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Author Topic: Do you think there is any point in a natural base?  (Read 5346 times)
Big Chiro Flex
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« Reply #150 on: July 25, 2013, 10:37:37 PM »

Think again. How fun is it to train knowing for certain that you are only maintaining - at best? As a lifelong natural you can still convince yourself that you might make some type of gains if you keep at it. If you know for certain you're never cycling again it's a pretty depressing place to be in. If you're only training to maintain somewhat between cycles then it's easier.

Also, once you've juiced extensively your clean state might be worse than if you never juiced at all, with the often permanently depressed testosterone levels. That's why most former juicers who continue training go on HRT, preferably on a liberal dosage (for example like Galeniko).

I should say that my stance is based on my own experience with training natty for many years and then transitioning into the "other side". And my views are still the same on it. I was making gains up until my 6th year natty when I injured my shoulder. So gear obviously was a lifesaver and helped me keep progressing around my injury, but I would keep training no matter what, even without it if it came down to it. This is my hobby, it's what I love to do. I assume I'm not the only long time natty who has crossed over and sill shares my same opinions.

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« Reply #151 on: July 25, 2013, 10:42:05 PM »


LOL - I have seen guys like you come and go for 20 years now like a dime a dozen.  20 years from now you will be either fat fuck or a skinny twink who looks like he never worked out a day in his life.  I been at this since almost as long as you are alive and seen guys like you all the time.  Get bloated and big, get sick and develop health issues or get lazy and stop training, and just fade away or get fat and obese.      

Enjoy it now - you wont have it for long at all.   Just take pics now so when you are 30, 35, 40, you can look back and say what a beast you were when you were 25.    



haha Im 20 .... by the time Im 25 i wont need to take pictures  with my shitty flip phone I'll be on the cover of magazines lol
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« Reply #152 on: July 25, 2013, 11:29:51 PM »

but I would keep training no matter what, even without it if it came down to it. This is my hobby, it's what I love to do. I assume I'm not the only long time natty who has crossed over and sill shares my same opinions.



Maybe you would but you haven't tried it yet. Cheesy

Think about training with a third of the test you had cruising in your body as a natural, then when you flex your muscles nothing happens, they always feel soft, aches and pains come back even worse than before, everyone asking if you've been sick and haven't been training and so on. Cheesy
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« Reply #153 on: July 25, 2013, 11:40:08 PM »

haha Im 20 .... by the time Im 25 i wont need to take pictures  with my shitty flip phone I'll be on the cover of magazines lol



huh.... younger than my gf... that explains a lot.
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« Reply #154 on: July 25, 2013, 11:43:39 PM »

Maybe you would but you haven't tried it yet. Cheesy

Think about training with a third of the test you had cruising in your body as a natural, then when you flex your muscles nothing happens, they always feel soft, aches and pains come back even worse than before, everyone asking if you've been sick and haven't been training and so on. Cheesy

this has been me for the past five years...

you just get used to it
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« Reply #155 on: July 26, 2013, 07:33:12 AM »

It's all about knowledge, form, and repetition. Natural strength has alot to do with it as well. I compare it to guys born with rocket arms.

how the fuck do you know
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« Reply #156 on: July 26, 2013, 07:41:40 AM »

a natural can weigh whatever he wants, everyone can gain fat Grin

gustavo badell chosen to stay natural, here straight from horse mouth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a4W8yUx0tY
So your opinion based on your personal natural limit is that a 6'2"+ guy can only weigh X amount?
What is X amount in your opinion?
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« Reply #157 on: July 26, 2013, 07:43:49 AM »

So your opinion based on your personal natural limit is that a 6'2"+ guy can only weigh X amount?
What is X amount in your opinion?

ripped about 210lbs

lean about 230 lbs

reasonable shape about 250 lbs
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« Reply #158 on: July 26, 2013, 07:46:27 AM »

Lol
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« Reply #159 on: July 26, 2013, 07:48:24 AM »

Lol

whats your take
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« Reply #160 on: July 26, 2013, 08:05:31 AM »

how the fuck do you know
I thought my numerous pics would have spelled it out.  Grin
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« Reply #161 on: July 26, 2013, 08:07:14 AM »

whats your take


He takes the whole pizza Grin
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« Reply #162 on: July 26, 2013, 09:40:52 AM »

whats your take
I hit 220 shredded as fuck, meticulous diet/training after about 5 years of bodybuilding style training before I got bored and started lifting heavy. So had I continued, who knows? But I do know most people lose the drive to push harder/heavier and end up juicing, staying stagnant or quitting.
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« Reply #163 on: July 26, 2013, 11:43:46 AM »

I hit 220 shredded as fuck, meticulous diet/training after about 5 years of bodybuilding style training before I got bored and started lifting heavy. So had I continued, who knows? But I do know most people lose the drive to push harder/heavier and end up juicing, staying stagnant or quitting.

What's your Bodyfat right now at 280?
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« Reply #164 on: July 26, 2013, 11:51:06 AM »

What's your Bodyfat right now at 280?
Fat enough but not so fat that it hangs over my belt. Never concerned myself with it.
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« Reply #165 on: July 26, 2013, 12:01:13 PM »

Fat enough but not so fat that it hangs over my belt. Never concerned myself with it.

Great now tell me what you're wearing right now

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« Reply #166 on: July 26, 2013, 12:17:18 PM »

Great now tell me what you're wearing right now


Jeans and a xxl T-shirt.... free balling.
You?
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« Reply #167 on: July 26, 2013, 04:33:14 PM »

I hit 220 shredded as fuck,

WHITE GOODRUM IN DA HOUSE !!!!  , hahhaa  ,oh brother .
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« Reply #168 on: July 26, 2013, 04:36:04 PM »

WHITE GOODRUM IN DA HOUSE !!!!  , hahhaa  ,oh brother .
Grin
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« Reply #169 on: July 26, 2013, 05:03:27 PM »

Fat enough but not so fat that it hangs over my belt. Never concerned myself with it.
Diabeetus.
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« Reply #170 on: July 26, 2013, 05:54:02 PM »

 lift until you are not able to grow on your own any more    then start ped
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« Reply #171 on: July 26, 2013, 06:07:04 PM »


former big juicers profit later on on small doses, for whatever mysterious reasons, but they do.


i think this can go one of two ways.

you hit a point of 'no return' ala ronnie coleman/ kamali/ markus ruhl/ dave palumo even jay cutler now, where the amounts of hormones they are taking only make them look worse, and they cant drop the dose cause they have gone too far past their genetic thresholds to ever look good again.

i think the best bet is to use moderate doses over a long period of time. not big cycles up and down up and down, but steady continual usage over time until you hit a point where your either going to go pro, or are happy with a good physique.

those guys who are happy with the good physique will benefit greatly like you say from running smaller doses than what it took to get them there, and even continue making gains. like you i cant figure it out.

the second group the further they go past ^ that point, the less able they are to have a respectable physique when dropping their dose, let alone look better running the same amounts (or more) it took to get there.

there is very definitely a law of diminishing returns.

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« Reply #172 on: July 26, 2013, 06:10:40 PM »



but natyy wont be 6ft 210lbs shredded, tha will not happen Cheesy
Lol
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« Reply #173 on: July 26, 2013, 07:13:29 PM »

I think natural base will only matter later on in life...Most won't be able to stay geared up all the time and when these guys come off and sometimes for good, without the natural base, they will look untrained as if they never stepped in a gym in their life...
This is truth. I love the fact that over 30 years of training I am now bigger than most ex-pros.
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« Reply #174 on: July 26, 2013, 07:14:38 PM »

Lol
I ate a peanut butter and jelly sandwich today.
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