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Author Topic: critique year long orals only  (Read 6652 times)
TrueBB93
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« Reply #25 on: January 09, 2013, 03:26:39 PM »

this may seem like a dumb question, but are there any injects which effect the liver like orals do(live toxic/kidney toxic?)
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #26 on: January 09, 2013, 03:29:07 PM »

All injects elevate enzymes too even testosterone, just not that much. Tren can elevate enzymes quite a bit and ppl don't realize it... also affects kidney. Anything that drains u from the inside will also affect kidney... and more than likely liver, hence the need to drink tons of water generally speaking... Deca elevates enzymes too more than test.

In fact when I just got on trt, my endo not only tested my estro and test levels, he also tested my liver enzyme changes! Why do you think he woulda done that hmm! Even test affects lipids! Another fact people neglect.

I hate when I hear ppl nay saying oh its nothing oh no problem oh ill be fine... as someone out there will listen to that advice and get hurt due to reading stupid stuff on the internet.

We're not all made the same, some ppl can get jaundice from a month worth of orals, some may do stupid stuff and turn out fine. I've gone stupid crazy with orals a few times for quick results... is it smart? No... Should everyone do it? No. Did the pros in the past do it? Yes. Do pros do it today, yes. Does everyone turn out fine? No!
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TrueBB93
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« Reply #27 on: January 09, 2013, 07:04:50 PM »

injects arent liver toxic though right?
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2013, 07:13:30 PM »

They raise enzymes still just not like orals. Tren is that special inject that raises enzymes more than others, but that's why tren is special lol.

oral equivalent injects like dbol, winny, etc... still cause liver stress like the orals, some ppl think taking them through injections is somehow less, its usually stronger and better absorbed but still causes liver enzymes to rocket like the oral equivalent, just because if its chemical structure.
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TrueBB93
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« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2013, 07:20:07 PM »

They raise enzymes still just not like orals. Tren is that special inject that raises enzymes more than others, but that's why tren is special lol.

oral equivalent injects like dbol, winny, etc... still cause liver stress like the orals, some ppl think taking them through injections is somehow less, its usually stronger and better absorbed but still causes liver enzymes to rocket like the oral equivalent, just because if its chemical structure.

thanks brotha Cool
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Dr Loomis
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« Reply #30 on: January 09, 2013, 08:28:16 PM »

the orals liver thing is mostly bro science

the ony people i know that have had problems have run massive dosages of both orals and injectibles

if you have anything that proves otherwise please post a link

To some degree. I've ran Dbol @ 50mg for around 6-9 mos (w/other inj) and my enzymes got up there enough to raise the eyebrow of my doc and he said changes need to be made. No massive dosages, very moderate.





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bigmc
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« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2013, 09:28:26 AM »

Okay I'm tuned in for the failure, it's your life.  Roll Eyes When I hopped on trt, to get back in shape quick I went on 500mg test, 6 weeks or was it 7 weeks of hdrol at 100mg, then took two three week  break, tried epistane for a week it killed my joints, went off, got on boladrol for 4-5 weeks, then took a bit off, then pulsed boladrol preworkout. Did blood work and my doctor wanted to take me to hospital to get liver examined.

I'm fine. I don't drink obviously. However for someone to say liver enzymes are bro science, you have to be a full blown retard. I am saying this not out of any other reason but your own well being.

Took full two+ months off and was still scared to visit doc.

Sure I gained 30lbs but... Smiley

calling me a retard wont change my opinion

as long as you only go on in short burst

and take other meds to look after your liver im saying unless you are predisposed to liver problems you will be ok

most steroid stuff on the internet is bro science

if people were having liver problems attributed to steroid use it would be all over the media they love jumping on that band wagon
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latiuss
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« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2013, 10:28:11 AM »

Got my bloodwork results earlier...cholestrol is fine but my liver enzyme is 116...when it should be 15-50max. Did 20week cycle mostly injectables with 6weeks of var and the odd bit of dbol pre workout . So it ain't bro science brah
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bigmc
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« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2013, 11:53:32 AM »

Got my bloodwork results earlier...cholestrol is fine but my liver enzyme is 116...when it should be 15-50max. Did 20week cycle mostly injectables with 6weeks of var and the odd bit of dbol pre workout . So it ain't bro science brah

brah science then brah
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« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2013, 12:41:01 PM »

Got my bloodwork results earlier...cholestrol is fine but my liver enzyme is 116...when it should be 15-50max. Did 20week cycle mostly injectables with 6weeks of var and the odd bit of dbol pre workout . So it ain't bro science brah

Do you have a baseline test prior to using AAS?

I used 60mg of Dbol for 8 months and my liver values only increased 15%.

Everyone is different.


Cool
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latiuss
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« Reply #35 on: January 10, 2013, 01:57:19 PM »

Do you have a baseline test prior to using AAS?

I used 60mg of Dbol for 8 months and my liver values only increased 15%.

Everyone is different.


Cool

Honestly no I didn't which is something I should have done now looking back , I was drinking a lot through out cycle with no living support supps which is stupid but I thought I'd be ok... atleast I know what to do and not to do when I do my next cycle
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Conker
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« Reply #36 on: January 11, 2013, 06:29:37 AM »

Personally would never do it myself, its not just liver issues , but have heard of quite a few getting digestion problems , stomach ulcers from sustained oral use, also orals tend to destroy cholesterol readings far worse than any injectable. All in all I think orals are generally far worse for health.

I think you would probably get away with just a year without too many probs but don't see the point. There are plenty things far more dangerous in the average household than a few needles, I have 2 kids myself , I keep all my stuff in a locked cabinet. Could maybe get a small safe or something(?)
If you don't like injections , just run esters where you can inject once a week, could still run orals alongside at maybe 6 weeks on 6 weeks off.

Anways not trying to preach, just my 2 cents worth GL with whatever you decide , .
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Oly15
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« Reply #37 on: January 14, 2013, 12:48:19 AM »

You wouldn't be the first person to try this and won't be the last. I know guys who have used Dbol for over a year straight and they were fine. I'm not a big fan of this idea, but if you are set on doing it at least get blood work done to make sure your liver is healthy enough to do this. Get some Liv52 and run it on the weeks you are not taking orals.

A lot of people don't realize that while this might not be the best route, it was very common to run orals for extended periods like this back in the 60's and 70's.


Cool

Any reason you recommend taking the Liv52 while off the dbol? Does it interfere with dbol's modes of action by taking it during? I always take milk thistle, betaine, and a couple of other support supps while on orals.
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big_pauly
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« Reply #38 on: January 14, 2013, 08:18:18 AM »

I have done a low dose dbol 20mg a day for 6 months and I still looked and felt good, but when I went to the doc, my blood pressure was slightly high at 100 and my cholesterol was up also, not terrible..but these are the things you should look for...I also got some bad acid reflux from taking for so long..everything was cool after I stopped..
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Borracho
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« Reply #39 on: January 14, 2013, 08:52:15 AM »

This is the most obvious reply here but I think when we're young we can get away with a lot more wrt what we put in our bodies. As the years go on there's only so much it will take before something starts going wrong.
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bigmc
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« Reply #40 on: January 14, 2013, 09:25:48 AM »

acid reflux is an issue

i might try primobolan 600mg a week one injection
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #41 on: January 14, 2013, 09:46:25 AM »

It's bro science to 'not take liver supports' while on wtf..

milk thistle, NAC, UDCA (especially UDCA) are a must year round if you want your liver healthy. On and off stay on these especially if you like to use orals.

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« Reply #42 on: January 15, 2013, 04:13:35 PM »

Any reason you recommend taking the Liv52 while off the dbol? Does it interfere with dbol's modes of action by taking it during? I always take milk thistle, betaine, and a couple of other support supps while on orals.

No it doesn't hurt anything.  I always saw better results using the liver support after i stopped using the orals.  Just my personal way of doing things.


Cool
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TrueBB93
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« Reply #43 on: January 15, 2013, 08:33:09 PM »

acid reflux is an issue

i might try primobolan 600mg a week one injection

I would go this route. Maybe some Var and Primo.
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a_ahmed
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« Reply #44 on: January 15, 2013, 08:39:11 PM »

I wish i could find AFFORDABLE legit primo200.. the source i 'had' dissapeared, or rather i lost contact with.. although it was STILL expensive..

I wanted to jump on some 600mg primo a week right about now.. but damn it Sad My regular source has 100mg but damn thats alot of pinning...
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TrueBB93
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« Reply #45 on: January 15, 2013, 08:56:10 PM »

I wish i could find AFFORDABLE legit primo200.. the source i 'had' dissapeared, or rather i lost contact with.. although it was STILL expensive..

I wanted to jump on some 600mg primo a week right about now.. but damn it Sad My regular source has 100mg but damn thats alot of pinning...

oh come on bro, you can pin tren ED but the primo is too much? lol, jk.


But I was reading another board and there was a disscussion about Primo, and I heard Primo can be run without Test since primo isnt very supressive? is this true or a myth?

"Primobolan is also a very popular "bridging" steroid, meaning that bodybuilders sometimes use a steady dose of it in between their regular cycles to keep the body in a more anabolic state that natural, but while not keeping natural testosterone shut down as harshly as some other steroids will do."

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a_ahmed
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« Reply #46 on: January 15, 2013, 09:08:24 PM »

Well anyone saying u can 'bridge' and not be shutdown is full of bro science. Even var shuts you down even 20mg, believe me i had bloodwork to prove it then again i am already set for low-normal test and in need of trt so MAYBE but STILL it killed what little test I had and killed my sperm too. This was in the period of time i got off trt and tried to get wife pregnant, briefly i thought hah var will do nothing.. but yes it did...

So don't listen to any bs of anyone say u wont be shutdown, certain roids shut down harder than others but all exogenous androgens WILL shut your endogenous production to one degree or another. In respect to recovery... some are quicker and easier to recover from (var for instance) vs say tren or deca or superdrol.

Secondly primo is touted as highly anti catabolic and able to produce lean mass even under low caloric situations... so yeah its beneficial in that respect for sure... that was my plan.. to 'bridge' with trt test and some primo as i cant stay on tren ALL the time.

ANd lastly im not pinning tren-a im pinning tren-e twice a week. Never wana do ed injections not even for one week HAH!
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TrueBB93
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« Reply #47 on: January 15, 2013, 10:03:49 PM »

Well anyone saying u can 'bridge' and not be shutdown is full of bro science. Even var shuts you down even 20mg, believe me i had bloodwork to prove it then again i am already set for low-normal test and in need of trt so MAYBE but STILL it killed what little test I had and killed my sperm too. This was in the period of time i got off trt and tried to get wife pregnant, briefly i thought hah var will do nothing.. but yes it did...

So don't listen to any bs of anyone say u wont be shutdown, certain roids shut down harder than others but all exogenous androgens WILL shut your endogenous production to one degree or another. In respect to recovery... some are quicker and easier to recover from (var for instance) vs say tren or deca or superdrol.

Secondly primo is touted as highly anti catabolic and able to produce lean mass even under low caloric situations... so yeah its beneficial in that respect for sure... that was my plan.. to 'bridge' with trt test and some primo as i cant stay on tren ALL the time.

ANd lastly im not pinning tren-a im pinning tren-e twice a week. Never wana do ed injections not even for one week HAH!

thanks 
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