Time For Tough Choices: California

[Soul Crusher]

1. Not the best analogy. Are you forgetting what the US government did to the Indians? 

2. Maybe you should spend 12 hours a day volunteering to show them how it's done... how good they'll have it. 

Nonsense.  I am self employed and dont need to learn skills to be productive.  Welfare cases by definition need to learn good work habits and skills to be productive.   

[Cap]

Incentives to seek employment is far better than work for welfare.

Well, the option to work has been there for these people and they choose to leach off the system.  They don't want to work, plain and simple.  If they don't want to work for themselves, then they should least perform a service for the money they get.

[24KT]

Nonsense.  I am self employed and dont need to learn skills to be productive.  Welfare cases by definition need to learn good work habits and skills to be productive.   

   What world are you living in? The self employed more so than anyone need to learn skills to be productive.

Or maybe you're substituting productive for employable. Even so, what welfare recipients need, isn't good work habits, they need jobs that pay them a decent wage, something that's going to make them want to bounce out of bed in the morning eager to go to work. Infact, ...that's what EVERYBODY needs. Something they can get passionate about.

[24KT]

Well, the option to work has been there for these people and they choose to leach off the system.  They don't want to work, plain and simple.  If they don't want to work for themselves, then they should least perform a service for the money they get.

Oh but they are, ...if they didn't exist, ...what would you have to get on GetBig to bitch about? 

[Cap]

Oh but they are, ...if they didn't exist, ...what would you have to get on GetBig to bitch about? 

Walmart shoppers, a various array of other political issues, bad drivers, dumb people, etc.

[GigantorX]

Not quite.  Look at it as a form of education...learning how to actually work for money.  ALL aid should be cut off to illegals. Cities and counties should send the illegal criminals to federal jurisdiction immediately to be deported and parents should have to show birth certificates and SS cards to enroll kids in school for the first time in school district, otherwise no school. 

You don't know how hard that is to do. Shit, I'm a teacher and we have kids from the city pour into our suburban school district and live with their"aunties and uncles", leach off of stuff that they didn't have to pay taxes for and fuck our schools up and fuck otherwise good kids up with violence and gangs activity.  And we can't tell them no because they can stuff 50 kids in a house and as long as they claim it as legal residence we can't do anything. Mayor Daley of Chicago should be drawn and quartered for what he has done to the state, county and collar counties, bull dozed the ghetto project housing and gave gave them housing vouchers and pushed them into section 8 housing in our area.

Now if it is almost impossible to do to legal citizens, how hard will it be to do to illegal citizens who will claim discrimination, racism and get La Raza and all the cooks to shout down logic and reason?

[Cap]

You don't know how hard that is to do. Shit, I'm a teacher and we have kids from the city pour into our suburban school district and live with their"aunties and uncles", leach off of stuff that they didn't have to pay taxes for and fuck our schools up and fuck otherwise good kids up with violence and gangs activity.  And we can't tell them no because they can stuff 50 kids in a house and as long as they claim it as legal residence we can't do anything. Mayor Daley of Chicago should be drawn and quartered for what he has done to the state, county and collar counties, bull dozed the ghetto project housing and gave gave them housing vouchers and pushed them into section 8 housing in our area.

Now if it is almost impossible to do to legal citizens, how hard will it be to do to illegal citizens who will claim discrimination, racism and get La Raza and all the cooks to shout down logic and reason?

I understand it's hard but just do it.  It might sound callous but if you can't keep track of your birth certificate or go get a SS from the SS administration then you don't belong in school.  Just tell people bluntly, if you don't have these documents and cannot prove you live in the district then you can't attend class. 

[Stormspirit]

it's about time we crack down on these nasty mexican cockroaches

[Cap]

it's about time we crack down on these nasty mexican cockroaches

In CA it's not just Mexicans; there are plenty of Asian immigrants that are sucking CA dry.

[Stormspirit]

In CA it's not just Mexicans; there are plenty of Asian immigrants that are sucking CA dry.

mexicans are the largest problem.  what asians are you talking about, Filipinos, chinese, or all of them?  Filipinos are teh mexicans of asia i hear

[Cap]

mexicans are the largest problem.  what asians are you talking about, Filipinos, chinese, or all of them?  Filipinos are teh mexicans of asia i hear

I couldn't say for certain on the breakdown by ethnicity but I had an interesting chat with a Korean man about how "his people", as he put it, come over with millions, claim they are broke and get free health care and welfare while running cash businesses.  Apparently he said they get away with it because they live in meager homes or have a bunch of people living in one house.  Basically they keep up appearances really well.  They aren't like other welfare cheats that are rollin in Escalades or 350Zs with 20 inch rims.

[Soul Crusher]

I couldn't say for certain on the breakdown by ethnicity but I had an interesting chat with a Korean man about how "his people", as he put it, come over with millions, claim they are broke and get free health care and welfare while running cash businesses.  Apparently he said they get away with it because they live in meager homes or have a bunch of people living in one house.  Basically they keep up appearances really well.  They aren't like other welfare cheats that are rollin in Escalades or 350Zs with 20 inch rims.

I cant believe anyone thinks giving people welfare with no work requirements is a good thing. 

[Cap]

I cant believe anyone thinks giving people welfare with no work requirements is a good thing. 

I mean unless you are crippled and cannot work there is no excuse for not trying to work or working a mediocre job until you get something better.  Shit, the Marines are looking for a few good men and they pay.

[Dos Equis]

I mean unless you are crippled and cannot work there is no excuse for not trying to work or working a mediocre job until you get something better.  Shit, the Marines are looking for a few good men and they pay.

Word. 

[Soul Crusher]

I mean unless you are crippled and cannot work there is no excuse for not trying to work or working a mediocre job until you get something better.  Shit, the Marines are looking for a few good men and they pay.

People need routine in their lives, which makes for productive work and employment.  Sitting home and collecting a check and running down to the liquor store does not make for good work traits. 

Additiionally, work makes people have a sense of worth and dignity.  Sitting home watching springer and My9 is a recipe for perpetual welfare.

[24KT]

I mean unless you are crippled and cannot work there is no excuse for not trying to work or working a mediocre job until you get something better.  Shit, the Marines are looking for a few good men and they pay.

Am in total agreement with you here, however the way welfare is structured with it's clawbacks for earned income, it's more of a disincentive to seek gainful employment. Under a work for welfare system, it would be even worse. At least a pt job that pays a few bucks an hour would allow someone the free time to seek an employment upgrade. A work for welfare system keeps the person forever trapped in the system without the possibility of escape.

[24KT]

People need routine in their lives, which makes for productive work and employment.  Sitting home and collecting a check and running down to the liquor store does not make for good work traits. 

Additiionally, work makes people have a sense of worth and dignity.  Sitting home watching springer and My9 is a recipe for perpetual welfare.

...as would be work for welfare.

[Cap]

People need routine in their lives, which makes for productive work and employment.  Sitting home and collecting a check and running down to the liquor store does not make for good work traits. 

Additiionally, work makes people have a sense of worth and dignity.  Sitting home watching springer and My9 is a recipe for perpetual welfare.

I don't love my job right now but it is a job and I can collect my check knowing I earned every cent; I can say that much for myself.  

I was so proud when I got my first paycheck as a 16 year old boy and have learned the value of hard work.  

Jag, you bring up a valid point but unfortunately the current system does the same thing.

[Soul Crusher]

...as would be work for welfare.

The problem is that all the social welfare programs, coupled together, amount to more than most people can make in entry level jobs.  Its a big problem, but you cant force small companies to pay people with little or no skills high wages just because welfare pays so much. 


These people should be given the choice of cleaning trash on the highway, taking care of seniors, getting a job, or getting nothing at all.  If they dont like it, they dont eat. 

[24KT]

The problem is that all the social welfare programs, coupled together, amount to more than most people can make in entry level jobs.  Its a big problem, but you cant force small companies to pay people with little or no skills high wages just because welfare pays so much. 


These people should be given the choice of cleaning trash on the highway, taking care of seniors, getting a job, or getting nothing at all.  If they dont like it, they dont eat.  

{lol} Oh they'll eat all right. Don't get it twisted. And they'll rob, steal, pillage & plunder to do it.
Mainstream society often forgets many social welfare programs exist primarily for their benefit,
not so much the impoverished. Believe me, ...you don't want to live in a society without a strong social safety net.

[Soul Crusher]

{lol} Oh they'll eat all right. Don't get it twisted. And they'll rob, steal, pillage & plunder to do it.
Mainstream society often forgets many social welfare programs exist primarily for their benefit,
not so much the impoverished. Believe me, ...you don't want to live in a society without a strong social safety net.

You know, I actually thought about the other day, but it felt really shitty to think that we give people welfare just to placate them from committing crimes.  Its a sad testement to the society if that is the case that we have to bribe people in that way to get them to not rob and pillage. 

[24KT]

I don't love my job right now but it is a job and I can collect my check knowing I earned every cent; I can say that much for myself.  

I was so proud when I got my first paycheck as a 16 year old boy and have learned the value of hard work.  

Jag, you bring up a valid point but unfortunately the current system does the same thing.

So the solution is to bring effective 'reform' to the system, not abolish it or make it worse.
A great man recently said something to the effect of "You don't use a hatchet where a scalpel is required."

[Cap]

So the solution is to bring effective 'reform' to the system, not abolish it or make it worse.
A great man recently said something to the effect of "You don't use a hatchet where a scalpel is required."

Yes, but until then I want people to work for their money.

[Straw Man]

simple solution for a decent chunk of budget problems

no more defined benefit pensions for any federal, state, city worker

they are archaic and unsustainable