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Author Topic: Skull Crushers vs Overhead Extensions  (Read 5568 times)
littleguns
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« on: February 27, 2012, 02:39:41 PM »

Any difference between Skull Crushers and using a curl bra and doing over head extensions? (as it relates to head usage)
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Yev33
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« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2012, 07:27:09 PM »

Yes, there is a difference.
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« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2012, 06:31:04 AM »

Do them both,not necessarily at the same workout, but alternating them is a good idea.

Overhead Extensions and its variations, is the only exercise that puts the triceps in the fully stretched position,so they should definately be in your routine.
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« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2012, 09:27:06 AM »

Overhead extensions very effectively work the long head of the triceps - the one that accounts for the most posterior arm mass. In EVERY arm workout, I perform either overhead extensions (db or bb) and/or bodyweight extensions, which is another extremely productive movement for the long head when done properly.

For many trainers, a significant determining factor in deciding between skull-crushers vs. overhead work comes down to elbow issues.
I feel that the overhead varieties of extensions are more forgiving on my condylar tendons. Although, Iíve learned in recent years that even skullís can afford similar comfort if done properly.

Some trainers find reduced stress by lowering the bar behind the head rather than to the bridge of the nose. Other people like to perform the move on a decline bench. The biggest help Iíve discovered is to lower the bar slowly, under great control. That seems to reduce much of the trauma that more rapid descents frequently cause.

IMO, a trainer interested in developing complete triceps should incorporate both varieties of exercise. The shorter ROM of supine extensions works the triís from a slightly different angle, offering variety; and it can build strength in other extension work, which is a definite plus.
You may also wish to explore skull-crusher derivations such as the JM Press. Larry Scott also had a unique twist on skullís that borrowed a bit from the JM & traditional skullís.
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« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2012, 10:01:01 AM »

Actually Yev33 hits the nail smack on the head.

SC'ers are a partial rep movement. Overhead extensions are (normally) a full ROM. All things being equal, SC'ers may prove harder on the elbows & wrist. Though some report using 300+ lbs, which is extreme pressure on the tendons/ligaments. Can also do SC'ers with DB's for an ever shorter ROM. And different angles to path of the DB. Any form (BB/DB) does help the bench...if the elbows allow it.

Though BB overhead extensions  have been a staple for years, the one arm DB version will allow a fuller overall stretch. But the upper arm should remain close to the head at all times, When the elbows drift out and away (as with a BB) a lot of the direct affect on the triceps is lost. Some do lower the bar to the top of the head or forehead. Can also use cables, rather than DB's.

Using an incline bench, the bar can be lowered behind (full stretch) the neck or to the forehead, like doing SC'er. Alternation reps on this exercise might prove interesting. Good Luck.
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« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2012, 10:11:27 AM »

for me personaly over head ez bar extensions put more size on my arms than any other movement...

i cant do them these days with my elbows, have to use overhead cables instead
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« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2012, 10:24:01 AM »

Actually Yev33 hits the nail smack on the head.

SC'ers are a partial rep movement. Overhead extensions are (normally) a full ROM. All things being equal, SC'ers may prove harder on the elbows & wrist. Though some report using 300+ lbs, which is extreme pressure on the tendons/ligaments. Can also do SC'ers with DB's for an ever shorter ROM. And different angles to path of the DB. Any form (BB/DB) does help the bench...if the elbows allow it.

Though BB overhead extensions  have been a staple for years, the one arm DB version will allow a fuller overall stretch. But the upper arm should remain close to the head at all times, When the elbows drift out and away (as with a BB) a lot of the direct affect on the triceps is lost. Some do lower the bar to the top of the head or forehead. Can also use cables, rather than DB's.

Using an incline bench, the bar can be lowered behind (full stretch) the neck or to the forehead, like doing SC'er. Alternation reps on this exercise might prove interesting. Good Luck.


Hey, dammit: those are all MY points!!

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« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2012, 11:20:23 AM »

Montague: Creative and copyright infringements?

Some where in the vast cosmos expansion, where all universal knowledge is stored, our psyche's must have crossed over to this vault of information at the same moment. Gathering every vital bit of information on The Triceps! And than sharing it with all the hungry minds on GB, yearning  for any micro bit of training help. Or something like that, I guess. But than again, it's just the fricken Triceps, not an overly complex muscle to build up.

So that's my story. Good luck.
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« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2012, 11:34:20 AM »

both exercises are dangerous and should be avioded at all costs
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« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2012, 11:53:05 AM »

Montague: Creative and copyright infringements?

Some where in the vast cosmos expansion, where all universal knowledge is stored, our psyche's must have crossed over to this vault of information at the same moment. Gathering every vital bit of information on The Triceps! And than sharing it with all the hungry minds on GB, yearning  for any micro bit of training help. Or something like that, I guess. But than again, it's just the fricken Triceps, not an overly complex muscle to build up.

So that's my story. Good luck.
Cheesy
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« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2012, 12:27:48 PM »

Montague: Creative and copyright infringements?

Some where in the vast cosmos expansion, where all universal knowledge is stored, our psyche's must have crossed over to this vault of information at the same moment. Gathering every vital bit of information on The Triceps! And than sharing it with all the hungry minds on GB, yearning  for any micro bit of training help. Or something like that, I guess. But than again, it's just the fricken Triceps, not an overly complex muscle to build up. 

So that's my story. Good luck.


That's exactly what I suspected!

Damn...it happened again...




GET OUTTA MY HEAD, MAN!!!
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« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2012, 01:24:21 PM »

I really like using the cables for overhead extention work, as well as free weights.
I like the rope overhead two arm extentions, as well as the single arm cable extentions where I'll just use the ball at the end of the cable instead of using any kind of attachment.

When you get into the heavier db's the elbows tend to flare out to make room for the db behind your head.
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« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2012, 02:14:32 PM »

I really like using the cables for overhead extention work, as well as free weights.
I like the rope overhead two arm extentions, as well as the single arm cable extentions where I'll just use the ball at the end of the cable instead of using any kind of attachment.

When you get into the heavier db's the elbows tend to flare out to make room for the db behind your head.


I knew an amateur-level competitor who liked doing overhead extensions on a Smith machine. The grip was odd: he'd close both hands into fists, use about a shoulder-width hammer grip (palms facing each other), resting the bar on the blade of the hand (ulnar/pinky side), and go into the extension.
He kept the ROM real short and tight.

He was nice enough to work with me a little bit until I got it down.
It was an interesting feel; actually different from using a triceps bar with the parallel handles.
I just thought of it now...may have to add these to a sporadic arm day every now and then.
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« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2012, 03:11:57 PM »

i like doing pushdowns using the pulley. single handed. or dual handed. palm down. or palm up. squeeze real hard at the bottom, flex as hard as you can, control the negative for a 3-4 second count, the explode the weight back down to the bottom while keeping good form and only using the tricep. repeat. stay away from failure. just a few good sets is all you need.
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« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2012, 04:05:23 PM »

both exercises are dangerous and should be avioded at all costs
if you check your ego at the door you won't get hurt. 70 lbs or so with strict concentration.


* tricep dd.jpg (22.46 KB, 323x418 - viewed 2370 times.)
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« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2012, 04:39:53 PM »

IMO,using a rope handle on anything other than Ab/Serratus Crunches is not a good thing.

The only other exception......again,only my opinion,is on pressdowns where you flare out the arms at the bottom of the movement to flex the triceps hard.

other than that,a straight bar,cambered bar for pulleys,and various V-Bar handles work much better........especially in the handle revolves.

FLAME ON!!  Grin
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« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2012, 04:58:56 PM »

i do all my extension (seated, standing, lying...) with dumbbells and never get hurt nor have any elbow/wrist issues.
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« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2012, 06:40:08 PM »


I knew an amateur-level competitor who liked doing overhead extensions on a Smith machine. The grip was odd: he'd close both hands into fists, use about a shoulder-width hammer grip (palms facing each other), resting the bar on the blade of the hand (ulnar/pinky side), and go into the extension.
He kept the ROM real short and tight.

He was nice enough to work with me a little bit until I got it down.
It was an interesting feel; actually different from using a triceps bar with the parallel handles.
I just thought of it now...may have to add these to a sporadic arm day every now and then.


I sort of developed a version of this on my own with a different twist. It came from not having any equipment open/available to do my normal extensions; where I stand in front of a barbell in a rack/Smith Machine and lean against it. I have seen videos but can't seem to find one right now.

Anyway, I didn't have any possible station I could do the exercise and so I used a Preacher Bench adjusted high enough to where I could use my hands balled up in fists and my head would clear the bench on the way down/up. It's not too different from the regular version I do, but it definitely feels different.


*edit: founda decent version (thanks to those that also searched & found)
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNUsmED11rM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNUsmED11rM</a>
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« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2012, 06:51:39 PM »

I sort of developed a version of this on my own with a different twist. It came from not having any equipment open/available to do my normal extensions; where I stand in front of a barbell in a rack/Smith Machine and lean against it. I have seen videos but can't seem to find one right now.

Anyway, I didn't have any possible station I could do the exercise and so I used a Preacher Bench adjusted high enough to where I could use my hands balled up in fists and my head would clear the bench on the way down/up. It's not too different from the regular version I do, but it definitely feels different.



Oh, okay. It sounds like you're describing bodyweight extensions, which are a fabulous triceps exercise; I think I mentioned them in my post up top!
What my buddy did was actually a seated barbell extension with the bar balanced on the fleshy little finger side of his closed fists.

We have an angled Smith machine at one of my current gyms.
I'm going to give these a go next arm session. I haven't even thought about them in years.
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« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2012, 09:10:50 PM »


Oh, okay. It sounds like you're describing bodyweight extensions, which are a fabulous triceps exercise; I think I mentioned them in my post up top!
What my buddy did was actually a seated barbell extension with the bar balanced on the fleshy little finger side of his closed fists.

We have an angled Smith machine at one of my current gyms.
I'm going to give these a go next arm session. I haven't even thought about them in years.


I think the bodyweight extensions is a good name, since I call them that too. No matter what I tried to search youtube with though, no luck.

I hope I can remember the exercise you describe on Friday when I do arms. If I were Wes' age I would forget as soon as I hit 'post.' Cheesy
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« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2012, 09:13:07 PM »

I sort of developed a version of this on my own with a different twist. It came from not having any equipment open/available to do my normal extensions; where I stand in front of a barbell in a rack/Smith Machine and lean against it. I have seen videos but can't seem to find one right now.

Anyway, I didn't have any possible station I could do the exercise and so I used a Preacher Bench adjusted high enough to where I could use my hands balled up in fists and my head would clear the bench on the way down/up. It's not too different from the regular version I do, but it definitely feels different.

Sounds like 'fixed bar tricep extensions'.

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/excercise/picfixedbartricepextensions.htm

(grip is too wide in the example - weird)
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« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2012, 09:17:30 PM »

Sounds like 'fixed bar tricep extensions'.

http://www.abcbodybuilding.com/excercise/picfixedbartricepextensions.htm

(grip is too wide in the example - weird)

That is it Smiley
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« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2012, 11:29:50 PM »

Saw Arnold doing those in the mags back in the day YB...he had a bar set midway on a power rack and did them.

I tried them,but the positioning is hard to get........gotta` be just right for the best stretch.
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« Reply #23 on: February 29, 2012, 07:57:08 AM »

reg's version


* reg park tris.jpg (119.66 KB, 308x480 - viewed 2314 times.)
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« Reply #24 on: February 29, 2012, 09:01:25 AM »

I've heard those "fixed bar tricep extensions" call push off's of push backs, but never by the fixed bar title (learn something every day). Again, one exercises can go by different names.

The beauty of the movement is that you can adjust the resistance from very light or very heavy by making slight body shifts. Going from a one rep max to a lighter super pump very quickly, all in the same set. Included is a outstanding stretch.  Usually the grip is close, as in regular triceps work, than shown in the drawing. The exercise can be preformed just about any where (table, counter, heavy chair, etc..even on a saw horse, which a guy I knew used in his home gym, though  mostly for dips). Can also treat this movement like a SC'er or lowering to the upper chest for a different angle on the triceps.

Some will try it for a while but are so programmed to thinking that they need to be using some sort of weight (BB/DB/Cable) resistance, rather than only bwt  they never give the exercise a fair shot. Might use it for a light pump at the end of an triceps work, but that's all. Limit thinking can give limited results as far as muscle size goes. The "tri bar ext" can be a stand alone exercise. And produce a super pump, if that is the main goal. This is a pure BB'ing movement.

Might note , that you can shift the majority of the body resistance to one arm at a time, giving more focus to triceps themselves. Good Luck.

Side Bar: Feel free to lower the bar for more of an advanced method, as you progress from the usually waist to lower chest height. If you can do them from a prone (face down) position your getting pretty good.
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