1993 - best ever!

[NarcissisticDeity]

no it didn't - the judging was impartial during his reign.

not so much in the 90's. that was the decade where the Mr./Ms. O never lost no matter how bad they looked compared to their competition. and it was even worse with the women than it was with the men.

  thats pretty clear just by looking at all these anti dorian threads, the pics of him getting owned all the time, and the fact that all the time he was given 'perfect' scores...

Hey same lame excuses as before , same judges for Dorian as for Ronnie  what now?

Dorian easily beat Flex Wheeler who was almost prime in 1993 , Ronnie had to fight a not prime Flex tooth & nail and only beat him by 3 points LMFAO that tells an intelligent person Dorian would crush Ronnie too

[Hulkster]

from the recent photos of muscletime, it's apparent that yates 93 showing is the best of all time.

his form has it all.

many shots of yates have been posted on this board, many by clowns trying to find and post the worst pics they can find of dorian.

shots like that exist for everyone.

however, when their best is presented, that is what should be used (for everyone) for evaluations.

when the best of yates is shown, he is the best.










notice everyone looking at dorian.

dorian looked great that year, no doubt about it.

but best of all time?

sorry, but there is this other Mr. O. that can own him. see for yourself:

[Hulkster]

more owning of dorian's best

[NarcissisticDeity]

dorian looked great that year, no doubt about it.

but best of all time?

sorry, but there is this other Mr. O. that can own him. see for yourself:

Dorian advantage in balance & proportion , Dorian advantage in density & dryness . Dorian better posing & presentation , Dorian more complete , Dorian win by armbar 

[Hulkster]

Dorian advantage in balance & proportion , Dorian advantage in density & dryness . Dorian better posing & presentation , Dorian more complete , Dorian win by armbar 

too bad none of what you claim is validated by real life :

[NeoSeminole]

No its not , subjective is comparing one champion to another from different eras thats very subjective , who is harder & drier isn't thats black & white , who's calves are in proportion with their quads is NOT subjective , who's forearms are in proportion with their biceps/triceps isn't subjective , just more examples of your ignorance , keep following my lead as well its all you can do

your limited way of thinking is evident by your responses. Who's to say a difference of 1-2% body fat outweighs a 30 lbs difference in size? Who's to say calves are more important than arms? Who's to say balance is more prized than muscle shape? My point is that everyone attaches their own importance to each criteria. Bodybuilding is a subjective sport. If it were objective as you say, then judges and fans should always agree on the placings since objectivity exist independent of the observer.

Who stopped posting in the truce thread? Me who responds to a great majority of my posts? YOU and Hulkster how can you do so if you're not following me around ? its not just me its Dorian and Me because you're still trying to prove you're right and have failed at every turn , the same interests is ME

oh brother! I've seen you posting in Ronnie threads. You also respond to a great majority of Hulkster's and my posts. So according to your logic, you're following us around.

[NeoSeminole]

Better forearms absolutely , better triceps sure better biceps NO better balance throughout his arm yes

better biceps? No. Better triceps? No. Better forearms? Perhaps. Better overall? No. A body part such as arms has to look better in more than 1 pose for it to be considered better. Name 1 other pose besides side triceps where Dorian's arms look more impressive.

[Hulkster]

oh brother! I've seen you posting in Ronnie threads. You also respond to a great majority of Hulkster's and my posts. So according to your logic, you're following us around

ND is the ultimate puppy dog.

it doesn't matter what time of day I post, he responds 2 seconds later

he must have my posts flagged or something..

[suckmymuscle]

silly boy, when will you learn that bodybuilding is a subjective sport? The point still stands that you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to competitive bodybuilding. This is a proven fact I've corrected you on many points and taught you how contests are judged - not vice versa.

ha ha ha, wow you are such an idiot. That's like me saying "you follow me around like a lost puppy b/c you post in every thread I post in." Did you ever stop to consider that maybe we post in the same threads b/c we share similar interests?

good job. I could do the same for you. I guess Ronnie must be in your mind too.

  This f.a.g.g.o.t basicaly parrots our posts word by word and he thinks he's proving something. He has pretty much nothing to say, and all of his "arguments" revolve around playing with semantics to claim that we said things we didn't really mean, or that our entire response to his posts is wrong because we misenterpretated a single word in his post, etc. This is SemenHole's tactics when he gets owned: manipulate the meaning of the words in his post that got addressed and proved wrong, and make it seem like we were responding to something he never claimed in the first place. It gets boring after a while, because the fag has no honor or shame whatsoever.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[NeoSeminole]

This handsome fella basicaly parrots our posts word by word and he thinks he's proving something. He has pretty much nothing to say, and all of his "arguments" revolve around playing with semantics to claim that we said things we didn't really mean, or that our entire response to his posts is wrong because we misenterpretated a single word in his post, etc. This is Sir NeoSeminole's tactics when he gets owned: manipulate the meaning of the words in his post that got addressed and proved wrong, and make it seem like we were responding to something he never claimed in the first place. It gets boring after a while, because the stud has no honor or shame whatsoever.

you lost too, puppy dog?

[suckmymuscle]

you lost too, puppy dog?

  The only puppy dog here is you. You start almost every response to our posts by parroting our posts word by word. It's pretty sad and pathetic. It's sad that I lost so much of my time arguing with such a delusional moron. Hey, SemenHole, tell us all how Ronnie gained an average of 5 lbs of lean mass a year after he became Mr.Olympia and thus carried 10 lbs more of muscle at the 2001 ASC than he did at the 1999 Olympia despite being 10 lbs lighter/ Bwa ha ha ha...what a fucking retard.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[NeoSeminole]

The only puppy dog here is you. You start almost every response to our posts by parroting our posts word by word. It's pretty sad and pathetic. It's sad that I lost so much of my time arguing with such a brilliant man. Hey, Sir NeoSeminole, tell us all how Ronnie gained an average of 5 lbs of lean mass a year after he became Mr.Olympia and thus carried 10 lbs more of muscle at the 2001 ASC than he did at the 1999 Olympia despite being 10 lbs lighter/ Bwa ha ha ha...what a genius.

oh noes! Puh-leaze dont kill mae wit ur bare hands!!!

On more than one occasion, I felt an undescribable urge to murder some of the posters of this board, for some commentaries they made at the time. In all honesty, if they were standing in front of me, I think I would have killed them. I'm dead serious, man. I thank my lucky stars they were away from me, because otherwise I'd be on death row, or facing a life-term. As an example, I killed my neighbors german shephard with my bare hands, by breaking his spine.

[NarcissisticDeity]

your limited way of thinking is evident by your responses. Who's to say a difference of 1-2% body fat outweighs a 30 lbs difference in size? Who's to say calves are more important than arms? Who's to say balance is more prized than muscle shape? My point is that everyone attaches their own importance to each criteria. Bodybuilding is a subjective sport. If it were objective as you say, then judges and fans should always agree on the placings since objectivity exist independent of the observer.

oh brother! I've seen you posting in Ronnie threads. You also respond to a great majority of Hulkster's and my posts. So according to your logic, you're following us around.

your limited way of thinking is evident by your responses. Who's to say a difference of 1-2% body fat outweighs a 30 lbs difference in size? Who's to say calves are more important than arms? Who's to say balance is more prized than muscle shape? My point is that everyone attaches their own importance to each criteria. Bodybuilding is a subjective sport. If it were objective as you say, then judges and fans should always agree on the placings since objectivity exist independent of the observer.

the irony of you claiming my thinking is limited , when your thinking is limited to your ignorance of how competitive bodybuilding is judged . and how the fuck did you come to the conclusion the difference in bodyfat is 1-2% ? I want an explanation please elaborate on this gem and 30 pounds of what? if Ronnie matched his 2001 Arnold Classic conditioning while being 287 pounds you'd be working with something but he's not even close , the difference between conditioning from  1998 and 1999 was noticeable enough to warrant a comment the difference between 1998 in terms of conditioning and 2003 is staggering

who says calves are more important than arms? well you're already working under the assumption Dorian doesn't have arms which is a lie because you know better , Dorian has better triceps/forearms the difference in biceps is staggering obviously just like the difference between calves is night & day , and to answer your question calves are a lost more important than biceps and why? because as you already know calves can been single in every single pose from every single angle , biceps can't but you know this already

And your statement that ' everyone attaches their own importance to each criteria ' is just another example of your blatant ignorance of how competitive bodybuilding is judged , you're not ignorant let me amend that because I've explained to you how contests work , so you're not ignorant just stupid. let me remind you all rounds are physique rounds the judges DO NOT attach their own importance to the criteria ALL the criteria is applied at once in every single pose from every single angle

And comparing one champion to another from another era is very subjective the judging criteria is NOT and the obvious reason is the fans and the judges don't always agree is? the fans DO NOT KNOW how contests are judged and the judges do you , Hulkster , pumpster and countless other still can't grasp how professional contests are judged , they always ponder how Yates' can win the the symmetry round despite not being as ' symmetrical ' as some of his contemporaries , how could he possibly win the posing rounds despite not being a classic poser like Lee Labrada , and how did he win? all rounds are physique rounds

Balance - A term referring to an even relationship of body proportions in a man's physique. Perfectly balanced phys-ical proportions are a much-sought-after trait among competitive bodybuilders.
perfectly balanced proportions are much sought after trait Dorian has the advantage especially over Ronnie 2003


Density - Muscle hardness, which is also related to muscu-lar definition. A bodybuilder can be well-defined and still have excess fat within each major muscle complex. But when he has muscle density, even this intramuscular fat has been eliminated. A combination of muscle mass and muscle density is highly prized among all competitive bodybuilders.

Dorian has a clear cut advantage in density especially over Ronnie 2003 its night & day not some 1-2%  now combine Dorian's advantage in balance & his advantage in density & dryness his completeness his advantage in posing & presentation he would make short work Ronnie 2003

oh brother! I've seen you posting in Ronnie threads. You also respond to a great majority of Hulkster's and my posts. So according to your logic, you're following us around.

I respond to your posts and his AFTER you people follow me around , and at times I do respond to your posts and his but the vast majority if you people following ME you can't keep the debate in the truce thread seeing I don't post there so you follow me around 

[NarcissisticDeity]

  This f.a.g.g.o.t basicaly parrots our posts word by word and he thinks he's proving something. He has pretty much nothing to say, and all of his "arguments" revolve around playing with semantics to claim that we said things we didn't really mean, or that our entire response to his posts is wrong because we misenterpretated a single word in his post, etc. This is SemenHole's tactics when he gets owned: manipulate the meaning of the words in his post that got addressed and proved wrong, and make it seem like we were responding to something he never claimed in the first place. It gets boring after a while, because the fag has no honor or shame whatsoever.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

dead on the money , he likes to try and bog the debate down with word games he loves to toy with words but what else can he do? he doesn't have anything he's have to know how the game is played and even when I teach him how its done its another semantics game lol

he's like Hulkster in the absurdity of his claims now the difference between conditioning between Dorian 1993/1995 and Ronnie 2003 was 1-2% LMFAO how he came to this conclusion is beyond me  but hey he thinks he's right about a lot of things and he's always in contrast with the judges

[NeoSeminole]

the irony of you claiming my thinking is limited , when your thinking is limited to your ignorance of how competitive bodybuilding is judged.

yawn, arguing with you is like arguing with a child.

Me: your limited way of thinking is evident by your responses

HD: nah-uh, your way of thinking is limited.

and how the fuck did you come to the conclusion the difference in bodyfat is 1-2% ? I want an explanation please elaborate on this gem and 30 pounds of what? if Ronnie matched his 2001 Arnold Classic conditioning while being 287 pounds you'd be working with something but he's not even close , the difference between conditioning from  1998 and 1999 was noticeable enough to warrant a comment the difference between 1998 in terms of conditioning and 2003 is staggering

I was just estimating how much extra body fat Ronnie carried than Dorian. Nowhere did I say this is an exact figure. A difference of 1-2% body fat at 287 lbs can be anywhere from 3-6 lbs of fat. Since Ronnie in 03 was shredded from head to toe, it's safe to assume he was under 2%. You don't get striated glutes carrying an extra 6 lbs of fat.

who says calves are more important than arms? well you're already working under the assumption Dorian doesn't have arms which is a lie because you know better , Dorian has better triceps/forearms the difference in biceps is staggering obviously just like the difference between calves is night & day , and to answer your question calves are a lost more important than biceps and why? because as you already know calves can been single in every single pose from every single angle , biceps can't but you know this already

show me where I said Dorian doesn't have arms. Go ahead. I'll wait. To counter your argment that calves are more important than arms, IFBB contest history shows us that judges favor arms over calves. Larry Scott, Sergio Oliva, Arnold, and Ronnie are all known for their arms. Other than Dorian, which Mr. Olympian is known for his calves? Let's look at other contests besides the Mr. Olympia. Flex Wheeler, Dexter Jackson, and Darrem Charles all have impressive arms and have won a show despite having poor calves.

And your statement that ' everyone attaches their own importance to each criteria ' is just another example of your blatant ignorance of how competitive bodybuilding is judged , you're not ignorant let me amend that because I've explained to you how contests work , so you're not ignorant just stupid. let me remind you all rounds are physique rounds the judges DO NOT attach their own importance to the criteria ALL the criteria is applied at once in every single pose from every single angle

ha ha ha, lay off the crack son. You're naive if you believe the judges follow a rubric that says "if bodybuilder A carries 1% more body fat than bodybuilder B but weighs 20 lbs more, the decision should go to B." It's up to the judges to interpret and apply the criteria hence why the sport of bodybuilding is subjective.

[NarcissisticDeity]

yawn, arguing with you is like arguing with a child.

Me: your limited way of thinking is evident by your responses

HD: nah-uh, your way of thinking is limited.



I was just estimating how much extra body fat Ronnie carried than Dorian. Nowhere did I say this is an exact figure. A difference of 1-2% body fat at 287 lbs can be anywhere from 3-6 lbs of fat. Since Ronnie in 03 was shredded from head to toe, it's safe to assume he was under 2%. You don't get striated glutes carrying an extra 6 lbs of fat.

show me where I said Dorian doesn't have arms. Go ahead. I'll wait. To counter your argment that calves are more important than arms, IFBB contest history shows us that judges favor arms over calves. Larry Scott, Sergio Oliva, Arnold, and Ronnie are all known for their arms. Other than Dorian, which Mr. Olympian is known for his calves? Let's look at other contests besides the Mr. Olympia. Flex Wheeler, Dexter Jackson, and Darrem Charles all have impressive arms and have a show despite having poor calves.

ha ha ha, lay off the crack son. You're naive if you believe the judges follow a rubric that says "if bodybuilder A carries 1% more body fat than bodybuilder B but weighs 20 lbs more, the decision should go to B." It's up to the judges to interpret and apply the criteria hence why the sport of bodybuilding is subjective.

yawn, arguing with you is like arguing with a child.

Me: your limited way of thinking is evident by your responses

HD: nah-uh, your way of thinking is limited.

no ND shows exactly why you're limited in your thinking and has proven it . recap you're limited by ignorance , because you don't know how contests are judged and bias I've provided example thanks for shying away from a cognizant reply you just reaffirmed what I stated

I was just estimating how much extra body fat Ronnie carried than Dorian. Nowhere did I say this is an exact figure. A difference of 1-2% body fat at 287 lbs can be anywhere from 3-6 lbs of fat. Since Ronnie in 03 was shredded from head to toe, it's safe to assume he was under 2%. You don't get striated glutes carrying an extra 6 lbs of fat.

LMFAO you were estimating , just like you estimated the scale of those horrendous ' comparisons ' you made too lol you didn't say it was an exact figure but you didn't claim it was an estimate either , you came up with that gem only when called on your fantasy conclusions Ronnie 03 wasn't shredded from head to toe either , shredded from head to toe would be 1998/2001 and that ain't it fan-boy and yeah you can have striated glutes and still be holding intramuscular fat , see ignorance , see limited abilities

show me where I said Dorian doesn't have arms. Go ahead. I'll wait. To counter your argment that calves are more important than arms, IFBB contest history shows us that judges favor arms over calves. Larry Scott, Sergio Oliva, Arnold, and Ronnie are all known for their arms. Other than Dorian, which Mr. Olympian is known for his calves? Let's look at other contests besides the Mr. Olympia. Flex Wheeler, Dexter Jackson, and Darrem Charles all have impressive arms and have a show despite having poor calves.

I love how your always trying to connect the dots , if this one and that one did this than see what would happen lol you're such an ignorant fan-boy and you're trying to bog this down into a battle of semantics who care about the parts? its about the whole package from head toe and the point still stands sub-par biceps can be hidden poor calves CAN NOT

ha ha ha, lay off the crack son. You're naive if you believe the judges follow a rubric that says "if bodybuilder A carries 1% more body fat than bodybuilder B but weighs 20 lbs more, the decision should go to B." It's up to the judges to interpret and apply the criteria hence why the sport of bodybuilding is subjective.

the judges follow something called the judging criteria and it calls for the judges to follow a set of criterion that will allow them to determine who has the superior physique , the criteria isn't subjective its black & white either someone is dry & hard or they ain't if , either someone's calves are in proportion with their quads or they ain't , either someone is carrying a lot of musclar bulk or they ain't , judges take into consideration ALL of the criteria in every single pose because all rounds are physique rounds

come back when you learn how contests are judged and then we'll talk until then I'll just keep correcting your ignorance

[NeoSeminole]

no ND shows exactly why you're limited in your thinking and has proven it . recap you're limited by ignorance , because you don't know how contests are judged and bias I've provided example thanks for shying away from a cognizant reply you just reaffirmed what I stated

wrong, I've shown how you're limited in your thinking and proven it. Recap: You're limited by ignorance b/c you don't know how contests are judged and bias. I've provided plenty of examples. Thank for shying away from an intelligent response. You just confirmed what I've stated all along.

LMFAO you were estimating , just like you estimated the scale of those horrendous ' comparisons ' you made too lol you didn't say it was an exact figure but you didn't claim it was an estimate either , you came up with that gem only when called on your fantasy conclusions Ronnie 03 wasn't shredded from head to toe either , shredded from head to toe would be 1998/2001 and that ain't it fan-boy and yeah you can have striated glutes and still be holding intramuscular fat , see ignorance , see limited abilities

LOLLERSKATES, ROFLCOPTER, STEAMLOLLER, ROFLBROTHEL

your arguments are lame. All you do is laugh like an idiot and change subjects. What do the comparisons I've made have to do with estimating body fat%?

I love how your always trying to connect the dots , if this one and that one did this than see what would happen lol you're such an ignorant fan-boy and you're trying to bog this down into a battle of semantics who care about the parts? its about the whole package from head toe and the point still stands sub-par biceps can be hidden poor calves CAN NOT

I love how you think by calling me a fan-body that you somehow countered my argument. I provided direct evidence supporting why arms are more important than calves. What do you have? Oh right, nothing.

the judges follow something called the judging criteria and it calls for the judges to follow a set of criterion that will allow them to determine who has the superior physique , the criteria isn't subjective its black & white either someone is dry & hard or they ain't if , either someone's calves are in proportion with their quads or they ain't , either someone is carrying a lot of musclar bulk or they ain't , judges take into consideration ALL of the criteria in every single pose because all rounds are physique rounds

learn to read, dipshit. Nowhere did I dispute the objectiveness of deciding who has better muscular bulk or definition. My point is the judges attach their own importance to each criteria relative to another. One judge may favor conditioning slightly over size while another may feel the opposite way. When you can show me where it says in the IFBB judging criteria "if bodybuilder A carries 1% more body fat than bodybuilder B but weighs 20 lbs more, the decision should go to B," then I will listen.

[m8]

too bad none of what you claim is validated by real life :

I like how Ronnie pictures are nearly always cut off at the knees. Hahahaha.

[NarcissisticDeity]

wrong, I've shown how you're limited in your thinking and proven it. Recap: You're limited by ignorance b/c you don't know how contests are judged and bias. I've provided plenty of examples. Thank for shying away from an intelligent response. You just confirmed what I've stated all along.

LOLERSKATES, ROFLCOPTER, STEAMLOLLER, ROFLBROTHEL

your arguments are lame. All you do is laugh like an idiot and change subjects. What do the comparisons I've made have to do with estimating body fat%?

I love how you think by calling me a fan-body that you somehow countered my argument. I provided direct evidence defending why arms are more important than calves. What do you have? Oh right, nothing.

learn to read, dipshit. Nowhere did I dispute the objectiveness of deciding who has better muscular bulk or definition. My point is the judges attach their own importance to each criteria relative to another. One judge may favor conditioning slightly over size while another may feel the opposite way. When you can show me where it says in the IFBB judging criteria "if bodybuilder A carries 1% more body fat than bodybuilder B but weighs 20 lbs more, the decision should go to B," then I will listen.

wrong, I've shown how you're limited in your thinking and proven it. Recap: You're limited by ignorance b/c you don't know how contests are judged and bias. I've provided plenty of examples. Thank for shying away from an intelligent response. You just confirmed what I've stated all along.

Thanks for playing Neo we have some lovely parting gifts for you  

[NarcissisticDeity]

I like how Ronnie pictures are nearly always cut off at the knees. Hahahaha.

lmfao for a very good reason

[NeoSeminole]

Thanks for playing Neo we have some lovely parting gifts for you

translation: I can't think of an intelligent response.

[NarcissisticDeity]

translation: I can't think of an intelligent response.

think what you like Neo , just like Ronnie 03 was his best showing , and the difference between conditioning is 1-2% , that balance & proportion are the same thing , etc , etc , etc

everything you ever typed has been addressed , corrected and dismissed I don't need to run from anything you type I could care less , the difference between you and Hulkster is he's scared to elaborate on his ' opinions ' out of fear of looking stupid , you on the other hand don't mind looking stupid 

I pick & choose when I want to play with my toys and when I want to put them back

[Hulkster]

I like how Ronnie pictures are nearly always cut off at the knees. Hahahaha.

and I love how your Ronnie pics are always from 1992 or 1995 LOL

[NarcissisticDeity]

and I love how your Ronnie pics are always from 1992 or 1995 LOL

just like the Yates pics you post when he's not at his best

[Hulkster]

just like the Yates pics you post when he's not at his best

yeah, because 93 was not his best LOL