Author Topic: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House  (Read 6395 times)

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2007, 06:14:00 PM »
I am still amazed that republican candidates get elected.

Their interests in privatizing everything and legislating solely to the benefit of the monied elites while overloading the burdens of the middle and lower class should bar them from receiving even scant support in popular elections.

But their political bullshit still draws votes from the great unwashed:

Tax cuts double tax revenues.

It's normal to work 2500 hours a year.

Any government program that helps you out is socialism and it fosters dependence.

Real americans hate corrupt unions.

You really can work your way up the income mobility chain.

Racism is over and everyone should be treated equally.

Tax rates are confiscatory and everyone should pay the same rate.

Abortion is the single most pressing issue--Once in office, I won't do anything about it--but it is the single most pressing issue facing us today.

Every country is threat to our well-being and we must be prepared to attack any country with our smart bombs which only kill bad guys.

You may not have health insurance but you certainly don't want socialized medicine...it's better to die a dignified manner--uninsured with no commie medical plan.

The government is stoopid and couldn't find a couch in a fucking living room....but I still want to be president!

God Bless and Good night.



Do you support Ron Paul?
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Decker

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2007, 06:18:36 PM »
Do you support Ron Paul?
I support his anti-war stance.  I do not support his economic, educational or health insurance policies.

I support Russ Feingold but he's not running for president.

Here is a website for Ron Paul fans.  http://www.antiwar.com/
It's a libertarian website.


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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2007, 06:28:20 PM »
I support his anti-war stance.  I do not support his economic, educational or health insurance policies.
I support Russ Feingold but he's not running for president.

Here is a website for Ron Paul fans.  http://www.antiwar.com/
It's a libertarian website.



Democrat, are you?

What do you have against his economic, educational and health insurance policies?
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Dos Equis

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2007, 06:31:45 PM »
I support his anti-war stance.  I do not support his economic, educational or health insurance policies.

I support Russ Feingold but he's not running for president.

Here is a website for Ron Paul fans.  http://www.antiwar.com/
It's a libertarian website.



I support Colin Powell, but he ain't running either, unfortunately. 

Decker

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #29 on: December 20, 2007, 07:15:02 PM »
Democrat, are you?

What do you have against his economic, educational and health insurance policies?
I've looked at his issues here:  http://www.ronpaul2008.com/issues/  
Economics usually means tax policy.  Less taxation is fine but I also noted that he mentions that capital gains taxes should be reduced too.  This smells of flat taxation which is really a tax hike on the lower and middle class...I mean the capital gains tax rate is already very low.

I believe Universal healthcare is the right course for this country.  Ron Paul does not.

I believe a citizenry educated as a matter of right at the gov.'s expense is in the best interest of the country as a whole.  Ron Paul doesn't.

He is a man of character.  I am not debating that.

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2007, 07:17:26 PM »
I support Colin Powell, but he ain't running either, unfortunately. 

Same here - America's one true leader refuses to enter the race. 

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #31 on: December 20, 2007, 08:07:09 PM »
I've looked at his issues here:  http://www.ronpaul2008.com/issues/  
Economics usually means tax policy.  Less taxation is fine but I also noted that he mentions that capital gains taxes should be reduced too.  This smells of flat taxation which is really a tax hike on the lower and middle class...I mean the capital gains tax rate is already very low.

I believe Universal healthcare is the right course for this country.  Ron Paul does not.

I believe a citizenry educated as a matter of right at the gov.'s expense is in the best interest of the country as a whole.  Ron Paul doesn't.

He is a man of character.  I am not debating that.

I like RP too but when he talks about abolishing the FDA, Dept of Ed, CIA, etc...I just can't get on board

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2007, 08:21:50 PM »
Same here - America's one true leader refuses to enter the race. 
yes... who can forget him knowingly lying his ass off at about mobile bio labs and bla bla bla... great guy...

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #33 on: December 20, 2007, 11:44:38 PM »
Same here - America's one true leader refuses to enter the race. 

Yep. 

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2007, 04:22:07 AM »
yes... who can forget him knowingly lying his ass off at about mobile bio labs and bla bla bla... great guy...

yeah, powell used to be my #1 choice for President.

But yeah, history will show him to be a big liar on that one.

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #35 on: December 22, 2007, 09:57:43 PM »
Its hard to hang your head high, when the stupidest man on the planet, is your president.... :'(


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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #36 on: December 23, 2007, 01:11:40 AM »
I like RP too but when he talks about abolishing the FDA, Dept of Ed, CIA, etc...I just can't get on board

Why do you think that the FDA and the Department of Education are necessary? Or the CIA for that matter?
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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #37 on: December 23, 2007, 03:09:08 AM »
War, i'm not sure how to post links up on GB so google..... youtube "bush on contractors in iraq"  and post the link up for all to see. this jackass in the WH amazes me with his utter stupidity.

watch how a first year college student runs circles around bush. truely pathetic.

Are you the chick in the picture? ;D
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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #38 on: December 23, 2007, 03:31:38 AM »

Trap, can you find this and post the link here ?

thanks in advance.

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #39 on: December 23, 2007, 08:26:09 AM »
I am still amazed that republican candidates get elected.

Their interests in privatizing everything and legislating solely to the benefit of the monied elites while overloading the burdens of the middle and lower class should bar them from receiving even scant support in popular elections.

But their political bullshit still draws votes from the great unwashed:

Tax cuts double tax revenues.

It's normal to work 2500 hours a year.

Any government program that helps you out is socialism and it fosters dependence.

Real americans hate corrupt unions.

You really can work your way up the income mobility chain.

Racism is over and everyone should be treated equally.

Tax rates are confiscatory and everyone should pay the same rate.

Abortion is the single most pressing issue--Once in office, I won't do anything about it--but it is the single most pressing issue facing us today.

Every country is threat to our well-being and we must be prepared to attack any country with our smart bombs which only kill bad guys.

You may not have health insurance but you certainly don't want socialized medicine...it's better to die a dignified manner--uninsured with no commie medical plan.

The government is stoopid and couldn't find a couch in a fucking living room....but I still want to be president!

God Bless and Good night.



Well, democratic candidates are basically offering the same thing. Nowadays there isn't much of a difference between republicans and democratic candidates in that, when elected, their agendas are already set and their main purpose is to make sure the ones with the money get to keep the money they have.

Obama is a fake, and Ms Clinton does not stand a chance vs any republican candidate because they will eventually bring out the subject of Mr Clinton's affairs and use it against her in some ugly manner, which is going to polarize the folks in "God's country". Fucking shit!!!!

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #40 on: December 23, 2007, 02:40:31 PM »
Why do you think that the FDA and the Department of Education are necessary? Or the CIA for that matter?
Even with the FDA in place we still have outbreaks of deadly diseases from our food.  Without its regulation, the next food product you buy could be your last.  Not to mention that having no requirement to list food ingredients on a product's label would incline me to think that the manufacturer would be overloading your food with sawdust fillers and whatever the hell else they can get away with to save a buck.

It is in the interest of the country as a whole to have an educated citizenry.  I shouldn't have to explain this one b/c thanks to the federal government, we are educated enough to understand its implications.

The CIA and its unaccountable ass should be shitcanned.

Decker

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #41 on: December 23, 2007, 02:43:30 PM »
Well, democratic candidates are basically offering the same thing. Nowadays there isn't much of a difference between republicans and democratic candidates in that, when elected, their agendas are already set and their main purpose is to make sure the ones with the money get to keep the money they have.

Obama is a fake, and Ms Clinton does not stand a chance vs any republican candidate because they will eventually bring out the subject of Mr Clinton's affairs and use it against her in some ugly manner, which is going to polarize the folks in "God's country". Fucking shit!!!!
You are pretty much correct.  Except the democrats throw a bone to the middle and lower class once in a while. 

Where are the Universal Healthcare Plans of the republican candidates?  Why do the republicans want to destroy Social Security (which benefits that same middle and lower class of people)?

But on the whole, this is a country by and for the wealthy vested interests.

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #42 on: December 23, 2007, 03:36:25 PM »
Even with the FDA in place we still have outbreaks of deadly diseases from our food.  Without its regulation, the next food product you buy could be your last.  Not to mention that having no requirement to list food ingredients on a product's label would incline me to think that the manufacturer would be overloading your food with sawdust fillers and whatever the hell else they can get away with to save a buck.

It is in the interest of the country as a whole to have an educated citizenry.  I shouldn't have to explain this one b/c thanks to the federal government, we are educated enough to understand its implications.

The CIA and its unaccountable ass should be shitcanned.

Private companies and the market place could take better care of the food products than the FDA. Market competition would ensure better quality and service.

So you think it is right to force an uneducated farmer to pay for your education?
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Decker

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #43 on: December 23, 2007, 03:51:29 PM »
Private companies and the market place could take better care of the food products than the FDA. Market competition would ensure better quality and service.

So you think it is right to force an uneducated farmer to pay for your education?
That's a nice story but simply unfounded.  Caveat Emptor went the way of the dinosaur for a reason.  The buyer was always getting screwed.  Market competition/self regulation by its own hand is another popular fallacy.  Without stringent regulation of the marketplace, there would be no "Free Market" or put another way, we would have a few massive corporations owning everything while the scraps are left to small time participants battling in the free market. 

We're already seeing evidence of this with Bush's deregulation of the FCC for example.  Monopolies are taking over.  5 or 6 corporations own the country's media.

The market as a self-regulating force for the benefit of the public is a fairy tale propped up by Ayn Rand followers like Allen Greenspan.

Another way to think about the Free Market is to think of it as an athletic competition.  The regulations and regulatory agencies are the referees enforcing the rules under which the athletes play.

Nothing wrong with that.

Yes I think an uneducated farmer or a childless couple should pay their taxes to educate our nation's children.  We have a more productive workforce if it's educated, no?

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #44 on: December 23, 2007, 04:21:16 PM »
That's a nice story but simply unfounded.  Caveat Emptor went the way of the dinosaur for a reason.  The buyer was always getting screwed.  Market competition/self regulation by its own hand is another popular fallacy.  Without stringent regulation of the marketplace, there would be no "Free Market" or put another way, we would have a few massive corporations owning everything while the scraps are left to small time participants battling in the free market. 

We're already seeing evidence of this with Bush's deregulation of the FCC for example.  Monopolies are taking over.  5 or 6 corporations own the country's media.

The market as a self-regulating force for the benefit of the public is a fairy tale propped up by Ayn Rand followers like Allen Greenspan.

Another way to think about the Free Market is to think of it as an athletic competition.  The regulations and regulatory agencies are the referees enforcing the rules under which the athletes play.

Nothing wrong with that.

Yes I think an uneducated farmer or a childless couple should pay their taxes to educate our nation's children.  We have a more productive workforce if it's educated, no?

I agree; I am not advocating anarcho-capitalism and I think one of the jobs of the government is to enforce contracts when necessary. You are talking about corporatism, not true free market capitalism.

Why shouldn't the farmer be allowed to keep his money to spend it how he sees fit? For example on a silo or tractor? Why must he pay for someone else's ambitions?
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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #45 on: December 23, 2007, 04:33:17 PM »
I agree; I am not advocating anarcho-capitalism and I think one of the jobs of the government is to enforce contracts when necessary. You are talking about corporatism, not true free market capitalism.

Why shouldn't the farmer be allowed to keep his money to spend it how he sees fit? For example on a silo or tractor? Why must he pay for someone else's ambitions?
I just reread my response and I don't mean to sound like a jackass....that's what happens when I have to come into work without dinner on a Sunday night after the Packers just got assraped by the Bears in a frickin blizzard(now that's ironic).

Free Market Capitalism fettered only by contract law quickly devolves into monopolies.  Then freedom is really in the crapper.

All of society is better served by an educated workforce.  From the silo or tractor line workers manufacturing the farmer's equipment, to the traffic cop or sewer worker.

I'm all for lower taxes, but not at the expense of education.  Anyway, the point may be moot b/c the bulk of school taxes are state/local affairs and not the federal government's.

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #46 on: December 23, 2007, 04:39:49 PM »
I just reread my response and I don't mean to sound like a jackass....that's what happens when I have to come into work without dinner on a Sunday night after the Packers just got assraped by the Bears in a frickin blizzard(now that's ironic).

Free Market Capitalism fettered only by contract law quickly devolves into monopolies.  Then freedom is really in the crapper.

All of society is better served by an educated workforce.  From the silo or tractor line workers manufacturing the farmer's equipment, to the traffic cop or sewer worker.

I'm all for lower taxes, but not at the expense of education.  Anyway, the point may be moot b/c the bulk of school taxes are state/local affairs and not the federal government's.

In income tax is implicit the idea that the federal government owns your earnings. Roles of government are: 1. Enforcing Contracts, 2. Defence, 3. Protection of Individual Rights; that's it. You know it's funny, when I argue with social interventionists whatever the moniker they might give themselves and they insist on government intervention in our lives I always take it to the next step. You start asking them where it stops, should the government put you on a diet if you are overweight? Should it tell youwhat to eat? What to drink? How about government dress code? Then they start folding. They realise there is no end game in sight. If government can tell you not to smoke a joint where does it stop? The argument that there will be poor people or people who don't do too well is fallacious; in the USA we have a War on Drugs, a War on Poverty and a War on Illiteracy and none of these has cured these ills. When people can keep their earnings they prosper and do well and people are content instead of forking over a quarter or even half of what they earn to the government to be used for either well intentioned but ill begotten purposes or entirely nefarious purposes. When there is an income tax (which is necessary for the gigantic bureaucracy we have going), it is the government telling you it owns you and the fruits of your labour are not yours to spend as you will; it does not matter whether it is 3% or 60% because the minute a government starts stealing from your labour the amount stolen is arbitrary and the principle remains the same: it owns you. Free markets and individual freedom are all about the individual making choices for himself.
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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #47 on: December 23, 2007, 04:50:51 PM »
In income tax is implicit the idea that the federal government owns your earnings. Roles of government are: 1. Enforcing Contracts, 2. Defence, 3. Protection of Individual Rights; that's it. You know it's funny, when I argue with social interventionists whatever the moniker they might give themselves and they insist on government intervention in our lives I always take it to the next step. You start asking them where it stops, should the government put you on a diet if you are overweight? Should it tell youwhat to eat? What to drink? How about government dress code? Then they start folding. They realise there is no end game in sight. If government can tell you not to smoke a joint where does it stop? The argument that there will be poor people or people who don't do too well is fallacious; in the USA we have a War on Drugs, a War on Poverty and a War on Illiteracy and none of these has cured these ills. When people can keep their earnings they prosper and do well and people are content instead of forking over a quarter or even half of what they earn to the government to be used for either well intentioned but ill begotten purposes or entirely nefarious purposes. When there is an income tax (which is necessary for the gigantic bureaucracy we have going), it is the government telling you it owns you and the fruits of your labour are not yours to spend as you will; it does not matter whether it is 3% or 60% because the minute a government starts stealing from your labour the amount stolen is arbitrary and the principle remains the same: it owns you. Free markets and individual freedom are all about the individual making choices for himself.
The government is entitled to a portion of each citizen's earnings to maintain the infrastructure of the nation.

There is such a thing as a national interest.  We are not merely an amalgam of individuals doing our own thing.  That sort of freedom is available to us but we must fund the national interest.

I have yet to see a tax system implemented in this country where the federal government owns or takes all of a citizen's earnings.  So I disagree with you on that.

So you get your opposition to fold under the old slippery slope argument of "where does the regulation stop?!."

Here's where it stops:  We are the government.  It is a government by and for The People.  Being the reasonable people that we are, our consitution is predicated on principles from the Elilghtenment, we the people set the boundaries for where government intervention begins and ends.

I think that's a pretty good idea.

The Government can be misused if we let it.  Just look at the Bush administration which privatizes as many government functions to enrich cronies and remove accountability while these privatized functions are done at extreme costs and in a half-assed manner.

Taxation without representation can be characterized as stealing.

This country has taxation with representation.  We are the government.  We decide the level of federal taxation as a nation.  We can take it (gov) back from special interest.

Too bad the republican propaganda machine makes that damn near impossibile.

The democrats contribute to that equation too but not as brazenly or completely as the republican party.

In principle, I am with you.  I first believe that we need a strong federal government to break the corporate hold on our representative form of government.  We can't do that without a strong federal government.

After corporations are handled, then we have various federal agencies reduced in size or eliminated and devolve power to the states to leave the decisions for certain things in local hands. 

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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #48 on: December 23, 2007, 04:55:58 PM »
The government is entitled to a portion of each citizen's earnings to maintain the infrastructure of the nation.

There is such a thing as a national interest.  We are not merely an amalgam of individuals doing our own thing.  That sort of freedom is available to us but we must fund the national interest.

I have yet to see a tax system implemented in this country where the federal government owns or takes all of a citizen's earnings.  So I disagree with you on that.

So you get your opposition to fold under the old slippery slope argument of "where does the regulation stop?!."

Here's where it stops:  We are the government.  It is a government by and for The People.  Being the reasonable people that we are, our consitution is predicated on principles from the Elilghtenment, we the people set the boundaries for where government intervention begins and ends.

I think that's a pretty good idea.

The Government can be misused if we let it.  Just look at the Bush administration which privatizes as many government functions to enrich cronies and remove accountability while these privatized functions are done at extreme costs and in a half-assed manner.

Taxation without representation can be characterized as stealing.

This country has taxation with representation.  We are the government.  We decide the level of federal taxation as a nation.  We can take it (gov) back from special interest.

Too bad the republican propaganda machine makes that damn near impossibile.

The democrats contribute to that equation too but not as brazenly or completely as the republican party.

In principle, I am with you.  I first believe that we need a strong federal government to break the corporate hold on our representative form of government.  We can't do that without a strong federal government.

After corporations are handled, then we have various federal agencies reduced in size or eliminated and devolve power to the states to leave the decisions for certain things in local hands. 

I have to head to the gym but I would argue that we DON'T have taxation wtih representation. When I get back I will reply.
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Re: Bush Confident Republicans Will Retain White House
« Reply #49 on: December 23, 2007, 05:06:43 PM »
The government is entitled to a portion of each citizen's earnings to maintain the infrastructure of the nation.

There is such a thing as a national interest.  We are not merely an amalgam of individuals doing our own thing.  That sort of freedom is available to us but we must fund the national interest.

I have yet to see a tax system implemented in this country where the federal government owns or takes all of a citizen's earnings.  So I disagree with you on that.

So you get your opposition to fold under the old slippery slope argument of "where does the regulation stop?!."

Here's where it stops:  We are the government.  It is a government by and for The People.  Being the reasonable people that we are, our consitution is predicated on principles from the Elilghtenment, we the people set the boundaries for where government intervention begins and ends.

I think that's a pretty good idea.

The Government can be misused if we let it.  Just look at the Bush administration which privatizes as many government functions to enrich cronies and remove accountability while these privatized functions are done at extreme costs and in a half-assed manner.

Taxation without representation can be characterized as stealing.

This country has taxation with representation.  We are the government.  We decide the level of federal taxation as a nation.  We can take it (gov) back from special interest.

Too bad the republican propaganda machine makes that damn near impossibile.

The democrats contribute to that equation too but not as brazenly or completely as the republican party.

In principle, I am with you.  I first believe that we need a strong federal government to break the corporate hold on our representative form of government.  We can't do that without a strong federal government.

After corporations are handled, then we have various federal agencies reduced in size or eliminated and devolve power to the states to leave the decisions for certain things in local hands. 

Decker you have way too much faith in the government.  Our government is probably the worst money manager in the history of the planet.  The service stinks.  Government workers are often indifferent and lack business sense.  I was just talking with my friend about this.  He works for the federal government.  I work in the private sector.  We were comparing how indifferent his boss is to a lot of issues, because the boss has been working for the federal government for over 30 years and he's at the top of the food chain.  He treats his employees like pieces of a board game.  We compared that to a meeting we recently had at my company where we were talking about things like fairness and perception when it comes to certain income issues involving employees.  Night and day.  That kind of indifference is epidemic in government. 

In general, I would trust a business over the government any day of the week.