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Author Topic: experts only: deadlifts  (Read 2250 times)
david1947
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« on: March 16, 2012, 12:20:55 AM »

I have few questions.  How important do you guys feel deadlifts are to building mass?  How would you put them in your split. Would you do them with back before doing bent over rows tbars  or would you not do them in the same workout.
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Yev33
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« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2012, 02:16:39 AM »


Back when I used body part splits I always put them at the end of the back workout. I found that putting them first really affected my strength on all my other lifts that followed. I also felt them in my lats a lot more this way too.

When I started doing an upper lower split, I put them on the lower body day and did them first. Would usually follow them up with machine hack squats or leg presses. Really liked this set up since it allowed me to go as heavy as I could on deads, and still hit my quads really well afterward.

If you want to get as strong as possible on them, put them first in the workout. If you want to get the most benefit out of them for your back development I would recommend putting them at the end of a back workout.


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oni
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« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2012, 04:11:06 AM »

Do them on lower body days or back days and done first, always do them first. The lat & upper back activation from heavy deadlifts is amazing and will set up the rest of your back workout up for success and after doing chins, rows etc your upper back will be fried and you will lose a lot of the tension needed to deadlift safely and heavy
If you're too tired after a few sets of deadlifts to do rows, chins, shrugs etc you're a pussy and you need to work on your conditioning
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jon cole
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« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2012, 06:12:15 AM »

dlis very special exercise.

my best dl training was simple as hell = 1 heavy set of 5 reps once every two week,and sometime when i reach my max once every two week was too much.
dling every week was useless for me because i stale.

this is why it's a very special exercise.

the original jon cole (famous pler of the 70's) did dl once a month.
 
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« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2012, 01:02:04 PM »

on a back workout do your bent over barbell rows first and then deadlifts(you have then the help from your legs). me myself i do undergrip pull-ups ..bent over barbell rows ..Deads.
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« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2012, 03:36:10 PM »

I have few questions.  How important do you guys feel deadlifts are to building mass?  How would you put them in your split. Would you do them with back before doing bent over rows tbars  or would you not do them in the same workout.

i would suggest that it depends on the person...

i love deadlifts and still do them.... just with more controlled poundages and for much higher rep sets
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« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2012, 05:35:16 AM »

i would suggest that it depends on the person...

i love deadlifts and still do them.... just with more controlled poundages and for much higher rep sets
The right way to do it.. good advice for anyone Wink
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« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2012, 07:55:51 AM »

The right way to do it.. good advice for anyone Wink

to expand on my thoughts about deadlifts... i currently like the 'deadlift-shrug' combo (shrug at the end of each deadlift)

i stick to 225 on the bar for 3-4 sets of 25,15,15,*10 (if i feel like it)...

the 25 rep set is amazing...

again, i could certainly go heavier but i focus on a good, slow deadlift and a nice squeezed shrug... i do these with only a small knee bend and i do wear straps (end up holding the bar for a fucking long time)
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Cashfan
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« Reply #8 on: March 19, 2012, 12:36:09 AM »

Deadlifts, fuck, they could be an entire workout all on their own.  I do them a little different than the traditional way.  I unrack the bar from waist level, walk back a step or two, lower the bar to the floor then pull up.  This enables me to focus on keeping my form tight and not rounding my back over with heavier poundages.  Try it, if you like it and it works for you great, if not, no harm no foul. 
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deadz
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« Reply #9 on: March 19, 2012, 03:17:13 PM »

I have been BB for 17 consistent years. I've only done deadz for the past two years. Deadz have taken my back to another dimension.
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« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2012, 04:14:24 AM »

Deadlifts are crucial. I prefer to do them at the beginning of my back workout and go as heavy as possible in the 3-6 rep range. Doing deads on the same day as squats will lead to poorer development on either or both movements, and expose one to a greater risk of overtraining.
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jpm101
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« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2012, 10:08:05 AM »

DL's are placed first. Want your full attention, and freshness, at the start of the workout to do this compound movement full justice. Might also suggest doing chins (close grip) and curl grip BB rows to complete the back workout.

Would suggest doing the DL's, starting  from around knee height (rather than from the floor position). Which may eliminate potential over extension of the lower back and doing away with the knees getting in the way of the path of the lifting bar. These two factors can be the major disadvantage of getting injury free DL workouts.

At time I will include shrugs with DL's, as one exdercise. Though I start the shrug when raising for the start of the DL position. As the Olympic lifters do. Don't know if any advantage to this compound movement, just works for me. Good Luck.
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« Reply #12 on: March 20, 2012, 06:36:35 PM »

hmmm... I do deadlifts last... same pumps and burn with lower poundages because i am fatigued
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Yev33
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« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2012, 07:18:48 PM »

 I have always done deadlifts last when I did them as a part of a back workout. I found that by doing deadlifts first, it drastically cut into my strength on rowing and pulling movements which followed. Whereas putting the rowing and pulling movements before deadlifts very minimally affected my strength on deads.
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John O
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« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2012, 03:59:44 PM »

Guess it goes without saying, as a powerlifter I do deadlifts first, then my other back work.
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« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2012, 05:18:42 PM »

Guess it goes without saying, as a powerlifter I do deadlifts first, then my other back work.

um... as a powerlifter you would not really do that...

I like the WSB method:

http://www.powerliftingwatch.com/files/Westside%20Barbell%20Template.pdf
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oni
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« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2012, 08:44:24 PM »

um... as a powerlifter you would not really do that...

I like the WSB method:

http://www.powerliftingwatch.com/files/Westside%20Barbell%20Template.pdf

the fuck are you chatting guy
name one successful powerlifter that hits accessory prior to the main movement of the day
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Voland
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« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2012, 12:54:24 AM »

more on deadlifts
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=420064.0
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« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2012, 02:49:37 PM »

the fuck are you chatting guy
name one successful powerlifter that hits accessory prior to the main movement of the day

please reduce your redbull intake

obviously you did not review the link I posted... I did not suggest a powerlifter would not work the main movement first, although in a different post I indicated that I do (I am getting old and have changed my lifting style)...

What I was getting at is that a powerlifter doesn't train with a BBing workout (back on 1 day, chest on another, etc...)

The WSB method (which I used in my youth... well something like it, then it a bit later) has you hit the main movement and then work the muscles that support that movement... anyway the whole thing is spelled out in the link I provided.
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BigCyp
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« Reply #19 on: May 04, 2012, 08:00:57 AM »

Back when I used body part splits I always put them at the end of the back workout. I found that putting them first really affected my strength on all my other lifts that followed. I also felt them in my lats a lot more this way too.

When I started doing an upper lower split, I put them on the lower body day and did them first. Would usually follow them up with machine hack squats or leg presses. Really liked this set up since it allowed me to go as heavy as I could on deads, and still hit my quads really well afterward.

If you want to get as strong as possible on them, put them first in the workout. If you want to get the most benefit out of them for your back development I would recommend putting them at the end of a back workout.



Good way to explain this.
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Zach Trowbridge
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« Reply #20 on: May 09, 2012, 08:45:53 AM »


The WSB method (which I used in my youth... well something like it, then it a bit later) has you hit the main movement and then work the muscles that support that movement...

... Which is exactly what John O said.  Unless you don't consider your back muscles to support your deadlift.
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kimo
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« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2012, 06:36:15 AM »

THE G REAT  exercice build hamstrings and lower back . and traps . for hams sets of five heavy . high reps over 10 are not that useful in deadlifting .
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jpm101
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« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2012, 08:31:31 AM »

Actually.......doing higher rep's (10-15 and sometimes, for special goals, 20 reps) can be an excellent way to build body mass. With perhaps sets of 2 to 4. Going to get a whole new feel and experience with those higher reps and get stronger,  

In the superior compound lifts, like DL's, squats, cleans, jerk presses, etc,  you will encounter stamina (strength plus endurance) issues at first, even with light to moderate weight. Which can be quickly adapted to by the body. You are not just working out , but training the body to a higher degree of performance. In return, gaining muscle mass and improved power in any lift you choose. Might suggest, never go to the point of failure on any set, even the last one. Good Luck.

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