The War in Iraq and Afghanistan, was/is it worth it?

[Agnostic007]

On a day where we are remembering the 3000+ lives lost in tragic terrorists events and the anger being refueled while we watch the towers being destroyed and thousands of innocent lives coming to a horrible end..we fast forward 10 yrs to this day. 

American soldiers killed in Iraq 4669
American soldiers killed in Afghanistan 1468

Trillions spent on the war

estimated 100,000 + Iraqi civilians killed

Bin Laden Killed
Hussien killed
Gaddafi toppled

Knowing what you know now, was invading Iraq worth it? Do we seperate Afghanistan and Iraq with one being worth it the other not? 

[headhuntersix]

Still open for debate. If the "arab" spring spreads democracy and Iran implodes...yeah it was worth it.

[Deicide]

On a day where we are remembering the 3000+ lives lost in tragic terrorists events and the anger being refueled while we watch the towers being destroyed and thousands of innocent lives coming to a horrible end..we fast forward 10 yrs to this day. 

American soldiers killed in Iraq 4669
American soldiers killed in Afghanistan 1468

Trillions spent on the war

estimated 100,000 + Iraqi civilians killed

Bin Laden Killed
Hussien killed
Gaddafi toppled

Knowing what you know now, was invading Iraq worth it? Do we seperate Afghanistan and Iraq with one being worth it the other not? 

Uhm, no, but that is only my opinion. I am sure plenty will disagree.

[OzmO]

Afghasstan:  yes ( but drawn out because of Iraq)

Iraq:  fuck no.

[garebear]

When I first heard OBL's reasoning of draining the US economy, I thought it was just ludicrous.

Now, it appears he has nearly pulled it off, with our economy teetering on collapse.

Iraq was the biggest mistake the US ever made. How does America benefit from a better ME if our own country is in shambles?

If we could go back, anybody with half a brain would realize that we should have treated as more a police problem within AFG. Of course, we are so invested with blood and treasure that it's become a truth no one can admit to.

Face it, we got burned on our own hubris. We laughed at those 'stupid Russians' for getting drawn in and thought we were some kind of invincible force. Fact is, we just didn't learn from history and were indeed doomed to repeat it.

This is why you should elect leaders who know their shit, not ones who you can have a beer with because it's just like a guy from down the street.

[tu_holmes]

Afghanistan, yes... Iraq and Lybia, no.

There will never be democracy in that region.

[Deicide]

Afghanistan, yes... Iraq and Lybia, no.

There will never be democracy in that region.

You think we should have stayed in Afghanistan for 10 years? or do you mean tactical strikes?

[tu_holmes]

You think we should have stayed in Afghanistan for 10 years? or do you mean tactical strikes?

I think if we hadn't gone into Iraq that we could have mopped up Afghanistan and been out in 4 years.

I don't think splitting our forces to run after the "Boogey man" did us any favors as far as timeline is concerned.

[garebear]

You think we should have stayed in Afghanistan for 10 years? or do you mean tactical strikes?

[Dos Equis]

Yes to both, although the war in Iraq was mismanaged.  Bush should have listened to Shinseki about the size of the force necessary to invade. 

[George Whorewell]

Iraq no.

Afghanistan yes.

If our military was allowed to fight a war to actually win instead of this pussyfooting around not to look bad to the "international community" and we had not squandered so much money and manpower in Iraq, Afghanistan would have been  conquered already.

And Gare, I find it hard to believe that you're military. Your entire take on politics reads more like a cross between the Communist Manifesto, Village Voice and Arriana Huffington if she were a special education high school student.

Comparing the Russian invasion to our invasion is both simplistic and idiotic. If you can't tell the obvious differences between the two, you're too dim to offer an opinion on the topic at hand.

[240 is Back]

gare has posted pics of him in various overseas and back home settings over the years.  and disappeared at times when serving.   

politics aside, i'm pretty sure the dude is in the service. 

[Deicide]

gare has posted pics of him in various overseas and back home settings over the years.  and disappeared at times when serving.   

politics aside, i'm pretty sure the dude is in the service. 

It's interesting that many assume anyone in the military will be far right ring but look at Hugo or Gare, neither are far right wing. I suspect the reason is because they have spent time in other countries in a non-military fashion.

[240 is Back]

It's interesting that many assume anyone in the military will be far right ring but look at Hugo or Gare, neither are far right wing. I suspect the reason is because they have spent time in other countries in a non-military fashion.

it's usually the old guys who served and now don't like the way things are run,
or those that never served and are 3 year out of college with Team America T-shirts...
or the lifer who understand it's a business

that think perpetual war is a-okay. 

It's often the guys who haven't served too long that don't like obama all that much, but sure as shit don't like getting shot at on the streets of some shitbird city on the other side of the world, for some bullshit reason.  You won't hear many of them tell you "it's about spreading democracy".  They know it's about oil and bases.

[OzmO]

Spreading democracy?  We should try that here. 

[headhuntersix]

it's usually the old guys who served and now don't like the way things are run,
or those that never served and are 3 year out of college with Team America T-shirts...
or the lifer who understand it's a business

that think perpetual war is a-okay.  

It's often the guys who haven't served too long that don't like obama all that much, but sure as shit don't like getting shot at on the streets of some shitbird city on the other side of the world, for some bullshit reason.  You won't hear many of them tell you "it's about spreading democracy".  They know it's about oil and bases.

Yeah your exactly right.  

What oil exactly....seriously what oil. If your gonna beat a dead horse, find the correct one.

[Fury]

Afghanistan, yes.

Nation building after eviscerating AQ and the Taliban? No. Playing nice to the world community, the very same community that ignores Darfur and every other atrocity? Why bother? The UN is a sad, sad joke and we have little use for it.

Pakistan is 100% the reason we're still in Afghanistan. Nothing more, nothing less. When you have a fucking terrorists state posing as an ally while their ISI stabs us in the back every chance they get, you have little chance of accomplishing this. Read some books on it as it has been well-discussed by people from the intelligence community. Relying on Pakistan from the get-go was mistake #1. They've done nothing more than suck $20+ billion out of us.

[andreisdaman]

Iraq was worth it because it got rid of Saddham and his sons who were a criminal Mafia running that country.....it brought democracy to the country and showed the Arabs a different way of living.....

Afghanistan was worth it because it got rid of the Taliban who were harboring Al Qaeda...and installed some type of democracy as well...although its not perfect by any means.....the nation building was a noble cause and a good try since now women are going to school and stuff like that but we can't stay there for ever..ultimately the afghans have to fight off the Taliban on their own..we gotta get out of there...

We spent way too much money and have lost a lot of blood over these wars...time to come home

[Bindare_Dundat]

Yup, all them TSA pat downs, the elevated threat levels, the Patriot Act, the talk of domestic terrorism caused by potentially disenfranchised Americans, encouraged spying on your neighbor, a strained economy, a strained military, $60 billion lost into a black hole, the trillions more on the wars,  yeah, it's all worth it.

[Agnostic007]

Just my opinion as an average citizen. I have no insider information that perhaps those making the decisions have..but

In my opinion if we had credible information that Afghanistan was housing Al Qieda and their main base of operations were in that country then I support our early action there. I did not fathom we would be there 9 yrs later nor do I think we should be. I recall early on that I was ready to go kick some Al Qieda ass in Afghanistan and was happy when we did begin military action.  I never supported the invasion of Iraq. I felt frustrated that Bush seemed set on it even though the inspectors would report progress.

I've always felt human life is precious and wars should be a last resort and something to avoid if at all possible. The toll on human lives as well as the impact on the families, not to mention the cost of engaging in a war is astronomical. When people making the decision to go to war have no family in the military it makes it too easy to de personalize what war actually costs.

I was pulling for Obama because he ran on a platform of ending the war. That was important to me. Every day lives were being lost and I personally don't feel the result was worth even one soldiers life much less thousands of lives. He backed out of that promise and here we are 9 yrs later, still at war, still losing lives, still spending billions that we don't have to fight it and I can't help thinking we should have learned our lesson in Vietnam.       

[OzmO]

Yup, all them TSA pat downs, the elevated threat levels, the Patriot Act, the talk of domestic terrorism caused by potentially disenfranchised Americans, encouraged spying on your neighbor, a strained economy, a strained military, $60 billion lost into a black hole, the trillions more on the wars,  yeah, it's all worth it.

But we took down a dictator who was next to ZERO threat tot he USA!

[andreisdaman]

But we took down a dictator who was next to ZERO threat tot he USA!

Dictators are a threat to everybody......they are a threat to human kind....we cannot always look the other way when regimes are inherently evil and murder and abuse their citizens....we as a civilized people should by all means topple these dictators when it is possible to do so......some would argue against this doctrine but its my belief

[Soul Crusher]

Iraq would have been worth it if we took the oil and did not dilly dally for months on end with that hearts and minds bs. 

Kill em all, let allah sort em out.

[Agnostic007]

Dictators are a threat to everybody......they are a threat to human kind....we cannot always look the other way when regimes are inherently evil and murder and abuse their citizens....we as a civilized people should by all means topple these dictators when it is possible to do so......some would argue against this doctrine but its my belief

What about a countries responsibility to stand up for themselves? Freedom or democracy won FOR you by another country probably won't work in the long run. I wouldn't mind so much helping another country but doing it for them? Not so much.  We generally have the government we deserve 

[OzmO]

Dictators are a threat to everybody......they are a threat to human kind....we cannot always look the other way when regimes are inherently evil and murder and abuse their citizens....we as a civilized people should by all means topple these dictators when it is possible to do so......some would argue against this doctrine but its my belief

We do look the other way.  All the time, even right now.  We did Not topple Saddam because he was a dictator abusing his poeple.  So your belief is based on a false assumption.