The federal government says: "no sex without marriage up to age 29"

[Deedee]

This is what it's about and has been for several decades. The abstinence-only teaching model has not been successful anywhere in the world.

"The effectiveness debate has largely obscured one underlying reason for the Bush administration's support: politics. Funding abstinence-until-marriage programs allows the White House to reward conservative groups by putting them on the federal gravy train."

But on the bright side, look at all the creative people who are going enjoy lucrative contracts while dreaming up fun campaigns for a whole new segment of society!

Idaho's state campaign tried using reverse psychology to show teens what was potentially uncool about having sex. Their television spots, produced by es/drake ad agency in Boise, Idaho, were spoofs of ads for popular dolls. "Action Teen Father," for example, resembles a Ken doll with a mullet haircut and faded jeans, and comes complete with a crib, diaper bag, "Action Baby Buggy," and food stamps. (His girlfriend, "Teen Mommy Darcie," is sold separately.) Although the message-- "Teen parenting isn't fun"--flashes in the final frame, some younger viewers apparently didn't get the point. According to Shelly Rambo Robertson of the Idaho Department of Health, a few parents complained that their children thought the toys were genuine and wanted to buy "Teen Mommy Darcie."

[Dos Equis]

My questions for you are these:

Do you really think that the government in the USA has allowed for a nationwide campaign directed at ALL teens and young adults?

If so, when was that campaign?

YIP
Zack

Yes.  

It is ongoing.  We have run numerous T.V. and radio commercials for years.  They have tried to become creative and make the commercials more appealing to young people.  What I'm not sure about is whether they hand them out in the schools or make them available to kids in the schools.  Even if they don't, I am certain anyone can walk into a plethora of clinics and Planned Parenthood buildings anywhere in the country and get free condoms.  Promoting condom use and making them available are not the problems.  It's getting guys to use them on a large scale, consistent basis, which I don't believe will ever happen, regardless of how much money we spend promoting their use.  

[Clubber Lang]

This is what it's about and has been for several decades. The abstinence-only teaching model has not been successful anywhere in the world.

"The effectiveness debate has largely obscured one underlying reason for the Bush administration's support: politics. Funding abstinence-until-marriage programs allows the White House to reward conservative groups by putting them on the federal gravy train."

But on the bright side, look at all the creative people who are going enjoy lucrative contracts while dreaming up fun campaigns for a whole new segment of society!

Idaho's state campaign tried using reverse psychology to show teens what was potentially uncool about having sex. Their television spots, produced by es/drake ad agency in Boise, Idaho, were spoofs of ads for popular dolls. "Action Teen Father," for example, resembles a Ken doll with a mullet haircut and faded jeans, and comes complete with a crib, diaper bag, "Action Baby Buggy," and food stamps. (His girlfriend, "Teen Mommy Darcie," is sold separately.) Although the message-- "Teen parenting isn't fun"--flashes in the final frame, some younger viewers apparently didn't get the point. According to Shelly Rambo Robertson of the Idaho Department of Health, a few parents complained that their children thought the toys were genuine and wanted to buy "Teen Mommy Darcie."

abstinence is like communism, a great idea in theory but totally at odds with reality/human nature

the most effective movement for curbing sex has probably been HIV

[Dos Equis]

This is what it's about and has been for several decades. The abstinence-only teaching model has not been successful anywhere in the world.

"The effectiveness debate has largely obscured one underlying reason for the Bush administration's support: politics. Funding abstinence-until-marriage programs allows the White House to reward conservative groups by putting them on the federal gravy train."

But on the bright side, look at all the creative people who are going enjoy lucrative contracts while dreaming up fun campaigns for a whole new segment of society!

Idaho's state campaign tried using reverse psychology to show teens what was potentially uncool about having sex. Their television spots, produced by es/drake ad agency in Boise, Idaho, were spoofs of ads for popular dolls. "Action Teen Father," for example, resembles a Ken doll with a mullet haircut and faded jeans, and comes complete with a crib, diaper bag, "Action Baby Buggy," and food stamps. (His girlfriend, "Teen Mommy Darcie," is sold separately.) Although the message-- "Teen parenting isn't fun"--flashes in the final frame, some younger viewers apparently didn't get the point. According to Shelly Rambo Robertson of the Idaho Department of Health, a few parents complained that their children thought the toys were genuine and wanted to buy "Teen Mommy Darcie."

I don't think abstinence only training has been unsuccessful at all.  I've heard and read about many success stories.  One of the problems I have is treating kids like they are uncontrollable, mindless animals who are unable to refrain from having sex.  I have many friends with teenaged virgins and we all teach our children that their virginity is a gift that they will give to their future spouse on their wedding night.  They are taught how to respect their bodies.  The girls (including mine) are taught and shown how boys and men have a one-track mind and will gladly make them a notch on their belts.  My girls have bought into it.  They're very open with me.  I know exactly which ones of their friends are having sex.  (Way too many.)  In fact, we were just talking last night about one in particular who might be pregnant at the age of 15.    

[Deedee]

Well, it doesn't seem to have worked in European and African countries.  The lowest rates of teen pregnancies in Europe are in the countries that teach sex education rather than abstinence.  Perhaps it only works in the US.  However, this thread is about reaching 19-29-year-olds which is a ludicrous undertaking.  The only reason for the campaign is to shuttle funds to certain conservative special interest groups. 

[Hedgehog]

Yes. 

It is ongoing.  We have run numerous T.V. and radio commercials for years.  They have tried to become creative and make the commercials more appealing to young people.  What I'm not sure about is whether they hand them out in the schools or make them available to kids in the schools.  Even if they don't, I am certain anyone can walk into a plethora of clinics and Planned Parenthood buildings anywhere in the country and get free condoms.  Promoting condom use and making them available are not the problems.  It's getting guys to use them on a large scale, consistent basis, which I don't believe will ever happen, regardless of how much money we spend promoting their use. 

From what I understand, and my experience when I lived in the USA, was that for every campaign that was trying to get teens and adults to use condoms, there were at least one campaign of abstinence.

I never had any condom talk during my senior year in US high school. Condoms weren't very available either in general. It wasn't like you could by a pack at any supermarket or drugstore, or gas station.

So that was a big change from what I was used from back in Sweden.

YIP
Zack

[Clubber Lang]

From what I understand, and my experience when I lived in the USA, was that for every campaign that was trying to get teens and adults to use condoms, there were at least one campaign of abstinence.

thats kind of interesting, i wonder if its by design(ie regulated)

i know that in canada you have to play at least one public service announcment add for every alcoholic add you play

[Cavalier22]

that preacher guy is a complete joke.

[Dos Equis]

From what I understand, and my experience when I lived in the USA, was that for every campaign that was trying to get teens and adults to use condoms, there were at least one campaign of abstinence.

I never had any condom talk during my senior year in US high school. Condoms weren't very available either in general. It wasn't like you could by a pack at any supermarket or drugstore, or gas station.

So that was a big change from what I was used from back in Sweden.

YIP
Zack

I'd be surprised if there is a 7-11, Safeway, etc. in Hawaii that does not carry condoms. 

[Dos Equis]

Well, it doesn't seem to have worked in European and African countries.  The lowest rates of teen pregnancies in Europe are in the countries that teach sex education rather than abstinence.  Perhaps it only works in the US.  However, this thread is about reaching 19-29-year-olds which is a ludicrous undertaking.  The only reason for the campaign is to shuttle funds to certain conservative special interest groups. 

I think it comes down to what kind of practices our government should be promoting.  Regarding teens, most rational people, particularly parents, believe teenagers should not have sex.  They're not old enough.  Generally not mature enough.  Regarding unmarried 19-29 year-olds, the commonsense advice I'd give to any of them is get your education, find a spouse, then have sex, kids, etc.  That's certainly reasonable advice in my book.  That's what I'm teaching my kids.

Obviously, this approach will not work with all kids and young adults.  But in terms of public policy, I have no problem at all with our government promoting the smartest approach for young adults.   

[AVBG]

 

[Deedee]

I think it comes down to what kind of practices our government should be promoting.  Regarding teens, most rational people, particularly parents, believe teenagers should not have sex.  They're not old enough.  Generally not mature enough.  Regarding unmarried 19-29 year-olds, the commonsense advice I'd give to any of them is get your education, find a spouse, then have sex, kids, etc.  That's certainly reasonable advice in my book.  That's what I'm teaching my kids.

Obviously, this approach will not work with all kids and young adults.  But in terms of public policy, I have no problem at all with our government promoting the smartest approach for young adults.   

It may sound like reasonable advice, but I think in practice it's fluffy clouds and unicorns idealism for the most part. And anyone who's still unattached and a virgin at 29 probably has serious issues with intimacy.

[Hedgehog]

I think it comes down to what kind of practices our government should be promoting.  Regarding teens, most rational people, particularly parents, believe teenagers should not have sex.  They're not old enough.  Generally not mature enough.  Regarding unmarried 19-29 year-olds, the commonsense advice I'd give to any of them is get your education, find a spouse, then have sex, kids, etc.  That's certainly reasonable advice in my book.  That's what I'm teaching my kids.

Obviously, this approach will not work with all kids and young adults.  But in terms of public policy, I have no problem at all with our government promoting the smartest approach for young adults.   

It seems like you have a very different opinion on what you think will prevent most cases of STD's and unplanned births from mine.

I happen to not agree with you on how to deal with the problem, but at least we seems to agree on what the problem is - too much unprotected sex.

Hypothetical question for you BB:

If there is research that clearly shows that safe sex with condom is the outstanding alternative to abstinence, would you be in favor of this being public policy and mandatory in all public and private schools?

YIP
Zack

[Deedee]

It seems like you have a very different opinion on what you think will prevent most cases of STD's and unplanned births from mine.

I happen to not agree with you on how to deal with the problem, but at least we seems to agree on what the problem is - too much unprotected sex.

Hypothetical question for you BB:

If there is research that clearly shows that safe sex with condom is the outstanding alternative to abstinence, would you be in favor of this being public policy and mandatory in all public and private schools?

YIP
Zack

The way you worded this says sex should be mandatory in all schools. 

[haider]

From what I understand, and my experience when I lived in the USA, was that for every campaign that was trying to get teens and adults to use condoms, there were at least one campaign of abstinence.

I never had any condom talk during my senior year in US high school. Condoms weren't very available either in general. It wasn't like you could by a pack at any supermarket or drugstore, or gas station.

So that was a big change from what I was used from back in Sweden.

YIP
Zack

The better question is: Why the fvck would u get your highschool education in the US? 

[Hedgehog]

The way you worded this says sex should be mandatory in all schools. 

True.

What I meant was....

Fcuk that, you guys know what I meant, besides, I'm gonna play the foreigner card this time.

Are you ok with that Beach?

YIP
Zack

[Dos Equis]

It seems like you have a very different opinion on what you think will prevent most cases of STD's and unplanned births from mine.

I happen to not agree with you on how to deal with the problem, but at least we seems to agree on what the problem is - too much unprotected sex.

Hypothetical question for you BB:

If there is research that clearly shows that safe sex with condom is the outstanding alternative to abstinence, would you be in favor of this being public policy and mandatory in all public and private schools?

YIP
Zack

Well, honestly it wouldn't be my first choice, but I'd certainly be willing to discuss it if the numbers showed one was vastly superior to the other.  I don't think such a study has been done in the U.S.?  Until then, I'll stick with my fluffy clouds and unicorns idealism.   

[Deedee]

Well, honestly it wouldn't be my first choice, but I'd certainly be willing to discuss it if the numbers showed one was vastly superior to the other.  I don't think such a study has been done in the U.S.?  Until then, I'll stick with my fluffy clouds and unicorns idealism.   

Based on comparative studies with other countries, so far it isn't looking so hot for the fluffy clouds... 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_education

[Hedgehog]

The better question is: Why the fvck would u get your highschool education in the US? 

I was there for a year. Reason? I wanted to learn more about USA, broaden my perspective a little.

I would recommend for anyone to send away their highschool kids to another part of the world, if they have the opportunity. Getting involved with international exchange programs is interesting.

You grow up a lot when you're on your own in another part of the world.

YIP
Zack

[Dos Equis]

Based on comparative studies with other countries, so far it isn't looking so hot for the fluffy clouds... 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_education

Okay.  I read the link.  It does not discuss a comparative study of condoms vs. abstinence.

I found this alarming:  "In France, sex education has been part of school curricula since 1973. Schools are expected to provide 30 to 40 hours of sex education, and pass out condoms, to students in grades eight and nine."    

Good Lord.  Giving condoms to 13 year old kids?     

[Deedee]

Okay.  I read the link.  It does not discuss a comparative study of condoms vs. abstinence.

I found this alarming:  "In France, sex education has been part of school curricula since 1973. Schools are expected to provide 30 to 40 hours of sex education, and pass out condoms, to students in grades eight and nine."    

Good Lord.  Giving condoms to 13 year old kids?     

Gotta love the French for their openmindedness when it comes to affairs of the heart. By the time a kid graduates 9th grade, they're 15. That's not too early to learn about condoms if you promote sex education.

The article does discuss the success rate of societies that promote sex education in keeping unwanted pregnancies down. It also points to a lack of responsibility in the use of contraceptives later on, in those that promote abstinence. Education is everything...

[Hedgehog]

Okay.  I read the link.  It does not discuss a comparative study of condoms vs. abstinence.

I found this alarming:  "In France, sex education has been part of school curricula since 1973. Schools are expected to provide 30 to 40 hours of sex education, and pass out condoms, to students in grades eight and nine."    

Good Lord.  Giving condoms to 13 year old kids?     

Look at the amount of STD's and unplanned birth in France in comparison to the USA.

But as far as passing out condoms, I'd say Sweden are equal or even better in that regard.

Any teen can get free condoms at the youth counciling, where free tests for STD's are also supervised, with great confidentiality, although if you test positive, you are obligated under law to list your sexual relations for the 6 past months.

As a result, the only risk group in Sweden for AIDS and HIV, are West Africans and those who choose to have sex with such persons.

Other STD's are being fought successfully with condoms, but as soon as the condom use drops, the STD's rise.

YIP
Zack

[Clubber Lang]

Good Lord.  Giving condoms to 13 year old kids?    

its so they can fuck each other, not so you can fuck them

[240 is Back]

I teach my kids abstinence.  

Do they listen?

[Dos Equis]

Do they listen?

Of course.