Anyone ever successfully "Clean Bulked"

[benchmstr]

You arent gonna do a lot of bulking doing all that cardio. Whats that about 40-45 min?

i have never timed it......but i only work out on the days that i dont run...so...

mon=chest, shoulders,tri's
tues=run
wed=legs
thur=run
fri=back, and bi's
sat=run

...so far since i have started doing this i have made the best natural gains of my life...i usually eat every 1 hour, or drink a shake...

bench

[Option D]

i have never timed it......but i only work out on the days that i dont run...so...

mon=chest, shoulders,tri's
tues=run
wed=legs
thur=run
fri=back, and bi's
sat=run

...so far since i have started doing this i have made the best natural gains of my life...i usually eat every 1 hour, or drink a shake...

bench

3500 cals/ day?

[benchmstr]

3500 cals/ day?

most likely more......i have very bad insomnia, and only sleep 2-3hours a night...

bench

[io856]

most likely more......i have very bad insomnia, and only sleep 2-3hours a night...

bench

the cardio and lack of sleep is going to have you ravenous during the day

Experimental sleep deprivation in healthy humans affects levels of ghrelin and leptin, two primary hormones involved in energy balance that regulate appetite and body weight. No study to date has examined levels of these hormones in patients with chronic insomnia. In this study, men diagnosed with primary insomnia using DSM-IV criteria (n = 14) and age and body weight comparable healthy control men (n = 24) underwent polysomnography. Circulating levels of ghrelin and leptin were measured at 2300 h, 0200 h and 0600 h. As compared to controls, insomnia patients showed less total sleep time, stage 2 and REM sleep and decreased sleep efficiency and more stage 1 sleep than controls (p's < .05). Ghrelin levels across the night were significantly lower in insomnia patients (p < .0001). Leptin was not significantly different between the groups. In conclusion, decreased nocturnal ghrelin in insomnia is consistent with findings for nighttime levels in sleep deprivation studies in healthy sleepers. These findings suggest that insomnia patients have a dysregulation in energy balance that may play a role in explaining prospective weight gain in this population.

Motivala SJ, Tomiyama AJ, Ziegler M, Khandrika S, Irwin MR. Nocturnal levels of ghrelin and leptin and sleep in chronic insomnia. Psychoneuroendocrinology .2009 May;34(4):540-5. Epub 2008 Dec 6.

[Option D]

most likely more......i have very bad insomnia, and only sleep 2-3hours a night...

bench

Not cool bro

[benchmstr]

the cardio and lack of sleep is going to have you ravenous during the day

Motivala SJ, Tomiyama AJ, Ziegler M, Khandrika S, Irwin MR. Nocturnal levels of ghrelin and leptin and sleep in chronic insomnia. Psychoneuroendocrinology .2009 May;34(4):540-5. Epub 2008 Dec 6.

its cool....i have had the insomnia since i was around 8 years old...i am used to it by now...i am never tired during the day either....my body just requires much less sleep...

bench

[Option D]

its cool....i have had the insomnia since i was around 8 years old...i am used to it by now...i am never tired during the day either....my body just requires much less sleep...

bench

Woah. i used to stay up watching Sanford and son...and then sleep at baseball practice while strecthing....lol

But its cool that your body has adapted to minimal amounts of sleep...

[io856]

its cool....i have had the insomnia since i was around 8 years old...i am used to it by now...i am never tired during the day either....my body just requires much less sleep...

bench

Yes the study was in reference to CHRONIC insomnia... your appetite will be through the roof only sleeping 2-3hours a night...

[Option D]

Yes the study was in reference to CHRONIC insomnia... your appetite will be through the roof only sleeping 2-3hours a night...

Yeah because when our "regular" Metabolism is taking a rest...He is up expending Energy....

But my question is "WHEN DO YOU RECOVER" if i dont sleep. I cant train. I feel very stale

[wavelength]

The thing is there is no such thing as a "clean" diet. The only thing that makes a bulk "dirty" is eating too much = fulking (fat bulking).

[io856]

Yeah because when our "regular" Metabolism is taking a rest...He is up expending Energy....

But my question is "WHEN DO YOU RECOVER" if i dont sleep. I cant train. I feel very stale

no it has more to do with ghrelin levels being raised did you not read the abstract I posted?  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghrelin

[benchmstr]

Yeah because when our "regular" Metabolism is taking a rest...He is up expending Energy....

But my question is "WHEN DO YOU RECOVER" if i dont sleep. I cant train. I feel very stale

my main recovery strategy is to post on getbig...

bench

[io856]

The thing is there is no such thing as a "clean" diet. The only thing that makes a bulk "dirty" is eating too much = fulking (fat bulking).

and how the fuck is somebody supposed to know when that point is..? without some sort of nutritional plan

[Option D]

The thing is there is no such thing as a "clean" diet. The only thing that makes a bulk "dirty" is eating too much = fulking (fat bulking).

hmm....so are you saying there is no real reason to eat 5k cals a day

[io856]

hmm....so are you saying there is no real reason to eat 5k cals a day

if they burn 4.5k then 5k cals ED may serve a purpose to leave a caloric surplus for muscle gain

Participants in the sport of bodybuilding are judged by appearance rather than performance. In this respect, increased muscle size and definition are critical elements of success. The purpose of this review is to evaluate the literature and provide recommendations regarding macronutrient intake during both 'off-season' and 'pre-contest' phases. Body builders attempt to increase muscle mass during the off-season (no competitive events), which may be the great majority of the year. During the off-season, it is advantageous for the bodybuilder to be in positive energy balance so that extra energy is available for muscle anabolism. Additionally, during the off-season, adequate protein must be available to provide amino acids for protein synthesis. For 6-12 weeks prior to competition, body builders attempt to retain muscle mass and reduce body fat to very low levels. During the pre-contest phase, the bodybuilder should be in negative energy balance so that body fat can be oxidised. Furthermore, during the pre-contest phase, protein intake must be adequate to maintain muscle mass. There is evidence that a relatively high protein intake (approximately 30% of energy intake) will reduce lean mass loss relative to a lower protein intake (approximately 15% of energy intake) during energy restriction. The higher protein intake will also provide a relatively large thermic effect that may aid in reducing body fat. In both the off-season and pre-contest phases, adequate dietary carbohydrate should be ingested (55-60% of total energy intake) so that training intensity can be maintained. Excess dietary saturated fat can exacerbate coronary artery disease; however, low-fat diets result in a reduction in circulating testosterone. Thus, we suggest dietary fats comprise 15-20% of the body builders' off-season and pre-contest diets. Consumption of protein/amino acids and carbohydrate immediately before and after training sessions may augment protein synthesis, muscle glycogen resynthesis and reduce protein degradation. The optimal rate of carbohydrate ingested immediately after a training session should be 1.2 g/kg/hour at 30-minute intervals for 4 hours and the carbohydrate should be of high glycaemic index. In summary, the composition of diets for body builders should be 55-60% carbohydrate, 25-30% protein and 15-20% of fat, for both the off-season and pre-contest phases. During the off-season the diet should be slightly hyperenergetic (approximately 15% increase in energy intake) and during the pre-contest phase the diet should be hypoenergetic (approximately 15% decrease in energy intake).

Lambert CP, Frank LL, Evans WJ. (2004). Macronutrient considerations for the sport of bodybuilding. Sports Med. 34(5):317-27.

[benchmstr]

hmm....so are you saying there is no real reason to eat 5k cals a day

but what if all the food i eat goes straight to my cock?......i would eat like...12,000 calories a day!!!!!!

bench

[Option D]

but what if all the food i eat goes straight to my cock?......i would eat like...12,000 calories a day!!!!!!

bench

LOL...COCK OBESE

[wavelength]

and how the fuck is somebody supposed to know when that point is..? without some sort of nutritional plan

Very easy: if you get too fat, reduce calories. Muscles can be gained in a surplus just as well as in maintenance or even a slight deficit.

hmm....so are you saying there is no real reason to eat 5k cals a day

Depends on the person of course. For most people, it just means getting fat.

[io856]

Very easy: if you get too fat, reduce calories. Muscles can be gained in a surplus just as well as in maintenance or even a slight deficit.

Depends on the person of course. For most people, it just means getting fat.

please cite reference

[Option D]

uh ohhhhh...the age old "bulking argument"

[io856]

uh ohhhhh...the age old "bulking argument"

theres no argument its just law of conservation of energy

[wavelength]

A very easy plan for bulking:

First, check this article about realistic lean body mass gains:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/supplement-marketing-on-steroids-by-alan-aragon.html

Then go for X lbs per week of body weight gain (X = e.g. 0.2lbs). Calculate what you should weight every day during the bulk. Step on the scale each morning. If you are above target weight for that day, skip a meal or two. If not, eat all your meals. Try to get enough protein in any case (about 1g / lb of LBM).

[wavelength]

please cite reference

Check e.g. this thread:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=118981601

Alan Aragon chiming in and agreeing.

[io856]

think of it this way... two ways to adapt to strength training... neurological adaptations (recruitment of muscle fibers, increased efficency) or hypertrophy (sacroplasmic, myofibrillar) now... which of these mechanisms will the body take preference of in a surplus and which one in a deficit? simple...

[io856]

Check e.g. this thread:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=118981601

Alan Aragon chiming in and agreeing.

Yes as a natural... chances are you won't be gaining much muscle at all... I agree

but this is bodybuilding and people with half a brain who want to gain muscle have supraphysiological levels of growth hormones