Parker
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« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2013, 09:59:09 AM » |
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Most bodybuilders do not train like powerlifters and the ones that do have very short careers the fact is you do not need train like that to get big.
JOJ is a Bber/powerlifter, and he is still competing. Branch Warren may train in a similar fashion. Mike Francois would still be going strong if it weren't for his illness. Mike trained like a powerlifter. Steve Effering is a powerlifting/Bber and he won his Pro card in his 40s.
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anabolichalo
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« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2013, 09:59:27 AM » |
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dj181 and closeline, great information, thanks
get this from books or experience?
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dj181
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« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2013, 10:08:37 AM » |
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experience
also look at sprinters
the biggest and most muscles ones are the short sprinters ie. 60 meter to 200 meter and they run their events in about 6-20 seconds
the long sprinters ie. 400 meters are not as heavily muscled and they run their event in about 45 seconds
and then you go to mid-distance like 800-1500 meter runners and they have almost no muscle, and elite 800 meter runners run their event in about 100 seconds
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anabolichalo
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« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2013, 10:25:16 AM » |
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so are you timing your sets?
how else do you know if you are doing the right loading time
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closeline
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« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2013, 10:42:46 AM » |
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JOJ is a Bber/powerlifter, and he is still competing. Branch Warren may train in a similar fashion. Mike Francois would still be going strong if it weren't for his illness. Mike trained like a powerlifter. Steve Effering is a powerlifting/Bber and he won his Pro card in his 40s.
good examples and joj as well as warren do not just lift heavy, they use a lot of momentum without momentum, you will barley be able to lift so heavy, that you can injure yourself a weight you can lift with proper form, without momentum is always ok btw most injuries, yates triceps-tear for example, happend after many month of minor injuries going along with inflamations in that area that are not taken care of in the right way
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closeline
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« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2013, 10:51:10 AM » |
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dj181 and closeline, great information, thanks
get this from books or experience?
20+ years of training  in a gym along with many competitors up to olympians i ve tried everything from 100 rep squats like tom platz did to heavy doubles like olympi lifters the best look i achive with training style like dorian yates but slower positive movement and a little lower reps on some exercise this is the general rule, sometimes i go really high reps ofcourse you can t go balls to the walls in every workout, sometimes it s time for a new impulse it helps to build mass and is a grat feeling to do a set like 315 for 50-60 reps of squats, or giantsets for back like pullovers- pullups- bent row wide grip- bent row close grip- lat pulldowns without rest between the sets 6-8 reps per set
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anabolichalo
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« Reply #31 on: January 19, 2013, 10:53:06 AM » |
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20+ years of training  in a gym along with many competitors up to olympians i ve tried everything from 100 rep squats like tom platz did to heavy doubles like olympi lifters the best look i achive with training style like dorian yates but slower positive movement and a little lower reps on some exercise this is the general rule, sometimes i go really high reps ofcourse you can t go balls to the walls in every workout, sometimes it s time for a new impulse it helps to build mass and is a grat feeling to do a set like 315 for 50-60 reps of squats, or giantsets for back like pullovers- pullups- bent row wide grip- bent row close grip- lat pulldowns without rest between the sets 6-8 reps per set ever considered publishing a book on this
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basil
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« Reply #32 on: January 19, 2013, 10:54:35 AM » |
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a lot of bodybuilders agree they don't go under 8-12 reps for upper body, 15-20 reps for lower body
not locking out in between reps, not just moving the weight but squeezing and pumping
this is one school of thought
the other one is about lifting heavy at all cost
obviously the latter one is more dangerous
but what about results, do you respond better to "working the muscle" type training or powerlifting type training?
i was surprised to see BFG reccomend 5x5 type strength training 3-4 times a week max in the off season, go real heavy he said
For longevity, option 1 is the answer, with a smidgen of option 2 sprinkled in to overcome boredom.
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closeline
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« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2013, 10:57:21 AM » |
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so are you timing your sets?
how else do you know if you are doing the right loading time
no i just know that 1 rep for examples barbell row is approx 1 second for positiv 2 second for negativ for an average of 5 reps equals 15 seconds for a set coleman for exampel 0.5sec positiv a little under 1 sec for negative, so his reps are much faster so if he does 15 reps , and it s rare that he goes to failure his sets may very well last much shorter than a set of yates doing 6 reps with slow negativ and 1-2 forced reps so it s not accurate to go for number instead go for time if talking about heavy btw i always felt if i go not heavy enough the assistant muscles tend to fail befor the acctually worked muscles fail and that s very limiting to muscle mass gains
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closeline
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« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2013, 10:58:24 AM » |
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ever considered publishing a book on this
lol i acctually started writing last summer vacation  but it is in german , someone would have to translate it, because my english is not so good
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dj181
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« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2013, 10:58:39 AM » |
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ever considered publishing a book on this
i think that there are general guidelines, but in the end you gotta find/figure out what works best for you as an individual
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closeline
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« Reply #36 on: January 19, 2013, 11:04:25 AM » |
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i think that there are general guidelines, but in the end you gotta find/figure out what works best for you as an individual
can t fully agree 95 percent have to lift heavy to build mass to look like a real bodybuilder and if you look close, the other 5 percent are blown up and miss quality if they choose to compete exceptions are beginners for the first month to hold the main part of the muscles you allready have you can go much lighter ofcourse,
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dj181
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« Reply #37 on: January 19, 2013, 11:09:46 AM » |
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can t fully agree
95 percent have to lift heavy to build mass to look like a real bodybuilder
and if you look close, the other 5 percent are blown up and miss quality if they choose to compete
exceptions are beginners for the first month
to hold the main part of the muscles you allready have you can go much lighter ofcourse,
well man, the gospel is progressive overload so that's first and foremost basically.... BIGGER TRAINING LOADS=BIGGER MUSCLES but there's different ways to train to enable oneself to add weight to the bar the best way for me is very low volume with a limited amount of exercises (all compound moves) with higher frequency (2 or even 3 times per week) Hise's abbreviated training for example
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closeline
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« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2013, 11:19:30 AM » |
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well man, the gospel is progressive overload so that's first and foremost
basically.... BIGGER TRAINING LOADS=BIGGER MUSCLES
but there's different ways to train to enable oneself to add weight to the bar
the best way for me is very low volume with a limited amount of exercises (all compound moves) with higher frequency (2 or even 3 times per week)
Hise's abbreviated training for example
yes , dj181 i fully agree with that low volume, allways increase weight, as far as i can say that after 20+ years of training to be honest, i think to make continuing gains over such a long period , you have to alternate the intensty and most off all (sadly) up the dosage or use new stuff depending on rest possible during the week i go with 3 or 4 times a week as well sometimes for shorter perionds, not longer than 3 weeks, i go with 2 on 1 off to max out strengh or mass
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