Author Topic: Full Range?  (Read 3222 times)

Donny

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Full Range?
« on: October 05, 2011, 08:05:19 AM »
doing benches with a barbell i lower it till my arms are about 90 degrees. Lowerng to my chest has no real advantage to me. I have never noticed a change in muscle stimulation ..opinions please

Overload

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2011, 08:48:15 AM »
I think it depends on the individual, but from my experience full ROM will give you the best results in muscle gains and strength.

There are times when partial reps come into play, but as a general rule you should always use full ROM unless it causes pain or injury.

Changing hand placement and spacing has alot to do with why some people struggle with bench press ROM. Try moving your hands around when warming up and learn to tuck your elbows.

Bench is one of those movements that IMO requires full ROM in order to be effective. Also remember to flex and squeeze your pecs to get the proper stimulation, a lot of guys just press the weight with their shoulders and triceps to get the weight up and then wonder why they never make any improvements in their chest.

Just my .02


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garebear

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2011, 09:04:10 AM »
Bench with dumbells.

If you want half muscles, continue with half movements.
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jpm101

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2011, 05:02:54 PM »
If a person is into athletics/sports or just a guy who wants better improvement in muscle size and strength, well beyond the normal average man, than full ROM is a must. And for the most part ,injuries will be avoided.

If wanting to take the muscular development to another level, than work the middle phase only of an exercise. That would also apply to using the TUT (Time Under Tension) protocol. The point of failure is usually avoided in any set. Admitting that some of these exercise styles looks almost laughable, with the quick short middle range reps and with the appearance that the muscles are not nearly worked to there full capacity. But that would be deceiving, muscle tissue in called upon strongly... In most cases, a cheating style is encouraged.

The above is only related to  BB'ing and the current exercise methods of some very large and muscular human beings. No lockout or full stretch (complete , by the book, ROM) is every attempted.  And not any hint of a pause in the exercise tempo/pace until the desired reps/sets are finished. One would have to experience a middle phase rep range workout, for a few weeks,to understand the current popularity of it. This is not partial rep training, in the original sense, which some may be mistaken with.

As with the original question, I might suggest touching, or use a slight bounce, off the chest each rep. Or, as  some others do, start each rep of the bench from a dead stop for 1 or 2 seconds  pause rather than starting the normal way from the overhead position. Should get a better pec involvement/stimulation  with this version. Seems to help with the overall strength of doing the BP it's self. May need spotters this way or set the pins at chest level. I'll do this dead stop at the bottom with weighted dips, which can work very well. Good Luck.

Side Bar: Never heard the term "Half Muscle" caused by half movements. Creative thinking?
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Montague

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2011, 05:20:53 PM »
If a person is into athletics/sports or just a guy who wants better improvement in muscle size and strength, well beyond the normal average man, than full ROM is a must.

If wanting to take the muscular development to another level, than work the middle phase only of an exercise.

The above is only related to  BB'ing


I agree with these ideas based on my own experiences using them.
JPM actually convinced me to give them a go about a year ago, and it's been well worth the investment.

Donny

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2011, 12:24:31 AM »
I find it's better for my shoulders and for maybe an inch or so the risk of injury is not worth it. Just the way i do it. My chest is getting enough stimulation... rises liked Baked Bread...lol

JAM

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2011, 07:07:23 AM »
I use partial reps sometimes with very heavy weight when trying to build up strength.  It does seem to help and then eventually a 75% rep can turn into a full range of motion after a period of time.  I'm not sure why or how this works but it seems to do the trick.  Maybe it helps the connective tissue, or gets the muscles used to firing all at once?  I dunno ...  ???

jpm101

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2011, 09:04:36 AM »
Partial reps are a version of the muscle overload system. The body get's use to, and will adjust to, using heavier weight loads.

Bench lockouts (2 to 4 inches from the top position) can be a good example. If using 205 in the regular bench, a person can be using 80 to 100lbs more at that top short range partial lockout. This also works strongly on building the ligaments and tendon strength. Perhaps most important of all, it builds the confidence of handling much heavier weight than normal (lifting 50-50 body & mind).

Working off the chest (dead stop...3-4 inches to pins) each rep, in the bench, will increase the starting and overall strength of the total bench. Same can be said for the middle position of the bench.

The key to this all is getting enough rest between workouts and never going to failure doing a workout. This will insure steady progress. Exception will be when checking out the gains by doing sets of 1 or 2 rep max's, every 3 weeks or so. But anyone should see progress from every workout taken, if enough rest is included. The muscles should take on a fuller and thicker look during this type of training.  Allow 6 to 9 weeks for partial training, than on to another form of workout. .Maybe a few more months, than back to basic partial training again. This is called Periodization training. Some plan a whole year of training , knowing exactly what they will be doing and when they will be doing it. Good Luck.
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JAM

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2011, 09:23:10 AM »
Cool, I never knew the details of why it works.  I just knew doing partials for a few work outs (usually a month or so) did seem to help.  So far... don't want to jinx it... no injuries either.  YaY   ;D

wes

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #9 on: October 11, 2011, 01:34:43 PM »
Full range = full development!!

I include half reps at the end of a set during certain exercises (burns) simply to extend the set.


Back in the day 99% of people in real gyms used full ROM,nowadays I see half benches,half dumbell presses,1/8 squats,and lots of other half assed shit that to me constitutes bullshit training.

Just my opinion,nothing against anyone here.................





















...........except people who do half reps!!  LOL  :)

j/k

Montague

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #10 on: October 11, 2011, 04:49:39 PM »
I think too many people equate partial reps with simply eliminating the hardest part of the movement in favor of making it easier.
Sadly, this is the type of practice often employed and seen in gyms.

The partial rep method JPM and I praise limits the ROM by actually confining it to the hardest part of the rep.
Done in this manner, constant tension is maintained on the target muscle rather than being transferred to ancillary muscles, joints, etc.

Of course, it’s not a “magic bullet” for everyone, but I’ve benefited noticeably from it - particularly my tri’s & delts, which have always been my most stubborn body parts.

wes

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2011, 03:51:24 AM »
I think too many people equate partial reps with simply eliminating the hardest part of the movement in favor of making it easier.
Sadly, this is the type of practice often employed and seen in gyms.

The partial rep method JPM and I praise limits the ROM by actually confining it to the hardest part of the rep.
Done in this manner, constant tension is maintained on the target muscle rather than being transferred to ancillary muscles, joints, etc.

Of course, it’s not a “magic bullet” for everyone, but I’ve benefited noticeably from it - particularly my tri’s & delts, which have always been my most stubborn body parts.

Point taken Montague,but these days most are just using half reps to use heavier weights,not part of an actual structured plan as you and jpm are talking about.

Love your posts dude.  :)

jpm101

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2011, 09:40:14 AM »
Wes: might be a case of six of one, half a dozen of the other.

That's one of the reasons I encourage different platforms during a 12 month training period. Pure BB'ing (as you do) and partials (or forms of), middle range, GVT, 8X8's, Tri/Quad sets, etc. All may have a place, depending on the person, and results/progress received. Periods of 6 to 8-9 week protocols styles, usually. Take a week, or two , off of training than on to another select method.

Out on the Pacific coast (at least SoCal) most are still doing the middle range rep scheme. Workout days from 4 to 6 a week. Though the whole body workout plan is becoming noticeable by some guys. (don't want to bore anyone with research, but middle range, quick reps seem the most productive in adding muscle mass. According to some sports science sources, anyway ..but than again, some things never work for everyone...just throwing that out there, for what it may be worth ((if anything)) ).

Best results I've had (besides football weight work...which would put a lot of muscle on a lot of guys..but can be pretty brutal stuff) are Power Rack (three phase partial positions) training. That and GVT and to a lesser extent 8X8's. Both of these are easier on the joints, which can use a little TLC from time to time. Good Luck.
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Montague

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2011, 01:48:16 PM »
Love your posts dude.  :)


Thanks; I'm here all week...
 ;)

wes

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2011, 12:39:22 PM »
:)

Donny

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2011, 01:15:08 AM »
I do not do half reps but stopping as my upper arms are parallel to my torso, this is not like half reps. lowering another inch or so will not make a bit difference

wes

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2011, 03:16:07 AM »
I do not do half reps but stopping as my upper arms are parallel to my torso, this is not like half reps. lowering another inch or so will not make a bit difference
Try it,your reps and poundages are sure to drop.

I can do partial DB Presses with the 100`s but use only do the 80`s for full range of motion reps.

I see tons of guys daily using more weight than they can properly handle by omitting part of their reps.

Yev33

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2011, 10:41:24 PM »
Unless you are doing partial reps in a specific ROM to improve the movement overall ( as jpm pointed out ), you should be using full range of motion, and yes it does make a difference.

But to each is own, just remember : if you bench 315 (or whatever #) with partial form, you didn't bench 315.  

 

wes

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Re: Full Range?
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2011, 02:23:11 AM »
if you bench 315 (or whatever #) with partial form, you didn't bench 315. 

QUOTED FOR TRUTH.