After Yesterday`s "No One" Machine Workout...

[Vince B]

I hear what you are saying. Heck, the guys in my gym don't listen to what I say about my system of training. They will listen to suggestions about how to perform various exercises they are not familiar with.

I got the same treatment when I post my theory here. I concluded that everyone with arms over 15 inches in an expert. Not only in building muscle but in nutrition!

Arthur Jones said that people knocked his ideas and even laughed. Eventually they copied him! Now there was a smart guy. However, he didn't get it right about bodybuilding. Partly right.

His theory about how muscles contract wasn't right so that affected everything. It wasn't the intensity that caused hypertrophy. It was partly that. You know it is more.....volume. Yep, that

is what big muscles are good for. Big effort for a short while then repeat again and again. So that is how you should train to get big.

We differ mainly re the amount of rest. I have included in my theory the concept of equivalence. That means there may be many different but equivalent ways to get big. You and I know that

no matter how you get there the end result is exhausted, shaking but pumped muscles. You have to experience those symptoms to grow. You should also be sore the next few days if you are

triggering rapid hypertrophy. So when I read where you said soreness ends after the 9 th week I wondered about the system. I don't advocate using any drugs or supplements. If you can

cause the muscles to grow you should get sufficient hormones released by the body. In old age that is the fountain of youth. It doesn't please me that so many Getbiggers resort to drugs

both to augment muscle size and prevent atrophy in old age. I still have to get my arms to 18 1/2 inches one day soon. Maybe shoot for 19! Now that would be an achievement. Drug free!

I need to design and build a new triceps machine to have a chance to do so rapidly. The darn elbows are too easy to damage when the weights get heavy enough to build big triceps.

[Simple Simon]

I still have to get my arms to 18 1/2 inches one day soon. Maybe shoot for 19! Now that would be an achievement. Drug free!

I need to design and build a new triceps machine to have a chance to do so rapidly

If you were going to have 19 inch arms you would have had them doing barbell curls.

machines dont make arms , intensity does.

[The Ugly]

I hear what you are saying. Heck, the guys in my gym don't listen to what I say about my system of training. They will listen to suggestions about how to perform various exercises they are not familiar with.

I got the same treatment when I post my theory here. I concluded that everyone with arms over 15 inches in an expert. Not only in building muscle but in nutrition!

Arthur Jones said that people knocked his ideas and even laughed. Eventually they copied him! Now there was a smart guy. However, he didn't get it right about bodybuilding. Partly right.

His theory about how muscles contract wasn't right so that affected everything. It wasn't the intensity that caused hypertrophy. It was partly that. You know it is more.....volume. Yep, that

is what big muscles are good for. Big effort for a short while then repeat again and again. So that is how you should train to get big.

We differ mainly re the amount of rest. I have included in my theory the concept of equivalence. That means there may be many different but equivalent ways to get big. You and I know that

no matter how you get there the end result is exhausted, shaking but pumped muscles. You have to experience those symptoms to grow. You should also be sore the next few days if you are

triggering rapid hypertrophy. So when I read where you said soreness ends after the 9 th week I wondered about the system. I don't advocate using any drugs or supplements. If you can

cause the muscles to grow you should get sufficient hormones released by the body. In old age that is the fountain of youth. It doesn't please me that so many Getbiggers resort to drugs

both to augment muscle size and prevent atrophy in old age. I still have to get my arms to 18 1/2 inches one day soon. Maybe shoot for 19! Now that would be an achievement. Drug free!

I need to design and build a new triceps machine to have a chance to do so rapidly. The darn elbows are too easy to damage when the weights get heavy enough to build big triceps.

So guys like Dorian, Mentzer, Labrada, even Haney to a degree, low/lower volume. If one size fits all, how do we explain their growth?

[Vince B]

If you were going to have 19 inch arms you would have had them doing barbell curls.

machines dont make arms , intensity does.

How simple you are. No, intensity is only part of the formula. A certain intensity plus an accumulated time under tension is what is required.

I have the only biceps supinator in the world so how would you know what is possible. I don't like doing barbell or dumbbell curls. I need

more effective machines. I built my own and it allows me to have an absolutely brutal workout. It is just a pity that I tore a biceps decades

ago doing those stupid deadlifts. Had I not had that injury I would have larger arms now. I also have sore elbows from doing heavy pullovers

with 250 pounds way back in 1965. Silly exercise as well.

[Coach is Back!]

I told both Luke Wood and Milos Sarcev I could help them get bigger arms. Luke died before he had a chance. Milos was angry when he read that but we sorted things out.

His training is somewhat like what no one recommends. I prefer longer rests and heavier resistance. I doubt whether lighter weights can build huge arms.

From the photo of no one I can see he has the potential for larger arms, especially triceps. Well, if he used my machines and equipment and followed my

protocols he should gain some size within a month. Half inch at least and maybe more. These guys never show up at my gym to see what I could do for

them.

Oh...you have a solution for bad genetics? Jesus Christ Vince, think a little.

[Vince B]

So guys like Dorian, Mentzer, Labrada, even Haney to a degree, low/lower volume. If one size fits all, how do we explain their growth?

Ray Mentzer stayed at my home for over a year. He trained at my gym as well. He would train muscle groups twice a week. Once directly and once

indirectly. I didn't see him increase the size of his already huge muscles. I concluded that what he did was sufficient to sustain his size.

Don't get me wrong, Ray was an extremely strong individual. His workouts were brief but intense. He used heavy weights.

Dorian Yates is an interesting bodybuilder. We can conclude that what he did was dangerous because he tore several muscles and some severly

like his biceps. That pretty much ended his career. It isn't great training arms with a torn biceps.

I would guess that whatever those guys did it was sufficient to trigger hypertrophy of an extreme order.

Let us do a thought experiment here. If we assume that all bodybuilders with 20 inch arms have similar genetics then if some do significantly

different things to achieve that size we have to conclude that maybe many are doing more than they need. If you grow as much muscle as you

can by ingesting 300 gm of protein that doesn't mean you need that much. It may be that half that amount is sufficient. The same thing goes

for exercise. Maybe 5 hard sets are sufficient to trigger hypertrophy, but most do double or triple that to be sure.

What we have to find out is what is necessary and sufficient to generate hypertrophy.

[Vince B]

Oh...you have a solution for bad genetics? Jesus Christ Vince, think a little.

How can you conclude that Milos and Luke had bad genetics for arms? What I have noticed with some bodybuilders is that they

recruit other muscles when training arms. Thus, they get big shoulders, chest and back while the arms don't grow much. My solution

is to get them to do special exercises that result in severe mechanical tension of the target muscles. That is the only way they are

going to get big arms.

[Coach is Back!]

How can you conclude that Milos and Luke had bad genetics for arms? What I have noticed with some bodybuilders is that they

recruit other muscles when training arms. Thus, they get big shoulders, chest and back while the arms don't grow much. My solution

is to get them to do special exercises that result in severe mechanical tension of the target muscles. That is the only way they are

going to get big arms.

Holy shit....

[Coach is Back!]

How can you conclude that Milos and Luke had bad genetics for arms? What I have noticed with some bodybuilders is that they

recruit other muscles when training arms. Thus, they get big shoulders, chest and back while the arms don't grow much. My solution

is to get them to do special exercises that result in severe mechanical tension of the target muscles. That is the only way they are

going to get big arms.

Fuck Vince, Milo's did like 40 exercises per workout for arms at high reps and still didn't get over 18-19. Lol

[Vince B]

I can't guarantee that Milos would get bigger arms but I am confident I could help.

I have two machines that I haven't seen in other gyms. It does make a difference for arms to have

movements that put more tension on the muscles. For example, the triceps respond better when the elbows

are overhead and stretched. Then you stop the elbows from moving and the triceps get more tension.

The biceps will grow faster by hitting two degrees of freedom. Flexion and supination.

[Vince B]

Fuck Vince, Milo's did like 40 exercises per workout for arms at high reps and still didn't get over 18-19. Lol

Milos had a great gym but he didn't have my equipment. No other gym does.

He still had big arms. Just not big enough to win the Olympia.

[Julio Ceasar]

Can anyone post a picture of that true Adonis up to date picture, how he look RIGHT NOW!! RIGHT FUCKING NOW? AT this mmotherfuckermoment! RIGHT NOW WHEN HE HAVE THIS UNIQUE GREAT TRAININGMETHOD!!!!!!!!! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE! I BET HE LOOK LIKE AGOOD RIGHT NOW: LIKE A FUCKING HEROIC MOTHERFUCKIN GOOOOOD!

How come all the losera always talk, talk talk....they cant do anything accept talk talk talk...

[Julio Ceasar]

If I was KIM JONG UN I would fucking tell the securityguards get out and find him then get him to the Parlament and shop his head off! Fooling my people with stupid ideas make them confused! Man I love dictatorship!

[Simple Simon]

I can't guarantee that Milos would get bigger arms but I am confident I could help.

I have two machines that I haven't seen in other gyms. It does make a difference for arms to have

movements that put more tension on the muscles. For example, the triceps respond better when the elbows

are overhead and stretched. Then you stop the elbows from moving and the triceps get more tension.

The biceps will grow faster by hitting two degrees of freedom. Flexion and supination.

I really wonder what you have ben doing all these years, two machines that do something you cant do with a free weight for arms, Im all ears.
The triceps straightens the arm., thats what it does, so straightning the arm under resistance develops the triceps.

Jeez.

[Julio Ceasar]

Vince Basil most be the kid that was pretty retard as a teenager. But now with 70 years of life experience he can cath up and get along with people 1/3 of his age...

Does he trying to say that one machine is the reason MIlosh dident get big arms? What the fuck is wrong with old man?

[SuperTed]

I can't guarantee that Milos would get bigger arms but I am confident I could help.

I have two machines that I haven't seen in other gyms. It does make a difference for arms to have

movements that put more tension on the muscles. For example, the triceps respond better when the elbows

are overhead and stretched. Then you stop the elbows from moving and the triceps get more tension.

The biceps will grow faster by hitting two degrees of freedom. Flexion and supination.

You are fucking delusional.

[The True Adonis]

Can anyone post a picture of that true Adonis up to date picture, how he look RIGHT NOW!! RIGHT FUCKING NOW? AT this mmotherfuckermoment! RIGHT NOW WHEN HE HAVE THIS UNIQUE GREAT TRAININGMETHOD!!!!!!!!! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE! I BET HE LOOK LIKE AGOOD RIGHT NOW: LIKE A FUCKING HEROIC MOTHERFUCKIN GOOOOOD!

How come all the losera always talk, talk talk....they cant do anything accept talk talk talk...

The last pic I posted on here was in April and I leaned down way more, but couldn`t be really bothered or cared to take any more pics.  In fact, that is the last picture I have taken of myself I believe.  Its just something I don`t really do at all.  

[Vince B]

I really wonder what you have ben doing all these years, two machines that do something you cant do with a free weight for arms, Im all ears.
The triceps straightens the arm., thats what it does, so straightning the arm under resistance develops the triceps.

Jeez.

I am wasting my time debating with some of you blokes. Let us examine triceps pressdowns done on the lat machine with various handles or ropes.

I have even fashioned apparatus where the user can stand with his back resting on a support at an angle. Even when people use my machines

they all cheat when the weight gets heavy. The elbows move. When the elbows move it means different muscles are being recruited to shift the

load and not only the triceps. So you have to try to isolate the triceps and it definitely helps to have pads to rest the triceps on and also pads

to prevent the elbows from moving outwards. Even with these pads some guys cheat. Their shoulders rise up and other muscles are recruited.

It appears that a certain control of the body is required to develop big triceps. Surely one doesn't need some brains to lift weights? I am afraid

knuckleheads are going to have trouble getting really big. Well, they can use someone else's brains!

My biceps machine provides an adjustable resistance for the twisting outward movement. No one machine that I have seen will do that.

I have finally worked out the correct movement of the arc for the curl movement. It isn't as easy as people think. My biceps machine is unique

and it is without a doubt the most effective that has ever been built.

In the photo there are no side pads on the apparatus because they were installed after this photo was taken. You can see how the straight leg allows

the user to be in a powerful position to train triceps. By having the elbow adjacent to the head the triceps are in a stretched position and this is

very effective for keeping mechanical tension on that muscle.

[The True Adonis]

Vince, do you do the machine welding and all the design yourself or do you take your plans and someone does it for you?

[Vince B]

Vince, do you do the machine welding and all the design yourself or do you take your plans and someone does it for you?

I do everything myself. From the design to the upholstery. I had to teach myself welding, fabricating, machining and so on.

I can visualize some machine and then design and build it. Not many bodybuilders have come up with anything original re

equipment. I have designed things from dumbbells to complex machines.

[The True Adonis]

I do everything myself. From the design to the upholstery. I had to teach myself welding, fabricating, machining and so on.

I can visualize some machine and then design and build it. Not many bodybuilders have come up with anything original re

equipment. I have designed things from dumbbells to complex machines.

That is extremely impressive.  Did you have to learn all the correct angles in regards to load bearing, yield strength and all of that?  I am always thinking about how machines and workout equipment should be designed rather than how it currently is and would like to learn what you know one day.  I find that most machines are designed with fulcrums at the wrong point and not being adjustable, ranges of motion that force you to conform to the machine rather than the machine conforming to you, unequal resistance at certain points in movement.  I think a lot of machines value safety over actual function.

[Vince B]

That is extremely impressive.  Did you have to learn all the correct angles in regards to load bearing, yield strength and all of that?  I am always thinking about how machines and workout equipment should be designed rather than how it currently is and would like to learn what you know one day.  I find that most machines are designed with fulcrums at the wrong point and not being adjustable, ranges of motion that force you to conform to the machine rather than the machine conforming to you, unequal resistance at certain points in movement.  I think a lot of machines value safety over actual function.

What has been happening with gym equipment companies is they have been buying the competitors stuff and eventually most get the movements right or good enough.

I was the first to use linear bearings in a Smith Machine. That solves the friction problem and never jams like the old machines did. Now all manufacturers use linear bearings.

Sometimes everyone makes similar machines. Take the leg extension machine. Just about everyone makes an apparatus with the user leaning back slightly and the seat tilted back a bit.

The problem here is that when a big load is used the person tends to come up off the pads. So handles are installed to help hold you down. One manufacturer from the 70s had the user

leaning back substantially more. I eventually did the same and modified a few of my machines. Why? Well, when you lean back a lot more of your bodyweight is lower than the pivot

point and you don't rise off the pads any more. So, someone got it right decades ago but no one copied it.

With the Smith Machine you find the movement isn't quite right for squats and bench presses. However, if the apparatus has approximately a 10 degree angle all of a sudden the movement follows

the correct line the body takes. Makes all the difference in the world.

If you want to design and build equipment then do so as a hobby only. It is far cheaper to buy used gym equipment at auctions, etc. Making you own requires a substantial investment

in engineering machines and tools. You need good tools to do a good job. Auto band saw, lathe, radial drill, Tig-Mig welder, linishers, milling machines, cut off machines, etc., etc.

I have my own engineering factory but I don't make equipment for anyone else. Takes too long and is too expensive and gym owners are basically cheap skates.

[The True Adonis]

What has been happening with gym equipment companies is they have been buying the competitors stuff and eventually most get the movements right or good enough.

I was the first to use linear bearings in a Smith Machine. That solves the friction problem and never jams like the old machines did. Now all manufacturers use linear bearings.

Sometimes everyone makes similar machines. Take the leg extension machine. Just about everyone makes an apparatus with the user leaning back slightly and the seat tilted back a bit.

The problem here is that when a big load is used the person tends to come up off the pads. So handles are installed to help hold you down. One manufacturer from the 70s had the user

leaning back substantially more. I eventually did the same and modified a few of my machines. Why? Well, when you lean back a lot more of your bodyweight is lower than the pivot

point and you don't rise off the pads any more. So, someone got it right decades ago but no one copied it.

With the Smith Machine you find the movement isn't quite right for squats and bench presses. However, if the apparatus has approximately a 10 degree angle all of a sudden the movement follows

the correct line the body takes. Makes all the difference in the world.

If you want to design and build equipment then do so as a hobby only. It is far cheaper to buy used gym equipment at auctions, etc. Making you own requires a substantial investment

in engineering machines and tools. You need good tools to do a good job. Auto band saw, lathe, radial drill, Tig-Mig welder, linishers, milling machines, cut off machines, etc., etc.

I have my own engineering factory but I don't make equipment for anyone else. Takes too long and is too expensive and gym owners are basically cheap skates.

I noticed that about Smith Machines for me.  Smith Machines, every one I have ever used, was way more difficult for me to use than the free weight counterpart.  I could do way more on free weight bench and squat than on the Smith Machine and it always occurred to me that some sort of angle needed to be introduced and you are the first person I have ever heard of noticing and building it.  Do you ever file patents or is that more trouble than its worth if you have no intention of mass producing?

[Marty Champions]

I do everything myself. From the design to the upholstery. I had to teach myself welding, fabricating, machining and so on.

I can visualize some machine and then design and build it. Not many bodybuilders have come up with anything original re

equipment. I have designed things from dumbbells to complex machines.

teach us how to weld vince .do you miss soldering what you?

[Marty Champions]

Any electric workout machines vince.