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Author Topic: should you train different while on te sause?  (Read 1400 times)
shrek
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« Reply #25 on: October 12, 2013, 03:04:57 PM »

come on man, you can't look that that fella naturally, no way in hell



I didnt not say that.... I simply said you don't have to be full of gear to look like a bber ...... ah fuck this thread I'm getting nowhere you are difficult so just fucking take your drugs eat your food hit it harder then what you've done and fuck bitches
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dj181
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« Reply #26 on: October 12, 2013, 03:23:31 PM »

I used to do HIT... I have found that not only does increased volume seem to spare injuries much better, that I see much better results when on low doses.

My opinion is to up the volume when training on...... But I don't have a shitton of experience with juice.

i think there's something to volume training while on, coz it causes a much better pump in the muscles and this pump brings the nutrients to the muscles to help them to grow better and even maybe recover faster

and if you do pump training with higher reps and more sets then you don't need to use such a damn heavy weight and it does spare the joints, so that's true

I didnt not say that.... I simply said you don't have to be full of gear to look like a bber ...... ah fuck this thread I'm getting nowhere you are difficult so just fucking take your drugs eat your food hit it harder then what you've done and fuck bitches

i'm difficult? now that's an understatement lol

i'm a stubborn asshole pretty much, but thanks for the input anyways dude and don't take it too personal Grin
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« Reply #27 on: October 12, 2013, 04:18:59 PM »

You can always incorporate both the dorian yates style work out and add in volume at the very end once you cant lift heavy anymore. So you get the best of both worlds. I think lifting heavy and intense does give a different look to the muscle. Pump up sets work to grow. But you will reach your limit with them because you are not really pushing your strength to go up. I mean if you do pump up set work outs lets say for 2 weeks and than go heavy for 2 weeks that would be a good starting point. But like said just go all out on every set and every rep on juice or not on juice. And that will really make the biggest difference. Especially when lifting like dorian yates. Because his style only works pretty much if you are on gear for the sake of your joints to have water retention around them for added cushioning plus if you are going all out. I mean that was the point of his work out style was so he could go all out. It is not easy though with a muscle group like legs though I mean any one can go all out on biceps but squats are a different more painful story. I have given up just one short of failure a few times its mentally hard to push through that type of pain. But very rewarding when you go all out and you know you left everything in the gym. Lol and you go home and lay down on the floor and feel like puking and cant eat or drink a shake.
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dj181
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« Reply #28 on: October 12, 2013, 04:29:58 PM »

but the thing is, training til failure each and every set drains the fuck out of ya, even if on the sause

it could be that pumping and getting blood and nutrients into the muscle without the overkill of hitting failure often could be the best method for cosmetic effects

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shrek
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« Reply #29 on: October 12, 2013, 04:31:50 PM »

I do 6 exercises for chest dumbbell presses starting at 70 and finishing at 120 for reps of 10 so about for sets then hammer strength incline 2 plates and up to 4 for sets of 10 then wide grip hammer 3 up to 5 plates for reps of 10 then a drop set till failure then peck deck heavy as hell and good form then decline chest cables the really wide smith incline presses high rep 15 with push ups at an angle ....... after that those pups are flooded then I fuck up tris wooooooooooooo makes my dick hard
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shrek
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« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2013, 04:35:13 PM »

I'm a large fuck but not strict on diet and I'm a drunk so in not cut or pretty but no belly and now in 34's at 6'1" 270
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« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2013, 04:56:08 PM »

but the thing is, training til failure each and every set drains the fuck out of ya, even if on the sause

it could be that pumping and getting blood and nutrients into the muscle without the overkill of hitting failure often could be the best method for cosmetic effects



Why do you even bother asking?  You just keep changing the question until you get the answer you want, so why even bother asking?
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shrek
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« Reply #32 on: October 12, 2013, 05:08:56 PM »

Why do you even bother asking?  You just keep changing the question until you get the answer you want, so why even bother asking?
finally someone says it
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Borracho
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« Reply #33 on: October 12, 2013, 06:41:55 PM »

Why do you even bother asking?  You just keep changing the question until you get the answer you want, so why even bother asking?


Because it's an opportunity for dj181 to talk about dj181.
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« Reply #34 on: October 12, 2013, 10:53:41 PM »

but the thing is, training til failure each and every set drains the fuck out of ya, even if on the sause


You don't know this because you have never been on the sauce before.
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illwill
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« Reply #35 on: December 01, 2013, 11:46:46 AM »

food for thought written by the much maligned, Christian Thibaudeau:




Quote
"STEROIDS, REPS AND WEIGHT

I have received some comments how low reps are not optimal to build muscle and how guys who are relying on low reps and heavy weights and who got big probably were using steroids. Nonsense!

If anything, it's the opposite!

From my experience working with a myriad of athletes and bodybuilders, natural and enhanced, individuals who are using steroids might respond better to higher reps and lower loads while naturals will grow more from high-force (heavy weight or explosive lifts) training with low reps.

This is a viewpoint shared by Micheal Gundhil, one of the foremost bodybuilding authority in Europe.

First of all steroids tend to increase muscle mass a lot more than tendon strength, in fact many steroids make the tendons more brittle and fragile. So you have a muscle that is much larger and stronger, but with a weaker attachment.

This both increases the risk of injury and eventually decreases the potential for strength gains because of an inhibitory mechanism due to the weaker tendons (the body will want to protect itself for a tendon tear and will reduce force production).

So ''enhanced'' athletes might progress fast at first from a program based on heavy, low reps lifting, but the risk of injuries will be drastically higher than for a natural trainee.

Not to mention that ''enhanced'' athletes can tolerate and recover from more training volume: they have a much greater rate of protein synthesis and also replenish muscle glycogen to a greater and faster extent. For that reason, they will thrive on doing a lot more work in the gym.

Finally, the increased rate of protein synthesis and constant anabolic state they are in reduces the need for a super powerful growth stimulus. I'm not saying that steroids are an ''easy way out''... to get the most out of it you must still train hard; but a lot of big bodies have been built with ''easy'' workouts when using steroids.

So basically in an "enhanced" athlete you have:

- increased protein synthesis and glycogen storage + lowered cortisol = better tolerance for volume
- constant anabolic state = less need for a powerful growth stimulus
- muscles that get stronger much faster than tendons = greater potential for injury

So this means that an enhanced lifter will respond better to high volume/moderate load training than their natural counterparts.

I'm not saying that low-reps/high force training is not effective for drug-using lifters, it is VERY effective. What I'm saying is that this type of training might be more hazardous for the enhanced and not as necessary to stimulate growth. As such, a steroid-using bodybuilder would be best to use high-force/low reps lifting in short cycles followed by bouts of higher volume training.

A natural lifter doesn't have these "problems". While his muscles will still grow stronger faster than the tendons, the difference is not as pronounced (especially considering that some steroids will make the tendons weaker). So the risk of low reps lifting is much lower for a natural trainee, so he can stay on this type of training for longer.

Actually I believe that high volume training will cause more injuries than high-force training in the natural lifter.

Since the natural lifter's anabolic to catabolic (testosterone, igf-1, GH / cortisol) ratio is not constantly in the positive range, the regulation of training volume is much more important if maximum progress is desired. So a natural lifter who does too much volume can really short-circuit his gains.

And because it is harder for a natural lifter to stimulate growth, he needs a more powerful stimulus... high-force lifting.

This is why I believe that low-reps/high force training, contrary to what some believe, is actually better suited to natural lifters than enhanced ones.





As for frequency for enhanced lifters, here is what I believe:

- TECHNICALLY enhanced lifters are able to train each muscle group more often because of the increased protein synthesis and glycogen storage. In other words the muscles recover faster from training.

- Still IN THEORY enhanced lifters are able to train more often (as in more days per week) for the same reason as above AND because they artificially blunt the action of cortisol at the receptor level.

HOWEVER in reality they should actually train each muscle group LESS OFTEN.

Why? Because...

- although their muscles recover faster their tendons do not. This, once again, increase the risk of injuries because as time goes by the muscles will get stronger while the tendons get progressively (and proportionally) weaker.

- while the increased protein synthesis and glycogen storage will allow the muscle to do more work and recover faster, the nervous system will not recover any faster (in fact some steroids are psychostimulants that might even drain the nervous system even more during a training session). For that reason an enhanced lifter might miss the signs that it's time to give the body a break: the muscles can still do the job, the lifter is still gaining strength and size... so he assumes that everything is fine. But the risk of chronic fatigue is quite real, he just doesn't see it."

Basically... an enhanced lifter CAN train more often. But by doing so he is likely to do more harm than good, especially in the long run.

Not to mention that since AAS basically makes the lifter anabolic 24-7, he requires a lesser frequency of stimulation to gain size and strength, so training at a higher frequency is unecessary.
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