Is Tom Brady The Best Football Player Ever?

[snx]

.this.  and it's just as much as a product of NE's system as anything else. I've said this before...I've never see someone as much as i see Brady, standing tall and hitting a WIDE OPEN receiver in stride that gets 40 yards on a ball that traveled 11 yards through the air. it's uncanny. And it's a "perfect storm" like someone else said..perfect QB for The perfect Coach in the perfect system.  if Manning is the QB i personally think he butts heads with coaches and the results aren't the same, ,and i'll say it now...he will never see another Super Bowl, this year was his best chance and HE blew it

Why Groink?

That's a young aggressive and strong performing defense. One of the league's best.

His receiver crew doesn't have a legit all-pro on it, so you can sub in receivers if some are lost to free agency, and I don't think you'll see a drop-off in production.

If they can keep an O-line together for the season, I think they can repeat as division champs and take another shot at the lombardi. They'll get mcgahee back too, which will help.

As we've seen, anyone can knock off anyone in the playoffs.

Baltimore finally fields a healthy defense, and they beat the Broncos who were supposed to walk over them.

Not many people gave Wilson and the Hawks a chance against the Falcons. They just about won that game.

I think Manning has another 2-3 years left to run his team into the playoffs. And except for the Texans and the Patriots (if Brady doesn't get hurt), I don't see another AFC powerhouse team getting ready to challenge them.

[Shockwave]

Why Groink?

That's a young aggressive and strong performing defense. One of the league's best.

His receiver crew doesn't have a legit all-pro on it, so you can sub in receivers if some are lost to free agency, and I don't think you'll see a drop-off in production.

If they can keep an O-line together for the season, I think they can repeat as division champs and take another shot at the lombardi. They'll get mcgahee back too, which will help.

As we've seen, anyone can knock off anyone in the playoffs.

Baltimore finally fields a healthy defense, and they beat the Broncos who were supposed to walk over them.

Not many people gave Wilson and the Hawks a chance against the Falcons. They just about won that game.

I think Manning has another 2-3 years left to run his team into the playoffs. And except for the Texans and the Patriots (if Brady doesn't get hurt), I don't see another AFC powerhouse team getting ready to challenge them.

I think Wilson has finally proven that he's fucking legit. No one gave him a chance because he's short. Lol.

[tu_holmes]

I think Wilson has finally proven that he's fucking legit. No one gave him a chance because he's short. Lol.

I never understood the "height" thing... Here's a short guy who was great in HS... Great in college, and all of a sudden his height is an issue?

Doug Flutiie wasn't tall (5'10"), neither is Drew Brees (6'0"). But with Wilson, being short is a problem? He's 5'11".

Just seems to be much ado about nothing.

[Shockwave]

I never understood the "height" thing... Here's a short guy who was great in HS... Great in college, and all of a sudden his height is an issue?

Doug Flutiie wasn't tall (5'10"), neither is Drew Brees (6'0"). But with Wilson, being short is a problem? He's 5'11".

Just seems to be much ado about nothing.

People get so caught up in numbers anymore.. There is a stat for everything, and half the time it doesn't equate to them being able to play for shit. Just another way for people to bench-race with football I suppose.

[snx]

I think Wilson has finally proven that he's fucking legit. No one gave him a chance because he's short. Lol.

He's rookie of the year if my vote counted for anything, which it doesn't.

[Shockwave]

He's rookie of the year if my vote counted for anything, which it doesn't.

Me too, although I'm just a tad biased. 

[tu_holmes]

He's rookie of the year if my vote counted for anything, which it doesn't.

No doubt... Definitely so.

Rookie and won a playoff game... Almost won a 2nd.

Kid is legit.

[Palpatine Q]

Why Groink?

That's a young aggressive and strong performing defense. One of the league's best.

His receiver crew doesn't have a legit all-pro on it, so you can sub in receivers if some are lost to free agency, and I don't think you'll see a drop-off in production.

If they can keep an O-line together for the season, I think they can repeat as division champs and take another shot at the lombardi. They'll get mcgahee back too, which will help.

As we've seen, anyone can knock off anyone in the playoffs.

Baltimore finally fields a healthy defense, and they beat the Broncos who were supposed to walk over them.

Not many people gave Wilson and the Hawks a chance against the Falcons. They just about won that game.

I think Manning has another 2-3 years left to run his team into the playoffs. And except for the Texans and the Patriots (if Brady doesn't get hurt), I don't see another AFC powerhouse team getting ready to challenge them.

Injuries,free agency, parity...the fickle nature of the league...it's not easy to get to the Super Bowl and he's on the tail end of his career, he's been to two of them in what 18 years, and history has shown that he is a guy who fucks up in the BIG game at a crucial moment. he thinks he can do too much and presses.

That was an ill advised pass that he never should have thrown, it wasn't a great play by a DB. he was scrambling to his right and tried to throw across his body to the other side of the field into heavy traffic to a guy that was covered . For a guy that is regarded as the ultimate QB with an unsurpassed football IQ, who can pick apart defenses at will, he has done that more than a few times

I mean...not all the time, he's one of the best ever, but he's got that karma of throwing the rare bad pass and he pays the ultimate price for it

[Shockwave]

Injuries,free agency, parity...the fickle nature of the league...it's not easy to get to the Super Bowl and he's on the tail end of his career, he's been to two of them in what 18 years, and history has shown that he is a guy who fucks up in the BIG game at a crucial moment. he thinks he can do too much and presses.

That was an ill advised pass that he never should have thrown, it wasn't a great play by a DB. he was scrambling to his right and tried to throw across his body to the other side of the field into heavy traffic to a guy that was covered . For a guy that is regarded as the ultimate QB with an unsurpassed football IQ, who can pick apart defenses at will, he has done that more than a few times

I mean...not all the time, he's one of the best ever, but he's got that karma of throwing the rare bad pass and he pays the ultimate price for it

For whatever reason, Peyton is the master of the choke in the post-season.

Dude is the fucking greatest during the regular year... But it's always the same story in the post season. I remember those years when it was a Peyton/Brady showdown in the Division playoffs, and Brady always seemed to have his number.

Dude will probably go down as the greatest QB ever... But man is he ever inconsistent when it counts.

[Palpatine Q]

For whatever reason, Peyton is the master of the choke in the post-season.

Dude is the fucking greatest during the regular year... But it's always the same story in the post season. I remember those years when it was a Peyton/Brady showdown in the Division playoffs, and Brady always seemed to have his number.

Dude will probably go down as the greatest QB ever... But man is he ever inconsistent when it counts.

I don't want to get all Dorian Yates and talk about Karma...but if Tom Brady throws the same ball,in the same exact situation... the receiver catches it, or the DB almost comes up with it and the announcers talk about how he dodged a major bullet. Peyton takes it directly up the ass every time for some reason.

[JBGRAY]

The heydays of Marino, Montana, Elway, Young, Kelly, and Kosar had them going up against defenses that were allowed to do bump and runs and hitting receivers............and the rules were nowhere near as prevalent today when it came to protecting the quarterback.  It gets even more lopsided the further back you go to the days of Staubach and Bradshaw.

However, in those days you had nowhere near the amount of parity seen today.  In today's game, literally all teams have legit chances to get to a Super Bowl.  In the 80s and 90s you had veritable all-star teams in the 49ers and the Cowboys, with teams like the Giants, Redskins, Bills, and Broncos trailing close behind.

Concerning Brady, if he isn't the best football player ever, then the guy who is barely eclipses him.  No clearcut winner here.

[240 is Back]

if you put up every QB in NFL history in their prime, in a line, and let teams or coaches choose their QB for one game...

Who would it be?   I have to think Montana or Young or Aikman would be chosen over Brady, all things equal.

[G_Thang]

if you put up every QB in NFL history in their prime, in a line, and let teams or coaches choose their QB for one game...

Who would it be?   I have to think Montana or Young or Aikman would be chosen over Brady, all things equal.

brady can't beat eli when it counts.  montana, aikman, and bradshaw prime (superbowl) could send new england home.  brady is good for today's rules.  i'd take bets the plunkett, allen and hayes raiders would bump in.  shit, he'd loose to the elway and davis broncos.  

it's timing for brady, just like those two russian heavy weight champs.

[Earl1972]

if you put up every QB in NFL history in their prime, in a line, and let teams or coaches choose their QB for one game...

Who would it be?   I have to think Montana or Young or Aikman would be chosen over Brady, all things equal.

aikman isn't even in the top 10

young and montana had all star teams, brady has had a completely different cast of characters since 2001, he had one hall of fame receiver for like 2 years and he broke records

i'd take brady over all except maybe john elway

E

[G_Thang]

aikman isn't even in the top 10

young and montana had all star teams, brady has had a completely different cast of characters since 2001, he had one hall of fame receiver for like 2 years and he broke records

i'd take brady over all except maybe john elway

E

brady is in an offensive nfl that doesn't allow late hits, bump and run, and stickum.   no such thing as steel curtains, 46 and flex defenses either.

Go Brady! 

[CARTEL]

brady is in an offensive nfl that doesn't allow late hits, bump and run, and stickum.   no such thing as steel curtains, 46 and flex defenses either.

Go Brady! 

This is true.

[tu_holmes]

aikman isn't even in the top 10

young and montana had all star teams, brady has had a completely different cast of characters since 2001, he had one hall of fame receiver for like 2 years and he broke records

i'd take brady over all except maybe john elway

E

Elway?

Another Elway over Montana person... Must be a Denver fan.

That's crazy talk.

Montana's first superbowl win was without Rice and Craig you know.

[Earl1972]

brady is in an offensive nfl that doesn't allow late hits, bump and run, and stickum.   no such thing as steel curtains, 46 and flex defenses either.

Go Brady! 

he's also in a league that doesn't have all star teams and where almost every team has a shot each year, and his teammates have consistently changed over the years

E

[Earl1972]

Elway?

Another Elway over Montana person... Must be a Denver fan.

That's crazy talk.

Montana's first superbowl win was without Rice and Craig you know.

i'm a steeler fan

elway did more with less than any qb, maybe besides brady

E

[CARTEL]

he's also in a league that doesn't have all star teams and where almost every team has a shot each year, and his teammates have consistently changed over the years

E

Well I am glad you agree that with me that Tim Duncan is the best player in the history of the NBA.

[Earl1972]

Well I am glad you agree that with me that Tim Duncan is the best player in the history of the NBA.

top 15, he was top 2 throughout the 2000's

E

[tu_holmes]

i'm a steeler fan

elway did more with less than any qb, maybe besides brady

E

No way... 1981 Niners man.

That team was nothing special.

[Palpatine Q]

It's an interesting question.

One common trait all of the great Qb's of the past had was they were mobile QBs who could throw on the run....and they had to because defenses weren't handcuffed like they are now.

But Brady plays against bigger, stronger faster players who hit harder. A modern day safety is the same size, is faster and hits harder than a linebacker from back then. offensive and defensive lines average over 300 pounds,and they are more athletic.. back then you had a few guys that size.

offenses score more now, but it's not like Brady has one set of rules and the rest of the league has another ...and he puts up more points than anyone. My point is yes it's an offensive league, and scoring is up, but he would still score points if it weren't,  just not as many..he would still be insanely accurate,strong armed, smart and super-competitive in any era. But he would definitely take many more clean hits. it's all relative.

[Bevo]

For whatever reason, Peyton is the master of the choke in the post-season.

Dude is the fucking greatest during the regular year... But it's always the same story in the post season. I remember those years when it was a Peyton/Brady showdown in the Division playoffs, and Brady always seemed to have his number.

Dude will probably go down as the greatest QB ever... But man is he ever inconsistent when it counts.

Greatest no, one of the best yes

[Bevo]

if you put up every QB in NFL history in their prime, in a line, and let teams or coaches choose their QB for one game...

Who would it be?   I have to think Montana or Young or Aikman would be chosen over Brady, all things equal.

Yeah but young could never get pass Favre and the packers only once 1999...