Natural bodybuilding goals, let's get real here

[dragonfist]

That's what i said.

besides, a natural will never have the traps and delts of a juicer, "naturally wide shoulders" or not.

And really, what's the fucking point in training when you have to run around naked so that anyone realizes anyways? LOL

That's why I try to aim for the mid-ground. Not so lean that I disappear and not so heavy that I just look like a fat guy.

[DK II]

That's why I try to aim for the mid-ground. Not so lean that I disappear and not so heavy that I just look like a fat guy.

mediocre. 


Looks like shit, i tried that for years. 

[Jaime]

What do you consider to be big?

Average height 200-210lb single digits.

[DK II]

Average height 200-210lb single digits.

Troll.

[Jaime]

Are you telling me Serge Nubret was natural??


ahahhhhhhahaahaahhaahaha ahahahahahaahahahaahaaha ha, omg.


Please shoot yourself now.

No. I was alluding to how his structure and shape created an illusion of far more size.

Somebody who is big boned and blocky with no taper is going to need a lot more size on their frame.

How you can dismiss structure and shape so easily is laughable.

[DK II]

No. I was alluding to how his structure and shape created an illusion of far more size.

Somebody who is big boned and blocky with no taper is going to need a lot more size on their frame.

How you can dismiss structure and shape so easily is laughable.

True, but you will not find a 200lbs natural with that conditioning.

It was said before, Frank Zane was even 185lbs, i would sell my soul to have his 185lbs build, but to think it would be attainable naturally is pure idiocy.

[dragonfist]

mediocre. 


Looks like shit, i tried that for years. 

Maybe I'm lying to myself but I think you can be more than mediocre. Not overly impressive by any means but okay for walking down the street.

[Jaime]

True, but you will not find a 200lbs natural with that conditioning.

It was said before, Frank Zane was even 185lbs, i would sell my soul to have his 185lbs build, but to think it would be attainable naturally is pure idiocy.

I have seen naturals with huge chests, arms, backs, certain mucles don't build easy natty like delts, traps, legs. That's normally the give away.

No you are not going to get an all over build like Zane natty, but certain bodyparts could be great depending on genetics.

[DK II]

Maybe I'm lying to myself but I think you can be more than mediocre. Not overly impressive by any means but okay for walking down the street.

Yeah well then, if you can settle with "ok", go for it. 

[dragonfist]

Yeah well then, if you can settle with "ok", go for it. 

After fourteen years of training I don't think I'm going to make any substantial gains if any.  My natural status gets questioned but is still believable.

[tlc]

I have seen naturals with huge chests, arms, backs, certain mucles don't build easy natty like delts, traps, legs. That's normally the give away.

Weird, for me the give away is thick slabby pecs. Never seen them on anyone natty, seen people with naturally big/thick other bodyparts aplenty, but never those 2" thick pecs. Acyually hoping I can avoid them myself, never liked that look.

[Karpaasi]

I have seen naturals with huge chests, arms, backs, certain mucles don't build easy natty like delts, traps, legs. That's normally the give away.

No you are not going to get an all over build like Zane natty, but certain bodyparts could be great depending on genetics.

For me delts are pain to develop. I've close to ten years of training. They are still(and always) behind. Funny thing is that strength wise they're my strong points.

That's the beauty of bodybuilding. Always try to improve and have a better balance.

[Earl1972]

That's what i said.

besides, a natural will never have the traps and delts of a juicer, "naturally wide shoulders" or not.

And really, what's the fucking point in training when you have to run around naked so that anyone realizes anyways? LOL

didn't you used to be against drugs and all for natural training?

E

[DK II]

didn't you used to be against drugs and all for natural training?

E

Yes, "used to be" is the keyword here.

I was stupid. Bodybuilding is the muscle drugs.

[dogbowl]

From another thread:


This is the reason that a lot of guys into old-fashioned "iron age" bodybuilding go wayyyyy back in time to find their role models.

I have seen naturals with huge chests, arms, backs, certain mucles don't build easy natty like delts, traps, legs. That's normally the give away.

Do other people agree with this?

What i find is that there are some muscles that will not (generally) have any decent size at all unless they are trained.  There are plenty of people who do not lift weights who have enormous calves, but very few people who do not lift weights who have huge traps, for example.    In my experience, anyway.

[dj181]

Do other people agree with this?

What i find is that there are some muscles that will not (generally) have any decent size at all unless they are trained.  There are plenty of people who do not lift weights who have enormous calves, but very few people who do not lift weights who have huge traps, for example.    In my experience, anyway.

I'd say that I have to agree as far as delts are concerned. But naturals will never have huge anything lol
Here's another natural from that thread, and he has got some pretty dense muscle on him.

[asbrus]

I have seen naturals with huge chests, arms, backs, certain mucles don't build easy natty like delts, traps, legs. That's normally the give away.

No you are not going to get an all over build like Zane natty, but certain bodyparts could be great depending on genetics.

IT DEPENDS 0N GENETICS. IT'S N0T A GIVE AWAY AT ALL. MY FRIEND HAS 17 INCH ARMS AT 6 2 AS A NATURAL BUT HIS DELTS SUCK. MY BR0THER HAS 14 INCH ARMS AT 5 9 143 BUT HIS DELTS ARE GREAT. EVERY0NE IN MY FAMILY HAS INSANE DELTS BUT MY BR0THER'S ARMS ARE SHITTY AND HE HAS TR0UBLE GETTING THEM T0 GR0W. 0N THE 0THER HAND I'VE SEEN NATURALS WITH GREAT ARMS BUT SHITTY DELTS. DELTS IS MAINLY DUE T0 Y0UR GENETICS. ETHNIC RUSSIANS AND GERMANS ALL HAVE HUGE DELTS. THE PR0BLEM IS Y0U RARELY SEE AN ETHNIC RUSSIAN IN THE STATES AND IF HE SPEAKS RUSSIAN HE'S EITHER A JEW 0R FR0M THE NEIGHB0RING C0UNTRIES.

[dyslexic]

Time for SJ's...

[dragonfist]

IT DEPENDS 0N GENETICS. IT'S N0T A GIVE AWAY AT ALL. MY FRIEND HAS 17 INCH ARMS AT 6 2 AS A NATURAL BUT HIS DELTS SUCK. MY BR0THER HAS 14 INCH ARMS AT 5 9 143 BUT HIS DELTS ARE GREAT. EVERY0NE IN MY FAMILY HAS INSANE DELTS BUT MY BR0THER'S ARMS ARE SHITTY AND HE HAS TR0UBLE GETTING THEM T0 GR0W. 0N THE 0THER HAND I'VE SEEN NATURALS WITH GREAT ARMS BUT SHITTY DELTS. DELTS IS MAINLY DUE T0 Y0UR GENETICS. ETHNIC RUSSIANS AND GERMANS ALL HAVE HUGE DELTS. THE PR0BLEM IS Y0U RARELY SEE AN ETHNIC RUSSIAN IN THE STATES AND IF HE SPEAKS RUSSIAN HE'S EITHER A JEW 0R FR0M THE NEIGHB0RING C0UNTRIES.

There's a difference between good delts and big delts.  I don't think I've ever seen someone who is big for a natural and lean with standout shoulder size.

[dyslexic]

There's a difference between good delts and big delts.  I don't think I've ever seen someone who is big for a natural and lean with standout shoulder size.

Zaney Zane Zane....

[WillGrant]

IT DEPENDS 0N GENETICS. IT'S N0T A GIVE AWAY AT ALL. MY FRIEND HAS 17 INCH ARMS AT 6 2 AS A NATURAL BUT HIS DELTS SUCK. MY BR0THER HAS 14 INCH ARMS AT 5 9 143 BUT HIS DELTS ARE GREAT. EVERY0NE IN MY FAMILY HAS INSANE DELTS BUT MY BR0THER'S ARMS ARE SHITTY AND HE HAS TR0UBLE GETTING THEM T0 GR0W. 0N THE 0THER HAND I'VE SEEN NATURALS WITH GREAT ARMS BUT SHITTY DELTS. DELTS IS MAINLY DUE T0 Y0UR GENETICS. ETHNIC RUSSIANS AND GERMANS ALL HAVE HUGE DELTS. THE PR0BLEM IS Y0U RARELY SEE AN ETHNIC RUSSIAN IN THE STATES AND IF HE SPEAKS RUSSIAN HE'S EITHER A JEW 0R FR0M THE NEIGHB0RING C0UNTRIES.

So your brother at 12 pounds lighter in your first pic has "great delts" yet you at 155pds (first pic) have shit delts ?

[asbrus]

There's a difference between good delts and big delts.  I don't think I've ever seen someone who is big for a natural and lean with standout shoulder size.

Y0U HAVEN'T CAME ACR0SS T0 MANY PE0PLE.

[asbrus]

So your brother at 12 pounds lighter in your first pic has "great delts" yet you at 155pds (first pic) have shit delts ?

I FIND IT FUNNY H0W Y0U THINK IT'S IMP0SSIBLE F0R  ME T0 PUT 0N 25LBS 0F MUSCLE NATURALLY FR0M 155.
0KAY FIRST 0F ALL MY BR0THER IS FLEXING IN THAT PIC AND I'M N0T. THEY ARE TW0 DIFFERENT PICS. MY BR0THER IS 5 YEARS 0LDER THAN ME AND I T00K THAT PIC WHEN I WAS 17 PRE LIFTING. Y0U EXPECT MY DELTS T0 P0P WITH0UT ME FLEXING 0R EVER T0UCHING A WEIGHT AT 17? L0L. MY BR0THER WAS ALREADY LIFTING F0R YEARS. MY MUSCLE WEREN'T EVEN DEVEL0PED 0R D0NE GR0WING AT ALL.  I'M N0T FLEXING IN MY PIC AND YET L00K AT MY FR0NT DELT. T0 SAY I HAVE SHIT DELTS WHEN I HAVEN'T EVEN T0UCHED A WEIGHT AT 17 AND N0T FLEXING IS N0T RIGHT. Y0U CAN ALREADY SEE THE LINE AND P0P 0N MY FR0NT DELT. L00K AT MY TRAPS IN THAT PIC. THERE'S N0THING DIFFERENT FR0M N0W. I'M JUST 30 LBS HEAVIER. MY BR0THER IS ALS0 3 INCHES SH0RTER THAN ME MINUS 21 LBS. AGAIN L00K AT MY FR0NT DELT AND TRAPS. MY TRAPS ARE ALREADY HIGH. THIS IS 17 PRE LIFTING AND N0T FLEXING. YAH I'M SURE T0NS 0F 17 YEAR 0LDS HAVE DELTS P0PPING WITH0UT LIFTING IN THAT P0SE. LMA0.

[Jaime]

IT DEPENDS 0N GENETICS. IT'S N0T A GIVE AWAY AT ALL. MY FRIEND HAS 17 INCH ARMS AT 6 2 AS A NATURAL BUT HIS DELTS SUCK. MY BR0THER HAS 14 INCH ARMS AT 5 9 143 BUT HIS DELTS ARE GREAT. EVERY0NE IN MY FAMILY HAS INSANE DELTS BUT MY BR0THER'S ARMS ARE SHITTY AND HE HAS TR0UBLE GETTING THEM T0 GR0W. 0N THE 0THER HAND I'VE SEEN NATURALS WITH GREAT ARMS BUT SHITTY DELTS. DELTS IS MAINLY DUE T0 Y0UR GENETICS. ETHNIC RUSSIANS AND GERMANS ALL HAVE HUGE DELTS. THE PR0BLEM IS Y0U RARELY SEE AN ETHNIC RUSSIAN IN THE STATES AND IF HE SPEAKS RUSSIAN HE'S EITHER A JEW 0R FR0M THE NEIGHB0RING C0UNTRIES.

There are exceptions to everything i agree.

The problem is there are a lot of guys that don't have he genetics for srength or muscle building, that like to pretend that it is impossible to do anything natural.

[Krankenstein]

I FIND IT FUNNY H0W Y0U THINK IT'S IMP0SSIBLE F0R  ME T0 PUT 0N 25LBS 0F MUSCLE NATURALLY FR0M 155.
0KAY FIRST 0F ALL MY BR0THER IS FLEXING IN THAT PIC AND I'M N0T. THEY ARE TW0 DIFFERENT PICS. MY BR0THER IS 5 YEARS 0LDER THAN ME AND I T00K THAT PIC WHEN I WAS 17 PRE LIFTING. Y0U EXPECT MY DELTS T0 P0P WITH0UT ME FLEXING 0R EVER T0UCHING A WEIGHT AT 17? L0L. MY BR0THER WAS ALREADY LIFTING F0R YEARS. MY MUSCLE WEREN'T EVEN DEVEL0PED 0R D0NE GR0WING AT ALL.  I'M N0T FLEXING IN MY PIC AND YET L00K AT MY FR0NT DELT. T0 SAY I HAVE SHIT DELTS WHEN I HAVEN'T EVEN T0UCHED A WEIGHT AT 17 AND N0T FLEXING IS N0T RIGHT. Y0U CAN ALREADY SEE THE LINE AND P0P 0N MY FR0NT DELT. L00K AT MY TRAPS IN THAT PIC. THERE'S N0THING DIFFERENT FR0M N0W. I'M JUST 30 LBS HEAVIER. MY BR0THER IS ALS0 3 INCHES SH0RTER THAN ME MINUS 21 LBS. AGAIN L00K AT MY FR0NT DELT AND TRAPS. MY TRAPS ARE ALREADY HIGH. THIS IS 17 PRE LIFTING AND N0T FLEXING. YAH I'M SURE T0NS 0F 17 YEAR 0LDS HAVE DELTS P0PPING WITH0UT LIFTING IN THAT P0SE. LMA0.

I can't ever read your shit because of the fucking caps lock and that damn zero.....just an FYI...a cheap keyboard is like $10

HTH