY other one of you is wrong. So why should I believe you over somebody of another faith? Your evidence is the exact same "You'll just feel it in your heart" spiel they give me.
If you have been religious since a young age I would be led to believe you were indoctrinated yourself. In which case - I don't want to hear debate from you.
Just show me the physical proof.
Here is a claim: I have brown hair.
I can prove it.
Here is another claim: I and 5'9.
I can prove it.
I have a car.
I can prove it.
I own a house.
I can prove it.
I am 24.
I can prove it.
ETC, ETC, ETC.
IF SOMETHING IS TRUE, IT SHOULDN'T BE THAT DIFFICULT TO SHOW IT DIRECTLY.
It is that simple.
Religion is the single worst thing to EVER happen to humanity. I don't like religion because I don't like killing and murder and bloodshed. I want to live in a world where we can get along and love one another and share and so on.
Seems ironic doesn't it? But if you look at the logical physical reality we live in, you will see I'm right. The difference between me and you is that I can prove what I say. You can't.
You are absolutely right. Science has only cracked the surface.
However, the science that has already been established can readily dismantle the outstanding majority of the Bible.
Yes it does. Jesus attributed illness to demons.
He commanded a demon to leave the boy with epilepsy.
Epilepsy is a neurological disorder, so it CAN be measured, explained, rationalized by science.
Even IF Jesus healed the epileptic, which he DIDN'T, he was wrong as to the cause.
Jesus was resurrected.
Matter can neither be created nor destroyed.
His body was missing from the tomb. Either it was stolen (but the Bible never even hints at this as a possibility, in fact the suggestion would have been considered heresy), the myth was invented (likely, Jesus' body is in some obscure Palestinian grave as we speak), or his body disappeared, which is a scientific impossibility.
So as you see, Religion DOES attempt to provide explanations for scientific phenomenon.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is no such thing as sin or evil. Matter is not created or destroyed, merely changes form.
The relative arrangement of atomic particles is irrelevant - it is a subjective value judgment.
If I shoot you, eat you, or vaporize you (of course I wouldn't! just an analogy) means nothing, no matter is destroyed, nothing is lost other than the electrical association between various particles, but this energy is compensated for by reducing the amount stolen from the adjacent environment.
Life is nothing more than an indifferent series of chemical reactions and atomic interaction.
Ah... 24 years old. A man of great wisdom. A man of experience. A man who has sought out great wisdom in his many years. From his lofty incline bench, he stares down his nose at those who he deems to be fools.must be nice to be so sure ::) do you still believe in the tooth fairy?
Your mind has been made up. You haven't told me anything of your evaluation of Christianity. All you have done is told me you can prove the obvious. Congratulations. Unfortunately real life is much trickier than I can prove I'm 5'9" (exactly 5' 9" ??? not a fraction of a micrometer more or less).
I've said all I have to say. I'm sure you are glad to hear that. I have been where you are. I was a skeptic. I evaluated the evidence and came to the conclusion that Jesus was who he said he was.
As I've said, I wish you the best on your search for truth.
must be nice to be so sure ::) do you still believe in the tooth fairy?
I believe in the Cock Fairy........he posts here under the name of Alexxx..........hahahaha, instead of leaving five dollars he sucks ball sacks dry and steals semen in the dead of the night.
How about this?
1) A key passage in Jesus' conversation with Nicodemus doesn't make sense in Aramaic.
However, it makes perfect sense in GREEK, so scholars acknowledge that Jesus did not really have this conversation, rather it was some the product of the imagination of some Greek scribe.
2) Several books in the Bible (particularly the Pauline epistles) are not really written by the alleged author. Its called pseudepigrapha, writing under a famous author's name, in this case the apostle Paul. How do I trust the content of the Bible if the authors are perfectly comfortable assuming another's identity??
3) The Bible is two-faced ... even the New Testament.
It supports racism, slavery, misogyny ... unacceptable in my eyes under any circumstance.
Read 2 Timothy if you don't believe me. Slaves were the physical property of their masters, so the master had every right to abuse them sexually. Even Abraham had sex slaves.
4) Matthew and Luke have entirely different, completely irreconcilable birth narratives.
... couple that with the fact that Homo sapiens is really a primate (since our genetic makeup is 99% synonymous to the others), abiogenesis has been documented, the Earth is billions of years old, not 6000 ... and lastly, the useless slaughter of innocent animals to appease an invincible God (speciesism).
No thank you. Even IF God existed, which he doesn't, I would not accept his salvation.
"Man created in God's image" ... what a carnal notion ::)
So right about the innocent slaughter of animals in the bible. It is amazing how many religious people go mum when it comes to animal rights. If Jesus saw the mass slaughter of animals on factory farms, fur farms and labortories he would be sickened. He even saved a lamb from slaughter. But do these religious nuts ever do anything to help animals, nope, never. The Vatican has been asked time and time again if they think slaughtering an animal for a fur coat is acceptable, they continue to refuse to answer. I mean why not just answer the question. If its yes so be it, if not cool. But at least answer the question. The Vatican has ignored animal rights for years and it is becoming a joke. The ultimate in compassion is a person who goes out of his way to prevent harm to an animal with no selfish interest at all, not even a thank you. Thats real compassion.
Animals don't have souls. Why would they be given moral consideration?
God created them to feed and clothe us. As long as we don't abuse them, it's all good.
Why are people such whiny bitches about this anyway?
Your human centrist philosophy is the reason why our environment is in such disrepair. Ecology/Science has proved we are not the center of creation. And by the way the industries that use animals to feed and cloth us are the very ones that outright abuse animals. It's all about money. Its not farmers in overalls anymore dude. Its serious exploitation and abuse for money. There is no attempt at all to "Shepard" these poor souls. Its just neglect, abuse and making money.
By saying animals don't have souls aren't you really giving permission to abuse them. If they are so unimportant to God then why not abuse them? You see when you select only one group to be the chosen one you devalue the unchosen ones. Thats how violent racism and homophobia starts.
I realize animals have to be used for food and other needs. I am just saying that the church has no position on the exploitation and mistreatment and misuse and abuse of animals(and we are talking billions of animals) and that my friend is hypocritical. They have been silent on the undeniable animal abuse for profit in the fur, zoo, hunting, entertainment, science and food industry. Why not have a position and state it openly.