Author Topic: The Fat Burner Thread  (Read 37209 times)

ripitupbaby

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The Fat Burner Thread
« on: April 27, 2008, 09:04:28 AM »
I'm going to give a few fat burners a try this week, just to see if I may be able to hang with them during my contest prep this year.

I am generally a wuss when it comes to OTC fat burners.  I can't stand ephedra and the way it makes me feel...I usually end up throwing up when I take it.  Last year, I fell in love a combo of Gaspari's Third Degree Burn and Thermogenic Thyrotabs.  I took it for the last 6 weeks of my contest prep, and it totally kicked ass.  Both products have been discontinued.   >:(

I have enough Third Degree Burn left to run it for the last 5-6 weeks of my prep again this year, and enough Thyrotabs for about the last 5 weeks, so I will run those again.  But I am looking for something to run for 6 weeks or so a little earlier in the prep...like from about 16 weeks out - 9 or 10 weeks out. 

I've got Gaspari's Cytolean to try out (only a sample which I will try for 2 days), and also At Large Nutrition's NITOR.  NITOR has very similar ingredients to Third Degree Burn, so I am very interested in trying that one....the main ingredient in both (other than caffeine) is DHEA, which I am a fan of.

I'll let you know what I try and what I think of it.

:)

benz

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2008, 09:12:34 AM »
why not lipo6?
.

swilkins1984

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2008, 09:52:36 AM »
I am on my 8th day of MHP Dren. I don't know how well it burns fat yet but I feel super alert I actually don't mind doing the cardio. Cytolean was good for me too especially for killing mid day appetite.

danielson

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2008, 09:58:17 AM »
Try Adderall Rip, 20 mgs. and you won't be hungry all day. Plus it's great for mental concentration.
E

powerpack

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2008, 10:27:51 AM »
I am also sensitive to Fat burners.
We can still get ECA here with out to much hassel but the Eph freaks me out, I actually get Eph rage.
LIPO 6 made me hurl because of the ALA but others have had good results with it.

Cytolean made me feel depressed and it was meant to make me feel happy  >:(

chaos

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2008, 10:30:30 AM »
The Cytolean at full dose (3) works good for me as far as energy goes....let us know how it works for you.
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

flexingtonsteele

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #6 on: April 27, 2008, 12:43:34 PM »
get palumbos lypolyze

Luv2Hurt

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2008, 02:37:36 PM »
Dont play with that stuff, waste of money IMO, plus you will have headaches and feel like sh*t.  Who can stay jacked on caffine 24/7?  Certianly not me.  Just get some Clenbuterol, start slow and work up.  Its all you will need, start at 10-8 weeks and take it all the way through to show day, straight through no cycling of it.

Blockhead

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #8 on: April 27, 2008, 03:56:58 PM »

 Plain ol' inexpensive and proven ECA.

 1) Ephedrine HCL (25mg) "Google"
 2) 1 No Doz tablet or Vivarin tablet (caffeine 200mg)
 3) Baby aspirin (81mg)

 ** If you don't like stimulants that much then cut it down a little. Ephedrine HCL is available in 12.5mg tabs or you can break a 25mg tablet in half. Same with the caffeine tab.

 4) Acetyl l-carnitine (500mg)
 5) Green Tea extract (250mg)

 Combine all of that together. All five capsules/tablets. 30 minutes before early morning cardio. Use ONLY before morning cardio and never any other time of the day.

 Feel free to add in a serving of BCAA capsules and 5g of l-glutamine, pre-cardio. Keep a steady flow of amino acids in the blood steam at all times.

 It's more cost effective than a Lipo 6 or a Hydroxycutt bottle. Also more effective. Probably. I would reccomend SPECIES Nutrition 'Lipoleyze' and the PM formula known as 'Somaleyze'.

 

  Just my TWO cents, Ripit...

                                                           -Block!

 
 I would also(if I were you) incorporate a NON-stimulant fat burner. 1 serving with 2 or 3 of your solid meals throughout the entire prep.
?

ripitupbaby

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #9 on: April 27, 2008, 05:36:10 PM »
Thanks for all the suggestions.  I'm willing to try a few out right now and see what I like. 

I cannot do ephedrine, so the ECA stack is out.

I'd like to try Lypolyze for sure, but I don't want to buy a bottle of it.  I'm going to talk to Jenny about it and see how she likes it...and maybe steal some from her when I see her in 3 weeks.  I'm going to see Palumbo next weekend, but I don't know whether we're on good terms at this point.   :-\

Tomorrow I'll try the Cytolean. 

:)

AVBG

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2008, 07:36:24 PM »
I bought some of Palumbo's line today, I will let you know what I think when I try them.

ripitupbaby

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2008, 04:18:00 AM »
I bought some of Palumbo's line today, I will let you know what I think when I try them.

Thanks, alex, I'd love to hear what you think.  Also flexington, if you've given it a try for a few days.

I popped two Cytoleans before morning cardio.  It's hard for me to tell the effects right now...it usually takes a meal and a little while for me to get back to a resting heart rate, etc. but I will say that I felt pretty damn good for the first time in a long time this morning, about 20 mins into my cardio (which is usually when I feel like quitting).  I have a third one which I will take mid-morning, and then we'll see how the day goes.

:)

michael arvilla

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #12 on: April 28, 2008, 07:58:03 AM »
I like the ALR Venom (and i have tried them all at one time or another)


Top Dog

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #13 on: April 28, 2008, 08:50:14 AM »
Clenbuterol.......what is it, is it good for the average weight trainer, is it legal, where do you get it, is it for males and females, etc. Can someone please fill me in and I thank you in advance.

michael arvilla

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2008, 08:54:37 AM »
Clenbuterol.......what is it, is it good for the average weight trainer, is it legal, where do you get it, is it for males and females, etc. Can someone please fill me in and I thank you in advance.
Drug,no,no,u can't,no,and no.................

Top Dog

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2008, 09:01:31 AM »
Mike, with all those stars you can do better than that. Or do I have to wait for RIP to give me an intelligent and thoughtful response. Then again maybe she's mad at me for the shirt thing.

michael arvilla

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2008, 09:24:12 AM »
Clenbuterol.......what is it, is it good for the average weight trainer, is it legal, where do you get it, is it for males and females, etc. Can someone please fill me in and I thank you in advance.

A Drug,it works yes,no,"friends"works for both males and females.........
Clenbuterol is a very widely used drug and has quite a reputation. A good one among athletes and recreational users, and a very bad one among those people who know very little about illegal performance enhancing aids. Its not a steroid. In fact, the only medical use for which clenbuterol is generally prescribed (and now being less and less prescribed thanks to its illegitimate use) is for obstructions of the air-way. People with chronic breathing disorders like asthma use this as a bronchodilator to make breathing easier. But its only one of the many things that can be achieved with the use of clenbuterol.

In terms of action this drug is best likened to the now also illegal ephedrine and its legal replacement, ma huang. All of them operate mainly by increasing the manufacture and secretion of catabolic hormones known as cathecholamines (like dopamine, epinephrine (adrenaline) and norepinephrine (noradrenaline)) which are secreted from the adrenal region. Now these hormones have a wide variety of functions. First of all they seem to alter the contractile characteristics of smooth muscle, but very specifically. Some will apparently be stimulated, and others inhibited. Amongst those inhibited, the smooth muscles in the bronchial tree, which explains its soothing effect in patients with breathing problems. What it also does is increase thermogenisis. This usually encompasses a rise in blood pressure, a stimulatory effect of the heart muscle and a resulting rise in body temperature.
Along with the reversing of the effects of insulin (and inhibiting the action of insulin) which results in a release of glycogen back into the blood stream as glucose and an inability to store or use more glycogen, it will increase the rate of protein and fat being burned in the body. For bodybuilders that appears to be the primary use of the drug. This thermogenisis and an increase in the rate of fat being burned usually has as a result that the metabolic rate of the subject its much higher and he burns more calories. This in turn results in loss of adipose tissue (the shedding of fat in other words) revealing a leaner physique with cuts and striations. The downside to this effect is that there is a concomitant rise in the rate of protein being burned. Where fat is robbed from the fatty tissue in the body, protein is generally robbed from the muscle. As with all catabolic hormones, in time muscle loss can and will occur. Which is why many opt to use this compound during a cycle of anabolic steroids that will help preserve the lean body mass while reducing the fat.

Among the other actions that cathecholamines have is an increase in aerobic capacity (facilitated by the easier breathing), a stimulation of the nervous system (facilitated by norepinephrine and acetylcholine release) and thus the skeletal muscle system, an increase in oxygen transportation (facilitated by the increased blood pressure) and an increase in vigil. These characteristics in turn combine to make this drug particularly interesting for athletes doing endurance sports and needing a boost. Especially in middle-long running numbers, this drug is widely abused and its no secret that in cycling circles clenbuterol in liquid form is combined with a painkiller and the drug EPO (synthetic erythropoeitin, a renal hormone) which increases the manufacture of red blood cells. It is then injected along the road, thereby avoiding positive tests prior to the race. Needless to say such a cocktail is very hazardous to the cardiovascular system. Just to demonstrate the wide use of this drug and its immense popularity among athletes, observe the US Olympic team. Exercise-induced asthma is an afflmiction that generally occurs in 3-7% of the population, and is in some rare cases treated with clenbuterol. In 2000 60% of US Olympic athletes claimed to have exercise-induced asthma and ALL of them were prescribed clenbuterol for this condition. An otherwise illegal drug, tolerated solely for this reason. And this while the Romanian gymnast Andrea Raducan was stripped of her gold medal for the 25 µg of norephedrine in her cold medicin she was taking...

In several animal studies1,2,3 Clenbuterol was also shown to act as an anabolic, believed to be able to impart muscle gains. This was never demonstrated in humans4 however, and there is more evidence that its effect on catabolic hormones invokes the opposite. In any case, the animal studies used much higher doses5 then one would safely recommend for humans. The late Dan Duchaine, by many held in high regard as a steroid guru and a former writer of the now defunct MM2K, believed it had something to do with the stimulation of a third beta receptor, which was different in humans as opposed to other mammals, and that this was the reason humans did not receive any anabolic benefits. As with most of what Dan said, this is very questionable, but one of many possible explanations in a debate that still rages on. Despite the many claims of other bodybuilders that still swear it has some form of anabolic action, I must say I've seen enough proof to the contrary to strongly advise against buying clenbuterol for promoting muscle mass. You may be more than sorely disappointed. Next time you see a 230 pound, 6 foot top-level cyclist, let me know and I may change my mind.

Clenbuterol, when used for its fat-burning properties is best used in a pyramid scheme. Slowly building up the dose may be more important that tapering off of it, as most first time users will rarely if ever know how they will react. Because of the effects on blood pressure its best to start with 20-40 µg per day and slowly work your way up increasing the dose every 3 days by 20 µg, to a maximum of 120-160 µg (most find 80 µg to be adequate). Its also best not used for long periods of time. Body homeostasis seems to negate the excitatory and inhibitive functions of clenbuterol over time, creating a complacency effect. It loses most of its nerve stimulation and fat burning benefits after 3-4 weeks, and using it longer on end would be futile. The user is best to discontinue use for an equal period of time and then recommence again.

Another thing people should be aware of is the inherent liver toxicity associated with clenbuterol use. When stacking with oral 17-alpha-alkylated steroids, accutane, anti-biotics or other hepatoxic elements, one should have his liver values checked by a licensed physician at regular points in time to avoid all problems. If you not a yellow discoloration of the skin cease use immediately and contact your doctor.

Top Dog

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2008, 10:31:36 AM »
For a moment I was thinking Laura was the only smart one in that house. Thanks for doing some reasearch for me, I appreciate the time. I'm looking for kind of an insiders view or opinion, not neccessarily the clinical version. I'm very confident that you or RIP, two who know their way around, could help. Thanks again, hope Laura is feeling well as she always looks very well.

ripitupbaby

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2008, 12:05:52 PM »
VENOM - I'm not too impressed with what I saw Laura Lee deal with after taking some VENOM.   :-\
I know that was something else, but it clearly affected her heart rate, etc, so it makes me think it would probably make me quite jittery.  Can you provide some more info, Mike.

CLEN - That's a pretty good clinical description of it.  I would recommend checking with the folks on the Steroid Board for more info and personal experiences...there are several good threads there about clen.  Also, Luv2hurt may be able to share some additional info.  It's not a steroid, but it is a banned substance and cannot be used for drug-tested shows.

CYTOLEAN - I took two this morning before cardio, as I mentioned.  I felt pretty good all morning.  It kind of made it hard to eat my breakfast, so I just saved 1/2 of breakfast and ate it about an hour later.  I took a third cap at about 11 AM and felt pretty cranked up after that.  It's 3 PM now, and I am feeling OK but still a little cranked.  Not too bad though...it didn't give me the jitters or make me feel sick.  It DID make me very thirsty, which is usually a sign that something's working, so that's not all bad.  I didn't get that euphoric feeling that some people have mentioned, although like I said, I felt pretty good all day, which works for me considering I got up at 5:30 to do cardio and I am dieting. 
I'm willing to give Cytolean a go for a few days and see how it feels.  I only had one sample (three caps) of Cytolean, so I need to get some more from a friend of mine this weekend and try it out for 3-4 days.  It says not to take more than 4 caps a day, but the sample comes with three caps.  I may try two in the morning before cardio and then two in the afternoon if I can get my hands on more of it.


Tomorrow I am going to start on the NITOR at a LOW dose, and I will take it for 3-4 days to see how it goes.  I find that I don't really fully understand how fat burners make me feel until I am on them for at least a few days.

:)

michael arvilla

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2008, 12:07:59 PM »
For a moment I was thinking Laura was the only smart one in that house. Thanks for doing some reasearch for me, I appreciate the time. I'm looking for kind of an insiders view or opinion, not neccessarily the clinical version. I'm very confident that you or RIP, two who know their way around, could help. Thanks again, hope Laura is feeling well as she always looks very well.

the "no bs" truth = Clen works (and works well) (be careful not to "overdose"/go slow and with caution)
my personal opinion is you can get almost as good results with an OTC fat burner like Venom(and it's much safer!)
leave the Clen for the competing bodybuilders(as it's just not worth the risk)

Top Dog

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2008, 12:21:04 PM »
the "no bs" truth = Clen works (and works well) (be careful not to "overdose"/go slow and with caution)
my personal opinion is you can get almost as good results with an OTC fat burner like Venom(and it's much safer!)
leave the Clen for the competing bodybuilders(as it's just not worth the risk)
Thanks, I'll take that advice as I do value it coming from you. That's what I was looking for... the no b.s. view.

ripitupbaby

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2008, 12:23:26 PM »
Clen has become very popular with Hollywood celebs for fat loss.  ::)


Mike, what is it about VENOM that you like so much?  What are the primary ingredients?

:)

michael arvilla

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2008, 12:31:19 PM »
Clen has become very popular with Hollywood celebs for fat loss.  ::)


Mike, what is it about VENOM that you like so much?  What are the primary ingredients?



The "buzz" or the energy it gives me (with no crash!).............it's strong (i like that!)
it's also very "smooth" meaning no "jitters"................just a nice warm "flushing" feeling and energy

Luv2Hurt

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #23 on: April 28, 2008, 06:07:11 PM »
With Clenbuterol having a long half life about 1.5 days its main advantage is it will be working around the clock.  You have to be taking an ECA stack around the clock to even come close to clens effectiveness, so guess what? with OTC stuff and ECA if you try that you will not be doing any sleeping.  ECA will have your heart rate increased more than clen also so it is going to be more uncomfortable.  There are other advantages to clen also but will not get into them here.

Personally I hate that stimulant type feeling of being jacked on speed and the fact it is hard to sleep.  ECA has a short half life of 3-4 hours, so soon after that you have to take more to keep the effect going.  Pretty much better take your last dose of ECA around 6 hours before bed time or you will have trouble sleeping.  During this time ECA is not working, but with clen you will still be burning fat and sleeping like a baby.

People make taking clen too complicated trying to cycle it and all this stuff with Benydril.  Just get on and stay on it at about 6 weeks clen will be making some real changes in your BF %  IME 8-10 weeks is fine.  Studies have shown significant fat loss still occurring at 6-8 weeks, so the theory it stops working in a short time is not true.

If you wanna take it I would recommend starting slow and ramping up.  You may feel a little jittery and buzzed at first but in a few days your body will acclimate and you will be fine, just don't go trying to build a watch or something LOL.

This is my ramp up protocol.  day 1 morning 20mcg, afternoon 20mcg. Day 2 same as day 1. Day 3 30mcg morning, 30mcg night. Day 4 same as day 3.  And so on ramping up 20 mcg every 2 days till you get to about 100mcg total per day.  Some may like a bit more or less than this but 100mcg is pretty effective.

Please be careful and know what you are doing when you measure it out, you don't wanna take more or less than you think you are taking.  Have heard some bad stories about people not knowing what they are doing and take like 2-3 times too much.  Know how the clen you have is dosed and do the math.

ripitupbaby

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Re: Testing out some fat burners this week...
« Reply #24 on: April 28, 2008, 06:54:08 PM »
Thanks for the info, Luv.  :)

:)