Truth about natural dieting

[animal1991]

My thoughts on this is that no matter what kinda diet you follow as a NATTY, you are still gonna lose LBM and look like a twink in the end with low bodyfat. No matter if you follow a high carb - moderate protein, keto, carb cycling etc, its all the same in the end.
I mean if you diet as natural and set a caloric intake and just get in a minimum of about 1g/kg of protein and your essential vitamins, minerals and fats and fill in the rest of your caloric intake with healthy foods you are GTG.
Mike Mentzer always preached to follow a balanced diet and said the perfect ratio is 65C - 25P - 10F, and all you have to do is to adjust your caloric intake. And yes I know he used hormones but its still a good way to eat in my opinion.
Of course this all changes if you're hormonized etc.
Any truth to this?

[chess315]

yes if your a cock strong 330 benching natural when you start dieting you will be lucky to hit 280 when your done fact thats why perma bulking is so popular you get so weak you say fuck this and eat.

[chess315]

my thoughts on losing fat and gaining muscle after years to to think about it is this if your base is 3000 calories to stay the same your diet should change very little no matter what the drugs,supplements is what you use to produce the effect

bulking 3000-3500

cutting 2700 and add epherdrine,t3 ,tren what ever let the drugs take you down not starvation

if natural your best plan is lower your calories a hair under maintence and lose around 1 -1.5 lbs a week and take the long hall 2lb+ will melt you like butter. You will lose 8-10 lbs on your compound lifts in a bad weak.

for the 3000 k base maybe 2750 and add ephedrine for a natural ephedrine prolly damn near has anabolic or anti catabolic properties if you will. Prolly ephedrine or clen is all a natural would want to use imo. fuck t3 and these other compounds unless really fat.

[j3di3]

after dieting i look like a skinny white boy and everybody at work ask me if i stopped working out. Also my body gets into the weight loss state and i just keep losing more weight despite eating normal again

[NeilGM]

You can get lean but small natty. The ratio in how the body uses different parts of the body such as bone, fat, muscle for energy is completely different natural to steroids. You will get leanish natty but never hold much mass as the body takes everything in a more balanced ratio where as when you have steroids your body greatly reduces the amounts of energy that come from muscles, bones etc.

[chess315]

people make to drastic changes . Change the diet very little just enough to produce and effect.  This means taking out a glass of milk or soemthing.

[Cleanest Natural]

No such thing as natty dieting ... you'll loose everything

[Nomad]

Ask the true adonis. I believe he got down to 155lbs, 6% bodyfat but this at morning height of 6 ft ( evening height of 5'11) .

[animal1991]

Ask the true adonis. I believe he got down to 155lbs, 6% bodyfat but this at morning height of 6 ft ( evening height of 5'11) .

True adonis never replies to any of my messages

[theisen]

No such thing as natty dieting ... you'll loose everything

this, so this year when i decided imma cut i added in 200mg of tren and 350 prop, at this current point im 10kgs more muscle than last year

[animal1991]

@Chev
Please stop posting this shit on the threads I make. It really isn't funny anymore and if you can't get over it I think you have a fucking problem dude.
I'm here for advice not for your shit comments so if you don't have anything USEFULL to say then YOU must GTFO.
You're fucking irritating and your like a fucking two year old with a fucking obsession. WTF dude. Get a life. Its the fucking internet.

[ChevChelios]

Welcome to the thunderdome bitch.

Get your toys and head back home 

[animal1991]

There's a difference between a joke and fucking stalking a guy for every thread he makes and commenting shit on it.
I know the thunderdome is "harsh", but its the fucking internet so who gives a fuck.
But if I post here for advice, I have the right to ask for it, just like anyone else has. And I have the right to ask you to stop posting shit that is irrelevant. Its getting old and just irritating everybody. It isn't funny at all.

[Cleanest Natural]

Here's me dieted down to 168 lbs no hormones with a little help from t3 and clen .. eating too little and doing too much cardio.

[Cleanest Natural]

Dude you CAN diet naturally but dont expect to be nowhere NEAR somebody who is doing the same on juice. Thats just logic. Lots of protein, carb cycling, low fat and some good omega fats, lots of veggies and if possible do TREN....oh wait

I do not agree

You do not need a LOT of protein

you DO need lots of good fats

Not much need for carbs .. cycling them? Please ..

[undertaker90]

agree, even on cycle you wont need much protein when dieting, i and many other have done this. i have been dieting on 110-130g prot ED and i havent lost any muscle... gona do a experiment starting monday, gona try upping my dose back to 2g and see if i can grow back to my former size on only 2300 kcal and 120-140g prot... as it takes 12-15g more protein ED to gain 60-75g off LBM ED... then you wont need much protein even on gear... and 1 pund off muscle if im not mistaken or it was a kg cant remember in my head only takes 600 kcal not 7000 kcal as fat...

I eat only as much protein as i need, i eat carbs because i like it and it gives me energy under my workouts, i get my fat from fish as i love salmon.... only thing i will keep my eye on is my kcal and that i get more than 120g prot... rest i will just eat what i like to eat... good old Norwegian food... i will take weight, bf test and other mesurments and before and after pics, i may post them up when i finished.....

[mass243]

Yup.
I dieted down (without supps) last summer. I lost fat.... but lost all the little muscle I had as well 

Horrible. Being natural sucks if you want to look like you train.

[YngiweRhoads]

I lose almost no strength, if any, and look more muscular due to being more defined.

[Tiny Coq]

Yup.
I dieted down (without supps) last summer. I lost fat.... but lost all the little muscle I had as well 

Horrible. Being natural sucks if you want to look like you train.

you will probably find you didnt lose that much muscle and that you were holding more fat than you originally thought.

[dfresh]

did this last summer as well. t3 at 50mcg, eating like a bird and lots of cardio

yes i leaned down...but felt/looked small

this time im doing things right....hello tren/prop

[Krankenstein]

my thoughts on losing fat and gaining muscle after years to to think about it is this if your base is 3000 calories to stay the same your diet should change very little no matter what the drugs,supplements is what you use to produce the effect

bulking 3000-3500

cutting 2700 and add epherdrine,t3 ,tren what ever let the drugs take you down not starvation

if natural your best plan is lower your calories a hair under maintence and lose around 1 -1.5 lbs a week and take the long hall 2lb+ will melt you like butter. You will lose 8-10 lbs on your compound lifts in a bad weak.

for the 3000 k base maybe 2750 and add ephedrine for a natural ephedrine prolly damn near has anabolic or anti catabolic properties if you will. Prolly ephedrine or clen is all a natural would want to use imo. fuck t3 and these other compounds unless really fat.

"Bulking" = poor excuse to become fat and eat shit when you know you shouldn't.

[Metabolic]

You should read this site

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss

It explains the pretty simple, bullshit-less and obvious world of dieting.  There really isnt mucho to it.

Also, if you eat 1 g of protein per lb of bw AND intenend to eat 65% of calories from carbs Im pretty sure numbers wont add up

[Super Natural]

IMO these are the mistakes most guys make when trying to diet without Hormonas :

* Too much cardio (no more than once a day, with one day complete rest a week) - use the diet rather.

* Adding cardio and dropping calories at the same time - too big a deficit

* Getting too fat in the off season ( as a natural you should see your top 4 abs at minimum in the off season, preferably all 6)

* too much HIIT (No more than 2-3 a week) taxes legs too much drains CNS

* Too many days, too much time spent in the gym, too many sets and with high reps & light weight, chasing the pump. - 3-4 days max, 40 min, High intensity, low volume, heavy weight, compound moves mostly, no isolation moves.
Your recovery is compromised when dieting..it does not make any sense to add more than is needed. Only enough to signal to your body to hold on to it's muscle (maintain it) that is all u need.

* Not dieting long enough (16 weeks minimum) 25 weeks is better.

* Using t3 (bad move)

* Not getting enough sleep (at least 8 hours)

* Using a Keto diet less than 100g carbs a day (Not the best IMO)

* Too much protein, too low carb...carbs will spare more muscle than protein. As far as protein more than what you need is a mistake (3g per kg BW) better off using those Kcal from carbs.

* Not enough EFA

* No re-feeds / diet breaks

* Not staying hydrated -especially around workouts

* Cutting out salt.

* losing more than a pound a week

[Krankenstein]

IMO these are the mistakes most guys when trying to diet without Hormonas :

* Too much cardio (no more than once a day, with one day complete rest a week)

* Adding cardio and dropping calories (too big a deficit) at the same time.

* Getting too fat in the off season ( as a natural you should see your top 4 abs at minimum in the off season, preferably all 6)

I have said this for many years.  Guys who 'bulk' are so damn delusional that they gained a shit ton of size when in reality they just got fat

* too much HIIT (No more than 2-3 a week) taxes legs too much drains CNS

Just once I want someone to explain this whole 'CNS' drain/burn out/depletion bro-science to me. 

* Too many sets and with high reps, chasing the pump. - 3-4 days max, 40 min, High intensity, low volume, heavy weight, compound moves mostly, no isolation moves.

Dont really agree that you need heavy weight to diet.  Plenty of guys who like the higher rep stuff for legs and arms...and they looked phenomenal on stage

* Not dieting long enough (16 weeks minimum) 25 weeks is better.

Only needed if you get 'huge'  off season by bulking.  Stay leaner, and you will only need the 10 - 12

* Using t3 (bad move)

This contradicts your list title.  If you use T3, you ARE using hormones.

* Not getting enough sleep (at least 8 hours)

* Using a Keto diet less than 100g carbs a day (Not the best IMO)

Anyone that says they can go ketotic on less than 100gms of carbs is FOS. 

* Too much protein, too low carb...carbs will spare more muscle than protein. As far as protein more than what you need is a mistake (3g per kg BW) better off using those Kcal from carbs.

Carbs are overrated IMO.  We have essential fats, essential amino acids, do we have essential carbs?  Nope.  Use enough carbs to 'spare' muscle...thats it

* Not enough EFA

* No re-feeds / diet breaks

Spot on

* Not staying hydrated -especially around workouts

* Cutting out salt.

* losing more than a pound a week

[dj181]

IMO these are the mistakes most guys when trying to diet without Hormonas :

* Too much cardio (no more than once a day, with one day complete rest a week) - use the diet rather.

* Adding cardio and dropping calories at the same time - too big a deficit

* Getting too fat in the off season ( as a natural you should see your top 4 abs at minimum in the off season, preferably all 6)

* too much HIIT (No more than 2-3 a week) taxes legs too much drains CNS

* Too many days, too much time spent in the gym, too many sets and with high reps & light weight, chasing the pump. - 3-4 days max, 40 min, High intensity, low volume, heavy weight, compound moves mostly, no isolation moves.
Your recovery is compromised when dieting..it does not make any sense to add more than is needed. Only enough to signal to your body to hold on to it's muscle (maintain it) that is all u need.

* Not dieting long enough (16 weeks minimum) 25 weeks is better.

* Using t3 (bad move)

* Not getting enough sleep (at least 8 hours)

* Using a Keto diet less than 100g carbs a day (Not the best IMO)

* Too much protein, too low carb...carbs will spare more muscle than protein. As far as protein more than what you need is a mistake (3g per kg BW) better off using those Kcal from carbs.

* Not enough EFA

* No re-feeds / diet breaks

* Not staying hydrated -especially around workouts

* Cutting out salt.

* losing more than a pound a week

did you use ECA when you hit contest condition?