Proposed 1.4% pay raise for military draws fire

[Dos Equis]

Yes they are... most of them are EXTREMELY average... That's why they are privates when they go in.

So try again.

That's inaccurate.  Most enlisted soldiers are privates when they enter, but nearly all officers are college graduates, and the majority of senior officers have graduate degrees.   

And as I said earlier, what they do is uncommon.  Unlike the overwhelming majority of Americans, they risk their lives to serve their country.  They work longer hours.  They sacrifice family relationships.  They suffer severe emotional and physical injuries when involved in combat.  They do what most people are unwilling to do.   

[Cy Tolliver]

And as I said earlier, what they do is uncommon.  Unlike the overwhelming majority of Americans, they risk their lives to serve their country.  They work longer hours.  They sacrifice family relationships.  They suffer severe emotional and physical injuries when involved in combat.  They do what most people are unwilling to do.   

You've just described police officers, fire fighters, miners, commercial fishermen, steel workers....

[tu_holmes]

That's inaccurate.  Most enlisted soldiers are privates when they enter, but nearly all officers are college graduates, and the majority of senior officers have graduate degrees.  

And as I said earlier, what they do is uncommon.  Unlike the overwhelming majority of Americans, they risk their lives to serve their country.  They work longer hours.  They sacrifice family relationships.  They suffer severe emotional and physical injuries when involved in combat.  They do what most people are unwilling to do.    

The CHOOSE to do it.

Also, are you disagreeing that most people in the military are not in fact enlisted? There are more chiefs than Indians? Really?

Facts are... most people in the military are in fact average. Most people in the WORLD are in fact average. No matter what your job is.

[Cy Tolliver]

Liberals... 

[MB]

They're not average Americans. 

It takes no special talents to enter the military.  They are doing a job that needs to be done, but it's a job that they chose (and in most cases because of job security).  There was never a promise of guaranteed wage increases.   

[Dos Equis]

You've just described police officers, fire fighters, miners, commercial fishermen, steel workers....

Not really.  At least not miners, commercial fishermen, and steelworkers. 

[The Showstoppa]

It takes no special talents to enter the military.  They are doing a job that needs to be done, but it's a job that they chose (and in most cases because of job security).  There was never a promise of guaranteed wage increases.   

They aren't paid for the "special talents" before entering the service, it's the talents they develop while in it.

I find it comical how libs/dems have so little respect for the military......and yet they wonder why the military votes republican traditionally.  A quick scan of this thread is very telling. 

[tu_holmes]

Not really.  At least not miners, commercial fishermen, and steelworkers.  

Most people would say that those jobs are actually MORE dangerous than police officers. Firemen actually help people... cops don't help shit.

[tu_holmes]

They aren't paid for the "special talents" before entering the service, it's the talents they develop while in it.

I find it comical how libs/dems have so little respect for the military......and yet they wonder why the military votes republican traditionally.  A quick scan of this thread is very telling. 

Bullshit... This isn't about liberal. It's about facts.

I have no disrespect for the military, but you are going to say that they should be guaranteed a pay raise? Bullshit.

[Dos Equis]

The CHOOSE to do it.

Also, are you disagreeing that most people in the military are not in fact enlisted? There are more chiefs than Indians? Really?

Facts are... most people in the military are in fact average. Most people in the WORLD are in fact average. No matter what your job is.

Yes they choose to put themselves in harm's way to serve their country.  That's largely what makes them so uncommon.  

The majority of military personnel are enlisted.  I was clarifying your comment, which I thought was saying all military members enter as privates.  

We have different viewpoints on people.  I think some folks are just cut from a different cloth.  Doesn't necessarily make them better persons, but it does make them different.  

[The Showstoppa]

Bullshit... This isn't about liberal. It's about facts.

I have no disrespect for the military, but you are going to say that they should be guaranteed a pay raise? Bullshit.

Really, it's about the "facts" huh?  So where in my post did I say ANYTHING about a raise, mr. facts?  F'n nowhere.....its the overall anti-military attitude in the thread that is bullshit. 

but I know the type well.....didn't have the guts to join the military, or were raised that it was beneath them somehow or are jealous of the attention that the military sometimes gets or maybe a Marine home on leave banged a girlfriend......who knows why, but the shit attitude is easy to spot.

[headhuntersix]

Wow......awsome thread...glad Tu decides that I'm both average and don't deserve a raise. Unlike the average civilian government employee we work long hours, especially deployed. DOD civilians, many of whom I'd like to strangle work 8-4. Those are hard and fast hours and if they're doing something for you, many times they pack up and leave, regardless of what you need. I just spend 13 months deployed...I worked on average from 7AM to 11 PM every day...everyday. The food sucked, the living conditions sucked..the Iraqi's sucked..I was paid well enough but the average American wouldn't put up with the crap we do..never mind heavy combat. I can deal with the current pay raise but I have a ton of time in and make good money..my guys worked the same hours for alot less pay...its not fair to them. There are plenty of places to cut...the military, favored whipping boy of the douchbag left, is'nt one of them.

[Kazan]

Good to see you back HH6, some of these guys should watch Restrepo, then see if you think what they do is average.

[headhuntersix]

Yeah....some of those kids were making 30K to suck down that shit...Afghanistan sucks.

[Kazan]

Yeah....some of those kids were making 30K to suck down that shit...Afghanistan sucks.

That documentary is eye opening, you hear about the 1000 yard stare, some of those guys had it.

[Fury]

Wow......awsome thread...glad Tu decides that I'm both average and don't deserve a raise. Unlike the average civilian government employee we work long hours, especially deployed. DOD civilians, many of whom I'd like to strangle work 8-4. Those are hard and fast hours and if they're doing something for you, many times they pack up and leave, regardless of what you need. I just spend 13 months deployed...I worked on average from 7AM to 11 PM every day...everyday. The food sucked, the living conditions sucked..the Iraqi's sucked..I was paid well enough but the average American wouldn't put up with the crap we do..never mind heavy combat. I can deal with the current pay raise but I have a ton of time in and make good money..my guys worked the same hours for alot less pay...its not fair to them. There are plenty of places to cut...the military, favored whipping boy of the douchbag left, is'nt one of them.

Good to see you back, HH6! 

[Emmortal]

Good to see you back HH6, some of these guys should watch Restrepo, then see if you think what they do is average.

I have that on the DVR and shall watch it, I've heard it's really good.

[MB]

They aren't paid for the "special talents" before entering the service, it's the talents they develop while in it.

I find it comical how libs/dems have so little respect for the military......and yet they wonder why the military votes republican traditionally.  A quick scan of this thread is very telling. 

I'm not liberal at all, just want the federal government to cut spending.  I don't necessarily like wage cuts as a starting point, but everything has to be cut back; social security, medicare, welfare, education, defense.  We overspend on everything. 

[The Showstoppa]

I'm not liberal at all, just want the federal government to cut spending.  I don't necessarily like wage cuts as a starting point, but everything has to be cut back; social security, medicare, welfare, education, defense.  We overspend on everything. 

But cutting the pay in the military is a lame bailout....the real waste is in the massive defense contracts we have, R&D on projects just to pad the contractors pockets (porkbarrel for the politicians from those states), close some bases in foreign countries, etc...  I agree we need to make cuts and get spending under control, but there are so many other areas that should be looked at first. 

[Fury]

Interesting. Leftists cry about the middle class getting fucked over and yet all soldiers fall into the middle class.

Guess it's only certain people in the middle class that matter.

[The Showstoppa]

Interesting. Leftists cry about the middle class getting fucked over and yet all soldiers fall into the middle class.

Guess it's only certain people in the middle class that matter.

Bingo....and hell, when I was in, I was in the "poverty level" as an enlisted guy for a couple of years.  We had guys on foodstamps that were active duty.  They made so little they actually qualified.....

[Dos Equis]

Wow......awsome thread...glad Tu decides that I'm both average and don't deserve a raise. Unlike the average civilian government employee we work long hours, especially deployed. DOD civilians, many of whom I'd like to strangle work 8-4. Those are hard and fast hours and if they're doing something for you, many times they pack up and leave, regardless of what you need. I just spend 13 months deployed...I worked on average from 7AM to 11 PM every day...everyday. The food sucked, the living conditions sucked..the Iraqi's sucked..I was paid well enough but the average American wouldn't put up with the crap we do..never mind heavy combat. I can deal with the current pay raise but I have a ton of time in and make good money..my guys worked the same hours for alot less pay...its not fair to them. There are plenty of places to cut...the military, favored whipping boy of the douchbag left, is'nt one of them.

Welcome back.   

This pretty much sums it up. 

[Cy Tolliver]

I'm not liberal at all, just want the federal government to cut spending. 

Exactly, as far as I know the liberals are the ones who are fiscally irresponsible.  Not the other way around.

[Emmortal]

Exactly, as far as I know the liberals are the ones who are fiscally irresponsible.  Not the other way around.

The difference between liberals and conservitives when it comes to spending comes down to this:

Liberals: Tax and Spend
Conservatives: Borrow and Spend


That's it.

[Bindare_Dundat]

In an ideal world we should give raises every year to the military, but guess what, we can't afford it, as well we can't afford most of the stuff we are doing. 

That pretty much says it all. It should be pretty clear to anyone with a brain that this is the new "normal". Get used to it.