Jihad @ Suny Binghamton?

[Fury]

All those places you just named are practically 3rd world.  NOT modern culture. 

Again, there are glaring cultural differences between each country.

[OzmO]

Again, there are glaring cultural differences between each country.

Not when it comes to places where law enforcement is weak.

Think about it.  Africa?   The southern Philippines?

[George Whorewell]

Ok- but what's your point?

That muslim terrorists who are home grown commit murders in the name of Islam, but not suicide bombings?

I fail to see the difference. Both are premeditated acts of violence against unarmed, innocent civilians in the name of "God".

[shootfighter1]

Yeah Oz, some of it is culture too, agreed...but I have read stories of 2nd & 3rd generation transplant muslims growing up in the UK becoming terrorists, which means that the islamic religion itself has some attraction to violent extremism.  Also culture and religion are inseparable with islamic fundamentalists.  Just like any religion, it depends on the interpretation by the leaders but there is some strong language in sharia law that is more demanding than other religions.  I think islamic traditions are by definition more antiquated and backward (like the Roman Catholic Church in times past).

[Fury]

Not when it comes to places where law enforcement is weak.

Think about it.  Africa?   The southern Philippines?

Ask yourself why it is like that? Why is the southern Philippines is like it is? Extremist Muslims waging a holy war for their own state. The Northern Philippines (the Catholic majority area) is pretty modern and a decent place. Why is Northern Africa viewed as MUCH, MUCH more violent than Southern Africa? What's the dominant religion in Northern Africa?

What is the dominant religion in Darfur?

Could it be that Islam breeds third-world culture? If that's the case, then it comes back to Islam being the reason. 

[Kazan]

Too bad he wasn't the Christian who kidnapped the little girl and made her a sex slave for 13 years.  He's gonna cost the California taxpayer millions because of his sexual slavery religious beliefs.

OK show me where in the new testiment that Jesus said it was right to kidnap and rape children. There is a huge difference in thinking god is talking to you and doing what is contrary to the whole premise of the religion, and doing what the religion teaches. I am in the process of reading the Koran, just reading the book has a tendancy to agitate me, not sure why. But if a casual reading gets that effect from it I can only imagine what goes through the minds of the people that live it.

[OzmO]

Yeah Oz, some of it is culture too, agreed...but I have read stories of 2nd & 3rd generation transplant muslims growing up in the UK becoming terrorists, which means that the islamic religion itself has some attraction to violent extremism.  Also culture and religion are inseparable with islamic fundamentalists.  Just like any religion, it depends on the interpretation by the leaders but there is some strong language in sharia law that is more demanding than other religions.  I think islamic traditions are by definition more antiquated and backward (like the Roman Catholic Church in times past).

I'm not surprised about the UK they roll over an pander to muslims there.

[OzmO]

OK show me where in the new testiment that Jesus said it was right to kidnap and rape children. There is a huge difference in thinking god is talking to you and doing what is contrary to the whole premise of the religion, and doing what the religion teaches. I am in the process of reading the Koran, just reading the book has a tendancy to agitate me, not sure why. But if a casual reading gets that effect from it I can only imagine what goes through the minds of the people that live it.

Part of the christian bible is the old testament where slavery and genocide are enacted by God.  I got a copy of the koran.  I feel if you put a religion like Isam in a place like the ME then you get crap like that.  But american muslims don't do that.

[OzmO]

Ask yourself why it is like that? Why is the southern Philippines is like it is? Extremist Muslims waging a holy war for their own state. The Northern Philippines (the Catholic majority area) is pretty modern and a decent place. Why is Northern Africa viewed as MUCH, MUCH more violent than Southern Africa? What's the dominant religion in Northern Africa?

What is the dominant religion in Darfur?

Could it be that Islam breeds third-world culture? If that's the case, then it comes back to Islam being the reason. 

No.  Lots of other things breed a third world culture.  However, a religion like Islam flourishes in it.

[Kazan]

Part of the christian bible is the old testament where slavery and genocide are enacted by God.  I got a copy of the koran.  I feel if you put a religion like Isam in a place like the ME then you get crap like that.  But american muslims don't do that.

Yes but the laws of the old testament do not apply to Christians, the old testament or Torah is there to show the proficies etc that prove Jesus is the messiah. Most don't even understand the OT yet use it as a proof, but there is a religion board for that discussion

[Straw Man]

where did it say this guy's motivation had anything to do with Islam?

[OzmO]

Yes but the laws of the old testament do not apply to Christians, the old testament or Torah is there to show the proficies etc that prove Jesus is the messiah. Most don't even understand the OT yet use it as a proof, but there is a religion board for that discussion

I understand OT laws don't apply.  My point is, lack of a modern culture (Law enforcement, judicial systems, poverty, less infrastructure and basics like education, resources, utilities etc) is more the cause not the religion.  Otherwise we'd see 2nd and 3rd generation muslim in america going bad shit at christian churches in America.

[Skip8282]

I understand OT laws don't apply.  My point is, lack of a modern culture (Law enforcement, judicial systems, poverty, less infrastructure and basics like education, resources, utilities etc) is more the cause not the religion.  Otherwise we'd see 2nd and 3rd generation muslim in america going bad shit at christian churches in America.

Not buying it.  If that's the case, how do you account for relatively peaceful 3rd world nations?  Tunisia, Mozambique, Ghana, Gabon, Bhutan...

[OzmO]

Not buying it.  If that's the case, how do you account for relatively peaceful 3rd world nations?  Tunisia, Mozambique, Ghana, Gabon, Bhutan...

Then by the same token how do you account for the peaceful muslims in America?

Great point.  Might be other reasons.  I just think the situation in the ME is a perfect breeding ground for radical Islam.  Hatred of the jews, constant violence, and America's Jewish support lets recruitment flourish.  That combined with a lack of education and a 13th century under culture, this is what you get. 

Saying it is the religion is incorrect.

[George Whorewell]

Then by the same token how do you account for the peaceful muslims in America?

Great point.  Might be other reasons.  I just think the situation in the ME is a perfect breeding ground for radical Islam.  Hatred of the jews, constant violence, and America's Jewish support lets recruitment flourish.  That combined with a lack of education and a 13th century under culture, this is what you get. 

Saying it is the religion is incorrect.

Oz this is utter nonsense. A recent poll which was done on a global scale shows that Muslims worldwide-- regardless of education, wealth or geographic location overwhelmingly believe 911 was done by Israeli agents or the US, that suicide bombing is acceptable and that the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are wars against Islam. A peaceful muslim is not a non-radical muslim-- it just means a muslim that hasn't openly engaged in jihad. Of course, most muslims aren't going to strap bombs to their chest and take out a local shopping mall-- but support for such acts, whether active or passive is support nonetheless. This religion breeds insanity. Pointing to something in the old testament does not rationalize or explain the fact that muslims today are the most violent, backwards people in the world.

[OzmO]

Oz this is utter nonsense. A recent poll which was done on a global scale shows that Muslims worldwide-- regardless of education, wealth or geographic location overwhelmingly believe 911 was done by Israeli agents or the US, that suicide bombing is acceptable and that the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are wars against Islam.  This religion breeds insanity. Pointing to something in the old testament does not rationalize or explain the fact that muslims today are the most violent, backwards people in the world.

Really?  Show me the poll.   That's lunacy.  But i wouldn't be too surprised is it's 3rd world muslims. 

A peaceful muslim is not a non-radical muslim-- it just means a muslim that hasn't openly engaged in jihad. Of course, most muslims aren't going to strap bombs to their chest and take out a local shopping mall-- but support for such acts, whether active or passive is support nonetheless.

Support based on what they believe is right just as we support what we believe is right. 

This religion breeds insanity. Pointing to something in the old testament does not rationalize or explain the fact that muslims today are the most violent, backwards people in the world.

This religion breeds insanity because it's prevalent in a perfect breeding ground.  Take away the the ground, and they are no different than american muslims.

[OzmO]

If we had suicide bombers in the USA who were 2nd or 3rd generation muslims because they were acting out their religious faith I'd agree with you.

To say it's the "muslim" religion is incorrect.  To say it isn't the muslim religion is incorrect also.  The religion does play a part in it.  I agree to that. 

[Kazan]

Most of the 9/11 Hijackers were Saudi's, they were educated. What drives an educated person to highjack a plane and crash it into a building? Why is that in prison so many are converted to Islam? It's because the actions are justified as doing the will of allah. Violence against infidels, domination of women all in the name of Islam. Muslims always qualify everything with "god willing" therefore what they do isn't wrong or right it is gods will if they succeed or fail. The fact that you are promissed what would be considered material things to become a martyr is fucked up on many levels. I can thing of a couple of instances of American mulsims going the jihad route, John Walker Lindh aka the American taliban, Adam Ghadan or Azam the American.

[Soul Crusher]

where did it say this guy's motivation had anything to do with Islam?

Straw - he didnt like the fact that the class was scheduled for 3:00 in the afternoon. 

WTF is wrong with you?