Author Topic: Bob Chic will petition to SEPARATE the 202s from the Open Class (Read 10047 times)

240 is Back · « **on:** August 18, 2008, 05:50:25 PM »

Currently, bodybuilders who compete in the under-202 class are able to compete in the Open (over 202) class as well.

Bob Chic said on PBBW tonight that he plans to petition to have them turned into separate entities. The Under 202's wouldn't be allowed to compete in the Open as well. If you competed in, (or won?) the 202, your night was over. No getting onstage with the big boys. If you're that good, skip doing the 202s and just do the open.

Is this a good idea or a bad idea? Does it mean no more David Henry/Freeman showdowns? Does it mean we won't get to see another Franco/Arnold rivalry again?

Chick · « **Reply #1 on:** August 18, 2008, 05:57:46 PM »

Doesn't make any sense to have crossovers...it isnt the NPC. If you're good enough ala Lee P, David Henry, etc.....great....compete against those you're competitive against...the big boys. For the other 99% of the guys, this class was made for this very reason. It's a nightmare for the judges, makes already "too long" shows, even longer...

Brutal_1 · « **Reply #2 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:00:51 PM »

agree 110%

michael arvilla · « **Reply #3 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:02:30 PM »

Quote from: Chick on August 18, 2008, 05:57:46 PM

Doesn't make any sense to have crossovers...it isnt the NPC. If you're good enough ala Lee P, David Henry, etc.....great....compete against those you're competitive against...the big boys. For the other 99% of the guys, this class was made for this very reason. It's a nightmare for the judges, makes already "too long" shows, even longer...

yea i agree with Bob here 100%

240 is Back · « **Reply #4 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:05:12 PM »

Quote from: Chick on August 18, 2008, 05:57:46 PM

Doesn't make any sense to have crossovers...it isnt the NPC. If you're good enough ala Lee P, David Henry, etc.....great....compete against those you're competitive against...the big boys. For the other 99% of the guys, this class was made for this very reason. It's a nightmare for the judges, makes already "too long" shows, even longer...

Yes... but... not even the 202 winner can get into the Open?

I mean, DHenry could have won Tampa just as easy as he got 3rd. Crowd seemed pretty surprised with him at 3rd.

Maybe just let the top 3 from the Under-202s enter the Open?

The biggest thing is that you won't get to see fan favorites - like Flex Lewis for example - stand next to the top guys. Like Flex said on Larry Pepe tonight... He wants to train to WIN something, so he and DH and other guys will do the 202s.

But it's a shame you can't get the top 3 into the Open class. Might be a healthy compromise. Let the top 3 from under 202 enter the Open. We're gonna get awfully tired of seeing Flex and DH standing next to scrubs each week (no offense tricky).

Chick · « **Reply #5 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:10:11 PM »

Quote from: 240 is Back on August 18, 2008, 06:05:12 PM

Yes... but... not even the 202 winner can get into the Open?

I mean, DHenry could have won Tampa just as easy as he got 3rd. Crowd seemed pretty surprised with him at 3rd.

Maybe just let the top 3 from the Under-202s enter the Open?

The biggest thing is that you won't get to see fan favorites - like Flex Lewis for example - stand next to the top guys. Like Flex said on Larry Pepe tonight... He wants to train to WIN something, so he and DH and other guys will do the 202s.

But it's a shame you can't get the top 3 into the Open class. Might be a healthy compromise. Let the top 3 from under 202 enter the Open. We're gonna get awfully tired of seeing Flex and DH standing next to scrubs each week (no offense tricky).

Again...if you are one of the few good enough at under 202 to stand with the big boys....then I would suggest for them to do just that. Bigger money....

As for the competition level...I think you'll be surprised how much it increases over the next year or two....there are some damn good BBers out there who are under 202, and just as many who compete slightly above that, that can drop down to be better BBers.

NaturalWonder83 · « **Reply #6 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:10:53 PM »

AGREED!!
BOB RULES!

Brutal_1 · « **Reply #7 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:13:46 PM »

Quote from: Chick on August 18, 2008, 06:10:11 PM

Again...if you are one of the few good enough at under 202 to stand with the big boys....then I would suggest for them to do just that. Bigger money....

As for the competition level...I think you'll be surprised how much it increases over the next year or two....there are some damn good BBers out there who are under 202, and just as many who compete slightly above that, that can drop down to be better BBers.

Absolutely!

I really don't care how awesome these guys look, when they're altogether the size of Freeman's thigh $:-\$

Lets not forget the basic premise of bodyBUILDING

Chick · « **Reply #8 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:15:43 PM »

I think they should remain as seperate entities....even if the 202 was a Olympia event...I would suggest keeping them as two different titles....just as the Heavyweight boxing champ doesn't fight the middleweight champ....more champions is never a bad thing for a sport.

Joe Roark · « **Reply #9 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:18:00 PM »

I agree that only the top three, perhaps top five (if the scores are dramatically close) should be allowed to crossover into the open.
In the Europa 202 top five:
1. Lewis won the 202 and tied for seventh in the open
2. Shabazz did not crossover, but obviously would have behind Lewis
3. Horvath, placed tenth in open
4. Bryant did not crossover
5. Farah placed twelfth in open

So of the top five in 202, two men broke into the top ten in the open.

About a half dozen other crossovers tied for last in the open.

Chick · « **Reply #10 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:24:44 PM »

and the paycheck was the same for 7th-last

lastrep · « **Reply #11 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:34:20 PM »

I agree.. and as I wrote months ago.. THE WINNER OF THE 202 AND THE WINNER OF THE OPEN SHOULD HAVE A SHOWDOWN AT THE END - AKA FOR THE OVERALL TITLE - THIS WOULD BE A VERY EXCITING AND WORTHWHILE ADDITION TO EACH AND EVERY SHOW.

Chick · « **Reply #12 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:36:03 PM »

Quote from: lastrep on August 18, 2008, 06:34:20 PM

I agree.. and as I wrote months ago.. THE WINNER OF THE 202 AND THE WINNER OF THE OPEN SHOULD HAVE A SHOWDOWN AT THE END - AKA FOR THE OVERALL TITLE - THIS WOULD BE A VERY EXCITING AND WORTHWHILE ADDITION TO EACH AND EVERY SHOW.

Exactly what I DONT want....

Tamer Razor · « **Reply #13 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:44:37 PM »

To expend the Sport and make it more acceptable to different demographics it is fundamental to separate classes. Pound for pound who is better Anderson Silva or Fedor. Bodybuilding is about increasing your muscle mass ...not doubt, but most importantly symmetry, balance, proportions...
I believe the public will really appreciate this class. If you want to see a Freak...great but if you really understand the concept of bodybuilding you would enjoy both classes as much as you enjoy watching fighters in different divisions.

Tamer Razor · « **Reply #14 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:46:37 PM »

Quote from: lastrep on August 18, 2008, 06:34:20 PM

I agree.. and as I wrote months ago.. THE WINNER OF THE 202 AND THE WINNER OF THE OPEN SHOULD HAVE A SHOWDOWN AT THE END - AKA FOR THE OVERALL TITLE - THIS WOULD BE A VERY EXCITING AND WORTHWHILE ADDITION TO EACH AND EVERY SHOW.

More champions the better...I don't see the Light-Heavy UFC champion Fitghting the Heavy Weight....A champ is a Champ....

timfogarty · « **Reply #15 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:55:53 PM »

But then we can't have someone winning both classes like Silvio Samuel Saviour did for the Europa in 2007

timfogarty · « **Reply #16 on:** August 18, 2008, 06:57:29 PM »

Quote from: lastrep on August 18, 2008, 06:34:20 PM

I agree.. and as I wrote months ago.. THE WINNER OF THE 202 AND THE WINNER OF THE OPEN SHOULD HAVE A SHOWDOWN AT THE END - AKA FOR THE OVERALL TITLE - THIS WOULD BE A VERY EXCITING AND WORTHWHILE ADDITION TO EACH AND EVERY SHOW.

that would be a lightweight class and a heavyweight class, which IFBB pro contests had until 1980

Chick · « **Reply #17 on:** August 18, 2008, 07:01:29 PM »

Quote from: timfogarty on August 18, 2008, 06:55:53 PM

But then we can't have someone winning both classes like Silvio Samuel Saviour did for the Europa in 2007

And...?

dknole · « **Reply #18 on:** August 18, 2008, 07:24:08 PM »

Good idea Bob, would keep it more competitive for those with lighter body weights.

dearth · « **Reply #19 on:** August 18, 2008, 08:52:25 PM »

Not sure what is exactly accomplished by limiting a competitors options... shorter show? easier on the judges?

Chick · « **Reply #20 on:** August 18, 2008, 09:02:39 PM »

Quote from: dearth on August 18, 2008, 08:52:25 PM

Not sure what is exactly accomplished by limiting a competitors options... shorter show? easier on the judges?

DEpends on how you're looking at it..I look at it as ADDING to a competitors options by coming up with the 202 in the first place....

The open guys don't have twice the opportunity to cash in...why should the 202 guys?

I believe it will ad to a competitors image, money making ability, potential contracts, etc....by being a champion in his own category, rather than watering it down with a "17th place chaser"...

Rich2 · « **Reply #21 on:** August 18, 2008, 09:04:49 PM »

i totally agree with this. i also think this would be another step towards legitimizing the weight class.

Chick · « **Reply #22 on:** August 18, 2008, 09:05:38 PM »

Quote from: Rich2 on August 18, 2008, 09:04:49 PM

i totally agree with this. i also think this would be another step towards legitimizing the weight class.

Correct...

mrusa85 · « **Reply #23 on:** August 18, 2008, 09:19:07 PM »

Not having 202 crossovers is a good idea. Having the 202 winner go against the open winner for the overall is a waste of time. The reason the 202 class was created was to give the smaller guys a chance to compete against smaller guys. Why put them back right back in with the big boys for an "overall" title? Anything to speed up a show is a good thing. The worst part of watching an NPC show is seeing every competitor come right back out for every class. IFBB shows do not need this.

stuntmovie · « **Reply #24 on:** August 18, 2008, 09:41:29 PM »

I'd be open to debate on this with Bob.

It could be best for all concerned and possibly even "fairer" if the 202 winner (and only the 202 winner) was allowed to compete against the bigger guys for the overall "bigger boys" trophy.

The 202 overall winner would merely have to step in the "bigger boys" lineup during the evening finals to allow the judges to do some further comparisons and then "adjust" their scores accordingly.

This would require an additional bit of time during the evening finals but it would not shut-out a better but smaller contender from collecting his due rewards when and if he deserved it.

Don't shut-out a great bodybuilder just because he doesn't tip the scale far enough! Allow him the opportunity to beat the big boys if he elects to do so. Allow him to make that decision.

Submitted on behalf of the smaller greats for Bob's and the IFBB's consideration.

Bob, will you be discussing this with those "lighter" and current contenders before making a formal submission to the IFBB?

Thanks, Bob.