pm question answered

[Van_Bilderass]

Creaine is NOT poisonous to the kidneys. Creatinine, the byproduct after a phosphate group has been removed from the creatine molecule IS toxic. Get it right SUCKY 

Neither of them is toxic to the kidneys!!! Creatinine is just a marker of kidney dysfunction. High creatinine due to creatine supplementation isn't toxic!

[Van_Bilderass]

  Nope. Creatine is directly poisonous to the kidneys. Take 100 grams at once, and 4 hours latter your kidneys will shut down. Just because the tiny amount that bodybuilders take is not enough to damage the kidneys. it doesen't mean that damage isn't being done.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Bullshit. Please show me evidence that creatine, at any dose, shuts down the kidneys or is toxic. Everything can be toxic when enough is ingested, even water, but creatine in comon bb dosages isn't toxic at all. NO evidence of such. but if you have post it. All 100g of creatine will do is cause stomach cramps. There is ZERO evidence that long term creatine supplementation is in any way harmful.

[The Squadfather]

Bullshit. Please show me evidence that creatine, at any dose, shuts down the kidneys or is toxic. Everything can be toxic when enough is ingested, even water, but creatine in comon bb dosages isn't toxic at all. NO evidence of such. but if you have post it.

exactly, where do people come up with this nonsense.

[Van_Bilderass]

One of the reasons steroids make you stronger and make you hold more water is increased creatine phosphate in muscle. If additional dietary creatine can fill up the muscles even more it's beneficial even for juicers IMO. Costs pennies, so it's a worthwhile supplement if it works for you.

[Dballn247]

exactly, where do people come up with this nonsense.

Just blame Michael Vick, he's the countries scapegoat right now.

[gh15]

i like the way vanblinder puts it,,if it works for you then use it,,hes on the money with almost every post he makes in my opinion

[Benny B]

LOL.   The real answer is :   Steroids give you protien synthesis and cellular bloat already.....so why add creatine?    Save your money for more gear.

gh15 will be so proud of me...

Exactly. Creatine is a waste to gh15 because he's an extreme juice-monkey. Of course he's not going to notice anything from ordinary over-the-counter supplements. You never ask a consistent steroid user about legal supplements...their opinions are largely irrelevant. Nothing matches the powerful effects of performance enhancing drugs.

A few claim creatine does nothing for them, but I sure noticed its effects from the first time I loaded on the stuff. And yes, I believe loading is important...none of this "five grams a day from day one" bullshit. That doesn't saturate the body with enough creatine. At least not for me. After doing the 20 grams a day for five days followed and then going to five grams per day,  I got stronger on most lifts for several weeks before the effects leveled off. Not necessarily muscle gains, but strength gains. And gained a few pounds as well. Its one of the VERY few legal supplements where I actually noticed a real, legitimate impact.

[Benny B]

  Nope. Creatine is directly poisonous to the kidneys. Take 100 grams at once, and 4 hours latter your kidneys will shut down. Just because the tiny amount that bodybuilders take is not enough to damage the kidneys. it doesen't mean that damage isn't being done.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Idiot

[300]

i like the way vanblinder puts it,,if it works for you then use it,,hes on the money with almost every post he makes in my opinion

Hi "vanblinder"!   

[Camel Jockey]

creatine always upset my stomach.

[delta9mda]

creatine always upset my stomach.

the monohydrate causes stomach problems, not the newer ethyl ester or malate.

[Don Miracle]

Thanks, GH. 

[local hero]

i agree 100% with gh here, i think a lot of people are kiddin them selves regarding supplements... unless someones sent free stuff or is paid to advertise it, id guarentee that they would only use very basic supplemnts, protein powders and such... and the nattys who swear by these supplements and who keep chasing the next big thing want to wake up and get on the gear, which is basicly what they want to do deep down but for some reason dont.. if they were happy natty they wouldnt keep using bizzar overpriced rubbish each week!

[Benny B]

i agree 100% with gh here, i think a lot of people are kiddin them selves regarding supplements... unless someones sent free stuff or is paid to advertise it, id guarentee that they would only use very basic supplemnts, protein powders and such... and the nattys who swear by these supplements and who keep chasing the next big thing want to wake up and get on the gear, which is basicly what they want to do deep down but for some reason dont.. if they were happy natty they wouldnt keep using bizzar overpriced rubbish each week!

You the "local hero" of the gay bathhouse? Fuckin' moron.

[local hero]

ok,, go and get huge on creatine and gakic or whatever..,. i'll whack 1000mg of sus in and be the bigest in the bathouse

[SteelePegasus]

only on getbig!!

don't use creatine....bad for you especially at 100g every couple of hours
anabolic steriods and a big mac....good for you..minimal water bloat

got it

[suckmymuscle]

Asinine example.

Many things become poisonous when taking is mega-doses.

Nobody is going to run around calling creatine toxic 

  Eating 100 grams of chocolate is not dangerous, or 100 grams of bread, or of steak, or of sugar - unless you're biabetic. My point is that creatine has a much higher level of toxicity than most things you can ingest. Is it as toxic as cyanide? No. Is it as safe as food and other supplments? No. Understand this, you incredible moron? Creatine has a level of toxicity more akin to that of a drug than a food.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Van_Bilderass]

Creatine has a level of toxicity more akin to that of a drug than a food.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Please please qualify that statement! At what dosage does it start to exhibit toxicity and what are the symptoms and what systems are affected? I can tell you that it hasn't been shown to have any toxicity at about 30 grams a day so that we know. At what dose does it start to become toxic?

Since you are so sure of this "creatine toxicity" you must have some proof? It sure as hell isn't in any study so what are you basing this on? There are no medical reports of people exhibiting toxicity with it and it has been on the market since the early 90s. I'll say that that is a very non-toxic substance with such a track record (nobody dying or getting damage from it).

[suckmymuscle]

Please please qualify that statement! At what dosage does it start to exhibit toxicity and what are the symptoms and what systems are affected? I can tell you that it hasn't been shown to have any toxicity at about 30 grams a day so that we know. At what dose does it start to become toxic?

  I do not know the dosage, but I do know that it's toxicity is high enough for it to not deserve being qualified as a supplement. It is definitely more toxic than butter, for instance - which is bad for your health. You can eat 100 grams a day of butter for years without having clogged artery, but 100 grams of creatine a day for years will most definitley harm your kidneys.

Since you are so sure of this "creatine toxicity" you must have some proof? It sure as hell isn't in any study so what are you basing this on? There are no medical reports of people exhibiting toxicity with it and it has been on the market since the early 90s. I'll say that that is a very non-toxic substance with such a track record (nobody dying or getting damage from it).

  I am basing it on the fact that I used creatine daily in doses much lower than 100 grams for a month and my urine started to come out a dark orange and I felt nauseated. The doctor had me examed and said that my kidneys were functioning at 80% capacity. When I stopped the creatine, I returned to normal in a few days. So, I have direct, empirical evidence that creatine is bad for the kidneys. The study was done on myself.

SUCKMYMUSCLE                                                                                                                                                   

[pobrecito]

  Eating 100 grams of chocolate is not dangerous, or 100 grams of bread, or of steak, or of sugar - unless you're biabetic. My point is that creatine has a much higher level of toxicity than most things you can ingest. Is it as toxic as cyanide? No. Is it as safe as food and other supplments? No. Understand this, you incredible moron? Creatine has a level of toxicity more akin to that of a drug than a food.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

Try taking in 1000 grams of protein per day via supplement and tell me how your kidneys are doing 

The bottom line is, recommended use of creatine is not in the least bit toxic. I'm surprised you've come back after being OWNED claiming that gluconeogenesis involves the conversion of carbohydrates hahahahahahahah what a moron LOL.

[garraeth]

It's funny how a couple anon internet bandits can come on here and actually have the ballz to debate this.

I'm not anon by a long shot.

Trust me when I say, I was really, really surprised at how anal all the pros were with their "normal" supplementation. If not given them, they'd insist on glutamine + creatine post workout, religiously -- And, no, these men & women aren't beginners (15+ years each), and obviously not anon.

So, what I'm saying is, basically, you're truly a moron if you listen to some jackoff anon inet warrior with "all the answers". 

[Benny B]

ok,, go and get huge on creatine and gakic or whatever..,. i'll whack 1000mg of sus in and be the bigest in the bathouse

Until you drop dead from the "1000mg of sus" or your sphincter ruptures from the bathhouse man-love. All the best! 

[Beener]

You the "local hero" of the gay bathhouse? Fuckin' moron.

I wouldn't mind having a bathhouse. all i have now is a shitty ass stand up shower. And i need to get a new curtain cuz the old one is gettin narsty..

[Necrosis]

   Just because the tiny amount that bodybuilders take is not enough to damage the kidneys. it doesen't mean that damage isn't being done.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

you contradicted yourself in two sentences.

not enough to cause damage, then you say it doesnt mean it doesn cause damage?

creatinine is toxic, but low doses will have no effect, so by that logic anything high in creatine will damage the kidneys, including all forms of meat.

which i would agree with, but supplementing has shown benefits in clinical study.

[GroinkTropin]

This is bullshit creatine is very useful and not all all kidney toxic if taken within reason. The toxicity argument stems from monohydrate ONLY, not ethyl ester kre alkalyn etc. Basically when you take monohydrate, you need to ingest about 10 grams per serving as about 90% instantly degrades when mixed with water. The creatine drops it's water molecule, and voila you have creatinine. I do agree monohydrate is horrible, but the others are fine and plenty effective. Keeps the size on after a cycle of whatever, it's more of a bridger than a builder IMO.