Dorian Yates - two pics - very good quality

[Immortal_Technique]

Not small at all moron.

Yates owning the competition in chest thickness:

I am English too butt-head, but your intelligence is low.

[OTHstrong]

Not even a question if Yates's back is better than Ronnie's. Other bodyparts I'm willing to believe, but no fucking way on the back.

Is Dorian's Bigger, maybe not, shape, maybe not,... but more seperated- definitely, Deeper lines-Definitely, Drier-definitly, so again it's apples and oranges.

[Mr.1derful]

Poor Neo not having much luck are you? every turn you make you're fucked kid  

NOT in my league kid

Call me crazy, but the back on the right looks worlds drier and more developed.   

[OTHstrong]

Call me crazy, but the back on the right looks worlds drier and more developed.   

Exactly, and that's only what you can see, now add glutes, hams and calfs,....LIGHTS OUT

[Figo]

Call me crazy, but the back on the right looks worlds drier and more developed.   

Yes it does

Plus yates had something called calves and very good hams

Ronnie wins on glutes (no homo)

[wild willie]

IMHO

Shawn Ray should have won at least two Sandows.....Maybe more.


Yates displayed tremendous size.....especially back, traps and calves.

But if you are looking to reward the most complete physique.....you have to give the trophy to Ray or Labrada or Paris or Benfatto. Just my 2 cents.

[RocketSwitch625]

IMHO

Shawn Ray should have won at least two Sandows.....Maybe more.


Yates displayed tremendous size.....especially back, traps and calves.

But if you are looking to reward the most complete physique.....you have to give the trophy to Ray or Labrada or Paris or Benfatto. Just my 2 cents.

By far the most complete. LOL

[RocketSwitch625]

To this day I still don't understand how Ray managed to place so high at the Olympia during the Shadow's reign. His conditioning was usually top notch but in terms of development he had nothing to shout about IMO.

[Mr.1derful]

IMHO

Shawn Ray should have won at least two Sandows.....Maybe more.


Yates displayed tremendous size.....especially back, traps and calves.

But if you are looking to reward the most complete physique.....you have to give the trophy to Ray or Labrada or Paris or Benfatto. Just my 2 cents.

Precisely which two Olympias, or more, should he have won then?  Ray was not by any means the most complete or balanced, but his flaws are often easily overlooked, being he had an "appealing" physique.  I would suggest that Ray received fitting placings.  He looked great alone, but was no match for Yates during any year.

[wild willie]

Precisely which two Olympias, or more, should he have won then?  Ray was not by any means the most complete or balanced, but his flaws are often easily overlooked, being he had an "appealing" physique.  I would suggest that Ray received fitting placings.  He looked great alone, but was no match for Yates during any year.

Get some new glasses.......Take a good look at Yates.....then take a good look at Shawn Ray......then tell me who is the more complete bodybuilder.

[Immortal_Technique]

Yeah sure it doesn't 

Well I guess you mean muscular size/SHAPE/density/dryness etc. All very important. Pure weight only indicates.....weight, it doesn't tell you how someone looks, how much water/fat they're carrying, how symmetrical they are or how how good they look. Otherwise by your strangely anti-iron-age example Ruhl is a better bodybuilder than Zane?!?!?!

[NarcissisticDeity]

Well I guess you mean muscular size/SHAPE/density/dryness etc. All very important. Pure weight only indicates.....weight, it doesn't tell you how someone looks, how much water/fat they're carrying, how symmetrical they are or how how good they look. Otherwise by your strangely anti-iron-age example Ruhl is a better bodybuilder than Zane?!?!?!

 your comment Weight means nothing, hope this helps which isn't accurate and now you're elaborating more on what you mean. Obviously weight alone means nothing and it's a combo of things ( which I've always maintained )

I would rather look like Zane but aren't under delusions he would beat Rhul in a contest

[NarcissisticDeity]

Get some new glasses.......Take a good look at Yates.....then take a good look at Shawn Ray......then tell me who is the more complete bodybuilder.

What do you mean by more complete?  what part does Shawn have that Dorian doesn't? 

[THEBOSS]

What do you mean by more complete?  what part does Shawn have that Dorian doesn't? 

  he has short legs and no calfs . long torso and he's narrow ? I suspect these are the things some of these guys think make a complete physique ? 

[Immortal_Technique]

your comment Weight means nothing, hope this helps which isn't accurate and now you're elaborating more on what you mean. Obviously weight alone means nothing and it's a combo of things ( which I've always maintained )

I would rather look like Zane but aren't under delusions he would beat Rhul in a contest

Hmm Greg Kovacs vs Flex Lewis ?

Paul Dillet vs Shawn Ray ?

Essentially weight does mean nothing, that's why an off-season Yates at 282lb isn't necessarily carrying much more MUSCLE than a 262lb Yates. 

UFC fighters lose about 20lb of water for weigh in, so fight at 20lb more than their weigh-in weight, that's the kind of weight variability we're talking about from one week to the next purely in water when someoneis dehydrated......so your endless comparisons of off-deason Yates with ONSTAGE Coleman are a pointless mis-use of weight-based statistics.

[Jaime]

Precisely which two Olympias, or more, should he have won then?  Ray was not by any means the most complete or balanced, but his flaws are often easily overlooked, being he had an "appealing" physique.  I would suggest that Ray received fitting placings.  He looked great alone, but was no match for Yates during any year.

94 and 97 and if it wasn't Ray it should have been someone not named Dorian

[NarcissisticDeity]

Hmm Greg Kovacs vs Flex Lewis ?

Paul Dillet vs Shawn Ray ?

Essentially weight does mean nothing, that's why an off-season Yates at 282lb isn't necessarily carrying much more MUSCLE than a 262lb Yates. 

UFC fighters lose about 20lb of water for weigh in, so fight at 20lb more than their weigh-in weight, that's the kind of weight variability we're talking about from one week to the next purely in water when someoneis dehydrated......so your endless comparisons of off-deason Yates with ONSTAGE Coleman are a pointless mis-use of weight-based statistics.

Hmm Greg Kovacs vs Flex Lewis ?

Paul Dillet vs Shawn Ray

Again like I said obviously weight ALONE means nothing , maybe you missed that.

Essentially weight does mean nothing, that's why an off-season Yates at 282lb isn't necessarily carrying much more MUSCLE than a 262lb Yates. 

You don't know that and like Yates said he was usually on contest ready conditioning six weeks out from a contest , therefore he was carrying more muscle , he's said multiple occasions he would continue to diet down in some vain hope of getting better conditioned and realized he wasn't getting more ripped he was just dieting away muscle

fact Dorian was carrying more muscle in 1993 precontest in the black & white photos than he was at the Olympia , he was 269lbs in the pics and 257lbs , Dorian if you look at his competition weights they increased almost every year

1990 228lbs
1991 239lbs
1992 242lbs
1993 257lbs
1994 262lbs
1995 260lbs
1996 257lbs
1997 266lbs

He realized his mistake and started to correct it , so yes it's very easy to assume he was carrying more muscle at higher bodyweights , obviously there is a point of diminishing returns but Kevin Horton photographed Dorian precontest mind you NOT off-season ( there is a big difference ) and said it was personally the best he ever seen Dorian and he was in really good condition at 283lbs , which is the pic of him he posted on bodybuilding.com of the front latspread

UFC fighters lose about 20lb of water for weigh in, so fight at 20lb more than their weigh-in weight, that's the kind of weight variability we're talking about from one week to the next purely in water when someoneis dehydrated......so your endless comparisons of off-deason Yates with ONSTAGE Coleman are a pointless mis-use of weight-based statistics.

the UFC analogy has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with competitive bodybuilding.

And again Dorian is not ' off-season ' he's precontest , big difference. And it's all a matter of conditioning and the weight , if two guys are both 250lbs one is bone dry and rock hard and the other isn't because he's carrying more water & sq fat who has more muscle?

Dorian Yates , Shawn Perine , Peter McGough , Kevin Horton have all said that Dorian in those black & white pics could have stepped on-stage like that and won the 1993 Olympia and that speaks volumes because almost everyone at the contest was in condition.

So comparing Ronnie ( or whomever ) to Dorian precontest you would be crazy to think a 22 pound weight advantage over a competitor wouldn't be a huge advantage ALONG with the rest of the criteria

This is what separates Ronnie from Dorian , Dorian could go higher in bodyweights without adversely  
effecting his conditioning as much , Ronnie went from a bone dry and rock hard 249lbs in 1998 to 257lbs in 1999 and his conditioning already suffered for it , the more weight Ronnie added the worse his conditioning became , he went to 264lbs in 2000 and same thing it was worse from 1999 , Ronnie looked his best lighter under 250lbs ( 2001 ASC ) Dorian actually looked his best higher at around 270lbs

[Immortal_Technique]

But .... in 6 attempts he never brought that look to a stage. How you appear onstage is crucial to winning a competition

You can't say with any certainty that in this one pic Dorian is the best physique ever, otherwise Dillet is the greatest physique ever. That's the whole thing about being onstage, the hams and glutes and lower back etc are exposed in a way that studio pics cannot show. Stage lighting is not flattering like gym or studio lighting.

I know you have quotes to prove me wrong, but I'm afraid, like weight, they mean dick. ALL that matters is how you look onstage.

[NarcissisticDeity]

But .... in 6 attempts he never brought that look to a stage. How you appear onstage is crucial to winning a competition

You can't say with any certainty that in this one pic Dorian is the best physique ever, otherwise Dillet is the greatest physique ever. That's the whole thing about being onstage, the hams and glutes and lower back etc are exposed in a way that studio pics cannot show. Stage lighting is not flattering like gym or studio lighting.

I know you have quotes to prove me wrong, but I'm afraid, like weight, they mean dick. ALL that matters is how you look onstage.

But .... in 6 attempts he never brought that look to a stage. How you appear onstage is crucial to winning a competition

Wrong , you insisted he attempted and failed not true and obviously how you appear on-stage is crucial to winning and he dominated on-stage , the whole point is he could have appeared on-stage like that and won

You can't say with any certainty that in this one pic Dorian is the best physique ever, otherwise Dillet is the greatest physique ever. That's the whole thing about being onstage, the hams and glutes and lower back etc are exposed in a way that studio pics cannot show. Stage lighting is not flattering like gym or studio lighting.

Actually I didn't say that one pic is the best physique ever , I said Kevin Horton said the best he ever seen Dorian was precontest 1995 where he took that pic from , he's seen Dorian throughout his entire career , that statement says a lot and Dillett is the greatest physique ever?  even precontest or offseason his back still sucked no escaping that

I know you have quotes to prove me wrong, but I'm afraid, like weight, they mean dick. ALL that matters is how you look onstage.

And Dorian appeared on-stage and how well did he do? to play your game Dorian 1993/1995 Olympia would beat any version of Ronnie for the same reasons I've always said.

[OTHstrong]

Get some new glasses.......Take a good look at Yates.....then take a good look at Shawn Ray......then tell me who is the more complete bodybuilder.

In terms of bodybuilding, Yates was cause size is big factor in being complete and this is how physiques are judged.

[NeoSeminole]

Dorian 1993/1995 Olympia would beat any version of Ronnie for the same reasons I've always said.

the same experts you argue said Dorian's best shape was 93/95 precontest also said it was the ONLY version of Dorian that could compete against a prime Ronnie. Every onstage version of Dorian would lose to him. You might want to cross-check your references next time you quote them

Peter McGough - Flex, August 2005

"Personally, the best physique I ever saw onstage (there was a contender for best-ever that I saw offstage: those crazy photos of sock-footed Dorian Yates taken seven weeks before the 1993 Mr. Olympia) was Ronnie's at the 2001 Arnold Schwarzenegger Classic. He was cut, full, trim in the waist and a monster (proving that when you're supersharp, you look superbig) at 244 pounds. Ronnie sporting that look would, in my opinion, be unbeatable."

Shawn Perine - Ironage, Dec 11, 2004

"As much as I love Haney and my IA champs, I think Ronnie circa '98 or at the 2001 Arnold is pretty much untouchable. Except by Dorian Yates 6 weeks out from the '93 O as photographed by our own KMH. Both men, on those specific occasions carried so much dry muscle mass in good proportion and with good lines that it's almost unfair to compare them to others."

[NarcissisticDeity]

the same experts you argue said Dorian's best shape was 93/95 precontest also said it was the ONLY version of Dorian that could compete against a prime Ronnie. Every onstage version of Dorian would lose to him. You might want to cross-check your references next time you quote them

Peter McGough - Flex, August 2005

"Personally, the best physique I ever saw onstage (there was a contender for best-ever that I saw offstage: those crazy photos of sock-footed Dorian Yates taken seven weeks before the 1993 Mr. Olympia) was Ronnie's at the 2001 Arnold Schwarzenegger Classic. He was cut, full, trim in the waist and a monster (proving that when you're supersharp, you look superbig) at 244 pounds. Ronnie sporting that look would, in my opinion, be unbeatable."

Shawn Perine - Ironage, Dec 11, 2004

"As much as I love Haney and my IA champs, I think Ronnie circa '98 or at the 2001 Arnold is pretty much untouchable. Except by Dorian Yates 6 weeks out from the '93 O as photographed by our own KMH. Both men, on those specific occasions carried so much dry muscle mass in good proportion and with good lines that it's almost unfair to compare them to others."

And? I don't need them to form my own opinion and they have theirs

How about contest records? they say a lot like Ronnie 1998 AT HIS BEST OLYMPIA just barely beat Flex by the skin of his teeth ( 3 points ) and Flex wasn't the same Flex Dorian dominated in 1993 either , but this is supposed to beat Dorian? 

Ronnie 1998 Mr Olympia does not stand a fucking chance in hell against Dorian 1993/1995 Mr Olympia , sorry sport ain't gonna happen and neither would 2001 ASC Ronnie either because he was the same as 98 except without butch-tits

At least you learned your lesson about post quotes in their entirety 

[NarcissisticDeity]

98/01

[King Shizzo]

your comment Weight means nothing, hope this helps which isn't accurate and now you're elaborating more on what you mean. Obviously weight alone means nothing and it's a combo of things ( which I've always maintained )

I would rather look like Zane but aren't under delusions he would beat Rhul in a contest

I would shoot myself in the face if Rhul actually won a contest against Zane.  Ruhl was all balloon.

[NarcissisticDeity]

I would shoot myself in the face if Rhul actually won a contest against Zane.  Ruhl was all balloon.

In this day and age he would win , if you agree with the facts or you don't, it doesn't change them