Author Topic: Holder Contempt vote any minute- found guilty by committee. going to house  (Read 1626 times)

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How will teh vote go?  What will the result be if he's found guilty? Removed from AG role?

Shockwave

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Re: Holder Contempt vote any minute
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2012, 01:02:36 PM »
He'll be found guilty, and nothing will happen. Just my bet.

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Holder Contempt vote any minute
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2012, 01:04:30 PM »
can anyone say what could happen?  I've read quite a few articles and none of them say what could be done after being found in contempt.

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Holder Contempt vote any minute
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2012, 01:09:36 PM »
found this :o

Inherent contempt
 
Under this process, the procedure for holding a person in contempt involves only the chamber concerned. Following a contempt citation, the person cited is arrested by the Sergeant-at-Arms for the House or Senate, brought to the floor of the chamber, held to answer charges by the presiding officer, and then subjected to punishment as the chamber may dictate (usually imprisonment for punishment reasons, imprisonment for coercive effect, or release from the contempt citation).

Concerned with the time-consuming nature of a contempt proceeding and the inability to extend punishment further than the session of the Congress concerned (under Supreme Court rulings), Congress created a statutory process in 1857. While Congress retains its "inherent contempt" authority and may exercise it at any time, this inherent contempt process was last used by the Senate in 1934, in a Senate investigation of airlines and the U.S. Postmaster. After a one-week trial on the Senate floor (presided over by the Vice-President of the United States, acting as Senate President), William P. MacCracken, a lawyer and former Assistant Secretary of Commerce for Aeronautics who had allowed clients to rip up subpoenaed documents, was found guilty and sentenced to 10 days imprisonment.[5]
 
MacCracken filed a petition of habeas corpus in federal courts to overturn his arrest, but after litigation, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that Congress had acted constitutionally, and denied the petition in the case Jurney v. MacCracken.[6][7]
 
Presidential pardons appear not to apply to a civil contempt procedure such as the above, since it is not an "offense against the United States" or against "the dignity of public authority."[8]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contempt_of_Congress

Soul Crusher

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Re: Holder Contempt vote any minute
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2012, 01:10:55 PM »
How will teh vote go?  What will the result be if he's found guilty? Removed from AG role?

180 - what did I say would happen w this over a year ago w Issa? 

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Holder Contempt vote any minute
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2012, 01:11:41 PM »
Rita Lavelle (Republican),
 EPA official
 
26 April 1983
 House Committee on Energy and Commerce
 
House of Representatives
 
Indicted for lying to Congress; convicted; sentenced to 6 months in prison, 5 years probation thereafter, and a fine of $10,000

Soul Crusher

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House panel votes to place Holder in contempt of Congress

www.thehill.com

By Jordy Yager - 06/20/12 04:21 PM ET





A House panel voted Wednesday to place Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress for his failure to comply with a subpoena, defying an assertion of executive privilege from President Obama.

The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, led by Republican Chairman Darrell Issa (Calif.), approved a resolution along party lines to place Holder in contempt after battling him for months over access to internal agency documents about the gun-tracking operation Fast and Furious.

The vote came shortly after Obama escalated the conflict by sending a letter to the committee claiming executive privilege over the documents that the panel had sought.

The resolution to place Holder in contempt will now move to the House floor. If Republican leaders opt to schedule it for a vote, it would require only a simple majority to pass.

Obama’s move to bring the Fast and Furious documents under executive privilege came just minutes before the panel began the contempt proceedings. In the letter announcing Obama’s decision, Deputy Attorney General James Cole argued DOJ has made “extraordinary efforts to accommodate the committee’s legitimate oversight interests.”

“The information provided to the Committee shows clearly that the Department leadership did not intend to mislead Congress in the February 4 letter or in any other statements concerning Fast and Furious,” Cole said in the letter.

Issa said the assertion of privilege by Obama fell short of any reason to delay the vote against Holder.

The high-stakes move against the attorney general came after talks to avoid the contempt vote fell apart Tuesday evening.

Holder attempted to exchange the requested documents for an agreement from Issa to drop his two subpoenas and the contempt measure. But the powerful Republican balked at anything short of a full document production while making no guarantees in return.

Issa wants documents that he says would show how much Justice knows about Fast and Furious, a controversial gun-tracking operation run by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF). Holder has insisted he did not know of the operation.

Obama has denied knowledge of Fast and Furious, but Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa), the ranking member of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said Obama's assertion of executive privilege raises "monumental questions" about whether the White House was involved in the authorization of or the fallout from the botched operation.

"How can the president assert executive privilege if there was no White House involvement? How can the president exert executive privilege over documents he's supposedly never seen?" Grassley said in a statement. "Is something very big being hidden to go to this extreme?"

A spokesman for Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) questioned whether Obama is “bending the law to hide the truth.”

"Until now, everyone believed that the decisions regarding Fast and Furious were confined to the Department of Justice,” Boehner spokesman Michael Steel said in a statement. “The White House decision to invoke executive privilege implies that White House officials were either involved in the Fast and Furious operation or the cover-up that followed. The administration has always insisted that wasn't the case. Were they lying, or are they now bending the law to hide the truth?”

Democrats on the oversight panel were indignant about Wednesday's vote. Rep. Ed Towns (D-N.Y.), a former chairman of the Oversight committee, ripped Issa for the way he has conducted the Fast and Furious investigation, calling it the “most ridiculous thing” he has seen in his years on the panel.

“I think this is a mistake, a major mistake,” Towns said. “It’s a discredit to this committee.”

The Congressional Tri-Caucus, meanwhile, condemned the move as “politics at its worst.” The caucus consists of nearly 80, mostly Democratic members of the Congressional Black Caucus (CBC), the Congressional Hispanic Caucus (CHC), and the Congressional Asian Pacific American Caucus.

“This is an extremely low moment in our body politic,” said Rep. Emanuel Cleaver (D-Ill.), the chairman of the CBC. “The cause for civility has been met by an unnecessary and unfortunate partisanship.”

The pressure on the Obama administration over Fast and Furious has been building for months.

Rep. Paul Gosar (R-Ariz.) garnered the support of 114 Republicans for a separate resolution that would express Congress’s lack of confidence in Holder and essentially call for him to step down because of how he has handled Fast and Furious.

Even with 242 Republicans in the House majority, it remains unclear whether the contempt measure would have the backing of the full caucus. Many GOP members have resisted action on the Fast and Furious issue out of a desire to keep the 2012 election focus on the economy and jobs.

In the past, the mere threat of contempt has been enough to compel the Justice Department to produce the documents requested by Congress, and the House has only voted on one contempt resolution in recent years. That resolution passed the Democratic-controlled House largely along party lines, but then-Attorney General Michael Mukasey, under President George W. Bush, refused to enforce the contempt measure against two senior White House officials, citing executive privilege.


 
If the measure against Holder passes the House, it would be sent to the U.S. Attorney for the District of Columbia, who would convene a grand jury that would decide whether to indict Holder. The U.S. Attorney’s office would be the designated prosecutor for the committee if Holder were to be indicted. The attorney general would face a maximum sentence of one year in prison if convicted by a jury.

Fast and Furious was an attempt by the Justice Department's Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) to track the flow of weapons from the United States into Mexico by drug cartels in hopes of dismantling their network.

Nearly 2,000 guns were sold in the United States to straw buyers for the cartels, but instead of tracking the weapons, ATF agents were ordered to let them go with the hope of rediscovering them later at a crime scene or drug bust.

The Department of Justice's inspector general, at the request of Holder, has been investigating Fast and Furious for more than a year. Issa has been conducting his own probe.

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Shockwave

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Perfect description.
Im surprised Obama tried to step in on this one. Makes things look a lot worse IMHO.

240 is Back

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Perfect description.
Im surprised Obama tried to step in on this one. Makes things look a lot worse IMHO.

unless he knew Holder on the stand would do a lot more damage than just this cover-up would.


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Hugo Chavez

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Perfect description.
Im surprised Obama tried to step in on this one. Makes things look a lot worse IMHO.
I think it pretty much says Obama is just as guilty.  so he opted for looking guilty rather than being proven guilty with the documents.

240 is Back

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I think it pretty much says Obama is just as guilty.  so he opted for looking guilty rather than being proven guilty with the documents.

right now, you can't prove to a soccer mom that obama or holder did anything wrong.

you can throw your CT at them.  You can try to make the case.

but if the documents came out, we'd know for sure.  he took the smaller hit, and earlier.  Issa can't drip this shit out til election day.

Soul Crusher

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right now, you can't prove to a soccer mom that obama or holder did anything wrong.

you can throw your CT at them.  You can try to make the case.

but if the documents came out, we'd know for sure.  he took the smaller hit, and earlier.  Issa can't drip this shit out til election day.

 ::)  ::)  ::)

HOLDER LIED TO THE CONGRESS AND SENT A FALSE LETTER TO THE CONGRESS 7 MONTHS AGO! 

Shockwave

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right now, you can't prove to a soccer mom that obama or holder did anything wrong.

you can throw your CT at them.  You can try to make the case.

but if the documents came out, we'd know for sure.  he took the smaller hit, and earlier.  Issa can't drip this shit out til election day.
This coming from the same guy that says that Zimmerman is guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt.
Way to be consistent there broseph.

240 is Back

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::)  ::)  ::)

HOLDER LIED TO THE CONGRESS AND SENT A FALSE LETTER TO THE CONGRESS 7 MONTHS AGO!  

yes he did.  But I'm trying to picture you arguing with an obama voter.  You evidence being some letter from the office of DOJ said something that doesn't jive with the official record.  She can defend that a million ways.

But you pwn her with a smoking gun document (obviously what obama just buried), and her sorry ass can't argue.

I mean, you can try to win an election on "holder sent a letter and it said something different from something he said once".  Good luck.

But you have a paper trail showing Holder/obama signing off on 2000 guns being handed to gangsters - now THAT changes elections.

240 is Back

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Zimmerman is guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt.


agreed.






MSNBCwawa/Romney editing of obama quoting mccain approved.

Hugo Chavez

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right now, you can't prove to a soccer mom that obama or holder did anything wrong.

you can throw your CT at them.  You can try to make the case.

but if the documents came out, we'd know for sure.  he took the smaller hit, and earlier.  Issa can't drip this shit out til election day.
He's trying to get the independent vote back, this isn't going to help him very much in that area.  Don't have to prove anything when he makes himself look this guilty.

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House Oversight Committee Just Charged Eric Holder With Contempt Of Congress
Grace Wyler|28 minutes ago|173|1




The House Oversight Committee has found Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress over his refusal to turn over documents related to the Fast and Furious gun-running scandal.
 
The 23-17 vote fell along party lines, and took place after hours of debate over Holder and his involvement in Operation Fast and Furious, an Arizona gunrunning operation in which U.S. agents allowed thousands of guns to "walk" across the Mexican border.
 
The vote comes on the same day that President Barack Obama asserted executive privilege over the Fast and Furious documents, a surprise move that conservatives say confirms their suspicions that the Obama administration is covering up its involvement in the botched gunrunning operation.  

House Oversight Chair Darrell Issa, who has been at the center of the Fast and Furious firestorm, announced Wednesday afternoon that the contempt resolution has now been sent to the full House of Representatives.
 
UPDATE, 4:40 p.m.: Almost immediately after the House Oversight vote, House Republican leadership have announced that the full House will vote next on whether to hold Holder in contempt.
 
Here's the joint statement from House Speaker John Boehner (R-OH) and House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-VA):
 
“Despite being given multiple opportunities to provide the documents necessary for Congress’ investigation into Fast and Furious, Attorney General Holder continues to stonewall.  Today, the Administration took the extraordinary step of exerting executive privilege over documents that the Attorney General had already agreed to provide to Congress.  Fast and Furious was a reckless operation that led to the death of an American border agent, and the American people deserve to know the facts to ensure that nothing like this ever happens again.  While we had hoped it would not come to this, unless the Attorney General reevaluates his choice and supplies the promised documents, the House will vote to hold him in contempt next week.  If, however, Attorney General Holder produces these documents prior to the scheduled vote, we will give the Oversight Committee an opportunity to review in hopes of resolving this issue.”
 
Here's everything you need to know about the scandal that could destroy Eric Holder >
 

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Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/eric-holder-contempt-of-congress-darrell-issa-house-oversight-2012-6#ixzz1yMx6WFLT






Obama/Holder going to jail. 

240 is Back

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He's trying to get the independent vote back, this isn't going to help him very much in that area.  Don't have to prove anything when he makes himself look this guilty.

he looks guilty in June.  

Better than Issa proving it in October.

by then, we'll have another economic crash, borders will be wide open, war with iran imminent, VP pick rubio stumbling in every interview...

Nobody is going to give a shit that 150 days ago, Obama classified a document that might be damaging.*




*and if they do, there is a 100% chance they weren't gonna vote obama already.

Soul Crusher

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he looks guilty in June.  

Better than Issa proving it in October.

by then, we'll have another economic crash, borders will be wide open, war with iran imminent, VP pick rubio stumbling in every interview...

Nobody is going to give a shit that 150 days ago, Obama classified a document that might be damaging.*




*and if they do, there is a 100% chance they weren't gonna vote obama already.


STFU really - do you ever do anything but troll and kneepad? 

This issue has been fomenting for a long time and no amount of obama cock sucking on your part is going to make people forget or ignore this. 

kcballer

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::)  ::)  ::)

HOLDER LIED TO THE CONGRESS AND SENT A FALSE LETTER TO THE CONGRESS 7 MONTHS AGO! 

I agree he should be not be able to get away with this. If his office is not answerable to the representatives of the US people, then democracy has failed.

However, the electorate is not exactly crazy on these issues. One need only look to Canada's recent election, their PM was found in contempt for withholding information and was voted in with a majority because of it.

It all depends on whether or not people understand the magnitude of the event. I'm guessing the American public, i.e. not on political boards, doesn't really care and just wants to find or keep work.
Abandon every hope...

Vince G, CSN MFT

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House Oversight Committee Just Charged Eric Holder With Contempt Of Congress
Grace Wyler|28 minutes ago|173|1




The House Oversight Committee has found Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress over his refusal to turn over documents related to the Fast and Furious gun-running scandal.
 
The 23-17 vote fell along party lines, and took place after hours of debate over Holder and his involvement in Operation Fast and Furious, an Arizona gunrunning operation in which U.S. agents allowed thousands of guns to "walk" across the Mexican border.
 
The vote comes on the same day that President Barack Obama asserted executive privilege over the Fast and Furious documents, a surprise move that conservatives say confirms their suspicions that the Obama administration is covering up its involvement in the botched gunrunning operation.  

House Oversight Chair Darrell Issa, who has been at the center of the Fast and Furious firestorm, announced Wednesday afternoon that the contempt resolution has now been sent to the full House of Representatives.
 
UPDATE, 4:40 p.m.: Almost immediately after the House Oversight vote, House Republican leadership have announced that the full House will vote next on whether to hold Holder in contempt.
 
Here's the joint statement from House Speaker John Boehner (R-OH) and House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-VA):
 
“Despite being given multiple opportunities to provide the documents necessary for Congress’ investigation into Fast and Furious, Attorney General Holder continues to stonewall.  Today, the Administration took the extraordinary step of exerting executive privilege over documents that the Attorney General had already agreed to provide to Congress.  Fast and Furious was a reckless operation that led to the death of an American border agent, and the American people deserve to know the facts to ensure that nothing like this ever happens again.  While we had hoped it would not come to this, unless the Attorney General reevaluates his choice and supplies the promised documents, the House will vote to hold him in contempt next week.  If, however, Attorney General Holder produces these documents prior to the scheduled vote, we will give the Oversight Committee an opportunity to review in hopes of resolving this issue.”
 
Here's everything you need to know about the scandal that could destroy Eric Holder >
 

Recommended For You


Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/eric-holder-contempt-of-congress-darrell-issa-house-oversight-2012-6#ixzz1yMx6WFLT






Obama/Holder going to jail. 



Nothing but politics.  Obama issued an executive order to keep those papers private with they should be....It ironic that they are demanding top secret documents while they are accusing the White House of leaking top secret documents.... ::)
A

Shockwave

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Nothing but politics.  Obama issued an executive order to keep those papers private with they should be....It ironic that they are demanding top secret documents while they are accusing the White House of leaking top secret documents.... ::)
Uh... wtf are you babbling about. Ever heard of checks and balances? Its there to prevent this kind of shit from happening.
Sometimes dude, I wonder if you even know what country you live in.