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Author Topic: Palestine is now a recognized state!!!  (Read 3344 times)
Tito24
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« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2012, 06:33:56 AM »

how about the extremist jews. you dont want to know what kind of pieces of shit live in israel.
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mass243
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« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2012, 06:42:30 AM »


That's right.


There is actually a "Medvedev-street" somewhere in Palestine, named after former Russian President Dmitry Medvedev.
In honor to Russian efforts through the years to up the living possibilities of people in the area !! Pretty nice from their part.


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« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2012, 06:59:14 AM »


put your self in the shoes of a paletinion, would you react any differntly?


the whole world except isreal and parts of usa see's this in palestines favour

It's a paper win - no change at all.
The people living in this area/s are used on a larger scale for political leverage.
The whole "world" is quite different from what you might want it to be - how can countries who violate their own people make judgment on how others mistreat a bunch of people lost in the desert? But as a good Collectivist - if all say the wrong thing then it makes it right.
The United Nations have long lost any credibility as they have become corrupted by various member states of dubious origin.
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« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2012, 07:28:27 AM »

how about the extremist jews. you dont want to know what kind of pieces of shit live in israel.
true. shitheads on both sides. that's why that war will never end.

unless Israel wipe out the Palestines completly which is a possible scenario.
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Tito24
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« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2012, 07:46:01 AM »

theres so much hatred on both sides. it would have been much better had they settled in madagascar all together , the jews.
 religion is the cancer of the world.
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mass243
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« Reply #30 on: November 30, 2012, 07:55:35 AM »


The United Nations have long lost any credibility as they have become corrupted by various member states of dubious origin.


Although there's no doubt the biggest blackmailer and on the other hand briber is none other than USA.
Ridiculous to think they're playing with clean cards.  

After all, I think it's good to have an international arena where small voices are heard as well.
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« Reply #31 on: November 30, 2012, 08:17:50 AM »

theres so much hatred on both sides. it would have been much better had they settled in madagascar all together , the jews.
 religion is the cancer of the world.

No shit, nice warm weather and beaches, just like Florida. Cheesy
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GigantorX
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« Reply #32 on: November 30, 2012, 08:49:23 AM »

So now that they are a state will they be subjected to the same laws and such that cover terror attacks, rocket strikes etc?
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« Reply #33 on: November 30, 2012, 09:06:11 AM »

The decline of U.S political influence in the world continues.
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« Reply #34 on: November 30, 2012, 09:11:15 AM »

Sweet, so now the fighting is over? Good job UN! Everyone has changed, peace has come to them at last!  Grin
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« Reply #35 on: November 30, 2012, 09:13:32 AM »

The decline of U.S political influence in the world continues.

We have an Afro-Marxist Islamist Supremecist as POTUS.   All of Americans' worst enemies know its now or never to get all of their dreams fulfilled w such incompetent idealogically driven neo-jihadis in high office.   
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« Reply #36 on: November 30, 2012, 09:28:52 AM »

We have an Afro-Marxist Islamist Supremecist as POTUS.   All of Americans' worst enemies know its now or never to get all of their dreams fulfilled w such incompetent idealogically driven neo-jihadis in high office.   

Yes because Obama has really been weak on terrorists.

Seriously have you ever been right on anything in your life?
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« Reply #37 on: November 30, 2012, 09:52:25 AM »

so now a ahmed can stfu
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« Reply #38 on: November 30, 2012, 09:55:34 AM »

btw its just "observatory statehood" thats granted.

whats the limitation on that?

Paper tiger.
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« Reply #39 on: November 30, 2012, 11:45:07 AM »

Quote
Palestine: Why UN recognition matters
by Randa Abdel-Fattah
Source: abc.net.au



Two-state, one-state, “peace process,” “path to peace” – whatever words one chooses to use, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is about one very simple thing: dispossession. It is about a population of newcomers taking the land, homes and possessions of the indigenous Palestinian people and expelling them. That is the essence of the conflict.

It was the essence of the problem in 1917 when the British presumed the right to give away what it did not possess and promised the Jews a homeland in the British Empire, ignoring the majority Palestinian population in the land. It was the essence of the problem when Israel unilaterally declared a state on 78% of the land in May 1948. It was the essence of the problem when Israel occupied the remaining 22% of the land in 1967. And it remains the essence of the problem today.

Despite countless United Nations resolutions, and in the face of the weight of international law, Israel and her allies – including Australia – continue to see the conflict quite differently. The starting point is not dispossession, but Israel’s so-called “right to exist.”

It is important to understand these two paradigms if we are to make any sense of the way forward. It also means we can put the Palestinian National Authority’s (PNA) bid to seek non-member observer state status for Palestine in the United Nations General Assembly into its proper context.

The two-state solution on the basis of Palestine’s pre-1967 borders is a compromise solution for Palestinians. And judging by the way it is lauded by Israel and Western leaders, it is the ideal solution – and a magnanimous one, at that. For Palestinians who accept such a state, however, it is a pragmatic solution that says: we accept that we have lost. Despite Israel having had no moral or legal legitimacy in expelling, depopulating and colonizing our majority population some sixty-four years ago, we will be pragmatic and compromise by accepting a return of a mere 22% of our historic homeland.

And yet even this modest compromise evades Palestinians, not, as Israel would have the world believe, because the Palestinians are incapable of negotiating and making peace, but because Israel is simply not interested in a two-state solution. Israel and her allies’ opposition to the PNA’s bid for non-member observer status is not because of any fear that this will lead to an independent Palestine state. Nobody honestly believes such a status represents anything more than a symbolic gesture of support.

Indeed, in an interview on ABC Radio National Breakfast yesterday, Peter Wertheim, Director of the Executive Council of Australian Jewry, said that an upgrade to observer state status would “harm the cause of peace by raising and then dashing expectations.” Presenter Fran Kelly then asked, “So it will harm the cause of peace because Palestinians in your view would get their hopes up that there is going to be a move towards recognition of a two state solution but that’s not going to happen?” Wertheim responded, “Precisely because nothing will actually change on the ground.” I couldn’t have put it better myself.

So, beyond the symbolism, what is all the fuss about? The fear lies in the fact that observer state status would potentially allow the PNA to take legal action in the International Criminal Court (ICC) against Israel and Israeli citizens for alleged war crimes, or for settlement building in the West Bank, including East Jerusalem. It is a fear so potent that Britain has made its support of the UN bid conditional on Mahmoud Abbas refraining from trying to join the ICC. While France is voting in favour of the PNA’s resolution, it has been pressuring the Palestinians to amend the resolution and make it clear that it will not take Israel to the ICC for any alleged war crimes committed retrospectively.

And this brings us to the heart of the issue. Israel and her allies know that a two-state solution is not on the horizon and that this resolution will have no impact on the ground. Their opposition is based on something more insidious. It is about continuing to allow a situation where Israel can enjoy immunity to legal accountability.

On 25 March 2001, then Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon was quoted by BBC News as saying: “Israel may have the right to put others on trial, but certainly no one has the right to put the Jewish people and the State of Israel on trial.” It is precisely this culture of impunity that Israel and her allies, including Australia’s Liberal Party and Prime Minister Julia Gillard – who was only forced to “abstain” because of political pressure – seeks to protect.

The fact is that the two-state solution is dead. Israel knows it. The United States knows it. And it is an illusion to think that our own government doesn’t know it. While the Labour government should be commended for pressuring Julia Gillard to agree to Australia abstaining, rather than opposing, a vote on the Palestinian observer status resolution, abstention does not quite get Australia on the “right side of history.” It is as if, as Ghassan Hage has put it, “Palestinians can now say: ‘Not that long ago, the Australian government didn’t believe we were human beings. Today they admit that they’re not so sure’.”

So, while a shift from a “No” vote to an abstention is an improvement on the tired, old policy of blind support for Israel, it is still only a modest victory. I fear we are still far from a genuine commitment to a viable two-state solution. For even a “Yes” vote, in the absence of real pressure applied on Israel to respect international law and make viable what it renders unviable with each passing day, is little more than a symbolic gesture.

The facts on the ground in the occupied territories and Jerusalem make a mockery of the call for a state based on the 1967 borders. The more the sloganeering about the “peace process” and “negotiations” (which the Palestine Papers clearly showed were a charade), the more attention is diverted from the expanding settlements, the seven-hundred kilometer long annexation wall, the Judaisation of Jerusalem, the land grabs and confinement of Palestinians into tightly controlled cities, the monopoly and control Israel exercises over the West Bank’s natural resources – including, most importantly, water – the complete dependency of the Palestinian economy on Israel, the blockade on Gaza, and so on.

While many Palestinians support the PNA’s UN resolution because of its symbolic weight and the potential to seek justice in the ICC, we cannot lose sight of the bigger and more important questions:

Will we accept the crumbs Israel leaves to us as a “state” and celebrate this as some sort of two-state solution?
Is there a possibility that the PNA, not holding the mandate of the Palestinian people, will accept a truncated “state” of Bantustans – a reinvention of the occupation with Palestinian rulers looking like they’re in charge?
Will governments use symbolic recognition of a Palestinian “state” to evade their responsibilities and ignore the elephants in the room: occupation, dispossession, settlements and the right of return of refugees?
Is the PNA’s UN bid a cynical ploy to maintain its power while burying the rights of Palestinian refugees, who continue to remain invisible in “peace” talks?
These are the questions that need to be asked. But these questions can only be asked if the starting point is an understanding that this conflict is and always has been about dispossession. That’s what it was about over sixty-four years ago. And that’s what it’s still about today.

Randa Abdel-Fattah is the award-winning author of eight novels. She practiced as a lawyer for ten years, and is now completing a PhD in the Department of Sociology at Macquarie University. You can watch her in conversation on ABC News 24 on the Gaza crisis.
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« Reply #40 on: November 30, 2012, 11:56:39 AM »

Good for them.

Now you just watch peace break out everywhere.


^^^^^^^
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #41 on: November 30, 2012, 11:56:44 AM »

Scum:

Quote
Israel to build 3,000 settler homes after UN vote


The Palestinians have said settlement building must cease before peace talks

Israel has authorised the construction of 3,000 more housing units in occupied East Jerusalem and the West Bank, according to Israeli officials.

It is also speeding up the processing of 1,000 planning permissions.

The Palestinian Authority has said it will not return to peace talks without a freeze in settlement building.

The decision comes a day after a vote at the UN General Assembly upgraded the Palestinians' status at the UN to that of non-member observer state.

According to the Israeli Haaretz newspaper, some of the new units will be between Jerusalem and the settlement of Maale Adumim.

Plans to build settlements in the area, known as E1, are strongly opposed by Palestinians, who say the development will cut the West Bank in two, preventing the creation of a contiguous Palestinian state

The move is a first indication of Israeli anger, less than 24 hours after the vote on Palestinian status was held at the UN, the BBC's Kevin Connolly in Jerusalem reports.

The Palestinians may well have been expecting this - or something like it - but it is a reminder that the gulf between the two on the settlement issue remains huge, our correspondent adds.

Earlier this month, a paper by the Israeli foreign ministry described the Palestinians' pushing for the vote as "crossing a red line that will require the harshest Israeli response".

About 500,000 Jews live in more than 100 settlements built since the occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem. The settlements are considered illegal under international law, though Israel disputes this.

'Political theatre'

Earlier on Friday, Israeli government spokesman Mark Regev said the UN vote was "negative political theatre" that would "hurt peace".

The General Assembly voted by 138-9 to recognise the Palestinians as a non-member observer state, with 41 states abstaining.

The Palestinians can now take part in UN debates and potentially join bodies like the International Criminal Court (ICC).

Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas said it was the "last chance to save the two-state solution" with Israel.

Two decades of on-off negotiations between Israel and the Palestinian Authority (PA) in the West Bank have failed to produce a permanent settlement, with the latest round of direct negotiations breaking down in 2010.

In January, several months of indirect "proximity talks" ended without any progress.

Palestinian negotiators insist that the building of Jewish settlements on occupied land must stop before they agree to resume direct talks.

Their Israeli counterparts say there can be no preconditions.

Mr Abbas was much criticised by many Palestinians for remaining on the sidelines of the conflict between the militant Hamas movement and Israel earlier this month in Gaza.





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« Reply #42 on: November 30, 2012, 01:53:30 PM »

Does this mean the UN recognizes Hamas as a legitimate government?  The same group the U.S. and others deem terrorists? 
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« Reply #43 on: November 30, 2012, 03:16:21 PM »

Hamas IS the government of Palestine and has been for several several years. The US and Israel may hate it but it's reality.

Oh boohoo they hve a 'military wing'. So does the US, so does Israel. What Palestinians can't have an army? lol.

They build schools, hospitals, roads, police the areas, etc... etc... they all struggle in the onslaught from Israel but they are struggling to live normal lives like anyone else.

Anytime the US or israel don't like someone despite them being elected, they want to undermine, demonize, kill, maim, etc... until the people are presured to give up or forced to accept a puppet imposed by US or Israel.
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« Reply #44 on: November 30, 2012, 03:19:19 PM »

Hamas IS the government of Palestine and has been for several several years. The US and Israel may hate it but it's reality.

Oh boohoo they hve a 'military wing'. So does the US, so does Israel. What Palestinians can't have an army? lol.

They build schools, hospitals, roads, police the areas, etc... etc... they all struggle in the onslaught from Israel but they are struggling to live normal lives like anyone else.

Anytime the US or israel don't like someone despite them being elected, they want to undermine, demonize, kill, maim, etc... until the people are presured to give up or forced to accept a puppet imposed by US or Israel.
So.. the next time a rocket enters Israel it's a legit military action from a neighbor and Israel gets to fuck them up? Sounds good.
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #45 on: November 30, 2012, 03:22:28 PM »

The difference is Hamas retaliates on Israeli aggression. Israel is the aggressor.

Israel claims to have the most advanced weapons and 'precision weapons' yet more than 50% of casualties are children and women.

Palestinians have nothing but rocks and fireworks, they retaliate how Israel targets their civillians.

I don't agree with killing of civillians in either case, however putting myself in their shoes I understand their desperation.

Israel is a cynical beast and it treats non-jews as less than animals. Straight out of the horse's mouth, their politicians talk like that all the time.
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« Reply #46 on: November 30, 2012, 03:25:45 PM »

The difference is Hamas retaliates on Israeli aggression. Israel is the aggressor.

Israel claims to have the most advanced weapons and 'precision weapons' yet more than 50% of casualties are children and women.

Palestinians have nothing but rocks and fireworks, they retaliate how Israel targets their civillians.

I don't agree with killing of civillians in either case, however putting myself in their shoes I understand their desperation.

Israel is a cynical beast and it treats non-jews as less than animals. Straight out of the horse's mouth, their politicians talk like that all the time.
You didn't answer the question. Just more rhetoric.
The next time a rocket fired from Palestine enters Israel, it will be considered a legitimate military action, yes? And therefore Israel will be able to respond with full military force. Sounds good to me.
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #47 on: November 30, 2012, 03:29:58 PM »

Israel is a useless turd who doesn't give a fuck about honor, about dignity, about respect, about life, about holding truces, about agreements, about peace or anything to do with any form of law, international or otherwise.

Israel is full of shit.

Whining and bitching about Hamas all day long, but then being a murderous scumbag that kills thousands of women and children.

Out of all the 'rockets' fired by Palestinians. Only 26 Israelis have been killed. EVER.

From all the 'precision' weaponery that Israel employes. Tens of thousands of Palestinians have been killed. Then we have the non weapons based war, where children are literally jailed, beaten, tortured by Israelis.

Fuck Israhell.

Just now they are stealing more land and plan to build 3000 more settlements.

Same story over and over again, you have to be dumb as fuck to not realize what's really going on. They are the ultimate evil in the region and that's that.

I remember since 97 all the 'settlement expansions'. There is no real 'peace talks' with Israel, they do not want peace. Negotiations are just for fun to ridicule palestinians and buy time. Every single time they kill more, steal more, that's it.

Israel is also the very country that supplied the 'intel' for the invasion of Iraq. No weapons of mass destructon there huh.

People who have been observing the conflict for the last few decades know this.

Israeli politiicans were just talking about 'returning to the table and holding onto oslo accords' WHAT oslo accords? Israel does not follow or obey ANYTHING agreed upon in the Oslo accords.

It's pure evil and pure cynicism at it's finest.

Now that Palestine has been upgraded in the UN, the next step is the ICC. International criminal court. Then Israel will be put in it's place and be judged for the war criminal that it is.
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« Reply #48 on: November 30, 2012, 03:48:07 PM »

You're ranting but not answering the question.

If a rocket is fired into Israel, it is now considered a legitimate military action, yes? Therefore, Israel can and will retaliate with full military force, correct?
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« Reply #49 on: November 30, 2012, 04:02:52 PM »

You're ranting but not answering the question.

If a rocket is fired into Israel, it is now considered a legitimate military action, yes? Therefore, Israel can and will retaliate with full military force, correct?

theoretically yes.  And vice versa as well.  That's the real reason Isreal was against it.
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