Bruce Lee the greatest fighter that ever lived?

[americanbulldog]

Wikipedia:

Wong didnt' come out with his side of the story until after Bruce Lee had passed.  James Lee, Howard Jackson, who still resided in the bay area would have made sure Bruce had heard about it if Wong would have said otherwise.  The point of the fight was to prevent Lee from teaching foreigners gung fu.  He still taught foreigners.  You do the math. 

[realkarateblackbelt]

That's not what it says in Wikipedia. It says he was challenged publically while they were alive.

Do you have another source?

[americanbulldog]

That's not what it says in Wikipedia. It says he was challenged publically while they were alive.

Do you have another source?

Howard Jackson, Linda Lee Caldwell, Al Dacoscos.   (Sifu Al is in Hawaii, he formed a system known as Won Hop Kun Do, an offshoot of Kajukembo.  His son Marc is an action movie star who appeared opposite of Jet Li in "Cradle to the Grave."   All of them were present at the fight, as was James Yim Lee, but he died.  The point of the original fight was for Lee to stop teaching foreingers.  Not only did he continue, he opened another school in Chinatown in LA which Dan Inosanto ran. 

[realkarateblackbelt]

I understand the point of the fight...

Wiki mentions both sides of the story but it doesn't say he placed the add inviting Lee to a public match after he died...probably because it wouldn't make any sense to invite Bruce Lee to a public fight in a newspaper after he died. Sounds rediculous.

It says he placed a public add in the newspapers inviting Lee to a public match since the winner was disputed. The invitation went unanswered.

[americanbulldog]

I understand the point of the fight...

Wiki mentions both sides of the story but it doesn't say he placed the add inviting Lee to a public match after he died...probably because it wouldn't make any sense to invite Bruce Lee to a public fight in a newspaper after he died. Sounds rediculous.

It says he placed a public add in the newspapers inviting Lee to a public match since the winner was disputed. The invitation went unanswered.

Soon after the fight, Bruce was showcased at Ed Parkers event in Long Beach.  He moved to LA, got on the Green Hornet and the rest is history.  To this day, Wong supporters chime that Wong won.  Even with all the people who corrected him in "Fighting Stars" (forerunner to Black Belt), he and his crew still maintain he won.  By all accounts, Bruce would stop hit, straight blast (jik jeung chui) and Wong would turn around and run away.  Bruce had to abandon his straight blast to tackle Wong, mount him and hit him in the face until he gave up. 

After this fight, Bruce started investigating other arts, and working on his conditioning.  We saw less and less of Wing Chun, choy li fut, etc, and more boxing, wrestling, judo.  Not as exciting as what was represented in "Dragon" but meaningful, nonetheless. 

[onlyme]

Howard Jackson, Linda Lee Caldwell, Al Dacoscos.   (Sifu Al is in Hawaii, he formed a system known as Won Hop Kun Do, an offshoot of Kajukembo.  His son Marc is an action movie star who appeared opposite of Jet Li in "Cradle to the Grave."   All of them were present at the fight, as was James Yim Lee, but he died.  The point of the original fight was for Lee to stop teaching foreingers.  Not only did he continue, he opened another school in Chinatown in LA which Dan Inosanto ran. 

God Howard Jackson is one of the guys I forgot from that photo.  Man I can't believe I forgot him.  Howard is or was Chuck Norris bodyguard cause I didn;t want to do it.  Chuck asked me and the same night called me back to say he didn't feel it would be good for me.  He hired Howard.  They went to the Philipines to make a movie and Howard met his wife there.  I haven't seen him in 15 years or so.  Really cool guy.  I didn't realize he was such a great fighter.

[beatmaster]

"Just prior to his death, he was quoted as saying a man with 1 years boxing experience and some wrestling would beat 100% of the black belts out there.  (This didn't make him popular with the McDojo school owners at the time since he was the hottest thing out).  So there it is."

this might just be the most poignant point of the whole thread. if there is one thing i admire most about lee is that he was honest to himself which is probably the greatest trait a fighter or even a man can have.

he is exactly right because he knew that real fighting was a very difficult thing to learn because it's not just whether you can throw a perfect left hook or a right roundhouse kick in a controlled setting. can you do it under pressure? can you set it up with timing and distance whilst your equally skilled opponent is reading you like a book? can you do it after you've been cracked so hard on your liver or kidneys that you can't even feel your legs anymore? can you do it so as you don't get countered? will you be open if it doesn't land? i could spend the next 3 pages doing this and we're only talking about one strike. i haven't even approached combinations/defence/shooting/grappling/sprawling, etc, etc.

these are the things we have ZERO evidence about lee. i have asked for one person to tell me WHO lee has fought and i've received some bullshit about lee not wanting to bother with a light strike karate tournament. yes i understand that, but what was stopping him entering a bare knuckle or boxing match. there were plenty of sanctioned fights and underground fights around in his day. he didn't enter any of them.

why? because he knew he would get owned and exposed in front of everyone. his mythical status would have been destroyed and the contrived american legend would have crumbled right there. a bit like seeing prime davey crocket in the flesh getting the absolute shit kicked out of him by a baby bear.

now, if lee were still alive and you asked him this HONESTLY eye to eye, i believe that he would have admitted it and, seriously, how could anyone blame him? the guy made millions from the ignorance and naivety of the masses who at the end of the day wouldn't know/care about the first thing about REAL fighting and simply wish to be entertained. a myth/legend inspires stupidity wonder and creates a buzz of excitement and stories to tell.

people, the title of this thread is 'Re: Bruce Lee the greatest fighter that ever lived?'

note the 'greatest fighter' part and the ? mark.

that right there is the discussion point, not who is a great martial artist or who looked the best, had the most nut huggers or, for christ's sake, who could AVOID hurting someone the best.

there is absolutely ZERO proof that lee was even A great fighter, never mind 'greatest'. ANYONE who states that lee was the greatest fighter or one of, i KNOW, is talking straight from the rectum. 

right on................... he was more of a myth (good publicity for movies)
bruce lee never won any fight, good philosophy, that's about it!!!