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Author Topic: The "sons" of God?  (Read 3766 times)
OzmO
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« Reply #25 on: May 22, 2007, 12:23:21 PM »

I don't know.  I've never looked into this myself.  Maybe I will my next time around reading the entire OT.  Maybe I'll come up with 3,000 or maybe 28,000 years.     Grin

Maybe other Christians on the board have an answer/opinion.

What makes that whole thing questionable is science.   

For example if God made the stars in the week he did (7000 years) only a small percentage of the stars we see at night would be visible due to how far they are away and the speed of light.

So basically,  if you are saying 28,000 years or even 100,000 years,  it makes either the Bible 100% correct or most of science 100% wrong.
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« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2007, 12:30:09 PM »

I've been curious about this. 


Genesis 6:2-4

That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. ............ when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them.


What does all mean?

What's the "Christian" take on this?

P.S.  I really am curious loco.  But based on anyone's answer ti may lead into a debate  Wink
I found this commentary from biblegateway.  I'm not sure who the commentator is though. 

The wickedness of the world which provoked God's wrath.

The most remarkable thing concerning the old world, is the destroying of it by the deluge, or flood. We are told of the abounding iniquity of that wicked world: God's just wrath, and his holy resolution to punish it. In all ages there has been a peculiar curse of God upon marriages between professors of true religion and its avowed enemies. The evil example of the ungodly party corrupts or greatly hurts the other. Family religion is put an end to, and the children are trained up according to the worldly maxims of that parent who is without the fear of God. If we profess to be the sons and daughters of the Lord Almighty, we must not marry without his consent. He will never give his blessing, if we prefer beauty, wit, wealth, or worldly honours, to faith and holiness. The Spirit of God strove with men, by sending Enoch, Noah, and perhaps others, to preach to them; by waiting to be gracious, notwithstanding their rebellions; and by exciting alarm and convictions in their consciences. But the Lord declared that his Spirit should not thus strive with men always; he would leave them to be hardened in sin, and ripened for destruction. This he determined on, because man was flesh: not only frail and feeble, but carnal and depraved; having misused the noble powers of his soul to gratify his corrupt inclinations. God sees all the wickedness that is among the children of men; it cannot be hid from him now; and if it be not repented of, it shall be made known by him shortly. The wickedness of a people is great indeed, when noted sinners are men renowned among them. Very much sin was committed in all places, by all sorts of people. Any one might see that the wickedness of man was great: but God saw that every imagination, or purpose, of the thoughts of man's heart, was only evil continually. This was the bitter root, the corrupt spring. The heart was deceitful and desperately wicked; the principles were corrupt; the habits and dispositions evil. Their designs and devices were wicked. They did evil deliberately, contriving how to do mischief. There was no good among them. God saw man's wickedness as one injured and wronged by it. He saw it as a tender father sees the folly and stubbornness of a rebellious and disobedient child, which grieves him, and makes him wish he had been childless. The words here used are remarkable; they are used after the manner of men, and do not mean that God can change, or be unhappy. Does God thus hate our sin?

And shall not we be grieved to the heart for it? Oh that we may look on Him whom we have grieved, and mourn! God repented that he had made man; but we never find him repent that he redeemed man. God resolves to destroy man: the original word is very striking, to ?I will wipe off man from the earth, to ? as dirt or filth is wiped off from a place which should be clean, and is thrown to the dunghill, the proper place for it. God speaks of man as his own creature, when he resolves upon his punishment. Those forfeit their lives who do not answer the end of their living. God speaks of resolution concerning men, after his Spirit had been long striving with them in vain. None are punished by the justice of God, but those who hate to be reformed by the grace of God. (Ge 6:8-11)
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« Reply #27 on: May 22, 2007, 12:35:25 PM »

What makes that whole thing questionable is science.   

For example if God made the stars in the week he did (7000 years) only a small percentage of the stars we see at night would be visible due to how far they are away and the speed of light.

So basically,  if you are saying 28,000 years or even 100,000 years,  it makes either the Bible 100% correct or most of science 100% wrong.

Where do you get 7000 years?  Didn't God create the earth along with a multitude of stars in 6 days?  Don't stars die and new ones are born?
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« Reply #28 on: May 23, 2007, 01:04:44 PM »

Where do you get 7000 years?  Didn't God create the earth along with a multitude of stars in 6 days?  Don't stars die and new ones are born?

Doesn't it say in the Bible a day to God is 1000 years?
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« Reply #29 on: May 23, 2007, 01:21:56 PM »

Doesn't it say in the Bible a day to God is 1000 years?

No, I think that's something recent people have made up actually... If there's a passage stating that, I've never seen it.
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« Reply #30 on: May 23, 2007, 03:57:47 PM »

Doesn't it say in the Bible a day to God is 1000 years?

You're probably thinking of 2 Peter 3:8:  "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." 
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« Reply #31 on: May 23, 2007, 05:54:22 PM »

so when in the Bible, God says he made man, earth and the heavens in 6 days he either meant 1000 years or 6 days right?
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« Reply #32 on: May 23, 2007, 06:07:58 PM »

so when in the Bible, God says he made man, earth and the heavens in 6 days he either meant 1000 years or 6 days right?

I doubt it.  The creation story says the evening and the morning were the first day, second day, etc. 
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« Reply #33 on: May 23, 2007, 06:56:43 PM »

I doubt it.  The creation story says the evening and the morning were the first day, second day, etc. 

i don't understand what you are saying.  Did he create the heavens and the earth and man in 6 days?
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« Reply #34 on: May 23, 2007, 07:19:30 PM »

i don't understand what you are saying.  Did he create the heavens and the earth and man in 6 days?

Yes and no.  The story starts with the earth already in existence.  It says (paraphrasing) that in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth and the earth was without form, etc.  It doesn't say when "the beginning" was.  Could have been 4.5 billion years ago, like many geologists, etc. believe. 

Then it talks about God creating light, sun, moon, animals, etc.  And after each "day," it says the evening and the morning were the first day, second, and so on.  So, the creation of things during the evening and morning = six day creation.

Not everyone agrees with me and I'm not entirely sure what I believe when it comes to the age of the earth itself.  Some believe the earth itself was created at the same time the six-creation started.   
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« Reply #35 on: May 23, 2007, 07:28:11 PM »

Yes and no.  The story starts with the earth already in existence.  It says (paraphrasing) that in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth and the earth was without form, etc.  It doesn't say when "the beginning" was.  Could have been 4.5 billion years ago, like many geologists, etc. believe. 

Then it talks about God creating light, sun, moon, animals, etc.  And after each "day," it says the evening and the morning were the first day, second, and so on.  So, the creation of things during the evening and morning = six day creation.

Not everyone agrees with me and I'm not entirely sure what I believe when it comes to the age of the earth itself.  Some believe the earth itself was created at the same time the six-creation started.   

So you're saying that only 7000 years ago did we get grass and animals?

Wow... That's not what Carbon dating shows.
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« Reply #36 on: May 23, 2007, 07:34:35 PM »

So you're saying that only 7000 years ago did we get grass and animals?

Wow... That's not what Carbon dating shows.

I didn't say anything about 7000 years.  Where are you getting that from? 

Carbon dating deals with grass and animals? 
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« Reply #37 on: May 23, 2007, 07:42:06 PM »

I didn't say anything about 7000 years.  Where are you getting that from? 

Carbon dating deals with grass and animals? 

Carbon dating deals with ANYTHING fossilized.

ie... Grass and Animals.
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« Reply #38 on: May 23, 2007, 07:47:08 PM »

Carbon dating deals with ANYTHING fossilized.

ie... Grass and Animals.

I don't remember much about it.  It has been many moons since I took a geology class.  I recall that it was one of the most boring classes Iíve ever taken, which helps explain why I donít remember much.   
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« Reply #39 on: May 23, 2007, 07:53:10 PM »

I don't remember much about it.  It has been many moons since I took a geology class.  I recall that it was one of the most boring classes I?ve ever taken, which helps explain why I don?t remember much.   

Well, rocks are just... well.... rocks.
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« Reply #40 on: May 23, 2007, 07:58:30 PM »

Well, rocks are just... well.... rocks.

Tell me about it. 
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« Reply #41 on: May 24, 2007, 05:11:04 AM »

You're probably thinking of 2 Peter 3:8:  "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." 


Yes and no.  The story starts with the earth already in existence.  It says (paraphrasing) that in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth and the earth was without form, etc.  It doesn't say when "the beginning" was.  Could have been 4.5 billion years ago, like many geologists, etc. believe. 

Then it talks about God creating light, sun, moon, animals, etc.  And after each "day," it says the evening and the morning were the first day, second, and so on.  So, the creation of things during the evening and morning = six day creation.

Not everyone agrees with me and I'm not entirely sure what I believe when it comes to the age of the earth itself.  Some believe the earth itself was created at the same time the six-creation started.   

I'm with Beach Bum on this one.   Smiley
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« Reply #42 on: May 24, 2007, 08:21:36 AM »

Hmmm,  so all this wasn't created in 6 days? 
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« Reply #43 on: May 25, 2007, 03:55:38 AM »

Well, rocks are just... well.... rocks.
rocks tell so much, but it's a tough learning curve.
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« Reply #44 on: June 09, 2007, 10:44:28 PM »

i read a book a few years ago expanding on the Genesis 1:1-2 and please forgive me if I don't explain exactly the way the author intended.

He stated in Gen 1:1 God created earth and between Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2 is the whole story of the expulsion of Lucifer and the Fallen angesl from Heaven (Ezekiel 28:2). thus causing God to destroy the earth he had created.

in Gen 1:11 and 12 the author explains the fact of grass and trees yielding after his ownkind was showing that they existed before and just being reformed. 

Please excuse me if I didn't get the authors explanation out, its been a few years and I really cannot remember the name of the book. 
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« Reply #45 on: September 09, 2011, 03:15:10 PM »

Carbon dating deals with ANYTHING fossilized.

ie... Grass and Animals.
for the record, carbon dating doesn't deal with anything fossilized but can be used for grass and animals.  Carbon dating has a short range so most fossils are to old for carbon dating. Which definitely puts them older than 7000 years ago lol...
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« Reply #46 on: September 09, 2011, 03:20:07 PM »

for the record, carbon dating doesn't deal with anything fossilized but can be used for grass and animals.  Carbon dating has a short range so most fossils are to old for carbon dating. Which definitely puts them older than 7000 years ago lol...

Then I must be mistaken... If I recall my physics class, it was anything fossilized.

That said, way older than 7000 years.
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« Reply #47 on: September 09, 2011, 03:32:09 PM »

Then I must be mistaken... If I recall my physics class, it was anything fossilized.

That said, way older than 7000 years.
The only reason it can't measure fossils that are really old is because of the half life of the carbon 14 isotope.  Since the dating method uses the rate of decay, it's useless after the carbon 14 has fully decayed.  The absolute range for carbon dating is something like 60,000 years.  All older organic life than that won't work with carbon dating.  but there are other dating methods with other isotopes.
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« Reply #48 on: September 09, 2011, 05:34:40 PM »

The only reason it can't measure fossils that are really old is because of the half life of the carbon 14 isotope.  Since the dating method uses the rate of decay, it's useless after the carbon 14 has fully decayed.  The absolute range for carbon dating is something like 60,000 years.  All older organic life than that won't work with carbon dating.  but there are other dating methods with other isotopes.

True... Either way, it certainly is much older than 6,000 years.
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« Reply #49 on: September 10, 2011, 09:06:53 AM »

tu_holmes as usual talking about stuff he knows nothing about and making claims he can't back up.  A true champion at self-owning.    Grin

tu_holmes, you do this here and in many other threads.  Stick to making claims about stuff you actually do know something about, and stay away from trashing the Bible and Christianity.  I hope at least you have learned something from all your self-owning on the subject.

Doesn't it say in the Bible a day to God is 1000 years?

No, I think that's something recent people have made up actually... If there's a passage stating that, I've never seen it.

You're probably thinking of 2 Peter 3:8:  "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."  

Carbon dating deals with ANYTHING fossilized.

ie... Grass and Animals.

for the record, carbon dating doesn't deal with anything fossilized but can be used for grass and animals.  Carbon dating has a short range so most fossils are to old for carbon dating. Which definitely puts them older than 7000 years ago lol...
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