The Wizard on Cutler, Dexter, Martinez, Wolf, Heath, IFBB, Weider, Obama, Bush

[dr.chimps]

Nope, but there is sufficient evidence (current lifestyle, past earnings, intelligence, etc.)  yet one makes reaching assumptions such as "credit" or "living off of family" it does suggest jealousy. 

If I saw anyone in their early 40's who I knew made millions during their career and now does not work and lives a relaxed lifestyle I would feel safe in assuming they are a millionnaire.  If someone kept looking for reasons to dodge that likelihood I would assume they are jealous.

Your Honour. I enter into evidence: Bernie Madoff. Strike one. 

[Mr. Magoo]

Nope, but there is sufficient evidence (current lifestyle, past earnings, intelligence, etc.)  yet one makes reaching assumptions such as "credit" or "living off of family" it does suggest jealousy. 

If I saw anyone in their early 40's who I knew made millions during their career and now does not work and lives a relaxed lifestyle I would feel safe in assuming they are a millionnaire.  If someone kept looking for reasons to dodge that likelihood I would assume they are jealous.

Current lifestyle: He has large expenses? How does he pay for these expenses? Does he pay? What expenses are these?

Past Earnings: How do you know what he use to earn? Forget what Nasser has said. What articles or references of proof can you provide to prove how much he use to earn and where that money went, assuming he kept care of it or invested it, in which more proof should arise.

Intelligence: This depends on how you percieve him apparently. He may seem smart to you, but smart people always seem like a genius in a room full of morons. You said in your previous post that your statement of Nassers intelligence was an exaggeration, so I'm automatically not considering this point.

[NarcissisticDeity]

Nope, but there is sufficient evidence (current lifestyle, past earnings, intelligence, etc.)  yet one makes reaching assumptions such as "credit" or "living off of family" it does suggest jealousy. 

If I saw anyone in their early 40's who I knew made millions during their career and now does not work and lives a relaxed lifestyle I would feel safe in assuming they are a millionnaire.  If someone kept looking for reasons to dodge that likelihood I would assume they are jealous.

Again you're constantly misquoting me and I asked you before to provide me the quote where I specifically claimed he retired off of credit , you're being very careful with your words now because the semantics game doesn't work , you misquoted mesomorph so it's nothing new to you , I said there could be many reasons for his lifestyle it doesn't mean he's a millionaire YOU keep harping on these I never said he was I said it could be

How do you know he made ' millions ' ? again you don't you're just believing whatever he tells you which brings me back to my original point his word can't be trusted when he claims EVERY pro takes synthol with the sole exception of him lol what is his word worth? you may blindly believe whatever he tells you I don't

and I doubt he made millions in his bodybuilding career , Pro bodybuilding has a lot over overhead and hus contest winning and guestposing gigs I seriously doubt if he made millions in his career , maybe on paper but when all is said and done I doubt it , hell the only one that made that much soley on bodybuilding would be Ronnie and maybe Jay

and I told you I'm not jealous and if I were it wouldn't be of him , it would be of Bill Gates why stop at an ex-bodybuilder who living comfortably?

[bigbobs]

Current lifestyle: He has large expenses? How does he pay for these expenses? Does he pay? What expenses are these?

He lives a decent house (5 bedroom, 3 garage), drives a Benz, goes out lots, and travels.  He pays for them from his investment income.

Past Earnings: How do you know what he use to earn? Forget what Nasser has said. What articles or references of proof can you provide to prove how much he use to earn and where that money went, assuming he kept care of it or invested it, in which more proof should arise.

He earned over $1 million from his Weider contract alone (keep in mind much of this was earned approx. 10 years ago).  He bought a very large house when the market was low and sold when it was high.  Last year Knny187 posted that house and was valued at $2.4 million, after the crash.  He made a lot in prize money, especially when you consider allt he European grand prix shows after the Olympia which most people forget about.  He made lots in appearances (as one of the most popular pros in the mid to late 90's he was invited on appearances about once a week.  He also sold thousands of dollars in photos at each appearance).  If you care enough you can do the math.  By the way it' snot only me who makes these claims, Doherty (the Australian) who has no reason to lie about Nasser also said here on getbig that he made a lot during his competitive years and invested it wisely unlike other pros.

Intelligence: This depends on how you percieve him apparently. He may seem smart to you, but smart people always seem like a genius in a room full of morons. You said in your previous post that your statement of Nassers intelligence was an exaggeration, so I'm automatically not considering this point.

By this I meant he is not the type who blows his money or lives beyond his means.  I know this because I know him personally.  

[NarcissisticDeity]

Current lifestyle: He has large expenses? How does he pay for these expenses? Does he pay? What expenses are these?

Past Earnings: How do you know what he use to earn? Forget what Nasser has said. What articles or references of proof can you provide to prove how much he use to earn and where that money went, assuming he kept care of it or invested it, in which more proof should arise.

Intelligence: This depends on how you percieve him apparently. He may seem smart to you, but smart people always seem like a genius in a room full of morons. You said in your previous post that your statement of Nassers intelligence was an exaggeration, so I'm automatically not considering this point.

Exactly and lets entertain he did invest everyone took a huge hit recently did he some how manage to escape this?  after taxes there goes what 35%? then all the supplements ,food , traveling expenses , etc , etc I mean where does the list end?

[bigbobs]

Oh man, the desire to argue for pages over the wealth of a man you do not even know is remarkable!  

[Lord Humungous]

...

x2

[NarcissisticDeity]

Oh man, the desire to argue for pages over the wealth of a man you do not even know is remarkable!  

You're defending his assumed wealth is the remarkable aspect and trying to get a straight answer out of you is another 

bottom line entertaining he is super wealthy that means what? you keep posting as if it means something , I bet Nasser would trade all the money in the world for at least one Sandow  more to life than bragging about money on the internet Bob

[bigbobs]

You're defending his assumed wealth is the remarkable aspect and trying to get a straight answer out of you is another 

I know the guy, you don't.  I would not go for pages arguing about what Dorian Yates' net worth may be, because I don't know him and don't care, but I would still give benefit of the doubt that he's a millionnaire even if he sought no external sources of income after he retired like his supplement line.  Physique I might debate for some pages because it is a bodybuilding forum, but trying to argue against a man's wealth who I don't know? Nah.

bottom line entertaining he is super wealthy that means what? you keep posting as if it means something , I bet Nasser would trade all the money in the world for at least one Sandow  more to life than bragging about money on the internet Bob

Never said he's "super-wealthy" - I always chose words like "well off" and "decent lifestyle."  I discuss his wealth when questioned about it or upon accusations that he is not well off.  More to life than arguing against money on the internet ND. 

He honestly would not trade much money for a Sandow.  When I visited he had tens of trophies all wrapped up in a corner in his home and only a couple on display

[NarcissisticDeity]

I know the guy, you don't.  I would not go for pages arguing about what Dorian Yates' net worth may be, because I don't know him and don't care, but I would still give benefit of the doubt that he's a millionnaire even if he sought no external sources of income after he retired like his supplement line.  Physique I might debate for some pages because it is a bodybuilding forum, but trying to argue against a man's wealth who I don't know? Nah.

Never said he's "super-wealthy" - I always chose words like "well off" and "decent lifestyle."  I discuss his wealth when questioned about it or upon accusations that he is not well off.  More to life than arguing against money on the internet ND. 

He honestly would not trade much money for a Sandow.  When I visited he had tens of trophies all wrapped up in a corner in his home and only a couple on display

I know the guy, you don't.  I would not go for pages arguing about what Dorian Yates' net worth may be, because I don't know him and don't care, but I would still give benefit of the doubt that he's a millionnaire even if he sought no external sources of income after he retired like his supplement line.  Physique I might debate for some pages because it is a bodybuilding forum, but trying to argue against a man's wealth who I don't know? Nah.

again YOU don't know if he's a millionaire that's the whole point that's either your assumption and or him telling you either way you still don't know

Never said he's "super-wealthy" - I always chose words like "well off" and "decent lifestyle."  I discuss his wealth when questioned about it or upon accusations that he is not well off.  More to life than arguing against money on the internet ND. 

He honestly would not trade much money for a Sandow.  When I visited he had tens of trophies all wrapped up in a corner in his home and only a couple on display

I never claimed you said he was super wealthy , I choose that word , again the money isn't the issue that's being argued about , it's the fact YOU don't know if he is or not is that 'debate ' 

There are trophies and then there is the Sandow , big difference and you and even he claims he is the uncrowned Mr Olympia so I think it weighs heavily on his mind 11 years later lol

[bigbobs]

again YOU don't know if he's a millionaire that's the whole point that's either your assumption and or him telling you either way you still don't know

I never claimed you said he was super wealthy , I choose that word , again the money isn't the issue that's being argued about , it's the fact YOU don't know if he is or not is that 'debate ' 

There are trophies and then there is the Sandow , big difference and you and even he claims he is the uncrowned Mr Olympia so I think it weighs heavily on his mind 11 years later lol

How many times do I need to say that I saw physical document evidence that proves he's a millionnaire?  So yes, I do KNOW that he's a millionnaire.

[dr.chimps]

There are trophies and then there is the Sandow , big difference and you and even he claims he is the uncrowned Mr Olympia so I think it weighs heavily on his mind 11 years later lol

At least 3x

[NarcissisticDeity]

How many times do I need to say that I saw physical document evidence that proves he's a millionnaire?  So yes, I do KNOW that he's a millionnaire.

You never claimed you seen a physical document evidence ( sic ) ) that proves he's a millionaire , keep track of your story

[bigbobs]

You never claimed you seen a physical document evidence ( sic ) ) that proves he's a millionaire , keep track of your story

Yawn, if I cared I could probably find at least three quotes in this very thread where I said that.

...or three times (at least) where I said that

[NarcissisticDeity]

Yawn, if I cared I could probably find at least three quotes in this very thread where I said that.

...or three times (at least) where I said that

NO you never once said that,  that's a lie , I will call you out find me where other than this past post you claimed this I saw physical document evidence that proves he's a millionnaire? and good luck 

[bigbobs]

NO you never once said that,  that's a lie , I will call you out find me where other than this past post you claimed this I saw physical document evidence that proves he's a millionnaire? and good luck 

I said I saw "documentary evidence" and that I wasn't going to disclose the details since they are personal.  One doesn't have to use the EXACT SAME words (when they mean the same thing) each time something is said to claim they have already said it.  Fuck you're anal, lol.

Now you'd be set to go for pages and pages to micro-inspect and debate above paragraph lol.   I have better things to do this evening.  Take care

[NarcissisticDeity]

I said I saw "documentary evidence" and that I wasn't going to disclose the details since they are personal.  One doesn't have to use the EXACT SAME words (when they mean the same thing) each time something is said to claim they have already said it.  Fuck you're anal, lol.

Now you'd be set to go for pages and pages to micro-inspect and debate above paragraph lol.   I have better things to do this evening.  Take care

Oh like others you like to play with words when people call you on them lol

[dr.chimps]

I said I saw "documentary evidence" and that I wasn't going to disclose the details since they are personal.  One doesn't have to use the EXACT SAME words (when they mean the same thing) each time something is said to claim they have already said it.  Fuck you're anal, lol.

Now you'd be set to go for pages and pages to micro-inspect and debate above paragraph lol.   I have better things to do this evening.  Take care

LOL. I have never once in my life ever seen, or been privy, to another person's 'documentary evidence' of wealth. Nasser just have his bank book open on the table? Did he take you into the el Sonbatty gold depository? Maybe he had price tags on all his objects? How would another person's wealth or assets even be broached in polite conversation!?

[HugeAl]

Bigbobs is an accountant and a good friend of Nasser's. Is it really that hard for people to understand why Bigbobs might be privy to Nasser's personal wealth? 

Anyway, it's public knowledge that Nasser sold his home for a few million dollars, owns three cars and earned over a million US dollars from his Weider contract alone.

[dr.chimps]

Bigbobs is an accountant and a good friend of Nasser's. Is it really that hard for people to understand why Bigbobs might be privy to Nasser's personal wealth? 

Anyway, it's public knowledge that Nasser sold his home for a few million dollars, owns three cars and earned over a million US dollars from his Weider contract alone.

Hmm. I understand that the wealth of public figures like Buffett and Gates are 'public knowledge' because of corporate governance and disclosure, but Nasser as well! My. my. Can you provide a link, HugeAl? 

[HugeAl]

Hmm. I understand that the wealth of public figures like Buffett and Gates are 'public knowledge' because of corporate governance and disclosure, but Nasser as well! My. my. Can you provide a link, HugeAl? 

Kenny posted public records confirming that Nasser's house sold for multi-million dollars. Damn dude, your jealousy of Nasser is really pathetic.

[Sherief Shalaby]

Mon_of_Steel asked Nasser 10 interesting questions, and Nasser has answered 5 of them so far, which I'm pasting below.  I made a new thread for it because many others probably didn't click on the original thread not realizing that it contains an insightful statement by Nasser within, as opposed to the typical Nasser threads plagued by immaturity of some other members.

1. What's his opinion on Dexter winning the O?

I think it was too long for Cutler to continue getting contest presents despire his deteriorating look, bad shape and condition.  Cutler was no longer acceptable as Mr. " O " because it was too obvious that he was pushed by the financially strong white financial powers, including Manion who still loves black east coast athletes, but even more he loves the white east coast athletes.  Also boring Cutler and Cutler's permanent brown nosing for years and telling Manion over and over again that he " admires Yates his body ( because Manion was ALWAYS a Yates fan ) ", had paid off at the beginning but it did not at the final end.  Even for the average knowledged bodybuilding fan it was too obvious that he ( Cutler ) was not the best body builder on the planet due to his drummer waist, a biceps tear, atrophying quad muscle, NO vascularity in the upper body, heaps of wrinkles and folds.  Even In some contest poses Cutler looked like he had too much baby fat on his body.

So " they " built up Dexter parallell to Cutler because at least both of them have been regularly consistent for years with their physiques compared to many others.  Dexter deserved to win the " O" in 2008.  No doubt.  But if Dexter would have competed in the 90ies, which he did ( = pinnacle of pro body building's development ) with his look now he would have placed high but most likely would have barely reached the top six of the " O "'s.  Dexter would have not been able to beat guys in their prime like Wheeler, Ray, Coleman, Yates,...neither physically nor politically.  Dexter was and is so far consistent but he lucky that the best body building era with the guys with the best shape, symmetry and size was in the ninties and not now.

2.  Who does he think is the next in line for the O, Heath, Wolf, Martinez?

If Martines makes more improvements he can be the new Mr. " O " in 2009 - but will his record be " something " against him and also that he is originally not a NPC athlete but from the Dominican  Republic?  Heath is also very good but he is too narrow. His nice personality and good demenour can speak for him at the end if he comes in great condition.  Wolf is an introvert, worse than anyone else on that stage. He is a foreigner ( who does not live in the US ), regardless if from Russia or seen as German. The judging clique will not give a member of the Aryan race the ultimate title ( we are not living anymore in Arnold's times ). Also Wolf has very weak hams and calves. Most black guys have also terrible ( due to their genetics ) and weak calves but they dont get penalized for it, however it will be taken more seriously in Wolf's situation.  Further Wolf has too flat of a back with great lack of size in the lower back.  And further Wolf looked better in 2007 than in 2008.  He better also stay away from Milos Sarcev permanently.  An association with Milos is not good for any aspiring athlete or an average person who wants to be taken seriously.  But if you are interested to talk about penis sizes, male sex endurance, drugs in general and drugs in specific and to learn how to cheat people out of your money, then go to Milos Sarcev.

3.  Knowing what he knows now about the IFBB, would he still have got into bodybuilding like he did?

I do think that the best body building federation is the IFBB.  There is no better one. DeMilia's former PDI was a failure, obviously.
From my point of view there is no alternative to the IFBB despite my and other guys criticism. There are a lot of problems in many associations, federations, institutions,..even in every government in this world.  But it would be so much easier to accept " wrong's " from the other side if many more people / athlete's would be paid better, higher and contracts would be longer.

I personally was with Weider 10 + years and made over one million US Dollars in contract money without even counting any other sources of money I earned from the sport.  The  way I see it I was paid by Weider and not by the IFBB ( despite the prize money ). However I received placements from the IFBB before I turned pro and because I placed high in many shows ( 32 placings in the top three in 33 shows ) I got a higher value / market value which Weider reflected in my income.  Basically in one way or the other Weider and the IFBB work together.

There is so much more in the upcoming book regarding the IFBB which I do not like to reveal here.  Weider made a body building hero out of me ( photo shoots, my salary increasing which further motivated me,...), not the IFBB despite that it was the IFBB who placed me.

4.  If he was 20 today would he get into bodybuilding with the state it's in

Not really, because there is too much work, sacrifice, self torture,....and the pay is too low.  There is no money for someone who is even regularly top 15 in the world of pros.  The lack of proper reembursement and lack of medical health care makes athletes become more aggressive among each other, creates more hostilities, and less self conscience about potential medical problems.  It is not all about money but you can not just live off love of the sport.  And a lot of IFBB guys in suits just do not care because they are selfish or / and do not make too much money for themselves either.  Pesonally I do not see any major progress in pro body building. 

G4Pay, escort service, muscleworeship,...are all part of the dark body building industry.  Personally I do believe that people who have a " weakness for money " do all kinds of things which are related to sex / body. This not just the case in ( pro ) body building.  And let us not forget there are many people who do not see anything wrong with earning from these acts.  This is not a justification but for many people it is really not a big deal, especially if you have tendencies to exhibit your body naturally without clothing.
 
If body building would be higher paying, the judges would be regularly rotated ( not for most of the time " life long " installed ) and more money would be around then body building would be so much more popular.  Even golf, which is not a really athletic sport has more acceptance than body building, because it is so highly paid.

5.  How does he feel about Obama being the president.

I think it is good to be away from the catastrophic 16 years of Bush government, but especially the last eight years of the younger Bush.  And the last Bush was not really the most intelligent and capable person to resolve inner domestic issues or outside of the USA lying problems.  Bush did that what he was told to be done. Even 95 % his speeches have been not written by himself. He was  just a simple puppet. From that perspective seen, I think almost everything else after him is " better and good ".
 
However the problem for Obama, a very intelligent and articulate man, is that it will be more than difficult and in some areas impossible to do a positive " change ".  But at least Obama, despite his seriousness in foreign affairs will not pull the US in another war like McCain potentially or Bush.  12  billion US Dollars spent / monthly on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan since March 2003 has not brought more world stability or " convinced " radicals to realize that they should better themselves due to Bush otherwise coming after them.  Bush lacked in diplomacy, vision and peaceful coexistance, hopefully Obama will be not a failure in those areas as well.  Personally I think that Bush damaged the American people and its image more than he helped them. We can see this almost every day here.  Hopefully Bush can sleep well despite him destroying over 4000 American lives, crippling thousands of " believing in the right thing " US service men and women and being responsible for over a million dead and crippled non Americans who had nothing to do with 09 / 11.  It will be more than difficult for Obama to repair what Bush has terminated and permanently or temporarilly damaged.  Anyone else than Obama would have not a lesser problem now.

great answers by the wizard!!!.. how come i didnt see this thread before