Author Topic: Obama Corruption & Scandal Thread - Solyndra and other crimes.  (Read 159494 times)

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot


You call their OT, pensions, enhacements, etc "bullshit"? 

Come on TU, those be important police matters. 

Apparently so...

I mean, I'm just a crazy person who debates like a 3rd grader, but I'm the one who isn't paid by the tax payer.

Is being a 3rd grader better or worse than being a leach?

Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439
No.. however, we focused on that for a bit... i'm saying that police arrest people for bullshit all of the time.

I'm saying that people are locked up over 50% for bullshit (like drugs) and I'm saying that I and everyone else would be just as "safe" with 1/2 the police force we have today.

Because that's what we're talking about right? Safety?

Ok, I hear what you are saying. 50% of all arrests are bullshit and we can do with 50% reduction in police. Gotcha

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
Ok, I hear what you are saying. 50% of all arrests are bullshit and we can do with 50% reduction in police. Gotcha

Yes, we could EASILY.

Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439
Yes, we could EASILY.

I disagree with you based on the fact our officers currently are running call to call and hardly have time to eat, and rarely finish a shift on time. Very few of these calls are drug related. In our case we are understaffed as it is and losing half the department would be detrimental to the citizens. But man it sounds good on paper.. 

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
I disagree with you based on the fact our officers currently are running call to call and hardly have time to eat, and rarely finish a shift on time. Very few of these calls are drug related. In our case we are understaffed as it is and losing half the department would be detrimental to the citizens. But man it sounds good on paper.. 

I call shenanigans... It wouldn't. You would simply prioritize the calls.

Unless Austin is the most dangerous city in the country, this is an excuse. 

I have done many ride alongs and have seen how when a call comes in 3-4 cars show up. Perhaps try it with only 2.

Why is a traffic stop getting 2 or 3 cars?

I got pulled over for running a red light last year. 4. That's right. FOUR cruisers stopped and one female officer had the audacity to talk to the passenger in my car. To which I explained to the officer that this person wasn't involved in the "crime" and after they identified themselves was under no legal obligation to talk to her.

Austin must be a crime ridden place if this is your stance.

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
GOP lawmakers say 100 'Fast and Furious' weapons linked to crime scenes
The Hill ^ | 07/26/11 | Jordy Yager




More than 100 weapons linked to crime scenes were sold under a federal gun-tracking program, according to a new congressional report.

The report from two Republican lawmakers says the program was allowed to continue despite pleas from U.S. agents stationed in Mexico to stop arming the country’s drug cartels.

Issued by Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) and Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) on Tuesday, the report found that Mexican law enforcement officials and U.S. attaché agents stationed in Mexico were kept largely in the dark about the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives’ (ATF) gun-tracking operation known as Fast and Furious.

As a result, the “ATF jeopardized relations between the U.S. and Mexico,” according to the 60-page report. The Republicans based their findings off more than a dozen interviews with ATF officials.

As chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, Issa will hear testimony on Tuesday from a half-dozen former and current ATF agents, including ATF attachés to Mexico and the ATF’s regional deputy assistant director for field operations.

Earlier this month, ATF acting director Kenneth Melson told the committee in a closed-door interview that neither he nor acting-deputy director Billy Hoover knew about the operation ahead of its public revelation earlier this year, according to a partial transcript of the meeting provided to The Hill by committee Democrats.

The Fast and Furious operation authorized gun dealers in the Southwest to sell more than 1,000 weapons to known and suspected straw buyers for Mexican drug cartels, with the stated hope of tracking the weapons to the eventual kingpins and dismantling the gun trafficking routes. But the federal officials in charge of the operation did not authorize enough surveillance of the weapons and offered no reliable method of tracing them other than if they were later recovered at a crime scene, according to ATF testimony before the committee last month.

Grassley and Issa have pursued the issue for seven months, ever since a whistleblower came to the senior Iowa lawmaker following the killing of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry. Two of the guns found at the scene of Terry’s killing were later traced to sales made under the operation’s authorization.

The lawmakers want to find out who gave the ultimate authorization for the operation. Both President Obama and Attorney General Eric Holder have decried the program. Holder called for the inspector general to investigate the issue, and Obama has declined to comment on the issue until that probe is complete.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Skip8282

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7004
I disagree with you based on the fact our officers currently are running call to call and hardly have time to eat, and rarely finish a shift on time. Very few of these calls are drug related. In our case we are understaffed as it is and losing half the department would be detrimental to the citizens. But man it sounds good on paper.. 



HA, doubt it.  My bro spends most of his time doing preventative patrol.  But there are times when it's one call after the next, like 9pm to 2am.  Seems to be really, really busy during that time.

You know something (for you and Tu), there's actually a case study.  Camden PD cut their police force in half earlier this year, and it's one of the highest crime areas in the country.  I don't know all the facts, but it would be interesting to learn how things panned out for them.

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.


HA, doubt it.  My bro spends most of his time doing preventative patrol.  But there are times when it's one call after the next, like 9pm to 2am.  Seems to be really, really busy during that time.

You know something (for you and Tu), there's actually a case study.  Camden PD cut their police force in half earlier this year, and it's one of the highest crime areas in the country.  I don't know all the facts, but it would be interesting to learn how things panned out for them.

Don't know skip - most of camden is already, and will always be, a zoo regardless of the amount of cops. 

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
How ATF delivered assault weapons to drug cartels: Attorney general should explain how...
Philadelphia Inquirer ^ | July 31, 2011 | Kevin Ferris



Attorney general should explain how misguided sting operation failed to trace guns.

Back in February 2009, Attorney General Eric Holder outlined the new administration's intent on an assault-weapons ban:

"As President Obama indicated during the campaign, there are just a few gun-related changes that we would like to make, and among them would be to reinstitute the ban on the sale of assault weapons."

Not only would it be good for the United States, Holder pointed out, but it also would "have a positive impact" on Mexico, which was plagued - then and now - by drug-related gun violence.

That same month, in a travel warning, the State Department confirmed the level of violence near the U.S. border: "Some recent Mexican army and police confrontations with drug cartels have resembled small-unit combat, with cartels employing automatic weapons and grenades. Large firefights have taken place in many towns and cities . . . most recently in northern Mexico."

Holder's comments on a weapons ban naturally upset Second Amendment proponents, who always fear the worst when it comes to the government and gun rights. But their worst fears were no match for the misguided policy that would be implemented on Obama and Holder's watch.

A push for the ban never materialized. Holder was no more accurate on that count than he was on closing the Gitmo detention facility or trying Khalid Shaikh Mohammed in a civilian court in Manhattan. Maybe that's all on the second-term to-do list.

What did happen was Fast and Furious, a new operation out of the Justice Department's Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives that turned the world of fighting gun trafficking upside down.

Before, ATF agents routinely busted straw purchasers - usually people with clean records who are paid to buy guns and pass them along to others with criminal records - and confiscated any weapons found. But straw purchasers are the bottom feeders in the gunrunning food chain. ATF officials, understandably, wanted to get closer to the cartel bosses running the smuggling operations.

Fast and Furious was supposed to help make that happen. The plan was to allow straw purchasers to make their deliveries, and then the ATF would trace the flow of the weapons.

But one huge detail was left unaddressed: The ATF made no provisions to actually trace the guns once they crossed the border.

The agency wasn't attaching electronic-tracking devices to the guns, and agents were not pursuing them into Mexico. They were forced to stop and watch the weapons "walk." Maybe Mexican authorities could have picked up the trail - but the ATF never told its counterparts across the border about the operation.

So, essentially, the U.S. government was now arming the very drug cartels that it was supposed to be helping Mexican officials fight.

Agents themselves were appalled. "It goes against everything we've been taught," Special Agent Carlos Canino said last week at the latest in a series of hearings on Fast and Furious by the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform.

More than 2,000 weapons walked. Fewer than 600 have been recovered. And recovered usually means found at the scene of a crime, often a shooting or a homicide, in the United States or Mexico.

The last straw for some agents occurred in December, when two weapons traced to Fast and Furious were found at the scene of a firefight in the Arizona desert that killed U.S. Border Patrol agent Brian Terry.

Agents took their concerns up the chain of command at the ATF, and to the Justice Department's inspector general. When that didn't work, they went to Sen. Charles Grassley (R., Iowa), ranking member of the Judiciary Committee. Grassley has been working with his House counterpart, Rep. Darrell Issa (R., Calif.), who had the power to initiate hearings.

As a result, Holder has ordered an internal investigation at Justice, and has said he didn't learn of the program until this year. Both Grassley and Issa have complained about the department's lack of cooperation as they have tried to find out who authorized the program and let it continue when it was clear that there was no way to keep track of the weapons. Further, they have warned about retaliation against ATF acting director Kenneth E. Melson, who took the unusual step of testifying July 4, accompanied by a private attorney rather than one from the Justice Department.

At last week's public hearing, one ATF official apologized for mistakes made, and agent William Newell said more "risk assessment" should have been conducted.

That's a start, but not enough. Rep. Pat Meehan (R., Pa.), a member of Issa's committee, agrees.

"You've got the highest-level local and regional people from ATF who are taking a fall for the team," Meehan said after the hearing. "But it's clear that they were operating with authority from above, certainly in collaboration with the prosecutor's office and, one would believe, with approvals right on up to the highest level of the Department of Justice."

Holder needs to be more forthcoming on the decisions that led to the death of Terry and others. He needs to detail how he plans to recover the other 1,400 weapons that "walked" before they end up at a crime scene. Finally, he needs to explain how the administration went from wanting to ban assault weapons to supplying them to drug lords.


Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439
I call shenanigans... It wouldn't. You would simply prioritize the calls.

Unless Austin is the most dangerous city in the country, this is an excuse. 

I have done many ride alongs and have seen how when a call comes in 3-4 cars show up. Perhaps try it with only 2.

Why is a traffic stop getting 2 or 3 cars?

I got pulled over for running a red light last year. 4. That's right. FOUR cruisers stopped and one female officer had the audacity to talk to the passenger in my car. To which I explained to the officer that this person wasn't involved in the "crime" and after they identified themselves was under no legal obligation to talk to her.

Austin must be a crime ridden place if this is your stance.

calls are already prioritized from 1 to 4. We must live in very different places. 2 officers on a traffic stop until the person is identified and the officer signals it is clear. Most of the time the back up hasn't arrived and goes back in service to another call.

2 officers are sent to typical disturbance calls unless a weapon is involved and the circumstances dictate how many go.

You and I have very different experiences apparently. I do this for a living, day in and day out for a couple decades and see what goes on all the time. That is one difference in our views. The other may be our location and the departments that work our locations.   

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
calls are already prioritized from 1 to 4. We must live in very different places. 2 officers on a traffic stop until the person is identified and the officer signals it is clear. Most of the time the back up hasn't arrived and goes back in service to another call.

2 officers are sent to typical disturbance calls unless a weapon is involved and the circumstances dictate how many go.

You and I have very different experiences apparently. I do this for a living, day in and day out for a couple decades and see what goes on all the time. That is one difference in our views. The other may be our location and the departments that work our locations.   

Yes... I haven't done any sort of police work since I was 21... so you're right... It's not my job.

My experiences are accurate though... I am not making anything up.

I've done many ride alongs and have many associates who are police officers... We don't talk much anymore because I find them hypocritical for the most part.

I actually know a guy, who is a cop, and was busted for DUI back when he was around 20.

He had his record expunged and is in the good old boy network and is a police lieutenant today... He busts people for DUIs all of the time.

I know another cop who was let go from his department for making inappropriate statements to minors... He will probably find a job elsewhere as a cop... he is always on the lookout.

A really good cop I know is very much the libertarian and HATES arresting people... He won't even write a ticket... That guy is cool and I consider a friend.

He would never make excuses for bad cops... he refuses to do so and is one of the biggest opponents of the "police state" mentality I know.

Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439
Yes... I haven't done any sort of police work since I was 21... so you're right... It's not my job.

My experiences are accurate though... I am not making anything up.

I've done many ride alongs and have many associates who are police officers... We don't talk much anymore because I find them hypocritical for the most part.

I actually know a guy, who is a cop, and was busted for DUI back when he was around 20.

He had his record expunged and is in the good old boy network and is a police lieutenant today... He busts people for DUIs all of the time.

I know another cop who was let go from his department for making inappropriate statements to minors... He will probably find a job elsewhere as a cop... he is always on the lookout.

A really good cop I know is very much the libertarian and HATES arresting people... He won't even write a ticket... That guy is cool and I consider a friend.

He would never make excuses for bad cops... he refuses to do so and is one of the biggest opponents of the "police state" mentality I know.

Good cops hate bad cops, that's universal. Can't say I HATE arresting someone who did an atrocious act. I can't even say I hate arresting someone who got behind the wheel at .30 and was swerving all over the road before stopped. I don't even think I HATE arresting the guy who put a gun to a pedestrians head and took everything in his pockets including his watch,  necklace and the $400 bucks he just got from cashing his check. In fact, I can't understand any "good" cop hating any of that..   

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
Good cops hate bad cops, that's universal. Can't say I HATE arresting someone who did an atrocious act. I can't even say I hate arresting someone who got behind the wheel at .30 and was swerving all over the road before stopped. I don't even think I HATE arresting the guy who put a gun to a pedestrians head and took everything in his pockets including his watch,  necklace and the $400 bucks he just got from cashing his check. In fact, I can't understand any "good" cop hating any of that..   

Once again, you always speak of these violent crimes (except for the DUI point... which in and of itself is facist, considering you are guilty of a crime even if you do not injure anyone else... just for driving with a BAC higher than some law dictates)

I have already shown where 57% of federal incarcerations are for NON-VIOLENT crime... so the majority of arrests are for NON-VIOLENT crime.

Once again, you take the REALLY bad stuff and act like it's the majority of arrests when as I've already shown statistically that it is NOT, and you act like it's the majority.

Why do you do that?

Skip8282

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7004
Good cops hate bad cops, that's universal. Can't say I HATE arresting someone who did an atrocious act. I can't even say I hate arresting someone who got behind the wheel at .30 and was swerving all over the road before stopped. I don't even think I HATE arresting the guy who put a gun to a pedestrians head and took everything in his pockets including his watch,  necklace and the $400 bucks he just got from cashing his check. In fact, I can't understand any "good" cop hating any of that..   


Uh...Tu clearly wasn't talking about any of those things...but, ok.

I'll pat you on the back.

Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439

Uh...Tu clearly wasn't talking about any of those things...but, ok.

I'll pat you on the back.

He said, his cop friend HATES arresting people. So no, it wasn't clear at all.

Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439
Once again, you always speak of these violent crimes (except for the DUI point... which in and of itself is facist, considering you are guilty of a crime even if you do not injure anyone else... just for driving with a BAC higher than some law dictates)

I have already shown where 57% of federal incarcerations are for NON-VIOLENT crime... so the majority of arrests are for NON-VIOLENT crime.

Once again, you take the REALLY bad stuff and act like it's the majority of arrests when as I've already shown statistically that it is NOT, and you act like it's the majority.

Why do you do that?

because you ignore it. You pretend cops aren't needed, they serve no purpose and it's down right evil to take away someones "liberty". When you argue so one sided then I play the same game so to speak. If you want to meet in the middle somewhere, thats cool   

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
because you ignore it. You pretend cops aren't needed, they serve no purpose and it's down right evil to take away someones "liberty". When you argue so one sided then I play the same game so to speak. If you want to meet in the middle somewhere, thats cool   

I'm not ignoring it... I said about 5 posts ago that we could do with 1/2 the cops and be just fine.

I have said in the past that if everyone carried a gun that cops wouldn't be needed much at all... that is also true.

Minus the badge and the gun which aid in your arrest power... What makes you special? Your power comes with the gun, the badge, and being a part of the biggest gang in America.

Agnostic007

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15439
I'm not ignoring it... I said about 5 posts ago that we could do with 1/2 the cops and be just fine.

I have said in the past that if everyone carried a gun that cops wouldn't be needed much at all... that is also true.

Minus the badge and the gun which aid in your arrest power... What makes you special? Your power comes with the gun, the badge, and being a part of the biggest gang in America.

Not all people want to carry guns or are capable of carrying guns. It's an illusion in my opinion to think if everyone carried a gun all would be well.

Without superpowers Superman would not be special. The badge and the commission by the State of Texas gives me authority to enforce the laws on the books. The gun, taser, OC spray, handcuffs, baton and training are tools to assist in enforcing them. I'm not "special", I'm someone who has taken up a career, an honorable career to mainly help people.

You might be surprised to know many departments have a District Representative or Neighborhood Officer type unit. They are officers who's sole job is to field complaints from citizens like you about oridinance violations like loud noise, illegal parking, abandoned/unsafe buildings etc etc. Policing isn't all about arresting people though that is a part of the job, a very necessary part.

Sure we are a gang if you want to go that route, churches are gangs, VFW members are gangs, Steelers fans are gangs since we aren't really following the common definition of gang. I've been to a couple rallys where the anarchist dressed in black throwing balloons of paint at Starbucks were gangs...   

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
August 3, 2011
Much More than a Third Rate Burglary
By Russ Vaughn



To believe that no top administration officials were involved in Operation Fast and Furious is not only disingenuous, it's dumb.  Of course some top Obama administration officials were involved, if for no other reason than contemporary bureaucrats simply lack the intestinal fortitude to initiate such an ill-conceived and uncoordinated program without clearance from above.  Here's a quote from a former ATF operative which makes that clear:

"I can tell you in every case I was involved in, the bureau would've been afraid to let the guns go," said William Vizzard who worked almost 30 years doing gun investigations for ATF and later taught criminal justice at California State University. "There was always the obsessive fear that if a gun goes out there ... it may be misused and traced back to you, and the political implications are terrible."

Note that political implications.  Where bureaucratic control of such programs typically ends is at that not always bright line where political control by political appointees pushing political agendas begins.  Anyone foolish enough to believe that Operation Fast and Furious was the brainchild of the head of the Phoenix ATF regional office, or even his agency bosses in Washington, needs to pay closer attention to how bureaucratic government operates, especially power-centered, leftist bureaucracies.

The lame rationale offered by the ATF is laughably implausible and refuted by their own field operatives.  The parent program for OF&F was Project Gunrunner, initiated in 2005 with the stated official objective:

to deny firearms, the "tools of the trade," to criminal organizations in Mexico and along the border, as well as to combat firearms-related violence affecting communities on both sides of the border.

That was all well and good so far as that appears to have been a legitimate goal of a legitimate program.  Contrast that with ATF's justification for OF&F given in testimony last week before the congressional committee investigating this scandal.  This from evasive paid answerer and former Special Agent in Charge of the Phoenix office, William Newell:

"Fast and Furious was ... designed to identify purchasers, financers, transporters, and decision makers in a Mexican cartel-based firearms trafficking organization," Newell said in his opening statements. "It was not the purpose of the investigation to permit the transportation of firearms into Mexico."

Sure, identifying the purchasers was easily enough accomplished by ATF agents (and their Washington supervisors) watching in person or on closed-circuit video as the weapons were bought in Southwest gun stores.  We should be able to assume that these same agents were collecting information on the drivers and vehicles being used to transport these weapons both down to and across the border.  But, and this is one huge but, that leaves the stated goal of identifying the financers and decision-makers yet to be reckoned with.  Common sense dictates that these key targets are all safely ensconced within the boundaries of Mexico, where unchecked corruption among law enforcement agencies affords them a degree of safety and sanctuary they certainly cannot expect north of the border.

Considering that ATF agents can't just cross the U.S./Mexican border willy-nilly in pursuit of criminal subjects, we must assume that provisions thus had been made with American ATF agents who are certified to operate within Mexico as well as Mexico's own ATF authorities to assume responsibility for the continued tracking of firearms beyond that boundary, right?

Wrong, completely and totally wrong, as testimony from these certified, Mexico-based ATF officials demonstrates.  Here are some findings directly from the joint staff report published by Congressman Issa's committee:

ATF and DOJ leadership kept their own personnel in Mexico and Mexican government officials totally in the dark about all aspects of Fast and Furious.  Meanwhile, ATF officials in Mexico grew increasingly worried about the number of weapons recovered in Mexico that traced back to an ongoing investigation out of ATF's Phoenix Field Division.

And this:

ATF officials in Mexico raised their concerns about the number of weapons recovered up the chain of command to ATF leadership in Washington, D.C. Instead of acting decisively to end Fast and Furious, the senior leadership at both ATF and DOJ praised the investigation and the positive results it had produced. Frustrations reached a boiling point, leading former ATF Attaché Darren Gil to engage in screaming matches with his supervisor, International Affairs Chief Daniel Kumor, about the need to shut down the Phoenix-based investigation.

So, we have the purported targets of OF&F, financers and decision-makers, located in Mexico, and the professed method of identifying those targets being the tracking of the illegal weapons to them directly.  But with the law enforcement resources responsible for that tracking having been kept ignorant of the entire operation, the alleged rationale for OF&F falls flat on its face.

And if government officials are willing to lie and obfuscate, as I believe Agent Newell and others most likely have, to a congressional investigating committee; and if the Justice Department is willing to stonewall document subpoenas and refuse to produce subpoenaed witnesses, this administration is in full Watergate mode.  What conclusion is to be drawn from their behavior other than that there are much bigger fish to be caught in Issa's net than a few overeager field operatives?

Are the big fish of the Obama administration ignoring the basic lesson of Watergate -- that it's the cover-up, not the crime, that can bring down a president?  But then, in the present situation, we have illegal arms-smuggling, apparently to further a domestic political gun control agenda, which may have resulted in the deaths of Mexican citizens and two United States federal officers.  Now that is a crime, a real and true crime, and most certainly a much more serious crime than a third-rate burglary.


Page Printed from: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/../2011/08/much_more_than_a_third_rate_burglary.html

 at August 03, 2011 - 10:39:11 AM CDT

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
Then again, maybe Obama administration DID directly traffic guns to Mexico
St. Louis Gun Rights Examiner ^ | 1 August, 2011 | Kurt Hofmann




Friday's column began with a bit of a qualifier:

In discussing "Project Gunwalker," this column tries to observe the perhaps small (but nevertheless important) distinction between directly trafficking guns, and "walking" them. That's why readers will find instance after instance of reference being made here to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives' (BATFE's) "facilitating the trafficking" of guns. Basically, the accusation being made here is not that the BATFE directly trafficked the guns.

There is, though, another way to look at it, in light of some startling allegations made by Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) Acting Director Kenneth Melson on July 4. In testimony he gave that day to the "Project Gunwalker" investigation, led by Representative Darrell Issa (R-CA, and Chariman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee) and Senator Charles Grassley (R-IA, and Ranking Member of the Senate Judiciary Committee), Melson revealed that some of the "gunwalked" guns may have been paid for courtesy of the American taxpayer. From Rep. Issa's and Sen. Grassley's letter to Attorney General Eric Holder (pdf file):


The evidence we have gathered raises the disturbing possibility that the Justice Department not only allowed criminals to smuggle weapons but that taxpayer dollars from other agencies may have financed those engaging in such activities.
Fox News, in fact, quoted sources claiming that the BATFE's top target was himself a paid informant for the FBI:


In a separate development, congressional sources have learned that not only was U.S. taxpayer money being used to buy guns that were later sent to Mexico, but the main target of the investigation was actually a FBI informant and former drug dealer who had been deported years ago.
Remember from Friday's column that former BATFE Phoneix field division Special Agent in Charge


(Excerpt) Read more at examiner.com ...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
U.S. Admits “Dramatic Increase In Violence” Along Mexican Border
Judicial Watch ^ | August 3, 2011




While the nation’s Homeland Security secretary repeatedly assures Americans that the southern border is more secure than ever, a separate U.S. government agency has quietly issued an alarming report warning of “recent violent attacks and persistent security concerns” in the area.

It’s like the Abbot and Costello version of government, where one agency can’t even coordinate with another to provide the country with a consistent story. Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano claims the Mexican border region is “as secure as it has ever been.” In fact, she embarked on a publicity tour to the area, using sound-bite opportunities to specifically deny that it’s infested with drug-cartel violence that often spills into the U.S.

It’s all a mistaken “perception” because the area is in fact a “secure and prosperous” region, according to Napolitano. During a trip to El Paso Texas a few months ago, she claimed that “misinformation about safety” is negatively impacting border communities by driving visitors away and hurting local business. She proceeded to say that “some of America’s safest communities are in the southwest border region.” The media was invited to tag along and Madame Secretary’s proclamations appeared in newscasts worldwide.

No such promotion of what appears to be a more accurate assessment, issued this week by the State Department, of the situation along the U.S.-Mexico border. Unlike Napolitano’s rose-colored glasses version, it mentions a “dramatic increase in violence”pdf and nearly 30,000 narcotics-related murders in the last few years. The State Department report bluntly says that “the security situation along the Texas border has changed markedly from a year ago.”

The culprits are sophisticated and heavily armed drug cartels competing with each other for trafficking routes into the U.S. In fact, a war between two notorious cartels has led to a “dramatic increase in violence” in two northern border regions, according to the State Department report issued this week by the agency’s Overseas Security Advisory Council (OSAC). Large-scale gun battles often occur in broad daylight on streets and other public venues and U.S. citizens have been trapped and temporarily prevented from leaving the area, according to the OSAC assessment.

Using the term “narcoterrorism,” it goes on to say that “continued concerns regarding road safety along the Mexican border have prompted the U.S. Mission in Mexico to impose certain restrictions on U.S. government employees transiting the area.” Local authorities aren’t helping because “police corruption and police involvement in criminal activity continue to be a problem in Mexico.”

As a result the violence is increasingly flowing north, even as the nation’s top Homeland Security official denies it. Just last summer a myriad of bullets fired into El Paso, striking City Hall and a public university building. The local sheriff said the gun battles are breaking out everywhere but his hands are tied because he’s legally forbidden from intervening in another country’s war. The disturbing incident inspired Texas’s Attorney General to send President Obama a letter saying his state is under constant assault from illegal activity threatening a porous border.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Maybe if obama and holder did not arm all these cartels this would not be happening. 

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
Felony or Felony Stupid: It shouldn’t be Rewarded
The Firearms Coalition ^ | 25 July, 2011 | Jeff Knox


________________________ ________________________ __


Representative Darrel Issa (R-CA) referred to the activities of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF) Operation Fast and Furious as “felony stupid.” Others have suggested that the plan was intentionally designed and cleverly crafted to bolster statistics in support of stricter gun control laws. Whether the operation was just stupid or intentionally criminal, it was clearly bad behavior on the part of ATF and Justice Department (DOJ) and such bad behavior should not be rewarded.

Some members of Congress, Diane Feinstein (D-CA) and Elijah Cummings (D-MD) in particular, want to reward ATF and DOJ’s criminal stupidity with increased funding and increased authority through tighter regulation of firearms dealers and lawful firearm purchasers. ATF has introduced – and the Administration has now approved – and “emergency” regulatory change requiring firearms dealers in border states to report any purchaser who buys more than one semi-auto rifle greater than a .22 within a given week. The US House of Representatives promptly, and properly, rejected the new regulations by passing an appropriations rider prohibiting any funds from being used to enact or enforce the plan.

Proponents of the regulation argue that it gives ATF an important tool to help detect straw buyers and traffickers and that it poses little inconvenience to lawful gun buyers. Many on our side disagree, but usefulness and inconvenience aside, the fact is that Congress has looked at long gun reporting in the past and rejected the idea. For ATF and the Obama administration to now push forward, bypassing Congress, in order to do something Congress has previously refused to do is clearly overreaching and probably illegal. If Congress had passed a law setting auto mileage standards, but had specifically chosen to omit larger pickups from those standards, it would be outrageous for some bureaucracy to later enact regulations including trucks. This case is no different except that it is questionable whether even Congress has the authority to regulate firearms sales. Unelected bureaucrats certainly don’t.

The regulation also creates a de facto registration system, something Congress has expressly forbidden on numerous occasions, and it puts additional burdens – and liabilities – on the gun dealers. ATF claims that the records will be destroyed after two years, but ATF and DOJ have long histories of reneging on such guarantees, even when they are spelled out in law.

Purchase of multiple firearms within a week is not particularly uncommon and doing so should not make a person a suspect, nor should it result in their personal information being stored in government systems. Also, if the regulation does go into effect, it will be no time at all until ATF will be demanding that the reporting requirement be expanded beyond the border states. It will become the “multiple sales non-reporting loophole” and they will insist that all states need to follow the reporting requirements.

Firearms dealers are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They want to honor and respect customers’ rights, but ATF controls their licenses and the laws and regulations hold dealers responsible for things they “should have known.” Dealers have to pass up business and/or alert ATF when they suspect possible criminal activity. Not doing so can have serious consequences. A New Mexico dealer is in jail today because the local police chief in the town of Columbus was allegedly trafficking guns to Mexico. The ATF says the dealer “should have known” so he is considered a co-conspirator. He could lose everything for selling guns to the Police Chief!

At the same time, gun owners can be very unforgiving of dealers who they perceive as “too cooperative” with ATF so dealers have to be careful about that too. Still, dealers don’t want to be selling guns to criminals as demonstrated during Operation Fast and Furious when dealers repeatedly expressed reservations about doing business with suspicious characters and ATF insisted that they go forward with sales. Mandatory multi-sale reporting increases dealers’ paperwork load, but relieves them of some judgment calls. It might make things generally easier on dealers in the short term, but it would probably make things worse for them in the long run.

Perhaps the most important reason to deny ATF’s long-gun registration regulation is, as stated earlier, that whether you’re dealing with dogs, children, or bureaucrats, it is always a mistake to reward bad behavior. ATF and DOJ (including the US Attorney’s Office and possibly the FBI and DEA) behaved badly. They encouraged and forced sales of some 2000 firearms (that we know of) to known Mexican gun traffickers and then they turned their backs and allowed those guns to disappear into the black market and to crime scenes in Mexico and the US, including the murder scene of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry. They did this in violation of long-standing rules of operation and common sense as well as international law. They did not do this in response to weak US gun laws or a need for multi-gun reporting. These straw buyers were already known and under surveillance. Politically motivated felony or just felony stupid, this was bad behavior any way you look at it and it should not be rewarded with increased authority, increased responsibility, and increased funding.

ATF, DOJ, the US Attorney’s Office, and any other agency involved in this fiasco need to be slapped down, not rewarded, and responsible individuals should be prosecuted.

Soul Crusher

  • Competitors
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 41759
  • Doesnt lie about lifting.
US Court Documents Claim Sinaloa “Cartel” Is Protected by US Government(Another DOJ Scandle!)
The Narcosphere ^ | July 31, 2011 | Bill Conroy




The son of a heavy hitter in a powerful Mexican drug trafficking organization has filed explosive legal pleadings in federal court in Chicago accusing the US government of cutting a deal with the the “Sinaloa Cartel” that gave its leadership “carte blanche to continue to smuggle tons of illicit drugs into Chicago and the rest of the United States.

The indictment pending against Zambada Niebla claims he served as the “logistical coordinator” for the “cartel,” helping to oversee an operation that imported into the US “multi-ton quantities of cocaine. Zambada Niebla also claims to be an asset of the US government.

The latest allegations are laid out in motions filed late this week in federal court. Those pleadings spell out the supposed cooperative relationship between the US Department of Justice and its various agencies, including DEA and the FBI, and the leaders of the “Sinaloa Cartel” — including Zambada Niebla.

Under that agreement, the Sinaloa Cartel, through Loya, was to provide information accumulated by Mayo, Chapo, and others, against rival Mexican Drug Trafficking Organizations to the United States government. In return, the United States government agreed to dismiss the prosecution of the pending case against Loya, not to interfere with his drug trafficking activities and those of the Sinaloa Cartel, to not actively prosecute him and the leadership of the Sinaloa Cartel, and to not apprehend them.

Zambada Niebla’s pleadings also reference the controversial U.S Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) weapons-trafficking interdiction program Fast and Furious — an operation, now the subject of Congressional hearings, that allegedly allowed some 2,000 guns to be smuggled across the US/Mexican border under ATF’s watch. Zambada Niebla contends that Fast and Furious is yet another example of the US government’s complicity in the carnage of the drug war.


(Excerpt) Read more at narcosphere.narconews.co m ...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Skip8282

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7004

 Steelers fans are gangs

 



Never knew I was in a gang before.  I feel soooo fucking street right now.

tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
Not all people want to carry guns or are capable of carrying guns. It's an illusion in my opinion to think if everyone carried a gun all would be well.

Without superpowers Superman would not be special. The badge and the commission by the State of Texas gives me authority to enforce the laws on the books. The gun, taser, OC spray, handcuffs, baton and training are tools to assist in enforcing them. I'm not "special", I'm someone who has taken up a career, an honorable career to mainly help people.

You might be surprised to know many departments have a District Representative or Neighborhood Officer type unit. They are officers who's sole job is to field complaints from citizens like you about oridinance violations like loud noise, illegal parking, abandoned/unsafe buildings etc etc. Policing isn't all about arresting people though that is a part of the job, a very necessary part.

Sure we are a gang if you want to go that route, churches are gangs, VFW members are gangs, Steelers fans are gangs since we aren't really following the common definition of gang. I've been to a couple rallys where the anarchist dressed in black throwing balloons of paint at Starbucks were gangs...   
The Definition.


A gang is a group of people who, through the organization, formation, and establishment of an assemblage, share a common identity. In current usage it typically denotes a criminal organization or else a criminal affiliation. In early usage, the word gang referred to a group of workmen.

Sounds like the police to me.

I ask why are you "special", because obviously you have the right to do things that common citizens do not... As we've already discussed in another thread.