As it relates to financial wealth...

[Paul Allen]

a key to riches, a rich man told me once, is not bigger paychecks; it's less bills.

[XFACTOR]

a key to riches, a rich man told me once, is not bigger paychecks; it's less bills.

Nice!

I'm fucked then,lol.

[Butterbean]

You could say that about Mother Teresa, Jebus or Ghandi, yet they didn't have a dime...

OK, I was talking about regular people who adopt that attitude mainly through accumulation of wealth and assets...... but to put a dollar amount on it, I'll agree w/the 10 million depending on age and spending habits; if it's successfully invested and/or income is still coming in and if the person isn't a meth or crackhead.

[wisconsinBB]

OK, I was talking about regular people who adopt that attitude mainly through accumulation of wealth and assets...... but to put a dollar amount on it, I'll agree w/the 10 million depending on age and spending habits; if it's successfully invested and/or income is still coming in and if the person isn't a meth or crackhead.

Where you live makes a HUGE difference.  Having a 10M net worth in Manhatten isn't nearly as impressive as having a 10M net worth living in Northeast wisconsin!

[Butterbean]

Where you live makes a HUGE difference.  Having a 10M net worth in Manhatten isn't nearly as impressive as having a 10M net worth living in Northeast wisconsin!

good point!

[troponin]

I think a net worth of $10.8 million puts you in the top 1% in the US. 

The top 1% of wealth are worth more than the bottom 90% combined. 

I'm pretty sure they don't count primary living residence as wealth for that measure, even if it is paid in full.  If that was counted, I'm sure the number would be a good bit higher.

[D-bol]

"if it's not "instant" it's not worth persuing?? Are you serious? Unless you win the lotto or inherit from some rich family member, there is no such thing as "instant" wealth. Every wealthy person didn't start out rich, even the CEO's who make 10mil a year didn't start out making that much, they had to work their way up the ladder as well, and trust me, it wasn't overnight, it took years upon years.

by instant i mean 5-10 years...it is achievable with the right business model for good entreprenueral idea...prolly achievable in executive ranks aswell if you are one of the best

what i see as useless is putting away few grand every year to a unit trust or some other passive investment fund and waiting for it to grow by cumulative 50% over 40 years....imo that's stupid, but unless you are a snob....

there is also an argument of leaving that money to your kids...but in 90% of the time, what took the father to accumulate over 40 years will take the son/daughter to piss down the pipes in a matter of months...

[omg]

being rich is being able to sit at home all day long and watch tv

[troponin]

by instant i mean 5-10 years...it is achievable with the right business model for good entreprenueral idea...prolly achievable in executive ranks aswell if you are one of the best

what i see as useless is putting away few grand every year to a unit trust or some other passive investment fund and waiting for it to grow by cumulative 50% over 40 years....imo that's stupid, but unless you are a snob....

there is also an argument of leaving that money to your kids...but in 90% of the time, what took the father to accumulate over 40 years will take the son/daughter to piss down the pipes in a matter of months...

I think you're grossly underestimating what a few grand a month can do in a good investment. 
You say that "instant" wealth is 5-10 years.  Put $2k a month into a good investment for 10 years, and tell me how much money you have.  I'm willing to bet that liquidating that money after 10 years will make you very happy. 

Most people don't realize what proper investing early in their financial careers can do as they age.  Being smart with your money when you're young will pay off 10 fold as you age. 

This doesn't mean you have to live as a pauper through your 20's either.  It just means being smart with your money. 
Making good investments at 25 that cause you to live "convervatively" for a few years will allow you to live comfortably in 5 years, very well in 10 years, and live extremely well in 20 years. 

[D-bol]

troponin,

I hear what you say. To avoid too many words, I'll just express my responce by hypothetical example.

Take a good sports car. Now, you are being smart w/ your money at 20's. So, you don't buy it at 20's and invest the money.
At 40 you can afford an even better sports car as you have been smart w/ your money and now have surplus through your investments.
The only thing is....at 40 you don't value sports car as much as at 20....

Everything is good in it's own time

[KillerMonk]

I support Worldvision i sponsor a child at a dollar a day,Even though im on a Pension i feel very Rich,In my 20s i was making tons of money and all it did was cause me worry.
If it was not for my desire to have kids i would become a Buddist Monk as long as i could smoke Reefer.

[rocket]

For me, rich financially is enough money to live comfortably off the interest/dividends.  I won't put a dollar value but suffice to say I could live on peanuts.

[troponin]

troponin,

I hear what you say. To avoid too many words, I'll just express my responce by hypothetical example.

Take a good sports car. Now, you are being smart w/ your money at 20's. So, you don't buy it at 20's and invest the money.
At 40 you can afford an even better sports car as you have been smart w/ your money and now have surplus through your investments.
The only thing is....at 40 you don't value sports car as much as at 20....

Everything is good in it's own time

Or, you could buy the sports car at 28 instead of 26, only this time you can pay cash for it. 
Then, invest what your payment would be over the next 3-4 years of driving and put that towards the downpayment of a home, cutting the monthly payment down dramatically.
Then, sell the sports car for 50% of what you paid, take that money and buy a good family car....again paying cash and use the money you save on the monthly mortgage to either re-invest or lease another sports car just to dick around with. 

So, in your early 30's you could either have a mortgage payment that tightens your budget but have had a sports car in your mid 20's. 

Or, you could have a low mortgage on a beautiful home, a new car paid in full....and have had a sports car in your 20's with another new sports car today. 
You could also take the money that you're saving by not having a payment on the sedan and pay down the house early, or blow a few hundred a month on skunky beer in a green bottle that claims to be German....whatever you happen to value at that time. 

You can pay $3k a month on a mortgage and take 30 years to pay for a home when the interest is working against you.
Or, you can put $3k a month into an investment for 5 years and then pay cash for that home. 
That is the difference when your money is working for you.....25 years difference in payments. 

It doesn't take decades for investments to be worth your while. 

[affy]

I hear this all the time. 
This is the most asinine statement imaginable when it comes to finances. 
If people would be smart with their money for a short time frame early in their career, they could enjoy an almost exponential increase in money the rest of their life. 

If people would put a few grand a month into investments in their 20's, they could then live like they wanted to live now in a year or two. 
At that point, they could still put money away, and in another year or two could live much better than they would if they had never put money away. 
By the time they reached their 40's, they could be living much better than they would had they not taken that initial year to be smart.  And, despite spending much more money they could still invest and allow all their previous investments to grow. 

a few grand a month into investments?  No one in their early 20s has a few grand a month to invest.  These are new graduates who are in some serious dept after school, no way they can invest a few thousand a month unless they got a free ride.  Even then...most entry level positions make <50 grand after taxes...thats around 4000/month.  After mortgage payments, car payments, and other shit... you would be lucky to invest a couple hundred a month..which is still good

another getbigger talking out of his ass

As for the original question...i think you're 'rich' or financially wealthy when you have enough money to hire other people to manage your money. 

[Tre]

About the $2000/month:

Over 10 years, that $2000/month would grow to $320,000 at a conservative 5% interest. 

(If you were able to get 10% from your investments, your money would be worth $425,000) 

At 5%:

After 15 years, you'd have $545,000.

After 20 years, you'd have $835,000.

After 25 years, you'd have $1,200,000.

After 30 years, you'd have $1,600,000.

At 10% (which is possible):

After 30 years, you'd have $4,300,000. 

-------------------------------------

Compound interest is a wonderful thing and one does not have to be a rich or a financial genius to take advantage of it.  You just have to be dedicated to saving what you earn instead of being dedicated to spending it. 

I would much rather be able to retire at 55 than to drive fancy cars when I'm younger and have to work until I'm 60+. 

Right now, I have a dilemma, though - my car is 11 years old and although it's driveable, it's dripping oil.  The repair will cost $2300...more than the value of the car. 

If I do replace it, I'd like to upgrade to a newer vehicle, but that would deplete my savings by about $15,000.  And let's not forget that my insurance will go way up, too.  So, each month, it's going to cost me more just to drive. 

I think I'm finally going to bite the bullet and buy myself a newer truck, but I'm not 100% happy about it.  If the repair on my Thunderbird was $1200 or less, I would've gotten it fixed and never looked back. 

[Tre]

a few grand a month into investments?  No one in their early 20s has a few grand a month to invest.  These are new graduates who are in some serious dept after school, no way they can invest a few thousand a month unless they got a free ride.  Even then...most entry level positions make <50 grand after taxes...thats around 4000/month.  After mortgage payments, car payments, and other shit... you would be lucky to invest a couple hundred a month..which is still good

another getbigger talking out of his ass

As for the original question...i think you're 'rich' or financially wealthy when you have enough money to hire other people to manage your money.

A lot of people have more money than they think they do and as a result, they waste more money than they should.

Hate to pick on her again, but let's talk about my wife for a moment.  Even though I've demonstrated to her that using coupons can save hundreds of dollars a year, she complains that they are 'too much trouble'.  Unbelievable - she'd rather just give that money to the store/manufacturer than to have it for our own uses.  Save $1200/year over 20 years and you've kept $24,000 in YOUR pocket. 

We need to stop teaching bullshit and start teaching people to be smarter with their money.  There's this misguided perception that conspicuous consumption is what drives the American economy and that's a crap philosophy.  All that does is make the rich (many of whom are foreign investors) richer and makes us more reliant on outsiders to keep our money afloat. 

[troponin]

A lot of people have more money than they think they do and as a result, they waste more money than they should.

Hate to pick on her again, but let's talk about my wife for a moment.  Even though I've demonstrated to her that using coupons can save hundreds of dollars a year, she complains that they are 'too much trouble'.  Unbelievable - she'd rather just give that money to the store/manufacturer than to have it for our own uses.  Save $1200/year over 20 years and you've kept $24,000 in YOUR pocket. 

We need to stop teaching bullshit and start teaching people to be smarter with their money.  There's this misguided perception that conspicuous consumption is what drives the American economy and that's a crap philosophy.  All that does is make the rich (many of whom are foreign investors) richer and makes us more reliant on outsiders to keep our money afloat. 

Couldn't agree more. 
Take the money most people blow on buying lunch AT work, fast food, sticks of gum, sodas when they get gas, etc., etc., and invest all that money for a decade, and there would be a lot less people complaining about money. 

I remember saving up a month's rent in college by taking all the change I had from purchases and putting it in a jar for a year.  Change I would have typically just left lying around or lost.

[MindSpin]

Couldn't agree more. 
Take the money most people blow on buying lunch AT work, fast food, sticks of gum, sodas when they get gas, etc., etc., and invest all that money for a decade, and there would be a lot less people complaining about money. 

I remember saving up a month's rent in college by taking all the change I had from purchases and putting it in a jar for a year.  Change I would have typically just left lying around or lost.

Troponin...

What do you think is a better use of money when it comes to primary home...to pay for it entirely or to get a mortgage and put your money to work somewhere else?

[troponin]

Troponin...

What do you think is a better use of money when it comes to primary home...to pay for it entirely or to get a mortgage and put your money to work somewhere else?

I'm certainly not an expert, but what is the APR on the mortgage? 
If you plan on living in the home for a short time (especially when the housing market isn't doing well), get a low APR, and feel you can get a better return than that on your investments, then I suppose that could be a good choice. 
But, if you're getting 6% on the home, you'll have to get a 10% return to make 1% over a 3% inflation rate.  That's not great odds. 

For most people, paying for their primary home entirely is not really an option. 
In areas of Michigan, you can buy a decent home for under $150k.  In an area like that, you could put $3k a month away for a few years and with a good return, pay cash for a home.  If that was an option, I'd do that. 
That isn't going to be an option for 95% of the geographical US. lol



Owning property is a powerful money making tool.  As an example:
You own a business, and want to buy a building.  You're currently renting. 

The building you wish to purchase is $1 million.  You're not sure you can make that payment, so you don't know what to do. 

I say buy into the building.  If the ONLY thing your business does is allow you to pay the mortgage on that building....you have to scrape by on business lines of credit, your wife's income, etc., etc.....and when you make the final payment on that building, your business totally fails.  You sell the business to another company and only cover your losses.

If that is the case, owning that building has made you a millionaire.  And a 'real' millionaire, as you have a million dollars of net worth separate from your primary residence. 
You can rent that building out to another company for (in this case) the same amount of money as your entire business was profiting each month.  The rent on that building, and the net worth of that building (especially when considering the average growth of that property over a period of years) is a better business than your 'real' business ever was. 


I'm certainly no expert.  I'm interested in this, but I didn't major in business.  My brother-in-law is my financial advisor, and he has helped us out a ton over the years.

[Livewire]

A lot of people have more money than they think they do and as a result, they waste more money than they should.

Hate to pick on her again, but let's talk about my wife for a moment.  Even though I've demonstrated to her that using coupons can save hundreds of dollars a year, she complains that they are 'too much trouble'.  Unbelievable - she'd rather just give that money to the store/manufacturer than to have it for our own uses.  Save $1200/year over 20 years and you've kept $24,000 in YOUR pocket. 

We need to stop teaching bullshit and start teaching people to be smarter with their money.  There's this misguided perception that conspicuous consumption is what drives the American economy and that's a crap philosophy.  All that does is make the rich (many of whom are foreign investors) richer and makes us more reliant on outsiders to keep our money afloat. 

Tre, I have Four grand I'd like to invest in a new pair of Rims for my truck.

I feel that by high-signing them all up and down my street, their value will appreciate among my friends and enemies alike.  in a few months, I will sell them and use the profits to buy nicer rims.

Please share your opinion on my investment philosophy.

[WhiteCastle]

Being able to quit working and live very comfortably off of investments and interest alone.

[omg]

hahaha who gives a shit, ur money is dependent on the usd.

if u had 1 million last year, you have like 900grand or 800grand this year on depreciation of usd alone. add in inflation, and it goes even lower

invest in silver/gold or real estate please.

[phreak]

my dream is living self-sufficiently on a little (5-10 hectare) farm. I don't really mind having to work a "real" job on the side. Oddly enough being self-sufficient requires an enormous amount of capital up-front. (at least where I live)

So rich for me and the wife would be having a net monthly income of about E 4000 (about USD 5500 at today's exchange rates). Should be there in a few years from now. This getbigger owns up to not being a multi-millionaire!

[bigdumbbell]

select slums that are close in and ontop of future subways stops

[MindSpin]

my dream is living self-sufficiently on a little (5-10 hectare) farm. I don't really mind having to work a "real" job on the side. Oddly enough being self-sufficient requires an enormous amount of capital up-front. (at least where I live)

So rich for me and the wife would be having a net monthly income of about E 4000 (about USD 5500 at today's exchange rates). Should be there in a few years from now. This getbigger owns up to not being a multi-millionaire!

that's a cool aspiration...