Author Topic: GENETICS!!!!!!  (Read 5926 times)

tbombz

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GENETICS!!!!!!
« on: February 08, 2009, 05:11:26 PM »
  :D

gordiano

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2009, 05:12:22 PM »
All Twinkies....




HAHA, RON.....

NaturalWonder83

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2009, 05:12:28 PM »
evan centapani
w

lovemonkey

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2009, 05:12:47 PM »
Well woopedoo, all synthol and stretchmarks.
from incomplete data

Wiggs

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2009, 05:31:04 PM »
hey fat, fat ;D
7

Pete Nice

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2009, 06:28:50 PM »
...
Air Falcon

The Coach

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2009, 06:29:41 PM »

tbombz

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2009, 07:27:47 PM »
Cast members from Deliverance?
fat kid in first pic is evan centaponi, second one is evan as a sophmore.
evan says eh got up to as fat as 220lbs as a freshman, then over tyhe summer leaned out into the sophmore body you see in the second picture. 220lbs as a freshman before ever working out... thats very fat, fatter than in the first pic.




the point was just that "genetics" dont play as big a role as does hard work, big eating, and drugs.

WillGrant

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2009, 02:15:15 AM »
fat kid in first pic is evan centaponi, second one is evan as a sophmore.
evan says eh got up to as fat as 220lbs as a freshman, then over tyhe summer leaned out into the sophmore body you see in the second picture. 220lbs as a freshman before ever working out... thats very fat, fatter than in the first pic.




the point was just that "genetics" dont play as big a role as does hard work, big eating, and drugs.
fat kids?

kiwiol

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2009, 02:28:08 AM »
the point was just that "genetics" dont play as big a role as does hard work, big eating, and drugs.

Wrong! If genetics didn't matter, most of the gym rats who juice, eat and lift hard would look like pros. Genetics is the reason why you will never have Phil Heath's arms or Dorian Yates' back even if you ate, juiced and lifted exactly what they did. Can't believe you made such a dumb statement Candi :-\

WillGrant

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2009, 02:38:19 AM »
Wrong! If genetics didn't matter, most of the gym rats who juice, eat and lift hard would look like pros. Genetics are the reason why you will never have Phil Heath's arms or Dorian Yates' back even if you ate, juiced and lifted exactly what they did. Can't believe you made such a dumb statement Candi :-\
Spot on as usal big kiwi.
This has been explained to candi many times and he still doesnt get it..maybe he says dumb things to get attention?  ???

Hugo Chavez

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2009, 02:51:00 AM »
BOOM!!!

Fatpanda

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2009, 03:17:53 AM »
Wrong! If genetics didn't matter, most of the gym rats who juice, eat and lift hard would look like pros. Genetics are the reason why you will never have Phil Heath's arms or Dorian Yates' back even if you ate, juiced and lifted exactly what they did. Can't believe you made such a dumb statement Candi :-\

bullshit !

you may not be able to change muscle shape, but if you take hg gear, eat and lift correctly anyone can be as big as a pro.

naturals don't all look the same due to the same reasons - i.e hormones due to differences in natural test levels.
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WillGrant

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2009, 03:26:25 AM »
bullshit !

you may not be able to change muscle shape, but if you take hg gear, eat and lift correctly anyone can be as big as a pro.

naturals don't all look the same due to the same reasons - i.e hormones due to differences in natural test levels.
But they wont look like a pro..just like anyone can lift heavy weights and eat to gain weight , doesnt mean they will look impressive or look like a bodybuilder...

Genetics is a whole pile of things , bellys , insertions , structure etc etc.only the elite have it all.


Candys statement is still wrong IMO. And if you reread kiwis statement it is correct.I could do the same thing as yates in regards to juice,training,diet it doesnt mean ill be pro calibar of course you will get bigger muscles but doesnt mean you will look like yates.

kiwiol

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2009, 03:32:30 AM »
bullshit !

you may not be able to change muscle shape, but if you take hg gear, eat and lift correctly anyone can be as big as a pro.

naturals don't all look the same due to the same reasons - i.e hormones due to differences in natural test levels.

Sorry, but you are wrong. Mike Matarazzo once (jokingly) said that at least half the audience in a show like the Mr Olympia are on more drugs than the competitors themselves! But then very few of them look like the pros onstage, don't they? Going by your theory, everyone in the pro level should be of the same or similar size as Ronnie Coleman of 2003 or Dorian Yates when he weighed 270 lb in 2007. The reason they don't is because of genetics.

At the top level, all pros do similar amounts of juice, yet some are bigger than others. They all have access to the best gyms and there are no secrets with dieting or juicing or training, but there is only one Phil Heath with arms like the ones he has or Dorian Yates with his calves. Johnnie Jackson probably lifts heavier than Dorian does (not that it matters if he doesn't) and even if he takes the same or more of the drugs than what Dorian did, he'll never have Dorian's calves in a billion years.

Throughout their reigns as Mr Olympia, both Dorian Yates and Ronnie Coleman had competitors trying to equal or surpass them in terms of size and muscularity. And save for a couple of guys who had the genetics for it (like Nasser and Jay), no one else could come close to them muscularity wise. Genetics are the reason why you can take someone like Kenny Jones, inject him with everything you can get your hands on and still not have him come anywhere near the shape Ronnie Coleman displayed at his best onstage.

Drugs will help you build more muscle than what you can naturally and do it quicker. But no drugs or training or dietary principles will change your calves to resemble those of Dorian Yates if your calves were 11" to start with, to give an example. Genetics is also the reason why some pros stay healthy (relatively speaking) and retain a head full of hair in spite of mega dosing stuff, while others have their body and organs break down and fail.

Genetics is a whole pile of things , bellys , insertions , structure etc etc.only the elite have it all.

Absolutely right!

Meso_z

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2009, 03:35:03 AM »
Everyone was skinny or fat at some point in his life.

Fatpanda

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2009, 03:44:22 AM »
But they wont look like a pro..just like anyone can lift heavy weights and eat to gain weight , doesnt mean they will look impressive or look like a bodybuilder...

Genetics is a whole pile of things , bellys , insertions , structure etc etc.only the elite have it all.


Candys statement is still wrong IMO. And if you reread kiwis statement it is correct.I could do the same thing as yates in regards to juice,training,diet it doesnt mean ill be pro calibar of course you will get bigger muscles but doesnt mean you will look like yates.

you are right, if you took what yates took you'll probably have better arms and no gut  ;D
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Fatpanda

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2009, 04:00:56 AM »
Sorry, but you are wrong. Mike Matarazzo once (jokingly) said that at least half the audience in a show like the Mr Olympia are on more drugs than the competitors themselves! But then very few of them look like the pros onstage, don't they? Going by your theory, everyone in the pro level should be of the same or similar size as Ronnie Coleman of 2003 or Dorian Yates when he weighed 270 lb in 2007. The reason they don't is because of genetics.

At the top level, all pros do similar amounts of juice, yet some are bigger than others. They all have access to the best gyms and there are no secrets with dieting or juicing or training, but there is only one Phil Heath with arms like the ones he has or Dorian Yates with his calves. Johnnie Jackson probably lifts heavier than Dorian does (not that it matters if he doesn't) and even if he takes the same or more of the drugs than what Dorian did, he'll never have Dorian's calves in a billion years.

Throughout their reigns as Mr Olympia, both Dorian Yates and Ronnie Coleman had competitors trying to equal or surpass them in terms of size and muscularity. And save for a couple of guys who had the genetics for it (like Nasser and Jay), no one else could come close to them muscularity wise. Genetics are the reason why you can take someone like Kenny Jones, inject him with everything you can get your hands on and still not have him come anywhere near the shape Ronnie Coleman displayed at his best onstage.

Drugs will help you build more muscle than what you can naturally and do it quicker. But no drugs or training or dietary principles will change your calves to resemble those of Dorian Yates if your calves were 11" to start with, to give an example. Genetics is also the reason why some pros stay healthy (relatively speaking) and retain a head full of hair in spite of mega dosing stuff, while others have their body and organs break down and fail.

Absolutely right!

mike isn't exactly going to come out and tell the truth - i.e anyone could be as big as him if they took illegal drugs too. he's not the only 'pro' to make this claim, yet as soon as they all come off they look like aids victims i.e. prince, titus, levrone, etc

yes genetics does involve a load of things, insertions, structure etc as will said. However your argument that ronnie and yates were special or genetic freaks is simply a guess. you have no clue what they take, and saying that every pro is on virtually the same thing is a guess too, in fact , many like milos, gh15, doggcrapp, priest, disgusted etc all disagree regading dosages. i read kamali and johnny jackson say the dosages chad wanted them to take would kill them - clearly ronnie didn't mind - and funnily enough was the largest ever.

reg park was considered a genetic freak, never to be beaten on size, then arnold, then haney, then dorian, then ronnie. the one thing they all have in common is larger doses.

steroids + training = size
diet + training = cuts

the rest i leave to genetics, which will be reflected in the judging or should i say 'personal preference' in the same way someone compares 2 faces and decides who is better looking.
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kiwiol

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2009, 04:17:59 AM »
yes genetics does involve a load of things, insertions, structure etc as will said. However your argument that ronnie and yates were special or genetic freaks is simply a guess. you have no clue what they take, and saying that every pro is on virtually the same thing is a guess too, in fact , many like milos, gh15, doggcrapp, priest, disgusted etc all disagree regading dosages.

I forgot who I was arguing with ;D

Going back to your post though, fair enough that I have no idea what Dorian or Ronnie were taking. But same goes for you and everyone else. The variation in dosages among these guys is a whole different topic altogether, but I'd say the dosages would be very similar, cause a lot of these guy do interact and know each other quite well. There aren't millions of substances out there for these guys to take - it's the same bunch of things and I'd say the differences in the amount they take would be minimal.

My point is that you have guys like Nasser, Dorian and Ronnie who are freaks among genetic freaks. Not all of their size and muscularity can be attributed to juice. Genetics dictates the size and shape of your muscles, along with your response to juice, your body's resiliency and so on. Which is why no matter how much you make someone like Kenny Jones lift or eat or juice, you'll never get him to come anywhere near how big and freaky Dorian or Ronnie were.

So juice is a big part of the equation, but not the determining factor when it comes to how big you can get or whether you can compete and win in pro shows. If you have read anything about amateurs who try their hand at competing, you'll find that a lot of them, including top names like Phillip Goglia (who wrote a great article in FLEX back in the 90s) admit that no matter what they take and how committed they are with their diet and insane they are with their training, they would never be Mr Olympia.

Same reason why Chris Lund said that if you combine Rich Gaspari's heart with Flex Wheeler's genetics, you'd get an unbeatable Mr Olympia ;)

Balloon

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2009, 04:28:07 AM »


Same reason why Chris Lund said that if you combine Rich Gaspari's heart with Flex Wheeler's genetics, you'd get an unbeatable Mr Olympia ;)
U look at Cormier, wheeler and Dillet, all caught up in the Venice beach scene and who got the latest rims.

Really a shame none of them reached their genetic potential. Venice Beach ruined them

Fatpanda

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2009, 04:35:00 AM »
I forgot who I was arguing with ;D

Going back to your post though, fair enough that I have no idea what Dorian or Ronnie were taking. But same goes for you and everyone else. The variation in dosages among these guys is a whole different topic altogether, but I'd say the dosages would be very similar, cause a lot of these guy do interact and know each other quite well. There aren't millions of substances out there for these guys to take - it's the same bunch of things and I'd say the differences in the amount they take would be minimal.

My point is that you have guys like Nasser, Dorian and Ronnie who are freaks among genetic freaks. Not all of their size and muscularity can be attributed to juice. Genetics dictates the size and shape of your muscles, along with your response to juice, your body's resiliency and so on. Which is why no matter how much you make someone like Kenny Jones lift or eat or juice, you'll never get him to come anywhere near how big and freaky Dorian or Ronnie were.

So juice is a big part of the equation, but not the determining factor when it comes to how big you can get or whether you can compete and win in pro shows. If you have read anything about amateurs who try their hand at competing, you'll find that a lot of them, including top names like Phillip Goglia (who wrote a great article in FLEX back in the 90s) admit that no matter what they take and how committed they are with their diet and insane they are with their training, they would never be Mr Olympia.

Same reason why Chris Lund said that if you combine Rich Gaspari's heart with Flex Wheeler's genetics, you'd get an unbeatable Mr Olympia ;)

i can see your point, and will's.

i still disagree though  :D

if you take 2 identical twins, give 1 human grade gear, proper diet , and use progressive resistance.

if the other twin lacks in any one of these factors the difference in physique will be vast.

the same vast difference you see in the pro's with the added difference of structure, shape etc

hell compare greg kovac when he first arrived on the scene to now - same genetics, but gear, igf, and god knows what else has caused him to develop palumboism, the gut etc

physiques will always look different due to general genetic differences between people, but size and condition is controlable with gear, diet, and lifting.

also look at the justin harris pics on he other thread - 2 years ago he thought he had a lagging bodypart ( due to genetics) 2 years later, he ups the dosage, changs the excercise and boom - wings.

do not believe the myth.
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kiwiol

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #21 on: February 09, 2009, 04:45:32 AM »
do not believe the myth.

OK, thank you Einstein ;D

Fatpanda

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #22 on: February 09, 2009, 04:47:17 AM »
OK, thank you Einstein ;D

 ;D

have you seen once were warriors kiwiol ?

some scary guys in that movie - is new zealand that bad ?
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njflex

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #23 on: February 09, 2009, 08:47:13 AM »
Everyone was skinny or fat at some point in his life.
TRUE,BUT IT'S THE MIDDLE ROAD COMBO TRAITS.that most pros are at that make them big and lean from the get go.fuller muscle look even half trained or just from playing sports,skinny guys can get bigger but always will trail most natural mesomorph types,heavy guy will be bigger mass wise but trail in good natural shape and muscle leaness.

spinnis

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Re: GENETICS!!!!!!
« Reply #24 on: February 09, 2009, 08:49:34 AM »
Epic genetics