Author Topic: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????  (Read 44261 times)

pestosterone

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2015, 01:29:30 PM »
When I do a barbell press over head press the lowest I go is my chin and highest just before lock out keep tension on the shoulders and try to keep it controlled was told a long time ago if I want to have fucked up shoulders then let the bar get below your chin puts outward pressure on rotaters my shoulders never hurt from OHP and are well developed in proportion to rest of my body.

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #26 on: May 04, 2015, 03:07:13 PM »
I do standing BB and DB presses on a regular basis.

They actually feel more natural for me to do them standing than seated.


8)

local hero

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #27 on: May 06, 2015, 09:00:55 AM »
When I do a barbell press over head press the lowest I go is my chin and highest just before lock out keep tension on the shoulders and try to keep it controlled was told a long time ago if I want to have fucked up shoulders then let the bar get below your chin puts outward pressure on rotaters my shoulders never hurt from OHP and are well developed in proportion to rest of my body.


Ha, I got a flash back of a guy I knew who used to point his chin unnaturally high, he also had a pointy chin, his range of motion was tiny, he did the exact same thing on inclines..

I agree with you tho, over extending is bad news

jpm101

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #28 on: May 06, 2015, 10:34:21 AM »
Was a trend for a while that most forms of overhead pressed (front..behind the neck) where done in the middle range only and very quickly.  The front press would be from a bit above the top of the head to near the chin area. Seemed to work for them very well. As mentioned, one of the advantages was the TUT (time under tension) factor.  Applied to the incline bench, with the middle rep range, also. Don't see too many doing that middle range thing much, but it does have it's advantages. Funny how guy's change exercise styles often, even if something works fairly well with what they were doing. Human nature I guess.

Never heard any suggestions that lowering the bar below the chin had a negative affect on the shoulders themselves Would believe that the over head extending lockout (the strongest part of the press) calls upon the most tension on the joints  But anyway, help yourself to whatever you may think works the best for you.

Good Luck.
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SF1900

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #29 on: May 06, 2015, 11:10:56 AM »
I actually tried the standing shoulder press on this machine

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pestosterone

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #30 on: May 06, 2015, 11:38:58 AM »
R u really short? Lol looks like it bottoms out at eye level

chaos

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #31 on: May 06, 2015, 12:12:02 PM »
R u really short? Lol looks like it bottoms out at eye level
;D
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SF1900

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2015, 12:29:16 PM »
R u really short? Lol looks like it bottoms out at eye level

Yes lol.

And the arms on the machine go up actually pretty high. A guy average height (5'10") could still go full extension. Probably not anyone over 6'0". They'd have a problem.
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pestosterone

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2015, 02:16:47 PM »
Shit if it feels good on your delts do it

SF1900

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #34 on: May 06, 2015, 03:32:26 PM »
Shit if it feels good on your delts do it


Shoulders were definitely sore today.

Next week Ill try them with dumbbells :)
X

Donny

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #35 on: May 06, 2015, 08:01:58 PM »

Ha, I got a flash back of a guy I knew who used to point his chin unnaturally high, he also had a pointy chin, his range of motion was tiny, he did the exact same thing on inclines..

I agree with you tho, over extending is bad news
yes  why stress your joints at a point where they are under the most stress and at a vulnerable point open to possible injury especially with heavy weight. Some should get with the times and learn anatomy. Good post from pestosterone.

chaos

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #36 on: May 07, 2015, 07:33:59 AM »
Always stop at the chin for strict presses, push presses come down all the way but I tend to arch my back more  for those to keep that weight resting on the body, not the shoulders.
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jpm101

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #37 on: May 07, 2015, 09:01:36 AM »
Some guy's tend to have too wide a hand spacing when doing front presses, which can put undo stress on the shoulder and even the elbow joint structure. A close in grip puts the pressing muscles more inline with the actual press it's self, with the anterior delts, triceps and upper pec's  (yes the upper pec's are involved in overhead pressing, though a minor degree). Like having the thumbs pretty much lined up with the lateral head of the delts.

Stopping at chin level (momentary pause) can put more TUT on the front/lateral delts, which also puts more TUT on the shoulder joints.  Dropping below chin level, with a closer to shoulder grip...never too wide, should not cause any superior tension anymore than stopping at chin level, to the shoulder joints themselves.

Actually overhead pressing can strengthen the tendons and ligament themselves. Some don't realize that when lifting you are not only building more muscle mass but also strengthening those tendons and ligaments around the joints. Which in return encourages more muscle strength. Another reason lockouts and static holds can become important training aids for serious lifters and BB'ers.

Example: I have done dead stop presses off a PR, on past occasions. Set the pins at about shoulder level. The next position of the pins is at eye level. The final pin setting is a little above the top of my head to a couple inches below lockout.   Excellent method to not only increase muscle strength but also training the ligaments and tendons that can allow the lifting of more weight over time.

Good Luck.
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chaos

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #38 on: May 07, 2015, 09:43:12 AM »
Some guy's tend to have too wide a hand spacing when doing front presses, which can put undo stress on the shoulder and even the elbow joint structure. A close in grip puts the pressing muscles more inline with the actual press it's self, with the anterior delts, triceps and upper pec's  (yes the upper pec's are involved in overhead pressing, though a minor degree). Like having the thumbs pretty much lined up with the lateral head of the delts.

Stopping at chin level (momentary pause) can put more TUT on the front/lateral delts, which also puts more TUT on the shoulder joints.  Dropping below chin level, with a closer to shoulder grip...never too wide, should not cause any superior tension anymore than stopping at chin level, to the shoulder joints themselves.

Actually overhead pressing can strengthen the tendons and ligament themselves. Some don't realize that when lifting you are not only building more muscle mass but also strengthening those tendons and ligaments around the joints. Which in return encourages more muscle strength. Another reason lockouts and static holds can become important training aids for serious lifters and BB'ers.

Example: I have done dead stop presses off a PR, on past occasions. Set the pins at about shoulder level. The next position of the pins is at eye level. The final pin setting is a little above the top of my head to a couple inches below lockout.   Excellent method to not only increase muscle strength but also training the ligaments and tendons that can allow the lifting of more weight over time.

Good Luck.
Lol, doing those last week and a guy came over and offered to help me, thought I was stuck. Had to explain the whole concept.
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!


jpm101

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #40 on: May 27, 2015, 09:28:45 AM »
Insightful articles offered by Rammstein. Bill Star(RIP) always gave solid advise, proven by thousands of men over the years. We followed his weight training ideas for football in my high school years, for the most part. Coach/trainers suggested them. Cleans & presses/jerks being one of the keystones of training back then.

I do part ways a little bit on his overhead pressing ideas......just a personal views on my part..not being any expert, always willing to learn different perspective on working out.

Plan to start including overhead rack pressing, following the GVT  (10X10's) protocol. Haven't done any serious OHP'ing for a while, so probably will begin with 205 and see what happens. With GVT you are using the same weight for all sets (100 reps total).

Just to note: if guy's spent the same amount of time overhead pressing, rather than the BP, you might see 250 to 300lbs in regular workouts as fairly common. And with much less shoulders problems than the wrecking ball that overuse benching has shown to be for many men.

Good Luck.
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Rammstein

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #41 on: May 27, 2015, 09:40:52 AM »
Insightful articles offered by Rammstein. Bill Star(RIP) always gave solid advise, proven by thousands of men over the years. We followed his weight training ideas for football in my high school years, for the most part. Coach/trainers suggested them. Cleans & presses/jerks being one of the keystones of training back then.

I do part ways a little bit on his overhead pressing ideas......just a personal views on my part..not being any expert, always willing to learn different perspective on working out.

Plan to start including overhead rack pressing, following the GVT  (10X10's) protocol. Haven't done any serious OHP'ing for a while, so probably will begin with 205 and see what happens. With GVT you are using the same weight for all sets (100 reps total).

Just to note: if guy's spent the same amount of time overhead pressing, rather than the BP, you might see 250 to 300lbs in regular workouts as fairly common. And with much less shoulders problems than the wrecking ball that overuse benching has shown to be for many men.

Good Luck.

Trying to read up on everything I can find from Bill Starr atm. Lots of good advice and ideas.

Regarding GVT I read this recently:

Quote
GVT has been around forever, but I loathed 10x10 as much as the next lifter, until my telephone call with Pavel answered the great question of life, the universe, and everything.

The Answer Is...
2-3-5-10

Let's review my recent workout. With two 53-pound kettlebells, clean the bells once and press them overhead two times. Lower to the floor and rest for a few seconds. Clean the bells once again and press them three times overhead. Rest. On the next "set," press them five times, then briefly rest again. Finally, clean the bells and press them 10 times.

That's twenty repetitions, and not a bad workout by itself. I find myself squeezing hard on reps eight, nine and ten, but nothing's too terrible. I put the bells down, rested a while longer, and then started again at two.

If you do 2-3-5-10 for a total of five sets, you'll have done a total of 100 reps, and your shoulders will be finished for a few days. The upside of this training is that there's very little nervous energy or stress going through the system when you train with this method, unlike 10x10 when you need a force of will to drive through a full workout.

I've found this ideal for all pressing workouts. If you can handle ten pull-ups without too much strain, try it with this, too. Rowing for 100 reps seems risky to me, unless you can maintain quality positions and do quality reps. Please don't try this with any weight or exercise that you're not going to control.

https://www.t-nation.com/training/more-new-techniques-youve-never-tried

Beefjake

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #42 on: May 27, 2015, 08:04:52 PM »
I do standing BB and DB presses on a regular basis.
They actually feel more natural for me to do them standing than seated.
I think that standing presses and the deadlift are two of the most natural movements for the human body.

jpm101

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #43 on: May 28, 2015, 08:18:42 AM »
I might add cleans/high pulls, along with overhead presses and DL's as the more natural movements of the body. When I do any of these I feel I have actually accomplished something in lifting.



Good Luck.
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d0nny2600

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #44 on: May 28, 2015, 09:17:20 AM »
Love them standing and to the front.

polychronopolous

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #45 on: May 28, 2015, 09:54:13 AM »
I might add cleans/high pulls, along with overhead presses and DL's as the more natural movements of the body. When I do any of these I feel I have actually accomplished something in lifting.



Good Luck.

What about the squat?

Man squatted for 1000s of years before chairs and toilets were invented.

Donny

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #46 on: May 28, 2015, 08:07:04 PM »
What about the squat?

Man squatted for 1000s of years before chairs and toilets were invented.
  ;D ;D agree with you there.

local hero

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #47 on: May 28, 2015, 11:00:39 PM »
I've been watching a young lad in our gym do strong man type training, ( no homo ),we have a lot of thick bars, he was doing those clean and presses where you bounce the bar off your stomache, starting with an over under grip, bouncing the bar up you body till I gets to pressing range.... They look brutal, my back couldn't take it, I cant imagine the wear n tear doing those regularly would cause

Donny

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #48 on: May 29, 2015, 07:13:58 AM »
I've been watching a young lad in our gym do strong man type training, ( no homo ),we have a lot of thick bars, he was doing those clean and presses where you bounce the bar off your stomache, starting with an over under grip, bouncing the bar up you body till I gets to pressing range.... They look brutal, my back couldn't take it, I cant imagine the wear n tear doing those regularly would cause
I think clean and press is a great move. However if i do a Bodybuilding type split i will train and tune in on my delts/traps. The Powerlifters argue the point it trains the whole body and core strength.. i agree too with this to a point. Lifting stupid weights for the sake of lifting a 1 rep max or max strength is asking for trouble however. The idea of lifting "Heavy" with a few exercises is not new but i have never known anyone who built an all round physique with this type of training. "Brawn" sure but not a well balanced physique. My point is Local Hero hit the nail on the head.

NaturalWonder83

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Re: STANDING SHOULDER BARBELL PRESS. YAY OR NAY????????????????
« Reply #49 on: May 29, 2015, 08:39:59 PM »
Anyone try the scrape the rack press from John meadows??
w