Carson: "Gravity, where did it come from?"

[Agnostic007]

“It says, in the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth,” continued Dr. Carson.  “It doesn’t say when He created them except for in the beginning. The Earth could have been here for a long time before he started creating things on it.”

[Agnostic007]

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/09/ben-carson-creationism-six-days

Ben Carson, one of the top-tier contenders in the GOP presidential primary, has long been known as an ardent creationist. He has debated prominent scientists who defend evolution, and it's no secret that his advocacy of creationism springs from his deep faith in the Seventh-day Adventist Church, a Christian religion established in the mid-1800s. Creationism is a core belief for many Seventh-day Adventists, and one of the religion's founders, Ellen White, was one of the first purveyors of the notion that the Earth is merely 6,000 years old.

This week, Carson, a retired neurosurgeon, took some heat for his creationism when Buzzfeed reported that during a 2011 lecture that was part of a "Celebration of Creation," Carson decried the Big Bang theory and asserted that Darwin's theory of evolution was "encouraged" by Satan.

In that talk, Carson did take slight issue with White and those creationists who claim the Earth came into existence just several thousand years ago. He noted, "I am not a hard-and-fast person who says the Earth is only 6,000 years old." Yet Carson quickly added, "I do believe in the six-day creation." And he meant literally six days, not metaphorical days—that is, not days that might have lasted millions of years.

[Dos Equis]

“It says, in the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth,” continued Dr. Carson.  “It doesn’t say when He created them except for in the beginning. The Earth could have been here for a long time before he started creating things on it.”

Interesting.  You mean 240 has been lying about Caron's views?  Shocker. 

[Coach is Back!]

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/09/ben-carson-creationism-six-days

Ben Carson, one of the top-tier contenders in the GOP presidential primary, has long been known as an ardent creationist. He has debated prominent scientists who defend evolution, and it's no secret that his advocacy of creationism springs from his deep faith in the Seventh-day Adventist Church, a Christian religion established in the mid-1800s. Creationism is a core belief for many Seventh-day Adventists, and one of the religion's founders, Ellen White, was one of the first purveyors of the notion that the Earth is merely 6,000 years old.

This week, Carson, a retired neurosurgeon, took some heat for his creationism when Buzzfeed reported that during a 2011 lecture that was part of a "Celebration of Creation," Carson decried the Big Bang theory and asserted that Darwin's theory of evolution was "encouraged" by Satan.

In that talk, Carson did take slight issue with White and those creationists who claim the Earth came into existence just several thousand years ago. He noted, "I am not a hard-and-fast person who says the Earth is only 6,000 years old." Yet Carson quickly added, "I do believe in the six-day creation." And he meant literally six days, not metaphorical days—that is, not days that might have lasted millions of years.

Mother Jones? Seriously? Could you pick anything more leftist and bias?

[Agnostic007]

Mother Jones? Seriously? Could you pick anything more leftist and bias?

I picked them for that very reason.. even THEY say he doesn't say he believes in a 6000 year old earth... and if anyone wanted to make him look even more stupid, wouldn't it be Mother Jones? Keep up coach

[avxo]

Mother Jones? Seriously? Could you pick anything more leftist and bias?

Mother Jones is far to the left of the far left, so no argument there. But I am curious, can you identify a single thing in the quoted passage that is not factual?

[240 is Back]

Mother Jones is far to the left of the far left, so no argument there. But I am curious, can you identify a single thing in the quoted passage that is not factual?

no.  he cannot and will not.

it's easy to just say "oh, that source sucks" and never look at the article.  but the article itself has links and video which cannot be refuted.

it's easy to live like that with minimal critical thinking.

[Agnostic007]

no.  he cannot and will not.

it's easy to just say "oh, that source sucks" and never look at the article.  but the article itself has links and video which cannot be refuted.

it's easy to live like that with minimal critical thinking.

and yet, you still say Ben Carson believes in a 6000 year old earth...

[tbombz]

Where did gravity come from?

Carson is not asking a superficial question, but a deep one.

You can say, "well, we think that gravity is a result of bent space-time caused by mass".

Ok. But what causes bent space-time to act in such a way as to cause gravity?


Questions about "how" and "why" things happen are impossible to answer without appeal to God.

You can say "well, X, Y, and Z have been observed to occur prior to or in correlation with the event in question" - but you cannot say anything more than that. No matter what you observe, you always have to ask "what caused that?". Regression as infinitum.

The ultimate cause and reason for phenomena that occurs in the universe is out of the realm of secular scientific study. These are questions of metaphysics that only religious answers apply to.

As for evolution and the age of the earth... yes, most scientists do believe in darwinian theory over billions of years. However, there are people with Phd's who do not believe in those things. Here is a list of just a few:


just a few of the Phd's alive today who believe in Biblical creation=

Dr. Nathaniel T. Jeanseon, PhD in cell and developmental biology from Harvard University.
Dr. Vernon R. Cupps, Ph.D. in nuclear physics Indiana University-Bloomington.
Dr. Jason Lisle, Ph.D. in astrophysics at the University of Colorado.
Dr. John C. Sanford, Ph.D. in plant genetics from University of Wisconsin–Madison.
Dr. Georgia Purdom, PhD in molecular genetics from Ohio State University.
Dr. Leo Hebert III, Ph.D. in physics the University of Texas at Dallas.
Dr. Jeffrey Tomkins, Ph.D. in genetics from Clemson University.
Dr Frank Marsh, Ph.D. in plant ecology from University of Nebraska.
Dr. Danny Faulkner, Ph.D. in Astronomy from Indiana University.
Dr. Russell Humphreys, Ph.D. in physics from Louisiana State University.
Dr. Don Batten, Ph.D. in plant science from the University of Sydney.
Dr. Tas Walker, Ph.D. in mechanical engineering from the University of Queensland.
Dr. Pierre Jerlstrom, Ph.D. in Molecular Biology from Griffith University.
Dr. John G. Hartnett  Ph.D. in Physics at the University of Western Australia.
Dr. Jim Mason, Ph.D. in experimental Nuclear Physics from McMaster University.
Dr. Jonathan Safarti, Ph.D. in Physical Chemistry from Victoria University of Wellington.
Dr. Robert Carter, Ph.D. in Marine Biology from the University of Miami.
Dr. Jay L. Wile, Ph.D. in Nuclear Chemistry from the University of Rochester.




so, it is safe to say that a large majority of scientists do believe in evolution and billions of years; there is still a large number (though small in percentage) who dont. you guys can believe whatever you want to believe. but one thing you cant believe is that every educated and intelligent person will agree with you.

[WOOO]

Ridiculous.

[Necrosis]

Where did gravity come from?

Carson is not asking a superficial question, but a deep one.

Or a completely non-sensical one, why do you assume it has to come from somewhere?

You can say, "well, we think that gravity is a result of bent space-time caused by mass".

Ok. But what causes bent space-time to act in such a way as to cause gravity?

The mass of the object, it is perfectly explained without god, the question you are asking has been answered.



Questions about "how" and "why" things happen are impossible to answer without appeal to God.

Why questions are useless, how questions provide answers. Why am I here versus how am I here, which provides actual answers? why questions are stupid as you are assuming there is a why required, things can just... be.

You can say "well, X, Y, and Z have been observed to occur prior to or in correlation with the event in question" - but you cannot say anything more than that. No matter what you observe, you always have to ask "what caused that?". Regression as infinitum.

Ditto for god, you can't say what caused that and then stop at the answer you find satisfying, god is no more an answer then the magic ju ju, it explains nothing, is intellectual lazy and clearly fucking wrong. You won't even follow your own logic path, you make a statement that all needs a creator then circumvent that by adding a stipulation that the christian god is exempt from this rule, do you know what cognitive dissonance is?


The ultimate cause and reason for phenomena that occurs in the universe is out of the realm of secular scientific study. These are questions of metaphysics that only religious answers apply to.

You sure are pretty fucking certain of yourself, this seems to be a pattern, you are arrogant and ignorant, it's painful to watch your life fall apart in front of our eyes, the reason ultimately being your weakness, mentally in particular.

As for evolution and the age of the earth... yes, most scientists do believe in darwinian theory over billions of years. However, there are people with Phd's who do not believe in those things. Here is a list of just a few:

No no no... no scientist that is worth a grain of salt believes the earth is 6000 years old, that would mean denying reality, aka anti-science. We know for a FACT the earth is not 6000, people believe the earth is flat, in fact some PHD's do, does that mean it's a valid position? no. This stupid song and dance you are doing by appealing to authority is hilarious, what evidence do they have? so is the earth flat? did you want a list of just a few? so while the majority of scientists believe the earth is a globe, some do not, this means the earth could be flat, all opinions are valid if you have a PHD. You have people on this list that do nothing with evolution, how retarded is that? who gives a flying fuck what they think? ideas are a dime a dozen, proving something objectively is hard, something you will never experience as you are intellectually lazy and clearly have brutal OCD. you are suffering from a common symptom, hyper religiousness or scrupulosity, bet those drugs made it go away, didn't they?



just a few of the Phd's alive today who believe in Biblical creation=


Dr. Nathaniel T. Jeanseon, PhD in cell and developmental biology from Harvard University.
Dr. Vernon R. Cupps, Ph.D. in nuclear physics Indiana University-Bloomington.
Dr. Jason Lisle, Ph.D. in astrophysics at the University of Colorado.
Dr. John C. Sanford, Ph.D. in plant genetics from University of Wisconsin–Madison.
Dr. Georgia Purdom, PhD in molecular genetics from Ohio State University.
Dr. Leo Hebert III, Ph.D. in physics the University of Texas at Dallas.
Dr. Jeffrey Tomkins, Ph.D. in genetics from Clemson University.
Dr Frank Marsh, Ph.D. in plant ecology from University of Nebraska.
Dr. Danny Faulkner, Ph.D. in Astronomy from Indiana University.
Dr. Russell Humphreys, Ph.D. in physics from Louisiana State University.
Dr. Don Batten, Ph.D. in plant science from the University of Sydney.
Dr. Tas Walker, Ph.D. in mechanical engineering from the University of Queensland.
Dr. Pierre Jerlstrom, Ph.D. in Molecular Biology from Griffith University.
Dr. John G. Hartnett  Ph.D. in Physics at the University of Western Australia.
Dr. Jim Mason, Ph.D. in experimental Nuclear Physics from McMaster University.
Dr. Jonathan Safarti, Ph.D. in Physical Chemistry from Victoria University of Wellington.
Dr. Robert Carter, Ph.D. in Marine Biology from the University of Miami.
Dr. Jay L. Wile, Ph.D. in Nuclear Chemistry from the University of Rochester.




so, it is safe to say that a large majority of scientists do believe in evolution and billions of years; there is still a large number (though small in percentage) who dont. you guys can believe whatever you want to believe. but one thing you cant believe is that every educated and intelligent person will agree with you.

Who gives a fuck what some idiots believe, what can they prove? you clearly have never attended a real school, educated people have to prove their position, there beliefs are rooted in fact, so they believe not what they want, but what appears to be real. You seem to value opinion over fact, usually someone is right and someone is wrong if they are talking opposite positions, objective data comes in and trumps your feelings, thoughts and logic, someone is correct like 1+1=2, and someone is wrong, the people on the above list are wrong, they have zero evidence and every field of science opposing them. There is no debate tbombz, just like there is no debate about 1+1=2, you could find PHD's I am sure, but again, that isn't an argument but a fallacy. Are logical fallacies no longer applicable to you? are you above logic?

Show me your evidence of a young earth, I could use a laugh and the mental stimulation.

[WOOO]

Who gives a fuck what some idiots believe, what can they prove? you clearly have never attended a real school, educated people have to prove their position, there beliefs are rooted in fact, so they believe not what they want, but what appears to be real. You seem to value opinion over fact, usually someone is right and someone is wrong if they are talking opposite positions, objective data comes in and trumps your feelings, thoughts and logic, someone is correct like 1+1=2, and someone is wrong, the people on the above list are wrong, they have zero evidence and every field of science opposing them. There is no debate tbombz, just like there is no debate about 1+1=2, you could find PHD's I am sure, but again, that isn't an argument but a fallacy. Are logical fallacies no longer applicable to you? are you above logic?

Show me your evidence of a young earth, I could use a laugh and the mental stimulation.

Next he will post mathematical fallacies to prove that 1+1 doesn't equal 2....

http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/57131.html

[whork]

Where did gravity come from?

Carson is not asking a superficial question, but a deep one.

You can say, "well, we think that gravity is a result of bent space-time caused by mass".

Ok. But what causes bent space-time to act in such a way as to cause gravity?


Questions about "how" and "why" things happen are impossible to answer without appeal to God.

You can say "well, X, Y, and Z have been observed to occur prior to or in correlation with the event in question" - but you cannot say anything more than that. No matter what you observe, you always have to ask "what caused that?". Regression as infinitum.

The ultimate cause and reason for phenomena that occurs in the universe is out of the realm of secular scientific study. These are questions of metaphysics that only religious answers apply to.

As for evolution and the age of the earth... yes, most scientists do believe in darwinian theory over billions of years. However, there are people with Phd's who do not believe in those things. Here is a list of just a few:


just a few of the Phd's alive today who believe in Biblical creation=

Dr. Nathaniel T. Jeanseon, PhD in cell and developmental biology from Harvard University.
Dr. Vernon R. Cupps, Ph.D. in nuclear physics Indiana University-Bloomington.
Dr. Jason Lisle, Ph.D. in astrophysics at the University of Colorado.
Dr. John C. Sanford, Ph.D. in plant genetics from University of Wisconsin–Madison.
Dr. Georgia Purdom, PhD in molecular genetics from Ohio State University.
Dr. Leo Hebert III, Ph.D. in physics the University of Texas at Dallas.
Dr. Jeffrey Tomkins, Ph.D. in genetics from Clemson University.
Dr Frank Marsh, Ph.D. in plant ecology from University of Nebraska.
Dr. Danny Faulkner, Ph.D. in Astronomy from Indiana University.
Dr. Russell Humphreys, Ph.D. in physics from Louisiana State University.
Dr. Don Batten, Ph.D. in plant science from the University of Sydney.
Dr. Tas Walker, Ph.D. in mechanical engineering from the University of Queensland.
Dr. Pierre Jerlstrom, Ph.D. in Molecular Biology from Griffith University.
Dr. John G. Hartnett  Ph.D. in Physics at the University of Western Australia.
Dr. Jim Mason, Ph.D. in experimental Nuclear Physics from McMaster University.
Dr. Jonathan Safarti, Ph.D. in Physical Chemistry from Victoria University of Wellington.
Dr. Robert Carter, Ph.D. in Marine Biology from the University of Miami.
Dr. Jay L. Wile, Ph.D. in Nuclear Chemistry from the University of Rochester.




so, it is safe to say that a large majority of scientists do believe in evolution and billions of years; there is still a large number (though small in percentage) who dont. you guys can believe whatever you want to believe. but one thing you cant believe is that every educated and intelligent person will agree with you.

No scientist's believe the earth is 5000 years old. Science says the earth is billions years old, not believing this fact is not believing in science, and therefore you are not a scientist.

[Necrosis]

Next he will post mathematical fallacies to prove that 1+1 doesn't equal 2....

http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/57131.html

LMAO

it's to funny, basic math can be fucking concretely described. That is, I have one can of pepsi, I buy another can, I have two can's of pepsi 1+1= 2. Terrence howard the actor is crazy and thinks that 1x something cannot be itself, lol. He wrote a paper on it, it's pure comedy, pretty sure he is high on drugs like TBOMBZ.

I was at dinner with a couple the other night, fine dining so a quite evening with a few drinks. She is in the field of woman's studies, a PHD, all my other conversations with her have been great, she seems bright etc. we talk about feminism, holy fuck she goes on to claim men and woman use to be equal size, strength etc that that societal pressures induced the changes we see now, saying gender is all society, there is no natural inclinations. Hilarious.

I wonder if she ever stopped to think about why men don't get osteoporosis? our bones are denser, making use heavier, stronger, more durable, less likely to injure, from testosterone.

[WOOO]

LMAO

it's to funny, basic math can be fucking concretely described. That is, I have one can of pepsi, I buy another can, I have two can's of pepsi 1+1= 2. Terrence howard the actor is crazy and thinks that 1x something cannot be itself, lol. He wrote a paper on it, it's pure comedy, pretty sure he is high on drugs like TBOMBZ.

I was at dinner with a couple the other night, fine dining so a quite evening with a few drinks. She is in the field of woman's studies, a PHD, all my other conversations with her have been great, she seems bright etc. we talk about feminism, holy fuck she goes on to claim men and woman use to be equal size, strength etc that that societal pressures induced the changes we see now, saying gender is all society, there is no natural inclinations. Hilarious.

I wonder if she ever stopped to think about why men don't get osteoporosis? our bones are denser, making use heavier, stronger, more durable, less likely to injure, from testosterone.

Some men are more feminine than others... They might enjoy the touch of a man for instance.

[Necrosis]

Some men are more feminine than others... They might enjoy the touch of a man for instance.

Sounds like you are describing a homosexual.
yes but they still have testicles.

Woman given test are more aggressive, less social, smile less etc aka are more manly. Woman have smaller brains when size is controlled for, more grey matter, use estrogen as a primary hormone which has a huge role in OCD behaviour,ambition and aggression.

Woman on average have more avg iq's, men tend to be more polarized, it's why most significant advancements have been made by men, why the highest iq's are nearly all male, why there is more men in jail (more stupid men then woman on avg), more impulsivity.

[WOOO]

Sounds like you are describing a homosexual.
yes but they still have testicles.

Woman given test are more aggressive, less social, smile less etc aka are more manly. Woman have smaller brains when size is controlled for, more grey matter, use estrogen as a primary hormone which has a huge role in OCD behaviour,ambition and aggression.

Woman on average have more avg iq's, men tend to be more polarized, it's why most significant advancements have been made by men, why the highest iq's are nearly all male, why there is more men in jail (more stupid men then woman on avg), more impulsivity.

I was taking a jab at someone discreetly. Similar to my other post.

Not arguing

[Necrosis]

I was taking a jab at someone discreetly. Similar to my other post.

Not arguing

I know, lol. I assumed it was Tbombz, i can only converse in argument form, i have down syndrome.

[Agnostic007]

http://bostonatheists.blogspot.com/2009/08/report-on-nathaniel-jeansons.html


1st person on Tbombz list... not very compelling

[tbombz]

i really dont want to get into an endless conversation about the nature of science, the principle of sufficient cause, the role that presuppositions play in our interpretation of the facts, etc. because that conversation will never end.


this is the only thing I want to get across =

 despite what you may think,  there are incredibly intelligent people, extremely well educated in the relevant fields of science, who do not buy into the whole "big bang+evolution over billions of years" theory of history.



Now, you all can go on believing whatever you like to believe. Your going to do that anyways. But what you cant do is claim that every intelligent and educated person will come to the same conclusions as you do. the secular scientific community is changing their theories on a daily basis and it will not be long until this current model is thrown out in favor of a new one which is thought to be more accurate.

http://bostonatheists.blogspot.com/2009/08/report-on-nathaniel-jeansons.html


1st person on Tbombz list... not very compelling

i give the boston atheists the benefit of the doubt that they are completely objective in their assessment........

   

[WOOO]

I could insert some of the proverbs quotes about stupidity. They're incredibly ironic to an anti theist. But I won't.

All of us will die soon enough. My only hope is that consciousness lasts long enough in death for believers to understand their wasted lives.

[whork]

i really dont want to get into an endless conversation about the nature of science, the principle of sufficient cause, the role that presuppositions play in our interpretation of the facts, etc. because that conversation will never end.

No lets rather have a debate without substance so you can "win".



this is the only thing I want to get across =

 despite what you may think,  there are incredibly intelligent people, extremely well educated in the relevant fields of science, who do not buy into the whole "big bang+evolution over billions of years" theory of history.


If you dont believe in evolution you are not a scientist. Science (imperical evidence) proves evolution. Where your beliefs are based on belief and assumptions, a theory about evolution is based on facts(imperical evidence).
Now show us some imperical evidence that supports your belief. Should be easy with SO many extemely educated minds on the case.


Now, you all can go on believing whatever you like to believe. Your going to do that anyways. But what you cant do is claim that every intelligent and educated person will come to the same conclusions as you do. the secular scientific community is changing their theories on a daily basis and it will not be long until this current model is thrown out in favor of a new one which is thought to be more accurate.



i give the boston atheists the benefit of the doubt that they are completely objective in their assessment........

   

[Necrosis]

i really dont want to get into an endless conversation about the nature of science, the principle of sufficient cause, the role that presuppositions play in our interpretation of the facts, etc. because that conversation will never end.


this is the only thing I want to get across =

 despite what you may think,  there are incredibly intelligent people, extremely well educated in the relevant fields of science, who do not buy into the whole "big bang+evolution over billions of years" theory of history.

Right, who cares? that;s why we have testing etc. to avoid opinions, you are appealing to authority, a fallacy, you can continue it but know that your argument is completely ridiculous




Now, you all can go on believing whatever you like to believe. Your going to do that anyways. But what you cant do is claim that every intelligent and educated person will come to the same conclusions as you do. the secular scientific community is changing their theories on a daily basis and it will not be long until this current model is thrown out in favor of a new one which is thought to be more accurate.

bullshit, new theories are changing on a daily basis? lol, you don't have a clue what a theory is. The theory of gravity has not changed, evolution by natural selection, big bang, planetary orbit, general and special relativity etc. you mean they find new facts which continue to support existing theories. You have not a single clue about anything your speaking about.




i give the boston atheists the benefit of the doubt that they are completely objective in their assessment........

lol, irreducible complexity is an argument he used, this is debunked, it's nonsense, are you a liar? why are you repeating lies? why are you immune to reason?


   

Thank god you never got into it for us, we could learn that new theories come up daily and that the fact science changes means it's wrong. You should really attend a proper college, you cite atheists being biased, meanwhile you cite religious people to support your beliefs? lol.  who could be more biased? their very existence rests in the balance.


You think you are smart, you seem unable to apply logic to your god. Sufficient cause, lol, william lane craig much?

even if it was true, how does it prove the christian god?

this shit is for weak minded people, if you picked up the book of scientology or the bible, without knowing anything, would you think either hold the secrets to life? you are following other people, listening to what god is from other humans (hint: they have no clue, nor could), reading a book written by men.

[Necrosis]

i really dont want to get into an endless conversation about the nature of science, the principle of sufficient cause, the role that presuppositions play in our interpretation of the facts, etc. because that conversation will never end.


this is the only thing I want to get across =

 despite what you may think,  there are incredibly intelligent people, extremely well educated in the relevant fields of science, who do not buy into the whole "big bang+evolution over billions of years" theory of history.











Now, you all can go on believing whatever you like to believe. Your going to do that anyways. But what you cant do is claim that every intelligent and educated person will come to the same conclusions as you do. the secular scientific community is changing their theories on a daily basis and it will not be long until this current model is thrown out in favor of a new one which is thought to be more accurate.



i give the boston atheists the benefit of the doubt that they are completely objective in their assessment........

   

Your arrogance is your downfall, always has been. You now are in possession of the truth (this time for sure), no need to question, just latch onto it for dear life.

[WOOO]

Your arrogance is your downfall, always has been. You now are in possession of the truth (this time for sure), no need to question, just latch onto it for dear life.

Luckily. Life will be shorter for some people than others.

Give thanks to God.