Pentagon admits Christian ministry not a 'hate group'

[Archer77]

yep, muslim countries often execute homosexuals where our religious nuts just wish they could execute homosexuals

The nutbags at AFA don't represent christians as a whole just like those idiots at Westborough Church don't represent christians

They all only represent themselves and it's pretty easy to see why the views of the AFA can be considered by some to be a "hate group"  

I have heard recently that many American evangelical groups are heavily involved in the violent anti-gay movement among their fellow christians in Uganda

I would argue that person of faith who publicly  condemns homosexuals is being more true to his religion than those who do not speak out against it or accept homosexuals.   I may disagree with Christians and Muslims about their condemnation of homosexuals but I also respect them for being honest and standing by their convictions.  It's the ones who stay quiet and pretend who are the cowards.

[Archer77]

as I'm sure you well know, not every Muslim interprets the Koran the same way just like not every christian interprets the bible the same way

a particular lazy beach loving person will tell you that anyone who doesn't interpret the bible the way that he does are not "real" christians

They are rationalizing away the nastier elements of their religion.  It's a common practice of the faithful.  Ignore or deny what they don't like.

[Straw Man]

I would argue that person of faith who publicly  condemns homosexuals is being more true to his religion than those who do not speak out against it or accept homosexuals.   I may disagree with Christians and Muslims about their condemnation of homosexuals but I also respect them for being honest and standing by their convictions.  It's the ones who stay quiet and pretend who are the cowards.

so you're saying that you understand "true christianity" better than the pope

I guess that also means Westborough Church is kind of of the right path too

how about we let any person who choose to practice any religion make their own interpretations about that religion

I'm sure you know the Bible also condemns to death people who work on the Sabbath

Here's a short list of the nuttyness.

Are you suggesting that current christians should be "more true" and follow all of these rules and their bible prescribed punishment for breaking them?

Here’s chapter and verse on a more-or-less comprehensive list of things banned in the Leviticus book of the bible. A decent number of them are punishable by death.

Unless you’ve never done any of them (and 54 to 56 are particularly tricky), perhaps it’s time to lay off quoting 18:22 for a while?

1.       Burning any yeast or honey in offerings to God (2:11)

2.       Failing to include salt in offerings to God (2:13)

3.       Eating fat (3:17)

4.       Eating blood (3:17)

5.       Failing to testify against any wrongdoing you’ve witnessed (5:1)

6.       Failing to testify against any wrongdoing you’ve been told about (5:1)

7.       Touching an unclean animal (5:2)

8.       Carelessly making an oath (5:4)

9.       Deceiving a neighbour about something trusted to them (6:2)

10.   Finding lost property and lying about it (6:3)

11.   Bringing unauthorised fire before God (10:1)

12.   Letting your hair become unkempt (10:6)

13.   Tearing your clothes (10:6)

14.   Drinking alcohol in holy places (bit of a problem for Catholics, this ‘un) (10:9)

15.   Eating an animal which doesn’t both chew cud and has a divided hoof (cf: camel, rabbit, pig) (11:4-7)

16.   Touching the carcass of any of the above (problems here for rugby) (11:

17.   Eating – or touching the carcass of – any seafood without fins or scales (11:10-12)

18.   Eating – or touching the carcass of - eagle, the vulture, the black vulture, the red kite, any kind of black kite, any kind of raven, the horned owl, the screech owl, the gull, any kind of hawk, the little owl, the cormorant, the great owl, the white owl, the desert owl, the osprey, the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe and the bat. (11:13-19)

19.   Eating – or touching the carcass of – flying insects with four legs, unless those legs are jointed (11:20-22)

20.   Eating any animal which walks on all four and has paws (good news for cats) (11:27)

21.   Eating – or touching the carcass of – the weasel, the rat, any kind of great lizard, the gecko, the monitor lizard, the wall lizard, the skink and the chameleon (11:29)

22.   Eating – or touching the carcass of – any creature which crawls on many legs, or its belly (11:41-42)

23.   Going to church within 33 days after giving birth to a boy (12:4)

24.   Going to church within 66 days after giving birth to a girl (12:5)

25.   Having sex with your mother (18:7)

26.   Having sex with your father’s wife (18:

27.   Having sex with your sister (18:9)

28.   Having sex with your granddaughter (18:10)

29.   Having sex with your half-sister (18:11)

30.   Having sex with your biological aunt (18:12-13)

31.   Having sex with your uncle’s wife (18:14)

32.   Having sex with your daughter-in-law (18:15)

33.   Having sex with your sister-in-law (18:16)

34.   Having sex with a woman and also having sex with her daughter or granddaughter (bad news for Alan Clark) (18:17)

35.   Marrying your wife’s sister while your wife still lives (18:18)

36.   Having sex with a woman during her period (18:19)

37.   Having sex with your neighbour’s wife (18:20)

38.   Giving your children to be sacrificed to Molek (18:21)

39.   Having sex with a man “as one does with a woman” (18:22)

40.   Having sex with an animal (18:23)

41.   Making idols or “metal gods” (19:4)

42.   Reaping to the very edges of a field (19:9)

43.   Picking up grapes that have fallen in your  vineyard (19:10)

44.   Stealing (19:11)

45.   Lying (19:11)

46.   Swearing falsely on God’s name (19:12)

47.   Defrauding your neighbour (19:13)

48.   Holding back the wages of an employee overnight (not well observed these days) (19:13)

49.   Cursing the deaf or abusing the blind (19:14)

50.   Perverting justice, showing partiality to either the poor or the rich (19:15)

51.   Spreading slander (19:16)

52.   Doing anything to endanger a neighbour’s life (19:16)

53.   Seeking revenge or bearing a grudge (19:18)

54.   Mixing fabrics in clothing (19:19)

55.   Cross-breeding animals (19:19)

56.   Planting different seeds in the same field (19:19)

57.   Sleeping with another man’s slave (19:20)

58.   Eating fruit from a tree within four years of planting it (19:23)

59.   Practising divination or seeking omens (tut, tut astrology) (19:26)

60.   Trimming your beard (19:27)

61.   Cutting your hair at the sides (19:27)

62.   Getting tattoos (19:28)

63.   Making your daughter prostitute herself (19:29)

64.   Turning to mediums or spiritualists (19:31)

65.   Not standing in the presence of the elderly (19:32)

66.   Mistreating foreigners – “the foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born”  (19:33-34)

67.   Using dishonest weights and scales (19:35-36)

68.   Cursing your father or mother (punishable by death) (20:9)

69.   Marrying a prostitute, divorcee or widow if you are a priest (21:7,13)

70.   Entering a place where there’s a dead body as a priest (21:11)

71.   Slaughtering a cow/sheep and its young on the same day (22:28)

72.   Working on the Sabbath (23:3)

73.   Blasphemy (punishable by stoning to death) (24:14)

74.   Inflicting an injury; killing someone else’s animal; killing a person must be punished in kind (24:17-22)

75.   Selling land permanently (25:23)

76.   Selling an Israelite as a slave (foreigners are fine) (25:42)

[Archer77]

I'm saying that if you present yourself as a member of a particular faith and you believe the holy scripture of your faith is the inerrant divine word of god, you should have the courage to claim all of it, even the most abhorrent elements.

[OzmO]

I would argue that person of faith who publicly  condemns homosexuals is being more true to his religion than those who do not speak out against it or accept homosexuals.   I may disagree with Christians and Muslims about their condemnation of homosexuals but I also respect them for being honest and standing by their convictions.  It's the ones who stay quiet and pretend who are the cowards.

Standing by or voicing your convictions is one thing.

Saying things that are untrue thus demonizing a group of people is hateful along with the other wacked out stuff that guy said on the video is another.

However that's just one guys opinion.  Is it the opinion of every member and the group as a whole?  I don't know.

[Straw Man]

I'm saying that if you present yourself as a member of a particular faith and you believe the holy scripture of your faith is the inerrant divine word of god, you should have the courage to claim all of it, even the most abhorrent elements.

and yet you know fully well that absolutely no one does that

even our crazy religious nutbags still pick and choose the shit they want to follow and the stuff they want to ingore

even our lazy beach resident does that

[Straw Man]

Standing by or voicing your convictions is one thing.

Saying things that are untrue thus demonizing a group of people is hateful along with the other wacked out stuff that guy said on the video is another.

However that's just one guys opinion.  Is it the opinion of every member and the group as a whole?  I don't know.

I'd say if you're a member of that group and you're aware of the public opinions of it's leaders then your membership is tacit approval of those beliefs

[Archer77]

and yet you know fully well that absolutely no one does that

even our crazy religious nutbags still pick and choose the shit they want to follow and the stuff they want to ingore

even our lazy beach resident does that

There are those who do follow their religious mandates to the letter.  Muslims for example, at least those that don't dismiss or willfully ignore the innate violence of their religious texts, do.

[Straw Man]

There are those who do follow their religious mandates to the letter.  Muslims for example, at least those that don't dismiss or willfully ignore the innate violence of their religious texts, do.

I don't know or know of any christian who follows the bible "to the letter" and the same goes for any Muslim that I know

Isn't it strange how you only hear fundie christians ranting about homosexuality and not ranting about working on the sabbath or making idols or “metal gods” or failing to include salt in offerings to god