Atheist Group Blasts Postal Service for Mother Teresa Stamp

[Soul Crusher]

Would you agree to a disclaimer on a MLK stamp? Or the drug abusing Elvis stamp?

I seriously dont expect an answer to that GREAT question.   

[The True Adonis]

I'm actually atheist but what I was focusing on is the fact that you're trying to latch yourself onto the accomplishments of Tesla and Edison when you have absolutely nothing in common with them beyond the fact that you're an atheist. The use of "we" as if you played in a part in their discoveries is pretty funny. 

MattC is notorious for doing this as well.

How am I trying to take credit for anything?  The point is, Tesla and Edison, had they been satisfied with "God the all powerful master behind everything" they would have been satisfied with not understanding the world much to humanity's loss for their talents would have never been exploited.

I share my free thinking with them as well and posses the same curiosity.  Religion and belief in god limit this and encourage limitation of the mind via faith or belief in the supernatural, evidence free.

Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.

[Fury]

I just dont get why Aiethists are so rabid on this issue. 

Atheists that trumpet it and are constantly talking about how superior atheism is while chastising others are no better than the religious nutjobs in my book.

[The True Adonis]

Atheists that trumpet it and are constantly talking about how superior atheism is while chastising others are no better than the religious nutjobs in my book.

Why should religion get a free pass?  You are on here all the time trumpeting about your choice in politics, movies and what have you....what you like, dislike and why you feel that way, why treat religion any different than you treat your politics?

Doesn`t make any sense.

[Fury]

Why should religion get a free pass?  You are on here all the time trumpeting about your choice in politics, movies and what have you....what you like, dislike and why you feel that way, why treat religion any different than you treat your politics?

Doesn`t make any sense.

Because your condescending attitude and how you conduct yourself with regards to atheism/religion is no different from the people trumpeting the bible/koran/whatever. Your arguments are no different from theirs. You just argue your point from the other end of the spectrum. Replace "atheism" with "Christianity" and your argument is exactly the same as theirs.

[The True Adonis]

Would you agree to a disclaimer on a MLK stamp? Or the drug abusing Elvis stamp?

Sure why not.  I wish the stamp were big enough to read like a biography.  I don`t care if Mother Teresa is on the stamp either.  I am not against it at all.  I am against people deifying a fraud and believing an alternate history rather than the one that did occur.
  MLK did not start the civil rights movement by the way.  (had to throw that in there since many think he did)  

I do find great pleasure in the music of Elvis and think he will be the type of icon that will be relevant hundreds of years from now.  


I don`t want to see Muhammad on a stamp and I suspect you don`t want to see that either.  I also do not want to see Jesus on a stamp. I personally like Dog stamps and animal stamps.  We need more of those.

I answered your question now you answer mine. So, would you want Muhammad on a stamp glorifying Islam?

[pellius]

Why should religion get a free pass?  You are on here all the time trumpeting about your choice in politics, movies and what have you....what you like, dislike and why you feel that way, why treat religion any different than you treat your politics?

Doesn`t make any sense.

Can you post a recent picture of the lovely Jeezebelle. I miss her. I wouldn't protest if they put her on a stamp.

[pellius]

Sure why not.  I wish the stamp were big enough to read like a biography.  I don`t care if Mother Teresa is on the stamp either.  I am not against it at all.  I am against people deifying a fraud and believing an alternate history rather than the one that did occur.
  MLK did not start the civil rights movement by the way.  (had to throw that in there since many think he did)  

I do find great pleasure in the music of Elvis and think he will be the type of icon that will be relevant hundreds of years from now.  


I don`t want to see Muhammad on a stamp and I suspect you don`t want to see that either.  I also do not want to see Jesus on a stamp. I personally like Dog stamps and animal stamps.  We need more of those.

I answered your question now you answer mine. So, would you want Muhammad on a stamp glorifying Islam?

Honestly, I never liked the idea of putting anybody on a stamp. I just alway by the one with the flag on it. Once I was desperate and had to buy a book of stamps at the grocery store. The only one they had was the one that said "LOVE" on it. For chrissakes! Just give me a fuking regular stamp already.

[The True Adonis]

Because your condescending attitude and how you conduct yourself with regards to atheism/religion is no different from the people trumpeting the bible/koran/whatever. Your arguments are no different from theirs. You just argue your point from the other end of the spectrum. Replace "atheism" with "Christianity" and your argument is exactly the same as theirs.

1. Atheism is not a religion and cannot be considered as one.  It is simply no belief.  I really don`t like the word as many seems to think it is a school of thought when it is merely an absence of supernatural belief of any kind.

2. My arguments are NOT arguments and are based in Evidence and Science.  Whereas theirs are faith based which means  believing in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.

3. Some may consider you condescending when it comes to politics and what you think you know.  Do I care.  Nope.  To me, you are that little twerp ( based on your older pic) who sometimes has some good points, but very rarely.  Hope this helps.

[The True Adonis]

Honestly, I never liked the idea of putting anybody on a stamp. I just alway by the one with the flag on it. Once I was desperate and had to buy a book of stamps at the grocery store. The only one they had was the one that said "LOVE" on it. For chrissakes! Just give me a fuking regular stamp already.

ROFLMAO.  I hope nobody got the wrong idea. 

Here is the first pic that came up.

[pellius]

ROFLMAO.  I hope nobody got the wrong idea. 

Here is the first pic that came up.

There was always something about her I liked and your only verifiable accomplishment in life. I have to give you that.

Tell her another one of her many GetBig fans gives his regards.

[loco]

Oh you mean like this one with the several million that this one brought in alone by Richard Dawkins:

http://givingaid.richarddawkins.net/
Non-Believers Giving Aid: a religion-free way to help disaster victims

Spurred by the horrific suffering in Haiti, the Richard Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science (RDFRS) has joined forces with 18 other freethought groups or associates, to collect donations to non-religious relief organizations. Those participating are Atheist Alliance International, Atheists Helping the Homeless, Atheists United, The British Humanist Association, Freedom From Religion Foundation, The International Humanist and Ethical Union, James Randi Educational Foundation, Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers, New Humanist Magazine, Pharyngula, Rationalist Association, Reasonable New York, The Reason Project, The Richard Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science, Secular Student Alliance, Skeptics in the Pub, The Skeptic Magazine, The Skeptics Society and Unreasonable Faith.

We have set up a new dedicated bank account and PayPal facility in the new name of Non-Believers Giving Aid. All of the money donated will be distributed to disaster relief.

Clearly the immediate need is for the suffering people of Haiti, and all the money raised by this current appeal will go to that cause, but the new account will remain available for future emergencies too. There are, of course, many ways for you to donate to relief organizations already, but doing it through Non-Believers Giving Aid offers some advantages:

1. 100% of your donation will be go to these charities: PayPal has agreed to waive all fees on Haiti-related donations from January 12th through February 11th. This means that more of your money will reach the people in need.

2. When donating via Non-Believers Giving Aid, you are helping to counter the scandalous myth that only the religious care about their fellow-humans.
It goes without saying that your donations will only be passed on to aid organizations that do not have religious affiliations. In the case of Haiti, the two organizations we have chosen are:
Doctors Without Borders (Médecins sans Frontières)
International Red Cross
You may stipulate using the dropdown menu which of these two organizations you want your donation to go to; otherwise, it will be divided equally between them.

Preachers and televangelists, mullahs and imams, often seem almost to gloat over natural disasters – presenting them as payback for human transgressions, or for ‘making a pact with the devil’. Earthquakes and tsunamis are caused not by ‘sin’ but by tectonic plate movements, and tectonic plates, like everything else in the physical world, are supremely indifferent to human affairs and sadly indifferent to human suffering. Those of us who understand this reality are sometimes accused of being indifferent to that suffering ourselves. Of course the very opposite is the truth: we do not hide behind the notion that earthly suffering will be rewarded in a heavenly paradise, nor do we expect a heavenly reward for our generosity: the understanding that this is the only life any of us have makes the need to alleviate suffering even more urgent. The myth that it is only the religious who truly care is sustained largely by the fact that they tend to donate not as individuals, but through their churches. Non-believers, by contrast, give as individuals: we have no church through which to give collectively, no church to rack up statistics of competitive generosity. Non-Believers Giving Aid is not a church (that’s putting it mildly) but it does provide an easy conduit for the non-religious to help those in desperate need, whilst simultaneously giving the lie to the canard that you need God to be good.

Whether you do it by clicking the PayPal button or by cheque (see below), please help us to help the suffering people of Haiti.
Important note for UK donors – please read carefully
If you are a UK taxpayer, please make it possible for us to claim Gift Aid on your donation. Gift Aid means that every £10 you donate becomes £12.82. We aim to have Gift Aid-compatible electronic donation facilities in place for future emergency appeals, but until then we would urge you to donate by cheque rather than to use the PayPal facility below, and to enclose a completed Gift Aid Declaration with your cheque. Please make your cheque payable to RDFRS, and make sure you write ‘NBGA’ on the reverse of it, along with the name of your preferred charity (MSF or IRC) if appropriate. If you simply write ‘NBGA’ on the reverse, without the addition of MSF or IRC, your donation will be evenly divided between them. Then post it, along with your completed Gift Aid Declaration, to the Oxford address shown below. RDFRS will not retain any part of your donation or any Gift Aid we are able to reclaim on it.
Donations made via the PayPal button below are still very welcome, and will still make a huge difference to the people of Haiti; but donations by cheque + Gift Aid Declaration will go further still, and we hope that this thought will help to compensate for any inconvenience. Thank you!

How sad that these atheists will help their fellow human beings, not because they care about people, but only to prove a silly point and to attack religion and compete with rescue efforts by religious organizations.

Religious organizations on the other hand are always willing to coordinate efforts with secular charities, because the people in need is all that matters.

Too bad these atheists are not willing to work with and coordinate efforts with religious organizations.

Oh well, whatever their motivation, the people of Haiti need their help too.

[loco]

Sure why not.  I wish the stamp were big enough to read like a biography.  I don`t care if Mother Teresa is on the stamp either.  I am not against it at all.  I am against people deifying a fraud and believing an alternate history rather than the one that did occur.
  MLK did not start the civil rights movement by the way.  (had to throw that in there since many think he did)  

I do find great pleasure in the music of Elvis and think he will be the type of icon that will be relevant hundreds of years from now.  


I don`t want to see Muhammad on a stamp and I suspect you don`t want to see that either.  I also do not want to see Jesus on a stamp. I personally like Dog stamps and animal stamps.  We need more of those.

I answered your question now you answer mine. So, would you want Muhammad on a stamp glorifying Islam?

Dogs are animals too.   

Oh, and whoever puts Muhammad on a stamp, it won't be to glorify Islam.  That would infuriate the Muslims and they would put a bounty on the heads of those responsible.

[drkaje]

Take your stupid bias (stupid because it is meaningless, why are you trying to make this personal?) against me out of the equation and instead focus on the information I presented.

Is any of it incorrect.  If it is, can you show me where and why it is incorrect?  Again, why do you want to make this personal?  All I did was provide the information and my information comes from research, books, first hand accounts, primary and secondary sources.  We just happen to communicate via the internet.

Would you rather me mail you correspondence instead?  You can always PM me your mailing address.  Do you want to discuss this over the phone?  Should I rent out a conference room and have a symposium?  Do you want to meet at the Library of Congress or some other facility?

Exit Question:  How is the same material presented on digital form any different than in paper form.

Also, when you see Obama, Bush or say Richard Dawkins or Stephen Hawking giving a lecture on the internet, do you not really think that they are the actual person but some sort of impostor?

Do you not think the Journals uploaded on internet sites are exact copies of paper copies?

You really cannot be this moronic.  Or can you?  I don`t want to presume you are but you are making it difficult to think otherwise.

Adonis,

Bigger words aren't a sign of intelligence.

You're actually less smart than originally given credit for.

Any idiot can quote or copy from a journal.

[haider]

Dogs are animals too.   

Oh, and whoever puts Muhammad on a stamp, it won't be to glorify Islam.  That would infuriate the Muslims and they would put a bounty on the heads of those responsible.

Let me go to a religious area in the United States and try to distribute material derogatory of Christianity or Jesus himself... I'm sure they'll take it in exchange for a peice of pie, or some flowers even 

[loco]

Let me go to a religious area in the United States and try to distribute material derogatory of Christianity or Jesus himself... I'm sure they'll take it in exchange for a peice of pie, or some flowers even 

You may or may not get punched in the face by some stupid red neck if you do that, but you can create all kinds of material derogatory of Christianity or Jesus himself, it happens every day, and Christians will not put a bounty on your head like Muslims have done when someone writes a book trashing Islam or publishes a cartoon of Muhammad in the newspaper. 

Either way, putting an image of Muhammad on a stamp would not be derogatory of Islam or Muhammad, but Muslims would definitely take offense to it.

[The True Adonis]

You may or may not get punched in the face by some stupid red neck if you do that, but you can create all kinds of material derogatory of Christianity or Jesus himself, it happens every day, and Christians will not put a bounty on your head like Muslims have done when someone writes a book trashing Islam or publishes a cartoon of Muhammad in the newspaper. 

Either way, putting an image of Muhammad on a stamp would not be derogatory of Islam or Muhammad, but Muslims would definitely take offense to it.

Muslims and Christians pray to the same god. HA HA HA

[haider]

You may or may not get punched in the face by some stupid red neck if you do that, but you can create all kinds of material derogatory of Christianity or Jesus himself, it happens every day, and Christians will not put a bounty on your head like Muslims have done when someone writes a book trashing Islam or publishes a cartoon of Muhammad in the newspaper. 

Either way, putting an image of Muhammad on a stamp would not be derogatory of Islam or Muhammad, but Muslims would definitely take offense to it.

I'm talking about Christians who take their faith seriously- not exactly a whole lot of them left around. I highly doubt christians in the third world would act any differently. You merely presuppose all of this based on how "christians" act in modern secular western countries.  Let us also not forget the wrongdoings of the Church in history in this respect.

Now you may argue that no christian LEADER calls a hit on some one if they publish anti-christianity material. But then again it is hard to attribute their actions to their christian faith, or the progressive western ethic against the use of violence. Some may argue that things would be a lot different, as they were in history, under dominant christian rule.

And also: It IS derogatory to make images of Muhammed FOR A MUSLIM. To take that as a peice of evidence agaisnt Islam as being a "violent religion" is very presumptuos.

[Hugo Chavez]

I saw a story once, think it was on Fox but I'm not sure that the number of atheists that actually go crazy with lawsuits, protests, prayer in school, 10 commandments in courts etc are actually very small in number.  So I always wonder why the media gives them the PR when they're bitching about something like this.  Wouldn't it be a bigger hit in the face to just ignore them if there are not many of them?  Or it could be the the right likes to give these few people headlines on stuff like this since it makes all atheists look bad?  I dunno....

[loco]

I'm talking about Christians who take their faith seriously- not exactly a whole lot of them left around. I highly doubt christians in the third world would act any differently. You merely presuppose all of this based on how "christians" act in modern secular western countries.  Let us also not forget the wrongdoings of the Church in history in this respect.

Now you may argue that no christian LEADER calls a hit on some one if they publish anti-christianity material. But then again it is hard to attribute their actions to their christian faith, or the progressive western ethic against the use of violence. Some may argue that things would be a lot different, as they were in history, under dominant christian rule.

And also: It IS derogatory to make images of Muhammed FOR A MUSLIM. To take that as a peice of evidence agaisnt Islam as being a "violent religion" is very presumptuos.

TA asked pellius

So, would you want Muhammad on a stamp glorifying Islam?

I was simply pointing out to TA the fact that Muhammad will never be on a stamp because one, that does not glorify Islam but rather offends Muslims and two, Muslims most likely will put a bounty on the head of anyone who does that.  These are simple facts.

I never said in this thread that this was evidence against Islam as being a "violent religion."  You said that.  I wasn't putting down Islam or trying to start a Christianity vs Islam argument.  You did.

By the way, you got your Christians reversed.  The "Christians who take their faith seriously" are the ones who not only would not strike you if you do or say something derogatory toward Christianity or toward Jesus Christ Himself, but they are the ones who also would not strike back even if you strike them first.  Christians who take their faith seriously are the ones who forgive their enemies and do not harm those who hate them.  And there are a whole lot of them left around.  They have been around for thousands of years.  This is what Jesus Christ taught by word and by example.  This is what his apostles taught by word and by example.  This is what Christians who take their faith seriously do or at least try very hard to do.  It has always been that way.

Pliny the Younger Letter to Trajan (c.111-117 C.E.)

"...they maintained that their fault or error amounted to nothing more than this: they were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before sunrise and reciting an antiphonal hymn to Christ as God, and binding themselves with an oath not to commit any crime, but to abstain from all acts of theft, robbery and adultery, from breaches of faith, from repudiating a trust when called upon to honour it."  Pliny, Epistles x.96, from Bruce, p.26.

[drkaje]

Interesting points, Loco. That being said it's doubtful people here would seriously discuss how few Christians practice Christianity's principles because it might end with them being compared to Muslims who have strayed from the Islam.

[LurkerNoMore]

Mother Teresa wasn't an atheist.  However, in her crisis of faith in the later years it became evident that she had lived a spiritual life as opposed to a religious one.  Which is not a bad thing.

Everyone has shortcomings, but this woman had a selfless heart that loved everyone openly no matter what gender, race, belief, etc..

I have no problem with honoring someone who valued the lives of others like she did.

[Soul Crusher]

Mother Teresa wasn't an atheist.  However, in her crisis of faith in the later years it became evident that she had lived a spiritual life as opposed to a religious one.  Which is not a bad thing.

Everyone has shortcomings, but this woman had a selfless heart that loved everyone openly no matter what gender, race, belief, etc..

I have no problem with honoring someone who valued the lives of others like she did.

According to TA - she was like Madoff and running ponzi schemes. 

[LurkerNoMore]

According to TA - she was like Madoff and running ponzi schemes. 

Off Topic - but have you seen the ponzi scheme kingpins coming out of S. Florida lately?  Rothstein was just jailed and facing a 100 years (fucking fool for returning to US and turning himself in), now some mini-rothstein has been nabbed on a much smaller level.  By much smaller, they say only about 30-40 million that they know of.

[Soul Crusher]

Off Topic - but have you seen the ponzi scheme kingpins coming out of S. Florida lately?  Rothstein was just jailed and facing a 100 years (fucking fool for returning to US and turning himself in), now some mini-rothstein has been nabbed on a much smaller level.  By much smaller, they say only about 30-40 million that they know of.

Our whole nation, and especially those who appear to have amassed all this "wealth", are running on, off, or close to a ponzi scheme as far as $ $ $ goes.