Legalized Marijuana and the Crime Question

[FredHayekowski]

Prohibition made Capone and organized crime into a national power that still exists to this day.  Drug laws do the same.  Decriminalize all drugs and treat the fallout medically through universal healthcare.  Dope is the number one cash crop in the US annually.  Another source of revenue.  And it's fun.

[Dos Equis]

Drugged driving deaths increase in Hawaii
Fatalities increase after medical marijuana legalized
Published  2:42 PM HST Mar 02, 2014

HONOLULU —Is marijuana making our roads safer or more dangerous? National studies are mixed on drivers under the influence of pot, but Hawaii statistics show a clear trend.

As a medical marijuana user, Joe Rattner has seen his health improve by using the drug.

"It relaxes me completely from my brain to my bodily functions. So I go about my day a little easier," said Rattner.

A recent study also suggests medical marijuana may have made roads safer.
It is based on national accident reports, and determined states that allowed medical marijuana saw a significant decrease in traffic fatalities during the first year of the program.

In Hawaii, the numbers didn't drop they actually increased from 132 deaths in 2000 to 140 in 2001.

The study suggested drivers substituted pot for alcohol, but overall there hasn't been much of a change with alcohol and fatal accidents.

Nearly 50 percent of drivers tested in those deadly accidents, tested positive for alcohol. That was true before and after the introduction of medical marijuana.

Other studies found marijuana affects driving behavior differently than alcohol, although there were some similarities.

"There is some decreased reflexes with medical marijuana or marijuana in general," said Big Island ER physician Dr. Josh Green.

"It totally slows your reaction down. Your reaction time is totally minimized. You are even thinking about other things than what you should be doing while driving," said Rattner.

Distracted driving or more like drunk driving? That can depend on the user.

According to Honolulu Police Department officers when they pull over drivers, they test for impairment. Which means some long-time or frequent marijuana users may still have the balance and adequate reflexes to pass even if they are high.

One of the statistics that is significant since the introduction of medical marijuana in Hawaii, is the percentage of drivers involved in fatal crashes that tested positive for THC - the psychoactive ingredient in marijuana.  Since 2001, that amount has tripled from five to 15 percent.

"Any decrease in your capacity to swerve and get out of the way of an accident is bad -- don't do it," said Green.

Unlike a breathalyzer or blood test that determines how much alcohol is in a driver's system at a particular time, THC can remain in the bloodstream for days or weeks -- which means more frequent users could have high levels even if they did not use marijuana just before being tested.

http://www.kitv.com/news/hawaii/drugged-driving-deaths-increase-in-hawaii/24767738#ixzz2uwMTV3U3

[RRKore]

Drugged driving deaths increase in Hawaii
Fatalities increase after medical marijuana legalized
Published  2:42 PM HST Mar 02, 2014

HONOLULU —Is marijuana making our roads safer or more dangerous? National studies are mixed on drivers under the influence of pot, but Hawaii statistics show a clear trend.

As a medical marijuana user, Joe Rattner has seen his health improve by using the drug.

"It relaxes me completely from my brain to my bodily functions. So I go about my day a little easier," said Rattner.

A recent study also suggests medical marijuana may have made roads safer.
It is based on national accident reports, and determined states that allowed medical marijuana saw a significant decrease in traffic fatalities during the first year of the program.

In Hawaii, the numbers didn't drop they actually increased from 132 deaths in 2000 to 140 in 2001.

The study suggested drivers substituted pot for alcohol, but overall there hasn't been much of a change with alcohol and fatal accidents.

Nearly 50 percent of drivers tested in those deadly accidents, tested positive for alcohol. That was true before and after the introduction of medical marijuana.

Other studies found marijuana affects driving behavior differently than alcohol, although there were some similarities.

"There is some decreased reflexes with medical marijuana or marijuana in general," said Big Island ER physician Dr. Josh Green.

"It totally slows your reaction down. Your reaction time is totally minimized. You are even thinking about other things than what you should be doing while driving," said Rattner.

Distracted driving or more like drunk driving? That can depend on the user.

According to Honolulu Police Department officers when they pull over drivers, they test for impairment. Which means some long-time or frequent marijuana users may still have the balance and adequate reflexes to pass even if they are high.

One of the statistics that is significant since the introduction of medical marijuana in Hawaii, is the percentage of drivers involved in fatal crashes that tested positive for THC - the psychoactive ingredient in marijuana.  Since 2001, that amount has tripled from five to 15 percent.

"Any decrease in your capacity to swerve and get out of the way of an accident is bad -- don't do it," said Green.

Unlike a breathalyzer or blood test that determines how much alcohol is in a driver's system at a particular time, THC can remain in the bloodstream for days or weeks -- which means more frequent users could have high levels even if they did not use marijuana just before being tested.

http://www.kitv.com/news/hawaii/drugged-driving-deaths-increase-in-hawaii/24767738#ixzz2uwMTV3U3

Holy shit, is this article indicative of the general level of journalism in Hawaii?  --- Could it be that the writer and editor(s) were stoned,lol?

The title is "Drugged driving deaths increase in Hawaii" but what the hell is "drugged driving"? 

I ask because about 3/4's through the article it says that though the % of drivers killed who had THC in their systems tripled (from 5% to 15%), it points out that the presence of THC in one's system does not mean that the driver was high since THC can linger in one's system for "days or weeks".

Also, does KITV not have a statistics major they can make use of?  That traffic fatalities went from 132 to 140 seems near useless info because of the small size of the sample.

Just a shit article.

Thanks BB.

[Dos Equis]

Holy shit, is this article indicative of the general level of journalism in Hawaii?  --- Could it be that the writer and editor(s) were stoned,lol?

The title is "Drugged driving deaths increase in Hawaii" but what the hell is "drugged driving"? 

I ask because about 3/4's through the article it says that though the % of drivers killed who had THC in their systems tripled (from 5% to 15%), it points out that the presence of THC in one's system does not mean that the driver was high since THC can linger in one's system for "days or weeks".

Also, does KITV not have a statistics major they can make use of?  That traffic fatalities went from 132 to 140 seems near useless info because of the small size of the sample.

Just a shit article.

Thanks BB.

I have no problem with the way the article was written. 

This part is troubling:

"There is some decreased reflexes with medical marijuana or marijuana in general," said Big Island ER physician Dr. Josh Green.

"It totally slows your reaction down. Your reaction time is totally minimized. You are even thinking about other things than what you should be doing while driving," said Rattner.

[RRKore]

I have no problem with the way the article was written. 

That you'd admit that is funny as hell but whateva.

This part is troubling:

"There is some decreased reflexes with medical marijuana or marijuana in general," said Big Island ER physician Dr. Josh Green.

"It totally slows your reaction down. Your reaction time is totally minimized. You are even thinking about other things than what you should be doing while driving," said Rattner.

Hilarious.

The very reasonable ER physician says "...some decreased reflexes...in general" followed by the quotes by Rattner (Id'd in this article only as a medical marijuana user) "It totally slows your reaction down." "Your reaction time is totally minimized." 

Like I said, BB, this is a shitty article. 

It seems to have been written/edited by 2 or more folks with quite different viewpoints.

[Dos Equis]

That you'd admit that is funny as hell but whateva.

Hilarious.

The very reasonable ER physician says "...some decreased reflexes...in general" followed by the quotes by Rattner (Id'd in this article only as a medical marijuana user) "It totally slows your reaction down." "Your reaction time is totally minimized." 

Like I said, BB, this is a shitty article. 

It seems to have been written/edited by 2 or more folks with quite different viewpoints.

Sounds like balanced reporting to me.

[RRKore]

Sounds like balanced reporting to me.

Including the title and subtitle?  You don't find them at least a little misleading after reading the article? 

You a Fox News sucker-upper or something?

[Dos Equis]

Including the title and subtitle?  You don't find them at least a little misleading after reading the article? 

You a Fox News sucker-upper or something?

Yes.  No. 

 

[RRKore]

Yes.  No. 

 

Dishonest and not-too-bright is no way to live out your golden years, BB. 

[Dos Equis]

Dishonest and not-too-bright is no way to live out your golden years, BB. 

Yawn. 

[RRKore]

BTW, who started this thread about a dumb article that ridiculously tried to link legalized marijuana with crime, anyway?

I think that other state governments are taking notice with great interest of the more than predicted amount of marijuana tax money that the state of Colorado has rolling in and so we'll likely see more and more states following suit before long.

[whork]

Dishonest and not-too-bright is no way to live out your golden years, BB. 

Beach Bum still believes the earth is flat and the sun rotates around the earth.

And he is on a non-stop mission to take away peoples right to do with their bodies as they please(in this case smoking weed).

A bad combo indeed.

[Dos Equis]

Would this become more prevalent with legalization?

3rd-Graders Caught Smoking Pot In Sonora School Bathroom
March 5, 2014

SONORA (CBS SF) — Three third-grade students at a Sonora elementary school were busted for smoking pot in the school’s bathroom last week.
Two 8-year-olds and a 9-year-old were caught by another student, who immediately informed school administrators.  Those officials then alerted local police.

The students were questioned by officers, and later released to their parents on February 27th.

Sonora Elementary School Principal Chris Boyles would not speak with CBS SF regarding the case, but Superintendent Leigh Shampain confirmed that the students were caught smoking marijuana in the school’s bathroom.  He would not discuss how the students might be disciplined.

“(I’m) shocked. To be in third grade and have their own pipe,” parent Linda Rodriguez commented to KTXL-TV. “I think they should be expelled, but I also think they should follow it further to where they found (the drugs).”

The case was forwarded to the Tuolumne County Probation Department.

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2014/03/05/third-graders-caught-smoking-pot-in-sonora-school-bathroom/

[RRKore]

Would this become more prevalent with legalization?

3rd-Graders Caught Smoking Pot In Sonora School Bathroom
March 5, 2014

SONORA (CBS SF) — Three third-grade students at a Sonora elementary school were busted for smoking pot in the school’s bathroom last week.
Two 8-year-olds and a 9-year-old were caught by another student, who immediately informed school administrators.  Those officials then alerted local police.

The students were questioned by officers, and later released to their parents on February 27th.

Sonora Elementary School Principal Chris Boyles would not speak with CBS SF regarding the case, but Superintendent Leigh Shampain confirmed that the students were caught smoking marijuana in the school’s bathroom.  He would not discuss how the students might be disciplined.

“(I’m) shocked. To be in third grade and have their own pipe,” parent Linda Rodriguez commented to KTXL-TV. “I think they should be expelled, but I also think they should follow it further to where they found (the drugs).”

The case was forwarded to the Tuolumne County Probation Department.

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2014/03/05/third-graders-caught-smoking-pot-in-sonora-school-bathroom/

Are you implying that it's prevalent now?

[StreetSoldier4U]

Would this become more prevalent with legalization?

3rd-Graders Caught Smoking Pot In Sonora School Bathroom
March 5, 2014

SONORA (CBS SF) — Three third-grade students at a Sonora elementary school were busted for smoking pot in the school’s bathroom last week.
Two 8-year-olds and a 9-year-old were caught by another student, who immediately informed school administrators.  Those officials then alerted local police.

The students were questioned by officers, and later released to their parents on February 27th.

Sonora Elementary School Principal Chris Boyles would not speak with CBS SF regarding the case, but Superintendent Leigh Shampain confirmed that the students were caught smoking marijuana in the school’s bathroom.  He would not discuss how the students might be disciplined.

“(I’m) shocked. To be in third grade and have their own pipe,” parent Linda Rodriguez commented to KTXL-TV. “I think they should be expelled, but I also think they should follow it further to where they found (the drugs).”

The case was forwarded to the Tuolumne County Probation Department.

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2014/03/05/third-graders-caught-smoking-pot-in-sonora-school-bathroom/

I'm not sure it would.  This is a failure by adult to properly supervise children. 

[RRKore]

BB's next thread idea:

Legalized guns, fire, gravity and the juvenile crime question.

[Dos Equis]

I'm not sure it would.  This is a failure by adult to properly supervise children. 

This happened at school, so not sure I'd blame the parents, but would sure like to know where the kids got it. 

[Dos Equis]

Actually surprised to hear Governor Moonbeam say this. 

[Jack T. Cross]

Would this become more prevalent with legalization?

3rd-Graders Caught Smoking Pot In Sonora School Bathroom
March 5, 2014

SONORA (CBS SF) — Three third-grade students at a Sonora elementary school were busted for smoking pot in the school’s bathroom last week.
Two 8-year-olds and a 9-year-old were caught by another student, who immediately informed school administrators.  Those officials then alerted local police.

The students were questioned by officers, and later released to their parents on February 27th.

Sonora Elementary School Principal Chris Boyles would not speak with CBS SF regarding the case, but Superintendent Leigh Shampain confirmed that the students were caught smoking marijuana in the school’s bathroom.  He would not discuss how the students might be disciplined.

“(I’m) shocked. To be in third grade and have their own pipe,” parent Linda Rodriguez commented to KTXL-TV. “I think they should be expelled, but I also think they should follow it further to where they found (the drugs).”

The case was forwarded to the Tuolumne County Probation Department.

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2014/03/05/third-graders-caught-smoking-pot-in-sonora-school-bathroom/

Very sorry to say, but nothing new with this one. It's been happening as long as people have been around.

[Dos Equis]

Very sorry to say, but nothing new with this one. It's been happening as long as people have been around.

Third graders smoking pot is not a longstanding problem in this country. 

[Jack T. Cross]

Third graders smoking pot is not a longstanding problem in this country. 

Human nature hasn't been transformed in the past few months. Perhaps you're confusing it with media focus.

[Dos Equis]

Human nature hasn't been transformed in the past few months. Perhaps you're confusing it with media focus.

It simply hasn't been happening for "as long as people have been around."  You realize a third grader is about eight years old?  You must be high (so to speak) if you think we have had a problem with eight-year-olds smoking pot for our entire country's history. 

[blacken700]

3rd graders,i wouldn't look any further than the parents

[Dos Equis]

3rd graders,i wouldn't look any further than the parents

That's the logical place to start, but sometimes it's not a parental failure. 

[Jack T. Cross]

It simply hasn't been happening for "as long as people have been around."  You realize a third grader is about eight years old?  You must be high (so to speak) if you think we have had a problem with eight-year-olds smoking pot for our entire country's history. 

Okay, so when did it become a problem?