Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
November 27, 2014, 02:20:12 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
 
   Home   Help Login Register  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Abs on naturals  (Read 1120 times)
calfzilla
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 12330


RIP little Halo


« on: January 29, 2014, 09:08:10 PM »

For naturals who want to get ripped and and "deep" abs like galeniko, should you work your abs or just lift and diet? 

I know it's common for enhanced lifters to avoid an work to prevent wide waist, but what about naturals?
Report to moderator   Logged
Wolfox
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 6529



« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2014, 04:33:14 AM »

Weighted ab exercises if you don't naturally have 3d abs...some do some don't. The rest is diet and sodium intake.

With aas you can grow muscle without exercise...this is fact as studies have shown. Juiced lifters rarely need to really hit abs hard.

Natties don't get a free pass. Gotta lift. Gotta program to progress. Diet has to be on point. No free rides for us natties.
Report to moderator   Logged

A
galeniko
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 4573


« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2014, 06:38:04 AM »

as natural, do train abs.can even train obliques and side abs directly.

i wouldnt use weighted exercises, but id do them twice weekly some 10sets.

steroid and gh users better have trained their abs before they start gear, bc if the obliques grow youve fucked up symetry good.


but natural no problemo, the how hard they look is merely bodyfat question.

natural can have gal abs "easy",just has to get as lean.

now the sodium and water thing, best to stay away from experiments with that, sure hteres way to manipulate that, but i fel its not very healthy thing to do,very draining, best reserved for competition,if that
Report to moderator   Logged

n
calfzilla
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 12330


RIP little Halo


« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2014, 08:10:42 AM »

Thanks gal. So just stick with crunches, leg lifts and such?
Report to moderator   Logged
oldtimer1
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 5326

Getbig!


« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2014, 11:33:50 AM »

Everyone has abs it's a question of body fat. Some have natural thick abs from good genetics. If you're a natural to show really good abs you have to be at such a low body fat that sometimes muscle gets wasted away too. ..

Some guys with really good abs barely train them. A few don't even train them. The abs are really almost just a stabilizer muscle with a short range of motion. They are contracting in so many exercises like squats, deadlifts, tricep pushdowns, standing presses and others. You can't go wrong though doing standard exercises like weighted crunches, hanging leg raises and the rest.
Report to moderator   Logged
galeniko
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 4573


« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2014, 09:42:40 PM »

Thanks gal. So just stick with crunches, leg lifts and such?
basicaly they get plenty of indirect work, but yes, crunches and leg lifts i find the best.


doesnt hurt to train them a bit,gear user will develop or overdevelop them even indirectly, but natural can go full out.

kinda agree with oldtimer, its mostly a bodyfat things, but why not have all the small fibres trained.the extra torso strenght could help in other exercises etc.

Report to moderator   Logged

n
jpm101
Getbig IV
****
Gender: Male
Posts: 2586


« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2014, 11:28:15 AM »

Feel free to treat the Abs like any other muscle group. Meaning weight added and reps within the usually 8-12 BB'ing reps. As with most short ROM muscle groups, the total ab wall is very powerful.

Doing direct Ab work will not increase the width of the waist, but the hip structure your born with does. As does extra fat around the area. Think of extra strong Abs as wearing a  built in lifting belt, insuring a stronger back, as they were both designed to support one another. Many bad backs can be the result of weaker Abs.

Might suggest, rather than holding added weight (BB plate, DB, etc.) on the upper chest or behind the neck, hold a BB/DB directly overhead (as in a finish of a BP), and start from that position (keeping the weight directly overhead at all times).   Or having a BB/DB in the full straight arm pullover position, preform crunches that way. Both these positions increase the leverage on the Ab wall greatly.

The Ab Wheel is another very effective device to totally work the lower and upper Ab wall very strongly and at the same time. As you advance, try raising the feet higher or even start from a ben tover standing position. Using the roller on a thicker rug or rough ground will make it even harder.    Good Luck
Report to moderator   Logged

F
Donny
Competitors II
Getbig V
******
Gender: Male
Posts: 9353



WWW
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2014, 11:43:59 AM »

Everyone has abs it's a question of body fat. Some have natural thick abs from good genetics. If you're a natural to show really good abs you have to be at such a low body fat that sometimes muscle gets wasted away too. ..

Some guys with really good abs barely train them. A few don't even train them. The abs are really almost just a stabilizer muscle with a short range of motion. They are contracting in so many exercises like squats, deadlifts, tricep pushdowns, standing presses and others. You can't go wrong though doing standard exercises like weighted crunches, hanging leg raises and the rest.
I agree with you. The Abs are trained in a very short range of Motion..a crunch, reverse crunch.   There are many variations and Hanging reverse crunch is in my opinion  extreme enough. I find in the Gym that People who use external poundages on ab machines do not really "feel" their Abs working. Cable crunches kneeling on the floor are not bad. At the end of the Day if your Body fat is low you will see your abs with any Ab Exercise. i think it depends on your Body type as well.
Report to moderator   Logged
jpm101
Getbig IV
****
Gender: Male
Posts: 2586


« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2014, 12:12:53 PM »

Those Ab leverage exercises, BB/DB raised overhead like a BP and the weight held in the straight arm pullover position at the start, were shown to me by a couple of retired circus/high wire acrobats here in San Diego. This man and his wife still had exceptional Abs in their late 50's and still strong. Also still impressed by their forearm and back developments.

Acrobats and people doing Handstand routines are unusually strong in leverage, holds and slower muscle control movements. A functional kind of strength not found among BB'ers or lifters. Tend to train with their partners, using them as live weight resistance, with either two hands or one. The Abs are used in just about every movement they do...unbelievable strength indeed.

They taught me the advantage of doing one arm pullups..and the slow negative lowering of he body. A whole different level of strength involved.

        Good Luck.
Report to moderator   Logged

F
JasonH
Getbig V
*****
Gender: Male
Posts: 11368



« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2014, 07:48:38 AM »

My abs have always been terrible and have only got them to respond and thicken by doing weighted exercises only. I appreciate diet plays a significant role too but my diet has always been good so I know that's not the problem. You can't tone what you don't have so build up first with resistance then cut down.
Report to moderator   Logged
Wolfox
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 6529



« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2014, 09:05:56 AM »

Weighted ab exercises are key. Luke jpm said treat them like other muscle groups.
Report to moderator   Logged

A
Donny
Competitors II
Getbig V
******
Gender: Male
Posts: 9353



WWW
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2014, 02:22:21 AM »

Weighted ab exercises are key. Luke jpm said treat them like other muscle groups.
some great Bodybuilders never use weight on Abs. Use your mind and not external poundages to work them. I see guys all the time using weight on machine crunches and when i ask them if they feel their abs working...well they almost always take a pause think and say no..not really. Superset hanging leg raises with crunches. If using weight was the Thing to do we would all have outstanding abs, there are more factors involved. Indeed Bill Pearl told me on the phone he never used weights on abs. Not saying he had the best abs but for a big man well not too bad.
Report to moderator   Logged
Donny
Competitors II
Getbig V
******
Gender: Male
Posts: 9353



WWW
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2014, 03:16:19 AM »

I myself still do full situps and now and again machine crunches but if you really want to hit your abs in the best way possible crunches are king. Double crunches on the floor are outstanding. Some crunch machines if well constructed are ok but most donīt hit the muscles enough. you will get the same Stimulation from heavy deadlifts, if not more so. this Video is funny but at the same time is true...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwljsCs1agM&list=PLfWIB2HAAcLfihcJVR74jW8dYO3rbgX1L
Report to moderator   Logged
funk51
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 16847


Getbig!


« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2014, 08:27:37 AM »

like everything else genetics plays a big part. boyer coe didn't get abs till he was older?HuhHuhHuh??


* boy coe vic pose.jpg (79.64 KB, 376x750 - viewed 330 times.)
Report to moderator   Logged
funk51
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 16847


Getbig!


« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2014, 08:30:22 AM »

better illustration young coe and older coe.


* bc hhjj.jpg (42.36 KB, 442x747 - viewed 330 times.)

* bc ia.jpg (47.27 KB, 413x767 - viewed 327 times.)
Report to moderator   Logged
funk51
Getbig V
*****
Posts: 16847


Getbig!


« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2014, 08:32:17 AM »

bodyfat means a lot of course.


* b harris.jpg (21.51 KB, 316x263 - viewed 339 times.)
Report to moderator   Logged
jpm101
Getbig IV
****
Gender: Male
Posts: 2586


« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2014, 11:29:14 AM »

Just my view, but I think a BB'ers looks more complete with a good set of impressive abs.

A good example might be Coe the younger and Coe the elder, as shown by Funk. Just about anyone can have ab's, but the highlighted muscular ridges are more that more impressive, to me anyway, than the flat ab look (young Coe).  Good Luck.
Report to moderator   Logged

F
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Theme created by Egad Community. Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!