2010 Olympia - Jay vs Phil - Bad Judges or Bad Politics???

[~UN_$ung~]

of course he does he's just as delusional as you , he still thinks he placed in 96 

haha, so true

[bic_staedtler]

Looks to me like they picked the 'right' Mr Olympia: he's just plain bigger than Phil. Not by much but enough to win the O.  

Sure, Phil is better all around and I'd consider him to be a more complete Mr O, but...have y'all been not paying attention the last ten years?  The Mr O is about ripped size; if you have size and come in ripped, you win.  

That leg atrophy is kinda strange though.  Next year will be interesting...but not so interesting that the only thing to look forward to is the O.  I was hoping Kai woulda been more of a threat this year.  But I do agree that Martinez is done.  I hope I'm wrong, but he's a non player when the best are on their game.  

And Wolf...possibly the most overrated 'comeback' I've ever seen.  He just looks a mess.

That is all.

[~UN_$ung~]

jays right/left disparity was much more profound in 2008........each of the last two years, he has brought his right side more and more in line with his left

[Flexb]

Looks to me like they picked the 'right' Mr Olympia: he's just plain bigger than Phil. Not by much but enough to win the O.  

Sure, Phil is better all around and I'd consider him to be a more complete Mr O, but...have y'all been not paying attention the last ten years?  The Mr O is about ripped size; if you have size and come in ripped, you win.  

I agree with most of this. Jay has more of a wow factor and has more "pop" when he poses. Sure Phil may have a more appealing look to most people but when comparing him to Jay pose for pose, he doesn't stand out or dominate in the least. The fact of the matter is, they were very close and the difference was Phil was more pleasing while Jay was more freaky. You can't beat the reigning in shape Mr. O without a physique that really stands out and dominates clearly.

[garebear]

Earl Warren really mixed things up.

Am I right, people?

[Royalty]

According to people at the show, Jays quads and hamstrings really crushed Phil's. This was from people seeing it live in vegas.


I think the fact that Jay has a size advantage also effects the judges. You cant just discount 265lbs of mass on Jays extra wide frame.


Having said that, I feel Jay was better in 2009.

[johnny1]

I don,t think it was ether bad judging or politics Sherief, Jays condition was close to his 2009 showing just not quiet as crisp as the year before, as the Defending Champion as History clearly shows you have to be "off" by ALOT to sway the judges initial view of you @ the Pre-Judging where as we all know is the "nuts and bolts" of the contest to a Degree, ala Cutler in 2008 where he was REALLY off, Phil has outstanding body-parts and to the eye alot more pleasing as in the flow of the Physique etc than jay, and if Jay had come in 2-3% heavier/holding more water etc, then i think its conceivable Phil would of won the 2010 O, unfortunately for Phil jay was CONDITION WISE still good enough on the day and thats how the Judges saw it.  

[Lion666]

mr o can not be out muscled when condition is equal...
if jay was big but smoother than, well thats dif but big slice and diced wins every time....

phils stand out arms. mainly tris look great tho and that crab most musclr ala kev lev looks good,,, sometimes phil looks to have bigger arms than jay,,, otherwise and even with still jay wins.

its gona be cool to see how much further phil can produce... hes still young to the sport.
that width of his tris is awesome and by those compare pics he does hold his own, maybe a lil more against jay but overall jay still wins.

[Ex Coelis]

are you trying to say that levrone should have won and nasser should have been in the 7th place?..

actually K-Lo should have been disqualified as well

technically speaking, Shawn Ray was the 2001 Mr. Olympia

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=58884.0

[suckmymuscle]

  Jay has a bazillion pounds of muscle on Phil. Superior taper, aesthetics and round muscle bellies only take you so far. The Mr.Olympia is about finding the World's not only most perfectly developed man but also the most developed, period, and Jay's muscle development is far superior to Phil Heath's. Also, Heath is far from perfect with his long waist, narrow clavicles and shitty calves.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[Ex Coelis]

Earl Warren really mixed things up.

Am I right, people?

no doubt about it

[Lion666]

  Jay has a bazillion pounds of muscle on Phil. Superior taper, aesthetics and round muscle bellies only take you so far. The Mr.Olympia is about finding the World's not only most perfectly developed man but also the most developed, period, and Jay's muscle development is far superior to Phil Heath's. Also, Heath is far more perfect with his long waist, narrow clavicles and shitty calves.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

yeah good post....
right on about the round bellies too...

phil does have those round muscle bellies,,, gives that cool big cartoon look....
jay has more angled m bellies,,, gives a totally dif look.  
all things equal, size / conditioning... the angled bellies give a more rugged look than the rounder bellies

it took me many years to really respect jays build,,, those bloated offseason pics during the ronnie jay showdowns of yesteryears didnt help either...  since 2001 and each passing olympia i get more respect and admire jays build. that classic pic from last year was awesome, he looked/looks like he trains like ronnie,,, but doesnt lol.
size isnt an indicator of strength tho but if it was jay would look the strongest out of that 2010 line up

[Mr. Magoo]

you do know that in some of those pics, jay is taller than phil, and in others, phil is taller than jay...

[Vince B]

You would think if the pros had a rep that he would be watching the judges very carefully. He would not be behind the microphone as MC! What a self-serving stooge this character is. Give him a monkey suit and watch him perform.

[Parker]

If you want to get technical Ronnie wore multi-colored trunks which is ' illegal ' according to the IFBB so he should have lost then too just based on that

Kinda like how Madonna Grimes was marked down or either disqualified due to her wearing a "thong". Something about the rules, stating that there shouldn't be 1/3 of the glutes showing....yet bbers can hike up the back of their trunks to show shredded glutes...I'd rather see women's asses than men's

[~UN_$ung~]

You would think if the pros had a rep that he would be watching the judges very carefully. He would not be behind the microphone as MC! What a self-serving stooge this character is. Give him a monkey suit and watch him perform.

im removing myself from my typical 'vince is a pedo' shtick and am asking you honestly.........


do you know how much of a small, bitter and pathetic old loser you sound like.......droning on in post after post that NO READS........wheres your self respect??

at leat when old men ramble about politics or wayward youth, or the old time.........their heart is in the right place........you a "bodybuilding conspiracy theoroist".....how fuckign inconsequential.







and as athletes rep what would bob do during a show???    INTERRUPT THE JUDGING PANEL?   FIRE JUDGES ON THE SPOT??  ARGUE LOUDLY WITH THE JUDGES TO REARRANGE THE CALLOUT DESCISIONS??  RUN BACK AND FORTH FROM STAGE TO STANDS REPORTING ATHLETES GREVIENCES IN REAL TIME??  
...............MAYBE AFTER A CONTROVERSIAL WINNER IS ANNOUNCED, BOB CAN START THE SHOW OVER

 
 
 



Your a lonely old bitter man who is out of touch with reality........a living, breathing cautionary tale

[Vince B]

What a dope. Clearly Bob can't do his job if he is occupied as MC. Good for Bob but that sucks for the pro athletes rep. He should be mingling with the athletes and making sure everything is okay. It is a travesty the way he does whatever he likes and no one gives a stuff. So much for bodybuilding as a sport. He most definitley should not be on this forum arguing with everyone.

[~UN_$ung~]

What a dope. Clearly Bob can't do his job if he is occupied as MC. Good for Bob but that sucks for the pro athletes rep. He should be mingling with the athletes and making sure everything is okay. It is a travesty the way he does whatever he likes and no one gives a stuff. So much for bodybuilding as a sport. He most definitley should not be on this forum arguing with everyone.

it not like bob, or anyone, is going to make broad sweeping changes to the "sport".......



there is an entrenched hierarchy that runs the IFBB/NPC........they have a complete monopoly.......all dissent has been met with crushing defeat...

what does this mean?, the brass is going to do what the brass wants to do.............bobs position is really kinda window dressing (no offense to bob)

he might be able to effect small changes like how a posing routine is scored, but anything tangible that might actually improve the bodybuilders health in the longterm, or any situation that might put people over profit will be wholly ignored

they are gonna do what they are gonna do anyway......why shouldnt bob get a sweet job out of it, i would love to have bobs job.........your just bitter cause you feel your name should be recognized in the industry, ...........and it is not

[Vince B]

Change? Bob is part of the organization so why would he want to change it? The question is, how come results suck year after year?

[Parker]

it not like bob, or anyone, is going to make broad sweeping changes to the "sport".......



there is an entrenched hierarchy that runs the IFBB/NPC........they have a complete monopoly.......all dissent has been met with crushing defeat...

what does this mean?, the brass is going to do what the brass wants to do.............bobs position is really kinda window dressing (no offense to bob)

he might be able to effect small changes like how a posing routine is scored, but anything tangible that might actually improve the bodybuilders health in the longterm, or any situation that might put people over profit will be wholly ignored

they are gonna do what they are gonna do anyway......why shouldnt bob get a sweet job out of it, i would love to have bobs job.........your just bitter cause you feel your name should be recognized in the industry, ...........and it is not

SOmething may happen when Joe dies, or when the old guard die off, or it might get worse...Joe maybe is the reason why it hasn't gotten worse.

[~UN_$ung~]

SOmething may happen when Joe dies, or when the old guard die off, or it might get worse...Joe maybe is the reason why it hasn't gotten worse.

for all we are concerned, joe is dead.......he has not had direct involvement for years

nothing is goin gto change anytime soon




at the end of the day bodybuilding is a lot less a sport, and a lot more a pagent........and like a pagent, there is no objective way to choose a clear winner

how do you judge beauty?  how you judge who has the most desirable body? its all completely subjective


if you judged it the way vince, or some people on here want it to be judged.....i suppose you can take measurements of people joints, waist, and muscle bellies, and work out some kind of a formula..........but that way all black guy will place first and it wont be very interesting for the fans

[Sherief Shalaby]

Looks to me like they picked the 'right' Mr Olympia: he's just plain bigger than Phil. Not by much but enough to win the O.  

Sure, Phil is better all around and I'd consider him to be a more complete Mr O, but...have y'all been not paying attention the last ten years?  The Mr O is about ripped size; if you have size and come in ripped, you win.  

That leg atrophy is kinda strange though.  Next year will be interesting...but not so interesting that the only thing to look forward to is the O.  I was hoping Kai woulda been more of a threat this year.  But I do agree that Martinez is done.  I hope I'm wrong, but he's a non player when the best are on their game.  

And Wolf...possibly the most overrated 'comeback' I've ever seen.  He just looks a mess.

That is all.

i agree wold didnt deserve his place.. looked very bad from the rear and the rest of him was not anything close to his best!!..

[Sherief Shalaby]

According to people at the show, Jays quads and hamstrings really crushed Phil's. This was from people seeing it live in vegas.


I think the fact that Jay has a size advantage also effects the judges. You cant just discount 265lbs of mass on Jays extra wide frame.


Having said that, I feel Jay was better in 2009.

jay's left quad is owsome,... may be the best in the sport so in all the front shots it makes his right "previosuly injured" quad look weak.. imo this should take some points from him..

phil's quads are ok but need some size to go with his huge arms and shoulders..

[Sherief Shalaby]

I don,t think it was ether bad judging or politics Sherief, Jays condition was close to his 2009 showing just not quiet as crisp as the year before, as the Defending Champion as History clearly shows you have to be "off" by ALOT to sway the judges initial view of you @ the Pre-Judging where as we all know is the "nuts and bolts" of the contest to a Degree, ala Cutler in 2008 where he was REALLY off, Phil has outstanding body-parts and to the eye alot more pleasing as in the flow of the Physique etc than jay, and if Jay had come in 2-3% heavier/holding more water etc, then i think its conceivable Phil would of won the 2010 O, unfortunately for Phil jay was CONDITION WISE still good enough on the day and thats how the Judges saw it.  

i agree with you jonny but this didnt happen in 2007 when jay the defending champion was clearly off and martinez and dex were on but still they gave it to him!!..

2010 was close but not because jay was that great but because all his top competitors have their clear flaws too!!..

still i see phil was better but again it was close and not as bad as when jay beat martinez in 2007!!..

[Sherief Shalaby]

actually K-Lo should have been disqualified as well

technically speaking, Shawn Ray was the 2001 Mr. Olympia

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=58884.0

this makes nasser in the top 6!!