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Author Topic: Should have done 'Washington' or 'Jefferson', Lincoln Sucks...  (Read 1549 times)
Roger Bacon
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« on: November 16, 2012, 11:49:55 PM »

 Roll Eyes
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andreisdaman
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« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2012, 11:52:52 PM »

in what way?
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Roger Bacon
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« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2012, 11:57:46 PM »

in what way?

As far as Presidents go, I don't understand all the admiration over Lincoln the original neo conservative.  Lips sealed
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« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2012, 12:57:05 AM »

"the best policy is to have no policy".   Lincoln was a great man.   A pragmatist, a damn fine human being, and worthy of much praise.  That being said, slot of the hype surrounding him comes from the civil war and not from his person.  Also, the fact his children and wife died on him during his presidency if I recall correctly was also a big factor.  But if you read about his character. The rat he dealt with people. In particular that's where you can really develop admiration for him
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andreisdaman
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« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2012, 11:05:06 AM »

"the best policy is to have no policy".   Lincoln was a great man.   A pragmatist, a damn fine human being, and worthy of much praise.  That being said, slot of the hype surrounding him comes from the civil war and not from his person.  Also, the fact his children and wife died on him during his presidency if I recall correctly was also a big factor.  But if you read about his character. The rat he dealt with people. In particular that's where you can really develop admiration for him

I actually think Lincoln was an amazing president....adding to what you said above, can you imagine being president when half the U.S. wants to break away from the union and there is an armed rebellion going on?  imagine the in-fighting going on in congress and having to wage war against your own citizens?...then you have slavery going on as well.....it must have been the most difficult presidency ever....I also believed had he lived race relations would be better today because after he died, his predecessors did not have the committment that he did to civil rights for blacks
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magikusar
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« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2012, 03:07:46 PM »

how about reagan?
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« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2012, 09:17:51 PM »

I actually think Lincoln was an amazing president....adding to what you said above, can you imagine being president when half the U.S. wants to break away from the union and there is an armed rebellion going on?  imagine the in-fighting going on in congress and having to wage war against your own citizens?...then you have slavery going on as well.....it must have been the most difficult presidency ever....I also believed had he lived race relations would be better today because after he died, his predecessors did not have the committment that he did to civil rights for blacks
absolutely. also, the issue of financing the war was a terribly monumental task to address (basically the only revenues the government had at the time was from tarriffs and it was terribly insufficient to pay for a war which was costing millions per day)
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« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2012, 09:23:55 PM »

how about reagan?
Roll Eyes

What do you like more about him, the way he raised taxes or let terrorists dictate his foreign policy?

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« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2012, 10:07:29 PM »

how about reagan?
he certainly had his moments

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO2_49TycdE" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO2_49TycdE</a>

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The True Adonis
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« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2012, 09:53:56 PM »

"the best policy is to have no policy".   Lincoln was a great man.   A pragmatist, a damn fine human being, and worthy of much praise.  That being said, slot of the hype surrounding him comes from the civil war and not from his person.  Also, the fact his children and wife died on him during his presidency if I recall correctly was also a big factor.  But if you read about his character. The rat he dealt with people. In particular that's where you can really develop admiration for him

Uh, Mary died in 1882.  And Robert Todd died in 1926.
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« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2012, 03:27:03 AM »

Well I recall reading one or more of his kids died while he was in office and his wife either went crazy or died shortly after due to the grieving process
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magikusar
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« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2012, 08:04:52 AM »

As far as Presidents go, I don't understand all the admiration over Lincoln the original neo conservative.  Lips sealed

its some weird democrat thing, about worshipping centralization of power, and destroying staet power by letting feds run wild

ill never understand it

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andreisdaman
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« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2012, 08:07:22 AM »

its some weird democrat thing, about worshipping centralization of power, and destroying staet power by letting feds run wild

ill never understand it



uh huh....and the Republicans don't bring up Reagan in EVERY conversation.......talk about worship

I hate when guys like you come on here with bullshit....go to school....geez.......... ........
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« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2012, 01:27:05 PM »

Lincoln is also a vampire hunter, so that gives him street cred asnwell.
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« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2012, 01:39:54 PM »

uh huh....and the Republicans don't bring up Reagan in EVERY conversation.......talk about worship

I hate when guys like you come on here with bullshit....go to school....geez.......... ........

Can you see the hilarity in arguing about hero worship with a guy who has Ayn Rand as his profile pic.
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« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2012, 11:53:10 AM »

how about regan?  Grin

8 years peactime growth with low deficits by cutting taxes !!
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Roger Bacon
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« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2012, 02:11:23 PM »

its some weird democrat thing, about worshipping centralization of power, and destroying staet power by letting feds run wild

ill never understand it



This guy gets it
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« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2012, 11:54:52 AM »

A Jefferson movie could be very good, but in order to be compelling it would have to show both his intellect and his hypocrisy.  Jefferson thought slavery was a terrible evil and a stain upon the new nation.  He feared God's vengeance on America for the sin of slavery.  He wanted it to end (by sending the black population back to Africa), but he also recognized that slaves (including his own) represented much of the individual wealth in America.  A healthy young slave was worth about $130k in today's dollars.  Now, imagine owning dozens or hundreds of slaves!  That's a lot of capital!  Jefferson was not prepared to give that up and he knew his peers weren't in the mood for that either.  Similarly, Jefferson, liked the taste of black booty and indulged his appetite regularly.  As recently as the 1990s DNA tests confirmed that Jefferson's (white) descendants share the same paternity as Sally Hemings' descendants.  The story of Jefferson fathering six children with Sally Hemmings was told for generations on the black side of the family, but Jefferson's descendants denied it for nearly 200 years--until the DNA tests were performed and confirmed that Jefferson is the father of both lines (black and white) of offspring.

Remember Senator Strom Thurmond, the 100 year old racist senator from South Carolina?  Six months after he died on 2003 it was revealed that he had fathered a black daughter with one of his family's maids.  At the time, the maid was 16; Thurmond was 22.  Thurmond took the secret to his grave.  His daughter was in her 70's when she finally told the secret at the urging of her children and grandchildren. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strom_Thurmond#Illegitimate_daughter

Yeah.  Jefferson was like that. Lips sealed

There is a movie there for sure!
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Roger Bacon
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« Reply #18 on: December 04, 2012, 01:06:52 PM »

A Jefferson movie could be very good, but in order to be compelling it would have to show both his intellect and his hypocrisy.  Jefferson thought slavery was a terrible evil and a stain upon the new nation.  He feared God's vengeance on America for the sin of slavery.  He wanted it to end (by sending the black population back to Africa), but he also recognized that slaves (including his own) represented much of the individual wealth in America.  A healthy young slave was worth about $130k in today's dollars.  Now, imagine owning dozens or hundreds of slaves!  That's a lot of capital!  Jefferson was not prepared to give that up and he knew his peers weren't in the mood for that either.  Similarly, Jefferson, like the taste of black booty and indulged his appetite regularly.  As recently as the 1990s DNA tests confirmed that Jefferson's (white) descendants share the same paternity as Sally Hemings' descendants.  The story of Jefferson fathering six children with Sally Hemmings was told for generations on the black side of the family, but Jefferson's descendants denied it for nearly 200 years--until the DNA tests were performed and confirmed that Jefferson is the father of both lines (black and white) of offspring.

Remember Senator Strom Thurmond, the 100 year old racist senator from South Carolina?  Six months after he died ion 2003 it was revealed that he had fathered a black daughter with one of his family's maids.  At the time, the maid was 16; Thurmond was 22.  Thurmond took the secret to his grave.  His daughter was in her 70's when she finally told the secret at the urging of her children and grandchildren. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strom_Thurmond#Illegitimate_daughter

Yeah.  Jefferson was like that. Lips sealed

There is a movie there for sure!

You're first post that doesn't include any straight bashing, or accusations that we're all homosexual!  I'm very proud of you, you're maturing.
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Jadeveon Clowney
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« Reply #19 on: December 04, 2012, 01:09:32 PM »

sally hemmings was reportedly hot - they could incorporate some good T&A into the narrative - resulting controversy would put asses in seats.
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« Reply #20 on: December 04, 2012, 02:33:10 PM »

You're first post that doesn't include any straight bashing, or accusations that we're all homosexual!  I'm very proud of you, you're maturing.

 Cheesy
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« Reply #21 on: December 04, 2012, 08:49:46 PM »

You're first post that doesn't include any straight bashing, or accusations that we're all homosexual!  I'm very proud of you, you're maturing.

And yet you are having queer thoughts. Congratulations: you are a fag!  Kiss
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Roger Bacon
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« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2012, 09:08:29 PM »

And yet you are having queer thoughts. Congratulations: you are a fag!  Kiss

Thank goodness, I was afraid you hit your head or something!  Kiss
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« Reply #23 on: December 05, 2012, 08:52:32 AM »

A Jefferson movie could be very good, but in order to be compelling it would have to show both his intellect and his hypocrisy.  Jefferson thought slavery was a terrible evil and a stain upon the new nation.  He feared God's vengeance on America for the sin of slavery.  He wanted it to end (by sending the black population back to Africa), but he also recognized that slaves (including his own) represented much of the individual wealth in America.  A healthy young slave was worth about $130k in today's dollars.  Now, imagine owning dozens or hundreds of slaves!  That's a lot of capital!  Jefferson was not prepared to give that up and he knew his peers weren't in the mood for that either.  Similarly, Jefferson, liked the taste of black booty and indulged his appetite regularly.  As recently as the 1990s DNA tests confirmed that Jefferson's (white) descendants share the same paternity as Sally Hemings' descendants.  The story of Jefferson fathering six children with Sally Hemmings was told for generations on the black side of the family, but Jefferson's descendants denied it for nearly 200 years--until the DNA tests were performed and confirmed that Jefferson is the father of both lines (black and white) of offspring.

Remember Senator Strom Thurmond, the 100 year old racist senator from South Carolina?  Six months after he died on 2003 it was revealed that he had fathered a black daughter with one of his family's maids.  At the time, the maid was 16; Thurmond was 22.  Thurmond took the secret to his grave.  His daughter was in her 70's when she finally told the secret at the urging of her children and grandchildren. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strom_Thurmond#Illegitimate_daughter

Yeah.  Jefferson was like that. Lips sealed

There is a movie there for sure!

Jefferson would be a tough movie to make.  He was such a rabid racist that it would overshadow almost anything positive he ever did, and make it very difficult to make him sympathetic to audiences.  Here are a few of Jefferson's personal thoughts on blacks.  I included the source of these quotes I read from a recent article in the New York times.

Jefferson claimed he had “never seen an elementary trait of painting or sculpture” or poetry among blacks and argued that blacks’ ability to “reason” was “much inferior” to whites’, while “in imagination they are dull, tasteless, and anomalous.” He conceded that blacks were brave, but this was because of “a want of fore-thought, which prevents their seeing a danger till it be present.”



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/01/opinion/the-real-thomas-jefferson.html?_r=2&
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« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2012, 11:23:58 AM »

Roll Eyes
he was a great wrestler and vampire slayer, worthy of all getbiggers admiration. Grin
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