Author Topic: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi  (Read 13436 times)

tommywishbone

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #75 on: August 28, 2014, 04:08:40 PM »
I heard next week they're going to put her in a nitro burning dragster.  Kids going to get her own reality show.

 ;D LOL. Perhaps get her a job working on an oil rig after a stint at driving a top fuel car. 
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Schnauzer

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #76 on: August 28, 2014, 04:34:14 PM »





_bruce_

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #77 on: August 28, 2014, 04:40:15 PM »
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SamoanIrishman

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #78 on: August 28, 2014, 04:55:30 PM »
Close the range, sue the place and put the parents in jail. Complete fuckin idiots. I hunt and carry and believe in teaching gun use and safety to my kids but this was like giving a new 15yr old driver a limbo.

My kids start at the range firing single shot high powered air rifles at 50yrds when they are about 10yrs old to learn safety, holds and other important lessons. At 12 they graduate to .22lr and squirrel hunting. 15yrs we move to shotguns for pheasant hunting and move to .22lr handgun training.

Once they have mastered safety handling and cleaning detail I will let them try some of my other calibers... mostly just to get a sense of respect for the power these little machines can put out.

We go practice maybe 4x a year otherwise all is in a large safe away from curious hands.

I'm not going to say if I have pre-ban full auto's but I can assure you there is no reason in hell my kids need to learn how to shoot one. If they want to that bad they can join the USMC like I did.

pellius

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #79 on: August 28, 2014, 05:02:59 PM »
Close the range, sue the place and put the parents in jail. Complete fuckin idiots. I hunt and carry and believe in teaching gun use and safety to my kids but this was like giving a new 15yr old driver a limbo.

My kids start at the range firing single shot high powered air rifles at 50yrds when they are about 10yrs old to learn safety, holds and other important lessons. At 12 they graduate to .22lr and squirrel hunting. 15yrs we move to shotguns for pheasant hunting and move to .22lr handgun training.

Once they have mastered safety handling and cleaning detail I will let them try some of my other calibers... mostly just to get a sense of respect for the power these little machines can put out.

We go practice maybe 4x a year otherwise all is in a large safe away from curious hands.

I'm not going to say if I have pre-ban full auto's but I can assure you there is no reason in hell my kids need to learn how to shoot one. If they want to that bad they can join the USMC like I did.

What rules did the range break? The reason they allowed a 9 year old to shoot is because the minimum age is 8. If you want to change the age limit that's
a fair point. If someone hurts themselves in the gym by improperly using the equipment is it the gym owners fault?

And the question is not what reason does a kid need to shoot an Uzi. What reason is there for someone to drive a Lambo or Ferrari? The question is, is it safe for a 9 year old, or anyone really, without prior experience to start blasting away with a firearm like an Uzi. I don't think it is and the little girl should not have been firing that gun.

tommywishbone

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #80 on: August 28, 2014, 06:04:02 PM »
What rules did the range break? The reason they allowed a 9 year old to shoot is because the minimum age is 8. If you want to change the age limit that's
a fair point. If someone hurts themselves in the gym by improperly using the equipment is it the gym owners fault?

And the question is not what reason does a kid need to shoot an Uzi. What reason is there for someone to drive a Lambo or Ferrari? The question is, is it safe for a 9 year old, or anyone really, without prior experience to start blasting away with a firearm like an Uzi. I don't think it is and the little girl should not have been firing that gun.

The rule of common sense.  The rule that anyone with an IQ over 37 would know instinctively; giving a nine year old girl a machine gun will not end well.    Close the range.  Jail the parents.  
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wolfrittner

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #81 on: August 28, 2014, 06:23:58 PM »
What the fuck is a 9 year old girl doing with an "Uzi"? Killing someone? What else can happen?
That girl will be dramatized for life. Parents should go to jail and then  do seminars why 9 year old children should not shoot Uzis or any kind of firearms.

The Abdominal Snoman

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #82 on: August 28, 2014, 07:06:32 PM »
Maybe she just watched Jamie Lee Curtis in Arnolds movie True Lies and thought that is how you're suppose to shoot


tommywishbone

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #83 on: August 29, 2014, 12:07:38 AM »
Maybe she just watched Jamie Lee Curtis in Arnolds movie True Lies and thought that is how you're suppose to shoot



LOL.  Nice... As gun bounces down the stairs and kills everyone.
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Nirvana

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #84 on: August 29, 2014, 03:10:47 AM »
It was mostly just done so some redneck could try to make his child look tough and troll the liberals. Epic literal backfire.

SamoanIrishman

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #85 on: August 31, 2014, 10:25:40 AM »
The rule of common sense.  The rule that anyone with an IQ over 37 would know instinctively; giving a nine year old girl a machine gun will not end well.    Close the range.  Jail the parents.  

Exactly.

pellius

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #86 on: September 03, 2014, 06:06:49 PM »
The rule of common sense.  The rule that anyone with an IQ over 37 would know instinctively; giving a nine year old girl a machine gun will not end well.    Close the range.  Jail the parents.  

Legality and common sense are not necessarily the same. Often they are mutually exclusive. The argument was whether the range should be sued.
Whether they violated the rules of common sense is not the same as whether or not they violated the rules of the range and the laws of the State. If you want the rules and laws changed that is a fair point. But it applies only AFTER you change the rules or laws. It cannot be enforced retroactively.

No rules or laws have been broken.


SamoanIrishman

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #87 on: September 04, 2014, 09:11:28 PM »
No rules were broken fine still jail the parents. Imagine their answer to the judges one question - Why did you pay to have your 9yr old fire an automatic weapon?

Possible fucked up dumb ass answers??
- uh cause we though it would be funny
- because she wanted to and we let her make decisions when it comes to firearms
-we needed to judge her stance and shooting technique
-the instructor said he only respects 9yr olds who can fire automatic weapons
- we thought it'd be funny to see the sheer terror on her face as she loses control and gets someone's brain matter all over herself
-we go duck hinting your honor and she can't handle a shotgun so we figured she'd have a good chance getting a duck with the spray and pray method of an automatic weapon.
-we are planning on moving to Ukraine, Sudan or even Israel so we wanted to make sure she passes basic rebel boot camp basics

Purge_WTF

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #88 on: September 06, 2014, 08:17:31 AM »
I'm all for the 2nd Amendment, but a good rule of thumb would be to not hand a kid a gun that's almost as big as they are.

pellius

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #89 on: September 06, 2014, 05:09:29 PM »
No rules were broken fine still jail the parents. Imagine their answer to the judges one question - Why did you pay to have your 9yr old fire an automatic weapon?

Possible fucked up dumb ass answers??
- uh cause we though it would be funny
- because she wanted to and we let her make decisions when it comes to firearms
-we needed to judge her stance and shooting technique
-the instructor said he only respects 9yr olds who can fire automatic weapons
- we thought it'd be funny to see the sheer terror on her face as she loses control and gets someone's brain matter all over herself
-we go duck hinting your honor and she can't handle a shotgun so we figured she'd have a good chance getting a duck with the spray and pray method of an automatic weapon.
-we are planning on moving to Ukraine, Sudan or even Israel so we wanted to make sure she passes basic rebel boot camp basics

In this country you have to break a law to go to jail.

You think the parents are happy about this? You think it's a joke? Their 9 year old just killed a man. Their daughter will forever be scarred for this and it's will loom over her life time. You don't think the parents are traumatize because of this?

A horrible acccident took place and you just want your pound of flesh and where it comes from is secondary.

If anything the instructor should have been more circumspect in who he allows to shoot guns and the type of guns shot no matter what the age. You don't start out a 9 year old on an automatic firearm designed to be used by train military or LE. The instructor is supposed to be the expert. Not the parents or the kid.

tonymctones

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #90 on: September 06, 2014, 07:20:29 PM »
What the fuck is a 9 year old girl doing with an "Uzi"? Killing someone? What else can happen?
That girl will be dramatized for life. Parents should go to jail and then  do seminars why 9 year old children should not shoot Uzis or any kind of firearms.
the fact it was an uzi doesnt mean shit, it is that it was a FULLY AUTOMATIC uzi. A semi automatic uzi would actually be much easier for a kid to shoot as opposed to a hand gun b/c its a a 9mm sub machine gun styled pistol basically and had much less recoil.

tonymctones

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #91 on: September 06, 2014, 07:22:28 PM »
In this country you have to break a law to go to jail.

You think the parents are happy about this? You think it's a joke? Their 9 year old just killed a man. Their daughter will forever be scarred for this and it's will loom over her life time. You don't think the parents are traumatize because of this?

A horrible acccident took place and you just want your pound of flesh and where it comes from is secondary.

If anything the instructor should have been more circumspect in who he allows to shoot guns and the type of guns shot no matter what the age. You don't start out a 9 year old on an automatic firearm designed to be used by train military or LE. The instructor is supposed to be the expert. Not the parents or the kid.
This is pretty much accurate.

It was the responsibility of the instructor to do the right thing and he didnt.

SamoanIrishman

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #92 on: September 07, 2014, 12:27:55 PM »
No. As a parent you have ultimate and final decision responsibility over your kids safety no matter what someone says or suggest you let them do.

Yes the instructor was wrong, but lack of common sense on the parents part allowed for the instructor to talk them not letting this happen.

tonymctones

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #93 on: September 07, 2014, 02:25:13 PM »
No. As a parent you have ultimate and final decision responsibility over your kids safety no matter what someone says or suggest you let them do.

Yes the instructor was wrong, but lack of common sense on the parents part allowed for the instructor to talk them not letting this happen.
I am not excusing the parents but a single person or even a couple cannot be experts at everything. Thus we depend on others who we believe have more education/skill/experience etc in areas where we lack.

You dont suppose a parent should go against doctors orders b/c they feel its not the right call.

The parents were stupid for allowing it to happen but the instructor as the "expert" in the situation should have stepped up and said this is fucking retarded.

pellius

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #94 on: September 07, 2014, 05:58:36 PM »
No. As a parent you have ultimate and final decision responsibility over your kids safety no matter what someone says or suggest you let them do.

Yes the instructor was wrong, but lack of common sense on the parents part allowed for the instructor to talk them not letting this happen.

No. You are wrong. If you hire a driving instructor who is incompetent or irresponsible then it is the instructor's fault not the parents. But you are conflating separate issues. Most would agree that the parents should have been more aware of the risks involved. Maybe they were just clueless about guns and only know by what they see on TV. They thought, and their daughter may have as well, it would be neat and cool to fire a fully automatic weapon like they do on TV having no idea what is involved in handling the firearm. It was incumbent upon the instructor to educate them and he should not have allowed it.

But the issue I was addressing was who should be punished. Both the range and the parents broke no laws. It was obviously an accident and no criminal intent on the part of the little girl. The instructor is dead.

But people just want to sue someone. Put someone in jail. I'm sure if the girl shot herself in the foot or wounded or killed someone else the instructor would be looking at a law suit.

SamoanIrishman

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #95 on: September 07, 2014, 10:08:46 PM »
I see your point but...I still hold parents ultimately responsible. Ignorance is not an acceptable excuse to me. But again I do see your point and respect your opinion. As far as punishment... man I don't know. Maybe the range will get fined? I hope the parents don't have the balls and try to sue that would just be absurd.

What's ultimately sad is someone lost their life and this kid will need therapy for awhile and the parent will have to live with whatever psychological damage this has cause their kid.

pellius

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #96 on: September 08, 2014, 05:52:00 PM »
I see your point but...I still hold parents ultimately responsible. Ignorance is not an acceptable excuse to me. But again I do see your point and respect your opinion. As far as punishment... man I don't know. Maybe the range will get fined? I hope the parents don't have the balls and try to sue that would just be absurd.

What's ultimately sad is someone lost their life and this kid will need therapy for awhile and the parent will have to live with whatever psychological damage this has cause their kid.

Sure parents are responsible for their children's safety. But that only goes so far. They only have so much control. When they hire a baby sitter, send them to school and put them in the hands of a teacher, send them to a doctor..., there is implicit trust. They trust their doctor will be competent and responsible and have the certifications and educational bonafides to back it up. If they screw up then you can take legal action.

You can argue that the parents were irresponsible or at best use poor judgement. But I don't think it merits legal action. The instructor was presumably the expert and should have screened this client better. I mean, if  I sent my daughter to a martial arts school I don't expect her to do live knife training on her first day.

A horrible, horrible thing happen and we want to see someone pay. But the only one that I think was legally responsible is dead.

That nine year old girl should not have been handling a fully automatic rifle. The instructor should have known better. It should have been obvious by how she handled the rifle when it was on single shot mode. If the instructor did not have her shoot the firearm in single shot mode first but started her out on full auto then he was even more incompetent and should never have been be an instructor.

Of course, I am in no way imply that he deserved to be shot in the head. I would like to know more about this instructor's background and experience.

The Ugly

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #97 on: September 08, 2014, 08:07:15 PM »
So she's got that hanging over her the rest of her life. Awesome.

Pray_4_War

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #98 on: September 09, 2014, 05:13:57 PM »
This situation is sad but lets think about the real problem here.  If someone had shown her how to properly fire an Uzi when she was 8, this wouldn't have happened.



kevthekid

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Re: Arizona Shooting Range Instructor Killed by 9 year old Girl With Uzi
« Reply #99 on: September 24, 2014, 09:01:41 AM »
So the 9 year old girls dumbfuck parents allow her to shoot an Uzi? I find it HILARIOUS how that other boy a few months ago that accidentally shot and killed himself got the gun instructor charged with involuntary manslaughter BUT when a little kid kills their instructor she AND her parents are off the hook and it's seen as an "accident"......Fucking bullshit and the reason why I hate the system