True definition of breaking through a plateau

[WillGrant]

And for the record I do have above average genetics, so it may be that I grow easier than others, but I still believe I am right.

hahaha no you dont - the pics you posted you look below average and where was the muscle that you never lose after stopping steroids ?  I know when I brought this up a few weeks ago you *claimed* all you were doing was cardio - bullshit I remember you talking about your lifting scedule and how you were doing it but struggling because of school etc so you blaimed that for not eating right which again is shit it was lack of discipline - you were skinny fat and did not look like you had ever been to a gym but in this thread you claim you keep all the muscle you gain on steroids haha no you dont dummy - scale weight is BS and going on those pics you posted you dont even train  repost them go on 

[DK II]

hahaha no you dont - the pics you posted you look below average and where was the muscle that you never lose after stopping steroids ?  I know when I brought this up a few weeks ago you *claimed* all you were doing was cardio - bullshit I remember you talking about your lifting scedule and how you were doing it but struggling because of school etc so you blaimed that for not eating right which again is shit it was lack of discipline - you were skinny fat and did not look like you had ever been to a gym but in this thread you claim you keep all the muscle you gain on steroids haha no you dont dummy - scale weight is BS and going on those pics you posted you dont even train  repost them go on 

The guy's an alcoholic that claimed he could turn pro naturally in 3 years.

Too bad i missed the pics.

[BILL ANVIL]

I am putting my fucking foot down. You do not break through plateaus by adding more juice you fucking monkey. There are MANY ways to do it, and what do you do for a natural trainer?

agreed. those who actually enjoy lifting weights know there are ways to get STRONGER just by persevering and being patient. 

[DK II]

agreed. those who actually enjoy lifting weights know there are ways to get STRONGER just by persevering and being patient. 

We were talking about muscle mass, not strength plateaus.

[WillGrant]

The guy's an alcoholic that claimed he could turn pro naturally in 3 years.

Too bad i missed the pics.

Well theres another contradiction then haha he claims you keep all the muscle you gain off steroids but then he is saying he is going to be the first ever natural pro haha how can he be natural if he has abused steroids like he "claims" and yet you keep the muscle you gain on said steroids once you stop   - honestly he looked terrible and beet red which i think must be from the alc   poor bastard - he needs help

[BILL ANVIL]

We were talking about muscle mass, not strength plateaus.

Obviously getting past a certain point is impossible without aas, but strength gains can come in increments naturally over long periods of time. Everythings already been explained in this thread anyways.

[DK II]

Obviously getting past a certain point is impossible without aas, but strength gains can come in increments naturally over long periods of time. Everythings already been explained in this thread anyways.

yes.

[Man of Steel]

the true defition of breaking through platue,,

this is again in regarding the known lie that plateau is breaken with new extra weight,,not the case!

platue in bodybuild is always breaken with the addition of hormones,,DOSES ,, and products when truly advanced bodybuild,,

when you maxed at trenbolona and propionets at 200lb 6% ,,only thing that will push you to 220 6% will be addition of testosterona with longer esters and gh ,, ofcourse there is small brekas in platue and big breaks,,

the higher the bodyfat is the smaler the break will be and should be ,, the lower bodyfat is the bigger the break wil be and should be ,,

example ,,from trenbolona ace and propioneta at respecivly 100mg/150mg every 2 day of each ,,200lb 6% bodybuild should break the latue with 1-1.5 gram of testosterona longer easter or sustanona with adujstable dose of legit hgh,, this will take the bodybuld to new 220lb 6% status

if bodybuild is 205lb 10% he should break the platue with lighter doses since he is smaller than the 200lb 6%,,he should add testosterona and  gh at lower doses inorder to work on the quality along with the size,,it wil be a slower process of growth but it can be done at higher bodyfat it just need to be tackled with LOWER DOSES

the fellas who need to blast on doses are the lower bodyfat fellas,,the ones who start 6-7% they will have the biggest break in platue and the most gained lean muscle with no fat when gh is in,,

so to conclude this ,,

breaking of platue has nothing to do with weights,,the weights increase come when the body is primed to growth and start growing even if not completely noticable yet,,but the major part of the equation si to increaese doses of testosterona to the grams ,,and yes i mean 1-2 grams ,,it is nothing ,,1-2 grams its nothing comparing to 2-3 grams many do ,,then ofcourse the higher grams the more gh you need so make sure you have enough legit gh if you decide to work with 2-3 grams,,1-1.5 grams a week go well with 6-12 iu  a day ,, over 1.5 grams need more gh to unilize most efficiently ,,15 iu gh come with 1.5-3 grams testosterona,,and ofcourse 20-30 and over come with insulina and insulina  is always there

ok hope this is understood,,also dont evrr forget your anabolics,,it is very importanto to make sure the anabolics are there big time ,,you want to put eq 300 mg inject together with nppiona 100 mg inject in same syrnge and shoot ,,you want to ad trenboolona and little masterona on the other ass cheek ,, so you dont get too soft and that you have the nasty factor that only trenbolona gives,,remember that pupils

gh15 approved

take drugs,, be awesome.  be more awesome,, take more drugs.


got it, now go away.

[tlc]

but strength gains can come in increments naturally over long periods of time.

True to a point, but once you've hit your natural limit of lean muscle, the only way you're getting stronger is by developing your tendons, ligaments, etc. and maybe continuing to adapt your CNS, but this too only continues to a point, same as lean muscle development. Technique is never perfected though.

@ BFRS: You don't magically retain muscle if you stop using it. A year without training, at best, and you're back to square one. Much quicker than that for most people.

[Firemuscle]

@ BFRS: You don't magically retain muscle if you stop using it. A year without training, at best, and you're back to square one. Much quicker than that for most people.

It depends what you mean by "without training".

 If you sit on your ass playing video games all day for a year you might lose all your muscle.

 But if you stop lifting weights, but still play sports, bicycle, do yoga, work a physical labor job, etc. You'll keep most of it.

 I've seen it a million times. Naturals will quit lifting, and they'll lose the sharpness and hardness, but the size doesn't drop all that much if they keep on eating well and stay active.

 Weight lifting is not the only way to be active.

[el numero uno]

It depends what you mean by "without training".

 If you sit on your ass playing video games all day for a year you might lose all your muscle.

 But if you stop lifting weights, but still play sports, bicycle, do yoga, work a physical labor job, etc. You'll keep most of it.

 I've seen it a million times. Naturals will quit lifting, and they'll lose the sharpness and hardness, but the size doesn't drop all that much if they keep on eating well and stay active.

 Weight lifting is not the only way to be active.

Bullshit

[Firemuscle]

Bullshit

 How dare you talk to "Big" BFRS like that little bitch? You need to remember who you're talking to here mother fucker.

[tlc]

. Naturals will quit lifting, and they'll lose the sharpness and hardness, but the size doesn't drop all that much if they keep on eating well and stay active.

What do you think that sharpness and hardness is? It's muscle. You lose it. Sure, you might have the same arm measurements a year later, because you've lost the beef and grown lardy instead.

[asbrus]

S0 H0W D0 Y0U GET THERE IF INCREASING M0RE WEIGHT 0N THE BAR D0SEN'T D0 IT?

[chaos]

S0 H0W D0 Y0U GET THERE IF INCREASING M0RE WEIGHT 0N THE BAR D0SEN'T D0 IT?

Assbruise.

[Meso_z]

Assbruise.

[Maldoror]

Assbruise.

[gh15]

Pure idiocy contained in this post.

Find me a natural, hell ten naturals who have hit a plateau and I will see them through it WITHOUT DRUGS.

What the fuck is wrong with you people???

When I was a kid I hit plateaus all the time and crushed them! That's how you fucking grow people! I didn't touch gear till I was 22 or so, and even up till that time I never had an issue growing. I was 110lbs when I was 14 and 230 at 22, never during that time did I ever stop growing and I have only one injury in my life, an ankle I sprained about 7 weeks ago trying to catch a fucking train.

You fucking people amaze me.

you didnt grow until you were 22 friend,, youstarted very young ,,most of us start 17 but we also compete al over place and turn profesiona, ,, 22 is very very young ,,most fellas who srat 22 and serious make money off bodybuild,,22 is a kid,,fella on hormones at 22 22-24 they grow into serious lean size if know what they do ,,its age 22 and forword that grew you ,,you cant break platue of size with out hormones,,never happened ,,first 2 years you put yourself in what originally god wanted you to be ,,after that its all hormones friend

gh15 approved

[gh15]

No dude its fact - you get to a certain point as a natural where muscular bodyweight just stops and any weight gained is a combo of water fat and maybe if you are lucky a few more ounces of lean tissue - thats when its time to jump on the hormone train.. do most naturals ever reach there full genetic potential ? i would say no - but you have stated you trained with full on intensity and followed the right diet so once at that level it is game over for more lean tissue unless of course you look to the pharma route be it AAS or pro hormones/steroids

this fella became the less complicated van b since van b go techincally aspect but this fella say it like it is  ,,he KNOWS what he is talking about to the t ,,very good postings from him

gh15 approved

[gh15]

I truly do not believe this. Obviously muscle becomes harder to come by, but one can always be growing. Maybe less than you'd like...And also, GH15 did not say this was "busting through the limits of natural growth", he is saying if you aren't growing on juice the only answer is- MORE JUICE!!! Let's not examine diet, training, rest and recovery etc. NO NO NO- UP THE DOSAGE!!!

What a load of crap.

no ,,dont quate gh15 wrong,,,if you dont grow on juice ...iti mean you got BUNK balonie,,THE END! ,,inorder to grow over size platue ,,lets say 200lb 7% ,,inorder to see 210 lb 7% you will have HAVE HAVE HAVE HAVE to increase the doses,,as in change the propioneta to sustanona and go from the 200mg propioneta a day 100 mg trenbolona a day  toooooooooooooo ,, 1200mg sustanona a week ,, nppiona and equipona combo of 800mg a week,, trenbolona still at 50-150 mg  every day or 2 ,, etc,,,ONLY THAT! WILL PUT YOU AT 210 7% ,,people do not understand how much 10lb of muscle is ,,they dont get it ,,and in most likleihood if you are over 30....you wont see no 210 lb 7% if not on hgh ,,and really n omatter what age you are...when you go the route of ovber 1200mg testosterona a week you better have legit gh in the blood

gh15 approved

[gh15]

This is a load of crap! If you train while on gear and build muscle, you do not lose it because you go off cycle. If this were true, I would have slowly disintegrated after I came off. My bodyweight shot down to around 205-210, and after some time back up into the 220's. I now weigh in the low 200's without even working out, pretty lean maybe 9-10%. Before I dieted down I maintained the 220's for YEARS.

Steroids build permanent muscle if you train properly.

I just hate this entire thread, and the attitude of the forum is sickening to say the least.

wrong,,steroid do nto build permananet muscle,,take bobie from this board,,he still train and on ,,look at the muscle,,nto even remotly close to what it was,,and i mean lean muscle tissue,,not even close to what it was,,yes weight is weight,,but weight is NOTTTTTTTTTTTTTT size,,lean size > weight,,you can be 200lb and look bigger than 260 lb if you got on you lean size at 6% and the other fella is 15-18%

gh15 approved

[Van_Bilderass]

The thinking here seems to be that you can not achieve much without drugs, and that the answer to getting bigger is always more drugs, and I would bet good money the guys whose opinions matter most (pro bodybuilders) would strongly disagree with this thinking. But then again, to you guys they are all huge drug abusers so you likely would never listen.

Yes they might say it to you, but that's not what they're thinking.

I'll give a personal example. I was discussing with pro X what his goal was for an upcoming show regarding placing.
He goes, "Van, you know as well as I do that it's all about drugs at my level. It all depends on whether I can get/afford enough quality GH. And of course the rest of the anabolics but GH is the main issue. I know I can place well if I have the funds/availability".

Look at Steve Namat. He complains that he doesn't have any money and that's why he hasn't placed that well recently. He doesn't need to tell us what he needs the money for.

Maybe you can give Namat some advice on plateau busters which doesn't involve drugs.

the training and diet matters but if you see a pro break a plateau it always involves improved drug manipulation. Either increasing dosages in general, addition of new types of drugs, better combos and so on.

[gh15]

Obviously I do not look like a pro bodybuilder nor goodrum...What the fuck standards are those? I even admitted recently I took 2 months off, and have just gotten back to training. I am 30 years old, and a full time student. What exactly are you expecting?

lol i swear it thoguht this fella was atleast ! 57 year old lol 30?? lol 30? ? ?

gh15 approved

[gh15]

I can only speak from my personal experience, but all the "natural bodybuilders" i run across only got fatter when they tell me that they are "225lbs" now.

They don't even look better, just fatter, if they would go down to contest shape they would be somewhere around 70-75kg, no matter if they started at 100kg with the diet or 85.

Another factor is that the natural guy dieting down from 100kg will NEVER get in shape, because he will lose so much muscle during the diet that he will end up skinnier than the 85kg guy, although he might hold 5kg more muscle before dieting.


I think it is bullshit that steroids build permanent muscle. Not even natural training builds permanent muscle, if you slack with your training or diet the muscle will be gone, albeit the natural muscle will be much harder to get back again.

BUT, all ex-juicers that i have ever met in my life that kept training had a far better body than people who had never touched steroids in their lives (but maybe they were on low dose test, i don't know). 

great great great posting!

gh15 approved

[gh15]

Natural muscle stays.

 I think a natural can keep about 80% of his muscle if he completely stops lifting, as long as he keeps his diet solid.

 I never see natural lifters shrink way down. They always keep like 80% of their size.

you should see some of the true natural i worked with ,,from 185 they shrink so fast to 165 that not even 30 days past and they were alking around 170-175 and then boom down to 165 within 60 days of not intune with eveyrthign to the t ,,they lost 20lb momeent they were not intune with everything and had to work over time or had to go off creatine and had to resuce training some or couldnt eat as much ,, lol

naturals lose very very fast when it come to lean muscle  180 to under 170 in record time!

gh15 approved