Is this back workout too much?

[JasonH]

I say yes - my training partner insists on it and it's starting to piss me off as it's burning me out (seeing as I'm currently natural). I'm getting some positive results from it but I think the same could be achieved by actually doing less. Here it is:

Warm-upWide-grip chins 3 sets to failure each time.

Main workout
Deadlifts - 3 sets 10-12 reps (to failure)
Close-grip pulldowns 3 sets 12 reps (to failure)
Wide grip cable rows 3 sets 12 reps (to failure)
T-Bar Rows - 3 sets 10-12 reps (to failure)
Unilateral Hammer machine rows - 3 sets 8-10 reps (to failure with forced reps each time)

Personally I'm thinking of dropping either the t-bar rows or the hammer rows - I mean there's 18 sets here. What do you people reckon?

[wes]

Not too excessive,but depends on how long he has been training and whether or not he is making gains.

The back is a big musclegroup and can take lots of work.

[JasonH]

Not too excessive,but depends on how long he has been training and whether or not he is making gains.

The back is a big musclegroup and can take lots of work.

He's been training for 20 years + and I've been training for nearly 15 years. He's a strong guy and great to work with, very intense,  but he doesn't eat right and as a result tends to stay the same size year after year. Maybe I'm just being a bit of a pussy about it really - the other muscle groups we work together are fine.

[Your MAAAAaaaa]

Personally I would only include One rowing movement, however that is my preference, it looks good to me but I would only use 2 of the three rows, maybe rotate them weekly.


Also why would you need to waste so much energy warming up? It decreases your ability when your actually working.

ta ta

[pumpster]

-If you're using good intensity and going to failure on most sets and maybe beyond failure occasionally on some sets, you would only need one type of each exercise 3-4 sets. The other exercises could be substituted in or out of the workout over time:

3-4 sets with high intensity of each:

1/ Rowing of some type - doing 3 types of rowing per workout's overkill for sure.
2/ Chins or pulldowns, one or the other
3/ Pullovers-one of the best for lats.


You say you're making decent gains. Try less sets and use even more intensity re training to failure or beyond, since you'll have less to do. Do that for 4-6 weeks and compare the results with what you're doing now.


-Also i find it strange that you're doing deads right in the middle of upper back work; I would separate them and do them at the end of the workout.

[omgsoswole]

FWIW, I only do 4 work sets per back workout...and get good size and strength gains.  The gains that I get (natural) are good enough to suggest that I wouldn't get much more from doing more volume.

Normally 2 work sets for a row (T-bar/Dumbell/Cable) and two sets chinning (chins/lat pull down).

Started off training with high volume so changing to this was a big step...well worth a try though as I feel it saves me a lot of time in the gym, for pretty much the same results.

[wes]

With 20 years of training under his belt,that looks OK to me.

Deadlifting early in the routine is fine, but it can tax the lower back and limit poundages on rowing movements.

The bottom line is,are you guys making gains........if not,change it up.

Progress is all that matters no matter what you are doing and no matter what others think or advise.........we are all different and will respond differently to different training protocols.

[JasonH]

With 20 years of training under his belt,that looks OK to me.

Deadlifting early in the routine is fine, but it can tax the lower back and limit poundages on rowing movements.

The bottom line is,are you guys making gains........if not,change it up.

Progress is all that matters no matter what you are doing and no matter what others think or advise.........we are all different and will respond differently to different training protocols.

Good advice - the deadlifting early on in the routine I don't have a problem with and I don't feel it impedes my strength on other movements to any extent.

I'll keep things the way they are for now until I feel I'm no longer getting any benefits from it. I did a back workout today and seeing as I've now got the whole weekend to recover I should be alright.

[pumpster]

Good advice - the deadlifting early on in the routine I don't have a problem with and I don't feel it impedes my strength on other movements to any extent.

I'll keep things the way they are for now until I feel I'm no longer getting any benefits from it. I did a back workout today and seeing as I've now got the whole weekend to recover I should be alright.

You're welcome.

[JasonH]

You're welcome.

And you too Pumpster.   

[haider]

I say yes - my training partner insists on it and it's starting to piss me off as it's burning me out (seeing as I'm currently natural). I'm getting some positive results from it but I think the same could be achieved by actually doing less. Here it is:

Warm-upWide-grip chins 3 sets to failure each time.

Main workout
Deadlifts - 3 sets 10-12 reps (to failure)
Close-grip pulldowns 3 sets 12 reps (to failure)
Wide grip cable rows 3 sets 12 reps (to failure)
T-Bar Rows - 3 sets 10-12 reps (to failure)
Unilateral Hammer machine rows - 3 sets 8-10 reps (to failure with forced reps each time)

Personally I'm thinking of dropping either the t-bar rows or the hammer rows - I mean there's 18 sets here. What do you people reckon?

Need more vertical movements, why so much rowing? I would add chins/pullovers, take out one of the rowing exercise so one rowing exercise is strength oriented while the other is more of a "squeezing" movement. Or you could just take 10 exercises milosh style and do 10 giant sets

[pumpster]

And you too Pumpster.   

For what, we helped you..

[delta9mda]

do one less set on the last 3 exercises.

[LatsMcGee]

Keep a row, a pull, and if you're a volume freak chin til you puke.  That's all you really need.

[jdooly]

 I don't think it's too much, but, maybe go full-bore/failure then drop off the last exercise.  Lee Haney "stimulate, don't annihilate."  But, he was not like us.