Author Topic: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples  (Read 7747 times)

Dos Equis

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These laws are going to die.  The folks who are steamrolling the ongoing seismic societal shift believe sexual preference trumps the First Amendment, and I think they will win at the end of the day.  Going to be a lot of wrangling over this stuff. 

Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
By Ben Brumfield and Dana Ford, CNN
Thu February 13, 2014
 
(CNN) -- Denying services to same-sex couples may soon become legal in Kansas.

House Bill 2453 explicitly protects religious individuals, groups and businesses that refuse services to same-sex couples, particularly those looking to tie the knot.

It passed the state's Republican-dominated House on Wednesday with a vote of 72-49, and has gone to the Senate for a vote.

Such a law may seem unnecessary in a state where same-sex marriage is banned, but some Kansas lawmakers think different.

They want to prevent religious individuals and organizations from getting sued, or otherwise punished, for not providing goods or services to gay couples -- or for not recognizing their marriages or committed relationship as valid.

This includes employees of the state.

The politics
The law claims to protect the rights of religious people, but gender rights advocates such as Equality Kansas are dismayed.

"Kansans across the state are rightly appalled that legislators are spending their efforts to pass yet another piece of legislation that seeks to enshrine discrimination against gay and lesbian people into law," state chairwoman Sandra Meade said.

"HB 2453 is a blatant attempt to maintain second-class citizen status for taxpaying gay and lesbian Kansans."

Despite the blowback, its chances of passing seem pretty good.

Republicans dominate the state's Senate and Gov. Sam Brownback is a conservative Christian known for taking a public stand against same-sex marriage.

Brownback has already praised the bill in an interview with a local newspaper.

"Americans have constitutional rights, among them the right to exercise their religious beliefs and the right for every human life to be treated with respect and dignity," he told The Topeka Capital-Journal.

The details
HB 2453 is titled "An act concerning religious freedoms with respect to marriage" and covers many bases.

It reads, in part: "No individual or religious entity shall be required by any governmental entity to do any of the following, if it would be contrary to the sincerely held religious beliefs of the individual or religious entity regarding sex or gender:

"Provide any services, accommodations, advantages, facilities, goods, or privileges; provide counseling, adoption, foster care and other social services; or provide employment or employment benefits, related to, or related to the celebration of, any marriage, domestic partnership, civil union or similar arrangement."

Anyone who turns away a gay couple not only can't face a civil suit, but if anyone tries to sue, they could get nailed with the other side's legal fees.
There are some small concession in the bill to gay couples.

If an employee at a nonreligious or government business refuses to serve a gay or lesbian couple for religious reasons, the manager is obligated to find another employee who will oblige.

It also explicitly says that the law does not authorize discrimination against anyone, including clergy, who performs or supports same-sex unions.

The trend
The Kansas bill would seem to buck the trend.

Laws approving same-sex marriage have recently passed in many parts of the United States, bringing the total number of states where it is legal to 17. Add to that the District of Columbia.

Worldwide, 16 other countries (and parts of Mexico) also have laws allowing same-sex marriage and domestic partnerships. Most of the nations are in Europe and South America.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/13/us/kansas-bill-same-sex-services/index.html

Vince G, CSN MFT

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2014, 08:22:05 AM »
These laws are going to die.  The folks who are steamrolling the ongoing seismic societal shift believe sexual preference trumps the First Amendment, and I think they will win at the end of the day.  Going to be a lot of wrangling over this stuff. 

Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
By Ben Brumfield and Dana Ford, CNN
Thu February 13, 2014
 
(CNN) -- Denying services to same-sex couples may soon become legal in Kansas.

House Bill 2453 explicitly protects religious individuals, groups and businesses that refuse services to same-sex couples, particularly those looking to tie the knot.

It passed the state's Republican-dominated House on Wednesday with a vote of 72-49, and has gone to the Senate for a vote.

Such a law may seem unnecessary in a state where same-sex marriage is banned, but some Kansas lawmakers think different.

They want to prevent religious individuals and organizations from getting sued, or otherwise punished, for not providing goods or services to gay couples -- or for not recognizing their marriages or committed relationship as valid.

This includes employees of the state.

The politics
The law claims to protect the rights of religious people, but gender rights advocates such as Equality Kansas are dismayed.

"Kansans across the state are rightly appalled that legislators are spending their efforts to pass yet another piece of legislation that seeks to enshrine discrimination against gay and lesbian people into law," state chairwoman Sandra Meade said.

"HB 2453 is a blatant attempt to maintain second-class citizen status for taxpaying gay and lesbian Kansans."

Despite the blowback, its chances of passing seem pretty good.

Republicans dominate the state's Senate and Gov. Sam Brownback is a conservative Christian known for taking a public stand against same-sex marriage.

Brownback has already praised the bill in an interview with a local newspaper.

"Americans have constitutional rights, among them the right to exercise their religious beliefs and the right for every human life to be treated with respect and dignity," he told The Topeka Capital-Journal.

The details
HB 2453 is titled "An act concerning religious freedoms with respect to marriage" and covers many bases.

It reads, in part: "No individual or religious entity shall be required by any governmental entity to do any of the following, if it would be contrary to the sincerely held religious beliefs of the individual or religious entity regarding sex or gender:

"Provide any services, accommodations, advantages, facilities, goods, or privileges; provide counseling, adoption, foster care and other social services; or provide employment or employment benefits, related to, or related to the celebration of, any marriage, domestic partnership, civil union or similar arrangement."

Anyone who turns away a gay couple not only can't face a civil suit, but if anyone tries to sue, they could get nailed with the other side's legal fees.
There are some small concession in the bill to gay couples.

If an employee at a nonreligious or government business refuses to serve a gay or lesbian couple for religious reasons, the manager is obligated to find another employee who will oblige.

It also explicitly says that the law does not authorize discrimination against anyone, including clergy, who performs or supports same-sex unions.

The trend
The Kansas bill would seem to buck the trend.

Laws approving same-sex marriage have recently passed in many parts of the United States, bringing the total number of states where it is legal to 17. Add to that the District of Columbia.

Worldwide, 16 other countries (and parts of Mexico) also have laws allowing same-sex marriage and domestic partnerships. Most of the nations are in Europe and South America.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/13/us/kansas-bill-same-sex-services/index.html



Glad they did it.  Its plenty of ammo for us to destroy the flat earther's as it makes them hypocrites on wanting small government not interfering with people's lives yet using that same government to disenfranchise others.  Come election time, we're going to once again beat the shit out of the 47er's
A

Mr.1derful

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2014, 08:39:33 AM »


Glad they did it.  Its plenty of ammo for us to destroy the flat earther's as it makes them hypocrites on wanting small government not interfering with people's lives yet using that same government to disenfranchise others.  Come election time, we're going to once again beat the shit out of the 47er's

Institutions should have the full right to refuse to perform a ceremony that is contradictory to the tenants of their beliefs.  It's that simple.  The gay propaganda is way out of hand and needs to stop.  Stop trying to infringe upon others who don't espouse your lifestyle choices.  Why should you have the right to choose your lifestyle of choice and have your own beliefs, but others are not entitled to those same rights, if they are in opposition to yours?

tonymctones

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2014, 08:49:31 AM »
Why should you have the right to choose your lifestyle of choice and have your own beliefs, but others are not entitled to those same rights, if they are in opposition to yours?
its called liberal tolerance bro...

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2014, 08:55:12 AM »
Institutions should have the full right to refuse to perform a ceremony that is contradictory to the tenants of their beliefs.  It's that simple.  The gay propaganda is way out of hand and needs to stop.  Stop trying to infringe upon others who don't espouse your lifestyle choices.  Why should you have the right to choose your lifestyle of choice and have your own beliefs, but others are not entitled to those same rights, if they are in opposition to yours?

Why reason with this guy?  Reading his posts it's pretty obvious he is clueless. 

Vince G, CSN MFT

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2014, 09:32:24 AM »
Institutions should have the full right to refuse to perform a ceremony that is contradictory to the tenants of their beliefs.  It's that simple.  The gay propaganda is way out of hand and needs to stop.  Stop trying to infringe upon others who don't espouse your lifestyle choices.  Why should you have the right to choose your lifestyle of choice and have your own beliefs, but others are not entitled to those same rights, if they are in opposition to yours?


No, they don't have the right to refuse.  They basically stepped on the Civil Rights Act.  It will of course be thrown out by a federal judge but it just makes the GOP look really stupid
A

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2014, 09:34:11 AM »

No, they don't have the right to refuse.  They basically stepped on the Civil Rights Act.  It will of course be thrown out by a federal judge but it just makes the GOP look really stupid

They should have that right. 

OzmO

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2014, 10:04:27 AM »
They should not.

It's simply another form of discrimination.  

Some of you people need to get over yourselves.

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2014, 10:08:52 AM »
They should not.

It's simply another form of discrimination.  

Some of you people need to get over yourselves.

And? 

Mr.1derful

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2014, 10:22:52 AM »

No, they don't have the right to refuse.  They basically stepped on the Civil Rights Act.  It will of course be thrown out by a federal judge but it just makes the GOP look really stupid

Yes, they certainly do.  Otherwise, you're infringing on other people's beliefs and values.  You're a hypocrite.  You want the freedom to believe and live how you wish, but don't want to allow others the same liberty.  You want to force your lifestyle down people's throats.  What about other people's civil rights?  Funny how it only works one way with you people.  

OzmO

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2014, 12:05:35 PM »
Discrimination is not a civil right. 

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2014, 12:08:38 PM »
Discrimination is not a civil right. 

It should be.

Emmortal

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2014, 12:27:43 PM »
This is exactly why government shouldn't be involved in marriage whatsoever.  I don't see what the problem is with not marrying someone if it conflicts with their religious beliefs.

This just screams of gays wanting to throw it in peoples face just because they can.  It's not difficult to go find someone to marry them that doesn't have a problem with it.

Mr.1derful

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2014, 01:01:15 PM »
This is exactly why government shouldn't be involved in marriage whatsoever.  I don't see what the problem is with not marrying someone if it conflicts with their religious beliefs.

This just screams of gays wanting to throw it in peoples face just because they can.  It's not difficult to go find someone to marry them that doesn't have a problem with it.

Exactly. 

Roger Bacon

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #14 on: February 15, 2014, 01:38:43 PM »
It should be.

x2

You should be able to refuse your services to anyone for any reason.

blacken700

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2014, 01:54:21 PM »
you should be able to drive your car at any speed down the road  :D

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2014, 02:17:44 PM »
you should be able to drive your car at any speed down the road  :D


Apples and oranges.

Roger Bacon

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2014, 02:18:19 PM »
Apples and oranges.

Don't bother, he's an idiot.

blacken700

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2014, 02:33:20 PM »
Don't bother, he's an idiot.
says the moron that doesn't realize that's why we have laws,so idiots like you don't do shit because you think it's right  :D

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2014, 02:56:52 PM »
says the moron that doesn't realize that's why we have laws,so idiots like you don't do shit because you think it's right  :D

This is how it works.  If you aren't allowed in a restaurant you eat some where else.

Roger Bacon

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2014, 03:05:02 PM »
This is how it works.  If you aren't allowed in a restaurant you eat some where else.

Fools like him would rather have the government intervene and force a private individual to serve him against their will.



StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2014, 03:07:00 PM »
Fools like him would rather have the government intervene and force a private individual to serve him against their will.




They can't make a distinction between something being wrong morally and something requiring a law to make it illegal. These are the kinds of people who create hate speech laws that squash free speech because they don't like it.

blacken700

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2014, 03:48:50 PM »
laws are there so idiots like you two don't take things in your own hands  :D  :D the fact is we have to have laws because of idiots like you  :D :D

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2014, 03:50:29 PM »
laws are there so idiots like you two don't take things in your own hands  :D  :D the fact is we have to have laws because of idiots like you  :D :D

Oh please, you've failed to answer any of the arguments presented against your position.

blacken700

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Re: Kansas House passes bill allowing refusal of service to same-sex couples
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2014, 03:53:31 PM »
no,your just to dumb to understand,are you the guy who was arguing about Mexican food a while back